Looking for an Indian POV on what is wrong with the Pakistani team

[Savak]

Rather than get Pakistani opinions, i will be interested to hear Indian posters give their views on why the gap between India and Pakistan has widened beyond reach in the last 10 years.

Is it because the talent and quality of players between the two countries?

Is it because of the difference in financial strength between the BCCI and PCB?

Is it a problem of playing an outdated brand of cricket?

Is it due to the IPL where Indian Cricketers get access to the best players and coaches in the world?

Bad coaching and selection decisions?

Lets see how our parosi's view this gap.

 

[Akki malhotra]

Lack of experience plus lack of playing top competitive cricket regularly.
hor khedo zimbawe,west indies,ireland ,sri lanka etc

 

[captain.hansolo]

Which fool won’t have slips in the first ten overs especially with swing bowlers?

 

[captain.hansolo]

No close in fielders for a leg spinner who took a beating wicket with his first ball last time the two teams met...

 

[Savak]

Lack of experience plus lack of playing top competitive cricket regularly.
hor khedo zimbawe,west indies,ireland ,sri lanka etc

Lol India in these series always rests its main 4-5 players and plays the benc strength while Pakistan is playing its top eleven. That is the difference in quality and class between the 2 countries.

 

[Joginder_Sharma]

Overthinking simple things. Also bad team selection in this tournament. On UAE pitches you need more than 2 frontline spinners in your team. No need for so many pacers unless they are all 140+ rapid.

 

[HEYY]

Need to play against top opposition more consistently, it can be difficult to organize tours but even playing against England/Aus/NZ/WI/BD/SL A teams is better than Zimbabwe. Also you simply cannot drop catches of any Indian top 3 in ODI, they all average 45+ and will make you pay.

 

[ipl_fan]

The captain. Sarfaraz is the worst thing to have happened to this team of mediocre cricketers. You are supposed to back them when they are morally down. Instead he gives them a royal dressing down in front of 25K people in the ground and million sin front of their tv sets. Players are half self conscious about their own performance thanks to this fear. What an idiotic captain.

 

[AuxiliA]

Honest opinion!

Playing most games against minnows hurt you.

Indians were more battle hardened.

 

[battler]

Talent and skill level is definitely a bit low for Pakistan right now.
Ability to handle pressure is also not good though should improve with time as Pakistani players are now playing in psl in front of packed crowds.
Make the players financially secure so they do not play for a place in the team but play for the team.
Playing too many minnows definitely lowers your overall standard as well.

 

[ind_win]

Negatives/things that should be encouraged to be improved for Pak cricket benefit:
1. Assure the captain stays irrespective of the result for 2 years at-least.
2. Select 2 all rounders, big hitting skilled players - if not available, scout for them - and players better than Shadab who is essentially a bits and piece type of player, no offense to him.
3. Fielding is to be improved
4. Send more players to play in a bigger, second-to-IPL tournament, Big Bash League and do not arrange PSL in that period.

Positives:
1.This team looks to be the fittest in terms of their physique, save the captain, in my memory.
2. One opener is positive, Babar is good, you need someone to backup Shoaib Malik.

These are the things that come to my mind at the moment...

 

[in_cutter]

The captain. Sarfaraz is the worst thing to have happened to this team of mediocre cricketers. You are supposed to back them when they are morally down. Instead he gives them a royal dressing down in front of 25K people in the ground and million sin front of their tv sets. Players are half self conscious about their own performance thanks to this fear. What an idiotic captain.

Far from ‘mediocre’ mate.

 

[pillionrider]

Pakistan just don't have the talent to be professional and consistently successful.

They should quit trying corporate rubbish because their best chance to pull off improbable wins is when they play raw and uncouth. Like beasts.

Try and read that not as insult or being patronizing

 

[joeldsouzax]

I think Pakistan cricket team needs to be more professional than emotional, I feel that they try too hard to become heroes that they forget the basics of having a plan to win. It will be cool if they play against top teams and get to know their weaknesses instead of hiding them against minnows this will let the weakness get roots and they would slowly descend into the abyss to never come back...

 

[Akki malhotra]

Lol India in these series always rests its main 4-5 players and plays the benc strength while Pakistan is playing its top eleven. That is the difference in quality and class between the 2 countries.

Have you seen total n.o of matches of your batsman .All are inexperienced except malik,sarfraz and babar.
These guys need to play way more matches and more importantly against top teams.Even indian A team play more competitive cricket than your national team.Our indian A team gets to play more cricket.

Lack of talent is not much issue

 

[gani999]

The lack of international cricket in Pakistan is taking its toll, in my opinion.

Athletes, like artists and other craftspeople, need a supportive audience. The motivation provided by fan support is a very big factor. That is not happening in the UAE where Pakistan play their 'home' games in front of empty stands. I think it is rather shameful on the part of the Pakistani diaspora in the UAE to stay away even from the PSL games. I don't get to watch the games where I am, but apparently the audience in both the India-Pakistan games in this Asia cup was overwhelmingly Indian.

I think Imran Khan must make bringing international cricket back to Pakistan as one of his government's top priorities.

And then there is the money factor. India is the financial super-power of world cricket and they can afford better coaches, facilities, and can provide better paychecks to their players. I believe the money would come back to Pakistan once international cricket returns there. It will then be up to the PCB to handle the finances properly.

 

[BaankeJi]

They need a batting powerhouse . Fakhar was supposed to be doing that role but he is inconsistent.
Someone like Dhawan or Sharma will do a world of good.

 

[Itachi]

Basics.

India has a professional setup where it makes sire that at least basics are done correctly even if everything goes against.

It starts right from the grass root and goes to drawing board before a match.

England, aus, RSA and India.... All have this setup. Rest still lagging.

You are dropping catches right and left. That's unforgivable.

The composure comes when you know what your responsibility is. Pak team most of the time looks clueless and it takes brilliance from one individual to inspire the morale. Otherwise, they will fall like a deck of cards.

If you can't take modern approach, you better bring at least two bowlers and two batsman out of whom, one will at least fire enough to lead the team. The rest will follow accordingly and this team can perform even without a pro setup.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

I know it's an unpopular opinion on PP but we have much better batsmen available than atleast DK, Dhoni, Jadhav and Rayudu . Im not sure Pakistan have any batsmen better than the ones currently playing. If you actually play to your potential you should beat us especially with that stellar bowling attack.

