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No Pakistani fast bowler has taken 200 Test wickets since Waqar Younis

Saj

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For a nation which has produced some of the greatest pace bowlers of all time, this is a frightening statistic.

Why is it that Pakistan has not produced a fast bowler who has managed to take 200 Test wickets since Waqar Younis?

What's going wrong?
 
Too much hype, too early in the career.

They came they performed well initially, got hyped to the sky. While their opponents adjusted their skill sets to nullify these bowlers, the bowlers failed to further mature.

Failure to recognize that there is a problem and the self deluding belief that pakistani bowlers are better than others, without going into the details of the actual performance.

Too many matches with minnows.

Still believing that every bowler is a wasim or waqar who will walk into the world stage, take it by storm and keep doing it for more than a decade without the need to reinvent themselves.

Refusing to believe that the world has moved forward in terms of fast bowling and pakistan needs to change too.
 
Too much hype, too early in the career.

They came they performed well initially, got hyped to the sky. While their opponents adjusted their skill sets to nullify these bowlers, the bowlers failed to further mature.

Failure to recognize that there is a problem and the self deluding belief that pakistani bowlers are better than others, without going into the details of the actual performance.

Too many matches with minnows.

Still believing that every bowler is a wasim or waqar who will walk into the world stage, take it by storm and keep doing it for more than a decade without the need to reinvent themselves.

Refusing to believe that the world has moved forward in terms of fast bowling and pakistan needs to change too.

Nah....the reasons are off-field issues.

Shoaib, Asif, Aamir all should have had much more than 200 wickets. The fact that they didn't is more due to 'other' issues rather than lack of skill.
 
Nah....the reasons are off-field issues.

Shoaib, Asif, Aamir all should have had much more than 200 wickets. The fact that they didn't is more due to 'other' issues rather than lack of skill.

Skills include fitness.

Akhtar was unfit for most of his career and Amir refused to do the hard rounds of test cricket.
 
We play around 7 Tests a year. Then the joke 2 test series against any decent opposition. Fickle selectors should won’t really give any bowler a decent run with this scenario as well.

100-150 wickets seems to be the ceiling these days
 
Simply not good enough or fit enough. They also seem to have no knowledge about the game whatsoever. Will just run up, bowl and hope for the best.
 
[table=width: 500, class: grid, align: center]
[tr][td]Player [/td][td]Span [/td][td]Mat [/td][td]Wkts [/td][td]Ave [/td][td]SR [/td][td]5W [/td][td]10W [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Wasim Akram [/td][td]1985-2002 [/td][td]104 [/td][td]414 [/td][td]23.62 [/td][td]54.6 [/td][td]25 [/td][td]5 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Waqar Younis [/td][td]1989-2003 [/td][td]87 [/td][td]373 [/td][td]23.56 [/td][td]43.4 [/td][td]22 [/td][td]5 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Imran Khan [/td][td]1971-1992 [/td][td]88 [/td][td]362 [/td][td]22.81 [/td][td]53.7 [/td][td]23 [/td][td]6 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Shoaib Akhtar [/td][td]1997-2007 [/td][td]46 [/td][td]178 [/td][td]25.69 [/td][td]45.7 [/td][td]12 [/td][td]2 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Sarfraz Nawaz [/td][td]1969-1984 [/td][td]55 [/td][td]177 [/td][td]32.75 [/td][td]78.8 [/td][td]4 [/td][td]1 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Umar Gul [/td][td]2003-2013 [/td][td]47 [/td][td]163 [/td][td]34.06 [/td][td]58.8 [/td][td]4 [/td][td]0 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Fazal Mahmood [/td][td]1952-1962 [/td][td]34 [/td][td]139 [/td][td]24.7 [/td][td]70.7 [/td][td]13 [/td][td]4 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Mohammad Amir [/td][td]2009-2019 [/td][td]36 [/td][td]119 [/td][td]30.47 [/td][td]64 [/td][td]4 [/td][td]0 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Mohammad Asif [/td][td]2005-2010 [/td][td]23 [/td][td]106 [/td][td]24.36 [/td][td]48.7 [/td][td]7 [/td][td]1 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Abdul Razzaq [/td][td]1999-2006 [/td][td]46 [/td][td]100 [/td][td]36.94 [/td][td]70 [/td][td]1 [/td][td]0 [/td][/tr]
[/table]

Akhtar could have reached 200 wickets had he managed his runup a bit better. Asif had 300+ potential. Fazal was unfortunate to born in an in era when subcontinent teams didn't play enough international matches. Too much rotation of bowlers by PCB selectors is to blame here as they didn't give any fast bowler a long rope in last 20 years. They kept hoping Wasim-Waqar-Imran would drop from a tree.
 
