Reason why India has become such a solid team

[kron]

Before SA 20 cricket south africa was also not a rich board. How do they unearth talents. Nz has no premiere leagues. Cricket is not their main sports. How do they unearth talents

Good school systems

And trust me all those white players you see playing for SA come from wealthy families. All private school kids. Great school systems. So they don’t care if they fail in sport. Those young kids have a back up plan in place. Parents have a trust fund for them or they have a family business to run etc should they not make it. It’s not the same for average desi kids in Asia.

Infact even in India despite bcci being rich, lots of talents miss out because these kids don’t have sufficient backing from their schools, parents etc due to financial constraints. Cricket isn’t cheap either if you want to go pro. Unless you get extremely lucky to get sponsored.

 

[kron]

NZ is a rich first world country and that impacts its systems. Nutrition, supportive parents, professionalism etc.

SA is not as rich but it is still upper middle income.

School system. Private schools

They are all rich kids/ all of them

Go check rabada’s parents background
And temba as well. They were rich even before he got into cricket.

Only ngidi had a scholarship.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Good school systems

And trust me all those white players you see playing for SA come from wealthy families. All private school kids. Great school systems. So they don’t care if they fail in sport. Those young kids have a back up plan in place. Parents have a trust fund for them or they have a family business to run etc should they not make it. It’s not the same for average desi kids in Asia.

Infact even in India despite bcci being rich, lots of talents miss out because these kids don’t have sufficient backing from their schools, parents etc due to financial constraints. Cricket isn’t cheap either if you want to go pro. Unless you get extremely lucky to get sponsored.

What i mean is their board doesn't do much. Even Srilanka relied a lot on school system.

 

[charlie007]

…..

I watched the first IPL, i watched the kind of rubbish Ravindra Jadeja was, but than Dhoni knew how to use that guy and made him into a star.

I have no ego to admit that India is amongst the best side.

My only issue is with their fans, the Indian nationals and now their captain of the T20 team. The fans will defend anything. THey may not be able to afford their needs or wants and would do bhangra over BCCI making 100 carore. They will defend everything wrong their team or countyr

No fan in the world celebrates their sports board making 100 carore, even if you are a liverpool or Man U fan. Infact, such fans would start questioning their sports board that why arnt they getting that money in terms of better parking or better stadium experience.

Jadeja (a U19 WC winner) was not in CSK in the first season, he played for Rajasthan Royals. Warne liked his skillset a lot and tipped him to be a superstar (he called him a rockstar too lol). Jadeja was an all round talent to start with. I’m sure Warne had a better eye for talent than most. After the first season where he performed admirably well, Jadeja himself wanted more money and started looking out. Dhoni or not, Jadeja would have been just fine anywhere.

About the BCCI money part:
It’s extremely important for making India a cricketing powerhouse. It brought cricket out as a viable career option. In a country like India where Education is the most sought after thing for parents, they actually started believing their kids could actually have a career playing cricket. All that’s because of money in the system.

Here are some tangible benefits if BCCI money that results in making cricket better in India that the fans take pride in:

1. Helps improve the overall playing infrastructure at several different levels

2. Helps BCCI grow the game at grass-root levels in India which in turn helps budding cricketers adopt the game as a career.

3. Helps pay top Indian cricketers top money, as they deserve. A top cricketer in India doesn’t have to worry about money after retirement, their next 3 generations can survive without working.

4. Better fields, better coaching, better tools.

5. Ability to use the money to frequently conduct tournaments at different levels - Gave players experience in absorbing pressure.

6. Helped domestic players learn more about cricket by putting them in the same dressing room with legends and also share their experience.

7. Money from IPL and sponsorship in general is being used to invest in Women's cricket.

8. Through the IPL, millions of people have a new pass-time in the evenings in terms of entertainment! The viewership itself attracts more sponsors and thus more money.
IPL is not a platform to unearth anyone from total obscurity, it is more to hone their skills and help them get used to playing in pressure conditions and determine who shines better under the spotlight. If you are good enough relatively, you'll play IPL and better your skills - and make money in the process.

There’s still ways to go in improvement as far as fan experience goes, I’m hoping it’ll get better in time.

It’s not about fans having a share in the money earned by the BCCI, but watching that money work for them through results. I don’t think any fan would have any standing if India lost more than they won despite all the money. They’ll be asking questions.

 

[CrIc_Mystique]

I won't purely attribute this to money. you still need talent . Long back guys form village, small town had awful lot of difficulty to make it to the top. With IPL , each franchisee has their own talent scouting team who are able to unearth these guys. . India already had a strong age group system. under-12, under-14,15 under-19. THen some prestigious high school trophies. Due to IPL cricket has become a profession.

Now each city, state host their own premiere leagues which makes the talent hunting easier. These are new avenues to make it top. Varun chakravarthy story is a fascinating story. But for a local state premiere league Varun would have never played cricket.

Varun Chakravarthy after finishing architetcutre was doing freelance arthitect job. Then becamse assistant director. He even acted in a cameo role. played as a junior artist. 600 Rs per day. He got into music as well for 6 months or one year. He quit. On the side he was playing tennis ball cricket. That was when his state premiere league (pioneer in India) was started by Srinivasn (cSK owner). His idea was to bring it to local districts. Through talent scouting they found Varun to play in this smaller league. His mysery bowling caugth everyone's attention. Very soon Dinesh karthik introduced him to KKR IPL franchisee. His life completely changed.

ARchitect -> Smaller State league -> IPL -> Indian T20 team -> Indian ODI team

There's a fascinating story about Varun Chakravarthy on a leading cricketing website called 'Namma Jai-Chitom, Machaa' or close enough... loosely translated - 'Akhir hum jeet gaye, bhai/mate/friend'...it has a terrific input on his life struggles, the number of changes he has made in his life...and these are so many - it can fill a novel or any bolly movie...
What a guy!


tbh he needs his own emoji on PP!

 

[sweep_shot]

Reasons:

1) They have more people than all other Test nations combined. Population of 1.4-billion+. It means they have more players to choose from.

2) They have more landmass which means they can have more cricket grounds. British Empire allocated them too much land instead of balkanizing more.

3) They tend to rip off other boards. For example, they don't allow their players to play in other leagues but accept foreign players in IPL. That's a ripoff.

4) They have hijacked ICC and get all sorts of preferential treatments. They can get away with almost anything. They feel they can do anything without consequences.

 

[RexRex]

PCB gets atleast 40 million dollars from the ICC every year. Add to that, other sources of revenue like sponsors .. lack of resources should be the last thing their fans complain about.

 

[jnaveen1980]

PCB gets atleast 40 million dollars from the ICC every year. Add to that, other sources of revenue like sponsors .. lack of resources should be the last thing their fans complain about.

Yea.. How the heck Pakistan produced better players 15 years back without money.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

I know this isn't about players but I went on a tour of lords recently and all of the tour group was Indian. The tour guide was a white old man who had actually been stationed in Quetta in his youth on an exchange.

Anyway I asked him if he ever had any Pakistanis coming, he said very few, it's mainly Indians.

Indians have a voracious appetite for cricket. It's unlikely any country will catch them as being quite honest it's only Indians that take cricket so seriously from a fan level all the way to player level.

This appetite means that from childhood their kids are cricket mad and parents are actively pushing them to succeed.

