Pakistan's ICC World Cup 2011 vs ICC World Cup 2023 Teams

[Bilal7]

I'm seeing a lot of negativity from the resident crybabies but I would just like to remind everyone about the 2011 WC, where we finished top of our group; beat the unbeatable Aussies; beat the eventual finalists Sri Lanka; and came within a few runs of making the final.

We did this with the following issues:

1) One, yes ONE, frontline pacer (albeit an excellent one).
2) An absolutely garbage keeper.
3) Mediocre openers.
4) No dynamism in the middle order with the exception of the inconsistent, younger Akmal.
5) Infighting and groupings.

If that team can waltz into the semi-finals and give India's greatest ODI team a scare, the current boys can at the very least match that performance.

After all, which team would you prefer?

1) K. Akmal (wk)
2) Mohammad Hafeez
3) Asad Shafique
4) Younis Khan (c)
5) Misbah ul Haq (c)
6) Umar Akmal
7) Abdul Razzaq
8) Shahid Afridi (c)
9) Saeed Ajmal
10) Shoaib Akhtar's rotting corpse
11) Umar Gul

12 Wahab Riaz

Vs

1) Fakhar Zaman
2) Imam ul Haq
3) Babar Azam (c)
4) Mohammad Rizwan (wk)
5) Saud Shakeel
6) Iftikhar Ahmed
7) Shadab Khan
8) Mohammad Nawaz
9) Shaheen Afridi
10) Nasee... Hasan Ali
11) Haris Rauf

12) Usama Mir

 

[Bilal7]

Although, I must say a combined team would absolutely destroy any team in the world today:

1) K. Akmal
2) Imam ul Haq
3) Babar Azam
4) Mohammad Rizwan (wk)
5) Saud Shakeel
6) Misbah ul Haq
7) Abdul Razzaq
8) Shahid Afridi
9) Shaheen Afridi
10) Umar Gul
11) Saeed Ajmal

12) Haris Rauf

 

[Cricket Warrior]

2011 team was well balanced in terms of bowling they were in a better shape.

Likes of Gul, Akhtar, Wahab, Ajmal made our bowling unit so strong.

what we have now?

 

[Rana]

Although, I must say a combined team would absolutely destroy any team in the world today:

1) K. Akmal
2) Imam ul Haq
3) Babar Azam
4) Mohammad Rizwan (wk)
5) Saud Shakeel
6) Misbah ul Haq
7) Abdul Razzaq
8) Shahid Afridi
9) Shaheen Afridi
10) Umar Gul
11) Saeed Ajmal

12) Haris Rauf

Looks like a Misbah 30-3 side

 

[Usman Chadda]

We had Ajmal, Afridi and Hafeez as our spin bowling attack.

Yes the batting in 2011 was quite lame compared to the batting line-up in this World Cup, but that spin bowling attack was excellent and more than made up for the batsmen’s weaknesses.

Having such a rubbish spin bowling attack was a recipe for disaster for a World Cup in India. Since Babar was relying more so on his pacers and one of them broke down right before the World Cup, he has a lulla langra bowling attack now unfortunately.

 

[topspin]

The 2011 WC had one of the worst batting line-ups in the tournament. It was worse than what Ireland had.

But back then the wickets had a better balance between bat and ball. 280+ was a winning score. 300+ was guaranteed if your bowling was half decent.

Pakistan's bowlers carried the team and they were more effective in these conditions with the likes of Afridi and the chucking services of Ajmal and Hafeez.

You take out Shaheen, there's nothing left in the bowling dept. The 2011 WC team had Gul, Akhtar and Ajmal.

Yes the batting has vastly improved since then especially now that Misbah isn't in the side but like him we have Imam, Babar and Rizwan who have no interest in winning matches for Pakistan. For them, averages and milestones are far more important. That's why this Pakistan team is so unlikeable.

The 2011 WC team made the semi-finals and they thoroughly deserved it by playing good cricket until Misbah came up with a show of his own in Mohali.

This team has no chance of making the semis. We can't fluke it like we did last year during the 2022 WT20 when we managed to get out of jail following the defeat to Zimbabwe. The margin for error is so small.

I much prefer the 2011 WC side not only because they proved themselves to be worth semi-finalists but also because we don't have a team, we have a very cringe clique led by Captain Milestone.

 

[topspin]

Although, I must say a combined team would absolutely destroy any team in the world today:

1) K. Akmal
2) Imam ul Haq
3) Babar Azam
4) Mohammad Rizwan (wk)
5) Saud Shakeel
6) Misbah ul Haq
7) Abdul Razzaq
8) Shahid Afridi
9) Shaheen Afridi
10) Umar Gul
11) Saeed Ajmal

12) Haris Rauf

No one in their right mind would take Misbah at number 6 if you were to combine both teams. This isn't stand up comedy.