On the contrary, I recon Naseem and Shaheen will change this by the time they reach 50 Tests
 
Interest g to compare how many Indian fast bowlers have taken 200 plus since Zaheer Khan, if somebody is willing to dig out stats, even though they play a lot more tests.
 
One of the main reasons is that PAK plays too few Test. Even for the three Lankans - Murali, Sanga & Mahela won't have reached their Test numbers for PAK because during their career period, I am sure Lanka has played more Tests than PAK.

Apart from that, focusing too much on LO cricket really ruined PAK pace attack - bowlers didn't develop skills for longer game, neither fitness for a sustainable decade long career. Wasim, Waquar, Imran & Sarfraz were County products for their skills & durability, hence they could play significant number of Tests despite PAK's malnourished Test schedules, even during their time as well. Still, I believe both Amir & Asif would have crossed 200 mark easily and Gul/Wahab had an outside chance. In fact, unless had he not wasted his career behind cheap cricket, A Razzak should have finished with 200+ wickets and may be 4000+ Test runs. One guy I thought should have a much better career was Sohail Khan - debuted in early 2009 and dumped within few months for 5-6 years.

At present, it's pure lack of quality - pacers coming with max 5 years cap before their tricks are exposed badly by international teams and by third/fourth year even passionate fans start to ask why oh why he is selected ...... going back 2-3 years in PP, Hasan Ali was destined to reach somewhere but not sure his present stay is where it was hyped. My hunch is, Abbas will struggle to cross 100 mark, let alone 200.
 
Amir and Asif were banned for long time. Akhtar and Gul had fitness issues. Junaid not sleceted regularly and fitness issues. Rahat, Sohail K, Mohd Sami not good enough. Wahab is a mystery
 
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Pakistan have done the smart thing here by identifying two guys who can become a 400 Test wicket each pair, and they have also directed them on the right path from an early age.

As long as Naseem and Shaheen stay fit, these boys will be challenging for top wickets tables for Fast bowlers.
 
Interest g to compare how many Indian fast bowlers have taken 200 plus since Zaheer Khan, if somebody is willing to dig out stats, even though they play a lot more tests.

Ishant Sharma - 297* wickets * indicates still to go

Shami- 180* wickets

Umesh Yadav 142* wickets.

You could have pulled this from cricinfo yourself lol
 
^ FYI Zak retired in 2014, add Bumrah and Bhuvi to the mix and all the wickets taken by Ashwin and Jadeja that’s mighty impressive
 
Pakistan plays few tests is absolute nonsense excuse for this.

Younis khan has 10,000+ runs and a mediocre batsmen like Asad Shafiq has played 75 tests in his career, there is no reason for a fast bowler not to take 200 wickets in this era for a top 8 team. Windies recently had Kemar Roach getting to 200 wickets.

It takes about 50-60 tests to take 200 wickets and this is literally not much. Yes, it's harder for Pakistan, SA and NZ to get to 400 wickets today but 200-300 is very much reachable for all.

Neil Wagner has been playing from not too long and has already reached 200 wickets so a benchmark of 200 wickets completely makes sense. As for wickets getting shared that is again wrong opinion, Starc, Cummins and Hazelwood all will go on and have 200+ wickets by the time they retire. Same for Steyn, Philander and Morkel and Boult/Southee/Wagner. All these teams had their wickets getting shared.
 
Neither Shaheen nor Naseem will take 200+ Test wickets.

Pakistani pacers are nothing but hot air.
 
It makes complete sense.

Akhtar struggled with injuries.

Gul was never a Test match bowler.

Amir and Asif (who would have hit 200) were banned in 2010.

Pakistan started playing Test cricket in the UAE in 2010 after the 2009 attacks.

Every great pacer of the 2010s struggled in the UAE. Steyn, Johnson, Starc, Anderson, Broad and Boult.

Pakistan started to base their bowling off spinners. Ajmal, Rehman, Zulfiqar, Bial and Yasir all bowled the bulk of the overs with Misbah and Sarfraz opting for support pacers like Rahat and Imran.