Have you really heard in Pakistan of parents taking their kids to training, camps,drills etc at a young age?

I have made this point on PP before but most of our players come into the team and tell us stories about how their fathers prevented them from playing and they used to sneak out etc etc.

Indians devour cricket man from every aspect and are obsessed by it. Naturally if they have an obsession, and it pays well, they will invest more and more into it and it becomes a cycle of success.

 

[saimayubera]

I know this isn't about players but I went on a tour of lords recently and all of the tour group was Indian. The tour guide was a white old man who had actually been stationed in Quetta in his youth on an exchange.

Anyway I asked him if he ever had any Pakistanis coming, he said very few, it's mainly Indians.

Indians have a voracious appetite for cricket. It's unlikely any country will catch them as being quite honest it's only Indians that take cricket so seriously from a fan level all the way to player level.

This appetite means that from childhood their kids are cricket mad and parents are actively pushing them to succeed.

Have you really heard in Pakistan of parents taking their kids to training, camps,drills etc at a young age?

I have made this point on PP before but most of our players come into the team and tell us stories about how their fathers prevented them from playing and they used to sneak out etc etc.

Indians devour cricket man from every aspect and are obsessed by it. Naturally if they have an obsession, and it pays well, they will invest more and more into it and it becomes a cycle of success.

Simply due to India becoming richer.

Due to IPL/FC cricket, you can have a very good life even if you never play international cricket. So parents aren't completely averse to kids playing cricket.

Manish Pandey has made 60 crore INR from his IPL career without being a regular India player. Plus must have made 5-10 crores off domestic/international cricket etc. Plus few small endorsements here and there.

If he invested well (and India has a booming stock market) he must have made enough for a lifetime.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Simply due to India becoming richer.

Due to IPL/FC cricket, you can have a very good life even if you never play international cricket. So parents aren't completely averse to kids playing cricket.

Manish Pandey has made 60 crore INR from his IPL career without being a regular India player. Plus must have made 5-10 crores off domestic/international cricket etc. Plus few small endorsements here and there.

If he invested well (and India has a booming stock market) he must have made enough for a lifetime.

For sure that plays a part too but I think India always had this obsession even before the riches.

 

[saimayubera]

For sure that plays a part too but I think India always had this obsession even before the riches.

Yeah, but ability to go to UK on vacation and do a Lords trip requires $$$.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Yeah, but ability to go to UK on vacation and do a Lords trip requires $$$.

true,

but even though they are less in numbers the Rich Pakistanis dont have that interest, they come for shopping and dinners.

you guys LOVE cricket.

Soon the Indian diaspora will dominate cricket in US and eventually Aus too.

 

[charlie007]

It’s the money in the game that has made cricket as a viable career option. Most urban parents and a lot of rural ones too want their kids to become engineers and doctors but if they still want to choose cricket, then the parents are reasonable comfortable letting their kids pursue cricket as a profession.
I agree with your assessment about the passion for cricket. It’s widespread. Always has been.

 

[saimayubera]

true,

but even though they are less in numbers the Rich Pakistanis dont have that interest, they come for shopping and dinners.

you guys LOVE cricket.

Soon the Indian diaspora will dominate cricket in US and eventually Aus too.

I think the rich Indians also don't care too much about cricket. By rich I mean the true elite - big businessmen, industrialists, actors etc.

Its the middle classes that have become rich enough to go abroad on cricket tours etc. Software engineers. 9/5 workers etc. Pakistan has not become rich enough that this demographic can afford to go abroad.

 

[Major]

true,

but even though they are less in numbers the Rich Pakistanis dont have that interest, they come for shopping and dinners.

you guys LOVE cricket.

Soon the Indian diaspora will dominate cricket in US and eventually Aus too.

I like how you are giving him and his country respect, but still an Indian being an Indian is trying to scream in this thread by writing it over and over again that we are rich, we are rich, we are rich. Even though he himself might not even be rich.

They just dont know how to talk when shown respect.

Its weird, every post the guy made is about being rich. Wonder if he himself covers his own needs first.

 

[saimayubera]

I like how you are giving him and his country respect, but still an Indian being an Indian is trying to scream in this thread by writing it over and over again that we are rich, we are rich, we are rich. Even though he himself might not even be rich.

They just dont know how to talk when shown respect.

Its weird, every post the guy made is about being rich. Wonder if he himself covers his own needs first.

When that is a reason for why India has left Pakistan behind in cricket (and hockey), that needs to be mentioned.

And don't worry too much about me - I can cover my own needs plus much much more.

 

[Red-Indian]

Simply due to India becoming richer.

Due to IPL/FC cricket, you can have a very good life even if you never play international cricket. So parents aren't completely averse to kids playing cricket.

Manish Pandey has made 60 crore INR from his IPL career without being a regular India player. Plus must have made 5-10 crores off domestic/international cricket etc. Plus few small endorsements here and there.

If he invested well (and India has a booming stock market) he must have made enough for a lifetime.

For every Manish Pandey who made his 60, there are hundreds who fell out of the system. Unfortunately, all the money in Indian cricket is still pretty unevenly distributed. There are probably 5000 young men and maybe 200 young women who can actually make a full time living from cricket. Think of the millions who try.

For a sport that generates upwards of a couple of billion USD, that's too few in my opinion. Money needs to be spread more agressively around the Indian cricket system. The BCCI seems to be happy sitting on it's reserves and hoping things take care of themselves.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Money is one thing. You still need motivation and hardwork. At one stage Prithvi shaw was blue eyed boy. Scored a debut Test 100. From that point to not getting picked by any IPL team. Abhishek was a lower middler order batsman in u-19 world cup team led by Prithvi shaw. Look where Abhishek is where Shaw is. In 2018 batch Nagarkoti, Mavi, Porel were ace fast bowlers for India. INdia expected great things from them. But you know who made it out from that batch? Reserve bowler Arshdeep singh.

 

[Farabi]

If I’m not wrong, the population of the Caribbean islands that make up the West Indies never went over 4/5 million.

That’s a tiny population compared to others, yet when they had less money they produced some of the all time best bowlers as well batsmen (too many names, some of those who count break into the XI back then would be ATGs elsewhere.)

They were never a so called first world country (or set of countries) like NZ which has a similar population yet were better when they were poorer.

Pakistan too for decades had relied on basically two cities (Lahore and Karachi), before the rise of Waqar Younis, and there too there were results.

So don’t think it’s a matter of money but more so how that (little or bigger) money is handled as well more systemic issues (the organization of cricket like departmental and so on, quality of pitches, availability of school cricket, coaching at basic level, you name it! So many things outside money!)

India because of its population and liberal economy since the 90s has become a convenient excuse to basically to not do anything substantial and systemic in terms of transformational reforms.

This is a very underrated point. PCB and its systems have likely degraded since.

 

[Local.Dada]

Reasons:

1) They have more people than all other Test nations combined. Population of 1.4-billion+. It means they have more players to choose from.

2) They have more landmass which means they can have more cricket grounds. British Empire allocated them too much land instead of balkanizing more.

3) They tend to rip off other boards. For example, they don't allow their players to play in other leagues but accept foreign players in IPL. That's a ripoff.

4) They have hijacked ICC and get all sorts of preferential treatments. They can get away with almost anything. They feel they can do anything without consequences.