 

[ArabKnight]

1. Sharjeel Khan
2. Azam Khan
3. Babar Azam
4. Sarfraz Ahmed (c) (wk)
5. Mohammed Haris
6. Imad Wasim
7. Asif Ali
8. Shaheen Afridi
9. Mohammed Amir
10. Abrar Ahmed
11. Usman Shinwari

 

[YousafTheBeast]

I’ll never forgive the PCB for taking players like Shafiq over Malik in conditions he would’ve done well in.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

1. Sharjeel Khan
2. Azam Khan
3. Babar Azam
4. Sarfraz Ahmed (c) (wk)
5. Mohammed Haris
6. Imad Wasim
7. Asif Ali
8. Shaheen Afridi
9. Mohammed Amir
10. Abrar Ahmed
11. Usman Shinwari

top two from ur list gave me the impression that they might be going to participate in a kabaddi match.

 

[GLORY OF '92]

top two from ur list gave me the impression that they might be going to participate in a kabaddi match.

Still better than Imam and Rizwan. I don't care if you weigh 40 stone if you win me a WC.

 

[saqib.rai]

Now when I look back, 2011 was a pretty good team.
Only if Shoaib Malik had been cleared to play instead of Asad Shafiq, it would have been an even better side

 

[CerebralPatriot]

I think a more apt comparison is with the 2017 CT team considering many of the guys that played that tournament are still active.
1. Fakhar > Abdullah - no need to explain
2. Azhar > Imam- although both are useless by 2017 Azhar had become a semi decent opener in ODIs and had a much greater ability to strike the ball compared to Imam
3. Babar < Babar- no need to explain
4. Hafeez > Rizwan- no need to explain
5. Sarfraz >> Agha- a match winner vs a match loser
6. Malik > Iftikhar- both are poor but Malik's fitness gives him the edge
7. Imad > Nawaz- no need to explain
8. Shadab > Shadab- probably the only case where'd you see a player regress rather than improve with 6 years of experience
9. Hasan> Hasan- I take my word back
10. Amir> Shaheen- Controversial however I don't think we will ever see Shaheen break the back of a ATG top order in an ICC final
11. Junaid = Rauf
So besides Babar who naturally improved over time, the rest of the 2023 is well below in comparison to the team of 2017. However that wouldn't be too alarming as the team we had assembled then was very good however the biggest issue is that of captaincy.

Sarfraz >>>>> Babar and due to that huge gap coupled with a poor team I think it's fair to say that this may top 2007 as our worst world cup performance

 

[pratiktc]

The 2011 WC field was the weakest with SA and India having strongest all round team and strongest batting order respectively.

Other contenders SL and Pak were average teams well behind the top 2 but they had capability to bring 20-25 overs of quality spin per game which helped cover their other inadequacies (in case of Pak, poor top order batting, in case of SL, weak middle order).

Aus and NZ fielded their weakest lineups in last 5-6 world cups and only made knockouts thanks to the format of tournament.

Eng surprisingly punched above their weight by outperforming with the bat in a few games. West Indies was mediocre and signed off with whimper defeats against India and Pak.

The team that will look on 2011 with most regrets was SA who had a great balanced team and brought brilliant strategy in playing 3 quality spinners. SA vs India was the final the 2011 WC deserved.

 

[pratiktc]

1. Sharjeel Khan
2. Azam Khan
3. Babar Azam
4. Sarfraz Ahmed (c) (wk)
5. Mohammed Haris
6. Imad Wasim
7. Asif Ali
8. Shaheen Afridi
9. Mohammed Amir
10. Abrar Ahmed
11. Usman Shinwari

The ultimate unlimited buffet destroyer team. Roti Saalan XI

 

[ArabKnight]

The ultimate unlimited buffet destroyer team. Roti Saalan XI

The Sarfraz, Imad, Amir have 6 ICC trophies between them. Amazing, right?

 

[hassan918]

On paper, this team is better than 2011 team but a couple of our key players are not in the best of forms. One of Fakhar Zaman and other is Shadab Khan. If they both can perform to the best of their ability then Pakistan would surely reach the semi-finals. After that, you can never be sure in knockout games.

