Mohammad Amir vs Junaid Khan in ODIs (since they started playing together)

[Kohli The King of Chase]

As the title suggests, this is to look at the performance of the both, since they both started to play together (Jan 2017).

We all know Amir is highly skilled. But stats doesn't say so.

Junaid is AT PAR with Amir, if not better.
(To be more precise, Junaid is slightly ahead STATISTICALLY)

Is it okay to say Amir is better than Junaid? Or is it right to decide based on stats?

A look into the stats

MATCHES:

Amir:12
Junaid:14

*Similar number of matches.


AVERAGE (Runs per wicket):

Amir: 31.66
Junaid:31.57

*Junaid is slightly better in decimals.

ECONOMY(Runs per over):

Amir: 5.25
Junaid: 5.41

* Amir gives 52.5 runs(on an average) in 10 overs, and Junaid, 54 runs.

So Amir gives 1.5 runs lesser than Junaid in his 10 overs. Not much of a difference.

STRIKE RATE(Number of balls per wicket):

Amir:36.1
Junaid:35

*Junaid takes one ball less to take a wicket, than Amir.


Now coming to the TEAMS they PLAYED AGAINST

Amir:

Total matches: 12

Australia:5
India:2
SA:1

West Indies:3
Sri Lanka:1

Out of 12, 8 games against top teams and 4 against Low ranked teams.

That's 66.66% against top teams.

Junaid:

Total matches:14

Australia:4
SA:1
India:1
England:1

Sri Lanka:5
West Indies:2

Out of 14, 7 against top teams, and 7 against low ranked teams.

That's 50% against top teams .

* So Amir has played 66.66% of his games against top teams, whereas Junaid, 50%. Here Amir has an upper hand.



Now taking it to the IN DEPTH ANALYSIS.
Let's look at THEIR WICKETS.

Here I have divided batsmen into 3 categories.

1 to 5 : Main batsmen
6 to 8 : Lower order
9 to 11: Tail enders

Amir:

Total wickets:18

1 to 5: 13
6 to 8: 3
9 to 11: 2

Junaid:

Total wickets:19

1 to 5: 11
6 to 8: 7
9 to 11: 1

* In percentage,

Amir:

72 % wickets are of main batsmen
16.66 % lower order
11.11 % tailenders

Junaid:

58 % main batsmen
37 % lower order
5 % tailenders

From this we can say most of Amir's wickets are of main batsmen.

Whereas Junaid has the combination of both Main batsmen and the lower order batsmen (6,7 and 8).

Another MAIN THING which can be inferred is, Amir is good only with the new ball. He rarely takes wickets with the old ball.

Whereas as Junaid is decent with the old ball and at the death.





All in all. Junaid should be used in the mid overs, and Usman should be the new ball partner for Amir.

These should be the bowling changes

New ball:
Amir
Usman

1st change:
Junaid
2nd change:
Shadab
3rd change:
Hassan

Bowling at the death:
Amir, Junaid and Hassan

 

[Bilal7]

Good analysis. Amir is certainly a better bowler than Junaid, however Junaid is easily one of the best pacers from Asia, if not the world. I only expect the numbers of these two to get better as they play morr matches.

 

[Hasan123]

Lol at Junaid as one of the best pace bowlers in the world, he just about makes the Pakistan team ).

Junaid is a decent bowler but I would take Amir over him anyday.

 

[babajee]

Lol at Junaid as one of the best pace bowlers in the world, he just about makes the Pakistan team ).

Junaid is a decent bowler but I would take Amir over him anyday.

Bhai, for the sake of Pakistan let’s hope Junaid gets back to his best.

His death bowling skills were amazing.

 

[Syed1]

The numbers do not lie, no matter what the PP experts say. Junaid is a very important part of our pace troika and is one of the reasons why we have the best bowling attack in the world.

 

[Syed1]

Also OP sahab completely forgot the best pacer in the world, Hasan Ali.


We are spoilt for riches. The last guy on our bench is better than the main bowler of most teams. Mashallah.