By that logic Pak and Bangla should be the no.2 and no.3 teams in the world

 

[JaDed]

There are lot of things honestly, IPL is probably the best thing that happened to Indian cricket.. Abhishek in his latest interview talked about Yuvi and even Shikhar Dhawan helping him stuff.

 

[Sir Alex]

For every Manish Pandey who made his 60, there are hundreds who fell out of the system. Unfortunately, all the money in Indian cricket is still pretty unevenly distributed. There are probably 5000 young men and maybe 200 young women who can actually make a full time living from cricket. Think of the millions who try.

For a sport that generates upwards of a couple of billion USD, that's too few in my opinion. Money needs to be spread more agressively around the Indian cricket system. The BCCI seems to be happy sitting on it's reserves and hoping things take care of themselves.

This is a misinformed post with no understanding of how cricket in India works and how if has come a long way in the last couple of decades. Especially the last one.

BCCI is trying to expand cricket to all possibl corners. It was among the first board to mandate equal pay for men and women cricketers. It pumped money into women's cricket and launched a premier product like WIPL that now is not only profitable but also pays women cricketers better packages than male cricketers in the PSL. No wonder we are seeing record turnout for women's games in India now. And also a huge uptick in parents who are enrolling their girls for cricket lessons.

Another example is the substantial improvement in test-only players' packages, so that the best test players still get to earn an IPL level salary. This has energized the confidence of traditional red ball cricketers in the Ranji and lower levels.

Further, the first class remuneration itself was substantially revised upwards. A decent ranji player can now a very good income from just playing domestic cricket alone (30-35 lakhs) and use the remaining period to train and recover, without having to seek side gigs or other employment opportunities to survive.

Lastly, IPL itself has led to formation of a hyper competitive parallel cricketing hierarchy. The first level below it is comprised of state level premier leagues such as TNPL. And below that city level leagues have come up. And all these tournaments are paying a decent amount. Half decent players earn around 5 to 10 lakhs with these tournaments.

And then there are other tournaments such as Buchi Babu etc where players get to earn decent money and be employed pretty much all the year around.

In addition, BCCI also transfers a huge amount of money to the state boards (approx 2000 crores annually). It is also investing in cricketing infrastructure such as the Center of Excellence at Bengaluru which is world class. It also is investing in upskilling coaches around the country with top tier training programs and certifications.

In short, the cricketing ecosystem has become unbelievably big in the last decade and a lot of it is due to sharp efforts by BCCI.

Give credit where due.

 

[Sir Alex]

Money is one thing. You still need motivation and hardwork. At one stage Prithvi shaw was blue eyed boy. Scored a debut Test 100. From that point to not getting picked by any IPL team. Abhishek was a lower middler order batsman in u-19 world cup team led by Prithvi shaw. Look where Abhishek is where Shaw is. In 2018 batch Nagarkoti, Mavi, Porel were ace fast bowlers for India. INdia expected great things from them. But you know who made it out from that batch? Reserve bowler Arshdeep singh.

Yes and also the system does not tolerate players like Shaw just on the basis of "tailunt" alone. Rather, the focus is on behavioral aspects such as discipline, work ethic and commitment to fitness. Shaw thought he could play the "flawed genius" archetype and get away but he was given a brutal wake up call.

Contrast that with someone like Azam Khan, who even made it to a world cup XI for Pakistan !! And we all know how that went. Painfully embarrassing for everyone around.

 

[RexRex]

There are lot of things honestly, IPL is probably the best thing that happened to Indian cricket.

I would say the best thing to happen to Indian cricket was Lalit Modi.

Long before he created the IPL, he brought in a corporate style of governance due to which TV rights money exploded to a huge amount. In the 90s decade, BCCI admins undersold the commercial rights to TV channels in private backroom negotiations while likely taking bribes on the side. That way the TV companies made all the money instead of the players and a few admins got rich.

Lalit brought in transparent open-bidding for the first time in 2006 which made the private TV companies try to outbid each other, thus getting the true market value of Indian cricket.

 

[JaDed]

I would say the best thing to happen to Indian cricket was Lalit Modi.

Long before he created the IPL, he brought in a corporate style of governance due to which TV rights money exploded to a huge amount. In the 90s decade, BCCI admins undersold the commercial rights to TV channels in private backroom negotiations while likely taking bribes on the side. That way the TV companies made all the money instead of the players and a few admins got rich.

Lalit brought in transparent open-bidding for the first time in 2006 which made the private TV companies try to outbid each other, thus getting the true market value of Indian cricket.

He was pretty awesome I give him that, I rather have somewhat corrupt but efficient person than say corrupt and inefficient leader.

 

[AamchiMumbaikar]

true,

but even though they are less in numbers the Rich Pakistanis dont have that interest, they come for shopping and dinners.

you guys LOVE cricket.

Soon the Indian diaspora will dominate cricket in US and eventually Aus too.

My son doesn't play cricket. Many kids are not into cricket in the current gen , soccer/ basket ball/ tennis/ swimming/ badminton is the first preference in urban places. Craze for cricket in particular is not that high now compared to 90s and 2000s

 

[light]

India has been heavily investing on the grassroot level/local coaches for a while now. The fruit has rippen and is for all to see now. Every country can improve their players if they take this step seriously - this is the same reason Aus/Eng/etc has a strong team.

 

[Varun]

I'd go so far as to say - okay, we've reached a certain standing in cricket. Now let's aim for other sports.

Let's make our Olympic tally double digits, for example.

 

[GoUgandaCranes]

I'd go so far as to say - okay, we've reached a certain standing in cricket. Now let's aim for other sports.

Let's make our Olympic tally double digits, for example.

I see that happening within the next 2 Olympic games.

 

[Savak]

India has been heavily investing on the grassroot level/local coaches for a while now. The fruit has rippen and is for all to see now. Every country can improve their players if they take this step seriously - this is the same reason Aus/Eng/etc has a strong team.

Tbh Australia will be in trouble once Steve Smith retires. Australia is already struggling in the top order after Warner retirement. Usman Khawaja too doesn't have much time left and Marnus Labu is no longer the same player, they don't have good replacements.

Will Australia have replacements for Starc, Hazelwood, Cummins, Bolland and Lyon?

 

[Red-Indian]

I'd go so far as to say - okay, we've reached a certain standing in cricket. Now let's aim for other sports.

Let's make our Olympic tally double digits, for example.

Won't be easy. Money brought professionalism in cricket. There's nowhere near that kind on money in Olympic sports to create the groundswell - talent identification at a young age, nationwide coaching programs etc. are needed.

At this point, what we can do if there is enough professionalism (doubtful) is look for those regional hotspots - Wrestling in Haryana, Badminton in AP/Telangana etc. and invest heavily. Continue waiting for that talent out of the blue and ride the coattails to popularise the sport. Anand and Chess are a prime example.

We're not China to be able to force the issue.

 

[Mockingbird]

Reasons:

1) They have more people than all other Test nations combined. Population of 1.4-billion+. It means they have more players to choose from.

2) They have more landmass which means they can have more cricket grounds. British Empire allocated them too much land instead of balkanizing more.

3) They tend to rip off other boards. For example, they don't allow their players to play in other leagues but accept foreign players in IPL. That's a ripoff.

4) They have hijacked ICC and get all sorts of preferential treatments. They can get away with almost anything. They feel they can do anything without consequences.