Another unpopular opinion - Pakistan play exceptionally well in English conditions and English conditions alone. Based on the evidence. CT, drawn test series etc. Sone try and extrapolate that to being better in all conditions but that's definitely not true especially not the UAE where your ODI record in last decade is atrocious.

 

[Cric_lover4487]

Micky Arthur's horses for courses, player rotation policies are harming the team. Subcontinent team culture is different. In some ways, his coaching style is similar to Greg Chappel and we know how it panned out. He is authoritarian and wants things done exactly his way. Harris Sohail, Umar Amin etc come and go away. No one is sure of his place in team. I think this is classic case of over analyzing things and poor captaincy. For a subcontinent team, coach has to be more of a motivator and leave captaincy to captain. Arthur seems to making all the decisions in current setup. Also, Safaraz attitude is very poor. He criticizes and blames everyone other than himself. He won't make it to the team if he was not captain. One more thing Pakistan fans also have to realize that players have to always upgrade their game and work on their flaws otherwise you will get find out. Clearly, Indian team have figured out Fakhar zaman. His honeymoon ended with Zimbabwe series. He might get lucky in final and Pakistan might win like in CT but clearly India is better team right now.

 

[ego-gambit]

I think you can win matches by making 250 on tracks where you have some assistance for fast bowlers you can't survive taking singles on flat wickets & too cautious in era where stroke making is mandatory to get boundaries you cannot wait for bad balls only .If Pak had scored 280-90 and hold on to the catches India may have won the match but not this easy.

 

[Dingolfy]

Poor Domestic structure. Look at your fielding itself. Even your youngsters are dropping sitters. I have seen your U19 team field the same way in the recent WC. No senior coach can teach fielding or batting basics to 21 year olds.They have to learn that in your domestic setup.

 

[Virat_Kohli_fan]

I think there's a bit of Hero-giri culture in Pakistan team - especially when it comes to playing against India. (Baki team ki zarurat nahi hai mai akela hi jeeta dunga)
Hasan Ali for instance said that he wanted to take 10 wickets - not only is it disrespectful to the opposing team, it's also disrespectful to your own fellow bowlers, are you saying you are so much better than all other 21 players on the playing field?
Play as a team, hold catches of your bowlers, don't spout garbage before match that will put additional pressure on you when you actually go and play. These are the quick fix things.

In terms of long term, better batting training at the grassroots level, It took India a long time but we finally got the pacers to compete with the world, Pakistan still doesn't have the batting might to compete with the world when Fakhar doesn't fire, when Sarfaraz and Malik were building their partnership today I wasn't the least bit worried, Why? I knew that even at their best they won't manage anything beyond an 85 SR and that won't be enough against India.

 

[happydavy]

It's a team devoid of any experience in the lower middle order. I support the theory that they should bat carefully initially and try to not loose wickets in the first 10-15 overs but the lower middle order still needs to be beefed up. Get Hafeez or one of the Akmals to bat at no:6. You can't win a tournament when 5 or 6 of playing XI have played less than 30 ODIs each, no matter how talented or devoted they are.

 

[Shandarchowka]

Enough of lessons from India. They themselves have a poor team barring their openers and they're here to lecture us after a couple of random wins

 

[Bhaijaan]

Rather than get Pakistani opinions, i will be interested to hear Indian posters give their views on why the gap between India and Pakistan has widened beyond reach in the last 10 years.

Is it because the talent and quality of players between the two countries?

Is it because of the difference in financial strength between the BCCI and PCB?

Is it a problem of playing an outdated brand of cricket?

Is it due to the IPL where Indian Cricketers get access to the best players and coaches in the world?

Bad coaching and selection decisions?

Lets see how our parosi's view this gap.

Sports infrastructure spreading to tier-2 and tier-3 cities in India in the last 10 years or so has been the game changer not just in Cricket but in all sports.

People have been rightly mocking India not producing enough world class cricketers/sports persons as a ratio of its population. Thats because the right infrastructure and set up was only concentrated in few major cities.

Tier-2/3 cities are fast catching up now and so the overall quality / standard of competition is getting better.

India has truly evolved as a cricket nation. They will of course have bad days here and there but there is enough quality there to keep bouncing back and stay among the top nations.

Credit to BCCI. It has invested smartly and significantly in helping to build state of the art facilities across Indian venues.

Pakistan will be there as well. They just need to follow India's footsteps in developing the infrastructure across the nation.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Just look at when Malik made debut.1990s. Relying still on him for stability indicates how Pakistan talent didn't take too much time before they regress into oblivion. Longevity of Pakistan talents is a problem. Make no mistake they could go ahead and beat India in the final convincingly. That will be due to either outstanding individual performance or India playing well below their potential. As a team this is very weak.

 

[Starky]

Problem is the outdated brand of cricket..there is no aggression in the PCT.Once in a while we get to see it but its very few and far btwn..Your bowling is still strong enough but the batting is horrendous apart from fakhar...Malik is good too but only against a minnow or against india...I dont see him making an impact against other teams..asif ali looks good but too early to call..Fakhar too needs to improve his legside play and rotation of the strike.Today there were a few balls on the stumps which he could have worked around the corner but couldnt...The main Problem which i see is it is either boom or bust, as in they either hit it with power for four or six or play lots of dots...No strike rotation at all..

 

[saabir]

First of all the captain of the side should be your best player or most smart player of the side. He is the one who inspire others. Pakistan have Sarfraz who behaves like a teacher of a govt school. He is not good enough to be in the side let alone be a captain. To me Shoaib Mallik is the best guy and the most reliable guy at the moment for captaincy. He is smart and fit to lead the side for Atleast 2 yrs. After Mallik I can only see Babar Azam as a captaincy material. He is the best batsmen in this line up.

 

[RainMan_]

It's hilarious to see the way ppl r overrating this Indian team. They r a top heavy team. Take couple of early wickets and watch them going into a shell.

The only reason they have done well in this tournament is because their openers have played exceptionally in this tournament and taken the game away from the opposition in first 20 overs.

 

[Swashbuckler]

I think Pakistan is a good team and are in the right direction. But why play the best XI against Zimbabwe 2nd string side? And then why gloat over the performances, would have been better to send an under 23 side even if it meant losing a couple of matches. Pakistani core players must play the top teams more frequently so that they can stay grounded and assess, introspect, improve. 13th World Champion GM Kasparov always said if a player plays low class competition, he is destined to become a low level player, same holds true for cricket. Greatness is forged by fire, not in a picnic garden.

 

[jnaveen1980]

It's hilarious to see the way ppl r overrating this Indian team. They r a top heavy team. Take couple of early wickets and watch them going into a shell.