 

[saqib.rai]

I think a more apt comparison is with the 2017 CT team considering many of the guys that played that tournament are still active.
1. Fakhar > Abdullah - no need to explain
2. Azhar > Imam- although both are useless by 2017 Azhar had become a semi decent opener in ODIs and had a much greater ability to strike the ball compared to Imam
3. Babar < Babar- no need to explain
4. Hafeez > Rizwan- no need to explain
5. Sarfraz >> Agha- a match winner vs a match loser
6. Malik > Iftikhar- both are poor but Malik's fitness gives him the edge
7. Imad > Nawaz- no need to explain
8. Shadab > Shadab- probably the only case where'd you see a player regress rather than improve with 6 years of experience
9. Hasan> Hasan- I take my word back
10. Amir> Shaheen- Controversial however I don't think we will ever see Shaheen break the back of a ATG top order in an ICC final
11. Junaid = Rauf
So besides Babar who naturally improved over time, the rest of the 2023 is well below in comparison to the team of 2017. However that wouldn't be too alarming as the team we had assembled then was very good however the biggest issue is that of captaincy.

Sarfraz >>>>> Babar and due to that huge gap coupled with a poor team I think it's fair to say that this may top 2007 as our worst world cup performance

If we win the World Cup, your opinion would change. So would the <, >, = you are so fond of using without any logical justifications

 

[mominsaigol]

I think a more apt comparison is with the 2017 CT team considering many of the guys that played that tournament are still active.
1. Fakhar > Abdullah - no need to explain
2. Azhar > Imam- although both are useless by 2017 Azhar had become a semi decent opener in ODIs and had a much greater ability to strike the ball compared to Imam
3. Babar < Babar- no need to explain
4. Hafeez > Rizwan- no need to explain
5. Sarfraz >> Agha- a match winner vs a match loser
6. Malik > Iftikhar- both are poor but Malik's fitness gives him the edge
7. Imad > Nawaz- no need to explain
8. Shadab > Shadab- probably the only case where'd you see a player regress rather than improve with 6 years of experience
9. Hasan> Hasan- I take my word back
10. Amir> Shaheen- Controversial however I don't think we will ever see Shaheen break the back of a ATG top order in an ICC final
11. Junaid = Rauf
So besides Babar who naturally improved over time, the rest of the 2023 is well below in comparison to the team of 2017. However that wouldn't be too alarming as the team we had assembled then was very good however the biggest issue is that of captaincy.

Sarfraz >>>>> Babar and due to that huge gap coupled with a poor team I think it's fair to say that this may top 2007 as our worst world cup performance

Azhar wasn't a bad opener, he played an important knock at the final and was a solid compliment to fakhar. He kept up the pace with fakhar and took all pressure of ove him unlike imam who hopes fakhar can accelerate so he can go on his merry way. Azhar kept up with the RR too. Azhar isn't as xonsistent as Imam but when he did perform he always had match winning knocks cause he didn't need fakhar hand holding, he complimented fakhar well.

Also Rauf > Junaid, it isn't a contest. Junaid was a has been by 2017, probs our worst bowler in that tournament. Rauf is superior to shaheen as a bowler lol, Shaheen relies on that early inswing, Otuerwise shaheen is trash at the middle overs. Rauf genuinely picks up wickets and has more variation and is smarter then junaid will ever be. After his injury, junaid never replicated his success from 2012 India series.

But yh, our 2017 CT team smokes pur 2023 World cup team. 2017 fakhar would feast on waseem Jr, or current hasan Ali lol.

Hafeez would love bowling to imam, and no one from our 2023 unit is surviving amir except for saud or babar(Assuming babar can hold off against the early inswing and get to the middle overs).

 

[mominsaigol]

I'm seeing a lot of negativity from the resident crybabies but I would just like to remind everyone about the 2011 WC, where we finished top of our group; beat the unbeatable Aussies; beat the eventual finalists Sri Lanka; and came within a few runs of making the final.

We did this with the following issues:

1) One, yes ONE, frontline pacer (albeit an excellent one).
2) An absolutely garbage keeper.
3) Mediocre openers.
4) No dynamism in the middle order with the exception of the inconsistent, younger Akmal.
5) Infighting and groupings.

If that team can waltz into the semi-finals and give India's greatest ODI team a scare, the current boys can at the very least match that performance.

After all, which team would you prefer?

1) K. Akmal (wk)
2) Mohammad Hafeez
3) Asad Shafique
4) Younis Khan (c)
5) Misbah ul Haq (c)
6) Umar Akmal
7) Abdul Razzaq
8) Shahid Afridi (c)
9) Saeed Ajmal
10) Shoaib Akhtar's rotting corpse
11) Umar Gul

12 Wahab Riaz

Vs

1) Fakhar Zaman
2) Imam ul Haq
3) Babar Azam (c)
4) Mohammad Rizwan (wk)
5) Saud Shakeel
6) Iftikhar Ahmed
7) Shadab Khan
8) Mohammad Nawaz
9) Shaheen Afridi
10) Nasee... Hasan Ali
11) Haris Rauf

12) Usama Mir

Ngl our 2011 team wins.