Sigh, here we go again - Sweepy regurgitating and crying over the same stuff (how India is a villain for controlling its players and ICC) + a new one (we were given too much land by the Brits - first time ever came across that, so well done!), without ever acknowledging the fact that India earns 90% of the world cricket revenue and props up ICC and world cricket.

Sweepy bro, life is unfair. And I do really get it - why cry just over the spilled milk, when you can cry over the cow, the glass, the table, and the idea of milk itself?

 

[light]

Tbh Australia will be in trouble once Steve Smith retires. Australia is already struggling in the top order after Warner retirement. Usman Khawaja too doesn't have much time left and Marnus Labu is no longer the same player, they don't have good replacements.

Will Australia have replacements for Starc, Hazelwood, Cummins, Bolland and Lyon?

You're right. It might also be something to do with interest in cricket declining and is becoming more India-centric. Which definitely doesn't help cricket grow internationally. Apart from the Ashes, Aus/Eng supporters does not pay much attention to cricket unless it's an ICC event and even then.

 

[Red-Indian]

This is a misinformed post with no understanding of how cricket in India works and how if has come a long way in the last couple of decades. Especially the last one.

BCCI is trying to expand cricket to all possibl corners. It was among the first board to mandate equal pay for men and women cricketers. It pumped money into women's cricket and launched a premier product like WIPL that now is not only profitable but also pays women cricketers better packages than male cricketers in the PSL. No wonder we are seeing record turnout for women's games in India now. And also a huge uptick in parents who are enrolling their girls for cricket lessons.

Another example is the substantial improvement in test-only players' packages, so that the best test players still get to earn an IPL level salary. This has energized the confidence of traditional red ball cricketers in the Ranji and lower levels.

Further, the first class remuneration itself was substantially revised upwards. A decent ranji player can now a very good income from just playing domestic cricket alone (30-35 lakhs) and use the remaining period to train and recover, without having to seek side gigs or other employment opportunities to survive.

Lastly, IPL itself has led to formation of a hyper competitive parallel cricketing hierarchy. The first level below it is comprised of state level premier leagues such as TNPL. And below that city level leagues have come up. And all these tournaments are paying a decent amount. Half decent players earn around 5 to 10 lakhs with these tournaments.

And then there are other tournaments such as Buchi Babu etc where players get to earn decent money and be employed pretty much all the year around.

In addition, BCCI also transfers a huge amount of money to the state boards (approx 2000 crores annually). It is also investing in cricketing infrastructure such as the Center of Excellence at Bengaluru which is world class. It also is investing in upskilling coaches around the country with top tier training programs and certifications.

In short, the cricketing ecosystem has become unbelievably big in the last decade and a lot of it is due to sharp efforts by BCCI.

Give credit where due.

Sorry didn't format correctly

 

[Red-Indian]

I'm afraid you're the one who's misinformed. I'm not denying the BCCI has done some good work. However, if you really want to know how much money the BCCI is making and what it's doing with it, you'll have to go into it's Financial Statements. The year ending March 2025 hasn't been published on the website yet but here's an extract from the 2023-24 Income Statement

All number in Rs. Crores



To put it simply, the BCCI made Rs.9,742 Crores in income, spent Rs.1,704 Crores, paid tax (under protest) of Rs. 3,150 Crores and added close to Rs.5000 crores to it's reserves taking cash balances from Rs.16,500 crores in the previous year to close to Rs.21,000 crores. Close to $2.5 billion in cash reserves!

Am I really to believe that there is no way for the BCCI to spend more than 20% of it's income? Nothing can be done to enhance pay and expand the number of players earning an income at the next level? We can't invest in upgrading our stadiums?

 

[amvbfm]

Something I posted in another thread about my opinion on the rise of Indian cricket:

-Largest country by population in the world
-Fanatical love for cricket
-One of the most valuable sporting brands in the world plus a lot more investment in the game overall
-Low per capita GDP and income inequality

Add all the factors above and you have a perfect recipe for an assembly line of world class talent. In India, cricket is not just a game its a way of life, a way to radically transform lives. There are countless stories of how cricketers playing in IPL have had their lives utterly transformed by the game and that inspires the millions of youngsters playing cricket in gullies and mohallas around the country. And scouting and finding talent is not the end of it. Professional cricket is no more just a game where raw talent alone will win you matches. The rise of IPL has ensured that investment has trickled down to all levels of the cricketing infrastructure resulting in better scouting and development of talent. The real success is not as much in identifying the talent as in grooming that talent and hardening it both physically and mentally for the rigors of league and international cricket.

Conversely, in Pakistan, while still a popular pastime, the game does not enjoy as much popularity amongst the youth as it used to in the last few decades. Infrastructure which was already shambolic has declined further, the domestic game has been modeled and remodeled so many times in line with the whims of those in power that standards have plummeted and gulf between domestics and internationals has widened irredeemably. Not to say that the country does not and will not produce talent. Producing 11 world class players from a population of 250 million is not the issue. The issue is how that talent is groomed and what opportunities they are given to develop not just their cricketing skills but also their minds.

For all you know Pakistan could reach the finals next week and trounce India. But play 10 games and it is highly likely that India will beat Pakistan 8 or 9 times because you cannot consistently compete with a cricketing culture grounded in professionalism and buoyed by massive investment with one that almost borders on the amateur. All this is not to say that there are no problems in the Indian infrastructure, no corruption or nepotism. Far from it. But when you have a system producing hundreds of options each equally good (solid arguments could be made about how Jaiswal and Rinku should play, or how a host of other players should be in the squad) the effect of those negative factors is diluted. And that system is the root of India's success.

 

[harshjoshi87]

Tbh Australia will be in trouble once Steve Smith retires. Australia is already struggling in the top order after Warner retirement. Usman Khawaja too doesn't have much time left and Marnus Labu is no longer the same player, they don't have good replacements.

Will Australia have replacements for Starc, Hazelwood, Cummins, Bolland and Lyon?

Australia will struggle for a while after Smith-Starc-Lyon-Hazelwood-Cummins, but they will eventually have the players who would dominate. There is an Ashes series for them & England which either team can't afford to lose.

 

[Vikram1989]

Lalit brought in transparent open-bidding for the first time in 2006 which made the private TV companies try to outbid each other, thus getting the true market value of Indian cricket.

On top of it former Bcci / Pepsi ceo johri showed how to enhance it. He segregated digital and TV deals. He reduced the 10 years rights time frame to 5 years suggesting 10 years is too high in the current volatile market.I daresay he showed the value of a hardened financial executive experience instead of illetarte bcci power hungry clowns. Bcci should employ such executives for financial services.

 

[adi_62941]

I think they have invested a lot in their domestic cricket and the overall management of cricket in India.

The coaches are selected on merit and then inducted into the national side based on performance.

What I like the most is that they are hiring only local coaches for the national team, as it helps build a strong understanding between players and coaches.

They have also depoliticized the Indian team (although, historically, they rarely had political issues despite being such a culturally diverse team).

The IPL has finally started to bear fruit for the Indian national side.

Most importantly, India is currently enjoying a golden era. Winning two ICC trophies back-to-back and narrowly losing one final (despite being unbeaten throughout the tournament) is a remarkable achievement that no other Asian side has ever managed. The BCCI has started making the right decisions at the right time.

