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The Mystery of India's Open Defecation Problem

Ronaldo7

Ronaldo7

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I came across a song today:
https://youtu.be/l01AMCBG0Wk

Hilarious

But it showed me that the problem is not whether Indians have toilets or not, the problem is that a lot of Indians don't want to use it.

Look at this:
https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.STA.ODFC.UR.ZS?locations=IN

Nearly 5% of India's URBAN, not rural, population practiced open defecation, in 2017.
5%.

Compare that with Pakistan's 0.03-ish%:

Here's a comparison between the two:
https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.STA.ODFC.UR.ZS?locations=IN-PK

The rural population's open defecation, expectedly, is a lot higher for both.

36% for India
16% for Pakistan.

https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.STA.ODFC.RU.ZS?locations=IN-PK


But my point is that the difference between Pakistan's rural and urban open defecation problem clearly shows that the urban people have access to toilets but the rural not as much. The urban population is making use of the toilets.

But the problem with India seems to be a bit more complicated.
They perhaps have a lot more toilets too but the urban population is not willing to actually go to the toilets to excrete.

They find excreting in the streets perhaps more comforting.

As shown in the video I linked about India's open defecation problem, "take your poo to the loo"
 
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Lame.

It’s very known and hardly new so I doubt you maze thread for any other reason than to make fun
 
I th8nk currently number is around 33% for whole India, current government has bring down lot by making free toilets specially poor North region, but still we have to go long way, hope that in next five years or something it will eradicate
 
Slog said:
Lame.

It’s very known and hardly new so I doubt you maze thread for any other reason than to make fun
Click to expand...

Well, no.

If i wanted to make fun out of this, i'd just say it in a random thread.

I wouldn't waste my time actually making a thread with so many facts and figures.

Did you not read my opening post?

I actually used to think India don't have enough toilets which leads to open defecation but i'm surprised to see that is not the case. They have a lot more toilets than i thought, they just don't use it.

So what part of anything i said is "lame"?

It's a genuine thread so treat is like one.
 
Last edited:
Should have added this in the OP:

P.S.
This thread is not make fun out of Indians. It's a genuine thread. Why are people not using the toilets?
 
Navdeep Srivastava said:
I th8nk currently number is around 33% for whole India, current government has bring down lot by making free toilets specially poor North region, but still we have to go long way, hope that in next five years or something it will eradicate
Click to expand...

Are these toilets you're talking about for the urban areas or the rural?
 
I don't know why India has this problem on a large scale. I don't see this as a major issue in other South Asian countries.
 
The rural folk who migrate to cities are used to doing it in the fields back in their villages. Now you give them toilets as adults, they will not like it. Old habits are not easy to lose.
 
Nowadays villages are cleaner than cities, good roads and drainage system.
 
I am pretty sure even in Pakistan this is an issue in the villages. In fact even in the cities.
 
Well it seems to be coming down. It was more than 90% in 2000.

Good to see Bangladesh eradicating this disgusting practice.
 
MenInG said:
I am pretty sure even in Pakistan this is an issue in the villages. In fact even in the cities.
Click to expand...
It is knew some poor folks with a big family of 13 living in a small house with no toilet so they used their neighbors toilets so there might be some open deification in Pak too but I think its because they have no choice which is different than openly defecating while you have toilets which I think OP is talking about if I am correct
 
Bigboii said:
It is knew some poor folks with a big family of 13 living in a small house with no toilet so they used their neighbors toilets so there might be some open deification in Pak too but I think its because they have no choice which is different than openly defecating while you have toilets which I think OP is talking about if I am correct
Click to expand...
and I was taking about Lahore city so it is our underrated massive problem too
 
Ronaldo7 said:
Are these toilets you're talking about for the urban areas or the rural?
Click to expand...

Mainly rural, as there was around 65 to 70 open defection in rural areas around 2010.
Up and orissa number were even more higher around 80 percent. They have made amore than 200 million free toilet in villages in last 6 years . I am not sure about exact numbers.
I work in Statistics department so I know about lot of scheme, one of many reason of Modi winning rural area is free loan to Farmers and then ask bank to waive loan, my wife is government banker and I think she was scolded from some higher authority that she is giving less loan to farmers.
Giving free LPGvcylinder alongside kit, and then also giving them free money to villagers to make house and another set of funds for toilets, free or cheap ration is been given to every BPL holder.
And there is another money around 6000 free which government give to every farmers and there is old age pension, widow pension to villagers and in some villages free electricity also
Bjp is said to be capitalist party but in last 6 years they given so much money that economy is completely wasted and we middle class person has to pay for their freebie, which screw us and India in longrun
 
MenInG said:
I am pretty sure even in Pakistan this is an issue in the villages. In fact even in the cities.
Click to expand...