The only reason they have done well in this tournament is because their openers have played exceptionally in this tournament and taken the game away from the opposition in first 20 overs.

They are world no.2 ODI team lol why do you think they are over-rated?

 

[Major]

Some funny replies by the Indians

Truth is, India plays by conditions and Pakistan plays by Myths.

Because Waseem akram, Waqar, Imran and Shoaib played for pakistan, Paksitanis have this myth that we are a fast bowling nation. Hence, often any fool that decides to captain this team ends up filling up the squad with pacers. Plus, we Pakistanis also have this belief that India is weak against Pace, thus, having fast bowlers makes more sense.

What we dont do is, we dont play according to the conditions anymore. UAE conditions dictates that a team should have 2 full time spinners and 1 part time spinner to have an advantage in a match.
A score of 250 is easily defend-able on such wickets if you have a got spinners.

Before Asia Cup, this Indian team had only played 2 odi games in UAE, while Pakistan members played more than 50. And yet we have ignored the conditions.

THe reason why India is a top nation is that they have mastered the Asian conditions. India played and watched only a handful of gmaes in UAE and they were able to deduce that spinners are needed here.

Today India played 4 spinners. THey restricted Pakistan to 237 with 4 spinners!!! Even though Pakistan are good players of spin, India did not care. THey saw the conditions and went with 4 spinners.

India could had played Khalil Ahmad who didn't bowl that bad. They could had bought in Pandya for power hitting.
But they went with the conditions.

Afghanistan, a new team, gave more of a fight than Pakistan. Why? Becuase afghanistan is also playing 4-5 spinners. Nabi,Rashid, Mujeeb, Shinwari, Rehmat Shah

If in the finals, Hasan Ali ends up taking 5 wickets against India, trust me, next year we might be playing at an Indian dustbowl and yet Hasan Ali would be selected in the team 11 because in the past he took 5 wickets against India. We wont see why he took it or how he took it, we will just say he took it, and he can take it again because India are weak agaisnt pace(a myth)

ANd this isn't the first time pakistan made this mistake. Back in 2016's world t20. Matches were played in India. The wicekts were friendly. Statner was getting alot of spin and he threaten India alot. Hes the kind of bowler who is not even a top spinner, but yet he was getting alot of spin and created problems for India.

Santer took 4 wickets on that Nagpur pitch and was man of the match.

Week later Pakistan were to play in Kolkata against India. And guess what? Pakistan played 4 pacers. No full time spinners, only part timers like afridi and malik were there.

I knew before the match that there would be spin. During the match Ashwin came to bowl, and he spun the ball so much that the batsmen was surprised.

Point is, we ignore conditions, while India takes advantage of it.

THe reasons being looking professional, having a proper set up, lack of talent are just old lame ******** stories that we keep hearing all the time.

 

[Canford Cliffs]

It's hilarious to see the way ppl r overrating this Indian team. They r a top heavy team. Take couple of early wickets and watch them going into a shell.

The only reason they have done well in this tournament is because their openers have played exceptionally in this tournament and taken the game away from the opposition in first 20 overs.

Top heavy team yes and a good bowling attack like Pak may trouble our middle order. But I still expect likes of Rayudu, MSD, Karthik, Jadhav to smash Bangla trundlers most days. So its not ONLY a top heavy team for teams like Bangla and our middle order is equally capable, if you can remove the openers to start with. Remember Nidahas final and Dinesh Karthik?

 

[bluevision]

I feel your current pool of players are not as talented as they are made out to be. The captain is a dud himself, very uninspiring. Hope your board Identifies the real talent and groom them. I'm sure you have some hidden gem of players yet to be spotted by your incomelpetent selectors (even worse than our bunch of jokers). Add to that dirty politics in your cricketing eco system.
Also stop finding false sense of solace in your victories against lesser ranked teams and odd wins against established sides here and there. They raise your expectation levels and later .........
I understand the fact as fans you can do nothing other than venting your frustrations online. As an Indian fan, we just finished witnessing an agonising English tour ourselves where we were just not good enough to cross the final huddle because of xyz reasons. So, I know where you are coming from.
Good luck for the next game (and the final, may be)!

 

[Proactive_]

Nothing much. Just the batting, bowling and fielding.

 

[Sachin136]

It's hilarious to see the way ppl r overrating this Indian team. They r a top heavy team. Take couple of early wickets and watch them going into a shell.

The only reason they have done well in this tournament is because their openers have played exceptionally in this tournament and taken the game away from the opposition in first 20 overs.

There's nothing bad about being a top heavy team if your top 3 is the best in the world.

 

[bluevision]

It's hilarious to see the way ppl r overrating this Indian team. They r a top heavy team. Take couple of early wickets and watch them going into a shell.

The only reason they have done well in this tournament is because their openers have played exceptionally in this tournament and taken the game away from the opposition in first 20 overs.

A BD fan terming Indian team as over-rated. Now I've seen it all.

 

[austerlitz]

Primarily on this team -

One proper batsman as i have said before - Babar azam is a very good one and will win pakistan many matches over his career.Fakhar zaman is a hack,u need a hack in ODIs if he can win you say 1 in 5 games.If he can't do that he needs to go.

Malik is great vs spinners and pain in the *** for india,but mediocre overall.Due to every team now playing wrist spinners in middle overs he has become more useful.

There aren't really any other batsmen to speak of.Imam is generic opener,so-so player but not a match winner in his own right.

Big problem is captain sarfraz doesnt deserve to be in the team at all,but cant be dropped.Asif is slogger.

If pakistan play 2 allrounders shadab and faheem bating becomes even weaker.

Bowling i feel is quite good.Pacers are not getting that much help in UAE conditions ,they will be alright in England.But big weakness for pakistan is lack of good spinners in middle overs ,shadab looks like part timer,nawaz is quite average.Need a specialist wicket taking option - maybe yasir shah.Right now if they don't get wickets in early spell,they are too dependent on hasan ali in middle overs.

Thats my view.

 

[bala977]

I think Amir is out of form, and that is affecting the entire bowling dept.

I expect Pakistan to come up with another CT type performance during the final. However, in my view, this is like a mini ODI series between the 2 sides and we have already won it!

 

[babajee]

Not an Indian bro but can [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION] please give us some insight

 

[Savak]

I think Amir is out of form, and that is affecting the entire bowling dept.

I expect Pakistan to come up with another CT type performance during the final. However, in my view, this is like a mini ODI series between the 2 sides and we have already won it!

