Pulwama crisis - Indian viewpoint

[Canford Cliffs]

All airports in Indian side will open for normal flight service. [Reports]

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Do you have an ounce of doubt about the Indian version of the story about last night?

huh?

Even Pak accepted IAF entered its airspace.

Only debated part is casualities.

 

[Adijazz1706]

Even yesterday, when we made out safely, they just gave in basic details and didn't make any comments.

I wish we have someone from our side tweeting about updates but it didn't happen yesterday or today.

The pilot's profile has been removed from the IAF website, preparing to disown him maybe?

 

[Canford Cliffs]

You are laughing at your soldiers suffering.

Glad to see you got your priorities right.

I can almost imagine you sitting behind the keyboard egging on those who are fighting while you have a smug look on your face.

If I am sitting behind keyboard...so are you. You are not fighting in border....stop getting personal and overestimate yourself.

No one is rejoicing Soldiers capture but thags part of any war. 40k Pak soldiers were with Ind in 1971. The ultimate aim of the war should not be forgotten which is to stop terrorism eliminating from Pak.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

The pilot's profile has been removed from the IAF website, preparing to disown him maybe?

Don't know.

But i wont support such cowardly behavior if it happens.

Lets wait. They can't just disown him and escape from our media.

 

[desirous of desire]

huh?

Even Pak accepted IAF entered its airspace.

Only debated part is casualities.

Well, Didn't IAF claim to hit its supposed target?

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Well, Didn't IAF claim to hit its supposed target?

Yes but didn't mention casualties.

 

[Mamoon]

Let’s not lose focus of the main point amid all the war hysteria.

People can bury their heads in the sand if they desire, but it doesn’t change the fact that there are terror camps in Pakistan and we have done very little to wipe them out.

In addition, quite a few of these camps have been funded by our military/intelligence.

The altercation with India aside, we must mend our ways and clean up our act. Denial has not helped in the past and will not help in the future.

 

[Balthazar]

Casualties are expected in a war.

Still, I wonder what was the need for him to cross the border after yesterday's successful mission. We have completed our goal. This was unnecessary. Should have waited for Pakistanis to make their move.

 

[Adijazz1706]

Let’s not lose focus of the main point amid all the war hysteria.

People can bury their heads in the sand if they desire, but it doesn’t change the fact that there are terror camps in Pakistan and we have done very little to wipe them out.

In addition, quite a few of these camps have been funded by our military/intelligence.

The altercation with India aside, we must mend our ways and clean up our act. Denial has not helped in the past and will not help in the future.

How is this the main point? India supplied zero evidence of having hit any camps so IDK what you're saying

 

[Canford Cliffs]

Captured pilot is a PoW, and war hero. He went after Pakistani jets, and was shot down during ensuing fight.

We should feel proud.

 

[Canford Cliffs]

Indian MEA Update

MEA: we have lost one Mi-21 , We have shot one Pakistani plane, One pilot missing in action

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Don't know.

But i wont support such cowardly behavior if it happens.

Lets wait. They can't just disown him and escape from our media.

We didn't disown him. Official reports.

He is a brave man.

What he did was unnecessary though.

 

[Mamoon]

How is this the main point? India supplied zero evidence of having hit any camps so IDK what you're saying

Whether India hit any camps or not is irrelevant and doesn’t matter. The fact is that we do have terrorist camps and we need to clean them up.

 

[Canford Cliffs]

Mea-
Pak tried to attack military installations.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Let’s not lose focus of the main point amid all the war hysteria.

People can bury their heads in the sand if they desire, but it doesn’t change the fact that there are terror camps in Pakistan and we have done very little to wipe them out.

In addition, quite a few of these camps have been funded by our military/intelligence.

The altercation with India aside, we must mend our ways and clean up our act. Denial has not helped in the past and will not help in the future.

The point of this conflict was self defense and respect.

No country should be held "ransom" to others whims and desires.

If you think this war was about "terrorists" and not about Modi "wanting to get re elected" lets revisit this thread in 4 months time after Indian general elections.

The next Indian PM, especially Modi will be shaking hands with Pakistan for peace.

 

[Canford Cliffs]

India attacks terror camps in Pak, Pak retaliates by attacking Indian military establishment

India had every right to self defence post Pulwama and it was only targetting Jaish camps. Bcoz, there are no terrorists residing in this side of the border, Pak IAF attacked Indian military establishment.