Decent pacers like Abbas, Amir and Hasan came to the team recently though. Abbas is doing well. Amir and Hasan were mismanaged and overplayed which resulted in fitness issues.

Expect the wickets to go up now. Shaheen and Naseem have been introduced and both have 5-fers because of the faster pitches in Pakistan. Abbas is unplayable in Rawalpindi. Hopefully Hasan Ali can come back soon as I have no doubt he will be great on Pakistani pitches.

Pakistan have to play more Test matches as well. Currently they play no Test cricket.
 
Neither Shaheen nor Naseem will take 200+ Test wickets.

Pakistani pacers are nothing but hot air.

Wow! It wasn't long ago when you backed him to take 300 test wickets.

I know you've never rated Naseem though.
 
Priority these days is quick bucks.

Play some Tests, then focus on white ball cricket.
 
Lol, Wasim debuted as a 18 year old and was a consistent pick from debut, Waqar debuted as a 19 year old and was a consistent pick from debut. All the other bowlers debuted late or had injuries, off the field issues. The volume of cricket that is being played these days, bowlers have to be super fit and have to have their workloads managed for longetivity
 
Lol, so you have turned on Shaheen as well now

He is a good bowler, but his problem is that he is a Pakistani, which means something will go wrong at some point, and he will not take 200+ wickets.
 
Nobody since Waqar has played 50 tests either (fast bowler).

Closest is Umar Gul - 47 tests.
 
Naseem and Shaheen will InshaAllah take 350+ wickets each.
 
Fitness issues
Tailing off after bright starts
Inconsistent selections
Bowlers lack of desire to play tests
 
Its a collective failure of the management systems and by the players involved
 
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We play around 7 Tests a year. Then the joke 2 test series against any decent opposition. Fickle selectors should won’t really give any bowler a decent run with this scenario as well.

100-150 wickets seems to be the ceiling these days

Pakistan would be well served with hard-working Trent Boult / Tim Southee type bowlers. Neither were hyped when they were young, yet the system developed them and they are both nearing 300 test wickets apiece despite playing fewer tests than Pakistan.

I realize Naseem and Shaheen are the flavour of the month, but how many such flavours have their been over the past 2 decades? In a way, it's best if fans realize that Wasim and Waqar were anomalies and history won't repeat itself, at least in the same fashion.
 
Pakistan would be well served with hard-working Trent Boult / Tim Southee type bowlers. Neither were hyped when they were young, yet the system developed them and they are both nearing 300 test wickets apiece despite playing fewer tests than Pakistan.

I realize Naseem and Shaheen are the flavour of the month, but how many such flavours have their been over the past 2 decades? In a way, it's best if fans realize that Wasim and Waqar were anomalies and history won't repeat itself, at least in the same fashion.

We have a great fan base, and legendary bowlers who were artists of the game. The expectations are high, the hype is inevitable.
 
Pakistan would be well served with hard-working Trent Boult / Tim Southee type bowlers. Neither were hyped when they were young, yet the system developed them and they are both nearing 300 test wickets apiece despite playing fewer tests than Pakistan.

I realize Naseem and Shaheen are the flavour of the month, but how many such flavours have their been over the past 2 decades? In a way, it's best if fans realize that Wasim and Waqar were anomalies and history won't repeat itself, at least in the same fashion.

Our bowlers suffer from the ego and mismanagement off officials as well.

Junaid Khan was a regular feature in the Pakistan team from 2011 to 2014, apparently his knee injury was badly mishandled by the then coaching staff of Waqar Younis, he apparently had a tiff with the team management as well and he never got a proper look in again. Junaid was an honest trier who benefited from the lack of hype and attention.

Amir was massively overhyped to the moon but suffered badly from poor workload management as well.

Wahab never got a consistent look in. He did reasonably well in the limited number of chances he got but his form was inconsistent.
 
Without Imran, Wasim and Waqar would have been around 200 wickets max or even less. They should thank his stars and kiss his feet for the tutoring/mentoring he provided them early on in their careers.
 
Too much hype, too early in the career.

They came they performed well initially, got hyped to the sky. While their opponents adjusted their skill sets to nullify these bowlers, the bowlers failed to further mature.

Failure to recognize that there is a problem and the self deluding belief that pakistani bowlers are better than others, without going into the details of the actual performance.

Too many matches with minnows.

Still believing that every bowler is a wasim or waqar who will walk into the world stage, take it by storm and keep doing it for more than a decade without the need to reinvent themselves.