 

[Hasan123]

The numbers do not lie, no matter what the PP experts say. Junaid is a very important part of our pace troika and is one of the reasons why we have the best bowling attack in the world.

He's decent but Hasan Ali, Amir , and Ruman are better imo Shinwari was looking good as well. I don't see a regular place for Junaid if those 4 are on form. Think Junaid, Shinwari,and Ruman should be rotated to keep them fresh.

 

[Hasan123]

Bhai, for the sake of Pakistan let’s hope Junaid gets back to his best.

His death bowling skills were amazing.

Hopefully he does. But I'm sure we can find someone better . I'll take Ruman over Junaid anyway.

 

[Hasan123]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] calling Junaid a rubbish bowler is incorrect. Other Pakistan fans calling Junaid one of the best in the world is OTT for me. He averages 46 in the last 2 years in international cricket.

I think Junaid is a good support bowler who is very good with the old ball. He's not the worst bowler in the world but clearly not the best in the world. Just because he is Pakistani we don't need to ovverate or underrate him.

 

[CricFan2012]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] calling Junaid a rubbish bowler is incorrect. Other Pakistan fans calling Junaid one of the best in the world is OTT for me. He averages 46 in the last 2 years in international cricket.

I think Junaid is a good support bowler who is very good with the old ball. He's not the worst bowler in the world but clearly not the best in the world. Just because he is Pakistani we don't need to ovverate or underrate him.

Junaid has been reaping the benefits caused by Amir and Hasan, Amir too to an extent but not as much.

Junaid is actually just a mediocre bowler who is gun barrel straight, at least Amir turns his game up during knock outs and against India.

Raees is much much better option.

Raees, Hasan, Amir, Shadab should definitely be the main part of our 2019 World Cup attack, dont know who will make up the other overs yet.

 

[Zeshan547]

We have all bases covered for LOIs and should play any three of these 5 in this order,

1_Amir
2_Hasaan
3_Shinwari
4_Rumnan
5_Junaid

And with Fahim as pace all rounder who can bowl 140 kph plus stuff this can be top 2 pace attack in next WC, only Australia with fit Starc, Hazelwood, Cummins, and Pattinson along with Mitch Marsh as fourth seamer can outdo us, and if batting of both team clicks I can see Pak vs Australia final in UK just like 1999, but just hope final have different result this time.

But for tests we have 2 sure startes in Amir and Hassan even though Amir hasn't been to his pre ban level in test and time is running out, and Hassan is also a newbie in Tests but has all ingredients other than tall height to be successful in test as well if he can keep up the good work, Abbas makes it as 3rd seamer based on current form but I am not sold on him, with his pace he will have to be M.Asif level good to retain his place and I don't think he can pull that off in long run on docile pitches vs top teams, Shinwari with his action can be very injury prone in tests but we can try him out in Wahab role as inforcer if his fitness permits in short sharp burst of 3 to 4 overs otherwise he is too valuable for LOI side to be forced to play tests and get injured, Rumman Raess could also be tried before being labeled as LOI specialist, he has increased his pace and can be very deceptive has great control as well. And JK if he can show good performance in FC can also be given a go if other options fail, and we badly need a tall and fast bowler like Shaheen Shah Afridi but he should first prove himself at least by playing next full FC season if not 2 more that he deserves a place and if he can make it big we will have one of the best attack for tests as well along with Fahim on Pace friendly pitches as fourth seamer, So do you guys agree with me, and [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION] [MENTION=138254]Syed1[/MENTION] [MENTION=137148]Rayyman[/MENTION] [MENTION=134608]Hawkeye[/MENTION] [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] [MENTION=140234]DRsohail[/MENTION] [MENTION=9]Saj[/MENTION] [MENTION=93712]MenInG[/MENTION]

 

[Syed1]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] calling Junaid a rubbish bowler is incorrect. Other Pakistan fans calling Junaid one of the best in the world is OTT for me. He averages 46 in the last 2 years in international cricket.

