Waqar Younis - Full marks for lifting a young Pakistan bowling attack

[Hawkeye]

This is probably the most daring and and bold team management in our history. Picking bowling attacks who are mostly teens. Even taking them to Australia on their debut tours.

Naseem was decent in Aus but lacked that polish, accuracy and a bowler's mindset in Aus.

Waqar seems to have done wonders with him. He's now become super good.

Hasnain, even though had pace, lacked accuracy and also an outswinger. He seems to have developed both.

Shaheen was always good, becoming even better.

Today, it's great to see this exciting bowling attack work together on a dead pitch in RWP. Naseem even picking a hat-trick.

Waqar Younis must be given credit for his contributions.

 

[Mueez]

Agree.

He has done some extra bit of polishing with Shaheen and Naseem, which is making them look lethal.

Great work by Waqar!

 

[Titan24]

Shaheen has developed his outswing under him while Naseem is already moving it both ways with decent control. So definitely he is doing a good job. I hope he is sharing his and Wasim’s fitness regimes as well with youngsters as that is the only way they can serve Pak for long.

 

[Mamoon]

Yes, he deserves a 10 year contract after the performance of our bowlers against Bangladesh B.

Why not wait for the upcoming overseas tours? Did we forget what happened in Australia?

Well I don’t blame our fans. They suffer from disappointment and humiliation for 80% of the international calendar, so they have no choice but to get carried away with cheap and soft wins, since that is all they can boast about.

What else should we expect from fans of a mediocre 6th ranked team?

Waqar is an awful coach and this is a mediocre bunch of pace bowlers barring Shaheen.

 

[Azzurri]

Yes, he deserves a 10 year contract after the performance of our bowlers against Bangladesh B.

Why not wait for the upcoming overseas tours? Did we forget what happened in Australia?

Well I don’t blame our fans. They suffer from disappointment and humiliation for 80% of the international calendar, so they have no choice but to get carried away with cheap and soft wins, since that is all they can boast about.

What else should we expect from fans of a mediocre 6th ranked team?

Waqar is an awful coach and this is a mediocre bunch of pace bowlers barring Shaheen.

Well, how about we stick to the present for now, instead of envisaging about the upcoming tours?
The OP is related to recent success and progress made by the young fast bowlers. Their effectiveness in overseas conditions, however, remains to bee seen. But for now, the discussion is all about their progress until this point.

 

[Markhor]

The team management have a very bold youth policy indeed - that Imran Khan and Kashif Bhatti kid have one hell of a future.

Azhar and Shafiq look like promising young guns too. All hail Misbah and Waqar.

 

[Arsal_AK]

I'll wait till the Eng and NZ before singing praises.

 

[Hawkeye]

Agree.

He has done some extra bit of polishing with Shaheen and Naseem, which is making them look lethal.

Great work by Waqar!

Shaheen has developed his outswing under him while Naseem is already moving it both ways with decent control. So definitely he is doing a good job. I hope he is sharing his and Wasim’s fitness regimes as well with youngsters as that is the only way they can serve Pak for long.

Indeed. Both have improved considerably.

Now, Hasnain has the most room to improve - the raw ingredient pace is there. I think he now has some control in swinging it both ways.

 

[Hawkeye]

Yes, he deserves a 10 year contract after the performance of our bowlers against Bangladesh B.

Why not wait for the upcoming overseas tours? Did we forget what happened in Australia?

Well I don’t blame our fans. They suffer from disappointment and humiliation for 80% of the international calendar, so they have no choice but to get carried away with cheap and soft wins, since that is all they can boast about.

What else should we expect from fans of a mediocre 6th ranked team?

Waqar is an awful coach and this is a mediocre bunch of pace bowlers barring Shaheen.

Umm, NZ A team, with their experienced and potent bowling attack, badly failed in AUS. Those tracks are flat highways. A debutant attack cannot be expected to run through sides there.

And it's not about Bangla team. They decimated SL team as well.

It's about the skills, that too on a dead track. They're making the ball talk, which will bring down any team.

