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Mir Hamza versus Shaheen Shah Afridi in Tests

Rana

Rana

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Who cares? Might as well start this thread.

Mir Hamza is evidently a better and more skilled left-arm seamer than Shaheen Afridi (who has been consistently playing international cricket since 2019).

Moreover, Hamza was entrusted with the responsibility of taking the new ball over Pakistan's so called premier seamer Shaheen Shah Afridi.

Why did Misbah-ul-Haq and Waqar Younis prefer Musa Khan, the 16-year-old Naseem Shah, and players like Tabish Khan over Mir Hamza, who is clearly a highly skilled pacer?
 
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Mir Hamza and Mohammad Abbas both should be frontline bowlers for Pakistan in Test Cricket, with Shaheen Shah Afridi as the third pacer. Shaheen has the opportunity to take 250+ Test wickets for Pakistan.
 
What match have you been watching? Mir Hamza looked the worst out of the 4 Pacers in this test match. No pace at all just bowling 120kph gun barrel straight.
 
FearlessRoar said:
Mir Hamza and Mohammad Abbas both should be frontline bowlers for Pakistan in Test Cricket, with Shaheen Shah Afridi as the third pacer. Shaheen has the opportunity to take 250+ Test wickets for Pakistan.
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For that to happen, I recon we will have to schedule a 3-5 match series every year against all of Sri Lanka, Bangladesh and Zimbabwe
 
fit Shaheen is league above Mir.
Mir can only play in England and New Zealand.
 
I rate Mir Hamza's skills but if there isn't any assistance he's not good enough to be playing for this team.

Shaheen, even whilst he's unfit, still bowls faster than him and is well ahead as a complete bowling package.
 
I’m not sure this comparison is necessary. Fast bowlers hunt in pairs. Sometimes you get wickets because of the guy at the other end. Just look at Australia bowling with Hazlewood and Cummins (of course Lyon and starc too) there is no respite on a fast wicket.

Shaheen and hamza with Jamal is a good attack. If Abrar is fit then this is a pretty good attack and Naseem just compliments it nicely…but it’s a long tail.
 
Mir Hamza is FC bowler, he isn't a test bowler that will get good players out on flat wickets, which most test wickets are. Swinging the ball at 78 mph will only trouble useless batsman.
 
bowls well in one innings, he is now better than shaheen. lol

first AA as captain, that Sajid Khan being considered the best spinner in the country, after which AJ being made captain, and now this.
 
bad bowler. The fact he has 400 first class wickets tells you how poor our domestic cricket is.
 
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If anyone who’s actually watched this series Hamza has actually bowled really well. I don’t think he is better than Shaheen but I do think Hamza should be persisted with
 
At least he isn’t crying about taking a rest from the best format of the game.

He’s been brilliant for Pakistan in this series. Good bowler
 
Major said:
bowls well in one innings, he is now better than shaheen. lol

first AA as captain, that Sajid Khan being considered the best spinner in the country, after which AJ being made captain, and now this.
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It’s more about Misbah ul Haq opting for bowlers like Musa Khan and 16 year old Naseem instead of proper bowlers on the Australian tour 4 years ago.

And how has Mir bowled poorly besides his good bowling in 1 innings according to you? He has bowled excellent in 3/4 innings that he played. Is it his fault that Pakistan have been bowled out for 130 to win?
 
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adzzy786 said:
If anyone who’s actually watched this series Hamza has actually bowled really well. I don’t think he is better than Shaheen but I do think Hamza should be persisted with
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Hamza is useless on flat wickets. He only made an impact in Melbourne because that pitch had some green bounce but even then he was out bowled by many other bowlers. He is not international quality
 
Savak said:
Hamza is useless on flat wickets. He only made an impact in Melbourne because that pitch had some green bounce but even then he was out bowled by many other bowlers. He is not international quality
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How many international games has he played on flat wickets? How can you make the judgement?
 
Misbah ul Haq brought ‘the worst bowling attack to enter Australian shores’

But his devout worshipper wants to make fun of Mir Hamza’s bowling
 
seeing him bowl 120 kph while defending 130 runs is just a joke. One innings wonder.
 
Where is Shaheen in this Test match?

Oh wait he is in the nets practicing how to swing a new white kookaburra
 
jnaveen1980 said:
Hamza is decent. He can be more useful in England. Even here he was decent.
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How was he decent? He didn't take wickets when the team needed him too. Test matches is not about unimpactful economical look good do nothing bowling, you have to take wickets for your team.

