What's new

PSL 2017 Final : "Lights, cameras, guns, action" by Mike Selvey

SL_Fan

Senior ODI Player
Joined
Oct 21, 2012
Runs
22,652
Post of the Week
1
A former cricketer who was part of an ICC delegation sent to assess the security on offer at the PSL final reports.

It is 0200 hours on the morning of Sunday, March 5. The night is crystal clear with a slight chill in the air after the heat of the day, and I am standing on the tarmac outside the VVIP reception terminal in a remote corner of Lahore's Allama Iqbal International airport. Behind me are maybe a couple of dozen armed Pakistan commandos and elite police. Five snipers are perched on the roof of the single-story building. To one side are four military helicopters, while ahead stretches the airport runway towards the main terminal, where the tailfin of Emirates flight EK622, newly landed from Dubai, stands out. A vehicle convoy, headlights blazing and red-and-blue lights flashing, has left the environs of the aircraft and is making its way rapidly towards us.

It pulls up by us, police vehicles topping and tailing the line. Sandwiched in between are two 16-seater Toyota Coaster buses, armoured to a B6 ballistics rating, and so designed to withstand bullets from assault rifles such as the commonly used AK47. There is also protection underneath from landmine-type blasts. Faces peer through the windows. The Peshawar Zalmi cricket team has arrived in the city to contest with Quetta Gladiators the final of the Pakistan Super League T20 competition.

The small convoy, joined now by the armoured bus I am in, makes its way through three security gates, plain-clothes close-protection officers running alongside. Beyond, a maelstrom of flashing lights and military presence, is the convoy that will take the team to the Pearl Continental hotel. We move forward, and are surrounded by the main body of the cavalcade that will deliver the team. In the last 24 hours, the route we will take has been swept for explosives and a practice run made.

The whole route, one of two alternatives and chosen at the last minute, has been lit with temporary floodlights every 100 metres. Officers likewise are staged every 100 metres and police vehicles every 200. Each kilometre sees a pair of motorcyclists, members of the new 670-strong "Dolphin" rapid-response teams, linked to a control centre by mobile cameras and GPS, and with the capability to upload and download visual information. Housing alongside the route has been swept and occupants vetted. Intermittent rooftops have snipers installed. Hospitals are on alert and safe houses have been readied. A helicopter throbs above, with others on standby for evacuation if necessary. All intersections are sealed off to a distance of 200 metres from the route and any cars not driven away voluntarily have been removed by forklift truck (as they will be from the environs of the Gaddafi stadium): the route is entirely free of traffic and scanned by perhaps the most advanced CCTV system in the world.

A cavalcade of 21 vehicles forms with the two team buses at the centre. In the vanguard is a motorcycle traffic "pilot" and behind him two traffic vehicles, each containing a high-ranking traffic officer. The buses are surrounded on either side and in front by seven vehicles containing elite heavily armed troops, the one in front armed with a light machine gun. Behind the rear bus comes an ambulance and a fire truck, and to either side of these, a vehicle that can jam signals and another containing the senior officer in charge of the operation. Two more elite vehicles and a rear traffic pilot complete the main cavalcade, while two more elite vehicles will run parallel to it down the other side of the dual carriageway that will be employed.

We move off, at high speed. The journey from the airport to the PC hotel generally can take up to an hour, such is the traffic. Here it takes precisely six minutes to reach Gate 3 of the hotel, which opens. The close-protection officers decant from their vehicles and take up their positions alongside the buses and escort them into the hotel grounds, where the team steps down from their bus and into the hotel lobby.

The hotel itself has been secured. Individual guests have been vetted for the duration of the team's stay. All booked functions have been postponed. Armed police are everywhere, and plain-clothes special-branch officers are by the lifts and occupy positions on the dedicated floors. No one can move around without protection at hand. It is close to 3am by the time the team get to bed, with a game starting in 17 hours.

I am in Lahore at the invitation of the Pakistan Cricket Board as part of an ICC security delegation, which includes representatives from Australia, the UK, South Africa, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, and the ICC itself. My brief from the ICC was to spend some time beforehand talking to the various experts with a stake in the very high level of security that was being put into place, and at the end of it all, make an honest and independent personal assessment on how I, placing myself in the shoes of an overseas cricketer, felt during that time. Did I feel secure in the knowledge that the security provided was intended to be, and was, of the highest standard, or despite this, did I still feel uneasy, particularly given the recent terrorist attacks in Pakistan and Lahore in particular? I was being paid for my time but not, I insisted as a condition, to write an ICC or PCB public-relations piece. I was fully aware of the proposal for a series of matches between Pakistan and a World XI to be played in Lahore in September 2017, and knew that the successful staging of the PSL final, with the security road-tested, was an integral part of the plan. I had travelled to Lahore with assurances but still less detailed security information than the two finalists had been given.

