What's new

Pakistan move up to #5 in latest ICC ODI rankings as Australia slip to 34-year low at #6

Buffet said:
One thing to keep in mind, moving up because some other team is losing badly is not sustainable. Just to put it in perspective, this rank #5 will quickly become rank #6 if Aus wins even one game in currently ongoing series. Clearly, best way is to win consistently. Anyway, Pakistan is doing better than earlier and not sure why fans shouldn't feel happy about it.
Click to expand...

The most measured post in this thread.

Well said.
 
Slim said:
Isnt it just beautiful that your fluke filter only applies to Pakistan?

Where was your fluke filter when the number one test team got owned by England at their own home?

Where was your fluke filter when the WC champions gets beaten by other teams in their LOI series?

You should have some shame before calling a tournament that was won by not just winning one match but a series of matches a fluke. But i believe, you are beyond that. You have sunk your reputation completely after the post CT meltdown.

Coming Asia cup and the next Pakistan ODI series, i predict you will end up resigning from the forum if you have any self respect left.
Click to expand...

You have obviously missed - or opted to miss - the fact that I have called India’s 83 World Cup win a fluke as well, but it is understandable because it doesn’t suit your agenda.

India lost to England in India in 2012, but that Indian team was not number one. Moreover, it was an aging side and that is why India struggled in Tests between 2011 and 2013.

Their Fab Four batting unit was past its prime, and they need fresh legs. England caught them at the right time in Tests, just like we caught them at the right time in ODIs in the 2012-2013 series.

Yes top teams lose series as well, and just because you have won the World Cup doesn’t mean you will win every series, but Pakistan is not a top team, and it has lost over 80% of its bilateral ODI series against the top teams since 2006.

Hence, Pakistan have a lot to prove, and unless we start beating the likes of Australia, England, India, South Africa and New Zealand frequently in a bilateral series, we cannot prove that the Champions Trophy was not a fluke.

However, it appears that we are not up for the challenge, because the Champions Trophy winners miserably failed their first major test since winning the trophy, i.e. the New Zealand ODI series.
 
Mamoon said:
Hence, Pakistan have a lot to prove, and unless we start beating the likes of Australia, England, India, South Africa and New Zealand frequently in a bilateral series, we cannot prove that the Champions Trophy was not a fluke.
Click to expand...

The team doesn't need to prove that the champions trophy win wasn't a fluke. Most sensible cricket fans realise that they won the CT by winning a series of games and went on to hammer their archrivals in the final. That's how sport works. The best team on the day wins.
 
Itachi said:
It was a fluke because except CT, resume of Pakistan team is poor.
Click to expand...

1 year on and it still hurts.

No winning by 180 runs is not a fluke, no matter how you pathetically attempt to spin it to this absurd conclusion.
 
AssassinatedDevil said:
The team doesn't need to prove that the champions trophy win wasn't a fluke. Most sensible cricket fans realise that they won the CT by winning a series of games and went on to hammer their archrivals in the final. That's how sport works. The best team on the day wins.
Click to expand...

What I find laughable is ICC tournaments were/are the best measuring tape for a team's success and bilateral matches are basically warm-ups to the leading tournaments...

The same [user] claims Amla/ABD records won't matter if they only perform in bilateral series' but don't do so in ICC tournaments. Yet all of a sudden bilateral matches are the ultimate test and not winning actual ICC affiliate tournaments :))

Never change :P
 
90MPH said:
1 year on and it still hurts.

No winning by 180 runs is not a fluke, no matter how you pathetically attempt to spin it to this absurd conclusion.
Click to expand...

Hypothetically speaking, let's assume it hurts to the level of a mountain.

But does that invalidate the point that pak has nothing to show in the resume for years as a top team?
 
Usman Chadda said:
Pakistan has played only two ODI series since the CT, the last of which was six months back. Rubbish scheduling has made sure the team hasn't had the opportunity to develop momentum/learn from its mistakes and continue to improve on their ranking

Just look at the amount of T20s we have played and how these young players have improved in that format
Click to expand...

More series against the top 3-4 will help. You won't lose too many points if you lose, but you can gain points. Playing against 8th/9th rank is not going to gain many points even if you win all games. What's schedule looks like for Pakistan for the next 1 year?

Anyway, Pakistan is doing better than earlier and not sure why it's hard to accept for anyone. Even without results, simply watching the younger team play makes it clear that team is playing better. Even if Pakistan loses to top 3-4 teams, I have no doubt in saying that they are playing better. Simply based on how they play now. I am comparing it to 2-3 years back.
 