Hazelwood destroyed Pakistan with a 3 wicket burst in one over and changed the entire test match. That is called impact.

Wasim Jr would have been more beneficial for Pakistan if he picked up wickets albeit at a higher economy rate.
 
Savak said:
How was he decent? He didn't take wickets when the team needed him too. Test matches is not about unimpactful economical look good do nothing bowling, you have to take wickets for your team.

Hazelwood destroyed Pakistan with a 3 wicket burst in one over and changed the entire test match. That is called impact.

Wasim Jr would have been more beneficial for Pakistan if he picked up wickets albeit at a higher economy rate.
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Hazlewood is one of the best channel bowler going around. Don't think Mirza is anywhere close to him. But he was reasonably accurate pitching on a good length. This trundling speed is the only downside as batsmen stand outside. But in England this speed will be ideal.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
Hazlewood is one of the best channel bowler going around. Don't think Mirza is anywhere close to him. But he was reasonably accurate pitching on a good length. This trundling speed is the only downside as batsmen stand outside. But in England this speed will be ideal.
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You can't select a bowler like Hamza just because of the perception he will be good in England. You should only be selected for the country if you can perform in all conditions
 
Savak said:
How was he decent? He didn't take wickets when the team needed him too. Test matches is not about unimpactful economical look good do nothing bowling, you have to take wickets for your team.

Hazelwood destroyed Pakistan with a 3 wicket burst in one over and changed the entire test match. That is called impact.

Wasim Jr would have been more beneficial for Pakistan if he picked up wickets albeit at a higher economy rate.
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Hamza was not the problem here Wasim should have played but for Hassan who was as usual useful. Hamza is a decent back up for Shaheen and should play whenever a Shaheen is rested

In an ideal world this is our test pacers by order of selection

Naseem
Shaheen
Jamal
Khurram
Hamza

Wasim and Ihsanullah the wild cards if they show performance then can leap ahead of Khurram and Hamza
 
Our second best bowler this series, I liked what I saw from him. It's a testament to picking experienced domestic players. Even when he wasn't taking wickets he rarely bowled poorly, keeping it tight and restricting runs
 
Bewal Express said:
Mir Hamza is FC bowler, he isn't a test bowler that will get good players out on flat wickets, which most test wickets are. Swinging the ball at 78 mph will only trouble useless batsman.
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He may not get wickets every match but he’s a good line and length bowler. He has decent height and control. His speed needs to improve by a yard or two. 84-85 is fine. 78-79mph is a little inadequate for sure.

But there have been many bowlers operating around the 78-79mph mark that have been very successful. Shaun pollock, B kumar, chaminda vaas etc. They all relied on a very good bowler at the other end. That’s the main issue we have. Mir Hamza with Hasan Ali looked awful but with SSA he looked a lot better.
 
Major said:
seeing him bowl 120 kph while defending 130 runs is just a joke. One innings wonder.
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What is he supposed to do? Suddenly start bowling 160kmh because Pakistan is defending 130?

What a ridiculous comment
 
Like I said before. Pakistan best ploy moving forward is " horses for courses " selection regarding the seamers. The surface decides the outcome of the attack. So yes, all the seamers need to be fit and firing and available for selection
 
Savak said:
How was he decent? He didn't take wickets when the team needed him too. Test matches is not about unimpactful economical look good do nothing bowling, you have to take wickets for your team.

Hazelwood destroyed Pakistan with a 3 wicket burst in one over and changed the entire test match. That is called impact.

Wasim Jr would have been more beneficial for Pakistan if he picked up wickets albeit at a higher economy rate.
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What is your issue?

Which bowler in Pakistan takes wickets when you desperately need them? Tell me how is Hamza any worse than those bowlers who have magical wicket taking at the right time ability?
 
Major said:
seeing him bowl 120 kph while defending 130 runs is just a joke. One innings wonder.
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You see Major the other day you claimed that your opposition of a player is based on cricketing reasons…

Well what’s this? How is this isn’t pure hate spouted by you? Is it because you have to defend the howlers made by previous managements?
 
Abid Z said:
He may not get wickets every match but he’s a good line and length bowler. He has decent height and control. His speed needs to improve by a yard or two. 84-85 is fine. 78-79mph is a little inadequate for sure.

