The ultra-religious and the ultra-liberal. Where is the middle ground?

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Only difference between religion and outdated superstition is the muscle power of institution and masses behind it, otherwise it is as ridiculous as any old myth or superstition...If we don't fight, it will never go away, they are not going to die by themselves...

You are very passionate about fighting religion and I can admire that dedication to your cause, you clearly obsess over this more than most on here. But as you are in the USA now, why not start the fight at home? If the most powerful nation in the world can be shown to reject religion as fairy tales and superstition then it will be a role model for every other nation to follow.

Unfortunately America is still seen as a nation blighted by religious fervour, and that confuses the message we should all be getting. Even if they are just playing lip service to religion, that is something that perhaps other countries could model. But that doesn't seem to be your ideal.

 

[Black Zero]

You sounds like as if that is some sort of immoral thing, we are taking away something valuable, I would argue the contrary, indoctrinating kids with religion is child abuse...Does Atheist, Scientist, Engineers force their 5/7 years old kid to memorize theory of evolution or General Theory of relativity or Bill of Rights or Deceleration of independence or UN Charter?? - Why God is so obsessed with forcing people to have Faith(belief without evidence and understanding) and that too at very young age, not to mention with lot of fear behind it?? - Its wicked and immoral to brain wash little kids...

Hitchens puts it nicely, I don't even wish there to be a God... If there ever be a God, I don't understand why we have to worship him or slave of him?? - I don't get why people get comfort from faith, well people do get comfort from drugs too, but atleast most of them know they are on drugs




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Mr Hitchens is/was not a scholar and it would not far from the truth if I call him close minded, highly opinionated indvidual.

Yes, in certain cases it would be immoral,
Telling mother of a dead child, that there is no afterlife would be immoral.
Placebo effect associated with religion is well known.
And on average religious person lives a happier life.

Now regarding brain washing childern, I am against it, however I am not sure that even without the presence of religion we can shield from brain washing.

In science, generally new evidence helps refine or revise theories, principles or laws, but I am not sure if a child understands this point. Even if he understands that, he does have the pre-requisite knowledge to have the actual insight to scientific theories, laws or principles and child basically believe his teacher or book.

Religion is playing core role in human,s since ages, in one form or other. And it serves several purposes including providing "purpose" to life itself.

Religion is here to stay, so its better to make it more humane.

 

[DW44]

We have seen very recently that there are facts and then the "alternate facts", people are trying to come up with new names for lies... Religious guys have being doing this for long time...Like "Evolution by natural selection" is just a theory...This "Alternate reality" is solid to poor and helpless as religion to control them.

One think I don't like about religion is that it targets the weakest and helpless. Science has hard time fighting it, because Science targets are opposite, it demands lot more work on there part...There are lot of Mcdonalds than whole food chain, Science education is not cheap unfortunately, but religion is made for poor, it has been used as most effective tools to make slaves, well racism, patriotism are other two, they all have same DNA...

In conservative circles(all over the world) there is a new trend, lets taught kids both Science based on evidence and Religion as Science, to make sure religion can survive for an other day, Mcdonald don't want to give up on selling junk, it is so profitable...Muslim cultures have not come to even that level yet, they straight away ban by laws any discussion that challenges foundation of religion... Net result is that society is far more conservative and close minded not to mention poor, that's religion's priority customers...

Purpose of education is not to validate the ignorance but to overcome it, you cannot teach both religion and science as equivalent, to me clash between religion and science is first and far most matter of education... Religion is as much true as any other superstition, we look down upon many of them now...Religion should be viewed by society as another superstition, once they have sufficient proof, I am ok to give them status of facts aka evidence base Science, till then I have no respect for it and I want to fight it like any other ignorant ideology.

Only difference between religion and outdated superstition is the muscle power of institution and masses behind it, otherwise it is as ridiculous as any old myth or superstition...If we don't fight, it will never go away, they are not going to die by themselves...

Quite possibly the greatest post in the history of PP. Those analogies are right on point especially when you compare them to the kind of analogies the other side comes up with(comparing women to lollypops and broken iPhones).

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Mr Hitchens is/was not a scholar and it would not far from the truth if I call him close minded, highly opinionated indvidual.

Yes, in certain cases it would be immoral,
Telling mother of a dead child, that there is no afterlife would be immoral.
Placebo effect associated with religion is well known.
And on average religious person lives a happier life.

Now regarding brain washing childern, I am against it, however I am not sure that even without the presence of religion we can shield from brain washing.

In science, generally new evidence helps refine or revise theories, principles or laws, but I am not sure if a child understands this point. Even if he understands that, he does have the pre-requisite knowledge to have the actual insight to scientific theories, laws or principles and child basically believe his teacher or book.

Religion is playing core role in human,s since ages, in one form or other. And it serves several purposes including providing "purpose" to life itself.

Religion is here to stay, so its better to make it more humane.

Quite likely the greatest post in the history of PP. If only because it reflects the reality of the great nations of the world today who all still pay lip service to religion while keeping it in it's place. This I feel is a far more effective strategy than taking a militant atheistic stance, and that's why I presume the leading nations adopt the inclusive approach.