It is the afternoon prior to the team's arrival and we are at the Punjab Police Integrated Command, Control and Communication centre (PPIC3), a white block building set in a compound in central Lahore. The manner in which Punjab is policed has been redrawn in the wake of the attack on the Sri Lankan team in 2009, and restructured in the past 12 months into the Safe Cities Authority, which includes, among other functions, integrated emergency response and counter-terrorism. Incidents of terrorism, we are told, have declined dramatically since the inception of this body, from 43 in 2012 down to seven last year.

We are in a wood-panelled first-floor conference room, and through plate glass see below a vast space with perhaps 50 or 60 screens on the wall, each monitored 24/7 by pods of specially trained IT graduates. This, we are told, is considered the most advanced and comprehensive CCTV coverage of a city in the world, the installation of which was overseen by the Metropolitan Police of London. Fifteen-thousand cameras monitor Lahore, 8000 of which are fixed at 1800 sensitive locations across the city, and the remainder mobile, including those assigned to the Dolphin teams. Fifteen-hundred kilometres of optical fibre were installed. The whole thing cost US$137 million. The capability and clarity are hugely impressive.

It is around the conference table that the protocols for the final are explained. The Gaddafi Stadium lies within Nishtar Park, a sporting complex containing hockey, swimming and football stadiums, as well as the cricket ground. The whole complex has already been secured and is being swept by dogs and detectors. Within the hockey stadium there is a dedicated control centre with its own bank of screens monitoring 81 on-site cameras (59 fixed and 22 with pan, tilt, and zoom capacity). There are two 20-bed temporary hospitals set up in the complex and two mobile hospitals. Contingency is in place for aerial evacuation of the teams.

The stadium is expected to be full to its 22,000 capacity. Tickets for the event have been sold through special outlets such as banks, with biometric identification required, and identities verified through the National Database and Registration Authority. The biometrics will be used again when spectators enter checkpoints in each of the four concentric zones with the stadium at the centre. There will be body searches and scans at each stage. Within the crowd, plain-clothed police and special-branch officers will mingle.

For the journey from the hotel to the stadium, the same cavalcade will form and again take one of two routes. Two hundred and twenty-seven cameras have been installed at 71 sites to monitor progress. The journey, as with that from the airport, will take around six minutes.

Now, though, we have some confusion. The team have been told that there will be a 4.30pm departure (three and a half hours before the match, although there is a closing ceremony first), while our delegation, due to travel in the same convoy, has been told it is half an hour later. The difference is split, but outside, in the hotel forecourt, it becomes chaotic. The players are installed in the buses, but a tidal wave of team owners and sponsors with their families and guests also disgorges from the hotel. Buses are boarded and disembarked again. There are too few places for everyone. At one point, some of the Pakistani players in the teams are placed in an unarmoured bus, which is far from satisfactory; the overseas players were unaffected and perhaps oblivious. It takes 20 minutes to sort it all out, all within the confines of the hotel grounds, but that, and the melee inside the hotel as the teams leave, will need rectifying in future. The cavalcade to the ground is rapid and uneventful.

Inside the stadium, the ground is already filling fast when the teams arrive, but it is some time, after the entertainment of the closing show, before they take the field and walk a lap to greet the crowd. The perimeter of the playing area is around 20 metres from the fencing in front of the stands, but there were perhaps a hundred people within that area: performers, VIP guests and families for the most part. At one point some players were surrounded by well-wishers and selfie-seekers, attention they might have done without. The sterile Players, Management and Officials zone that embraces the dressing rooms seems less secure than it ought.

Perhaps this is nit-picking but that, as my fellow delegates are quick to point out, is what they are here to do: be mindful of the weakest link. The vetting procedure has been immense and the level of protection within the hotel and on the roads staggering. The chaos on the hotel forecourt can easily be addressed, and likewise the limited intrusion at the ground.

Throughout, I was afforded the same level of security as the teams (a visit I made on my own to the stadium the day after the match saw my car preceded by an outrider and flanked by two vehicles of elite forces). I felt completely comfortable in regard to my own safety. I subsequently was told that in any case, intelligence service intercepts had discovered that the intense nature of the security had acted as a deterrent, which prior knowledge might also have served to ease the doubts of those who while taking their own safety as a given, were nonetheless concerned about any incidents in the crowd beyond the stadium's security blanket.

The day after the match, Colonel Azam Khan, 20 years an intelligence officer and now the PCB's head of security, said that overall he was very satisfied. The process had begun ten days previously, he said, and 90% of the objective was to secure not just Lahore but the whole of Punjab. There was still some fine-tuning, he admitted, with "maybe a lack of some coordination at some operational points". But these too could be readily addressed and not repeated.

There will be natural questions. With so many resources concentrated at this event, did it dilute security elsewhere across Lahore and Punjab? How sustainable is such a security exercise in the future?