I think Junaid is a good support bowler who is very good with the old ball. He's not the worst bowler in the world but clearly not the best in the world. Just because he is Pakistani we don't need to ovverate or underrate him.

Don't know how you got that number. He averages 31.57 across all formats in the last two years. (which is only ODIs since he has not played T20s or Tests in that period)

 

[troodon]

Amir has the fear factor. He can rip apart the top order of any team on any given day. Basically a match winner on his day.

Nobody is scared of Junaid. He can be a good support bowler to the match winners. On his day, he can continue the good work done by the likes of Amir and Hasan Ali.

Amir can make the new ball talk even on flat pitches. Juanid becomes a gun barrell straight bowler on flatties.

As an Indian, I would much rather see Junaid in the lineup than Amir.

 

[BunnyRabbit]

Rumman and Shinwari being better than Junaid is a myth.

Junaid is a proven bowler while Rumman and Shinwari aren't. Simple as that.

Doesn't mean Rumman and Shinwari aren't good. A big fan of Rumman, but I think Junaid is better for ODI's and Tests. Rumman is a better t20 bowler.

 

[Mamoon]

Amir has a much higher ceiling than Junaid, but his intensity and work ethic is poor. On the other hand, Junaid is an average bowler who gives his 100% every delivery, so he has been able to bridge the gap somewhat.

Junaid mislead everyone with that fluke spell in India 5 years ago - he is just a poor man's Gul. Zero ability to make the new ball swing, but can reverse the ball and bowl some good yorkers on his day. However, he is a captain's nightmare and doesn't have any semblance of bowling intelligence.

He needs to booted out for good as soon as possible.

 

[Savak]

Amir has a much higher ceiling than Junaid, but his intensity and work ethic is poor. On the other hand, Junaid is an average bowler who gives his 100% every delivery, so he has been able to bridge the gap somewhat.

Junaid mislead everyone with that fluke spell in India 5 years ago - he is just a poor man's Gul. Zero ability to make the new ball swing, but can reverse the ball and bowl some good yorkers on his day. However, he is a captain's nightmare and doesn't have any semblance of bowling intelligence.

He needs to booted out for good as soon as possible.

On what basis are you saying Amir's work ethic is poor? All the coaches including Mickey Arthur say otherwise.

 

[Mamoon]

On what basis are you saying Amir's work ethic is poor? All the coaches including Mickey Arthur say otherwise.

Azhar Mahmood seems to disagree. Read his interview post the CT final, where he stated that Amir didn't seem like someone who was giving more than 70% before the final. Nonetheless, it has been pretty obvious anyway. His attitude is lackluster, and he seems like someone who is hard to motivate.

 

[Hasan123]

Don't know how you got that number. He averages 31.57 across all formats in the last two years. (which is only ODIs since he has not played T20s or Tests in that period)

Only in ODIs he averages 46 in 2014,2015,and 2017. It's on cricinfo.

Even an average of 31 isn't amazing.

 

[Syed1]

Only in ODIs he averages 46 in 2014,2015,and 2017. It's on cricinfo.

Even an average of 31 isn't amazing.

You said last two years. Now you are coming up with new logic of "an average of 31 isn't amazing"

 

[Hasan123]

You said last two years. Now you are coming up with new logic of "an average of 31 isn't amazing"

He didn't play a game in 2016. So I had to use the stats from 2014 and 2015. Obviously they don't suit your agenda so of course they become irrelevant.

 

[Syed1]

He didn't play a game in 2016. So I had to use the stats from 2014 and 2015. Obviously they don't suit your agenda so of course they become irrelevant.

Actually you are the one with an agenda since you tried to fudge the numbers to build up a narrative but unfortunately for you I didn't take your numbers on face value and did my own checking. Don't blame me for outsmarting you.

 

[babajee]

Actually you are the one with an agenda since you tried to fudge the numbers to build up a narrative but unfortunately for you I didn't take your numbers on face value and did my own checking. Don't blame me for outsmarting you.