No one in 2023 team is surviving chucking saeed ajmal nor shahid afridi spell.

Batting wise the 2011 team sucks though. Even more so then our 2023 batting team.

 

[Bilal7]

Ngl our 2011 team wins.

No one in 2023 team is surviving chucking saeed ajmal nor shahid afridi spell.

Batting wise the 2011 team sucks though. Even more so then our 2023 batting team.

How is the 2011 team going to survive Shaheen's opening spell? Or play Haris Rauf?

Ajmal was a beast but with spin bowling being nerfed due to the new rules, I can see Babar, Rizwan and Saud negotiating him. Afridi is not going to pose much danger due to the number of left-handers we have.

The 2023 team has the better batsmen, bowlers and fielders. The 2011 team had the better spin attack.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Ngl our 2011 team wins.

No one in 2023 team is surviving chucking saeed ajmal nor shahid afridi spell.

Batting wise the 2011 team sucks though. Even more so then our 2023 batting team.

To be honest, Chuckmal, Hafeez and Afridi were at their prime in that World Cup.

Gul was on fire and Akhtar was well Akhtar while Wahab was good.

That attack could destroy most teams on its day.

They didnt need to score more than 250.

The bowlers were good enough to win the match on its own.

 

[mominsaigol]

How is the 2011 team going to survive Shaheen's opening spell? Or play Haris Rauf?

Ajmal was a beast but with spin bowling being nerfed due to the new rules, I can see Babar, Rizwan and Saud negotiating him. Afridi is not going to pose much danger due to the number of left-handers we have.

The 2023 team has the better batsmen, bowlers and fielders. The 2011 team had the better spin attack.

You mean the same way New Zealand part timers played haris Rauf?

The thing is, Shaheen is a killer new ball bowler, Rauf is a killer middle over batsmen but shaheen is a garbo middle overs bowler and Rauf is terrible at opening bowling but he has too due to the absence of naseem.

The rest of the bowling attack is so non existent that even minnows can play them. Current hasan Ali, waseem Jr, nawaz, And current shadab ain't troubling anyone. Also Umar, Kamran, misbah, afridi, razzaq, Younis, Hafeez ain't too bad.

Ik for a fact that gul, World cup level wahab, 2011 bowling afridi, saeed ajmal, all these guys are clearing our current batsmen with ease. Only babar and saud can really see them off.

Also you're overrating our 2023 team. Our 2023 team is riding on the tails of imam, Babar and rizwan performing. If saud plays then he can be the X factor. But shadab, Nawaz, Agha, are liabilities.

Rizzu and imam won't survive our 2011 bowling attack.

Our 2011 bowling attack troubled peak India and virtually dismissed Sachin Tendulkar 7x if it wasn't for our chocking nature against India.

Our 2011 bowling only weak link was akhtar who wasn't even fronline wahab was in his place and wahab although an average series bowler he's probs been pakistan's best world cup bowler for the past decade. Gul, Afridi and ajmal are unplayable for our 2023 team. Chacha, imam, Rizzu, these guys ain't doing anything. Only saud and Babar can see off.

 

[Bhaijaan]

This is definitely a better batting line up, at least potentially.

Fast bowling again, potentially better this time around but there’s not a huge difference now with Naseem Shah out.

What that 2011 team had it going for them was a spin trio of Ajmal, Afridi, Hafeez. It made up a very good spin line up. Ajmal we all know was class apart. Afridi took care of the minnows and Hafeez took care of the lefties.

 

[Swashbuckler]

2011 team was better in my opinion. A real contender especially if you consider the kind of sluggish, turning pitches in that edition, and one new ball rule. That team used to boss the middle overs with the spin trio of Afridi, Ajmal and Hafeez. Gul was probably the second best ODI bowler behind Malinga at that time, killer yorkers, killer reverse swing. You also had Akhtar, Wahab Riaz. Good all rounders in Razzaq, Afridi, Hafeez. Younis was a master batsman against spin, and those pitches needed him in the XI. He failed in Mohali but that was due to nerves, everyone was so nervous in that game because of the hype. Misbah on such pitches was a gun captain, he knew how to handle his spinners, how to win 240-260 score games. Umar Akmal back then was the next big thing in cricket, in 2010 and 2012 WT20s he played some blinders, very dynamic middle order batsman. You may have the benefit of hindsight now but 2011 Umar Akmal was more dynamic than any middle order Pak batsman of today.

