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Pakistan in series deciders vs higher ranked teams

Gotham Cronie

Test Debutant
Joined
Jun 15, 2006
Runs
14,599
Last time Pakistan won an ODI series decider vs a higher ranked team was June 19, 2002 vs Australia in Brisbane.

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Since that win, they have played 15 ODI series deciders over-all and won 3 of them.

  • 2013 vs Zimbabwe
  • 2015 vs Zimbabwe
  • 2017 vs Windies
 
I think it’s criminally unfair that of all the set narratives about South Africa and choking in tournaments, not enough gets discussed about how much stage fright Pakistan have suffered from historically in big moments.
We are a truly brittle team. Panickstan is the apt description.
 
I think it’s criminally unfair that of all the set narratives about South Africa and choking in tournaments, not enough gets discussed about how much stage fright Pakistan have suffered from historically in big moments.
We are a truly brittle team. Panickstan is the apt description.

In the large scheme of things nobody remembers bilaterals. Pakistan's record in ICC tournaments is on PAR with the other top teams. They have won 50 over world cup (yes it was a long time ago). More recently they have won the World T20 and CT17. For what its worth they also won the Asia cup.

They also regularly reach ICC semi finals as well. Agreed on some occasions they have collapsed like a pack of cards, but generally Pakistan turn up for world events and give a decent account . Im still not confident we could chase 270 plus score in a crunch knockout match, but " Panickstan" is a extremely far fetched term, and South Africa till now will still in "big tournaments" remain chokers.
 
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In the large scheme of things nobody remembers bilaterals. Pakistan's record in ICC tournaments is on PAR with the other top teams. They have won 50 over world cup (yes it was a long time ago). More recently they have won the World T20 and CT17. For what its worth they also won the Asia cup.

They also regularly reach ICC semi finals as well. Agreed on some occasions they have collapsed like a pack of cards, but generally Pakistan turn up for world events and give a decent account . Im still not confident we could chase 270 plus score in a crunch knockout match, but " Panickstan" is a extremely far fetched term, and South Africa till now will still in "big tournaments" remain chokers.

I actually want pakistan to get set a target above 300 so we can know if they are able to chase it or not.
 
I actually want pakistan to get set a target above 300 so we can know if they are able to chase it or not.

Same because that is what will be expected in the WC in batting friendly conditions in England. If it is a 350+ wicket, can't always rely on the bowlers to bring that down to under 250. Batsmen will need to play their part. I would be intrigued to see if Imam has the ability to keep up with the rate in a 300+ scenario and how Babar deals with scoreboard pressure because he also takes his time to get set but I have more hopes from him since he was able to bat at over run a ball in the 3rd ODI when Pakistan made 317.

In the CT, not once were Pakistan set a total of 250+ in their must win games courtesy of Hasan Ali taking 3 wickets in virtually every match
 
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In the large scheme of things nobody remembers bilaterals. Pakistan's record in ICC tournaments is on PAR with the other top teams. They have won 50 over world cup (yes it was a long time ago). More recently they have won the World T20 and CT17. For what its worth they also won the Asia cup.

They also regularly reach ICC semi finals as well. Agreed on some occasions they have collapsed like a pack of cards, but generally Pakistan turn up for world events and give a decent account . Im still not confident we could chase 270 plus score in a crunch knockout match, but " Panickstan" is a extremely far fetched term, and South Africa till now will still in "big tournaments" remain chokers.

I would wager that Pakistan’s win loss ratio and general standing in cricket has declined over time due to these cherry picked consolation prizes randomly dispersed occasions.
It is entirely clear Australia has won more world cups than any other team, because they have won more bilaterally ad more deciding games in bilaterals. It is something india is trying to emulate which is why it will be considered a form team and favorite for the World Cup.
It really is that simple. Teams that win more games are more likely to go further in to the World Cup.
Pakistan cricket and it’s fans can choose to look at history for inspiration or they can actually change things now.
 
I actually want pakistan to get set a target above 300 so we can know if they are able to chase it or not.

Not tomorrow dude. 300 doesn't get chased under lights at Cape town.
We will get practice when we play the 5 odis Vs England.
Wed we need the bat first and score 320. That will be progress as we will have batted really really well in 4 out of 5 games be it first or second
 
Not tomorrow dude. 300 doesn't get chased under lights at Cape town.
We will get practice when we play the 5 odis Vs England.
Wed we need the bat first and score 320. That will be progress as we will have batted really really well in 4 out of 5 games be it first or second

During to course of the series it was either mike haysman or mark nicholas (because it obviosuly cant be rameez since he is not bothered by professional curiosity) that Imam made a comment earlier this year about wanting to fix pakistan's approach to chasing. Thats a good sign if you have young players coming in understanding this unwanted legacy that Pakistan has always carried.
 
I would wager that Pakistan’s win loss ratio and general standing in cricket has declined over time due to these cherry picked consolation prizes randomly dispersed occasions.
It is entirely clear Australia has won more world cups than any other team, because they have won more bilaterally ad more deciding games in bilaterals. It is something india is trying to emulate which is why it will be considered a form team and favorite for the World Cup.
It really is that simple. Teams that win more games are more likely to go further in to the World Cup.
Pakistan cricket and it’s fans can choose to look at history for inspiration or they can actually change things now.