But there have been many bowlers operating around the 78-79mph mark that have been very successful. Shaun pollock, B kumar, chaminda vaas etc. They all relied on a very good bowler at the other end. That’s the main issue we have. Mir Hamza with Hasan Ali looked awful but with SSA he looked a lot better.
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He isn't improving and he isn't very good. There may be the odd pitch or ground that he looks OK on but let's be clear he ain't getting good players on typical test pitches
 
Absolutely, Mir Hamza is better than Shaheen Shah Afridi. In this three Test match series against Australia, Shaheen's bowling average is 42, while Mir Hamza has an average of 21.
 
FearlessRoar said:
Absolutely, Mir Hamza is better than Shaheen Shah Afridi. In this three Test match series against Australia, Shaheen's bowling average is 42, while Mir Hamza has an average of 21.
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Exactly. All it takes is basic cricket sense and understanding to realise this. You can clearly see the gulf in quality and skill. The man has learned his art grinding and toiling rigorously on domestic circuits in Pakistan and England.
 
These 78mph bowlers are all over county teams and he isn't better than them, infact he did play County cricket and from memory he didnt do alot. He played in April-May, in conditions that suit him. Good solid pro, but not international quality.
 
Bewal Express said:
These 78mph bowlers are all over county teams and he isn't better than them, infact he did play County cricket and from memory he didnt do alot. He played in April-May, in conditions that suit him. Good solid pro, but not international quality.
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Agree. His county performances were marginal at best.

For seaming conditions, Pakistan's best bet is still Abbas
 
aboveandbeyond said:
Like I said before. Pakistan best ploy moving forward is " horses for courses " selection regarding the seamers. The surface decides the outcome of the attack. So yes, all the seamers need to be fit and firing and available for selection
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Who does this? Test cricket isn’t T20 cricket

You have a settled XI for all conditions. Which horses for courses do Australia have? They are arguably the number 1 Test side in the world and have been for quite some time
 
Abbas is too old. The problem was that he was OK with his 1st spell and then his pace dropped to a point that it was only 75mph later in the day.
 
Rana said:
Exactly. All it takes is basic cricket sense and understanding to realise this. You can clearly see the gulf in quality and skill. The man has learned his art grinding and toiling rigorously on domestic circuits in Pakistan and England.
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He's got no other option but to toil away in domestics Doesn't really bring anything for other formats.

Multi format performers are like gold dust in international cricket and the big franchises
 
Bewal Express said:
He isn't improving and he isn't very good. There may be the odd pitch or ground that he looks OK on but let's be clear he ain't getting good players on typical test pitches
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To get good players out you need good bowling partners and all 4 bowlers in form. 1 loose bowler and the attack falls apart. Australia are so good because all four are fantastic.
India are so good because they have at least 4 good bowlers.

England have weakened because now there’s only Anderson and broad possibly woakes but stokes and archer are injured.

One weak link and the bowling falls apart.

Hamza will improve …he’s only played 4 tests.

SSA NEEDS to step up.

Jamal now is a shoe in.

The fourth bowler needs to emerge. Possibly Naseem/ Khurram but they will be returning from injury.
Of course you need a good spinner too.

With that combination you can think about Mir but now is not the time there are bigger concerns.
 
Hamza needs to be done away with. You will not do much in international cricket operating at 75-80 mph
 
Mir Hamza is not a better bowler than Shaheen. He would have been very useful for Pakistan, had he been given chance in his early 20s but sadly as with a lot of talented domestic players they never get to play for Pakistan. He is still an asset as a backup option. Better than Hassan Ali in tests at the moment.
 
Abid Z said:
To get good players out you need good bowling partners and all 4 bowlers in form. 1 loose bowler and the attack falls apart. Australia are so good because all four are fantastic.
India are so good because they have at least 4 good bowlers.

England have weakened because now there’s only Anderson and broad possibly woakes but stokes and archer are injured.

One weak link and the bowling falls apart.

Hamza will improve …he’s only played 4 tests.

SSA NEEDS to step up.

Jamal now is a shoe in.

The fourth bowler needs to emerge. Possibly Naseem/ Khurram but they will be returning from injury.
Of course you need a good spinner too.

With that combination you can think about Mir but now is not the time there are bigger concerns.
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If Hamza improves then I will be the 1st to apologise but when you are 31( and that is a PK cricket age) then the chances he won't.
 