Refusing to believe that the world has moved forward in terms of fast bowling and pakistan needs to change too.

This is absolutely spot on. Our fast bowlers don't possess the inclination or ability to evolve after the opposition has them figured out.

Lack of test cricket or too much focus on the low hanging fruit of ODI cricket might have been an excuse for bowlers such as Shoaib, Asif or Gul, but those excuses don't apply for the present generation, which has just simply not been good enough to succeed at the highest level. It's not as if any of them are pulling any trees in white ball cricket either.
 
We have a great fan base, and legendary bowlers who were artists of the game. The expectations are high, the hype is inevitable.

But it becomes a repetitive case of the 'boy who cried Waqar', from Mohammad Sami to Rahat Ali and everyone in between. 1985 and 1989 were a long time ago, and Pakistan should get rid of any notion that is a bowling superpower of some sort. Even the batting stocks have run dry in this time.

Australia went through a similar phase after Warne's retirement, when they trialed no fewer than 17 spinners in the hope of finding another one like him. In the end, a workhorse like Lyon is doing the job for them and he's nothing like Warne. Likewise, Pakistan should craft its own future not based on the past.
 
But it becomes a repetitive case of the 'boy who cried Waqar', from Mohammad Sami to Rahat Ali and everyone in between. 1985 and 1989 were a long time ago, and Pakistan should get rid of any notion that is a bowling superpower of some sort. Even the batting stocks have run dry in this time.

Australia went through a similar phase after Warne's retirement, when they trialed no fewer than 17 spinners in the hope of finding another one like him. In the end, a workhorse like Lyon is doing the job for them and he's nothing like Warne. Likewise, Pakistan should craft its own future not based on the past.

For as long as I’ve watched, only these following bowlers were hyped;

Asif
Amir
Junaid (for a bit)
Naseem (now)

Not sure when did Pakistan ever hype Rahat or others in the period of Akhtar spearheading onwards. 2 of those overhyped bowlers should have had 3-400 Test wickets if they didn’t get banned. Junaid went off the radar for whatever reasons and Naseem is still very young, he’s done ok so far at the age of 17 and an average of 34. With valuable away experience to Australia and England
 
Wahab Riaz has played 27 Tests in 8 years. He was a regular for a long time, clearly we are just not playing enough Test cricket!
 
Not sure when did Pakistan ever hype Rahat or others in the period of Akhtar spearheading onwards. 2 of those overhyped bowlers should have had 3-400 Test wickets if they didn’t get banned. Junaid went off the radar for whatever reasons and Naseem is still very young, he’s done ok so far at the age of 17 and an average of 34. With valuable away experience to Australia and England

Let's take him for example - on what basis are his tyres being pumped up? He averages 68 in England, 69 in Australia, 32+ in First Class cricket and is probably not 17 years old.

I'm just telling you to not set yourself up for disappointment.
 
Let's take him for example - on what basis are his tyres being pumped up? He averages 68 in England, 69 in Australia, 32+ in First Class cricket and is probably not 17 years old.

I'm just telling you to not set yourself up for disappointment.

He’s played 7 Tests, and he will get better and better.

I’m simply refuting this claim that Pakistani fans hype up every bowler. They don’t. I have clearly outlined 4 bowlers who I have seen hyped up and 2 of them were 400+ Test wicket taker quality for sure
 
Pakistan plays few tests is absolute nonsense excuse for this.

Younis khan has 10,000+ runs and a mediocre batsmen like Asad Shafiq has played 75 tests in his career, there is no reason for a fast bowler not to take 200 wickets in this era for a top 8 team. Windies recently had Kemar Roach getting to 200 wickets.

It takes about 50-60 tests to take 200 wickets and this is literally not much. Yes, it's harder for Pakistan, SA and NZ to get to 400 wickets today but 200-300 is very much reachable for all.

Neil Wagner has been playing from not too long and has already reached 200 wickets so a benchmark of 200 wickets completely makes sense. As for wickets getting shared that is again wrong opinion, Starc, Cummins and Hazelwood all will go on and have 200+ wickets by the time they retire. Same for Steyn, Philander and Morkel and Boult/Southee/Wagner. All these teams had their wickets getting shared.