Itachi said:
Hypothetically speaking, let's assume it hurts to the level of a mountain.

But does that invalidate the point that pak has nothing to show in the resume for years as a top team?
Click to expand...

Are you saying that there are only 2 top teams? I don't recall anyone except Aus and Ind winning many trophies in the last 10-15 years.
 
Buffet said:
More series against the top 3-4 will help. You won't lose too many points if you lose, but you can gain points. Playing against 8th/9th rank is not going to gain many points even if you win all games. What's schedule looks like for Pakistan for the next 1 year?

Anyway, Pakistan is doing better than earlier and not sure why it's hard to accept for anyone. Even without results, simply watching the younger team play makes it clear that team is playing better. Even if Pakistan loses to top 3-4 teams, I have no doubt in saying that they are playing better. Simply based on how they play now. I am comparing it to 2-3 years back.
Click to expand...
Well said. People are just looking at the statistics and judging the current Pakistan team based on the performances of their predecessors. Just a few days back I had an individual tell me Pakistan's performances against Australia in 2017 and England 2016 under Azhar Ali is a reflection of how the team would perform going forward. The next few months has Pakistan playing New Zealand, Australia, South Africa and then England next year before the World Cup. The team should be judged properly then rather than one whitewash in NZ. In between we have a few ODIs against Zimbabwe and an Asia Cup, which should be good warm-ups for the tough series coming up
 
England are gonna stay on top for a while and Aus may drop further imo if they lose to Pakistan in October
 
Buffet said:
Are you saying that there are only 2 top teams? I don't recall anyone except Aus and Ind winning many trophies in the last 10-15 years.
Click to expand...

It is not just about trophies but overall performances. Just looking at ODIs, India has a W/L ratio of 1.926 over the last 10 years and is the highest out of any team. Then out of the major teams, you have Australia, SA, England, NZ, SL, and then Pakistan. That's enough to say that they haven't been a top team.

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...2008;spanval1=span;template=results;type=team
 
Sachin136 said:
It is not just about trophies but overall performances. Just looking at ODIs, India has a W/L ratio of 1.926 over the last 10 years and is the highest out of any team. Then out of the major teams, you have Australia, SA, England, NZ, SL, and then Pakistan. That's enough to say that they haven't been a top team.

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...2008;spanval1=span;template=results;type=team
Click to expand...

I was only challenging the view that top teams tag means lots of trophies. That's what poster was saying.

Sure, Pakistan was not among the top 3-4 sides in the last 10 years. No one will disagree with that statement.
 
Buffet said:
Are you saying that there are only 2 top teams? I don't recall anyone except Aus and Ind winning many trophies in the last 10-15 years.
Click to expand...

Actually yes.

Supposedly If there are 2 top teams, then lingering around #6 or #5 even after winning a CT win should show sad state of affairs. because now you aren't evn in top 4 which comprises only 2 top teams and rest average ones.
 
Mamoon said:
You have obviously missed - or opted to miss - the fact that I have called India’s 83 World Cup win a fluke as well, but it is understandable because it doesn’t suit your agenda.

India lost to England in India in 2012, but that Indian team was not number one. Moreover, it was an aging side and that is why India struggled in Tests between 2011 and 2013.

Their Fab Four batting unit was past its prime, and they need fresh legs. England caught them at the right time in Tests, just like we caught them at the right time in ODIs in the 2012-2013 series.

Yes top teams lose series as well, and just because you have won the World Cup doesn’t mean you will win every series, but Pakistan is not a top team, and it has lost over 80% of its bilateral ODI series against the top teams since 2006.

Hence, Pakistan have a lot to prove, and unless we start beating the likes of Australia, England, India, South Africa and New Zealand frequently in a bilateral series, we cannot prove that the Champions Trophy was not a fluke.

However, it appears that we are not up for the challenge, because the Champions Trophy winners miserably failed their first major test since winning the trophy, i.e. the New Zealand ODI series.
Click to expand...

India's WC 2011 was a fluke as well, they did not win the 2011 semi final. Pakistan lost it. How can a team which gets owned by Pakistan at their home series be called Champions in 2011? ;)

You see, the more deeper we go with your fluke theory, the more rubbish it seems.

Because by using your absurd logic, any victory, any championship can be discounted as a fluke. But here is what you try to cover it up. You say that "top teams" are not required to win all of their series to prove they are champions but Pakistan have to win all of their series to prove that. Well done, lad. You just did yourself. :yk

You say that Indian team had older players which is why they lost countless series but you fail to mention that how Pakistan team has changed since Mickey and Sarfraz took over.