)

But I thought you weren’t a Junaid Khan supporter?

 

[Syed1]

)

But I thought you weren’t a Junaid Khan supporter?

I'm a supporter of the Pakistan cricket team. I will also try to fight people who present false information about a player whether I like that player or not.

 

[mak36]

He didn't play a game in 2016. So I had to use the stats from 2014 and 2015. Obviously they don't suit your agenda so of course they become irrelevant.

Sometimes it is easier to admit your mistake.

 

[babajee]

Azhar Mahmood seems to disagree. Read his interview post the CT final, where he stated that Amir didn't seem like someone who was giving more than 70% before the final. Nonetheless, it has been pretty obvious anyway. His attitude is lackluster, and he seems like someone who is hard to motivate.

The Umar Akmal of bowling?

 

[Hasan123]

Actually you are the one with an agenda since you tried to fudge the numbers to build up a narrative but unfortunately for you I didn't take your numbers on face value and did my own checking. Don't blame me for outsmarting you.

I gave the stats for his last 2 years that he was playing. No one has outsmarted anyone , you canr change that he averages 46 from 2014-2017 in ODIs. I didn't include tests and t20s as I didn't want to mix formats together and I didn't think he had played loads of games in those formats.

 

[Hasan123]

Sometimes it is easier to admit your mistake.

When I said 2 years, I meant his last 2 playing years of international cricket. Junaid Khan is a decent bowler but he's not world class which some on this forum think he is.

 

[Hasan123]

Junaid has been reaping the benefits caused by Amir and Hasan, Amir too to an extent but not as much.

Junaid is actually just a mediocre bowler who is gun barrel straight, at least Amir turns his game up during knock outs and against India.

Raees is much much better option.

Raees, Hasan, Amir, Shadab should definitely be the main part of our 2019 World Cup attack, dont know who will make up the other overs yet.

Oh bhai don't talk sense. It's forbidden on this forum. As a Pakistan fan you have to say our players are the best and same for Indian fan it's the same.

Junaid is a decent bowler, he good if there's reverse swing on offer and at the death. Think Ruman offers more with the new ball and is also a better death bowler. That's why I would go with Ruman over Junaid.

 

[babajee]

Oh bhai don't talk sense. It's forbidden on this forum. As a Pakistan fan you have to say our players are the best and same for Indian fan it's the same.

Junaid is a decent bowler, he good if there's reverse swing on offer and at the death. Think Ruman offers more with the new ball and is also a better death bowler. That's why I would go with Ruman over Junaid.

I just hope Rumman can get his pace up a little bit more, then he can be truly devastating.

 

[Hasan123]

I just hope Rumman can get his pace up a little bit more, then he can be truly devastating.

Best time to use Ruman is in the middle overs and at the death. Like his personality as well.

 

[CricFan2012]

Best time to use Ruman is in the middle overs and at the death. Like his personality as well.

Add to that he is an intelligent bowler, sets up batsmen nicely with his variation.

 

[waleed88]

Mohammad Amir still has pace over Junaid, which adds to his nippiness and makes him difficult to get away. Junaid (I mean the new Junaid) has a tendency to get hit for a few when he is not in rhythm.

 

[SarfiBabarHaris]

Not a fan of Juni but he has done well especially in CT. Took crucial wickets against SL and Eng.

Amir is supremely talented but hearing him on tv few times I think the guy need some self inspection. Listening to him, I got this feeling that he doesn't put his best if the match is not against Aus, India or in conditions offering swing and considering the fan following he gets, he is content with it. Should try to win maximum matches for Pakistan like Hasan even if the opposition is not his favorite. He has the skills to do it and become one of world's best like Hasan.

Ideally would pick Rumman, Sadaf, or Ehtesham over Juni as the third pacer depending on conditions.

 

[msb314]

Amir has a much higher ceiling than Junaid, but his intensity and work ethic is poor. On the other hand, Junaid is an average bowler who gives his 100% every delivery, so he has been able to bridge the gap somewhat.

