The Caveat of Mohammad Amir - A Devil's Advocate Picture

[Dr_Bassim]

Just to play the devil's advocate for a change.

I know Amir has been pretty much ordinary.

But I keep saying it could all change at a certain time.

Imagine if Federer didn't pick a racket for 5 years and then played in 4 Grand Slams after 5 years. Do you really think he will be performing at same ability as when he was 5 years ago? Not really. It will take time, for him to reacquire the tricks of trade or even get into the zone.

Similar problems are probably in Amir's mind. Perhaps his body is not ready yet, despite being fast tracked into the team. Perhaps he wants to perform, but his body is not accepting the things he wants to do.

Patience might be the key here, then again, I am not sure, our fans have patience, considering Hafeez might be called up. Yes, the very same Hafeez who people laughed at outside Asia.

Anyhow, more on Hafeez later.

At this point, comparisons with Steyn, Starc or anyone else are foolish. Even considering him as potential ATG is foolish.

And it is also foolish to write him off.

 

[hafizexpress]

Great and accurate post! InShaAllah Australia looks like the right place for him to perform!

 

[Hawkeye]

At this point, comparisons with Steyn, Starc or anyone else are foolish. Even considering him as potential ATG is foolish.

And it is also foolish to write him off.

I don't think anyone is doing any of that here, Dr. saab!

About the comparisons in the past, that were done on his future potential, which is/was very high indeed. You gotta understand.

 

[Suleiman]

Think the comparisons with Steyn, Starc or whoever have subsided for now and pretty much everyone has accepted Amir is not the same Amir of 2010.

Was always against him being fast-tracked, few months in domestic cricket would hardly bring him up to speed off of 5-6 years of absence. Should've played more there including the recent QA trophy.

He has a stint with Essex next so if he fails in Aus, maybe time to take a bit of time off from intl cricket do well at the county circuit and go back to the basics.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

I don't think anyone is doing any of that here, Dr. saab!

About the comparisons in the past, that were done on his future potential, which is/was very high indeed. You gotta understand.

But looking at new Amir, even potential looks rusty.

I could understand the past comparisons 5 years ago. Right. They would have made sense, seeing he had pace, ability to swing it, and was bowling at 145 clicks.

At the moment, he doesn't swing it more than 3 overs or so, pace is in mid 130s, and he looks a shadow of former self.

If anything, if people still say "he is a would-be-potential-ATG" looking at purely only his last 6 months of performance, then it's extremely unfair to others who have outperformed him, but are not considered ATG.

A certain Rabada for example is much better but rarely do you get people to say he is ATG potential or material.

 

[hur rizvi]

He's had enough time now, so rust is not an excuse. 7/8 tests is good enough time to get your confidence back and he certainly seems to have lost it. At present he is an average bowler, but still he makes the team on merit.

 

[marlonbrowndo]

But looking at new Amir, even potential looks rusty.

I could understand the past comparisons 5 years ago. Right. They would have made sense, seeing he had pace, ability to swing it, and was bowling at 145 clicks.

At the moment, he doesn't swing it more than 3 overs or so, pace is in mid 130s, and he looks a shadow of former self.

If anything, if people still say "he is a would-be-potential-ATG" looking at purely only his last 6 months of performance, then it's extremely unfair to others who have outperformed him, but are not considered ATG.

A certain Rabada for example is much better but rarely do you get people to say he is ATG potential or material.

Create an Amir vs Rabada thread right now and you will be proven wrong

 

[kingusama92]

I've said this before, he'll have to adapt to his reduced pace.

He's running in with the mindset of a bowler who bowls 140+, but the ball is coming out at 133 KPH. That's a substantial drop.

He'll have to set batsmen up more than ever before. It's going to take him time but he does have the bowling IQ to do it.

 

[anindo]

I hope he doesn't go the Irfan Pathan way. Cricket needs exciting fast bowlers like the 2010 Amir.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

I've said this before, he'll have to adapt to his reduced pace.

He's running in with the mindset of a bowler who bowls 140+, but the ball is coming out at 133 KPH. That's a substantial drop.

He'll have to set batsmen up more than ever before. It's going to take him time but he does have the bowling IQ to do it.

Why does he have to adapt to reduced pace, though?

He is only 24.

Why can't he go back to 145 clicks even upto 150 clicks?

 

[kingusama92]

Why does he have to adapt to reduced pace, though?

He is only 24.

Why can't he go back to 145 clicks even upto 150 clicks?

Improving his bowling IQ through adapting will be valuable regardless of his pace. If he's able to regain his pace than that's a bonus.

For now, he has to be realistic. He's only getting slower from what I've seen. Amir was quicker six months ago than he is now.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Improving his bowling IQ through adapting will be valuable regardless of his pace. If he's able to regain his pace than that's a bonus.