Lastly, the overall condition of India as a country has improved drastically over the past two decades, giving them an edge in almost every field. They have also moved past the colonial-era inferiority complex.

 

[Sachin fan]

Pakistan have plenty of physically strong people in rural areas just like India

A country that won the javelin throw in Olympics will definitely have strong people.

Matter of finding and nurturing it.

Problem with Pakistan is that they neglect first class cricket

All youngster beauties only want to play t20 which gives access to easy money.

Develop skills in first class cricket and then work on power hitting. Get the fundamentals right. Everything else will fall in place once you are technically strong. It’s not that the players don’t have power. Yes some parchi selections don’t help but there are plenty of strong players in Pakistan domestic league I am sure. They just lack the technique and the timing/reflex needed for power hitting.

Nah, weightlifting, shot put, wrestling etc require way more strength and inda leave Pakistan in th dust there.

And most of our asian champions in these sports are from very poor backgrounds

 

[saimayubera]

Tilak, Abhishek, Rana, Arshdeep from the AC side are playing vs Aus A today.

The hustle never stops.

 

[saimayubera]

Nah, weightlifting, shot put, wrestling etc require way more strength and inda leave Pakistan in th dust there.

And most of our asian champions in these sports are from very poor backgrounds

India still richer than Pak and has better infra tbh. They might be poor but aren't as poor as Pakistanis and still go through the Indian system.

 

[Sachin fan]

India still richer than Pak and has better infra tbh. They might be poor but aren't as poor as Pakistanis and still go through the Indian system.

While true, we have been dominating those sports in asia since the 70s and till 90s we were very poor, Pakistan was better off.

Then Zia happened and rest is history about how Pakistan got radicalized and went backwards.

Bangladesh is going through a similar radicalisation lately and likely to go in same direction.

 

[saimayubera]

While true, we have been dominating those sports in asia since the 70s and till 90s we were very poor, Pakistan was better off.

Then Zia happened and rest is history about how Pakistan got radicalized and went backwards.

Bangladesh is going through a similar radicalisation lately and likely to go in same direction.

That's true as well.

 

[kron]

Nah, weightlifting, shot put, wrestling etc require way more strength and inda leave Pakistan in th dust there.

And most of our asian champions in these sports are from very poor backgrounds

Not saying India or Pakistan are better than each other

All I am saying is both countries have plenty of physically strong guys. Check most farmers and construction workers and village ones they are all built like tanks

 

[Mirpuri Don]

Not saying India or Pakistan are better than each other

All I am saying is both countries have plenty of physically strong guys. Check most farmers and construction workers and village ones they are all built like tanks

British Pakistanis are a good case : they’re 1/100 of Pakistan’s population and weren’t selected on the basis of their genetics nor wealth (in fact they’re of poorer/rural background like most), yet they’ve been doing good in a sport as physical and as competitive as pro boxing, of course Amir Khan but also Hamzah Sheeraz and Adam Azim who are both in the top 10 p-to-p (I think Hamza is No. 1 even) with dozens of other upcoming prospects.

A bit like India and chess with Anand, Amir Khan had launched a pro boxing enthusiasm among kinds and you get the fruits now but thing is UK has all the facilities, in Pak the potential Amir Khan’s would never even think of boxing let alone become world champions in it.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Not saying India or Pakistan are better than each other

All I am saying is both countries have plenty of physically strong guys. Check most farmers and construction workers and village ones they are all built like tanks

Difficult translating that type of strength into the explosive strength required for sports/athletics.

But overall you are right, lack of power hitting isn't just a strength issue, it's a cricketing issue.

 

[Savak]

Australia will struggle for a while after Smith-Starc-Lyon-Hazelwood-Cummins, but they will eventually have the players who would dominate. There is an Ashes series for them & England which either team can't afford to lose.

I am not entirely convinced. In the last 10-15 years, there has been too much focus in Australian domestic cricket on the Big Bash, the quality of their sheffield cricket or Pura Cup has not been the same, the Australians struggle to now produce technically correct all conditions batters who can perform in all conditions and are now producing T-20 hacks. India beat Australia twice in the last 3 test series in Australia. Heck a weak poor side like Pakistan beat Australia 2-1 in the ODI series in 2024 and could have won the series 3-0. These are alarming signs for Australian Cricket.

 

[Savak]

Something I posted in another thread about my opinion on the rise of Indian cricket:

-Largest country by population in the world
-Fanatical love for cricket
-One of the most valuable sporting brands in the world plus a lot more investment in the game overall
-Low per capita GDP and income inequality

Add all the factors above and you have a perfect recipe for an assembly line of world class talent. In India, cricket is not just a game its a way of life, a way to radically transform lives. There are countless stories of how cricketers playing in IPL have had their lives utterly transformed by the game and that inspires the millions of youngsters playing cricket in gullies and mohallas around the country. And scouting and finding talent is not the end of it. Professional cricket is no more just a game where raw talent alone will win you matches. The rise of IPL has ensured that investment has trickled down to all levels of the cricketing infrastructure resulting in better scouting and development of talent. The real success is not as much in identifying the talent as in grooming that talent and hardening it both physically and mentally for the rigors of league and international cricket.

Conversely, in Pakistan, while still a popular pastime, the game does not enjoy as much popularity amongst the youth as it used to in the last few decades. Infrastructure which was already shambolic has declined further, the domestic game has been modeled and remodeled so many times in line with the whims of those in power that standards have plummeted and gulf between domestics and internationals has widened irredeemably. Not to say that the country does not and will not produce talent. Producing 11 world class players from a population of 250 million is not the issue. The issue is how that talent is groomed and what opportunities they are given to develop not just their cricketing skills but also their minds.

For all you know Pakistan could reach the finals next week and trounce India. But play 10 games and it is highly likely that India will beat Pakistan 8 or 9 times because you cannot consistently compete with a cricketing culture grounded in professionalism and buoyed by massive investment with one that almost borders on the amateur. All this is not to say that there are no problems in the Indian infrastructure, no corruption or nepotism. Far from it. But when you have a system producing hundreds of options each equally good (solid arguments could be made about how Jaiswal and Rinku should play, or how a host of other players should be in the squad) the effect of those negative factors is diluted. And that system is the root of India's success.

I would say the decline in cricket fandom in Pakistan is linked with the abscence of marquee victories or an Indo Pakistan series and the abscence of international cricket of quality from Pakistan from 2009 to 2020 did not help matters either. Even before 2009, the war on terror in 2001 meant teams like England, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa became hessitant to tour us consistently.

I can't think of many signature wins by the team for a long time, when was the last time the Pakistani team won a test series in England, New Zealand, South Africa or Australia. Apart from the 2009 T-20 WC or the ICC Champions Trophy in 2017, the team has badly under delivered and our players have not consistently performed to become global super stars. When the team won the 2009 T-20 WC and the 2017 CT, the fans came out in millions to greet and celebrate the players. There is no better way for fans to celebrate than consistent dominant wins against India. These things are all missing right now in Pakistan Cricket which is why the fandom is low.

 

[jnaveen1980]

I would say the decline in cricket fandom in Pakistan is linked with the abscence of marquee victories or an Indo Pakistan series and the abscence of international cricket of quality from Pakistan from 2009 to 2020 did not help matters either. Even before 2009, the war on terror in 2001 meant teams like England, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa became hessitant to tour us consistently.