It escalated quickly than I thought. Now it wont be tough to convince international powers regarding who is the culprit.

Self goal?

 

[Khan12]

Crying has already started. I do wonder if some people actually have any brain cells.

 

[Mamoon]

The point of this conflict was self defense and respect.

No country should be held "ransom" to others whims and desires.

If you think this war was about "terrorists" and not about Modi "wanting to get re elected" lets revisit this thread in 4 months time after Indian general elections.

The next Indian PM, especially Modi will be shaking hands with Pakistan for peace.

Our retaliation was a consequence of India invading our airspace, but we must not divert from what started the conflict in the first place.

A terrorist organization based in Pakistan claimed responsibility for the attack in Pulwama.

Whether they actually carried out the attack or not doesn’t change the fact that we do have terror camps in Pakistan that have been not wiped out, and this is something that is recognized in international forums.

 

[desirous of desire]

Yes but didn't mention casualties.

Hence I am asking if u have an ounce of doubt about their claim of hitting the target?

 

[midaz]

India confirms pilot missing and aircraft down
Spokesman Raveesh Kumar says that India has "unfortunately lost" a MiG-21 and that the pilot is missing.

He said India is assessing the situation and acknowledged Pakistan said it was holding the pilot.

 

[Romali_rotti]

The point of this conflict was self defense and respect.

No country should be held "ransom" to others whims and desires.

If you think this war was about "terrorists" and not about Modi "wanting to get re elected" lets revisit this thread in 4 months time after Indian general elections.

The next Indian PM, especially Modi will be shaking hands with Pakistan for peace.

Dr,

I have mad respect for you, even I was of the opinion this was a political stunt by Modi, however now I am starting to think there is more to this, no way he would be mad enough to risk a full fledged war with Pakistan as that will ruin India economically...

 

[the Great Khan]

Mea-
Pak tried to attack military installations.

we didnt try thats the point. we made a statement. in broad daylight that we can hit you whenever we want and retaliate. The vaunted IAF was left surprised and napping. And lost two aircraft in teh process of your quite poor response to this action. I would sack the head of the IAF once this round is over.

 

[Sycamore]

India media and government is a joke.

They are about 5 hrs too late and DG ISPR released all the info before them.

They are still saying they downed a F-16 whereas Pakistan called it hours ago they haven't even used F-16 for this operation.

Pakistan decided before hand they will not hit military installation and not cause casualties, and thats exactly what they did, but apparently India thwarted attack on military ? ok

 

[Rinnegan Sasuke]

Our retaliation was a consequence of India invading our airspace, but we must not divert from what started the conflict in the first place.

A terrorist organization based in Pakistan claimed responsibility for the attack in Pulwama.

Whether they actually carried out the attack or not doesn’t change the fact that we do have terror camps in Pakistan that have been not wiped out, and this is something that is recognized in international forums.

Agreed, this has gone far enough. I'm sure even the generals know nothing good will come by supporting these groups anymore, we aren't in the 90s anymore. Let's build a better Pakistan.

 

[the Great Khan]

still trying to figure out where this mythical camp was..all we know is they bombed some hill where an old man and his family lived. If thats the camp they are talking about then I cant really say much more. On the other hand the PAF's response has been sharp, deliberate and strategic. They have completed humiliated the IAF and the Indian govt. Modi will now have to deal with an angry voter base who will demand the return of their brave jawaan. It could be a Jimmy carter moment for Modi.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Dr,

I have mad respect for you, even I was of the opinion this was a political stunt by Modi, however now I am starting to think there is more to this, no way he would be mad enough to risk a full fledged war with Pakistan as that will ruin India economically...

These are political games.

Pakistan has responded in the only manner that was deemed possible.

However, I feel for Wing Commander Abhi not just because of his capture, but he probably will NEVER get to see his FAMILY again all because of people sitting in the hot seat passing orders. People will say, he signed up for it, but no one signs up to be captured forever.

 

[WebGuru]

Anyone saw the video where Pak Army was trying to protect the arrested pilot from villagers on LOC and keeping them away? It was sad to see but it's hard to imagine what those villagers on LOC go through during these regular firings so they were trying to release their anger.

 

[the Great Khan]

These are political games.