Lol, Amir has done nothing since the CT Trophy final. The entire bowling attack has had to carry him instead.

 

[MMHS]

Not Indian bro but can [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION] please give us some insight

Not much - may be next game PAK should play Fahim, he is good enough to start as 2nd pacer for most teams.

 

[babajee]

Not much - may be next game PAK should play Fahim, he is good enough to start as 2nd pacer for most teams.

Tell me something I don't know

 

[rhony]

There is no way Pakistan team can be timid and win against India. This Indian team is on auto pilot most times and u can beat them only if u play out of your skin. Pakistani bowling can't restrict good teams for 250 anymore. You need to score above par and field well. This is the same answer for Pakistan vs England too. Eng and Ind are just on another level atm.

 

[MMHS]

[MENTION=143344]babajee[/MENTION]

On a serious note, first start to accept that this is a poor PAK side under a horrible Captain. Last 15 months, PAK's record against any team above 8th rank is LLLLLLL - 7-0.

Apart from that, if you make the final, may be one trick can be to chase under light. Sarfraz has won 2 tosses and lost both game for the cost of 3 wickets and 67 overs, one of the wicket is Run-out.

Apart from that, instead of IND, I would suggest to focus on BD games first - we edged past AFGs after gifting 2 run-outs in crucial moment - if Shakib & Mushi puts a partnership against non existent PAK spin threat..... superior class of your batsmen won't chase the target at Abu Dhabi.

After that, we'll talk about the small matter of a respectable defeat against IND.

 

[rhony]

I think Amir is out of form, and that is affecting the entire bowling dept.

I expect Pakistan to come up with another CT type performance during the final. However, in my view, this is like a mini ODI series between the 2 sides and we have already won it!

Have you noticed how Amir's bunny Rohit changed his stance and adapted in this series against Amir? That's what good batsmen do. Amir alone is not the solution. Pakistan has a decent attack but assuming they will roll the Indian team for 150 like in CT finals every time is a myth. They need to score above par and take their catches. Bowling isn't the concern compared to batting and fielding

 

[babajee]

[MENTION=143344]babajee[/MENTION]

On a serious note, first start to accept that this is a poor PAK side under a horrible Captain. Last 15 months, PAK's record against any team above 8th rank is LLLLLLL - 7-0.

Apart from that, if you make the final, may be one trick can be to chase under light. Sarfraz has won 2 tosses and lost both game for the cost of 3 wickets and 67 overs, one of the wicket is Run-out.

Apart from that, instead of IND, I would suggest to focus on BD games first - we edged past AFGs after gifting 2 run-outs in crucial moment - if Shakib & Mushi puts a partnership against non existent PAK spin threat..... superior class of your batsmen won't chase the target at Abu Dhabi.

After that, we'll talk about the small matter of a respectable defeat against IND.

I don't think they are as bad as we've seen them against NZ and in the Asia Cup so far. Not even being swayed by performances against minnows.

Need a specialist spinner though, that is true.

 

[Savak]

Have you noticed how Amir's bunny Rohit changed his stance and adapted in this series against Amir? That's what good batsmen do. Amir alone is not the solution. Pakistan has a decent attack but assuming they will roll the Indian team for 150 like in CT finals every time is a myth. They need to score above par and take their catches. Bowling isn't the concern compared to batting and fielding

One has to adopt to the situation. Bowlers if they are not getting anything from the wicket, need to find ways to keep the run rate down. The toss is the only thing you do not control therefore if India wins the toss and puts Pakistan into bat or Pakistan to bowl, either ways the bowlers have to keep the run rate down.

Pakistan's batting will punch above its weight if it gets to 300 but even 300 is not a safe total against India.

 

[MMHS]

I don't think they are as bad as we've seen them against NZ and in the Asia Cup so far. Not even being swayed by performances against minnows.

Need a specialist spinner though, that is true.

An average team with a HORRIBLE Captain - it should sum up. Replace your Captain with the Midget Mushi, and put Malik as Captain, you might have a decent unit outside ZIM. Good for you that AFG's choked last time and they played back to back game for which fatigue caught them in last 20 overs of fielding, otherwise ... you know.

 

[babajee]

An average team with a HORRIBLE Captain - it should sum up. Replace your Captain with the Midget Mushi, and put Malik as Captain, you might have a decent unit outside ZIM. Good for you that AFG's choked last time and they played back to back game for which fatigue caught them in last 20 overs of fielding, otherwise ... you know.

Fair enough. Time is ticking for Sarfraz.

 

[rhony]

One has to adopt to the situation. Bowlers if they are not getting anything from the wicket, need to find ways to keep the run rate down. The toss is the only thing you do not control therefore if India wins the toss and puts Pakistan into bat or Pakistan to bowl, either ways the bowlers have to keep the run rate down.

Pakistan's batting will punch above its weight if it gets to 300 but even 300 is not a safe total against India.

I disagree. Once you put a substantial score on the board and in this case close to 270, the approach from the Indian batters wouldn't have been the same. Pakistan were at least 30 to 40 runs short. Rohit's catch in the 8th over, if taken, would have been a dicey situation for India with Indian middle order being very flaky.

 

[Ab Fan]

Rather than get Pakistani opinions, i will be interested to hear Indian posters give their views on why the gap between India and Pakistan has widened beyond reach in the last 10 years.

Is it because the talent and quality of players between the two countries?

Is it because of the difference in financial strength between the BCCI and PCB?

Is it a problem of playing an outdated brand of cricket?

Is it due to the IPL where Indian Cricketers get access to the best players and coaches in the world?

Bad coaching and selection decisions?

Lets see how our parosi's view this gap.

The answers are:-

Dont think so

Yes

A big Yes

Yes, IPL helped Indian players evolve their game a lot.

Coaching is bad in the domestic structure itself.

There are just too many glaring flaws to be mentioned :-

The brand of cricket that Pakistan is playing is massively outdated. After winning the toss and deciding to bat, if you are putting 28/1 on board after 10 overs, then the story is clear there itself.

With Pakistan, it is not just that the talent and skill-sets are lower but the ability to handle pressure is quite poor as well. The leadership is mediocre, there seems to be no professionalism in their game and the fielding standards are pathetic to say the least.

Your domestic setup itself is very poor. The game at the local level is unorganized and mismanaged. The players aren't doing the basics right and as a result, have failed to take their game to another level. The result of all this is the mediocrity which Pakistan is going through.