For now, he has to be realistic. He's only getting slower from what I've seen. Amir was quicker six months ago than he is now.

Unfortunately I believe, one of the main weapons of Amir was his swing at pace.

Once he loses pace, and resorts to intelligence, he becomes another version of Bhuvensh Kumar.

I think Pakistan has many bowlers, who can bowl mid 130s and swing it, perhaps even better than Amir, if that's what we require of him now.

He will have to find a way to up his pace.

At least that's my opinion.

 

[Speedster777]

Amir's fitness is the problem. His second and third spell are not upto the mark and speed has gone down.

 

[Speedster777]

Unfortunately I believe, one of the main weapons of Amir was his swing at pace.

Once he loses pace, and resorts to intelligence, he becomes another version of Bhuvensh Kumar.

I think Pakistan has many bowlers, who can bowl mid 130s and swing it, perhaps even better than Amir, if that's what we require of him now.

He will have to find a way to up his pace.

At least that's my opinion.

Exactly. He has to regain his pace to beat the batsmen.

 

[ShoonyaSifar]

Amir since his return in Jan 2016

Tests - 8 matches, 25 wickets@38, SR of 74
ODIs - 9 matches, 12 wickets@28, SR of 35, ER of 4.7
T20Is- 13 matches, 11 wickets@32, SR of 27, ER of 7

Very good in ODIs, average in T20s and below par in tests. Has had lots of catches dropped off him as well.

Overall, a decent return for someone returning back after a 5 years gap. he still has a decent pace, good action but some technical issues which can be resolved. Its also a little more about self confidence. He needs one math winning performance to get back to his old self.

Yes he hasn't gone onto to take truckloads of wickets as he was expected to but cant blame him for the hype.

 

[Xoib]

I've said this before, he'll have to adapt to his reduced pace.

He's running in with the mindset of a bowler who bowls 140+, but the ball is coming out at 133 KPH. That's a substantial drop.

He'll have to set batsmen up more than ever before. It's going to take him time but he does have the bowling IQ to do it.

He does not need to accept the fact that he's a medium pacer he is till mid 20's with very little wear and tear and no major injury issues infact his peak could be 28-32 due to less wear and tear so he should look to find a way to get the pace back and not accept the fact that he is a trundler now.

 

[Xoib]

First time I saw Amir back after his return I was dissipointed to see his body shape seems during the off period he did no work on his fitness this was the time period where he should have just focused on the fitness and made himself stronger and fitter I think his body is currently unable to take the workload of an international fast bowler.

 

[Junaids]

But looking at new Amir, even potential looks rusty.

I could understand the past comparisons 5 years ago. Right. They would have made sense, seeing he had pace, ability to swing it, and was bowling at 145 clicks.

At the moment, he doesn't swing it more than 3 overs or so, pace is in mid 130s, and he looks a shadow of former self.

If anything, if people still say "he is a would-be-potential-ATG" looking at purely only his last 6 months of performance, then it's extremely unfair to others who have outperformed him, but are not considered ATG.

A certain Rabada for example is much better but rarely do you get people to say he is ATG potential or material.

I'm sorry, but this is just not accurate.

Mohammad Amir always bowled mainly between 133 and 139K in Tests. He was - and still is - quicker in ODI and T20 matches.

I can only see one significant change since his return. The new real-time video-assisted crackdown on running on the wicket means that he now bowls from wider on the crease. That in turn means that he has less scope to get wickets LBW and instead slants it across the right-hander towards the slips.

But he has adapted well to that video crackdown and is creating more slip catching chances than the other two quicks combined. Only for the slips to drop them.

He has 26 wickets in 9 Tests since his return, but also 12 dropped catches of which 10 were simple chances.

He is still by far your best quick bowler.

 

[kingusama92]

I'm sorry, but this is just not accurate.

Mohammad Amir always bowled mainly between 133 and 139K in Tests. He was - and still is - quicker in ODI and T20 matches.

I can only see one significant change since his return. The new real-time video-assisted crackdown on running on the wicket means that he now bowls from wider on the crease. That in turn means that he has less scope to get wickets LBW and instead slants it across the right-hander towards the slips.

But he has adapted well to that video crackdown and is creating more slip catching chances than the other two quicks combined. Only for the slips to drop them.

He has 26 wickets in 9 Tests since his return, but also 12 dropped catches of which 10 were simple chances.

He is still by far your best quick bowler.

I disagree.

I posted a video before of his performance in 2009 against NZ (tests).

Wicket #1: Unrecorded
Wicket #2: 141 KPH
Wicket #3: 132 KPH
Wicket #4: 138 KPH
Wicket #5: 143 KPH
Wicket #6: 142 KPH
Wicket #7: 143 KPH

Those are the ones in the video. For one of the wickets, he set Guptill up with a series of deliveries (142 KPH, 142 KPH, and 143 KPH).