Your double standards and hypocrisy are clear and for everyone to see. I used to think its Indian fans who are suffering from PTSD but i didnt know we have people on our side as well who are suffering the same because their massive ego is hurt.
 
Slim said:
India's WC 2011 was a fluke as well, they did not win the 2011 semi final. Pakistan lost it. How can a team which gets owned by Pakistan at their home series be called Champions in 2011? ;)

You see, the more deeper we go with your fluke theory, the more rubbish it seems.

Because by using your absurd logic, any victory, any championship can be discounted as a fluke. But here is what you try to cover it up. You say that "top teams" are not required to win all of their series to prove they are champions but Pakistan have to win all of their series to prove that. Well done, lad. You just did yourself. :yk

You say that Indian team had older players which is why they lost countless series but you fail to mention that how Pakistan team has changed since Mickey and Sarfraz took over.

Your double standards and hypocrisy are clear and for everyone to see. I used to think its Indian fans who are suffering from PTSD but i didnt know we have people on our side as well who are suffering the same because their massive ego is hurt.
Click to expand...

There way nothing flukey about India's World Cup win. That Indian team was the best in the world in Asian conditions, and were overwhelming favorites to win the title. 8/10 times, that Indian team would have won the World Cup in those conditions.

As far as the 2012-13 series is concerned, Pakistan caught them at the right time. The great Indian team were at the end of their cycle, and players like Sehwag, Gambhir, Tendulkar (who was dropped before the series), Yuvraj and Zaheer were pretty much done.

It is our great fortune that India have turned down our begging bowl in this decade, because had Pakistan vs India been an annual affair over the last 10 years or so, the head-to-head record would not have looked pretty. We have been extremely lucky to avoid playing India when we have been at our lowest ebb.

You can rubbish my theory of fluke and call me a hypocrite if you want to, but I think that 99/100 times, this Pakistan team will not be able to win the Champions Trophy against the same opposition in the same conditions, and same goes for India's 1983 World Cup and West Indies' 2004 Champions Trophy. I am citing these three because they are the biggest tournament flukes that I can think off the top of my head.

As far as the idea that the "Pakistan team has changed Mickey and Sarfraz took over" is concerned, again, I do not see much evidence. The proof lies in the pudding, and I cannot give them points for imaginary series.

Sarfraz-Mickey have had too many buffet series in Limited Overs. Even Azhar and Waqar's Pakistan dispatched the likes of Sri Lanka and the minnows in ruthless fashion. Yes they lost badly to Bangladesh, but they are a very good ODI side at home.

This team got thrashed like no tomorrow in the only major test that they faced, i.e. the New Zealand ODI series. That embarrassment has only reinforced my belief that the Champions Trophy was a fluke. Had Pakistan won that series or even put up a big fight, I would have accepted the the Champions Trophy was the start of something special rather than a flash in the pan.

Similarly, if this side goes onto to beat the likes of England, South Africa, Australia, New Zealand etc. in an ODI series, I will happily revisit my views on the Champions Trophy. However, as of now, I see little evidence in the theory that we have turned a corner in ODIs and are ready to take on any team in the world.

Good luck convincing me after the humiliation in New Zealand.
 
Chief Destroyer said:
Can we move past the fluke nonsense?

This is good progression from Pakistan and long may it continue, inshaAllah.
Click to expand...

Hardly any progression ... in a first real series after CT against Kiwis we got walloped!

Our batting is a major hurdle to becoming elite top 2-3 team.
 
hadi123 said:
I'm a Pakistani fan but I am not looking too much into this. Not many other nations would celebrate going up to 5, which still isn't that great. Performances matter more than rankings. The Zimbabwe series won't mean much, if we can beat NZ and Australia in UAE in ODI's then I will be satisified :) . The Champions Trophy wasn't a fluke as we played amazing cricket there and were deserved winners but we need to build on that. Can't be taking one step forward and then another step back, as we got thrashed 5-0 by NZ which was our first high-profile series since the Champions Trophy.
Click to expand...

Well said, agree 100%.
 
Nice to see us in the top 5 but the only downside is that we hardly play any ODI's, seems to strange that we've played billions of ODI's under Misbah's captaincy (20+ ODI's against South Africa in 2013 to reinforce this) which was one of our lowest points in ODI's.
 
Australia finish in sixth position after series whitewash

MEDIA RELEASE 24 Jun 18

Australia have slipped behind Pakistan after losing four points in the series and finishing on 100 points. Australia, who fell to sixth place for the first time in more than three decades when they conceded a 2-0 lead during the series, are now two points behind Pakistan and seven ahead of Bangladesh.