Time for PCB to invest a bit more of money in the youth system, provide better quality coaching and there is a great deal of need to improve the fielding standards as well.

 

[Eye_Done]

If your openers are scoring consistently and scoring 100s then you will win most matches. Last time we won a game against India opener Fakhar scored a 100 and result was big win.

 

[Savak]

The answers are:-

Dont think so

Yes

A big Yes

Yes, IPL helped Indian players evolve their game a lot.

Coaching is bad in the domestic structure itself.

There are just too many glaring flaws to be mentioned :-

The brand of cricket that Pakistan is playing is massively outdated. After winning the toss and deciding to bat, if you are putting 28/1 on board after 10 overs, then the story is clear there itself.

With Pakistan, it is not just that the talent and skill-sets are lower but the ability to handle pressure is quite poor as well. The leadership is mediocre, there seems to be no professionalism in their game and the fielding standards are pathetic to say the least.

Your domestic setup itself is very poor. The game at the local level is unorganized and mismanaged. The players aren't doing the basics right and as a result, have failed to take their game to another level. The result of all this is the mediocrity which Pakistan is going through.

Time for PCB to invest a bit more of money in the youth system, provide better quality coaching and there is a great deal of need to improve the fielding standards as well.

The long term solution is pumping finances into domestic cricket but that is not easy for a cash strapped PCB with no international cricket in Pakistan. With the PSL there has been some improvement in the ODI and T-20 team but there is still a big gap between Pakistan and the rest of the top 5.

But the team management can make the best decisions with the things in their control i.e. selecting the right players in the team, having the right game plan, sure you may lose the odd game batting very aggressively but why not sending the message to the aggressive players that we will not drop you after one failure but give you a good 10 games on the stretch, just go out there and play your natural game?

 

[BlackThunder]

Except Malik the rest look afraid to lose hence they end up stuck in the crease unable to rotate the strike. Also Pakistan need a proper batsman at six and they are definitely lacking a quality spinner. Pakistan fans can badmouth Rashid Khan all they want but they certainly can use a bowler like him in this lineup.

 

[the_outsider]

Rather than get Pakistani opinions, i will be interested to hear Indian posters give their views on why the gap between India and Pakistan has widened beyond reach in the last 10 years.

Is it because the talent and quality of players between the two countries?

Is it because of the difference in financial strength between the BCCI and PCB?

Is it a problem of playing an outdated brand of cricket?

Is it due to the IPL where Indian Cricketers get access to the best players and coaches in the world?

Bad coaching and selection decisions?

Lets see how our parosi's view this gap.

Talent and quality - Yes there is quite a bit of difference.

Financial strength - it definitely has an impact, especially at grassroots level cricket and developing talent

Outdated brand of cricket - No. Pak is not playing outdated cricket.

IPL - Yes, quite a bit. Because what IPL adds is experience and the ability to handle pressure. Obviously, the quality of cricket and opposition is also much higher than PSL so that also makes a big difference.

Bad coaching and selection - Nothing wrong with your coach. MA is a tried and tested coach and he will be good for you guys. But selecting only 2 proper spinners in the squad for Asia Cup was a big oversight.

 

[mystical man]

Rather than get Pakistani opinions, i will be interested to hear Indian posters give their views on why the gap between India and Pakistan has widened beyond reach in the last 10 years.

Is it because the talent and quality of players between the two countries?

Is it because of the difference in financial strength between the BCCI and PCB?

Is it a problem of playing an outdated brand of cricket?

Is it due to the IPL where Indian Cricketers get access to the best players and coaches in the world?

Bad coaching and selection decisions?

Lets see how our parosi's view this gap.

After England's debacle it is hard to state which of the two sides are better and a win in the final for either of the two team's will lead to no change. We will have to contend ourselves with the uncle's or sifarishi players that will lead to another debacle... Both teams need massive change in their line up...

 

[the_outsider]

Talent and quality - Yes there is quite a bit of difference.

Financial strength - it definitely has an impact, especially at grassroots level cricket and developing talent

Outdated brand of cricket - No. Pak is not playing outdated cricket.

IPL - Yes, quite a bit. Because what IPL adds is experience and the ability to handle pressure. Obviously, the quality of cricket and opposition is also much higher than PSL so that also makes a big difference.

Bad coaching and selection - Nothing wrong with your coach. MA is a tried and tested coach and he will be good for you guys. But selecting only 2 proper spinners in the squad for Asia Cup was a big oversight.

Most importantly though, what PCT lacks is experience. And I mean relevant experience i.e. constantly playing against strong(er) teams. No team ever improves by playing against weaker oppositions .

 

[cricketjoshila]

In addition to the playing minnows point, there is one more thing.

Many Pakistani fans wont accept it but they dont have a ATG level bowler. Pakistan needs to find a 150k tearaway who is ATG level. Trust me that one addition will galvanise this team. You need a lynchpin around whom the team plays. For Pakistan its always been the fast bowlers. Sadly they dont have one of that class today.

The blame goes to the board and selectors. They were happy winning matches in Uae by fielding Ajmal Yasir and co. They didnot care that the most important aspect of Pakistani team was being ignored.

 

[Ab Fan]

The long term solution is pumping finances into domestic cricket but that is not easy for a cash strapped PCB with no international cricket in Pakistan. With the PSL there has been some improvement in the ODI and T-20 team but there is still a big gap between Pakistan and the rest of the top 5.

But the team management can make the best decisions with the things in their control i.e. selecting the right players in the team, having the right game plan, sure you may lose the odd game batting very aggressively but why not sending the message to the aggressive players that we will not drop you after one failure but give you a good 10 games on the stretch, just go out there and play your natural game?

Yes, it is obviously an uphill task for a cash-strapped PCB and then no international cricket in Pakistan makes things even harder.

But that is what the root cause is for Pakistan. The youngsters aren't able to evolve themselves, the standards are quite low as well, they aren't doing the basics right, let alone able to take their game to a different level. As a result of this, when they hit the scenes at international level, what we find is a huge gulf of class between Pakistan team and the other top teams like Aus, SA, India and England.

The point you mentioned about right planning and right approach is actually a fair one but then it all comes down to how players execute this on field and then there begins the test of player's character and mental fortitude.

We have talked so much about how Fakhar and Imam shouldn't wilt under pressure early on in the game and approach it with an aggressive yet positive brand of cricket. They are aware that they have to go with this mindset only. But then it is all about executing your plans and not wilt under the pressure. Unfortunately, they failed to execute it on both occassions against India and ended up messing things early on in the game. Someone gotta show that character, try and make sure to execute the plans and lead the team up-front like a man and inspire them. That is what is the need of time for Pakistan. Sarfaraz is unfortunately not that guy. Perhaps there is no one currently like that for Pakistan.