I don't think he even hit 143 KPH in NZ this time around. I might be wrong on that front.

The ENG/AUS tests from 2010 shouldn't be used as a benchmark to describe his pace. He bowled well within himself on that tour to maintain control over the swing.

BUT, I see merit in your point about his positioning at the crease. It's a valid observation and might also be hindering his pace.

 

[Shafi]

If Federer didn't pick a racket for 5 years he will never be same even after 5 years of comeback. That's why Amir will never be same or even close where he was 5 years back.

 

[SandyB]

Unfortunately I believe, one of the main weapons of Amir was his swing at pace.

Once he loses pace, and resorts to intelligence, he becomes another version of Bhuvensh Kumar.

I think Pakistan has many bowlers, who can bowl mid 130s and swing it, perhaps even better than Amir, if that's what we require of him now.

He will have to find a way to up his pace.

At least that's my opinion.

Nice dig at Bhuvi though. The guy has actually increased his pace to the early 140's and has made a strong comeback post injury to the test squad !

 

[ShoonyaSifar]

Nice dig at Bhuvi though. The guy has actually increased his pace to the early 140's and has made a strong comeback post injury to the test squad !

Not really , he can occasionally bowl at 140+ but is more of a 133-134 kmph bowler on an average.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

It's not amir's fault that he was overhyped based on 2-3 good series. Even in OP he is being compared to someone like Federer. Federer didn't become federer after 1 successful year in tennis. Likewise amir's journey has just restarted again. He first has to live upto fans expectations.

He has not taken many wickets but his economy rate is pretty good.

 

[Syed1]

People were expecting Amir to run in and bowl better than Wasim at his peak. Only set themselves up for disappointment.

Amir has done well since his return, nothing breathtaking but well enough. Certainly looks more threatening than Rahat, Imran, Sohail and Wahab even though the wickets column may not suggest that. You actually have to watch the match to see the difference in quality between Amir and the rest of the "fling it and hope for the best" brigade.

 

[Mamoon]

I think the more pertinent point is that was he really that good in the first place or was he made to look like Wasim Akram's successor due to the perfect bowling conditions in England in 2010. Sure he showed promise elsewhere as well, but you have to wonder where he would have been today if he wasn't banned back then.

If Umar Akmal would have been banned alongside him, I'm sure majority of the people would be holding the view that we got robbed of the next Tendulkar or Miandad.

 

[Deewana Mastana]

Have said it a gazillion times before that he lacks proper fitness as he has gone more skinnier than he ever was, no muscle in the legs or upper body and his pace has gone way down than what people expected.

Ofcourse was not expecting him to hit speeds of 145 or more straight back in the first few games he played but if you gradually take a look so far it is going to be nearly a year since he returned to international cricket and still there seems to be that spark missing from his bowling.

His swing he used to be able to get before his ban is not there either to aide him much as he would like it to be.

Catches dropped off his bowling is another issue as most bowlers have had that off their bowling but yes it has played a part in that too.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Progressing just fine. Action refinement will come over time. Albeit inconsistent, his pace was up this series and the previous one. He bowled a couple of spells around 140ks.

In the shorter formats, his pace is not a problem. Consistently clocks 140k+.

 

[Xoib]

I think the more pertinent point is that was he really that good in the first place or was he made to look like Wasim Akram's successor due to the perfect bowling conditions in England in 2010. Sure he showed promise elsewhere as well, but you have to wonder where he would have been today if he wasn't banned back then.

If Umar Akmal would have been banned alongside him, I'm sure majority of the people would be holding the view that we got robbed of the next Tendulkar or Miandad.

He got great bowling condition in NZ and despite the dropped catches he looked below average his quailty and potential was evident even before that English tour even if performance were scattered. The way he ran in and bullied the best batsman of the tournament to set the tone in the 2009 T-20 final in his debut the spell at MCG where he bowled a 145-150 spell non stop for two hours to pick his first fiver on a flat track.

 

[coy0607]

your point would be very valid if Amir was just coming back, the problem is he's been playing cricket for over a year now, and there really hasn't been drastic improvement

the other point is, if Amir needs match practice then maybe he should be getting that in domestic.

The Pakistan International team is not a place for ANY cricketer to use to get back into form. That being said, Amir is still our best fast bowler so he should play, but he's clearly not living up to expectations

 

[Cricketfan no 1]

I think the more pertinent point is that was he really that good in the first place or was he made to look like Wasim Akram's successor due to the perfect bowling conditions in England in 2010. Sure he showed promise elsewhere as well, but you have to wonder where he would have been today if he wasn't banned back then.