I have attached the links to the stats in the first post.

It is a problem in the rural areas (16%) but barely a problem in the urban areas (0.03%)
 
Last edited:
Bigboii said:
It is knew some poor folks with a big family of 13 living in a small house with no toilet so they used their neighbors toilets so there might be some open deification in Pak too but I think its because they have no choice which is different than openly defecating while you have toilets which I think OP is talking about if I am correct
Click to expand...

Correct.

Well at least they're using the neighbour's toilet instead of openly doing it so that's a positive.
 
Navdeep Srivastava said:
Mainly rural, as there was around 65 to 70 open defection in rural areas around 2010.
Up and orissa number were even more higher around 80 percent. They have made amore than 200 million free toilet in villages in last 6 years . I am not sure about exact numbers.
I work in Statistics department so I know about lot of scheme, one of many reason of Modi winning rural area is free loan to Farmers and then ask bank to waive loan, my wife is government banker and I think she was scolded from some higher authority that she is giving less loan to farmers.
Giving free LPGvcylinder alongside kit, and then also giving them free money to villagers to make house and another set of funds for toilets, free or cheap ration is been given to every BPL holder.
And there is another money around 6000 free which government give to every farmers and there is old age pension, widow pension to villagers and in some villages free electricity also
Bjp is said to be capitalist party but in last 6 years they given so much money that economy is completely wasted and we middle class person has to pay for their freebie, which screw us and India in longrun
Click to expand...

Interesting.

Let's hope that the toilet problem solves for the rural population.

But my main concern is that why is the percentage so high for the urban population?
5% is very high for any urban population.

What could be the reason?
 
Ronaldo7 said:
Interesting.

Let's hope that the toilet problem solves for the rural population.

But my main concern is that why is the percentage so high for the urban population?
5% is very high for any urban population.

What could be the reason?
Click to expand...
Very simple slum areas of cities where landlords make room but no toilet or one toilet for 7 or 8 rooms.
Actually for rural area government has again asked to check stats of rural toilets, I check two villages, in first one there was only two toilet in 42 houses( very small village) and in other one which has 14000 population has over 90 percent toilet.
 
Navdeep Srivastava said:
Very simple slum areas of cities where landlords make room but no toilet or one toilet for 7 or 8 rooms.
Actually for rural area government has again asked to check stats of rural toilets, I check two villages, in first one there was only two toilet in 42 houses( very small village) and in other one which has 14000 population has over 90 percent toilet.
Click to expand...

That makes a lot of sense.

Thanks for all the information you've shared on this thread.

Very helpful
 
Remove UP and Bihar stats and the number will go down to almost zero. These two states have this problem.
 
OK up has 45 percent in rural but Bihar has 36 percent in rural, Tamil nadu is surprising factor with 37 percent in rural defection, orissa topped the chart with 50 percent in rural defection
 
I have seen people get off from their cars and take a leak in open when there's a free public toilet 50 meters away.

It's a habit which cannot be changed within this generation, it will take atleast 20-30 years to see a substantial change.
 
Itachi said:
Remove UP and Bihar stats and the number will go down to almost zero. These two states have this problem.
Click to expand...

why do many Indians always mention these 2 states when it comes to development issues India faces? Are they really that backward? I always thought UP had historic centres of education and learning?
 
irfan said:
why do many Indians always mention these 2 states when it comes to development issues India faces? Are they really that backward? I always thought UP had historic centres of education and learning?
Click to expand...
Same
 
It's in Hindu scripture, using toilets is forbidden and are considered impure. We should respect all religions.

j87se32027k41.jpg
 
It's cannonized in Hinduism, pretty much every thing about Indian society can be explained once you read Hindu scripture.
 
I think open defecation in pak is massively underrated we should look at that issue too!
 
Ronaldo7 said:
Don't know about references but here's something interesting:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/thepri...use-a-toilet-than-muslims-in-india/44959/?amp
Click to expand...

Among different communities, one may face an issue more than the other which is very natural (hindu and Muslims in this case).

Financial, social awareness, education, health sector lots of elements work along with it.

But my question was, what were those ancient hindu texts which promoted open defecation? (to the person who made that claim and then talking in a cryptic manner even when asked by MIG)
 
Itachi said:
Among different communities, one may face an issue more than the other which is very natural (hindu and Muslims in this case).

Financial, social awareness, education, health sector lots of elements work along with it.

But my question was, what were those ancient hindu texts which promoted open defecation? (to the person who made that claim and then talking in a cryptic manner even when asked by MIG)
Click to expand...

You should look at the number of people who think open defecation is pure and those who think toilets are unclean.

Compare the hindus numbers with the muslims
 
Ronaldo7 said:
I came across a song today:
https://youtu.be/l01AMCBG0Wk

Hilarious

But it showed me that the problem is not whether Indians have toilets or not, the problem is that a lot of Indians don't want to use it.

