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Mohammad Abbas in ODIs?

He does deserve at least one chance but i think he is not suited. Doesnt have pace or a killer slower ball. Cant hold a bat as well.

Lets not distract ourselves from his Test performances.
 
No.

Amir
Hasan
Shaheen
Shadab
Faheem

+ a few overs here and there from Talat and Haris.
 
no, his bowling style (medium pace, line and length) will get destroyed by any decent opener in ODIs on most wickets. his List A stats suggest that he's a much better bowler in tests / first class

I would continue investing in Shinwari, Shaheen Shah, Faheem, Rumman in ODI's, along with Hassan and Amir
 
PakSarZameen said:
No. His List A stats suggest he is only a Test bowler.
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His List A stats aren't awful, it's 27.87. We're playing Junaid Khan for example who has worse list A stats. Raees has 26.77 which is a bit better but not much. Shinwari has excellent list A stats of 22.33.

If he can bowl well upfront with the new ball, I'd argue that might be better than a potentially better bowler who can only bowl well with the old ball. And I don't know if we have a better new ball bowler in Pakistan atm other than Amir.

Who would people here play instead out of interest?
 
Why not?? Play him in T20 as well so as Sami Aslam....
Select 15 players and play them all 3 formats until they burns out
 
I wouldn't play him in T20s. He won't get burnt out lol, Pakistan play hardly any test cricket and Abbas's action and speed isn't exactly straining. Doesn't bat much either.
 
ads101 said:
His List A stats aren't awful, it's 27.87. We're playing Junaid Khan for example who has worse list A stats. Raees has 26.77 which is a bit better but not much. Shinwari has excellent list A stats of 22.33.

If he can bowl well upfront with the new ball, I'd argue that might be better than a potentially better bowler who can only bowl well with the old ball. And I don't know if we have a better new ball bowler in Pakistan atm other than Amir.

Who would people here play instead out of interest?
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27 is not very good at all by current domestic standards. Its a bit worse than Riaz if I am not mistaken. Why would you play Abbas who averages 27 over Sadaf who averages 18? The gap in performance is huge. Yet what Abbas' continuing performance in international cricket reaffirms is that it is worth while paying attention to domestic performances records. International cricket is not easier than domestic cricket, most of the time, and there is no reason to expect bowlers who do relatively poorly in domestic cricket to be better against tougher competition.
 
New Yorker said:
27 is not very good at all by current domestic standards. Its a bit worse than Riaz if I am not mistaken. Why would you play Abbas who averages 27 over Sadaf who averages 18? The gap in performance is huge. Yet what Abbas' continuing performance in international cricket reaffirms is that it is worth while paying attention to domestic performances records. International cricket is not easier than domestic cricket, most of the time, and there is no reason to expect bowlers who do relatively poorly in domestic cricket to be better against tougher competition.
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It's no longer 18 now 20 on flat wickets it's doubtful whether any fast bowler can average sub 25 in international one day cricket but on merit Sadaf deserves a chance he would've done better than Rahat in England in test cricket.
 
New Yorker said:
27 is not very good at all by current domestic standards. Its a bit worse than Riaz if I am not mistaken. Why would you play Abbas who averages 27 over Sadaf who averages 18? The gap in performance is huge. Yet what Abbas' continuing performance in international cricket reaffirms is that it is worth while paying attention to domestic performances records. International cricket is not easier than domestic cricket, most of the time, and there is no reason to expect bowlers who do relatively poorly in domestic cricket to be better against tougher competition.
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I'm being realistic and I don't think Sadaf will be given a chance. He should be, but he won't in the near future.

27 isn't great, but it's not bad either. As I said we are playing guys with similar bowling domestic records anyway. Junaid has a worse domestic record as of now (I think it used to be better). And Raees has a slightly better one. And yet these are our two main third pacer options atm. I wouldn't mind a bowler averaging 27 in ODIs who bowls well with the new ball atm.

Riaz was actually decent till the two new ball rule ruined him. I think this is a big problem with a lot of our bowlers, they simply prefer the old ball, when ODIs favour the new ball with the rule changes. Too often team start off well against us, even if we tend to take wickets in the middle (with Hasan and Shadab). It'd be much nicer to start off strong too.
 