Abid Z said:
To get good players out you need good bowling partners and all 4 bowlers in form. 1 loose bowler and the attack falls apart. Australia are so good because all four are fantastic.
India are so good because they have at least 4 good bowlers.

England have weakened because now there’s only Anderson and broad possibly woakes but stokes and archer are injured.

One weak link and the bowling falls apart.

Hamza will improve …he’s only played 4 tests.

SSA NEEDS to step up.

Jamal now is a shoe in.

The fourth bowler needs to emerge. Possibly Naseem/ Khurram but they will be returning from injury.
Of course you need a good spinner too.

With that combination you can think about Mir but now is not the time there are bigger concerns.
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bro how is Hamza going to improve? He is 31 years old in cricketing ages and is bowling 125 kph. How is he gonna increase his pace at this age?
His bowling speed has been the same for quite some time now. Even when he made his debut he was 130 kph bowler.
 
A stunningly high percentage of maiden overs by Pakistan young pace sensation Mir Hamza. Check out his stats below. Simply bravo👏
IMG-20240106-WA0053.jpg
 
The Bald Eagle said:
A stunningly high percentage of maiden overs by Pakistan young pace sensation Mir Hamza. Check out his stats below. Simply bravo👏
View attachment 141101
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Maidens are not enough in test cricket. I will take a bowler who picks 3-4 wickets at an economy rate of 5-6 vs someone who bowls 20-25 maidens with no wickets to show for it classic look good do nothing unimpactful bowling, such a bowler puts pressure on the other bowlers to over attack to strive for wickets.

This is not T20 and ODI Cricket where economy matters. Even in ODI Cricket bowlers operating in the opening and middle overs need to pick up wickets.
 
Savak said:
Maidens are not enough in test cricket. I will take a bowler who picks 3-4 wickets at an economy rate of 5-6 vs someone who bowls 20-25 maidens with no wickets to show for it classic look good do nothing unimpactful bowling, such a bowler puts pressure on the other bowlers to over attack to strive for wickets.

This is not T20 and ODI Cricket where economy matters. Even in ODI Cricket bowlers operating in the opening and middle overs need to pick up wickets.
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You would but not proper teams

That sort of economy is acceptable from a 4th/5th seamer. Not an out and out bowler. Building pressure through economy is the Art of Test cricket. Wickets fall when pressure builds, especially against proper batting line ups.
 
Rana said:
Where is Shaheen in this Test match?

Oh wait he is in the nets practicing how to swing a new white kookaburra
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If Shaheen was the one who requested to be rested for this game then he deserves all the criticism for skipping this test.
 
topspin said:
If Shaheen was the one who requested to be rested for this game then he deserves all the criticism for skipping this test.
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It’s clearly documented that it was Shaheen’s decision to skip the Test
 
Rana said:
Misbah ul Haq brought ‘the worst bowling attack to enter Australian shores’

But his devout worshipper wants to make fun of Mir Hamza’s bowling
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He will shift the blame on Waqar, who was the Bowling Coach at the time, but the fault lies entirely with Misbah who was responsible for bringing him in and accepting his recommendations.

For a duo who've played more than enough cricket in Australia, Misbah and Waqar have shockingly low cricketing IQ. The same goes to the Misbah cult as well. Their reading of the game is shockingly bad because they're unable to see cricket outside his lens.
 
topspin said:
He will shift the blame on Waqar, who was the Bowling Coach at the time, but the fault lies entirely with Misbah who was responsible for bringing him in and accepting his recommendations.

For a duo who've played more than enough cricket in Australia, Misbah and Waqar have shockingly low cricketing IQ. The same goes to the Misbah cult as well. Their reading of the game is shockingly bad because they're unable to see cricket outside his lens.
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Exactly

He has the ‘Humana doggy Tommy’ attitude when it comes to Misbah’s sense of direction. Horrendous distorter of facts and reality when it comes to cricket
 
Mir Hamza definitely has superior bowling skills because unlike Shaheen he can swing the ball both ways.

However, we also Abbas operate at the same pace. His line and length was impeccable but he got found out as batsmen would stand well outside their crease to negate the swing/seam. Let's not forget Abbas was a superior bowler to Hamza as well.

I like Mir Hamza. He's a great fielder and gives it his all but unfortunately he won't survive at international level because of his gentle pace.
 
topspin said:
Mir Hamza definitely has superior bowling skills because unlike Shaheen he can swing the ball both ways.