Look at this:
https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.STA.ODFC.UR.ZS?locations=IN

Nearly 5% of India's URBAN, not rural, population practiced open defecation, in 2017.
5%.

Compare that with Pakistan's 0.03-ish%:

Here's a comparison between the two:
https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.STA.ODFC.UR.ZS?locations=IN-PK

The rural population's open defecation, expectedly, is a lot higher for both.

36% for India
16% for Pakistan.

https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.STA.ODFC.RU.ZS?locations=IN-PK


But my point is that the difference between Pakistan's rural and urban open defecation problem clearly shows that the urban people have access to toilets but the rural not as much. The urban population is making use of the toilets.

But the problem with India seems to be a bit more complicated.
They perhaps have a lot more toilets too but the urban population is not willing to actually go to the toilets to excrete.

They find excreting in the streets perhaps more comforting.

As shown in the video I linked about India's open defecation problem, "take your poo to the loo"
Click to expand...

Toilets in posh Mumbai apartments are less than 30-40 Sqft and the city has millions living is slums . Can you imagine now why there is this problem in cities as well ? In fact this will be completely eradicated in villages before we do it in cities
 
Ronaldo7 said:
You should look at the number of people who think open defecation is pure and those who think toilets are unclean.

Compare the hindus numbers with the muslims
Click to expand...

You aren't getting my point.

Its different between what some people believe and what the actual ideology/principles dictate.

1. Here, one pper stated that its hinduism which promotes it.

2. What you are saying here is, most hindus do it.

Can you notice the difference between these two statements?
 
Itachi said:
You aren't getting my point.

Its different between what some people believe and what the actual ideology/principles dictate.

1. Here, one pper stated that its hinduism which promotes it.

2. What you are saying here is, most hindus do it.

Can you notice the difference between these two statements?
Click to expand...

If you think about it, you could understand the logic from a Hindu point of view. My understanding has always been that Hindus believe very much in natural cycles, whether astronomy, reincarnation or homeopathy. I could see that those who are very close to nature would feel that defecating in the open is like giving back to nature, after all, other animals all do this too. I know you would often see faeces floating on the holy river Ganges, I imagine that was also part of the life process in eyes of the devoted.
 
Cpt. Rishwat said:
If you think about it, you could understand the logic from a Hindu point of view. My understanding has always been that Hindus believe very much in natural cycles, whether astronomy, reincarnation or homeopathy. I could see that those who are very close to nature would feel that defecating in the open is like giving back to nature, after all, other animals all do this too. I know you would often see faeces floating on the holy river Ganges, I imagine that was also part of the life process in eyes of the devoted.
Click to expand...

One shouldn't explain religious texts (be it quran, bible, or vedas) with logics as logics are knowledge discovered by man whilst scriptures are word of god. Hence, i dont think human explanations are applicable here. (assuming that text exists)
 
Itachi said:
One shouldn't explain religious texts (be it quran, bible, or vedas) with logics as logics are knowledge discovered by man whilst scriptures are word of god. Hence, i dont think human explanations are applicable here. (assuming that text exists)
Click to expand...

To be clear, I am not presenting my views as an explanation, these are just my own musings which I make pretty clear.
 
All the people in this tread are making this complex, while most of time most simplest explanation are real solutions, most of the poor in villages don't have money right now, government is already funding them, number s are down by 70 to 36percent in rural area in last 7 odd years, it will get more down by in next 5 to 10 or may be get to 0 percent
 
Itachi said:
Remove UP and Bihar stats and the number will go down to almost zero. These two states have this problem.
Click to expand...

Lol whenever you point something negative about India why is this the go-to response of almost every Indian PPer. (Don’t know if this response is same in real life but haven’t experienced)

Asides from the obvious question that aren’t these two states part of India, the statement is not even based on truth because other states have equally bad problems as well.
 
Itachi said:
Remove UP and Bihar stats and the number will go down to almost zero. These two states have this problem.
Click to expand...

LOL classic indian response. Take out the most populous states out of any country and the indicators would look different :)) . Also the rest of india isn't even much better in fact I always associate slums and poverty with Mumbai and south India.
 
Pakistanian said:
LOL classic indian response. Take out the most populous states out of any country and the indicators would look different :)) . Also the rest of india isn't even much better in fact I always associate slums and poverty with Mumbai and south India.
Click to expand...

People (both indian and pakistani ppers) are asking about the source of your post where you stated that defecation was according with Indian hindu text.
 
Slog said:
Lol whenever you point something negative about India why is this the go-to response of almost every Indian PPer. (Don’t know if this response is same in real life but haven’t experienced)

Asides from the obvious question that aren’t these two states part of India, the statement is not even based on truth because other states have equally bad problems as well.
Click to expand...