This Pakistani team isn't that dangerous because they are outdated. Pakistanis of 2011 WC were not outdated, especially not with one new ball rule and those pitches. Today we have flatter pitches, 2 new balls, different powerplay rules, all to suit the power hitting SENA sides. Pakistan is very weak in the middle and end phase especially now that Naseem is injured. Better in overs 1-10 but not in 11-50. Batting is better but the 2011 team had better middle order, both in terms of handling spin and late overs bashing because of Akmal/Afridi/Razzaq.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

Nostalgia merchants are at it again…..


This Pakistani team beats the 11 one on everything apart from spin bowling.

Fakhar
Imam
Are probably amongst the top 5 openers pak ever had in odis.

Babar is the greatest odi batsman they have produced by a country mile

Rizwan , although not great in odis still beats Kamran Akmal by a fair margin with infinitely better keeping and being more consistent in batting

Umar was talented,but what was his output in 2011? Chacha will definitely do better than him, also he is Pakistan’s best batsman against spin

Misbah and YK were two of the worst odi batsman who played so many matches, Shakeeel has to be a failure of epic proportions to be worse than them.

Now coming to fast bowling,
Shaheen is better than anyone in that lineup (considering Shoaib was done and dusted)

Rauf alcan easily match Akhtar of 11

As for Wahab Riaz, he did well in the semis but you know that how bad he can be on some days. Will definitely take Hasan alis career over Wahabs


Spin bowling of 11 was way better but that was due to two chuckers.

Afridi was mostly a minnow basher as a bowler in odis but he had a good world cup.
If someone disects his overall stats against top teams they are even worse than Youvraj Singh who was considered to be a part tomer.

 

[Kianig89]

Nostalgia merchants are at it again…..


This Pakistani team beats the 11 one on everything apart from spin bowling.

Fakhar
Imam
Are probably amongst the top 5 openers pak ever had in odis.

Babar is the greatest odi batsman they have produced by a country mile

Rizwan , although not great in odis still beats Kamran Akmal by a fair margin with infinitely better keeping and being more consistent in batting

Umar was talented,but what was his output in 2011? Chacha will definitely do better than him, also he is Pakistan’s best batsman against spin

Misbah and YK were two of the worst odi batsman who played so many matches, Shakeeel has to be a failure of epic proportions to be worse than them.

Now coming to fast bowling,
Shaheen is better than anyone in that lineup (considering Shoaib was done and dusted)

Rauf alcan easily match Akhtar of 11

As for Wahab Riaz, he did well in the semis but you know that how bad he can be on some days. Will definitely take Hasan alis career over Wahabs


Spin bowling of 11 was way better but that was due to two chuckers.

Afridi was mostly a minnow basher as a bowler in odis but he had a good world cup.
If someone disects his overall stats against top teams they are even worse than Youvraj Singh who was considered to be a part tomer.

I watched every delivery of that SF when it happened there is earth to sky difference between 2011 side and 2023 side.
Recently again went through the scorecard nothing extraordinary by Indians still cannot fathom how we lost that game, We are in that game despite multiple.blunders dropped Sachin several times not to mention the dubious hawkeye review, even while chasing despite the baffonery of our batters and the tuk tuk brigade we were in the game, Umar Akmal I feel was the one wicket from where India turned the tabled and the crank in Shastri' voice highlights the turning point , Indian bowlers did nothing extraordinary Zak the Premier bowler was most expensive at 5.8 Yuvi bowled 10 overs, what an opportunity missed by Pakistan but then again whole country is a story of missed opportunities and advantage given up

 

[Major]

2011 world cup squad was picked on the basis of 6 months preparation. After Amir and co were caught trying to earn illegal money by spot fixing, Pakistan had a few months to build a team.

Yet when the squad was announced, everyone was happy. OP only posted 12 man, but the 15 man squad was the best squad for the conditions. Pakistan went with Abdur Rehman as an extra spinner cause the world cup was in India.

While the 2023 batting attack is better, but the bowling attack of 2011 was marvelous. Afridi was bowling well, Hafeez was a wonderful 5tth bowler and than we Ajmal chucking for us. Abdur Rehman was a very good Left arm spinner and played some very crucial matches.

The squad was soo good that someone like Junaid Khan was not even needed in the world cup even though he was in the squad. Umar Guls bowling against Australia was a treat to watch.

One thing i credit is Akhtar who quietly did his last 6 months. No controversy after the spot fixing event. He played his cricket, did not do anything stupid and was able to retire.