Pakistan has responded in the only manner that was deemed possible.

However, I feel for Wing Commander Abhi not just because of his capture, but he probably will NEVER get to see his FAMILY again all because of people sitting in the hot seat passing orders. People will say, he signed up for it, but no one signs up to be captured forever.

He is a brave soldier and should be returned to his family. We dont want to keep him here any longer than neccessary. Soldiers do not sign up to fight an election campaign. They sign up to defend their country.

i hope he is returned. The Indian govt needs to accept their error of judgement and start a dialogue with Pakistan.

 

[WebGuru]

PM IK speech started...

 

[WebGuru]

These are political games.

Pakistan has responded in the only manner that was deemed possible.

However, I feel for Wing Commander Abhi not just because of his capture, but he probably will NEVER get to see his FAMILY again all because of people sitting in the hot seat passing orders. People will say, he signed up for it, but no one signs up to be captured forever.

He will return to his family in a couple of weeks or months we always return them the soldiers are profesional they treat each other really well.

 

[the Great Khan]

Agreed, this has gone far enough. I'm sure even the generals know nothing good will come by supporting these groups anymore, we aren't in the 90s anymore. Let's build a better Pakistan.

we arent supporting them like in the 90's. The LOC is heavily monitored and it is very difficult to go across the border. There are plenty in kashmir ready to do what that young chap did in pulwama. India needs to deescalate the situation and just reduce its military presence in kashmir. Start development like its doing in the rest of its country. Things will calm down.

 

[Romali_rotti]

These are political games.

Pakistan has responded in the only manner that was deemed possible.

However, I feel for Wing Commander Abhi not just because of his capture, but he probably will NEVER get to see his FAMILY again all because of people sitting in the hot seat passing orders. People will say, he signed up for it, but no one signs up to be captured forever.

Yeah It is a heart breaking situation, I feel Abhi's pain, can only imagine what his family is going through.. I have heard about so many Malayalee soldiers, ppl of my ethinicity being broughr back in coffins and the government would not take care of or provide any assistance to their families. Crying shame, imo ppl of the sub-continent are just a lost cause, they cannot be salvaged...........

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Hence I am asking if u have an ounce of doubt about their claim of hitting the target?

There is never a question of ounce of doubt in these kind of situations.

You form opinions based on what data you have and then adjust with emergence of new data.

I have already stated in the other thread that Indian govt should provide more details about what happ, estimated casualities and what not.

All I know for now is they invaded Pak airspace and dropped the payload. Everything else is subjective.

 

[Adijazz1706]

we arent supporting them like in the 90's. The LOC is heavily monitored and it is very difficult to go across the border. There are plenty in kashmir ready to do what that young chap did in pulwama. India needs to deescalate the situation and just reduce its military presence in kashmir. Start development like its doing in the rest of its country. Things will calm down.

The deaths and disappearances of a hundred thousand people cannot be forgotten because of good roads and malls etc.

 

[Romali_rotti]

we arent supporting them like in the 90's. The LOC is heavily monitored and it is very difficult to go across the border. There are plenty in kashmir ready to do what that young chap did in pulwama. India needs to deescalate the situation and just reduce its military presence in kashmir. Start development like its doing in the rest of its country. Things will calm down.

TGK,

The only way for peace in Kashmir is to remove section 35A, once it is removed rest of India will slowly settle down there and the uprising would die down. There will be a lot of turbulence initially but it will lead to ever lasting peace between India and Pakistan......

 

[Romali_rotti]

The deaths and disappearances of a hundred thousand people cannot be forgotten because of good roads and malls etc.

So basically you want India and Pakistan to keep going the way they are in the name of Kashmir. Nice....

 

[Azzurri]

So basically you want India and Pakistan to keep going the way they are in the name of Kashmir. Nice....

India should leave Kashmir. End of discussion

 

[Romali_rotti]

India should leave Kashmir. End of discussion

Not gonna happen, if you insist on seeing Pakistan go the way it is, with no money and zero economy, please keep thinking like your post...

 

[rhony]

India should leave Kashmir. End of discussion

On the contrary, they will escalate in Kashmir I think. They can't engage with Pak anymore

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

On the contrary, they will escalate in Kashmir I think. They can't engage with Pak anymore

I am afraid this is not the end of this saga.

 

[Haroon786]

I am afraid this is not the end of this saga.