Junaid mislead everyone with that fluke spell in India 5 years ago - he is just a poor man's Gul. Zero ability to make the new ball swing, but can reverse the ball and bowl some good yorkers on his day. However, he is a captain's nightmare and doesn't have any semblance of bowling intelligence.

He needs to booted out for good as soon as possible.

On what basis does Junaid need to be "booted out for good as soon as possible"?

Even if you what you say is true i.e. cannot swing the new ball or not as fast as Amir - he is very economical with the new ball.

Yes Dhawan put him away for a few boundaries in the CT final but that pitch was as flat as a pancake anyway. His tight line to Yuvraj was one of the major reasons we built up pressure that led to India's middle order collapse in that final - was rightfully rewarded a wicket of that of Jadeja.

He has been our 2nd best bowler after Hassan since his recall for the 2017 tour of Australia. In bilaterals - I would argue he makes the team ahead of Amir.

In no way shape or form is he "poor man's Gul"...

 

[msb314]

Amir has a much higher ceiling than Junaid, but his intensity and work ethic is poor. On the other hand, Junaid is an average bowler who gives his 100% every delivery, so he has been able to bridge the gap somewhat.

Junaid mislead everyone with that fluke spell in India 5 years ago - he is just a poor man's Gul. Zero ability to make the new ball swing, but can reverse the ball and bowl some good yorkers on his day. However, he is a captain's nightmare and doesn't have any semblance of bowling intelligence.

He needs to booted out for good as soon as possible.

Btw - the way you describe Junaid makes it seem like you are talking about Wahab lol
[MENTION=138254]Syed1[/MENTION]

 

[msb314]

The Umar Akmal of bowling?

There is a difference between poor work ethic and indiscipline.

In Amir's case - he follows his coaches instructions, stays fight and is unbelievably good with the new ball but just does not give his 100% all the time. That is a case of poor work ethic.

Umar Akmal on the other hand suffers from indiscipline where he does not follow anyone's advice, seems to be "uncoachable" and does not maintain his fitness as required by the management. That is a case of poor discipline.

 

[Chip32]

Not a fan of Junaid as he simply lacks natural ability.

However, he’s been a much better bowler than Amir, the latter seems content with ambling in and restricting the run flow.

 

[khurram39]

Muhammad Amir needs to convert his ability into action by taking more wickets. As he rated in international cricket, his wickets column doesn't reflect that.

As far Junaid is concerned he is not rated as high as Amir. He is doing pretty well in his capacity. With time he will improve if he remains fit.

 

[Mamoon]

On what basis does Junaid need to be "booted out for good as soon as possible"?

Even if you what you say is true i.e. cannot swing the new ball or not as fast as Amir - he is very economical with the new ball.

Yes Dhawan put him away for a few boundaries in the CT final but that pitch was as flat as a pancake anyway. His tight line to Yuvraj was one of the major reasons we built up pressure that led to India's middle order collapse in that final - was rightfully rewarded a wicket of that of Jadeja.

He has been our 2nd best bowler after Hassan since his recall for the 2017 tour of Australia. In bilaterals - I would argue he makes the team ahead of Amir.

In no way shape or form is he "poor man's Gul"...

Gul has achieved more for Pakistan than Junaid ever will. Apart from a fluke spell in India, he has no achievements.

It is not good enough to be economical with the new ball - you need bowlers who can make the ball talk. It is time Hasan shares the new ball with Amir, with Rumman as first change.

Junaid has not been exposed on his return because of Hasan's brilliant form. He is still a mediocre bowler.

 

[Mamoon]

The Umar Akmal of bowling?

He doesn't have attitude problems. I am struggling to think of another cricketer who is clearly very good but underperforms because of lack of effort. Maybe MoYo, but it is a poor analogy to be honest.

 

[Square Drive]

Junaid definitely belongs in the squad.

Amir-Hasan-Shinwari should be the trio, with Rumman (4th pacer) and Junaid (5th pacer) on the bench and Fahim and Talat as the two pace A/Rs.