 

[DRsohail]

[MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION].Yhhis is not that bad team as you are making it to be or the way they perfomred.It was selection blunders which caused us to go down.I knwo from where are you coming but we would have not defended 250 against afghan if we went there with 4 phaast bowlers,so thst the thing hunting us.And we are playing with 9 players.you knwo what i am talking about,may be you can call them8.5 because one is worst behind the wickt and anothe wil play and waste 20 balls before getting out.

 

[mystical man]

Yes, it is obviously an uphill task for a cash-strapped PCB and then no international cricket in Pakistan makes things even harder.

But that is what the root cause is for Pakistan. The youngsters aren't able to evolve themselves due to the poor setup, they aren't doing the basics right, let alone able to take their game to a different level. As a result of this, when they hit the scenes at international level, what we find is a huge gulf of class between Pakistan team and the other top teams like Aus, SA, India and England.

The point you mentioned about right planning and right approach is actually a fair one but then it all comes down to how players execute this on field and then there begins the test of player's character and mental fortitude.

We have talked so much about how Fakhar and Imam shouldn't wilt under pressure early on in the game and approach it with an aggressive yet positive brand of cricket. They are aware that they have to go with this mindset only. But then it is all about executing your plans and not wilt under the pressure. Unfortunately, they failed to execute it on both occassions against India and ended up messing things early on in the game. Someone gotta show that character, try and make sure to execute the plans and lead the team up-front like a man and inspire them. That is what is the need of time for Pakistan. Sarfaraz is unfortunately not that guy. Perhaps there is no one currently like that for Pakistan.

What gulf of class are we talking about? The same indian team got hammered in tests along with Odi against England and God knows what will happen against Australia ... Class was in the early 2000's with the fab 04 and the likes of Sehwag... For me that was a complete team for all formats of the game...

 

[sachin-10dulkar]

Your captain is the issue. Just look at his face after every boundary being hit. And his lack of trust in players. Haris dropped just after 1 match he failed to deliver in. Too much changes in squads every other match. And lack of senior player in the team like Hafeez.
Shoaib malik should be the captain. He is a more calm person. And hafeez can make a huge difference with his bowling also. Amir is still your best bowler.

 

[Balthazar]

No quality batsmen and your captain sucks. That CT final was an one-off event, and I still believe there's nothing has changed between these two teams. Your bowlers are fine but you need to have batsmen who can take responsibility and consistently score 280+ runs. Batsmen win limited-over games and bowlers win Test matches. It's as simple as that.

 

[docteurmanish]

Rather than get Pakistani opinions, i will be interested to hear Indian posters give their views on why the gap between India and Pakistan has widened beyond reach in the last 10 years.

Is it because the talent and quality of players between the two countries?

Is it because of the difference in financial strength between the BCCI and PCB?

Is it a problem of playing an outdated brand of cricket?

Is it due to the IPL where Indian Cricketers get access to the best players and coaches in the world?

Bad coaching and selection decisions?

Lets see how our parosi's view this gap.

hi

as someone who played for mumbai under 16 23 years ago i see the following main differences

1- money

plenty of support at every level if u make it to state teams ( u16 onwards)
kids and parents think of it as a career( pandya bros, jadeja, chepu etc are products of parents wanting kids to succeeed cos of awesome financial rewards)
20 years ago it was boom or bust ( most never made it cos nepotism would killl u- now ipl saves u, gives u support and allows u to bloom and bcci complements it

2- ganguly - dravid- kumble - laxman

these guys changed indian cricket
ganguly brought in fight
dravid showed discipline
kumble - grit
laxman - few people realize that the fightback against aussies was the rise of the self belief in indian team ...

3 dalmiya

fought for indian cricket

4 fast bowling

this is something most people dont get it
bumrah bowling yorkers to pak batsmen in uae ..
but wait its factory behind him
kumar, pandya, shami, sharma i ,mavi , nagarkoti , khaleel, thampi, siraj mohammed .. few

its a miracle again due to ipl. players are fit and remain fit . due to ipl .

5 importance to winning abroad

60-90 india was happy to win in chennai . niw the goal is to win abroad - the hunger is there .dravid as u-19 coach and a team coach is an example of forward thinking (shastri is an aberration - kumble will be back )

6 less imp to pak

india as a country has changed .. nobody cares abt pak as an enemy etc . its another nation for sport . indians are most happy defeating australia

regarding pak- i can only say that natural talent is probably higher but india is finally getting the dhonis from jharkhand or the yadavs from vidarbha - true hinterland talent which is reason we can compete . pak on other hand seems to have regressed . no waqars or wasims seen ( amir was no wasim ever ) . likely represents the desire of pak men to migrate .

i think immigration to us and europe is v high in pakistani middle class which might be taking away some talent

 

[Stumper]

We always had an upper hand in batting, but now our bowling is closing the gap with their counterpart and even doing better then them. Add to this lack of exposure with good teams. I think its about time pak should drop Amir he is wicketless boy.

 

[Wonderwoman]

1. No cricket in Pakistan for the last 10 years. This is the biggest setback to Pakistan
2. Hero worship of mediocrities like Afridi, they have instilled nothing but disregard to systematic approach to cricket.
3. Lack of fitness
4. Too many egos in and out of teams
5. Blaming BCCI for all ills
6. Tried and tested failures in rotation
7. Minnow bashing for 80% of the year and feeling false sense of being competent.
8. Too many accumulators in batting in this era, No batting mentors to look upto.
9. Pakistani fans, hyping every new kid as the next Virat Kohli or Wasim Akram or Imran Khan. and too many minnow games add to that narrative.. Case in point. Babar Azam, Immam ul haq, Fakhar Zaman. These guys have been minnow bashing through out and have almost alwyas been mediocre against stronger teams.

 

[BobbySharma]

Indian fan POV

Having read all these comments... i feel there is something that no one brought up.. the presence (rather, absence) of an on field leadership group. When Dhoni was kaptaan, we had Zaheer often setting the fields for the bowlers who were going for runs. In SA and Eng, in the white ball games, Virat being the kaptaan, let Dhoni set some of the fields (not all the time) and Shikar/Rohit/Dhoni were in his ear all the time. In the opening game against HK, Dhoni took over in the field and did what he does best... dry up runs. He set the field that get rid of Shakib in the BD game.