Do you have any info on this?

 

[Aman]

Pakistan have schooled India here so badly.

On social media so many Indians were celebrating the IAF's air strikes, here Pakistan have mounted a big blow with actual evidence and there are things like #SayNotoWar trending which is predominately being pushed by Pakistani celebs.

Compare this to a couple of days when a large number of Indians and media were war mongering (including actors and cricketers - idiots the lot of them, using their platform for there jingoistic agendas ).

 

[desirous of desire]

There is never a question of ounce of doubt in these kind of situations.

You form opinions based on what data you have and then adjust with emergence of new data.

I have already stated in the other thread that Indian govt should provide more details about what happ, estimated casualities and what not.

All I know for now is they invaded Pak airspace and dropped the payload. Everything else is subjective.

But they aren't providing anything just like they didn't provide any proof of supposed surgical strike. What is your stance about surgical strike now? Have you adjusted from your initial position with no emergence of any data about surgical strike. Pakistan has asked the same as the last time when India was boasting on about that surgical strike that Indian/foreign media can itself come and see at the location India is claiming its attack.

 

[Haroon786]

Pakistan have schooled India here so badly.

On social media so many Indians were celebrating the IAF's air strikes, here Pakistan have mounted a big blow with actual evidence and there are things like #SayNotoWar trending which is predominately being pushed by Pakistani celebs.

Compare this to a couple of days when a large number of Indians and media were war mongering (including actors and cricketers - idiots the lot of them, using their platform for this disgusting message fpalm).

Yep, despise blind nationalism.

 

[rhony]

I am afraid this is not the end of this saga.

I think it is. India will lose diplomatic support if they escalate this. But I don't expect Modi to back down. He will focus elsewhere before the elections and Kashmir is the answer.

 

[Bilal7]

India should pack its bags and leave Kashmir. That will solve 90% of the subcontinent's problems. All these terrorists, freedom-fighters, border skirmishes, hostile relations, etc. are the result of India's unjust occupation of a people who clearly do not want to do anything with them.

Apparently, the pilot of the downed helicopter that landed in Indian-occupied Kashmir was pelted with rocks by the Kashmiris. If that doesn't send a message, I don't know what will.

 

[Aman]

Yep, despise blind nationalism.

Dude have you seen how so many Indian celebs reacted to this strikes? Disgusting clowns.

Have some shame, you're supposed to be the educated and have the platform to promote a positive message.

Priankya Chopra was a UNICEF ambassador and she was celebrating the air strikes the other day

Hope she's booted out, don't need idiots like that representing UNICEF.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Do you have any info on this?

Simple.

If Modi goes to election now, he will get routed. Not because of this alone but also because of lack of jobs, awful economic policies, etc. This fiasco will be like the final nail in the coffin.

Yesterday, when we raided Pak, even the Pak envoy said no other country (including China) condemned India. That was a diplomatic victory.

What happened today has reversed all that. Public won't remember what happ yesterday but only today.

I just don't see how India will just let it go.

This is all just an educated guess.

With that being said, I could be 100% wrong here.

 

[Aman]

I think it is. India will lose diplomatic support if they escalate this. But I don't expect Modi to back down. He will focus elsewhere before the elections and Kashmir is the answer.

India are looking awful to the rest of the world atm. This is a world class innings from Pakistan.

My dad thinks Modi is doing this only because of the election and he's basically won since the 'alleged' air strikes, riling up idiots and the media are making it out to be some landmark achievement which shows India's power to the world when in reality they look like fools and are being clowned by Pakistan of all countries.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

I think it is. India will lose diplomatic support if they escalate this. But I don't expect Modi to back down. He will focus elsewhere before the elections and Kashmir is the answer.

This issue has gone from Kashmir vs India ....to Pak vs India.

Modi can do whatever he wants in Kashmir but people will ask what happ with Pak.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

We always would win this war.

India acted blindly.

Next 48 hours a statement of peaceful intent will come from India.

Mark my words.

Also China will offer something in the next 24 hours.

 

[Haroon786]

Dude have you seen how so many Indian celebs reacted to this strikes? Disgusting clowns.

Have some shame, you're supposed to be the educated and have the platform to promote a positive message.

Priankya Chopra was a UNICEF ambassador and she was celebrating the air strikes the other day

Hope she's booted out, don't need idiots like that representing UNICEF.