To the first: all major sporting events anywhere in the world require concentration of resources, so Pakistan is no different, but the short answer is that bringing international cricket back to Pakistan will be a slow and lengthy process. This has been a first tentative step in the right direction. The economic benefits of regular international cricket, even as a representation of a more normal society, would far outweigh the security costs. This security is merely a manifestation of the total revamping of policing in Punjab.

To the second, the most senior officials from across the province were drafted in for this exercise, but as Colonel Azam suggested, the security of the stadium was only 10% of the objective, with that of the whole of Lahore and the province paramount. In the next few years, resources such as those for Lahore will be rolled out in other cities: Faisalabad, Rawalpindi, Multan, Gujranwala and Bahawalpur.

It is my hope to return in September, and, as things stand, I will do so without hesitation or any of the apprehensions I might have had this time. Between now and then, world-class players will be approached and asked if they will participate in what will be a second significant staging post on the way to bringing regular international cricket back to Pakistan. The success of the PSL final, and the testimony of those overseas players who took part, such as Darren Sammy and Dawid Malan, should go some way to assuaging doubts, and it may be that the advice of the security advisers to the national boards will have softened somewhat.

It was a fine occasion, and a small first step, but one that needed to be taken. Pakistan, not just Pakistan cricket, deserves it.

Link
 
Very good security, however not really sustainable for a full tour of say 3 Tests, 3 ODIs and 3 T20s. Selvey says it everywhere that so far these measures can only be applied in Lahore.
 
It is the afternoon prior to the team's arrival and we are at the Punjab Police Integrated Command, Control and Communication centre (PPIC3), a white block building set in a compound in central Lahore. The manner in which Punjab is policed has been redrawn in the wake of the attack on the Sri Lankan team in 2009, and restructured in the past 12 months into the Safe Cities Authority, which includes, among other functions, integrated emergency response and counter-terrorism. Incidents of terrorism, we are told, have declined dramatically since the inception of this body, from 43 in 2012 down to seven last year. We are in a wood-panelled first-floor conference room, and through plate glass see below a vast space with perhaps 50 or 60 screens on the wall, each monitored 24/7 by pods of specially trained IT graduates. This, we are told, is considered the most advanced and comprehensive CCTV coverage of a city in the world, the installation of which was overseen by the Metropolitan Police of London. Fifteen-thousand cameras monitor Lahore, 8000 of which are fixed at 1800 sensitive locations across the city, and the remainder mobile, including those assigned to the Dolphin teams. Fifteen-hundred kilometres of optical fibre were installed. The whole thing cost US$137 million. The capability and clarity are hugely impressive. It is around the conference table that the protocols for the final are explained. The Gaddafi Stadium lies within Nishtar Park, a sporting complex containing hockey, swimming and football stadiums, as well as the cricket ground. The whole complex has already been secured and is being swept by dogs and detectors. Within the hockey stadium there is a dedicated control centre with its own bank of screens monitoring 81 on-site cameras (59 fixed and 22 with pan, tilt, and zoom capacity). There are two 20-bed temporary hospitals set up in the complex and two mobile hospitals. Contingency is in place for aerial evacuation of the teams.
Perhaps these three paras are the reasons why the final had to be in Lahore. Don't think Sindh, K.P.K or Baluchistan govt have the finances and the manpower to undertake such police reforms. $137 million is no small amount.
 
Unfortunately it isn't sustainable for the long-term. A one-off game is do-able but I seriously cannot see a major tour taking place anytime soon, and rightly so.
 
didnt tak long for the whingers to turn up again...it is the right step and a full series is the next step..it will happen and Pakistan will stage it.especially now that we know who the enemy is and are prepared tod eal with it properly. the only time I would avoid major events is when there is a change of govt. If the powers that be can ensure that a change of govt will not impact this then that will be another step forward.
 
didnt tak long for the whingers to turn up again...it is the right step and a full series is the next step..it will happen and Pakistan will stage it.especially now that we know who the enemy is and are prepared tod eal with it properly. the only time I would avoid major events is when there is a change of govt. If the powers that be can ensure that a change of govt will not impact this then that will be another step forward.

These whingers are too busy worshipping Imran Khan to see any sense.

If he says jump, they say how high.

Me and you and others know exactly needs to be done to get our cricket back home. Just 1 domestic match has generated so much positive press!

We need to get a team to tour as soon as possible. Im sure security delegations were satisfied with arrangements. They are not going to say no to more revenue.

Our cricket is on life support, few more years and our cricket will be dead. We have to act now.
 
didnt tak long for the whingers to turn up again...it is the right step and a full series is the next step..it will happen and Pakistan will stage it.especially now that we know who the enemy is and are prepared tod eal with it properly. the only time I would avoid major events is when there is a change of govt. If the powers that be can ensure that a change of govt will not impact this then that will be another step forward.

Whingers?