However, we also Abbas operate at the same pace. His line and length was impeccable but he got found out as batsmen would stand well outside their crease to negate the swing/seam. Let's not forget Abbas was a superior bowler to Hamza as well.

I like Mir Hamza. He's a great fielder and gives it his all but unfortunately he won't survive at international level because of his gentle pace.
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Abbas and Hamza are a bit different

I personally would never expect any keeper to stand up to the stumps to Mir. I think he is a lot quicker off the pitch than his pace suggests. A good, decent keeper can back themselves to stand up to the stumps to Abbas and his action is a lot more easier to read as compared to Hamza’s.

Hamza is a very good white ball seamer too. I am sure he would run through a top international team with right handers in the top 4 if given the chance on a day+pitch that offers some assistance.
 
Rana said:
Abbas and Hamza are a bit different

I personally would never expect any keeper to stand up to the stumps to Mir. I think he is a lot quicker off the pitch than his pace suggests. A good, decent keeper can back themselves to stand up to the stumps to Abbas and his action is a lot more easier to read as compared to Hamza’s.

Hamza is a very good white ball seamer too. I am sure he would run through a top international team with right handers in the top 4 if given the chance on a day+pitch that offers some assistance.
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That's a good point. I agree with this. Mir Hamza is also taller which might explain why he's quicker off the pitch.

I also like how he set up Mitchell Starc in the second test. Roughed him up with a decent bouncer before getting him to edge one behind.
 
Rana said:
Why did Misbah-ul-Haq and Waqar Younis prefer Musa Khan, the 16-year-old Naseem Shah, and players like Tabish Khan over Mir Hamza, who is clearly a highly skilled pacer?
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Whilst the outcome (whitewash) was the same, Pakistan look levels above the last two tours, where Misbah attempted to captain and then coach the side in the next series.

With better fielding, Pakistan would've won at least one test match.

Misbah supporters have been left red faced by the leadership of Shan Masood, who's gone toe-to-toe with Australia in numerous session during the series.
 
topspin said:
Whilst the outcome (whitewash) was the same, Pakistan look levels above the last two tours, where Misbah attempted to captain and then coach the side in the next series.

With better fielding, Pakistan would've won at least one test match.

Misbah supporters have been left red faced by the leadership of Shan Masood, who's gone toe-to-toe with Australia in numerous session during the series.
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No wonder they are going after players that were ignored by Misbah ul haq tuk tukand his terrible cricket ideology.

Mir Hamza alone has been better than Misbah’s entire career as a coach in Test Cricket in Australia
 
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Major said:
bro how is Hamza going to improve? He is 31 years old in cricketing ages and is bowling 125 kph. How is he gonna increase his pace at this age?
His bowling speed has been the same for quite some time now. Even when he made his debut he was 130 kph bowler.
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I’m not necessarily disagreeing with you. I’m saying two points.

1) whist 125 kph (77/78) is not conducive to getting good test cricketers out on docile tracks, It’s control , line and length with seam and swing that’s most important alongside a good bowling unit. There are ample examples of very successful tall medium pacers who have been very successful if only as part of a good unit. Shaun pollock, philander, chaminda vaas are prime examples. So it’s not just Mir who has to improve the whole bowling unit must be tight. It doesn’t have to be spectacular, just nice and disciplined. Very much like India in the 2000’s or even New Zealand.
2) yes Mir is not young but 31 is hardly old. When you are part of the international setup and regularly bowling at this level you tend to lift yourself and have exposure to elite coaches and biomechanics. At domestic level you tend to bowl within yourself. Just look how much Tim Southee has improved over the years. Even broad is strictly 135kph but just gets better with age (because they also have good bowling partners.

Pressure for places helps. You need a squad of at least 6-7 medium fast bowlers match ready. Just look at Australia the guy with one of the best averages in the world Boland is match ready and sitting on the bench.

Be patient
SSA, hamza, Jamal, Naseem, Wasim, Hussnain, is a good squad. There are a few others that just need a few tweaks (ihsanulla, etc) need a bit of experience but squad rotation is important.
Pak don’t play that much test cricket so bowlers need exposure.
 
Abid Z said:
I’m not necessarily disagreeing with you. I’m saying two points.