The bowling of 2023 is just a complete joke.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Egg on your face

I watched every delivery of that SF when it happened there is earth to sky difference between 2011 side and 2023 side.
Recently again went through the scorecard nothing extraordinary by Indians still cannot fathom how we lost that game, We are in that game despite multiple.blunders dropped Sachin several times not to mention the dubious hawkeye review, even while chasing despite the baffonery of our batters and the tuk tuk brigade we were in the game, Umar Akmal I feel was the one wicket from where India turned the tabled and the crank in Shastri' voice highlights the turning point , Indian bowlers did nothing extraordinary Zak the Premier bowler was most expensive at 5.8 Yuvi bowled 10 overs, what an opportunity missed by Pakistan but then again whole country is a story of missed opportunities and advantage given up

Pakistan were 208/9 chasing 261. That game was already over before Misbah slogged a few to make the defeat look better.

PAK were completely out of it by then

 

[pillionrider]

Hafeez would outbowl every current Pak pacer except Shaheen (and if it's vs India, I'm not sure about him too )

So as has been pointed out in this thread and by a lot of commentators, it's the spinners.

 

[SamNJ]

I agree 2011 was an opportunity missed.
Ajmal and Hafeez were unplayable with their blatant chuckings. Afridi was good too.

 

[Kianig89]

Pakistan were 208/9 chasing 261. That game was already over before Misbah slogged a few to make the defeat look better.

PAK were completely out of it by then

Who said Misbah made a match, read carefully when U Akmal got out India had the upper hand

 

[mominsaigol]

Pretty sure 2011 batting lineup wouldn't struggle against this current bowling line up lol

And 2011 bowling line up would eat this batting line up alive

 

[Mamoon]

Although, I must say a combined team would absolutely destroy any team in the world today:

1) K. Akmal
2) Imam ul Haq
3) Babar Azam
4) Mohammad Rizwan (wk)
5) Saud Shakeel
6) Misbah ul Haq
7) Abdul Razzaq
8) Shahid Afridi
9) Shaheen Afridi
10) Umar Gul
11) Saeed Ajmal

12) Haris Rauf

That team would get smashed left right and center by all the top teams today, but sure be it far from me to rain your parade. I have been doing that for 12 years anyway.

On topic: 2023 has better batting resources but 2011 had better bowling. Nonetheless, 2011 team would fail quite badly in 2023 conditions as well.

 

[mominsaigol]

That team would get smashed left right and center by all the top teams today, but sure be it far from me to rain your parade. I have been doing that for 12 years anyway.

On topic: 2023 has better batting resources but 2011 had better bowling. Nonetheless, 2011 team would fail quite badly in 2023 conditions as well.

Wasn't the 2011 era the one ball era? The 2 new balls makes it easier to get big totals.

Wouldn't the batting do slightly better and the bowling slightly worse( Minus chuck ajmal and chuck hafeez?)

 

[sugumarrising]

Very surprising comments from Pakistan friends here, 2011 is the only time since 99 Pakistan qualified for semis, that team is way ahead of this team.

 

[Mamoon]

Wasn't the 2011 era the one ball era? The 2 new balls makes it easier to get big totals.

Wouldn't the batting do slightly better and the bowling slightly worse( Minus chuck ajmal and chuck hafeez?)

Other than Kamran who would be really good today, the other batsmen in the team like Younis, Misbah and Shafiq would be pretty poor in this format even today.

I would take Kamran and Umar from that too though but no one else as far as batting is concerned.

Hafeez played a lot of cricket after 2011 and he was never consistent enough in ODIs. The only semblance of consistency that he displayed with the bat was in T20Is in 2020 but that came a little too late in his career.

The current batting lineup is pretty good especially for our standards. It is the bowling that is the problem and the constant overhyping of this attack, especially pace attack, is only making things worse because it means they escape accountability.

There will be no accountability this time either because Babar and a lot of the delusional fans are convincing themselves that if Naseem was here things would be different.

If Naseem was here and Shaheen/Rauf weren’t then their absence would have been used as an excuse. In fact, Rauf was also injured during the Asia Cup and had he not recovered, everyone would be using his absence as an excuse and peddling narratives about how he would have been impactful with his pace etc. but he has been the biggest liability.

Naseem or no Naseem, Pakistan’s pace attack is an ordinary one because each of the three main pacers have their own problems and none of them are consistent.

Shaheen has lost his pace big time which has made him largely ineffective and he is to obsessed with his one trick which is becoming predictable one. Every single batsman knows what he is going to howl.

Rauf has no brain. He just runs and throws rocks at the batsmen without understanding the match situation and field placements. He is not an ODI bowler at all. He can’t bowl 60 deliveries because he will have a 15-20 ball period in between where we will completely lose it and that makes all the difference in the end.