 

[HuzaifaE]

No comparison, Amir by daylight, but the latter just doesn't seem to bring the intensity and effort to every match, while Junaid, despite his injuries which have hampered him, at least always leaves what he has on the pitch, similar to Wahab. That attitude doesn't bridge the gap in skills however and Amir is comfortably superior.

Junaid can never bowl a spell like Amir did in the CT final, even his Chennai spell doesn't have an inch over it and like Wahab's Watson spell, that spell should not be used as evidence in Junaid's favor any longer. He's simply too limited in skill set to persist with.

Rumman has the brain and cunning nature to be a good foil for Hasan and Amir while Fahim has shown he has the natural skillset to build on to eventually make a stake for the 3rd seamer spot on decks where we need two spinners.

 

[Raja Sab]

I waited five years to see these two bowl side by side, glad I wasn't disappointed. Their first run together in a tournament got Pakistan the CT

 

[MMHS]

We have all bases covered for LOIs and should play any three of these 5 in this order,

1_Amir
2_Hasaan
3_Shinwari
4_Rumnan
5_Junaid

And with Fahim as pace all rounder who can bowl 140 kph plus stuff this can be top 2 pace attack in next WC, only Australia with fit Starc, Hazelwood, Cummins, and Pattinson along with Mitch Marsh as fourth seamer can outdo us, and if batting of both team clicks I can see Pak vs Australia final in UK just like 1999, but just hope final have different result this time.

But for tests we have 2 sure startes in Amir and Hassan even though Amir hasn't been to his pre ban level in test and time is running out, and Hassan is also a newbie in Tests but has all ingredients other than tall height to be successful in test as well if he can keep up the good work, Abbas makes it as 3rd seamer based on current form but I am not sold on him, with his pace he will have to be M.Asif level good to retain his place and I don't think he can pull that off in long run on docile pitches vs top teams, Shinwari with his action can be very injury prone in tests but we can try him out in Wahab role as inforcer if his fitness permits in short sharp burst of 3 to 4 overs otherwise he is too valuable for LOI side to be forced to play tests and get injured, Rumman Raess could also be tried before being labeled as LOI specialist, he has increased his pace and can be very deceptive has great control as well. And JK if he can show good performance in FC can also be given a go if other options fail, and we badly need a tall and fast bowler like Shaheen Shah Afridi but he should first prove himself at least by playing next full FC season if not 2 more that he deserves a place and if he can make it big we will have one of the best attack for tests as well along with Fahim on Pace friendly pitches as fourth seamer, So do you guys agree with me, and [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION] [MENTION=138254]Syed1[/MENTION] [MENTION=137148]Rayyman[/MENTION] [MENTION=134608]Hawkeye[/MENTION] [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] [MENTION=140234]DRsohail[/MENTION] [MENTION=9]Saj[/MENTION] [MENTION=93712]MenInG[/MENTION]

I think, JK gets a bit bashing here for his horror show after returning from injury. I still can recall his man-handling by Tamim & Soumya, which probably has left a scar at PP; but he has been decent in recent times. Apart from CT, he actually bowled well in AUS as well, could have been statistically better, but for few no balls.

For PAK team, I don't think JK should start in best XI, not for his bowling (or bowling action), rather because it doesn't make a good combination. In Asia, PAK should play 2 specialist spinners + Malik; that leave 3 (or 2.5) pacers spot - obviously Amir & Hasan are 1st 2 picks, followed by an all-rounder which happens to be Fahim, Yamin or even Hammad.

Outside Asia, he can come as the 3rd pacer in place of 2nd spinner, but his inclusion doesn't complement the attack much. JK isn't a new ball bowler, in fact he is poor with new ball (Didn't check stats, but only can recall for few months in late 2012, to 2013 he bowled well with new ball), besides, he is another lefti. Picking him as 3rd seemer means, either -

1. He'll open with Amir
2. He'll come as 1st change with Hasan taking new ball
3. He'll come as 2nd change with Fahim/Yamin taking new ball, keeping Hasan at 1st change.