Keep him away from Odis

If he has a successful time vs England , give Abbas an A contract, give him a fitness routine and let him play tests and county

No reason for him to play Odis, we have better optiona anyway
 
ads101 said:
I'm being realistic and I don't think Sadaf will be given a chance. He should be, but he won't in the near future.

27 isn't great, but it's not bad either. As I said we are playing guys with similar bowling domestic records anyway. Junaid has a worse domestic record as of now (I think it used to be better). And Raees has a slightly better one. And yet these are our two main third pacer options atm. I wouldn't mind a bowler averaging 27 in ODIs who bowls well with the new ball atm.

Riaz was actually decent till the two new ball rule ruined him. I think this is a big problem with a lot of our bowlers, they simply prefer the old ball, when ODIs favour the new ball with the rule changes. Too often team start off well against us, even if we tend to take wickets in the middle (with Hasan and Shadab). It'd be much nicer to start off strong too.
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I hadn't realized Junaid's average was so poor, and his list A is worse than his ODI average. Yet for all the stick he gets, he was a standout performer in the CT; should have been included in the XI for the tournament.

I don't see the case for Abbas in ODIs or T20 really. Again it is not about whether 27 is bad or not (it is deeply mediocre) Why would you pick a 27 over a 20-22? Of which there are more than Sadaf.

If Abbas is unfit and Sadaf somehow still a taboo subject for the PCB, Shinwari should get the nod, he's a had a good international debut and has a better List A record than Abbas at ave 22.

If not Shinwari perhaps Rumman; really just whoever has done best in recent domestic List A tourneys. Work down the list. But Abbas is not really up there as far as I know. And again, I am huge fan of his as a Test bowler.
 
Why isn't Mohammad Abbas tried in ODIs as an option?

I think he bowled quite well during our Test series and could have been tried during an ODI series. He could be the next Asif
 
Several reasons. He's a test bowler. That format of the game suits his style. Plus, he can't field and nor can he bat. Moreover, look at his FC stats vs List A. That should give you the answer. Similar to Mir Hamza.

He's a new ball specialist. He will get hammered as the ball wears down. Basically, he's not suited for ODI's
 
Something said:
Several reasons. He's a test bowler. That format of the game suits his style. Plus, he can't field and nor can he bat. Moreover, look at his FC stats vs List A. That should give you the answer. Similar to Mir Hamza.

He's a new ball specialist. He will get hammered as the ball wears down. Basically, he's not suited for ODI's
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He played some t20's for his Leceister and did pretty well actually. He would give you 1 or 2 wickets every powerplay each game plus he has a good yorker so he can bowl with the old ball as well.
 
Amirforpresident said:
He played some t20's for his Leceister and did pretty well actually. He would give you 1 or 2 wickets every powerplay each game plus he has a good yorker so he can bowl with the old ball as well.
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He averages 41 in T20's compared to 17.69 in tests. Also, his economy is almost 9 in T20's
 
Unless he's very accurate and has a good Yorker he won't succeed on flat wickets bowling 125kph in limited overs.
By now Sadaf should've been tried as he has done well in List A cricket.
 
Amirforpresident said:
He played some t20's for his Leceister and did pretty well actually. He would give you 1 or 2 wickets every powerplay each game plus he has a good yorker so he can bowl with the old ball as well.
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You do realise Leicester is division 2 in uk. And those 4/5 day performances have come under cloudy skies and fast pitches. No doubt he’s our only world class bowler but the UAE requires not just one good bowler but at least a good fast bowling pair and a couple of very good spin options.
 
Should have been part of the squad for ages now. He has bowled well in Asia, West Indies and UK now so has taken wickets in all conditions. He has a knack of picking top order wickets. And is comfortable opening the bowler.

In contrast atm only Amir is comfortable opening the bowling. And Amir isn't taking wickets, especially top order ones in either tests or ODIs.

Abbas is consistent at bowling well and hitting the right length for long periods of time. A lot of our players are too inconsistent and can't keep it up as the innings progress.