Did you even read the report? The security was backed by proper command centers, a proper infrastructure which is ONLY available in Lahore. The hotel where the team stayed had all its functions/events postponed and was otherwise closed off to the public. How will they keep a team there for a month during a full tour? Or does PC hotel run on PCB charity? How will they carry out the security in other cities when no such infrastructure/rapid response teams/CCTVs/command centers/real-time security feeds in thousands exist in other cities? How long can we sustain tours just in one city?

The ''whingers'' are saying this is a very good small step and a step towards a match vs the World XI in September or maybe even 2-3 PSL games for sure. But a full Test/ODI/T20 month long tour....I doubt it,
 
These whingers are too busy worshipping Imran Khan to see any sense.

If he says jump, they say how high.

Me and you and others know exactly needs to be done to get our cricket back home. Just 1 domestic match has generated so much positive press!

We need to get a team to tour as soon as possible. Im sure security delegations were satisfied with arrangements. They are not going to say no to more revenue.

Our cricket is on life support, few more years and our cricket will be dead. We have to act now.

How can a team stay for a full Test/ODI/T20 tour which would last a month? PC Hotel, earns tens of thousands, through their functions/events/guests was closed off to anyone but the teams, they will run on PCB charity for a month?

The report states only Lahore has the infastructure available for security (to the tune of $137 million dollars), how long can we sustain tours to one city? Saying that, I agree we can definitely start with small tours for ODIs/T20s which would last maybe a week. Maybe play Tests in UAE.

What is unreasonable that I have said?
 
during the lead up to PSL final in Lahore I only saw negativity at cricinfo but things has change a lot since then. This article clearly shows ICC is quite happy with the level of security. International cricket in Pakistan is not distant dream anymore.
 
during the lead up to PSL final in Lahore I only saw negativity at cricinfo but things has change a lot since then. This article clearly shows ICC is quite happy with the level of security. International cricket in Pakistan is not distant dream anymore.

I hope we get the World XI in September with some top players. Should be amazing stuff!
 
I hope we get the World XI in September with some top players. Should be amazing stuff!

I have said this before and i am repeating it that this God-Made opportunity for PCB arise because of rift between BCCI and CA& ECB. Giles Clark advised PCB to held final in Lahore even with bomb blasts and now he (clark) won't let this opportunity go. May be England team will be the first to tour Pakistan.
 
I have said this before and i am repeating it that this God-Made opportunity for PCB arise because of rift between BCCI and CA& ECB. Giles Clark advised PCB to held final in Lahore even with bomb blasts and now he (clark) won't let this opportunity go. May be England team will be the first to tour Pakistan.

There is no chance English team will come to Pakistan.
 
One step at a time. The delusion in this thread is too strong. Teams like England, Australia and South Africa will not tour Pakistan for another decade. However, we should look to bring the whole PSL to Pakistan within 3-4 years and go from there. If things go as planned, the likes of Bangladesh (politics aside), SL and WI should be touring Pakistan by 2021-2022.
 
The PCB should not be forced into providing presidential level security for a single match of cricket that lasts some 4 hours. That is ridiculous. The situation in India is no better, or barely better and yet players and officials do not want the same sort of assurance that they want from Pakistan.

The entire country and the PCB are failures when it comes to diplomacy and dealing with the ICC when it comes to such issue. If they keep going down this road of holding a final or two a year in such a way, we will never see the return of normal cricket to the country.
 
The PCB should not be forced into providing presidential level security for a single match of cricket that lasts some 4 hours. That is ridiculous. The situation in India is no better, or barely better and yet players and officials do not want the same sort of assurance that they want from Pakistan.

The entire country and the PCB are failures when it comes to diplomacy and dealing with the ICC when it comes to such issue. If they keep going down this road of holding a final or two a year in such a way, we will never see the return of normal cricket to the country.

No team has been attacked in other countries, I agree with the gist of your post but that's the harsh truth.

And I read the attack report: a rocket missed the bus, and a grenade exploded beneath the bus 2 seconds after the driver saw it coming. Its amazing noone died.
 
World xi touring Pakistan will be harbinger of which team touring Pakistan first. If most of the player would be from England, England will tour Pakistan.
 
With the amount of money, scrutiny , inconvenience to the public, This doesn't seem sustainable. You cannot have all these preps for like a 1-2 month tour of a country visiting Pak. Too many loopholes and arrangements required. And what would be the incentive for another nation to put themselves at risk ?
Work has to be done at the ground level first.
 
I have said this before and i am repeating it that this God-Made opportunity for PCB arise because of rift between BCCI and CA& ECB. Giles Clark advised PCB to held final in Lahore even with bomb blasts and now he (clark) won't let this opportunity go. May be England team will be the first to tour Pakistan.

Don't rule it out, although it will be a limited tour.
Most likely they would hold the tests in UAE, then shift the ODIs and T20s to Lahore. If they want to be more cautious, host only the T20s in Lahore. They'll sell out regardless of opponent.
 