The emphatic series victory sees England consolidate their position at the top of table. They have made up for a surprise loss to Scotland in a one-off ODI before this series when they lost two points and slipped to 123 points. They have finished the Australia series on 126 points, four more than second-placed India.

England’s next series is against India at home from 12 to 17 July, in which the Asian team have the chance to seize back the top position if they put up the kind of performance England did against Australia.

England will retain the top spot even if they lose the series 2-1 but should they go down 3-0, the rankings table will see India back at the top of the table.

The rankings table is available here and the rankings predictor function is available here

https://www.icc-cricket.com/media-releases/755134
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Man, the burning is real.

Never cared about ICC's ranking but it's sad and funny to see haters spitting hate and downplaying Pakistan.

Pathetic.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Updated Men's ODI rankings <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Cricket?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Cricket</a> <a href="https://t.co/iTQsFiqJdh">pic.twitter.com/iTQsFiqJdh</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@Saj_PakPassion) <a href="https://twitter.com/Saj_PakPassion/status/1027583694586949637?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 9, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
I don’t understand what the issue is here. Yes we would like us to be number one and give us a reason to celebrate but to see us go up from number 9 to number 5 is a great improvement, we are more consistent than ever in ODI’s we are gelling well as a team and have some great bright future superstars. Yes we are only number 5, and that’s mid table but the reason why Pakistani fans are happy, not because they are number 5 but we recognise the improvement from where we were. It’s great to finally see us doing better than we have done in a long time.
 
From no 9 to no 5 in such a short time under Sarfi is a great improvement and also throws the myth that we defeated minnows. Imo we will be in top 3 this time next year.
 
Its a massive improvement that Pakistan have got to No.5 specially if remember where we were before. Hopefully the only way is up.
 
Out with the old, in with the new is finally paying off for Pak cricket. This should have been done a long time ago.
 
Now comes the real climb! 8 points rating difference from where we are and where we would like to be next. If we somehow manage to make it in the top 3 in the next year that would be one hell of an achievement, given not so long ago were were ranked 9th!
 
BDfanforever said:
How are they going to go past NZ when they lost to NZ 0-5? Most likely Australia will regain it's position in the next 12 months when it's players returns.
Click to expand...

Yeah that nz series is only excuse you guys have left .you will see it in asia cup how this new pakistan team is capable of reaching in top 3.
 
BDfanforever said:
How are they going to go past NZ when they lost to NZ 0-5? Most likely Australia will regain it's position in the next 12 months when it's players returns.
Click to expand...

Looks like you guys are going to milk that NZ series as long as you can. Desperate :))
 
saeed5646 said:
Yeah that nz series is only excuse you guys have left .you will see it in asia cup how this new pakistan team is capable of reaching in top 3.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's because that is the only quality team they played in recent series.

Asia cup only has one top quality side.

When you start playing the likes of England, SA, and even #6 Australia and start to beat them people will get convinced.
 
BDfanforever said:
Yeah, that's because that is the only quality team they played in recent series.

Asia cup only has one top quality side.

When you start playing the likes of England, SA, and even #6 Australia and start to beat them people will get convinced.
Click to expand...

nz is in top three because they have improve immensely at home and too strong to beat their

i said asia cup because it is happening in uae our adopted home where we will dominate most team

in asia cup unlike in 2015 to 2016 when we were terrible side .

here is our last odi series against top side in uae

aus 2012/13

SA 2014

nz 2015

england 2015

i will back my team to beat most of them at home if we played them currently
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

BouncerGuy
ICC Teams and Player Rankings watch for 2025
2
Replies
88
Views
11K
BouncerGuy
BouncerGuy
The Bald Eagle
  • Poll Poll
[PICTURES] Can the Pakistan team ever remain among the top five sides in the ICC ODI rankings without facing minnow teams?
Replies
52
Views
2K
gazza619
gazza619
Devadwal
[PICTURE] ICC ODI Team of the Year (2024) announced
Replies
0
Views
384
Devadwal
Devadwal
Savak
Mitchell Johnson vs Mitchell Starc: Who will go down as the bigger legend for Australia?
Replies
28
Views
2K
RedwoodOriginal
RedwoodOriginal
The Bald Eagle
Jasprit Bumrah crowned as the winner of Sir Garfield Sobers Award for ICC Men’s Cricketer of the Year 2024
Replies
19
Views
822
BouncerGuy
BouncerGuy
Back
Top