1) whist 125 kph (77/78) is not conducive to getting good test cricketers out on docile tracks, It’s control , line and length with seam and swing that’s most important alongside a good bowling unit. There are ample examples of very successful tall medium pacers who have been very successful if only as part of a good unit. Shaun pollock, philander, chaminda vaas are prime examples. So it’s not just Mir who has to improve the whole bowling unit must be tight. It doesn’t have to be spectacular, just nice and disciplined. Very much like India in the 2000’s or even New Zealand.
2) yes Mir is not young but 31 is hardly old. When you are part of the international setup and regularly bowling at this level you tend to lift yourself and have exposure to elite coaches and biomechanics. At domestic level you tend to bowl within yourself. Just look how much Tim Southee has improved over the years. Even broad is strictly 135kph but just gets better with age (because they also have good bowling partners.

Pressure for places helps. You need a squad of at least 6-7 medium fast bowlers match ready. Just look at Australia the guy with one of the best averages in the world Boland is match ready and sitting on the bench.

Be patient
SSA, hamza, Jamal, Naseem, Wasim, Hussnain, is a good squad. There are a few others that just need a few tweaks (ihsanulla, etc) need a bit of experience but squad rotation is important.
Pak don’t play that much test cricket so bowlers need exposure.
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The bowlers you mentioned in point one, are those bowlers that are more like Khurram Shezad. He also was bowling at lower speeds but he was consistent with his line and length. Mir Hamza is not a similar kind of bowler and relies the air more.

Mir couldn't really imporve himself since his debut and his pace is just dipping more.
 
Major said:
The bowlers you mentioned in point one, are those bowlers that are more like Khurram Shezad. He also was bowling at lower speeds but he was consistent with his line and length. Mir Hamza is not a similar kind of bowler and relies the air more.

Mir couldn't really imporve himself since his debut and his pace is just dipping more.
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Whether he is improving or not since debut,

Right at this very moment he is a better Test class seamer than Shaheen Afridi. You heard that right. And Shaheen has been bowling consistently at international level for the past 4 years, barring his one injury break. So what does that say about Hamza?

Don’t even try to say Shaheen is a better Test match bowler than Hamza right at this moment. It’s going to be a lie. So don’t even bother
 
Mir Hamza is another look good do nothing bowler like Abbas. He is not going to trouble the top teams and is going to be ineffective on placid wickets. Wickets are what wins games for you. I would rather have an Amir Jamal going for 5-6 runs per over provided he picks up 3-4 wickets in the process in comparison to Hamza who will bowl 10-15 maidens but not have any wickets to show for it. In test cricket, batsmen have enough time to play out channel bowlers
 
Brother, why does everything have to be a versus with Pakistani players?

Sarfraz Vs Rizwan
Mir vs Shaheen

What’s the point to always tarnish one Pakistani player in lieu of the other?

What’s the point of such black and white thinking?

What is stopping people from accepting that most of the time there’s players who have pros and cons over one other? That it’s not as one sided as you perceive it to be?

I won’t engage in the debate because I’m a fan of both and don’t want to say x is better than y to play down y.

I like Shaheen but have been wanting to see Hamza get the chance to play at this level for a few years now and am very happy for him esp with the new ball skills he has to move it both ways.
 
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Major said:
The bowlers you mentioned in point one, are those bowlers that are more like Khurram Shezad. He also was bowling at lower speeds but he was consistent with his line and length. Mir Hamza is not a similar kind of bowler and relies the air more.

Mir couldn't really imporve himself since his debut and his pace is just dipping more.
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I don’t think hamza has disgraced himself on this tour at all. Regardless of pace he seems to belong at international level alongside Afridi. They complement each other nicely. I think whether he improves or not is yet to be seen. He’s only 4 tests old. I’d rather see a bowler toil away in domestics and then get into the national team than see somebody arrive with a bang play a handful of tests and then breakdown. We will see re his speed. Doesn’t look like Pak have that many tests in 2024 anyway.
 
Suleiman said:
Brother, why does everything have to be a versus with Pakistani players?

Sarfraz Vs Rizwan
Mir vs Shaheen

What’s the point to always tarnish one Pakistani player in lieu of the other?

What’s the point of such black and white thinking?
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With all due respect brother,

I appreciate that you want this world of Pakistan cricket to be fair and non-toxic. That’s how I wanted to see this, I always did for a long time as a Pakistan cricket fan. I’ve seen enough, and I’ve suffered enough as a Pakistan cricket fan for my optimism for all players to completely die.