I can't think of many signature wins by the team for a long time, when was the last time the Pakistani team won a test series in England, New Zealand, South Africa or Australia. Apart from the 2009 T-20 WC or the ICC Champions Trophy in 2017, the team has badly under delivered and our players have not consistently performed to become global super stars. When the team won the 2009 T-20 WC and the 2017 CT, the fans came out in millions to greet and celebrate the players. There is no better way for fans to celebrate than consistent dominant wins against India. These things are all missing right now in Pakistan Cricket which is why the fandom is low.

Australia vs India rivalrly played a good role in India setting their standard higher and higher. It is bound to happen when an ATG team considers your home as a final destination. INdia had stars like Tendulkar, Dravid, Sehag. Australia had Ponting, Mcgrath, Warne. These contests in the early 2000s ( pre-IPL era)really provided enough spark. After 2001 epic series they increased the number of tests between Australia and India. They all lived up to its billing. INdia met Austarlia in 2003 world cup final. Pakistan never developed similar rivalry with any other top nation. They repeatedly got butchered by Australia every time they visited. India went to Australia with thorough preparation each time. South Africa was also a gun team in the 2000s. Pakistan didn't do well against them either. They need to find a new strong rival. THey ain't playing INdia for the foreseeable future.

 

[harshjoshi87]

Australia vs India rivalrly played a good role in India setting their standard higher and higher. It is bound to happen when an ATG team considers your home as a final destination. INdia had stars like Tendulkar, Dravid, Sehag. Australia had Ponting, Mcgrath, Warne. These contests in the early 2000s ( pre-IPL era)really provided enough spark. After 2001 epic series they increased the number of tests between Australia and India. They all lived up to its billing. INdia met Austarlia in 2003 world cup final. Pakistan never developed similar rivalry with any other top nation. They repeatedly got butchered by Australia every time they visited. India went to Australia with thorough preparation each time. South Africa was also a gun team in the 2000s. Pakistan didn't do well against them either. They need to find a new strong rival. THey ain't playing INdia for the foreseeable future.

Yes India-Australia rivalry began in 2001 during that epic series. It came at a time when we stopped playing Pakistan. Australia had dominated everyone home & away only to lose to Ganguly's Indian team. Australia did win in 2004 but Sachin missed 2 of those 4 test matches & rain played spoilsport in Chennai on the 5th day when India needed 180 on the last day with 9 wickets in hand. Australia has never come close to beat India in India since then & we have won 2 out of last 3 series there. Even this year's Sydney test would have gone our way if Bumrah wouldn't have been injured. This rivalry with Australia has also played a role in India becoming #1 team in all formats.

You are right Pakistan should develop that kind of rivalry with other top teams as India-Pakistan bilateral series won't happen in the future too. But I don't see them having that mentality to build a rivalry with other teams as they seem obsessed with India.

 

[harshjoshi87]

I am not entirely convinced. In the last 10-15 years, there has been too much focus in Australian domestic cricket on the Big Bash, the quality of their sheffield cricket or Pura Cup has not been the same, the Australians struggle to now produce technically correct all conditions batters who can perform in all conditions and are now producing T-20 hacks. India beat Australia twice in the last 3 test series in Australia. Heck a weak poor side like Pakistan beat Australia 2-1 in the ODI series in 2024 and could have won the series 3-0. These are alarming signs for Australian Cricket.

I agree with you but Ashes is a prestigious trophy for Australia to lose out on. They will eventually have players who would play tough 5 day cricket & dominate the white ball game. Head was a sitting duck in 2018-19 series vs India, he made a great comeback, so did Cummins after missing out 6-7 years of international cricket. Australia are also the luckiest cricket nation out of all teams, things do go their way most of the time.

 

[amvbfm]

I would say the decline in cricket fandom in Pakistan is linked with the abscence of marquee victories or an Indo Pakistan series and the abscence of international cricket of quality from Pakistan from 2009 to 2020 did not help matters either. Even before 2009, the war on terror in 2001 meant teams like England, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa became hessitant to tour us consistently.

I can't think of many signature wins by the team for a long time, when was the last time the Pakistani team won a test series in England, New Zealand, South Africa or Australia. Apart from the 2009 T-20 WC or the ICC Champions Trophy in 2017, the team has badly under delivered and our players have not consistently performed to become global super stars. When the team won the 2009 T-20 WC and the 2017 CT, the fans came out in millions to greet and celebrate the players. There is no better way for fans to celebrate than consistent dominant wins against India. These things are all missing right now in Pakistan Cricket which is why the fandom is low.

Yes that is a major factor. So is the lack of marquee players. I mean no disrespect but i don't think many young kids would take up cricket to emulate the likes of Misbah, Malik, Hafeez, Azhar or the Akmal brothers. They were all good players but the team in the late 80s, 90s and even the early 2000s was a totally different breed. The departure of the last players of the golden generation of the 90s coincided with the 2009 terror attack closely followed by the fiasco in England and it was all too much for an already crumbling setup. Misbah does deserve credit for restoring the dignity of the team during his tenure but he modeled the team in his image - staid and unremarkable - which was totally the opposite of what the team had been for almost 3 decades.

Also there are a host of socioeconomic and demographic factors that have contributed. The traditional centers of Pakistan cricket aren't producing as many players as they used to. KPK has taken up the slack somewhat but the diversity of talent and characters is sorely missing. In large urban centers interest had already been waning due to lack of facilities, change in lifestyles etc. Today you won't see half as many street games in any major city as as you would have 10-15 years ago. Cricket and sports in general are a generational and communal thing where parents and extended families pass on their interest to their kids and the dip in interest in the last 20 years has affected, and will continue to affect, our talent pool.

And you are right that there is no substitute for winning. Our decline has been so steady and so long that even the most diehard fans have given up. People have stopped watching due to loss of confidence in the team, no marquee victories, no inspiring players etc. But that can change quickly. What can't change quickly, or on its own, and what requires urgent intervention is the overall infrastructure of the game in the country. And that is all that the PCB or any other body can and should do. Their job is to create conditions that revive interest in the game and provide pathways to talented players. Alas, we all know how unlikely that is.

 

[Cryin Out Loud]

In this Asia Cup, India for the first time ever did had the status of the Australia team of 1995-2007, where you are thinking this is the team we cant beat so lets hope for a miracle.

We can go on about their batting talent and spin talent, but thats not the reason why India purely dominates. Its the kind of captains these guys make. Its the think tank that they have which includes their selectors, coaches and the captain. 5 spinners in the champions trophy and everyone was bashing them. I knew for a fact that in UAE these guys will pull it off as you need 5 spinners.

I watched the first IPL, i watched the kind of rubbish Ravindra Jadeja was, but than Dhoni knew how to use that guy and made him into a star.

I have no ego to admit that India is amongst the best side.

My only issue is with their fans, the Indian nationals and now their captain of the T20 team. The fans will defend anything. THey may not be able to afford their needs or wants and would do bhangra over BCCI making 100 carore. They will defend everything wrong their team or countyr does.

Look at the post above, the poster @Sachin fan still doesnt understand what i am trying to say, becuase they think critisizng their teams or countryes issue is being anti national.

No fan in the world celebrates their sports board making 100 carore, even if you are a liverpool or Man U fan. Infact, such fans would start questioning their sports board that why arnt they getting that money in terms of better parking or better stadium experience.