Naseem is more traditional and consistent in his line and length compared to the other two and can make the ball move both ways but in spite of what his SR on paper might show, he has a problem with taking wickets and I can say that after watching every spell of his ODI career with my own eyes.

So many times he beats the batsmen with a lot of lateral movement but he is unable to get them out because he is bowling the wrong line. At times, he moves the ball away from the batsmen as much as Steyn did in his prime but unlike Steyn, he starts on the fourth stump and ends up on the sixth stump which means the batsmen can leave the ball or has to play away from his body to make contact.

Steyn would pitch the ball on middle stump and move the ball away to the fourth stump which means the batsmen would have no choice but to play at it.

It is a simple issue that he or his coaches should have been able to rectify by now. More so by himself because self-learning is very essential but you need to have the intelligence and awareness. Our players don’t do that and they keep repeating the same mistakes but expect different results.

Pakistan pace attack is not even top 3 in the world simply because all the bowlers are dimwitted and cannot learn from their mistakes.

 

[mominsaigol]

Other than Kamran who would be really good today, the other batsmen in the team like Younis, Misbah and Shafiq would be pretty poor in this format even today.

I would take Kamran and Umar from that too though but no one else as far as batting is concerned.

Hafeez played a lot of cricket after 2011 and he was never consistent enough in ODIs. The only semblance of consistency that he displayed with the bat was in T20Is in 2020 but that came a little too late in his career.

The current batting lineup is pretty good especially for our standards. It is the bowling that is the problem and the constant overhyping of this attack, especially pace attack, is only making things worse because it means they escape accountability.

There will be no accountability this time either because Babar and a lot of the delusional fans are convincing themselves that if Naseem was here things would be different.

If Naseem was here and Shaheen/Rauf weren’t then their absence would have been used as an excuse. In fact, Rauf was also injured during the Asia Cup and had he not recovered, everyone would be using his absence as an excuse and peddling narratives about how he would have been impactful with his pace etc. but he has been the biggest liability.

Naseem or no Naseem, Pakistan’s pace attack is an ordinary one because each of the three main pacers have their own problems and none of them are consistent.

Shaheen has lost his pace big time which has made him largely ineffective and he is to obsessed with his one trick which is becoming predictable one. Every single batsman knows what he is going to howl.

Rauf has no brain. He just runs and throws rocks at the batsmen without understanding the match situation and field placements. He is not an ODI bowler at all. He can’t bowl 60 deliveries because he will have a 15-20 ball period in between where we will completely lose it and that makes all the difference in the end.

Naseem is more traditional and consistent in his line and length compared to the other two and can make the ball move both ways but in spite of what his SR on paper might show, he has a problem with taking wickets and I can say that after watching every spell of his ODI career with my own eyes.

So many times he beats the batsmen with a lot of lateral movement but he is unable to get them out because he is bowling the wrong line. At times, he moves the ball away from the batsmen as much as Steyn did in his prime but unlike Steyn, he starts on the fourth stump and ends up on the sixth stump which means the batsmen can leave the ball or has to play away from his body to make contact.

Steyn would pitch the ball on middle stump and move the ball away to the fourth stump which means the batsmen would have no choice but to play at it.

It is a simple issue that he or his coaches should have been able to rectify by now. More so by himself because self-learning is very essential but you need to have the intelligence and awareness. Our players don’t do that and they keep repeating the same mistakes but expect different results.

Pakistan pace attack is not even top 3 in the world simply because all the bowlers are dimwitted and cannot learn from their mistakes.

Bro I've already read your previous points that you've reiterated and I've agreed with you lol, no need to repeat.

I only asked 2011 squad amd how'd they do in this era. Thanks for answering, but their was no need to additonally explain the 2023 bowling attack lol, I already read your standpoints on other threads and already agreed with it XD.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Other than Kamran who would be really good today, the other batsmen in the team like Younis, Misbah and Shafiq would be pretty poor in this format even today.

I would take Kamran and Umar from that too though but no one else as far as batting is concerned.

Hafeez played a lot of cricket after 2011 and he was never consistent enough in ODIs. The only semblance of consistency that he displayed with the bat was in T20Is in 2020 but that came a little too late in his career.

The current batting lineup is pretty good especially for our standards. It is the bowling that is the problem and the constant overhyping of this attack, especially pace attack, is only making things worse because it means they escape accountability.

There will be no accountability this time either because Babar and a lot of the delusional fans are convincing themselves that if Naseem was here things would be different.

If Naseem was here and Shaheen/Rauf weren’t then their absence would have been used as an excuse. In fact, Rauf was also injured during the Asia Cup and had he not recovered, everyone would be using his absence as an excuse and peddling narratives about how he would have been impactful with his pace etc. but he has been the biggest liability.