No team has been attacked in other countries, I agree with the gist of your post but that's the harsh truth.

And I read the attack report: a rocket missed the bus, and a grenade exploded beneath the bus 2 seconds after the driver saw it coming. Its amazing noone died.

Sports stars and sports teams across multiple sports and multiple countries have been attacked and yet its only Pakistan out of any major nation that has been banned from hosting sporting events. Why is that? Was Germany ever banned?

And let's not even get started on terror attacks that have just missed in places such as India (Mumbai, Bangaluru etc).
 
Immaculate presentation of the events that unfolded in Lahore, the arrangements seemed to be fine barring a few issues that can be corrected next time. I watched the final but truth be told the enthusiasm was missing and devoid of energy from the spectators, could it be because of excessive policing that the crowd never felt comfortable or maybe a broadcasting issue but it was a fairly lifeless game considering a major event happening after such a long hiatus.

Nevertheless a very good step taken by the PCB, which they can build on in future.
 
Sports stars and sports teams across multiple sports and multiple countries have been attacked and yet its only Pakistan out of any major nation that has been banned from hosting sporting events. Why is that? Was Germany ever banned?

And let's not even get started on terror attacks that have just missed in places such as India (Mumbai, Bangaluru etc).

The head of Formula 1's daughter in law was kidnapped in Brazil. F1 driver was robbed at gun point.

Multiple incidents like this around the world in pro sports yet we are vilifed and judged for eternity for 1 isolated incident in our history.
 
Sports stars and sports teams across multiple sports and multiple countries have been attacked and yet its only Pakistan out of any major nation that has been banned from hosting sporting events. Why is that? Was Germany ever banned?

In Germany only one specific nation (i.e Israel) was targeted by an international organisation in a country with a history of NO terror attacks. And there was no indication any other side would be targeted as the Palestinians only had problem with Israel. In Pakistan a side was attacked by home grown terrorists in a country plagued by violence and there was every indication that ANY international side would be targeted since the target was to tarnish Pakistan's image.

And let's not even get started on terror attacks that have just missed in places such as India (Mumbai, Bangaluru etc).

Teams still visited Pakistan even after ''missed attacks''. NZ still came months after their hotel was bombed. Asia Cup still happened even though the Marriot Hotel was bombed (where teams were meant to stay). Only in Pakistan a team was directly attacked was when tours stopped.
 
World xi touring Pakistan will be harbinger of which team touring Pakistan first. If most of the player would be from England, England will tour Pakistan.

Fairly sure it was being said that the match was planned for September which would rule out any English players anyway?
 
The head of Formula 1's daughter in law was kidnapped in Brazil. F1 driver was robbed at gun point.

Multiple incidents like this around the world in pro sports yet we are vilifed and judged for eternity for 1 isolated incident in our history.

Name an incident in recent memory where a dozen policemen died and a team got hit by bullets?

Thousands of Westerners can go to Brazil safely, and do for tourism. There is no way they can do that in Pakistan, the comparison is laughable and an insult to the memory of martyred policemen.
 
Name an incident in recent memory where a dozen policemen died and a team got hit by bullets?

Thousands of Westerners can go to Brazil safely, and do for tourism. There is no way they can do that in Pakistan, the comparison is laughable and an insult to the memory of martyred policemen.

I'm not sure if you are simply misinformed or lying. Brazil hast he perception of being safe for tourists but the reality tehre is very different. Just last year a group of my friends who went to Brazil were robbed at gunpoint. it's a common occurrente there and certain parts of Brazil have comparable murder rates and crime rates in general to Pakistan.

Plus, the person you quoted already stated how otehr sports have been affected by crime and violence yet you are only interested in a specific incidence of sports team being attacked?

Well, let's see, how about the mass slaughter of almost the entire Israeli Olympic team in 1972? West Germany would go onto play Hungary not long after. No stoppage of international sport in the country.

In 2010, the Togolese football team was attacked before the start of the Africa Cup of nations in Angola. 3 people were killed, many injured. Thet ournament was not postponed, international teams apart from Togo did not pull out. Still to this day, international teams and clubs travel to and play football in Angola.

Across South America, numerous footballers have been kidnapped for ransoms, some have even been killed. Yet no south american country, to the best of my knowledged, is banend from hosting international football matches or international sport in general.

Like I said before, the situation in Pakistan is not unusual or unique, it is part and partial of the "3rd world" or the "developing world". Taking into account the other major cricketing nation that is a 3rd world, India, they are only 2 places below Pakistan on the terrorism index, for much of the 21st century, it has been ranked alongside Pakistan, Afhanistan and Iraq as one of the top 4 countries with the highest number of civilian deaths per year due to terrorism.