It really didn't hurt trying him out. Yeah it's nice to see actual fast bowlers, but these type of bowlers have done well in the past even in ODIs. His list A record isn't terrible either, it's 27 something. We've tried out guys with worse records in the past like Rahat Ali in ODIs. Not that it matters that much, I think international success in any format is probably a better indicator than domestic.
 
I think in favourable conditions he could do damage. The problem is other than the new ball , he wouldn't be of any use. He isn't a great fielder and is a pure tailender. So we would be picking for someone for there new ball skills. Let's be honest how many ODI pitches are favourable for seam movement ?

If he plays I would only bowl him in the first 20 overs. I don't see him being selected in any case.
 
Time to again seriously reconsider him for ODIs. Seems like he makes it work whatever the conditions, and nearly always gets good length.

Philander turned out with a decent average in ODIs despite fears he wouldn't be good in them either (and he had a much poorer list A bowling average than Abbas), so I don't see the harm of giving Abbas a go.
 
I think his style of bowling will only work for first 3/4 overs but nothing to say he cant develop a good yorker or bouncer for death overs. But I would leave him to concentrate on test match cricket for Pakistan. Plus he cant bat or field which doesn't work in ODI's.
 
ODI is played with white Kookaburra, therefore it's not so conclusive for him in ODI. But, if he can control the white ball on spot at 127-134KM, definitely can be an option. He can give a long opening spell of 7-8 overs & take couple of early wickets.

In every aspect, that series against ZIM reserves was a disaster - instead of obvious names, PAK could have played Abbas, Afridi & couple of new faces in spin & batting department to test the bench; a WK as well.
 
I don't know what kind of variations he has but by bowling at 130 kph he is not going to trouble batsmen on the kind of pitches ODIs are played nowadays.

When you're bowling 128-133 kph, your yorkers and bouncers become ineffective too. And he's not going to reverse the white ball. So idk how he will pick up wickets in ODIs.
 
Stewie said:
More importantly, should Bilal Asif be playing ODIs?
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Was gonna say and am sure someone will make a thread of that too. But it's a little early for Bilal, Abbas has played quite a few international games now, and looking at him in tests and comparing to our current pacers in ODI who have not looked stellar of late, I'm not all together convinced Abbas would do worse.

I could see Bilal fitting in at 8, Shadab at 7. Two spinners worked for India in England, and I'd like if we did the same. It does arguably make our batting a bit weak though, and Shadab would have to up his batting. But at least you'd have two proper bowlers in them who would be expected to bowl 10 overs and allowed spin bowlers to have a partner. Faheem as 4th pacer, not relied on for 10 overs, weakening the batting line up was less ideal.
 
Take him to the world cup just incase conditions don't turn out to be as flat as expected. Got a scorching summer this year but next year could very easily be damp and a bowler like Abbas would be ideal.
 
Its a fsir point.. in ODIs typicslly the required skill level is lower than test crickrt and if people like amir, hasan, etc leaked runs by bucket loads in the asia cup on the same wickets and abbas has taken wickets, by bowling stump to stump, which is more of an ODI trait, i really dont see him doing any worse than amir, hasan, etc.
 
I have a feeling he abbas could be our secret weapon in the world cup in england. He has played there, he has the experience and his style of bowling is tailor made for english pitches. At least with the new ball he could be a perfect fit..
 
Ok I think since our new ball bowling has been so poor in ODIs off late so Abbass is worth a go i guess. He can potentially bowl 8-9 overs up front with the new ball..
 
ads101 said:
Has been doing well in tests ever since he started. Do you think he can replicate it in ODIs?

We're missing a bowler who can bowl well with the new ball to partner Amir. Most of our pacers prefer the older ball, Hasan, Junaid, Raees etc. The only pacer who perhaps can bowl with the new ball decently (except Amir) is Shinwari.

I'm quite liking this partnership by Amir and Abbas. Doesn't let up the pressure. I think it's worth a try in ODIs too, given none of our third pacers have been able to hold down a spot of late.
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Test cricket is way different than ODI, in ODI he will get smashed because of lack of pace. He's good for tests. Lets keep it limited to that.
 