My point is.. Sarfi is stressed out and it would not be a bad thing for Shoiab and Amir to chime in. Cricket is a team sport.. so why should leadership in Cricket be an individual thing... Australia do this formally.. India does this informally.

Tagging [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] for his insight.

 

[Napa]

Rather than get Pakistani opinions, i will be interested to hear Indian posters give their views on why the gap between India and Pakistan has widened beyond reach in the last 10 years.

Is it because the talent and quality of players between the two countries?

Is it because of the difference in financial strength between the BCCI and PCB?

Is it a problem of playing an outdated brand of cricket?

Is it due to the IPL where Indian Cricketers get access to the best players and coaches in the world?

Bad coaching and selection decisions?

Lets see how our parosi's view this gap.

A couple of years ago I made a post which someone kindly decided to award the POTW:

Actually Pakistan is not improving, because improvement does not come out of the thin air. A cricket team is only a reflection of how systems function in the country and the Pakistani systems are dysfunctional. Systems do not change unless something fundamental changes, and nothing fundamental has changed.

Pakistan has now won the last 7 matches it played, and will likely win the next 4. However in the 11 matches win streak the only one with value will be the T20 against Eng. The ODI against Eng had them facing a team which was 4-0 up and resting its top spinners.

India produces better players because its systems are better. Along with the IPL and BCCI, the message is "Work hard, improve yourself and you have a chance of big rewards". This system wins against a system in which players do not have the same incentives and the same security.

Pakistani batting is a grade lower than other top teams. The only significant victory they had in 2015 WC (against SA) was due to its bowling. Wait for the Jan 2017 Aus tour and you will see the true state of Pakistani cricket.

Since then the PSL has become quite successful and has provided the Pakistani team with a few young players.

My belief however is that the "sifarish" culture in Pakistan remains strong, like it used to be in India. Till the mid-1990s, the politicians and bureaucrats dominated India and the "sifarish" culture was strong. Since then freeing the economy has resulted in the alternative "produce and you will be rewarded" culture growing, though the "sifarish" culture is still there.

Not to say that capitalism does not have serious problems, but it does produce performers.

Also, professional sportsmen with million dollar IPL contracts have a totally different mentality. Their confidence is sky high. They will not be intimidated in a game, as they know they will always have the security of their bank balance.

The Pakistani team will become more professional along with the rest of the country. As the various institutions of the country become more professional, so will the cricket team. India went through liberalization of its economy 25 years ago, and the cricket team is stronger now. Pakistan needs its own liberalization.

Of course, cricket and especially its cricketing rivalry with India is of special importance to Pakistanis. So the people who are put in charge of the team may bring in more professionalism even if the rest of the country does not change. But it is really more important that the country improves, rather than only the cricket team improve.

 

[Bangalorean]

-ve's:

1. Lack of skill due to IPL snub which created huge gap. Now they have PSL, hope things will improve.

2. Minnow mentality, being such a big cricketing nation, need to behave like pro's and players should work hard more than living on past laurels for long.

3. Having non performing task master Captain is also one of the biggest hindrance for Pak team

+ve's:
Team looks much fitter compared to earlier generations, with right attitude and hard work this team can regain Glory days of 90's Pak Team

Note: My honest opinions, feel free to disagree or debate

 

[Rightarmfast]

From an Indian perspective, I think its just natural progression. Post mid 80's, Pakistan used to give us major thumpings. But post 2000, roles have reversed.

However, I feel more than skill level, professionalism, a good cricket structure, Pakistani players seem to be living in the past. Most of their players seem to have the pressure of performing like Waqar, Wasim, Shoaib, Shahid Afridi etc, and i feel they go overboard. Hassan Ali, more than bowling, concentrates on drama. The openers seem to be playing ODI's in the 80's. Sarfaraz seems to be trying hard to better Dhoni each time. This wont work. Pakistani players dont seem to be natural to me. They are trying to be someone they are not. Acceptance of being mediocre players is the first step towards improvement.

 

[WengerOut]

This is just an emotional thread. I have always maintained that the difference between Ind and Pak in ODIs is Kohli. What happened in the last two matches , in my view is , Pakistan being pressurised to live upto their CT final exploits. We all know they dont have the greatest of nerves.

 

[Romali_rotti]

I feel not allowing Pakistani players to participate in IPL has played a part. Pakistani players dont get to o up against quality opposition with the odd exception of ENG. Its sad the country politics, Kashmir and whatelse not is causing all this disharmony... If I had my way I would allow Pakistani players to play in IPL as it is not right to see Pakistan as a weak team, I am used to the Pakistani teams which had quality players like Anwar, Akram, etc...

 

[sjahmed23]

Some very good points here. I think I agree India has institutionalized cricket while we have solely relied on individuals. This is in line with what Imran Khan thinks of our cricket so I'm hopeful grassroot changes will be implemented soon and allowed to prosper. Anything meaningful requires 5-10 years to change so it will take some time.

Another stark difference I see between our players and their players is intelligence. Indian players know how to carry themselves while ours simply look lost sometimes. PCB needs to ensure that these guys get the proper education so they can speak and carry themselves well on and off the field and not rely on some old ratta-mar cliches to bail them out when someone asks a tough question.

This is why Misbah was so different he knew how to out think opposition when going got tough even though he had limited talent at his disposal.

 

[shaz72]

Some funny replies by the Indians

Truth is, India plays by conditions and Pakistan plays by Myths.

Because Waseem akram, Waqar, Imran and Shoaib played for pakistan, Paksitanis have this myth that we are a fast bowling nation. Hence, often any fool that decides to captain this team ends up filling up the squad with pacers. Plus, we Pakistanis also have this belief that India is weak against Pace, thus, having fast bowlers makes more sense.

What we dont do is, we dont play according to the conditions anymore. UAE conditions dictates that a team should have 2 full time spinners and 1 part time spinner to have an advantage in a match.
A score of 250 is easily defend-able on such wickets if you have a got spinners.

Before Asia Cup, this Indian team had only played 2 odi games in UAE, while Pakistan members played more than 50. And yet we have ignored the conditions.

THe reason why India is a top nation is that they have mastered the Asian conditions. India played and watched only a handful of gmaes in UAE and they were able to deduce that spinners are needed here.

Today India played 4 spinners. THey restricted Pakistan to 237 with 4 spinners!!! Even though Pakistan are good players of spin, India did not care. THey saw the conditions and went with 4 spinners.