Again, Pakistan's situation is not unique in the world, or in Asia or even in the tiny confines of cricket. What is unique is Pakistan's place as a sporting powerhouse in a couple of sports, on a level that no other Muslim country has, so sport is once again used as a political tool, in this instancet o isolate Pakistan and make it seem like a warzone. These are tactics that have been used by western powers andt heir allies for a long time.

What ia a failure on Pakistan's part is that for decades now (remember international teams had been refusing to tour Pakistan since before 2009, when no cricketing team had been attacked) they have failed to use their position of privilege in cricket as a bargaining chip and eventually the rot set in and now they don't have any bargaining chips. Diplomacy and politics have failed because the structure in Pakistan has **** poor politicians and diplomats. They can't make alliances and deals to save their lives if they ever needed to.

None of that however means that Pakistan is any more unsafe than any other similar country on the planet.
 
I'm not sure if you are simply misinformed or lying. Brazil hast he perception of being safe for tourists but the reality tehre is very different. Just last year a group of my friends who went to Brazil were robbed at gunpoint. it's a common occurrente there and certain parts of Brazil have comparable murder rates and crime rates in general to Pakistan.

Plus, the person you quoted already stated how otehr sports have been affected by crime and violence yet you are only interested in a specific incidence of sports team being attacked?

Well, let's see, how about the mass slaughter of almost the entire Israeli Olympic team in 1972? West Germany would go onto play Hungary not long after. No stoppage of international sport in the country.

In 2010, the Togolese football team was attacked before the start of the Africa Cup of nations in Angola. 3 people were killed, many injured. Thet ournament was not postponed, international teams apart from Togo did not pull out. Still to this day, international teams and clubs travel to and play football in Angola.

Across South America, numerous footballers have been kidnapped for ransoms, some have even been killed. Yet no south american country, to the best of my knowledged, is banend from hosting international football matches or international sport in general.

Like I said before, the situation in Pakistan is not unusual or unique, it is part and partial of the "3rd world" or the "developing world". Taking into account the other major cricketing nation that is a 3rd world, India, they are only 2 places below Pakistan on the terrorism index, for much of the 21st century, it has been ranked alongside Pakistan, Afhanistan and Iraq as one of the top 4 countries with the highest number of civilian deaths per year due to terrorism.

Again, Pakistan's situation is not unique in the world, or in Asia or even in the tiny confines of cricket. What is unique is Pakistan's place as a sporting powerhouse in a couple of sports, on a level that no other Muslim country has, so sport is once again used as a political tool, in this instancet o isolate Pakistan and make it seem like a warzone. These are tactics that have been used by western powers andt heir allies for a long time.

What ia a failure on Pakistan's part is that for decades now (remember international teams had been refusing to tour Pakistan since before 2009, when no cricketing team had been attacked) they have failed to use their position of privilege in cricket as a bargaining chip and eventually the rot set in and now they don't have any bargaining chips. Diplomacy and politics have failed because the structure in Pakistan has **** poor politicians and diplomats. They can't make alliances and deals to save their lives if they ever needed to.

None of that however means that Pakistan is any more unsafe than any other similar country on the planet.

Pre-2009 every team apart from Australia visited Pakistan, some did so multiple and triple times. Countries like NZ, who's team could have been killed, arrived months later again. So I am not sure what you're on about.

I already addressed your German point, I can't be arsed repeating myself but I will humor you, again. In Germany only one specific nation (i.e Israel) was targeted by an international organisation in a country with a history of NO terror attacks. And there was no indication any other side would be targeted as the Palestinians only had problem with Israel. In Pakistan a side was attacked by home grown terrorists in a country plagued by violence and there was every indication that ANY international side would be targeted since the target was to tarnish Pakistan's image. And the same goes for countries like Togo, like Germany those two nations are not plagued by terrorism nor do any group in those countries aim to maim international teams SPECIFICALLY to tarnish their image. In Pakistan the goal for such vermin was to target teams specifically. They had tried and failed before.

You simply can't compare crime with terrorists incidents. Small time crimes like robberies, theft will maximum affect people in single digits during that crime occurring. Terrorist incidents can affect or kill hundreds at the same time. The robber in Brazil is not aiming to rob the England team when they play in Brazil and there is no organisation that aims to kill foreign teams when they come to Brazil. In Pakistan we know for a fact TTP and its scumbag umbrella organisations WILL kill other teams. A robber or a cartel has no interest in attacking any teams, since their aim to make money off drugs and hence attacking visiting sides is irrelevant. The goal of organisations in Pakistan is destroying our image, promoting their 'brand' and killing westerners hence attacking any visiting team guarantees them that. As I said, tens of thousands can visit Brazil safely, for the large part, but if you tens of thousands people visiting Pakistan from Europe would be safe, then what can I say. :facepalm:


We will not agree. I am unsure as to why we are even arguing. I posted before the final that in my decades of experiencing sporting events in person and TV nothing had me excited as PSL coming to Lahore once again. As of now I agree teams should come back and play ODIs/T20s in Lahore atleast.
 