Their captain has start to bring his stupid nationalism to the game, which is why their team willl always lack any respect on this forum.

Great team, but a pathetic and stupid group of supporters with an now equally jahil captain.

Not sure I agree with you entirely - the Indian fan behaviour you speak of is basically the essence of nationalism the world over. its like some obese guy sitting in Arkansas taking pride in the US Military.

While we Indians can go hyper -national, we’re as if bit more vicious when criticising our own. I mean get u to some Virat versus Rohit fan wars and you’ll see.

That said, it was a good post and I wanted to acknowledge that.

 

[Cryin Out Loud]

Having followed Pakistan cricket for four decades plus, and it’s slow decline,
I believe that at heart the PCB, Pakistan players, maybe most Pakistanis for all I know, basically want to be overnight heroes.

They don’t respect the process, they adulate someone who basically becomes an instant star, however fragile the shelf life.

That’s why Fakhar Zaman gets to be a star based on 1/2 standout performances. That’s why Shahid Afridi is thought of as a great.

That’s why you laughed at us Indians when we set up the MRF Pace Academy in 1987. Many Pakistanis refused to believe that the weak, undernourished Indians would ever develop pace bowlers, far less pace bowlers superior to anything Pakistan had to offer.

Over the years you have centres of excellence, world class institutions. But in most spheres (in this case cricket)PCB/ Pakistanis (maybe) don’t believe in investing in process, they don’t believe in the really long term view, the slow accumulation of best practices.

This is in my opinion the essential difference from India and BCCI.

And it’s that PCB or Pakistan or Pakistanis - whoever you want to refer- somehow don’t believe in process.

That’s why you haven’t built an Infosys or TCS in your private sector, process dense organisation employing lakhs iod people.

Cricket - all sport really - is now the end result of processes implemented over years if not decades.

Until Pakistanis respect process and invest in it, this is how it will remain and will probably hey worse.

 

[jnaveen1980]

India under 19 have trounced Australia under 19 both in ODIs and Tests

 

[mominsaigol]

Yes India-Australia rivalry began in 2001 during that epic series. It came at a time when we stopped playing Pakistan. Australia had dominated everyone home & away only to lose to Ganguly's Indian team. Australia did win in 2004 but Sachin missed 2 of those 4 test matches & rain played spoilsport in Chennai on the 5th day when India needed 180 on the last day with 9 wickets in hand. Australia has never come close to beat India in India since then & we have won 2 out of last 3 series there. Even this year's Sydney test would have gone our way if Bumrah wouldn't have been injured. This rivalry with Australia has also played a role in India becoming #1 team in all formats.

You are right Pakistan should develop that kind of rivalry with other top teams as India-Pakistan bilateral series won't happen in the future too. But I don't see them having that mentality to build a rivalry with other teams as they seem obsessed with India.

PK can logically develop a rivalry with NZ. And NZ is willing to play Pakistan on repeat.

But they don't want to for some reason. They dont really care if they lose or not.

I'm sure NZ is the only team in the world that would actually be willing to play a 5 match test series with Pakistan

 

[harshjoshi87]

PK can logically develop a rivalry with NZ. And NZ is willing to play Pakistan on repeat.

But they don't want to for some reason. They dont really care if they lose or not.

I'm sure NZ is the only team in the world that would actually be willing to play a 5 match test series with Pakistan

You are right, New Zealand plays almost every year against Pakistan, so they can develop that rivalry. Pakistan can also develop rivalry with England. They should just find somebody other than India.
The only thing Pakistan has to do is to play tough hard cricket against top teams, rivalries will follow.

 

[mominsaigol]

You are right, New Zealand plays almost every year against Pakistan, so they can develop that rivalry. Pakistan can also develop rivalry with England. They should just find somebody other than India.
The only thing Pakistan has to do is to play tough hard cricket against top teams, rivalries will follow.

England and NZ can be rivals if Pakistan lets go of their ego.

England would love to play a 5 match test series with PK since their desperate to get into wtc final aka a tournament that consistently takes place in their own dem

 

[harshjoshi87]

England and NZ can be rivals if Pakistan lets go of their ego.

England would love to play a 5 match test series with PK since their desperate to get into wtc final aka a tournament that consistently takes place in their own dem

yes for that to happen, Pakistan should first improve their test team. England will be happy to play 5 test matches as they give preference to test cricket over anything. Pakistan should also play minimum 3 test matches against New Zealand & South Africa in every series home & away.

 

[mominsaigol]

yes for that to happen, Pakistan should first improve their test team. England will be happy to play 5 test matches as they give preference to test cricket over anything. Pakistan should also play minimum 3 test matches against New Zealand & South Africa in every series home & away.

Can happen but I doubt it will. Cricket is a dying breed of a sport at this point. Might as well rename it to SENAI cricket. Aka SA, Eng, NZ, Aus, India Cricket.

Its just 5 teams really.

 

[rpant_gabba]

England and NZ can be rivals if Pakistan lets go of their ego.

England would love to play a 5 match test series with PK since their desperate to get into wtc final aka a tournament that consistently takes place in their own dem

Doubt it. They won't even recover cost of the DRS setup and Eng would never tolerate losing money

 

[Vikram1989]

Am mighty impressed with under 19 Indian team after watching the highlights. Right arm pacers are switching to around tge wicket as soon as the lefty batsmen are in.pacers are persistent with their length to let tge batsmen drive.even then they are quite economical.Lower order batsman/pacers can bat with decent technique.they are able to rotate the strike effectively with tail enders and knows exactly what to do for every delivery. Able to take the sledges with non chalance. Fielders are not even letting a sigh of frustration for a dropped catch as though the end result or the opposition doesn't matter.it brought me back the memories of atg Aussies against a hapless opponent.

Suryavanshi, both patels( pacer and leg spinner) are looking for a guaranteed spot in future Indian team .deepesh the pacer is quite good for a 3rd pacer role with good batting and game awareness. He reminds me of aswin's eq and iq.Kundu (wk) really going to make it big .he had a phenomenonal odi series.

 

[harshjoshi87]

Can happen but I doubt it will. Cricket is a dying breed of a sport at this point. Might as well rename it to SENAI cricket. Aka SA, Eng, NZ, Aus, India Cricket.

Its just 5 teams really.

That's the point, if Pakistan doesn't improve in tests, it will always be SENAI teams playing test cricket against each other. West Indies, Sri Lanka & Pakistan should improve their domestic structure to unlock players like other top nations do. These 3 teams need to find players who can deliver in international cricket or else we will only have 5 teams playing test cricket in the future.

 

[mominsaigol]

Doubt it. They won't even recover cost of the DRS setup and Eng would never tolerate losing money

Their 1.3-1.6M Pakistani's in UK with a loyal cricket fan following. They'll get their money's worth in ticket sales quite easily.

 

[mominsaigol]

That's the point, if Pakistan doesn't improve in tests, it will always be SENAI teams playing test cricket against each other. West Indies, Sri Lanka & Pakistan should improve their domestic structure to unlock players like other top nations do. These 3 teams need to find players who can deliver in international cricket or else we will only have 5 teams playing test cricket in the future.

We only have 5 teams playing all formats anyway, the rest are their to fill numbers and time pass

 

[rpant_gabba]

Their 1.3-1.6M Pakistani's in UK with a loyal cricket fan following. They'll get their money's worth in ticket sales quite easily.