RehanG said:
Test cricket is way different than ODI, in ODI he will get smashed because of lack of pace. He's good for tests. Lets keep it limited to that.
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No harm in giving him at least one or two ODIs to see how he handles it..?
 
He's just come off a whole summer in English conditions so he really needs an chance in ODI's now with next year in mind. Post Asia cup we're in a situation where literally not a single one of our famed pace battery are dead certain to be in the squad for the WC. Even Hasan Ali seems droppable now. Abbas could make the most of this opportunity.
 
hitthestump said:
He's just come off a whole summer in English conditions so he really needs an chance in ODI's now with next year in mind. Post Asia cup we're in a situation where literally not a single one of our famed pace battery are dead certain to be in the squad for the WC. Even Hasan Ali seems droppable now. Abbas could make the most of this opportunity.
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The most important lesson that Abbas teaches us is that we should heed domestic performance. Abbas has been the standout pacer in domestic FC cricket for a couple of years now. It accordingly seems wrong headed to then push for his selection in LOI cricket, in which he has not excelled in domestics, compared to many others. What is even stranger, amidst a feeling that slots are now open post Asia Cup debacle, is to continue ignore Sadaf Hussain, who was the dominant domestic pacer before and alongside Abbas. And who does have a great domestic LOI record.
 
Why doesn't Pakistan give a chance to Mohd Abbass in ODI's?

The guy is literally our best new ball bowler so far. He is very accurate and he has proven so far in his career that he can take the pitch out of the equation.

Do we seriously need to waste more time on the over rated Zulfiqar Babar type ineffective bowling of Amir.

Given that the WC is going to be played in England in 2019, Pakistan honestly needs to give a chance to Mohd Abbass in the limited overs format going forward.
 
With the sort of pitches we see in ODIs these days Abbas will be a liability. He can get you a wicket in the first 6-7 overs yes but once the movement goes away Batsmen will look to target him. He can be in the squad, if the conditions are conducive to swing bowling he can be given 10 bowlers on the trot.
 
Fahdi said:
With the sort of pitches we see in ODIs these days Abbas will be a liability. He can get you a wicket in the first 6-7 overs yes but once the movement goes away Batsmen will look to target him. He can be in the squad, if the conditions are conducive to swing bowling he can be given 10 bowlers on the trot.
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You forgot his reverse swing, which has been his main weapon in ongoing test. He has got decent Yorkers as well.
 
Shaheen Shah Afridi, Junaid Khan and Mohd Amir can form a fairly deadly Odi Attack. Using Mohd Amir as the 3rd bowler can do the trick. Even if Amir is not taking wickets he does not give away runs. Which means he is hard to go after. Lately Pakistan's regular 3rd pacer Hassan Ali has been struggling to get wicket. So we need someone who can replace Hassan Ali till he finds form.
 
Titan24 said:
You forgot his reverse swing, which has been his main weapon in ongoing test. He has got decent Yorkers as well.
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You're not gonna get much reverse with a 25 overs white ball. And I don't think a yorker bowled at 128-132 kph is gonna trouble too many batsmen.
 
Titan24 said:
You forgot his reverse swing, which has been his main weapon in ongoing test. He has got decent Yorkers as well.
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With the 2 new balls reverse swing rarely comes into play these days. Even then the ones who can exploit it properly need a bit of pace because the ball isn't old enough. With his speed of 130 kph he just has to miss his length a little and he will disappear, unless its a really slow pitch in which case his lack of pace may make him harder to hit.
 
Why is pace so overhyped especially here in pakistan. What are the bowlers with pace doing currently?

The main first 2 things a bowler should be selected for are.

1. His control over the ball.
2. How smart is he as a bowler

If a bowler got these 2 things then pace should not be in the picture. There have been many great medium pace bowlers in the past. The bowler has to be smart, a thinking bowler and should have great control over his bowling.

I see that in abbas. We can atleast give him a chance. U cant just overlook him, bcz he is not express pace.
 
Well he played for Leicestershire in the T20 Blast and didn't do anything special. Ended up getting dropped. So maybe red ball cricket is what he should stick to. Also, he is not a very good batsman and in ODI's, even the bowlers need to be good batsmen.
 