Last edited:
Pre-2009 every team apart from Australia visited Pakistan, some did so multiple and triple times. Countries like NZ, who's team could have been killed, arrived months later again. So I am not sure what you're on about.

I already addressed your German point, I can't be arsed repeating myself but I will humor you, again. In Germany only one specific nation (i.e Israel) was targeted by an international organisation in a country with a history of NO terror attacks. And there was no indication any other side would be targeted as the Palestinians only had problem with Israel. In Pakistan a side was attacked by home grown terrorists in a country plagued by violence and there was every indication that ANY international side would be targeted since the target was to tarnish Pakistan's image. And the same goes for countries like Togo, like Germany those two nations are not plagued by terrorism nor do any group in those countries aim to maim international teams SPECIFICALLY to tarnish their image. In Pakistan the goal for such vermin was to target teams specifically. They had tried and failed before.

You simply can't compare crime with terrorists incidents. Small time crimes like robberies, theft will maximum affect people in single digits during that crime occurring. Terrorist incidents can affect or kill hundreds at the same time. The robber in Brazil is not aiming to rob the England team when they play in Brazil and there is no organisation that aims to kill foreign teams when they come to Brazil. In Pakistan we know for a fact TTP and its scumbag umbrella organisations WILL kill other teams. A robber or a cartel has no interest in attacking any teams, since their aim to make money off drugs and hence attacking visiting sides is irrelevant. The goal of organisations in Pakistan is destroying our image, promoting their 'brand' and killing westerners hence attacking any visiting team guarantees them that. As I said, tens of thousands can visit Brazil safely, for the large part, but if you tens of thousands people visiting Pakistan from Europe would be safe, then what can I say. :facepalm:


We will not agree. I am unsure as to why we are even arguing. I posted before the final that in my decades of experiencing sporting events in person and TV nothing had me excited as PSL coming to Lahore once again. As of now I agree teams should come back and play ODIs/T20s in Lahore atleast.

You have yet again made misinformed points. I won't type up a long response as I can't be bothered but for your own research, look up terror attacks in Germant in the time when the ywere occupied across two separate territories. To claim there were no terror attacks before 72 or after is ridiculous.
 
You have yet again made misinformed points. I won't type up a long response as I can't be bothered but for your own research, look up terror attacks in Germant in the time when the ywere occupied across two separate territories. To claim there were no terror attacks before 72 or after is ridiculous.

1 incident in our history. 1 incident. And that was 8 years ago.

We need to move on. Some of these people need to stop feeling sorry for themselves. Only Pakistanis do this, nobody else in the world does this.

We can't be squeaky clean with perfect record, this is not possible. Sometimes things go wrong, it happens to everybody.

Along with Mike, there were ICC experts Sean Norris, Bob Niclois (NSA), Mike Selvey (ICC Media), Sean Carrol (CA), Sarathchandra Li Yanage (SL), Reg Dockson (ECB), Julian Siebrand, Director General Intelligence (BCB) and Majakm Anisu d Dowla (intelligence Bangladesh), all present at the final.

We need to arrange a tour asap. Not with Afghanistan or some other pointless minnow. We need a proper team to come for a full tour.
 
You have yet again made misinformed points. I won't type up a long response as I can't be bothered but for your own research, look up terror attacks in Germant in the time when the ywere occupied across two separate territories. To claim there were no terror attacks before 72 or after is ridiculous.

I looked them up, 12 attacks over 2 decades. All home-grown Germans from fringe organisations who had no intention to target any international side. Their targets were bankers, mobile-company heads etc. Total fatalities? Less than 40 (38 to be specific over a 28 year period). That's 1.5 people dead in a year. And you're comparing this to 60,000 civilians and 4,000 army dead in a five year bloodbath by organisations who's aim was to kill any Westerner or their 'allies', an average of 12,000 dead in a year. This comparison is so disingenuous that I am surprised you're even comparing the two.
 
1 incident in our history. 1 incident. And that was 8 years ago.

We need to move on. Some of these people need to stop feeling sorry for themselves. Only Pakistanis do this, nobody else in the world does this.

We can't be squeaky clean with perfect record, this is not possible. Sometimes things go wrong, it happens to everybody.

Along with Mike, there were ICC experts Sean Norris, Bob Niclois (NSA), Mike Selvey (ICC Media), Sean Carrol (CA), Sarathchandra Li Yanage (SL), Reg Dockson (ECB), Julian Siebrand, Director General Intelligence (BCB) and Majakm Anisu d Dowla (intelligence Bangladesh), all present at the final.

We need to arrange a tour asap. Not with Afghanistan or some other pointless minnow. We need a proper team to come for a full tour.