Not too long ago we were losing Tests even at home. SL whitewashed us.

That darkness, thankfully, is over. We're becoming dominant at home, like the top Test teams.

 

[pakistanisgreat]

yet there was a thread not long ago where people were bashing Waqar. I believe that was series after Australia.

 

[Brilliance]

The bigger tests are yet to come.

 

[Shafi]

Lets see how our bowlers do against team like England, NZ and S Africa. Can't judge a coach who was a failure in last 3 occasions and got sacked.

 

[Titan24]

Lets see how our bowlers do against team like England, NZ and S Africa. Can't judge a coach who was a failure in last 3 occasions and got sacked.

This is only the 2nd time he is the bowling coach. Head coach which he was twice is a different position altogether with much more on plate than working with the pacers.

 

[shamaan]

People criticising waqar atleast hes given the youngsters a chance something that we dont often do

 

[shah_1]

Youngsters are doing on very flat tracks and Kookaburra balls

They would love England

 

[Manunited18]

Youngsters are doing on very flat tracks and Kookaburra balls

They would love England

Yes definitely

 

[Savak]

Shaheen Afridi looks much improved, how much is Waqar responsible, not sure because Shaheen was already showing signs of improvement before Waqar came along.

Naseem Shah was already a famous hyped domestic talent before Waqar came along.

I didn't see anything special in Hasnain's bowling to feel Waqar has made a massive impact.

Abbass looks to be getting worse day by day, Waqar has certainly failed to help him.

 

[Bewal Express]

Tell will tell, imparting ideas is one thing, whether someone has the intelligence to take it on board, is another matter

 

[MenInG]

Absolutely no room for personal attacks on posters.

 

[Titan24]

Shaheen Afridi looks much improved, how much is Waqar responsible, not sure because Shaheen was already showing signs of improvement before Waqar came along.

There wasnt even a single sign of Shaheen getting the ball into the right handers until Waqar joined the team. If somebody in NCA helped him than thats another matter but under Azhar there was no swing onto the right handers which we started noticing in Aus tour.

 

[Hawkeye]

Youngsters are doing on very flat tracks and Kookaburra balls

They would love England

Yes, exactly.

Not easy at all to make the ball move n talk, like the pace unit did vs. SL and now BD.

Flat track, kookaburra balls.

Dukes ball and ENG should be piece of cake.

 

[Kingpin786]

I think the bigger problem is to sustain performance hasan ali and junaid khan are biggest example

 

[Titan24]

I think the bigger problem is to sustain performance hasan ali and junaid khan are biggest example

Junaid had chronic knee issues. While Hassan will comeback and I guess people often confuse his ODI form with other formats. Even when he was struggling in ODIs he was doing well in tests and T20s. Aside from his height he is pretty skillful and is only out of the team due to injury otherwise he would have been playing for Pak. It shouldnt be a surprise if post PSL he is part of Pak squad again.

Overall I agree that Pak bowlers need to sustain performances for longer durations.

 

[Kingpin786]

Junaid had chronic knee issues. While Hassan will comeback and I guess people often confuse his ODI form with other formats. Even when he was struggling in ODIs he was doing well in tests and T20s. Aside from his height he is pretty skillful and is only out of the team due to injury otherwise he would have been playing for Pak. It shouldnt be a surprise if post PSL he is part of Pak squad again.

Overall I agree that Pak bowlers need to sustain performances for longer durations.

Lets hope for the best

 

[the Great Khan]

Important to highlight the fact they are using the kookaburra which we all hate. If they can get that rock moving then happy days!!

 

[topspin]

Usual hyperbole by this OP but thanks for a bumpable thread.

Waqar Younis was the main reason why Pakistan's bowling was blasted by Ponting during the Australia series. I mean who can forget the selections of Imran Khan and Musa Khan, just a couple of months ago.

Waqar is a poor coach and a failed tactician - his third stint will end in misery.

 

[moghul]

Waqar is a wonderful coach and it is showing. I think Misbah playing his role in selection Musa and IK.