It is utterly disgusting - didn't know that about Priyanka but yes I've seen buffoonery galore from them.

Just hope the situation is de-escalated, all-out war will be BAD.

 

[Aman]

We always would win this war.

India acted blindly.

Next 48 hours a statement of peaceful intent will come from India.

Mark my words.

Also China will offer something in the next 24 hours.

If Pakistan want to go for the double, they should hand over the Indian pilot.

 

[rhony]

This issue has gone from Kashmir vs India ....to Pak vs India.

Modi can do whatever he wants in Kashmir but people will ask what happ with Pak.

Yes they will ask. But he has exhausted his options to engage Pak at least militarily.

 

[Muhammad10]

India confirms pilot missing and aircraft down
Spokesman Raveesh Kumar says that India has "unfortunately lost" a MiG-21 and that the pilot is missing.

He said India is assessing the situation and acknowledged Pakistan said it was holding the pilot.

In that case, I think the thread title needs to be updated for accuracy. [MENTION=93712]MenInG[/MENTION]

 

[Haroon786]

Simple.

If Modi goes to election now, he will get routed. Not because of this alone but also because of lack of jobs, awful economic policies, etc. This fiasco will be like the final nail in the coffin.

Yesterday, when we raided Pak, even the Pak envoy said no other country (including China) condemned India. That was a diplomatic victory.

What happened today has reversed all that. Public won't remember what happ yesterday but only today.

I just don't see how India will just let it go.

This is all just an educated guess.

With that being said, I could be 100% wrong here.

Hope it is, don't want the conflict to go any deeper into either country's territories.

 

[Aman]

How do Indians feel about all this? Is a different narrative being pushed in India?

I'm not sold on the supposed surgical attacks as there's no proof of it, while the two aircrafts being gunned down and pilot being in custody is there with video and photographic proof.

Looking from the outside in, India look like they're in the wrong and have been clowned by Pakistan.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

But they aren't providing anything just like they didn't provide any proof of supposed surgical strike. What is your stance about surgical strike now? Have you adjusted from your initial position with no emergence of any data about surgical strike. Pakistan has asked the same as the last time when India was boasting on about that surgical strike that Indian/foreign media can itself come and see at the location India is claiming its attack.

I had no opinion on the number of casualities. So nothing to adjust for me.

This is the official quotes:

A "very large number of Jaish-e-Mohammed terrorists" were killed in the pre-dawn air strikes by the Indian Air Force across the Line of Control on Tuesday, the government said today, two weeks after 40 soldiers were killed in a terror attack in Jammu and Kashmir's Pulwama.

Foreign Secretary Vijay Gokhale said it was a "non-military, pre-emptive strike" specifically targeted at the Jaish-e-Mohammed camp and the "selection of the target was also conditioned by our desire to avoid civilian casualties."

Twelve Mirage 2000 jets dropped 1,000 kg bombs on the terror training camp of the Jaish-e-Mohammad, which had claimed responsibility for the Pulwama terror attack. Mr Gokhale said Jaish had been active in Pakistan for the last two decades, led by Masood Azhar with its headquarters in Bahawalpur.

"In an intelligence-led operation in the early hours of today, India struck the biggest training camp of JeM in Balakot. In this operation, a very large number of JeM terrorists, trainers, senior commanders and groups of jihadis who were being trained for fidayeen attacks were eliminated. This facility at Balakot was headed by Maulana Yousouf Azhar, also known as Ustad Ghouri, the brother-in-law of JeM chief Masood Azhar."

"Credible intelligence was received that JeM was attempting another suicide terror attack in various parts of the country, and the fidayeen jihadis were being trained for this purpose. In the face of imminent danger, a pre-emptive strike became absolutely necessary," said Mr Gokhale.

The foreign secretary also said Pakistan must live up to its commitment to dismantle terror camps and act on terrorists operating from its soil.

"The Government of Pakistan had made a solemn commitment in January 2004 not to allow its soil or territory under its control to be used for terrorism against India. We expect that Pakistan lives up to its public commitment and takes follow up actions to dismantle all JeM and other camps and hold the terrorists accountable for the actions," he said.

----

 

[Varun]

How do Indians feel about all this? Is a different narrative being pushed in India?