Abbas should be given a chance in ODIs:

- 2 new balls. He can bowl his 6-7 overs in his first spell. You don’t need that many variations. He does have the good old off-cutter as a variation.
- his accuracy and movement are better than shaheen shah, amir, Junaid or hasan ali.
- with his pace Sarfraz can stand upto the stumps to him. Stops batsmen from standing outside or charging.
 
Not sure if its a good idea. But can be tried. Whats his LA record like?
 
Leave him just playing tests and county cricket, doesnt need to be burdened with ODIs.
 
He will be good in England, He should be tried atleast for few ODIs obviously can only afford one such players who cant bat or field. Will probably have to bowl most of his over with the new bowl.
 
I am up for playing him in ODI cricket especially with his accuracy. I feel he needs to be kept away from t20 format as much as possible which is a killer for any bowlers confidence
 
People should see how he did in the T20 Blast for Leicestershire before suggesting this.
 
Trying Abbas for NZ ODIs

Why doesn't PCB give Abbas a shot while dropping one of our underperforming bowlers. You never know that he might turn out to be a lucky charm for us.
 
Junaid looked off colour today. I think Abbass has a strong case to be tried in the next ODI series
 
The way Junaid bowled today, I will not be surprised if Abbas play for Pakistan in next series.
 
Should be tried, may be he will solve our problem and turn out to be a good limited over bowler.
 
Ahmed216 said:
He's accurate and moves the ball, these are assets in any format.
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True but in modern day odi game, needs to have a good slower ball, knuckle ball and some other tactics to disturb the batsman's momentum etc. But will take him for tours to England South Africa Australia New Zealand as a new ball bowler
 
Bring in Abbas for Junaid for the last ODI as he will be there anyway for the Test series.

Pak would have a good new ball attack then.
 
ask_analyse_act said:
True but in modern day odi game, needs to have a good slower ball, knuckle ball and some other tactics to disturb the batsman's momentum etc. But will take him for tours to England South Africa Australia New Zealand as a new ball bowler
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but who knows he might adapt well and come up with the variations you are talking about.
plus with two new balls at both ends he can easily bowl a 6-7 over opening spell which can be useful even in asian conditions as was demonstrated in test matches against Aus.
junaid really doesnt offer much with the new ball
 
Given English ODI pitches are phatta's these days, aren't his medium pace deliveries just going to end up being pies? Happy to be told otherwise.
 
When should Muhammad Abbas be introduced to LOI?

The elephant in the room. I'am dying to see him bowl on South African pitches.

Should he eventually be a part of the 2019 world cup squad? :abbas1
 
Worth giving it a shot imo. Shaheen needs someone to share the new ball with who can be effective and Abbas should be tried in SA ODI's. Now SA ODI wickets can be just as unforgiving as English ones these days so that should be a good test for him. Also there's no guarantee that the likes of Junaid, Aamir, Hassan, usman are better new ball bowlers so there's half a chance that he might actually be more economical than them upfront and maybe take a wicket or two. In case he does worse than those guys, you can always go back to them. There's absolutely nothing to lose by trying him out.
 
He should be the first name in next ODI squad.

I know his pace and these days ODI's are played on belters, but bowling intelligence, skills to use new ball, bowling in channel, bowling on awkward length ... these are universal. I saw his 6 overs today, mostly negotiated by Raval - if he can give such 6 overs with white ball, I would love to see how many modern power hitters surviving Power play. His pace isn't great for end game, but not necessary either - bowl out him for 7+3 spells within first 25 overs. Every team these days are loaded with top order, top 4 carries almost entire bating - get them 60/2 in PP, it's a great start, get 3 down - almost match winning.

I don't think "All-rounder" formula is working much for PAK. Rather, I would like to see going back to the past - play 4 genuine wicket taking bowlers and operate at 250 level.

1. FZ
2. Babar
3. Haris
4. Open Spot (Saud/Umar)
5. Open Spot (Umar/Maqsood)
6. Sarfraz
7. Shadab (Or Irfan - the idea is to play best leggi in country)
8. Amir
9. Hasan
10. Afridi
11. Abbas

This is better in a sense that at least this XI can defend 250 most times or keep the target under 250, then 7 batsmen can chase it by playing out 50 overs. At current formula, even on best batting conditions, chasing or setting 300 is not going to happen with posedu all-rounders & Josh Buttlrs holding key batting positions.
 