India could had played Khalil Ahmad who didn't bowl that bad. They could had bought in Pandya for power hitting.
But they went with the conditions.

Afghanistan, a new team, gave more of a fight than Pakistan. Why? Becuase afghanistan is also playing 4-5 spinners. Nabi,Rashid, Mujeeb, Shinwari, Rehmat Shah

If in the finals, Hasan Ali ends up taking 5 wickets against India, trust me, next year we might be playing at an Indian dustbowl and yet Hasan Ali would be selected in the team 11 because in the past he took 5 wickets against India. We wont see why he took it or how he took it, we will just say he took it, and he can take it again because India are weak agaisnt pace(a myth)

ANd this isn't the first time pakistan made this mistake. Back in 2016's world t20. Matches were played in India. The wicekts were friendly. Statner was getting alot of spin and he threaten India alot. Hes the kind of bowler who is not even a top spinner, but yet he was getting alot of spin and created problems for India.

Santer took 4 wickets on that Nagpur pitch and was man of the match.

Week later Pakistan were to play in Kolkata against India. And guess what? Pakistan played 4 pacers. No full time spinners, only part timers like afridi and malik were there.

I knew before the match that there would be spin. During the match Ashwin came to bowl, and he spun the ball so much that the batsmen was surprised.

Point is, we ignore conditions, while India takes advantage of it.

THe reasons being looking professional, having a proper set up, lack of talent are just old lame ******** stories that we keep hearing all the time.

Your analysis is on dot. We lack game awareness fitness is only one expect of the game. We should be equally aware how to monitor and handle ever changing game situation. This also come with education unfortunately majority of our player doesn't have basic education the lack this. Furthermore, IPL has boosted Indian cricket they had invested wisely in their cricket and other sporting infrastructure . Whereas 2009 incident has destroyed any hope of improving the cricketing facility in Pakistan because of shortage of funds etc.

 

[Pakpak]

hi

as someone who played for mumbai under 16 23 years ago i see the following main differences

1- money

plenty of support at every level if u make it to state teams ( u16 onwards)
kids and parents think of it as a career( pandya bros, jadeja, chepu etc are products of parents wanting kids to succeeed cos of awesome financial rewards)
20 years ago it was boom or bust ( most never made it cos nepotism would killl u- now ipl saves u, gives u support and allows u to bloom and bcci complements it

2- ganguly - dravid- kumble - laxman

these guys changed indian cricket
ganguly brought in fight
dravid showed discipline
kumble - grit
laxman - few people realize that the fightback against aussies was the rise of the self belief in indian team ...

3 dalmiya

fought for indian cricket

4 fast bowling

this is something most people dont get it
bumrah bowling yorkers to pak batsmen in uae ..
but wait its factory behind him
kumar, pandya, shami, sharma i ,mavi , nagarkoti , khaleel, thampi, siraj mohammed .. few

its a miracle again due to ipl. players are fit and remain fit . due to ipl .

5 importance to winning abroad

60-90 india was happy to win in chennai . niw the goal is to win abroad - the hunger is there .dravid as u-19 coach and a team coach is an example of forward thinking (shastri is an aberration - kumble will be back )

6 less imp to pak

india as a country has changed .. nobody cares abt pak as an enemy etc . its another nation for sport . indians are most happy defeating australia

regarding pak- i can only say that natural talent is probably higher but india is finally getting the dhonis from jharkhand or the yadavs from vidarbha - true hinterland talent which is reason we can compete . pak on other hand seems to have regressed . no waqars or wasims seen ( amir was no wasim ever ) . likely represents the desire of pak men to migrate .

i think immigration to us and europe is v high in pakistani middle class which might be taking away some talent

Why don't normal Indian posters like you post here more

 

[Savak]

I feel not allowing Pakistani players to participate in IPL has played a part. Pakistani players dont get to o up against quality opposition with the odd exception of ENG. Its sad the country politics, Kashmir and whatelse not is causing all this disharmony... If I had my way I would allow Pakistani players to play in IPL as it is not right to see Pakistan as a weak team, I am used to the Pakistani teams which had quality players like Anwar, Akram, etc...

We tend to over romanticize the 80's and 90's. Cricket is a different game now in limited overs, it can be debated as to how well would the players in the 80's and 90's have done today

 

[jeetu]

Biggest issue is complacency. Pakistani players were relying too much on form against weak teams and were overconfident to steam roll every team in Asia Cup. Present Pakistani team tend to do better when they are not the favorites.

 

[prisha]

hi

as someone who played for mumbai under 16 23 years ago i see the following main differences

1- moneyt5

plenty of support at every level if u make it to state teams ( u16 onwards)
kids and parents think of it as a career( pandya bros, jadeja, chepu etc are products of parents wanting kids to succeeed cos of awesome financial rewards)
20 years ago it was boom or bust ( most never made it cos nepotism would killl u- now ipl saves u, gives u support and allows u to bloom and bcci complements it

2- ganguly - dravid- kumble - laxman

these guys changed indian cricket
ganguly brought in fight
dravid showed discipline
kumble - grit
laxman - few people realize that the fightback against aussies was the rise of the self belief in indian team ...

3 dalmiya

fought for indian cricket

4 fast bowling

this is something most people dont get it
bumrah bowling yorkers to pak batsmen in uae ..
but wait its factory behind him
kumar, pandya, shami, sharma i ,mavi , nagarkoti , khaleel, thampi, siraj mohammed .. few

its a miracle again due to ipl. players are fit and remain fit . due to ipl .

5 importance to winning abroad

60-90 india was happy to win in chennai . niw the goal is to win abroad - the hunger is there .dravid as u-19 coach and a team coach is an example of forward thinking (shastri is an aberration - kumble will be back )

6 less imp to pak

india as a country has changed .. nobody cares abt pak as an enemy etc . its another nation for sport . indians are most happy defeating australia

regarding pak- i can only say that natural talent is probably higher but india is finally getting the dhonis from jharkhand or the yadavs from vidarbha - true hinterland talent which is reason we can compete . pak on other hand seems to have regressed . no waqars or wasims seen ( amir was no wasim ever ) . likely represents the desire of pak men to migrate .

i think immigration to us and europe is v high in pakistani middle class which might be taking away some talent

This is the best analysis so far. This is what I wanted to write and you put it very eloquently. Even if current indian team fails multiple times we are confident our current setup will find replacement players. I hope pak finds few coaches dedicated to sport at grass root levels to instill discipline and confidence like dravid does. Indian middle class are better financially now so they are able to explore other options than education.