Only Umar has played close to 50 tests, so yes Pakistan has been playing fewer tests than likes of India, Aus, and England. And the bowlers have been rotated around due to various issues already mentioned in this thread. How many Indian pace bowlers have taken 200 plus wickets since Srinath and Prasad retirements,, not many. Both Pakistan and India have been relying on their spinners for bulk of their wickets especially in India and UAE.
 
2 main things kept Pakistani fast bowlers away from getting 2 wickets, Longevity and fewer tests than other nations. Like come on, in 2008 Pakistan played ZERO tests. 2009, 2010, was slightly more. Someone like Asif, Aamir, Wahab, Junaid should've gotten close or crossed. Ok well Aamir and Asif were banned, but there is no doubt they would've easily gotten to 200+ or more.
 
Don't know about Amir but Asif would have surely got 200.

Too bad they decided to disgrace their nation. :asif
 
Only Umar has played close to 50 tests, so yes Pakistan has been playing fewer tests than likes of India, Aus, and England. And the bowlers have been rotated around due to various issues already mentioned in this thread. How many Indian pace bowlers have taken 200 plus wickets since Srinath and Prasad retirements,, not many. Both Pakistan and India have been relying on their spinners for bulk of their wickets especially in India and UAE.

It actually tells us that Pakistan have failed to handle their fast bowlers because of which none of their bowlers have been able to maintain a career of 60 tests(that should be enough for 200 wickets) in last 20 years.

In contrast, even India who are not as known for producing great fast bowlers have produced Zaheer, Shami and Ishant who had good enough careers to boost about. The point is not completely about aggregate number of wickets but the fact that how long do I have the service of my good bowlers.

What is the advantage for us if Bumrah ends with 100-120 test wickets at 21, it would mean nothing as his services was there just for 2-3 years of test career?
 
Naseem and Shaheen will InshaAllah take 350+ wickets each.

I think they'll follow the Mohammad Amir route.

What I mean by that is play Tests for a few years, have their fare share of injuries and then call it a day from red ball cricket.
 
Forget test matches, last pakistani pace bowler to have taken 200+ ODI wickets was Shoaib Akhter who debuted in the 90's and retired 9 years ago. Surely people now wont provide excuse of Pakistan not playing enough ODIs.
 
This is absolutely spot on. Our fast bowlers don't possess the inclination or ability to evolve after the opposition has them figured out.

r.

Fast bowlers find it difficult now because there is no reverse swing available as a cushion, their predecessors had that massive advantage. It's not easy for for sub continent fast bowlers to take wickets without Reverse swing.

You put Wahab / Junaid etc in that 80's team scenario and they will do far better.

You put a post Injury Waqar in today's world and he will struggle to hit 300.

Only exception would be Mohd Asif

Now add to it

1) Lesser annual tests

2) Poor / inconsistent selections

3) Modern ways of dissecting fast bowlers

And it becomes a cocktail of sorts

P. S. Imagine Shaheen Shah under Imran in 80's reversing the old ball... Mouth watering prospect
 
I think they'll follow the Mohammad Amir route.

What I mean by that is play Tests for a few years, have their fare share of injuries and then call it a day from red ball cricket.

At the end of the day, PCB have done the best they can with these 2. Drafted them in early, driving in to them the importance of Test cricket and letting them play important away games. If they sink, well at least the PCB gave them the platform to achieve the most they could
 
makes sense , no pakistani fast bowler has played 50 test matches since waqar younis.


Only gul and shoaib got to play more than 40 test matches.

To take wickets you have to play as well.
 
At the end of the day, PCB have done the best they can with these 2. Drafted them in early, driving in to them the importance of Test cricket and letting them play important away games. If they sink, well at least the PCB gave them the platform to achieve the most they could

Agree, but our players and to be fair the players of many other nations are lured by the bright lights, easy money and the fact that they only have to bowl 4 overs in a match.
 
The same waqar was in the coaching capacity of the national side since 2006... Became the head coach in 2010.. In the last 10 years Waqar has been the coach for atleast 5 years... how many bowlers has he produced....
 
I think they'll follow the Mohammad Amir route.

What I mean by that is play Tests for a few years, have their fare share of injuries and then call it a day from red ball cricket.

No no no. Not this. Not again. No.

PCB must limit the number of foreign leagues pakistanis play in and the number of matches and seasons they play in county.
 
Akhtar debuted in '97. Way too many cameras around nowadays.

Yes in 1990s and 2000s there were 2 cameras on the field. Akhtar’s wicket taking rate is top notch. Don’t be so bitter about life lol.
 