 

[Abdullah]

[MENTION=134608]Hawkeye[/MENTION] -The worst thing about your thread is, is that misbah has admitted to being backed into a corner about having to pick the kids.
He was very very annoyed with amir and wahab for making themselves unavailable.
Take into account he tried to give Imran khan the first go and picked a 30 something year old Kashif bhatti he would have continued his love for the older brigade, and had wahab and amir been available , these guys wouldn't have got a look in.

You will never be ready to admit this. But misbah admitted it himself!!

 

[Mueez]

Indeed. Both have improved considerably.

Now, Hasnain has the most room to improve - the raw ingredient pace is there. I think he now has some control in swinging it both ways.

Hasnain needs a year to fulfill his potential.

But what a fast-bowling trio it would be:

Shaheen
Naseem
Hasnain

Mouthwatering stuff.

 

[Hawkeye]

Important to highlight the fact they are using the kookaburra which we all hate. If they can get that rock moving then happy days!!

Definitely.

For a long time, moving the kookaburra has been the hardest thing for our bowlers.

This unit is giving me some hope. I can see us becoming a top 3 Test side in a few years if Misbah & Waqar continue these dominating performances.

 

[Hawkeye]

Hasnain needs a year to fulfill his potential.

But what a fast-bowling trio it would be:

Shaheen
Naseem
Hasnain

Mouthwatering stuff.

Yes, Hasnain doesn't appear to be ready yet for Test cricket.

 

[Rayyman]

Hasnain needs a year to fulfill his potential.

But what a fast-bowling trio it would be:

Shaheen
Naseem
Hasnain

Mouthwatering stuff.

Yea Hasan Ali and Faheem too. Hopefully this is Abbas’ last good year.

 

[Mueez]

Yea Hasan Ali and Faheem too. Hopefully this is Abbas’ last good year.

I feel Hasan Ali and Faheem Ashraf have to work more on their batting.

They have the talent and they can become the fast-bowling allrounder that we need.

 

[ataullah]

Important to highlight the fact they are using the kookaburra which we all hate. If they can get that rock moving then happy days!!

How do u see Shaheen and Naseem performing in summer against England?

 

[chacha kashmiri]

I feel Hasan Ali and Faheem Ashraf have to work more on their batting.

They have the talent and they can become the fast-bowling allrounder that we need.

and end up like umar gul and rana naved ul hasan
That's the last thing we need

The tail didn't perform in the first Innings but it looks it won't matter

 

[OhTwadi]

Absolutely loved watching the boys in the last half an hour. Looked like Wasim and Waqar operating!

 

[pratiktc]

Can give a pat on back but job is only just beginning.

Good that there is now a first choice promising Test pace core trio. Should work on improving fitness and skillsets of Shaheen and Naseem.

Suggest to also rest/rotate Shaheen from ODIs/T20Is while likes of Hasnain/Rauf are inducted in the same alongside attack leader Amir.

Rehabilitation of Hasan is also key priority

 

[the Great Khan]

How do u see Shaheen and Naseem performing in summer against England?

I think shaheen should do well in England with the dukes ball and his line and lengths are suited for that part of the world. I also see abbas doing ok too. Naseem I dont see getting too many wickets but his pace should rattle the pampered posh boys. He will find it a bit hard in the start as he has never bowled in england while the others have. Our problem will be the bowling allrounder as you need one in england inmho.

 

[the Great Khan]

Can give a pat on back but job is only just beginning.

Good that there is now a first choice promising Test pace core trio. Should work on improving fitness and skillsets of Shaheen and Naseem.

Suggest to also rest/rotate Shaheen from ODIs/T20Is while likes of Hasnain/Rauf are inducted in the same alongside attack leader Amir.

Rehabilitation of Hasan is also key priority

I dont think shaheen should play too much ODI cricket as the world cup is far away..we should preserve him..try out some new bowlers..