1st one may be acceptable, but there are better new ball partners for Amir - if it happens to be another lefti, then UKS or even Irfaaaaan is swinging/hitting deck better with new ball. I am sure, if given chance, Hamza will bowl better with new ball outside Asia, but again another lefti.

2nd one is absolutely foolish - why should you change a proven combination by forcing the best semi-old ball pacer in world between over no. 11-20, to accommodate someone who isn't bringing anything extra? If it was Asif, it's a no brainier, but don't fix something not broken yet for JK.

3rd one is risky - outside Asia, you have to attack with new ball and try to knock couple of top orders, because apart from PAK, every team is top heavy - their 1, 2 & 3 sets the game. Recently IRL beat AFG against odds, and their top 3 were instrumental in that. Opening with Fahim/Yamin allows batting sides some respite from losing wickets against new ball, besides any of them might go for plenty in PP.

Both Irfaaan & Asif are in their mid 30s, therefore I don't know what to suggest. But, in UK 2019, an Asif or Irfaaan type bowler will be ideal partner for Amir. In fact, really surprised that this Umaid Asif guy never played for PAK - he is probably among best new ball bowlers in PAK right now, but he is also almost 34, officially.

PAK should look for a new face for this role - Amir's partner with white ball, who happens to be young, must be tall and better fielder. This is another issue - Amir is probably shorter side of 6'0" mark, Hasan probably 5'9" max, Fahim similar or may be 5'10", Raees is shorter or equal to Amir, UKS is similar to Hasan or Fahim - and most of them are swing bowlers, not express. Intelligent teams will start to stand a foot outside crease to force shortening their length - to break that strategy, Asif or Umaed Asif or definitely Irfaaan was the best medicine, while JK is probably the worst to bowl short of length lifters. Amir/JK opening pair isn't suggested for a long 9 game WC ............

 

[msb314]

Gul has achieved more for Pakistan than Junaid ever will. Apart from a fluke spell in India, he has no achievements.

It is not good enough to be economical with the new ball - you need bowlers who can make the ball talk. It is time Hasan shares the new ball with Amir, with Rumman as first change.

Junaid has not been exposed on his return because of Hasan's brilliant form. He is still a mediocre bowler.

Yes Umar Gul is a legend due to his amazing performances in the 2007 and 2009 World T20. However, that does not take away Junaid's brilliance - who himself was elected in the Team of the Tournament for the 2017 CT.

And no economical bowling is highly valuable in modern day ODI cricket with flat wickets and large bats that has seen huge totals and fast scoring in recent years. Having a low economy rate when others are taking wickets around is very useful. Obviously if Junaid runs through a lineup on his own - it will be even better for him but as a support bowler - he is still doing a fine job as it is.

 

[Zeshan547]

[MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION] you raised some great points but I guess we will have someone new till 2019, meanwhile do you agree with my analysis of Pak probable test bowlers, I am more than satisfied with our current ODI stocks, maybe a quality specialist offie is lacking but we can do without it in LOIs but it's must in Tests to have well rounded attack, but my original post was who should be Pak test pacers going forward in which pecking order?

 

[Darkrai]

These numbers just reveal how average these two bowlers have been for us. For all the hype Amir gets he rarely ever gives a great performance. Remove Hasan ali from our bowling attack and see the difference. We only have one World class bowler and that's Hasan. Although on his day Amir is also world class but his 'day' only comes once or twice a year or when we play India. Another reason why Amir gets so much attention is because he performs against India and we all know how passionate we are when it comes to Pak vs India. That being said, i still like Amir and i believe with hard work and more passion he can become one of the best bowlers.

 

[Buffet]

I will take 25th ranked bowler over 50th ranked bowler.

 

[Kohli The King of Chase]

UPDATED:

Matches:
Amir:16
Junaid:14

Avg:
Amir:35.75
Junaid:31.57

Eco:
Amir: 5.23
Junaid: 5.41

STRIKE RATE(Number of balls per wicket):
Amir:40.9
Junaid:35

How's Amir better than junaid?