I'm not sold on the supposed surgical attacks as there's no proof of it, while the two aircrafts being gunned down and pilot being in custody is there with video and photographic proof.

Looking from the outside in, India look like they're in the wrong and have been clowned by Pakistan.

It is the opposite of Kargil. Just wait a couple of years and pull up this event on Wikipedia - we are clearly the bad guys here.

With the captured pilot et al, Modi is going to get thumped in the elections. Good riddance.

 

[PerfectionPersonified]

How do Indians feel about all this? Is a different narrative being pushed in India?

I'm not sold on the supposed surgical attacks as there's no proof of it, while the two aircrafts being gunned down and pilot being in custody is there with video and photographic proof.

Looking from the outside in, India look like they're in the wrong and have been clowned by Pakistan.

Only if more Indians understand thhis

 

[Aman]

It is the opposite of Kargil. Just wait a couple of years and pull up this event on Wikipedia - we are clearly the bad guys here.

With the captured pilot et al, Modi is going to get thumped in the elections. Good riddance.

It's funny because most would have thunk it would be the other way around. Pakistan being too emotional and unprofessional.

India have not developed as much as they let you believe.

 

[Akki malhotra]

How do Indians feel about all this? Is a different narrative being pushed in India?

I'm not sold on the supposed surgical attacks as there's no proof of it, while the two aircrafts being gunned down and pilot being in custody is there with video and photographic proof.

Looking from the outside in, India look like they're in the wrong and have been clowned by Pakistan.

Matter of the fact is Indian planes crossed loc even today after what they did yesterday. So one of them shot down by Pakistan.
How this ended bad for India? You were thinking that Indian planes will always be successful inside Pakistan. Well

 

[rhony]

India are looking awful to the rest of the world atm. This is a world class innings from Pakistan.

My dad thinks Modi is doing this only because of the election and he's basically won since the 'alleged' air strikes, riling up idiots and the media are making it out to be some landmark achievement which shows India's power to the world when in reality they look like fools and are being clowned by Pakistan of all countries.

Yes elections played a big part but remember Modi isnt the only one that riled them up. Entire India was baying for blood after 40+ soldiers died and he obliged. I'm pretty sure he didn't expect this outcome but he's a politician. He'll come up with something. As far India's perception goes, this is an embarrassment surely. But India is too big to suffer this for long. I bet they are already scheming up something.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Yes they will ask. But he has exhausted his options to engage Pak at least militarily.

Technically not true bhai.

Not even close.

Question is what does he want to do now.

 

[Adijazz1706]

I had no opinion on the number of casualities. So nothing to adjust for me.

This is the official quotes:



----

The younger brother of Masood Azhar mentioned sent a message yesterday saying there was no attack on them and no casualties. India has not shown a shred of evidence that any terrorists were killed at all hence it makes no sense to blindly believe the media and government claims

 

[Aman]

Yes elections played a big part but remember Modi isnt the only one that riled them up. Entire India was baying for blood after 40+ soldiers died and he obliged. I'm pretty sure he didn't expect this outcome but he's a politician. He'll come up with something. As far India's perception goes, this is an embarrassment surely. But India is too big to suffer this for long. I bet they are already scheming up something.

Do you think the strikes actually happened?

With how Imran Khan reacted, the lack of evidence and today's events, I think Pakistan were telling the truth.

I'm not taking any sides here, this from the outside looking in. It's one country's word against another, the evidence mostly seems to be in Pakistan's corner and they're willing to show the world the sites which were supposedly hit by the IAF which adds credence to their story.

 

[rhony]

Technically not true bhai.

Not even close.

Question is what does he want to do now.

On what basis will he continue this? Indian Minister, that lady in China mentioned India doesnt want to escalate this. This was before Indian jets were shot down. The External affairs clarified yesterday's mission was non military and they've achieved their objective already. Pak claims they shot Indian jets in Pak airspace. There is no basis for him to attack now. Instead, he will divert the attention to something big. We'll have to wait and see.

 

[rhony]

Do you think the strikes actually happened?

With how Imran Khan reacted, the lack of evidence and today's events, I think Pakistan were telling the truth.

Strikes are immaterial. India encroached Pak air space, bombed and came back unharmed. That was an embarrassment to Pak defence. Pak today embarrassed India and some.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

The younger brother of Masood Azhar mentioned sent a message yesterday saying there was no attack on them and no casualties. India has not shown a shred of evidence that any terrorists were killed at all hence it makes no sense to blindly believe the media and government claims

Cool.