When Luke Skywalker asked his father to return to the light side, Anakin’s response was “it is too late for me son.”
These threads, comparisons of players within the squad are a result of it all. I’ve seen enough disrespect of players that have served Pakistan in the past, and fans+journalists making it seem that these current players are untouchable whereas those before them never truly deserved to represent Pakistan as they were under political regimes that are not acceptable. Sorry but it was never about the politics for me, it still wouldn’t have been unless those who were in favour of a new regime (post 2019) had not made it seem like everything now is great whereas everything in the past was bad.

When Carl told Negan that we can all live together happily in a world of fairness and goodness, Negan’s response was “do you think any of this is fair?”

I have gone too far down this road of Pakistan cricket darkness that it is too late for me to return to that world of positivity. The regime change in 2019 allowed a section of Pakistan cricket fans to tear into our cricket system, social media narrative that has left a sickening taste in my stomach. I see Pakistan cricket now as two separate identities; the one that existed Pre-2019 and the one that existed after. They are two separate Pakistan’s.

Maybe one day those who played their role in the divide can realise the massive damage they have done due to the political goal scoring, because it only gives rise to people like me. My vengeance is based on the truth, and facts. It serves as a strong reality check and a reminder.

If I say that I believe Mir Hamza is a better Test bowler in terms of skill and control than Shaheen Afridi…why does this statement hurt that section of fans? It hurts because everything I said above is true. I know it to be true.
 
I wonder why he can not add 5-7 kph while keeping his skills. Bhuvi did it, why can't Hamza. I fear our players are just lazy, not pushing themselves beyond their limits.
 
Reflecting back on this series, if you ask the Australian team which pakistan bowling line up would they rather face out of:

Shaheen
Naseem
Hassan Ali
Jamal

Or

Hamza
Khurram
Hassan Ali
Jamal

Who do you think they would honestly rather face? I’m pretty sure they would much rather face the Naseem+Shaheen one because of their lack of control and discipline to build the pressure of taking wickets.
 
Rana said:
Reflecting back on this series, if you ask the Australian team which pakistan bowling line up would they rather face out of:

Shaheen
Naseem
Hassan Ali
Jamal

Or

Hamza
Khurram
Hassan Ali
Jamal

Who do you think they would honestly rather face? I’m pretty sure they would much rather face the Naseem+Shaheen one because of their lack of control and discipline to build the pressure of taking wickets.
Click to expand...
I think Naseem is pretty good. Rate him much higher than Shaheen. Seemed to be the only player that consistently troubled the Indians. This new version of Shaheen is terrible.
 
Shaheen has better pace but he is not disciplined enough in Test cricket.

On the other hand Mir Hamza doesn't have much pace but he is very accurate with his line and length which makes him a little superior to Shaheen.

So my pick would be Mir Hamza.
 
I don't understand why Shaheen keeps getting chances after his horrible performances in Tests. Mir Hamza has already proven that he is a better option compared to Shaheen.
 
Cricket Warrior said:
I don't understand why Shaheen keeps getting chances after his horrible performances in Tests. Mir Hamza has already proven that he is a better option compared to Shaheen.
Click to expand...
Mir Hamza is a better option thanks to line and length.

Speed wise even women cricketers would be embrassed. That aussie girl I forgot her name but she's playing the women's world cup atm. She's clicking it at 129-130kph and wrecking havoc.

The fact that she bowls faster then mir Hamza is hilarious.

Mcgrath was the only exception, as frankly I have never heard of a medium only bowler that can succeed in cricket. Moat west indian players who would also bowl at said speeds were allrounds and batters, and even they weren't throwing it at 120kph like mir Hamza.

It tells us more about how crap shaheen has become then mir Hamza being special or anything
 
Rana said:
Why do you have so many classics that do not age well?
Click to expand...
I wish I could find the post this year where he said

"Miandad is the 2nd best thing to ever come out of Pakistan after Babar Azam"

And his atg odi team of

1) Saeed Anwar/ Imam( Yes he actually contemplated between these 2 lol)
2) Fakhar Zaman
3) Babar
4) Rizwan
5) Miandad
6) Misbah
7) Shadab
8) Imran (Shadab batting above imran lol)
9) Wasim
10) Waqar
11) Shaheen
 
I think Mir Hamza should be in the team for 2nd test. Re his speed yes it’s a worry but Philander and Shaun Pollock were never Fast. Though we desperately need a good spinner.
 
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