The same waqar was in the coaching capacity of the national side since 2006... Became the head coach in 2010.. In the last 10 years Waqar has been the coach for atleast 5 years... how many bowlers has he produced....

Overrated cricket Admin. He’s basically living off the name and game he made as a bowler, otherwise he is not up to mark in any job he does
 
Agree, but our players and to be fair the players of many other nations are lured by the bright lights, easy money and the fact that they only have to bowl 4 overs in a match.

This same option is available for Indians Aussies Englishman Saffers etc.

PCB must make sure they pay the young players well and that no one takes them for a ride like Amir did.
 
No no no. Not this. Not again. No.

PCB must limit the number of foreign leagues pakistanis play in and the number of matches and seasons they play in county.

They've limited it to 2 leagues per player, but PCB cannot stop the retirement route that the likes of Mohammad Amir took.
 
Can PCB say, if you retire from tests then you retire from all formats

They could not pick them for any format, but as we have seen with Amir and Wahab they have not done that.

But I feel the Mohammad Amir type situation will be one that will keep coming up in future in Pakistan cricket.
 
Maybe poor pitches?

If the likes of Shaheen and Naseem continuously play more on say hard Australian pitches they will take bucket loads of wickets. Subcontinental pitches are not good for pace bowling.
[MENTION=139165]naseem[/MENTION]
 
Says a lot about longevity, short-sighted ness motivation, off-field issues of our players.

Even the batters who are getting 5k and 6k runs are getting them at averages of 40 or sub-40 rather than 50.
 
As I replied in another thread few days ago.

Its been a mixture of few things that why no Pakistani pacer in the last decade or so was able to take 200 wickets post Waqar. Firstly, take out two best pacers of any nation from their cricketing decade, their second string would struggle to create impact and take too many wickets in limited tests let alone in UAE. Pakistan lost two of their best pacers of the time in Asif and Amir in 2010 itself. If people say Amir is now available, what has he done it would be an ignorant view of looking at things. Take 5 years out of any athlete in their 20s when he cant even play at club level is one of its kind of a setback. If anyone was expecting Rahat Ali, Mohammad Irfan (With that fitness and age), Bilawal Bhatt, Imran Khani etc to take 200 test wickets while playing home tests in UAE then expectations were unrealistic.

There was obvious lack of quality in pace bowling in last decade from and as I said take two of the best under 27 bowlers out of any team at the start of the decade they will struggle more often than not. Bench strength was Pak wasnt great and injuries to decent pacers like Junaid Khan and Umer Gul also didnt help much otherwise especially Gul had an outside chance of achieving that. Sohail Khan was another pacer who was pretty skillful but struggled with fitness and couldnt get selected at the right time. There are countless examples of 2nd tier pacers from each country which faded away.

Current gen of Pak pacers is inexperienced but anyone with even slight understanding of cricket can tell the difference between the raw quality vs pacers from 7,8 years ago.

200 test wickets is a big milestone and you need certain level of longevity and obviously quality to achieve that. Other than Asif and Amir the quality wasnt great and if there were few bowlers with decent quality they didnt have enough longevity. Further as mentioned playing limited number of tests and in conditions like UAE which were spin friendly also didnt help much.
 
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Pace bowling is the main crisis

Not many Pakistan fans would like to admit but we have a pace bowling crisis in our country.

Shaheen is the only international standard test pacer we have. Naseem, Haris, Hasnain Wasem etc all look good to eye but they have shown nothing soo far in their career to suggest they can be red ball bowlers at top level

The best test pacer after Shaheen is still over the hill Abbas and inconsistent Hassan Ali.

We have been out reversed two series in a row at home.
 
Only Shaheen has the capability among the current lot, no one else is good enough. They are only talented in the heads of their fans.
 
Shaheen has the talent but he has a long way to go to be an dominant Test bowler. Yes, he is lethal with the new ball but after that he doesn't know what he is doing and tries to bowl in every direction. He still needs to learn to art of taking wickets. His performances in England and Australia Tests have been nothing special.

No doubt he is a good new ball bowler in the shorter format but in that too he goes for plenty in the death.

I'm not sure how long he will play Tests because very soon he has to give up one format and it looks likely it will be Test Cricket. Playing 3 formats in not easy for a fast bowler. If he plays all the formats then he will definitely be injury prone and lose pace.