Pakistan has always been known as unpredictable and mercurial. That has not changed over the course of time. No sensible Pakistan fan would call them world beaters , and we would even say we are not even "consistent". There are glaring flaws in the team and there is a " senior complexity " in our team which means players like Malik and Hafeez get a ridiculously long rope, whilst a new comer like Hussain Talat gets unceremoniously dumped after one game.

However your original post was comparing Pakistan to South Africa in pressure games and situations. Winning world events is not cherry picking, as they are big tournaments, with big coverage and high stakes. Performing well in them is not cherry picking, it actually shows that despite the flaws of the teams, they can rise above all odd, withstand pressure and win.

England is another classic example, of not being able to cope under pressure. They have the best team, and in CT13 and CT17 had the momentum, home advantage etc. Yet they came unstuck and choked under pressure, as India and Pakistan respectively in those matches rose to the occasion. i reckon a similar fate awaits them this summer.
 
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During to course of the series it was either mike haysman or mark nicholas (because it obviosuly cant be rameez since he is not bothered by professional curiosity) that Imam made a comment earlier this year about wanting to fix pakistan's approach to chasing. Thats a good sign if you have young players coming in understanding this unwanted legacy that Pakistan has always carried.

Absolutely agree, I said before the start of the series I would rather be losing tosses in this series so that we can be put under pressure.
I also said except for the DN in Cape town because 300 doesn't get chased there as the ball starts doing too much under lights and getting shot out for 140 in a series decider due to conditions rather than performance is not good for morale
 
Pakistan has always been known as unpredictable and mercurial. That has not changed over the course of time. No sensible Pakistan fan would call them world beaters , and we would even say we are not even "consistent". There are glaring flaws in the team and there is a " senior complexity " in our team which means players like Malik and Hafeez get a ridiculously long rope, whilst a new comer like Hussain Talat gets unceremoniously dumped after one game.

However your original post was comparing Pakistan to South Africa in pressure games and situations. Winning world events is not cherry picking, as they are big tournaments, with big coverage and high stakes. Performing well in them is not cherry picking, it actually shows that despite the flaws of the teams, they can rise above all odd, withstand pressure and win.

England is another classic example, of not being able to cope under pressure. They have the best team, and in CT13 and CT17 had the momentum, home advantage etc. Yet they came unstuck and choked under pressure, as India and Pakistan respectively in those matches rose to the occasion. i reckon a similar fate awaits them this summer.

I stand by my original post, Pakistan's record in series deciders shows how bad they have been in terms of ability to handle pressure. The reason why south africa gets more spoken about, as you rightly point out is that south africa was shredding every team to bits and regularly melting down at the world cup.
Pakistan never gets called a choker because most folks dont expect it to win. Thats a valid critique and narrative for outsiders.
But for those folks that run pakistan cricket...its worth pondering and fixing (and yes all those issues you mentioned are the ones to fix).
FWIW - I dont consider Pakistan's performance over the course of the CT to be a fluke.
 
I actually want pakistan to get set a target above 300 so we can know if they are able to chase it or not.

If we are put in to field first, I'd rather we put the foot on the gas and decimate SA batting line-up. Let's face it, we're not going to win the world cup if our bowling concedes 300 regularly. Once or twice is okay, but that's just wouldn't be our roadmap to victory. Either bat first and score big under less pressure, or take the opposition out cheap if bowling first. Our team is a bit one-dimensional like that at the moment.
 
For the OP: Your results show that we have been losing to higher ranked opposition - is this so surprising? More or less this simply highlights that in your selected time period our team has been poor and would be expected to lose against teams that are ranked higher.

As other posters have pointed, Pakistan has been punching above their weight in most tournament settings (i.e. WT20 win & multiple semi-final appearances, ICCT win, WC semifinalists) despite being ranked lower and having a worse outfit! Compare this to South Africa and you will find that their side consistently ranks high and losers to teams lower in ranking at crucial junctures - that's the difference.
 
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If you were to ask a neutral fan to name the top three ODI sides in the last decade, most will not mention Pakistan. We rank lower in this time period because we have been a poor ODI outfit.
 
If you were to ask a neutral fan to name the top three ODI sides in the last decade, most will not mention Pakistan. We rank lower in this time period because we have been a poor ODI outfit.

Foe me, Pakistan was at par with Australia in the 1990's. Since that 2003 world cup, Pakistan ranks 4th or 5th overall in ODI's.
 
Foe me, Pakistan was at par with Australia in the 1990's. Since that 2003 world cup, Pakistan ranks 4th or 5th overall in ODI's.

Yup I agree with you. This is the main reason we've been losing series deciders or series in general against higher ranking opposition; we simply haven't been good enough. The idea that we "panic" or are poor under pressure in high-stake matches simply has no merit at least in my opinion.
 
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