Naseem or no Naseem, Pakistan’s pace attack is an ordinary one because each of the three main pacers have their own problems and none of them are consistent.

Shaheen has lost his pace big time which has made him largely ineffective and he is to obsessed with his one trick which is becoming predictable one. Every single batsman knows what he is going to howl.

Rauf has no brain. He just runs and throws rocks at the batsmen without understanding the match situation and field placements. He is not an ODI bowler at all. He can’t bowl 60 deliveries because he will have a 15-20 ball period in between where we will completely lose it and that makes all the difference in the end.

Naseem is more traditional and consistent in his line and length compared to the other two and can make the ball move both ways but in spite of what his SR on paper might show, he has a problem with taking wickets and I can say that after watching every spell of his ODI career with my own eyes.

So many times he beats the batsmen with a lot of lateral movement but he is unable to get them out because he is bowling the wrong line. At times, he moves the ball away from the batsmen as much as Steyn did in his prime but unlike Steyn, he starts on the fourth stump and ends up on the sixth stump which means the batsmen can leave the ball or has to play away from his body to make contact.

Steyn would pitch the ball on middle stump and move the ball away to the fourth stump which means the batsmen would have no choice but to play at it.

It is a simple issue that he or his coaches should have been able to rectify by now. More so by himself because self-learning is very essential but you need to have the intelligence and awareness. Our players don’t do that and they keep repeating the same mistakes but expect different results.

Pakistan pace attack is not even top 3 in the world simply because all the bowlers are dimwitted and cannot learn from their mistakes.

Lol what? You are describing Hasan Ali here, who starts off at the fourth stump and that slingy action takes the out swinger away towards the sixth stump. That's why Hasan gets cut quite regularly. Pull out Naseem's stats and you would know he doesn't get cut quite so often, and in fact cramps the batsmen for room with the one that seams away at good pace. Watch his spell to Rohit Sharma amid the carnage of the first ten overs in that 228-run mauling in Asia Cup.

Naseem's issue is that he doesn't have the follow up delivery to get a good batsman out. He bowls three good deliveries then he bowls the follow up delivery on the wrong line, a bit too straight, then gets clipped for runs releasing all the pressure he has built up. That spell to Stokes and Buttler in the T20WC was also similar, where he kept beating the bat with conventional seam up deliveries then bowled one a bit too straight or too full to release the pressure on the batsman. Something Asif did very well was he kept the batsman guessing, while Naseem becomes too predictable looking for that magic delivery.

It's inexperience and he will learn on the job unfortunately, as our domestic cricket is rubbish.

Shaheen is a very limited bowler and hasn't done anything to improve his skill-set. A bowler who doesn't have the basic nous of setting up his line right when there's no swing, doesn't deserve to be called world-class I am sorry to say. I knew once he lost form, Shaheen would look bang average and he is looking a shadow of his former self right now. It's not just about the pace, when you are bowling on the pads consistently you are setting yourself up for failure looking to catch up all the time when you do get hit for boundaries on those bad deliveries. Shaheen also has a massive temperament issue and just doesn't know when it's a good time to not go for glory and look to cramp the batsmen and bore them out. That's why you see bad deliveries consistently when things aren't going his way.

Haris is just too dumb, with his pace his only option is to bowl wicket to wicket or at the body, with the right field in place. He is trying too hard to be a conventional pace bowler, which he can never be since he doesn't get that shape on the ball. Any half decent batsman can just stand there and hit him through the line, as at Haris' pace any width on these wickets means a certain boundary unless the ball goes straight to the fielder. I don't think he's even smart enough to set his own field, that's a sign of an amateur bowler who doesn't know what's going on. There was no way he should have kept bowling those buffet fourth stump line at his pace against Afghanistan, and should have tried to target the stumps or the body. The only chance our pacers did create was when Gurbaz was troubled by one directed at his body and he almost spooned a catch to Hasan Ali at deep fine leg. As I said, he is only a T20 bowler who gets away with having zero intelligence when he bowls.

 

[Statpadder Inc]

Although, I must say a combined team would absolutely destroy any team in the world today:

1) K. Akmal
2) Imam ul Haq
3) Babar Azam
4) Mohammad Rizwan (wk)
5) Saud Shakeel
6) Misbah ul Haq
7) Abdul Razzaq
8) Shahid Afridi
9) Shaheen Afridi
10) Umar Gul
11) Saeed Ajmal

12) Haris Rauf

This team finishes 6th in this wc and that is being generous. India and SAN would eat them alive