Then Pakistan should go ahead, tell the world and humiliate India no.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

On what basis will he continue this? Indian Minister, that lady in China mentioned India doesnt want to escalate this. This was before Indian jets were shot down. The External affairs clarified yesterday's mission was non military and they've achieved their objective already. Pak claims they shot Indian jets in Pak airspace. There is no basis for him to attack now. Instead, he will divert the attention to something big. We'll have to wait and see.

Obviously she can't say anything else during a foreign trip.

No one does.

 

[Aman]

Strikes are immaterial. India encroached Pak air space, bombed and came back unharmed. That was an embarrassment to Pak defence. Pak today embarrassed India and some.

Meh, depends on who's story is true IMO.

If India actually hit a terrorist camp and killed 300 terrorists, fair enough. Pakistan look bad for allowing their air space being invaded.

Or

If India did get into to Pakistan's air space, only to be chased out and them to drop payloads, it makes India look comical.

I'm leaning towards Pakistan's story atm as there's more supporting their story than there is India's. If India really killed 300 terrorists and hit a terrorist camp, where are the photos and video coverage to back up their claims? Why aren't they showing it to the world?

 

[desirous of desire]

I had no opinion on the number of casualities. So nothing to adjust for me.

This is the official quotes:



----

I am talking about Surgical Strike and you deflected it. What is your position after no proof being given about surgical strike.

Its only the claim that they have managed to hit their target just like they claimed about surgical strike.

 

[DRsohail]

Welll done PAF .Proud of you....naako channay chabwaw jo bhi meeli aankh sa deekhay ya hamari trritory k andhar aana ka soch bhi lay........well done full marks.

 

[Aman]

Obviously she can't say anything else during a foreign trip.

No one does.

SIF be rational here.

IK was willing to show the sites hit to the world.

Modi is not showing anything from the supposed strikes even though it would strengthen the perception of India and him to the rest of the world.

Better yet it would add actual and tangible credence to the claims Pakistan are sheltering terrorists and would put pressure on Pakistan to act.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

SIF be rational here.

IK was willing to show the sites hit to the world.

Modi is not showing anything from the supposed strikes even though it would strengthen the perception of India and him to the rest of the world.

Better yet it would add actual and tangible credence to the claims Pakistan are sheltering terrorists and would put pressure on Pakistan to act.

Cmon Aman....I have been reading your posts reg this issue from Day 1 (Pulwama).

With all due respect, let's just say you are not aware of the backstory/intricacies reg this whole saga.

Just making a generic statement that Sidhu is one of the saner Indians reveals lack of understanding of the bigger issue or the nuances of this issue that Indians are having.

I don't blame you but I would suggest you go through the whole story cos this is a long saga.

As for this whole surgical strike, I don't care. I didn't create a big brouhaha over terrorists killed. I didn't even bother with our media claims of 300 terrorists killed. Nor do I care if Modi gives Pak the info to show the rest of the world whether he is right or wrong.
It's possible IAF didn't hit their intended targets.

I know IAF went into their airspace and dropped a payload. That's all I talked about post IAF attack.

What I do care about is the big picture. The terrorists holed up in Pak that attack India. If Pakistan has all the right answers, they can easily shut up India when we raise issues about terrorists. But they can't. All we get is evasive, defensive answers.

Go and see how the world reacted when we entered Pakistan and dropped a payload. Even ex Pak envoy went on record saying this:

'Even China Didn't Speak in Our Favour': Former Pak Envoy to US Rues Lack of International Support

https://www.news18.com/news/india/n...former-pakistan-ambassador-to-us-2049729.html

Think about it for a minute.

Why is this happening?

Why are Indians so mad?

Imran Khan is asking for proof reg Jaish chief who was freaking rescued after terrorists hijacked a plan and held passengers ransom. And this is just scratching the surface. Let's not even get into his "house arrest" saga in 2016 when he was accused and then magically released by Pak inspite of India providing evidence.

And now they need proof?

lol.

This is a joke bhai.

Everyone has a breaking point. Pulwama was India's.

 

[Adijazz1706]

Cmon Aman....I have been reading your posts reg this issue from Day 1 (Pulwama).