Sure. That's why Pak last visited Eng in 2020.

 

[mominsaigol]

Sure. That's why Pak last visited Eng in 2020.

In 2020 it was covid time which is why it was low. Before then the audience was high.

Secondly calm down and stop with tue sarcasm. It is a discussion forumn and some of you push my buttons 24/7 even when I'm not pressing forward

 

[Varun]

In 2020 it was covid time which is why it was low. Before then the audience was high.

Secondly calm down and stop with tue sarcasm. It is a discussion forumn and some of you push my buttons 24/7 even when I'm not pressing forward

People can deploy whatever tactics they want. You are free to revert to ChatGPT if the going gets too touch.

Also, DRS as used above refers to the Decision Review System, not Duckworth Lewis Stern.

 

[GoUgandaCranes]

England and NZ can be rivals if Pakistan lets go of their ego.

England would love to play a 5 match test series with PK since their desperate to get into wtc final aka a tournament that consistently takes place in their own dem

I'll just add some context because I don't think there's much to do with ego over here.

NZ and Pak cannot be a rivalry because there's not enough appetite in terms of the rights market & finances are the thing that dominate cricket. They have played often with each other but both boards do not see a 4-test series as a profitable thing.

England versus Pakistan was a proper bitter rivalry for the longest time but it has mellowed down & is more like a friendship series now where long lost friends come together to hit some ball & reminiscence about the good old days. Beating England in cricket at one time was considered the pinnacle of Pak cricket but now it's just not it. Even some of our most controversial events -- the 2010 spot fixing scandal, forfeiting a match, Shakoor rana incident -- happened against England but even the barmy army has moved beyond these & now when the two teams play, the environment is more jovial than ever and there's a lot of banter involved between both sets of fans.

This is outside the scope of the discussion & may even be wrong so I apologize to the mods before hand; do not know how our rivalry will shape up in the future as racial politics are on the rise in UK but for now it seems like smooth sailing with British dignitaries sitting in the VIP boxes enjoying the matches.

We also have a 4-test series with England planned in the near future & if it goes well, we may play a 5-test match series with them after 1992.

 

[sweep_shot]

India have more people than all other Test nations combined. That helps I guess.

They also have a reasonably big landmass. So, they can build more cricketing infrastructures.

They also don't allow their players to play in other leagues while accepting foreign players to play in IPL. This means other boards can't maximize their revenues but India can.

Finally, India engage in many unethical behaviors due to controlling ICC (for example, scheduling preferences during ICC events).

You add these four factors and you get modern day Indian team. It is the result of a large population and various unethical practices.

 

[harshjoshi87]

We only have 5 teams playing all formats anyway, the rest are their to fill numbers and time pass

Hahaha they need to stand up, play tough hard cricket. Things will improve.

 

[Mockingbird]

I have

I'll just add some context because I don't think there's much to do with ego over here.

NZ and Pak cannot be a rivalry because there's not enough appetite in terms of the rights market & finances are the thing that dominate cricket. They have played often with each other but both boards do not see a 4-test series as a profitable thing.

England versus Pakistan was a proper bitter rivalry for the longest time but it has mellowed down & is more like a friendship series now where long lost friends come together to hit some ball & reminiscence about the good old days. Beating England in cricket at one time was considered the pinnacle of Pak cricket but now it's just not it. Even some of our most controversial events -- the 2010 spot fixing scandal, forfeiting a match, Shakoor rana incident -- happened against England but even the barmy army has moved beyond these & now when the two teams play, the environment is more jovial than ever and there's a lot of banter involved between both sets of fans.

This is outside the scope of the discussion & may even be wrong so I apologize to the mods before hand; do not know how our rivalry will shape up in the future as racial politics are on the rise in UK but for now it seems like smooth sailing with British dignitaries sitting in the VIP boxes enjoying the matches.

We also have a 4-test series with England planned in the near future & if it goes well, we may play a 5-test match series with them after 1992.

Rivalries exist between equals - unfortunately Pak is so behind the big 5, especially in away conditions that nobody considers them a rival anymore. They can be wary of Pakistan because they can still upset you once a while at home, but that’s not rivalry material.

Real rivalry is only between India-Aus, India-Eng, Aus-SA or Aus-Eng. Now those series are spicy and entertaining.

 

[Obaidd]

India have more people than all other Test nations combined. That helps I guess.

They also have a reasonably big landmass. So, they can build more cricketing infrastructures.

They also don't allow their players to play in other leagues while accepting foreign players to play in IPL. This means other boards can't maximize their revenues but India can.

Finally, India engage in many unethical behaviors due to controlling ICC (for example, scheduling preferences during ICC events).

You add these four factors and you get modern day Indian team. It is the result of a large population and various unethical practices.

Just building on this, in my opinion the reasons for India’s ‘success’ are (in no particular order): most eyeballs, richest board, most powerful broadcasters, favorable treatment, stability, talent, and hard work.

 

[sweep_shot]

Just building on this, in my opinion the reasons for India’s ‘success’ are (in no particular order): most eyeballs, richest board, most powerful broadcasters, favorable treatment, stability, talent, and hard work.

You are right.

Anyway, I think all countries have talented players. It is all about nurturing those talents.

Countries like South Africa and NZ probably have better talents than India. But, cricket is not #1 in South Africa or NZ. So, they don't give cricket as much importance as India do I guess.

 

[Justcrazy]

That's the point, if Pakistan doesn't improve in tests, it will always be SENAI teams playing test cricket against each other. West Indies, Sri Lanka & Pakistan should improve their domestic structure to unlock players like other top nations do. These 3 teams need to find players who can deliver in international cricket or else we will only have 5 teams playing test cricket in the future.

How many Tests is Pakistan Playing every year ? I have forgotten last time Pakistan played a three Test match series. Pakistan needs to play at least 12 - 15 Tests a year , even if you have to play 4 of them against Ireland and Afghanistan.

 

[Obaidd]

You are right.

Anyway, I think all countries have talented players. It is all about nurturing those talents.

Countries like South Africa and NZ probably have better talents than India. But, cricket is not #1 in South Africa or NZ. So, they don't give cricket as much importance as India do I guess.

If Aussies gave cricket even a quarter of importance it gets in ind, they won’t even let ind come close.

For example, ind won zero gold medals in summer olympics, would barely register at upcoming winter olympics and won’t qualify even for an expanded 48 team football world cup. Goes on to show where they are really positioned in world sports.

 

[rpant_gabba]

If Aussies gave cricket even a quarter of importance it gets in ind, they won’t even let ind come close.

For example, ind won zero gold medals in summer olympics, would barely register at upcoming winter olympics and won’t qualify even for an expanded 48 team football world cup. Goes on to show where they are really positioned in world sports.

If this not major cope, I don't know what is.

Pak loserdom crown taken over from you birdbrain!

 

[jnaveen1980]

If this not major cope, I don't know what is.

Pak loserdom crown taken over from you birdbrain!

If only Bermuda give 5% more interest they would beat pakistan, bangladesh lol what a strawman logic. 93% of the Aussies follow cricket. Where India's interest in cricket has dropped significantly down to 70% in the recent survey. Not everyone in a country would be following cricket. Before IPL it was probably even less. Now women watch just IPL not internationals.