If Umar Akmal would have been banned alongside him, I'm sure majority of the people would be holding the view that we got robbed of the next Tendulkar or Miandad.

He sure was good back then, Newzeland had more supporting conditions but he didn't perform like that.The problem is he is not getting the swing consistently whether green pitch or flat pitch

 

[endymion248]

He's had enough time now, so rust is not an excuse. 7/8 tests is good enough time to get your confidence back and he certainly seems to have lost it. At present he is an average bowler, but still he makes the team on merit.

If that were true then a guy of Amir's talent could start playing cricket at 23 and still become a star. We all know how absurd that notion is.

 

[Major]

oh bhai, this needs to stop

When a new domestic player comes in, we dont use such excuses for 3 series.

He should had not been selected for Pakistan in the first place, and now that he has been selected he should be dropped based on his performance. Someone who is performing in Domestic should be bought back in

 

[yasir]

But looking at new Amir, even potential looks rusty.

I could understand the past comparisons 5 years ago. Right. They would have made sense, seeing he had pace, ability to swing it, and was bowling at 145 clicks.

At the moment, he doesn't swing it more than 3 overs or so, pace is in mid 130s, and he looks a shadow of former self.

If anything, if people still say "he is a would-be-potential-ATG" looking at purely only his last 6 months of performance, then it's extremely unfair to others who have outperformed him, but are not considered ATG.

A certain Rabada for example is much better but rarely do you get people to say he is ATG potential or material.

Pace Issue

His pace in test matches has not dropped significantly from 2010 levels. His best performance was back in English summer of 2010, he rarely cross 140 in that whole season in test matches, he was swinging more and late but pace was still in mid 130s...Only in AUS test matches he was bowling 140+, we will see what he does this time... Normally bowlers bowl 5 clicks more in AUS, 130 bowler starts bowling at 135, 135 go unto 140, and 140 to 145... I am expecting Amir to bowl 140 avg and Wahab 145 avg in AUS...

His pace is ODIs and T20 was 140 avg, which is still the case. His effectiveness in those format is somewhat on par with what it was back in 2010... We have seen him bowling 145-150 in T20s, he can crank it up, but don't expect him to bowl 20+ overs a day at 140-145 anytime soon.

Work load is a major issue in test. He has bowled 250+ overs in 8 test since June(less than six months), that's lot of overs. Misbah resort to Amir and Yasir to dry up runs... You cannot be enforcer and run drier at the same time... He is also experimenting less and does not have enough time to fix his seam release issues. Next year schedule is relaxed, he should have more time to fix his issues. I am glad that he got a county contract, best place to fix seam release issues.


Swinging the ball and Seam Up

Swinging the ball is a problem, but not as much as releasing the ball seam up consistently. Well you will be able to swing the ball, if you are able to release the ball seam up on consistent basis, unless he fixes his release, swing will not come back. This is probably where he has lost his effectiveness, this is not an easy thing to do consistently. This is an area where Federer comparison you mention sits well. His release and wrist control is not where it should be, that will take its time. Once he get hang of it, his confidence and pace will be up, he will be more confident in attacking with fuller length...


Reverse Swing

Amir was never really great at reverse swing...Back then his main focus was regular swing, once you develop that then you can experiment with reverse swing. He does little here and there with white ball, but does not looks like that was his core focus. Amir should experiment more with reverse swing and yorkers with white ball. You have to change action a bit to make it more slingy for reverse....

Even Akram started reversing 3/4 years into the team... War was early on reverse swing, because he started off on old ball... Rabada does reverse better, again because he is not really a new ball bowler. Strac was also same case, but he is naturally sling bowler for him reverse swings come natural. Steyn started doing reverse late in the career for same reason, his focus was regular swing early on...

 

[yasir]

oh bhai, this needs to stop

When a new domestic player comes in, we dont use such excuses for 3 series.

He should had not been selected for Pakistan in the first place, and now that he has been selected he should be dropped based on his performance. Someone who is performing in Domestic should be bought back in

His performance is better than any other fast bowler on the team. On what basis you are dropping him?? - Pakistan don't have Strac, Rabada, Anderson in the wings

You can't look at stats alone, must watch the game as well, even on stats he is not far off, despite lots of dropped catches... He is still the best prospect for Pakistan, others are far worse, you got to drop them first.

 

[in_cutter]

Too much focus on Amir like he is the most important member of the side.

 

[ali ray]

He will regain his form and finish with 500 test wickets at 23 average, mark my words

 

[Cricket-passion]

and dropping openers in his early spells consistently is not helping either

 

[Abdullah]

Cue a man of the series performance in aus!!
I think his bowling is coming on ok bar the swing issue which he will work out.
It his batting I am more disappointed with.
We need a couple of 40s from him in aus