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07.Shadab
08.Imad / Faheem / Hassan
09.Amir
10.Shaheen
11.Abbas

Shaheen looked much better with the old ball, compared to the new ball.

So, Amir and Abbas to open the bowling and, Shaheen, first change.

As [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION] said, give Abbas 7 overs(at least 6) with the new ball.
 
MMHS said:
He should be the first name in next ODI squad.

I know his pace and these days ODI's are played on belters, but bowling intelligence, skills to use new ball, bowling in channel, bowling on awkward length ... these are universal. I saw his 6 overs today, mostly negotiated by Raval - if he can give such 6 overs with white ball, I would love to see how many modern power hitters surviving Power play. His pace isn't great for end game, but not necessary either - bowl out him for 7+3 spells within first 25 overs. Every team these days are loaded with top order, top 4 carries almost entire bating - get them 60/2 in PP, it's a great start, get 3 down - almost match winning.

I don't think "All-rounder" formula is working much for PAK. Rather, I would like to see going back to the past - play 4 genuine wicket taking bowlers and operate at 250 level.

1. FZ
2. Babar
3. Haris
4. Open Spot (Saud/Umar)
5. Open Spot (Umar/Maqsood)
6. Sarfraz
7. Shadab (Or Irfan - the idea is to play best leggi in country)
8. Amir
9. Hasan
10. Afridi
11. Abbas

This is better in a sense that at least this XI can defend 250 most times or keep the target under 250, then 7 batsmen can chase it by playing out 50 overs. At current formula, even on best batting conditions, chasing or setting 300 is not going to happen with posedu all-rounders & Josh Buttlrs holding key batting positions.
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I would prefer Hussain Talat over sohaib maqsood in ODI team. At the moment Talat might not be very good but he is young and can become useful in future, we are just wasting him in T20s.

Honestly I don't expect anything good from Umar Akmal but an in form Umar Akmal will be handy for the team. Apart from his batting, he needs to sort his off field issues.

I would like to see following team:
1. FZ
2. Babar
3. Haris
4. Saud
5. Hussain Talat / Umar Akmal
6. Sarfraz (we badly need his replacement after WC)
7. Shadab (i haven't seen irfan, so cant say anything about him)
8. Amir
9. Hasan
10. Afridi
11. Abbas
 
Sadozai said:
I would prefer Hussain Talat over sohaib maqsood in ODI team. At the moment Talat might not be very good but he is young and can become useful in future, we are just wasting him in T20s.

Honestly I don't expect anything good from Umar Akmal but an in form Umar Akmal will be handy for the team. Apart from his batting, he needs to sort his off field issues.

I would like to see following team:
1. FZ
2. Babar
3. Haris
4. Saud
5. Hussain Talat / Umar Akmal
6. Sarfraz (we badly need his replacement after WC)
7. Shadab (i haven't seen irfan, so cant say anything about him)
8. Amir
9. Hasan
10. Afridi
11. Abbas
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Idea is same - 4 bowlers on bowling merit, 5 batsmen on batting merit, max one all-rounder & a WK who can bat. Couple of batsmen capable of bowling few overs or couple of bowlers capable of adding some with bat is bonus.

And, all 11, including WK, fields well, while the captain knows how to use his bowlers to get 10 wickets - containing a batting side isn’t working much for PAK bowling.
 
MMHS said:
He should be the first name in next ODI squad.

I know his pace and these days ODI's are played on belters, but bowling intelligence, skills to use new ball, bowling in channel, bowling on awkward length ... these are universal. I saw his 6 overs today, mostly negotiated by Raval - if he can give such 6 overs with white ball, I would love to see how many modern power hitters surviving Power play. His pace isn't great for end game, but not necessary either - bowl out him for 7+3 spells within first 25 overs. Every team these days are loaded with top order, top 4 carries almost entire bating - get them 60/2 in PP, it's a great start, get 3 down - almost match winning.