As I said, a full tour is not possible. You cannot ask International hotels to suspend their business and lose tens of thousands over a month. However what SHOULD be possible is Tests in UAE and ODIs in Pakistan.
 
Only had they done even a fraction of these 8 years back ............
 
Brother mistakes happen and government in charge at the time were utterly incompetent at everything.

That doesn't help - those who were shot won't tell that, better luck next time. There are few things uncompromising & requires zero tolerance. For example - death; I have only one chance to die.

Moreover, the explanation given by the then PCB Chairman after the incident was not only unprofessional, but shallow. It damaged credibility more than the incident; because teams did tour even after Karachi bombing or Marriott bombing. But, buffoon butt banged it bigger than those blasts.
 
That doesn't help - those who were shot won't tell that, better luck next time. There are few things uncompromising & requires zero tolerance. For example - death; I have only one chance to die.

Moreover, the explanation given by the then PCB Chairman after the incident was not only unprofessional, but shallow. It damaged credibility more than the incident; because teams did tour even after Karachi bombing or Marriott bombing. But, buffoon butt banged it bigger than those blasts.

You're explaining it to the blind.
 
I looked them up, 12 attacks over 2 decades. All home-grown Germans from fringe organisations who had no intention to target any international side. Their targets were bankers, mobile-company heads etc. Total fatalities? Less than 40 (38 to be specific over a 28 year period). That's 1.5 people dead in a year. And you're comparing this to 60,000 civilians and 4,000 army dead in a five year bloodbath by organisations who's aim was to kill any Westerner or their 'allies', an average of 12,000 dead in a year. This comparison is so disingenuous that I am surprised you're even comparing the two.

Just FYI, your stats are wrong. It's 30,000 civilians in 15 years. The 60,000 count includes all civilians, army and terrorists.
 
Just FYI, your stats are wrong. It's 30,000 civilians in 15 years. The 60,000 count includes all civilians, army and terrorists.

SO around 5,000 a year directly by terrorists and 1,000 army men killed in a year average indicating a country at war. Which we were especially when places like Swat were overrun.

A ridiculous number. And not even comparable to a nation like Germany, was my point. FYI.
 
Last edited:
That doesn't help - those who were shot won't tell that, better luck next time. There are few things uncompromising & requires zero tolerance. For example - death; I have only one chance to die.

Moreover, the explanation given by the then PCB Chairman after the incident was not only unprofessional, but shallow. It damaged credibility more than the incident; because teams did tour even after Karachi bombing or Marriott bombing. But, buffoon butt banged it bigger than those blasts.

It is more important to move on from what happened 8 years ago and look at the reality now. Violence in Pakistan is 75% less now than it was in 2009. The police, rangers, military are far more battle hardened now. That was seen with the security arrangements in Lahore if by nothing else. So, let's stick with today's ground reality rather than dwelling on what happened 8 years ago.
 
SO around 5,000 a year directly by terrorists and 1,000 army men killed in a year average.

A ridiculous number. And not even comparable to a nation like Germany, was my point. FYI.

No, 2000 civilians average per year by terrorists, which is now down to 600 a year starting from 2016. LEA (including army, paramilitary, police) is 400 a year average but much less than that in the last years. There's a big difference between 12000, 5000, 2000 and 600. 600 is not some ridiculous number that is inconceivable. We had the same number in 2006, when all teams were willing to tour Pakistan.
 
Last edited:
No, 2000 average per year by terrorists, which is now down to 600 a year starting from 2016. There's a big difference between 12000, 5000, 2000 and 600. 600 is not some ridiculous number that is inconceivable. We had the same number in 2006, when all teams were willing to tour Pakistan.

...and which is not my point. Had you read my posts. My point was that it WAS understandable why teams did NOT visit Pakistan after 2009 but as of NOW they should be coming back to play ODIs atleast.
 
...and which is not my point. Had you read my posts. My point was that it WAS understandable why teams did NOT visit Pakistan after 2009 but as of NOW they should be coming back to play ODIs atleast.

Ok, so I am not sure what the debate here is about then. We all seem to be in agreement that teams at least should be open to playing ODIs and T20s in Pakistan.
 
Ok, so I am not sure what the debate here is about then. We all seem to be in agreement that teams at least should be open to playing ODIs and T20s in Pakistan.

Absolutely. After this report there is no reason not to.
 
Just FYI, your stats are wrong. It's 30,000 civilians in 15 years. The 60,000 count includes all civilians, army and terrorists.

Just to correct myself, it's 21.5k civilians in 15 years. I had mixed up civilian casualties with terrorist casualties. The terrorist dead count is around 30,000 in 15 years.
 
Just to correct myself, it's 21.5k civilians in 15 years. I had mixed up civilian casualties with terrorist casualties. The terrorist dead count is around 30,000 in 15 years.

From 2006-2009 there were 7500 people killed, 3,000 a year. The last few years thankfully have evened out the number.
 
Back
Top