With all due respect, let's just say you are not aware of the backstory/intricacies reg this whole saga.

Just making a generic statement that Sidhu is one of the saner Indians reveals lack of understanding of the bigger issue or the nuances of this issue that Indians are having.

I don't blame you but I would suggest you go through the whole story cos this is a long saga.

As for this whole surgical strike, I don't care. I didn't create a big brouhaha over terrorists killed. I didn't even bother with our media claims of 300 terrorists killed. Nor do I care if Modi gives Pak the info to show the rest of the world whether he is right or wrong.
It's possible IAF didn't hit their intended targets.

I know IAF went into their airspace and dropped a payload. That's all I talked about post IAF attack.

What I do care about is the big picture. The terrorists holed up in Pak that attack India. If Pakistan has all the right answers, they can easily shut up India when we raise issues about terrorists. But they can't. All we get is evasive, defensive answers.

Go and see how the world reacted when we entered Pakistan and dropped a payload. Even ex Pak envoy went on record saying this:

'Even China Didn't Speak in Our Favour': Former Pak Envoy to US Rues Lack of International Support

https://www.news18.com/news/india/n...former-pakistan-ambassador-to-us-2049729.html

Think about it for a minute.

Why is this happening?

Why are Indians so mad?

Imran Khan is asking for proof reg Jaish chief who was freaking rescued after terrorists hijacked a plan and held passengers ransom. And this is just scratching the surface. Let's not even get into his "house arrest" saga in 2016 when he was accused and then magically released by Pak inspite of India providing evidence.

And now they need proof?

lol.

This is a joke bhai.

Everyone has a breaking point. Pulwama was India's.

Joshila's posts claim another victim, we'll remember the original you which is preserved in your various sensible posts in these forums. RIP SIF

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

I am talking about Surgical Strike and you deflected it. What is your position after no proof being given about surgical strike.

Its only the claim that they have managed to hit their target just like they claimed about surgical strike.

Ok I can see why you might feel that way.

Let me put it this way.

You are expecting my view to be in binary form. Either India is right or Pakistan is right.

Actually I have another view...that of limbo until something is absolutely proven.

Meaning, if India fails to provide irrefutable proof, I don't have to believe the Pak view (unless there is irrefutable proof). I can be in a limbo state not caring what really happened.

Now let's take the latest Surgical Strike:

1. We invaded their airspace and droppped a payload. All are aboard this train.

2. Now we claim that we bombed Jaish holdout killing many terrorists including brother in law of Masood Azhar (official version).

3. Pak says ghanta happened.

4. Some posters said India could provide the coordinates, estimates and other details to humiliate Pak but Indian govt hasn't provided it. I have always maintained thats a reasonable viewpoint. We are not doing it which is why its hard for me to completely accept Indian claims.

5. Now, with that being said, I am no obligation to accept the Pak version that we just went and bombed some trees. Why should I? What exemplary track record does Pak establishment have that would make me do that? Nothing.

So my view stays limbo.

Maybe India dropped the payout but it didn't hit the target.
Maybe it hit the target but there weren't a lot of casualities.
Maybe our jets had to scramble back and they dropped the payout on the way out.

Anything could be the truth.

You know what I do when it comes to these things?

I don't worry. I don't waste time. I happily stay in limbo until some irrefutable proof forces me to change my view.

Hence...my comment, I don't have to adjust my viewpoint at all.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Joshila's posts claim another victim, we'll remember the original you which is preserved in your various sensible posts in these forums. RIP SIF

Not sure wat Joshila's post has got to do with it.

There are actual quotes in this article.

Even leaving aside this article, none of the foreign entities slammed India for doing what it did.

It was all generic statement (peace, dialogues, etc) and some went to add Pak has to stop supporting terrorist groups.

 

[GBK_Fan]

Frankly I am happy with the response from PAF. It sent a message without causing any casualties.

On the Indian side, we have lost track of what we are trying to achieve. There has been no respect for the Pakistani military capabilities. Hopefully this episode serves as a wake up call. The Pakistani military is not a push over and we don’t really have the military muscle to annihilate them without suffering casualties. We drive around in mig-21s. We have no place doing a cross border raid.

How about focusing on the economy? China is a 12T economy and still there is a separate Taiwan. We still control Arunachal Pradesh. If we want to ape China, let’s start there.