I don't think "All-rounder" formula is working much for PAK. Rather, I would like to see going back to the past - play 4 genuine wicket taking bowlers and operate at 250 level.

1. FZ
2. Babar
3. Haris
4. Open Spot (Saud/Umar)
5. Open Spot (Umar/Maqsood)
6. Sarfraz
7. Shadab (Or Irfan - the idea is to play best leggi in country)
8. Amir
9. Hasan
10. Afridi
11. Abbas

This is better in a sense that at least this XI can defend 250 most times or keep the target under 250, then 7 batsmen can chase it by playing out 50 overs. At current formula, even on best batting conditions, chasing or setting 300 is not going to happen with posedu all-rounders & Josh Buttlrs holding key batting positions.
Click to expand...

Umar is useless. Any half decent SLA can get him out and with his fitness level, captain will have to hide him in the field.

Sarfaraz should bat at 5. He is too slow for number 6.

Won't mind Maqsood at 6 but his attitude is poor and looks disinterested on field. Couldn't even perform at PSL. And it is too early to right off Asif Ali or Hussain Talat.

Same with Shadab and Faheem, too early to right them off as 'pseudo allrounders'. Both have potential and should be backed. Abbas is too slow for LOIs.
 
Greenstorm said:
Umar is useless. Any half decent SLA can get him out and with his fitness level, captain will have to hide him in the field.

Sarfaraz should bat at 5. He is too slow for number 6.

Won't mind Maqsood at 6 but his attitude is poor and looks disinterested on field. Couldn't even perform at PSL. And it is too early to right off Asif Ali or Hussain Talat.

Same with Shadab and Faheem, too early to right them off as 'pseudo allrounders'. Both have potential and should be backed. Abbas is too slow for LOIs.
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My mistake - instead of using names, I should have used “open spot”. It’s about role profile - I am looking for 2 proper middle order batsmen who can score quick, can convert starts, can play pacers and can hit - if there are better incumbents than Umar & Maqsood - unse bulao. But this spin basher MoHa Malik Sarfu is not going to work much in UK. Besides, Umar is back up WK - you can’t take 16 men for 9 games in 29 days & 1 WK. Each & every team barring PAK has one player in starting XI, who can keep in crisis; PAK doesn’t take one even in squad!!! I am not sure actually where should Sarfraz bat - he is there as Captain, so I kept him at designated WK’s spot.

Shadab & Fahim can still make the XI (Shadab is there in my XI), if they can justify their spot for bowling - not for combined contribution of bat & ball; my whole argument is on that. Fahim can replace one of the 4 pacers, if his bowling justifies that - I take his runs as bonus. Same goes for Shadab - his honeymoon period is over, he has to justify spot for his 10 overs between 15-45 overs. Otherwise, on contribution value, you can’t drop Hafeez, even Malik - the king pair of bits & pieces cricketers. Even Imad makes better sense than say Afridi or Amir because he can add 20 extra runs & won’t concede 20 more in his 10 overs - net, net a computer program will always tell that Imad is more valuable than may be Shaheen or Amir.

That thought process of effective contribution is killing PAK ODI team (Test as well - but let NZ win the Test first, otherwise trolls will put me in place for taking a dig at Bilal, in PP everything is measured by final outcome) - I wish to change that. Specialists to play ODI and they must be judged on their core contribution: 6-7 overs of bowling for 1/34, then 38 ball 35 might make you top rated all rounder by computer ranking, or a valuable contributor in your fantasy league, but impact is almost zero, unless it’s winning game. If you are batting in top 6, you must win a game once you are set - even one in every 10 innings is acceptable, but that one innings has to be match winner, not like Sarfraz’s 60 in 1st ODI. Similarly, if you are picked as a bowler, you must be rated for the strike rate, not for economy.

Remember, PAK won CT for 3 specialist players doing their job properly : Hasan Ali MoS (& MoM in SF), opener FZ MoM in Final & Amir in opening spell in final - and these are bang specialist in their job (though Amir contributed against SRL with bat). And, Hasan also won it with ball against SAF, and Sarfraz did his job as no. 6 against SRL.

Hope it explains better - idea wasn’t to take a pun at the all-rounders.
 
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