Stats Show Amir is behind Junaid by a significant margin in average and strike rate.

Not much difference in economy. Junaid gives 54 runs in 10 overs, whereas Amir 52.

 

[Kohli The King of Chase]

Update:

Amir:

21 wkts in 22 matches at an average of 41.52, with a str.rate of 51.0 and an economy of 4.88

Junaid:

26 wkts in 18 matches at an average of 26.65, with a str.rate of 31.8 and an economy of 5.02


Amir is being cornered here. The rise of Shaheen only adds to his worries. He better get his act right, if not he may soon become a backup bowler, if not dropped

On a sidenote, even Hassan needs to get his act right, if not face the same fate as Amir.

 

[Saj]

Update:

Amir:

21 wkts in 22 matches at an average of 41.52, with a str.rate of 51.0 and an economy of 4.88

Junaid:

26 wkts in 18 matches at an average of 26.65, with a str.rate of 31.8 and an economy of 5.02


Amir is being cornered here. The rise of Shaheen only adds to his worries. He better get his act right, if not he may soon become a backup bowler, if not dropped

On a sidenote, even Hassan needs to get his act right, if not face the same fate as Amir.

Wow didn't realise just how much difference there is in the stats.

I guess Amir gets picked for his economy rate

 

[Savak]

Wow didn't realise just how much difference there is in the stats.

I guess Amir gets picked for his economy rate

Yup, the Pace bowling Zulfiqar Babar.

 

[Kohli The King of Chase]

Wow didn't realise just how much difference there is in the stats.

I guess Amir gets picked for his economy rate

Not much difference in the economy either.

Amir gives ~49 runs in 10 overs, whereas Junaid, 50

Unless it's like ek run ki qeemat tum kya jaano ramesh babu?

 

[Kohli The King of Chase]

Lol at Junaid as one of the best pace bowlers in the world, he just about makes the Pakistan team ).

Junaid is a decent bowler but I would take Amir over him anyday.

[MENTION=141114]Hasan123[/MENTION] Will you still take Amir over Junaid?

 

[Hasan123]

[MENTION=141114]Hasan123[/MENTION] Will you still take Amir over Junaid?

On current form I would take Junaid. But when Amir is at his best I would take him but those days don't seem to be often. I hope a spell out of the team will force a change in Amir.

 

[Shandarchowka]

Juni is proving to be more effective than Amir. The latter needs to get his act right before we move on from him.

 

[mastersaan10]

Junaid on dead tracks is >>>> than Amir. When Amir was banned, it was Junaid leading the attack in these dead tracks and taking wickets. unfortunate that Junaid gets dropped when conditions are better for fast bowlers.

 

[Kohli The King of Chase]

On current form I would take Junaid. But when Amir is at his best I would take him but those days don't seem to be often. I hope a spell out of the team will force a change in Amir.

I still feel he can stage a good comeback, IF he wants to.

Pak strength was and is their pace bowling, they have to go pace heavy at the WC.

Hassan for me looks like he's not going to improve. He should be on the bench and, Pak should play 4 left arm seamers at the WC.

Bowling attack should be:

07.Shadab
08.Amir
09.Shaheen
10.Junaid
11.Usman

Usman and Amir to take the new ball.

 

[in_cutter]

Amir needs to be dropped indefinitely- enough of this preferential treatment. He has been nothing but shoddy since he’s comeback.

 

[Ummii]

I still feel he can stage a good comeback, IF he wants to.

Pak strength was and is their pace bowling, they have to go pace heavy at the WC.

Hassan for me looks like he's not going to improve. He should be on the bench and, Pak should play 4 left arm seamers at the WC.

Bowling attack should be:

07.Shadab
08.Amir
09.Shaheen
10.Junaid
11.Usman

Usman and Amir to take the new ball.

And Hasan? Would you prefer Usman over Hasan?
Interesting to see, Usman isn't much favourite in PP