Ask any pakistani pper who have came to india.

Unlike pakistan, India isn't a homogenous country. Once you cross borders, you will see different social construction and hence accordingly different culture including toilet habits.
 
Itachi said:
Ask any pakistani pper who have came to india.

Unlike pakistan, India isn't a homogenous country. Once you cross borders, you will see different social construction and hence accordingly different culture including toilet habits.
Click to expand...

So Pakistan is homogenous? :)))

Pakistan has 4 provinces.
All 4 are quite different in terms of culture.

So how did you come to that conclusion?
 
Squatting in public is the least of India's problems though it looks embarrassing.

More people = More Squatters. 130 billion people cannot all have toilets. Even if Government builds public toilets, it takes one guy who ate too much spicy curry the previous evening to ruin the Toilet for good.

Better let the nature take the blunt of the spicy curry force.
 
Itachi said:
Ask any pakistani pper who have came to india.

Unlike pakistan, India isn't a homogenous country. Once you cross borders, you will see different social construction and hence accordingly different culture including toilet habits.
Click to expand...

there isn't a homogenous country in the world especially in terms of social class and other areas. You guys think you're snowflakes.
 
Literally every country has regional, provincial, social and class diversity lol, it's funny how our indian members think that India is unique and therefore defecating in public is acceptable.
 
troodon said:
Squatting in public is the least of India's problems though it looks embarrassing.

More people = More Squatters. 130 billion people cannot all have toilets. Even if Government builds public toilets, it takes one guy who ate too much spicy curry the previous evening to ruin the Toilet for good.

Better let the nature take the blunt of the spicy curry force.
Click to expand...

I'm surprised to see that China has no such problem but has a billion plus population.
Why?
 
Ronaldo7 said:
I'm surprised to see that China has no such problem but has a billion plus population.
Why?
Click to expand...

Chinese were Squatting not long ago. They turned it around the Communist way. India is a democracy. There may not be 100% freedom of speech in India, but there is 100% freedom to Squat.

China would shoot someone if their police sees someone doing open defecation. The fear is there in people's mind.
 
Itachi said:
Ask any pakistani pper who have came to india.

Unlike pakistan, India isn't a homogenous country. Once you cross borders, you will see different social construction and hence accordingly different culture including toilet habits.
Click to expand...

so if you take out UP and Bihar, India has very few problems? How much would the per capita income go up by you think?
 
Slog said:
so if you take out UP and Bihar, India has very few problems? How much would the per capita income go up by you think?
Click to expand...

Without UP and Bihar, India's population will be reduced by 50 crores :sachin
 
Babu Bhaiya said:
Not denying that open defecation is a big problem in India. But don’t link it with the religion. Manusmirti isn’t a holy book, it was written as code of conduct. Its not even widely accepted. I’m open to know about the other books, if any.
Click to expand...
So what do you think is the reason some indians defecate outside even though they have toilets (that's the point op is trying to make I think)

I personally don't think it has something to do with religion exclusively but at the same time I am confused about why would someone do it outside?

Is it cultural?
 
Bigboii said:
So what do you think is the reason some indians defecate outside even though they have toilets (that's the point op is trying to make I think)

I personally don't think it has something to do with religion exclusively but at the same time I am confused about why would someone do it outside?

Is it cultural?
Click to expand...

Ignorance, Lack of education and awareness about hygiene.

From my interactions and knowledge- In rural India its a cultural thing. People think that Toilets are for women. Men go out in open thinking that eventually it will convert into fertiliser. Farmers take it as an opportunity for early morning walk to go the their lands, relieve themselves and have a look at their crops. Labour class don’t have the facilities yet.

However numbers have significantly reduced in last 8-10 years. Still a long way to go.
 
Ronaldo7 said:
But the problem with India seems to be a bit more complicated.
They perhaps have a lot more toilets too but the urban population is not willing to actually go to the toilets to excrete.

They find excreting in the streets perhaps more comforting.
Click to expand...

They generally excrete in fields. If there is no fields then railway tracks. If anyone sees poop in street then that is basically from cows, dogs, cats, etc not from humans.

Yes, people are not willing to use toilets in India.

1) Poop is kinda unholy in Hinduism for them.They don't want to poop in the house where they pray, eat and sleep. So Toilet inside their campus is strict No from them.

2) Generally a toilet in rural households and urban class workers has to be shared by atleast 6-7 persons. Imagine the condition of toilet and maintenance required for it because of indian spices.
Toilet stinks. Excreting in the open doesn't.

3) People who had done in fields don't enjoy doing that in closed room of 30 square ft toilets. They enjoy the ventilation provided by the nature in the fields while excretion of those spices.
 
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