So, I'm not sure he will join the 200 wicket club.
 
Hasan Ali was on the way to be premier test bowler but Pakistan mishandled him by playing him a lot in his weakest format.
 
Asif, Amir, and Gul should've crossed 200 wickets. Asif and Amir threw it away.

I think Shaheen has a good chance to cross 300 wickets (maybe even 400).
 
Too much hype, too early in the career.

They came they performed well initially, got hyped to the sky. While their opponents adjusted their skill sets to nullify these bowlers, the bowlers failed to further mature.

Failure to recognize that there is a problem and the self deluding belief that pakistani bowlers are better than others, without going into the details of the actual performance.

Too many matches with minnows.

Still believing that every bowler is a wasim or waqar who will walk into the world stage, take it by storm and keep doing it for more than a decade without the need to reinvent themselves.

Refusing to believe that the world has moved forward in terms of fast bowling and pakistan needs to change too.

This is the reason. Not learning and maturing with age and mismanagement of team management. Pace will go down the more you play with age, hence working on skills set is important to nullify the opposition bowlers.

There was one special case of Mohammad Asif though who was a special talent but it went the wrong way for off field reasons.
 
Shaheen is very good. However, is he as good as Robinson or Jamieson let alone Bumrah or Cummins? No. Not yet. They are mismanaging him.
 
Only 4 reasons for this
a. Lack of Test cricket
b. Fickle selectors chop and change
c. Lack of interest from top players
d. Injuries

Selectors have chop and changed bowlers like Rahat Ali Junaid Khan, while players like Gul Amir and Wahab got bored took sabbatical now destroying players like Hassan Ali
 
Only 4 reasons for this
a. Lack of Test cricket
b. Fickle selectors chop and change
c. Lack of interest from top players
d. Injuries

Selectors have chop and changed bowlers like Rahat Ali Junaid Khan, while players like Gul Amir and Wahab got bored took sabbatical now destroying players like Hassan Ali

pitches too, for every pitch like rawalpindi a fast bowler will pbly lose 4 or 5 tests in his career. tests simply arent given the priority they should be in pak.
 
In some ways, PAK's fast attack really is minnow level.

PAK have lost every single Test match in the Southern Hemisphere since early 2011.

SL had an attack of Kasun Rajitha, Vishwa Fernando and Suranga Lakmal which completely outbowled Aamir, Shaheen, Abbas, Hasan etc.

BD won a Test in NZ when Taskin , Shoriful and Ebadot bowled in a manner that a Pakistan pace attack can only dream of nowadays.
 
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In some ways, PAK's fast attack really is minnow level.

PAK have lost every single Test match in the Southern Hemisphere since early 2011.

SL had an attack of Kasun Rajitha, Vishwa Fernando and Suranga Lakmal which completely outbowled Aamir, Shaheen, Abbas, Hasan etc.

BD won a Test in NZ when Taskin , Shoriful and Ebadot bowled in a manner that a Pakistan pace attack can only dream of nowadays.

Taskin is a promising bowler. I like that dude. Ebadot is also fiercely competitive. Never drops his pace. Consistently above 140k
 
This could be tough winters for Pakistan and NZ next a possibility of 0-5 looming
 
Pakistan need to move away from playing on deserts. Give more supporting wickets which will encourage bowlers to play the longer format.
 
In some ways, PAK's fast attack really is minnow level.

PAK have lost every single Test match in the Southern Hemisphere since early 2011.

SL had an attack of Kasun Rajitha, Vishwa Fernando and Suranga Lakmal which completely outbowled Aamir, Shaheen, Abbas, Hasan etc.

BD won a Test in NZ when Taskin , Shoriful and Ebadot bowled in a manner that a Pakistan pace attack can only dream of nowadays.

I beg these white pundits to please stop banging on about "Pakistan's fast bowling strength" every time we play. It's not the 1990s anymore.

Apart from Shaheen, there isn't a single world-class all-format pacers in our ranks.
 
I don’t think it’s a fair reflection of our fast bowling stocks. It’s a combination of things - 2010-17, fast bowling was given zero importance and then there was indecisiveness in selection. There are a lot of random 200 wkt fast bowlers in other teams. A lot of them have got there because there’s no one better. Pakistan haven’t really settled on anyone.

Amir and Asif bans naturally had an effect. They were easy 200 wkt shoe ins. Misbah rotated the fast bowlers like a merry go round post 2010.
 
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