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

England and New Zealand will determine the quality of this attack. Failing in Australia can be forgiven. Even the best Pakistani attacks have done poorly in Australia. But England and New Zealand will offer wickets conductive to swing, seam and pace so I'll be interested in seeing how they do there.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

I dont think shaheen should play too much ODI cricket as the world cup is far away..we should preserve him..try out some new bowlers..

If we want Shaheen to be mentioned in the same breath as Cummins, Archer, Bumrah & Rabada one day, he has to play all the formats.

 

[Third Man]

There wasnt even a single sign of Shaheen getting the ball into the right handers until Waqar joined the team. If somebody in NCA helped him than thats another matter but under Azhar there was no swing onto the right handers which we started noticing in Aus tour.

Oh, come on. Shaheen has done that way before that. Remember that PSL match in which he got K. Akmal bowled with an inswinging yorker and was regularly beating Umar Amin outside his off stump. He's been working on that delivery for a long time now.

That said, I'm not implying that Waqar hasn't been useful to their development.

 

[Titan24]

Oh, come on. Shaheen has done that way before that. Remember that PSL match in which he got K. Akmal bowled with an inswinging yorker and was regularly beating Umar Amin outside his off stump. He's been working on that delivery for a long time now.

That said, I'm not implying that Waqar hasn't been useful to their development.

You are correct. He showed that in swing in PSL on occasions and I should have mentioned international cricket as he wasnt able to execute that at international level with much confidence before. If you look at Eng series before WC and WC he wasnt getting much shape but now he is doing that much more consistently and with control. He is now bringing the ball in or pushing it away at will and consistently.

Even Hassan Ali was looking like a gem in PSL 2019 with that Banana in swing going but as he joined Pak squad post that somehow everything was gone. I am not trying to blame Azhar here but something was definitely off.

 

[sindhiboy]

Hasnain needs a year to fulfill his potential.

But what a fast-bowling trio it would be:

Shaheen
Naseem
Hasnain

Mouthwatering stuff.

besides the fact hasnain needs atleast another 2-3 years of development, his addition will make the bowling too redundant.

sameen gul is a much better prospect, he swings the ball and hits very good lines and lengths. if waqar can develop sameen somehow, that would make a trio more lethal than the aussie bowlers.

 

[Sir-fraz]

Ive seen these thread so many times over the past decade of following PP.

It always comes from posters who dont understand cricket or are fans of certain players or coaches.

Waqar is a TTF. We will see when we face better opposition

 

[BoomBoomCricket]

Australia were 580 all out in Brisbane in November.
Australia were 589-3 in Adelaide in December.

Lets not get carried away lads.

When it mattered in a country where good fast bowling performances are key, the attack was toothless in the country where Waqar Younis now resides.

It was humiliating to watch.

 

[Pete Rose]

Will withhold judgement till tougher tours. But he has certainly done what should have been so far at home.

 

[the Great Khan]

Australia were 580 all out in Brisbane in November.
Australia were 589-3 in Adelaide in December.

Lets not get carried away lads.

When it mattered in a country where good fast bowling performances are key, the attack was toothless in the country where Waqar Younis now resides.

It was humiliating to watch.

Shaheen's first series in Aus, Naseems first in Aus, Musa's first series..that attack was as raw as a steak from the butchers. The more experienced NZ attack was destroyed and I suspect England India and others may experience the same in the future..wait till you see what they do to SA..

Lets give Waqar some time..also we only visit Aus every four years so we just never get used to the conditions..we really ened to send our youngsters to aus on long placements and apprenticeships..

At this moment in time Waqar is doing his job well..

 

[Slog]

Waqar is Doing a great job and you can see significant improvement in quality of the bowling.

 

[Hasan123]

It's difficult to trust a coaching team of Misbah and Waqar when it comes to development. It will be better to judge them when they were playing a higher quality of opposition anyway.

 

[Hawkeye]

It's difficult to trust a coaching team of Misbah and Waqar when it comes to development. It will be better to judge them when they were playing a higher quality of opposition anyway.

Yes, and the pathetic time we had under Mickey Arthur can be praised and trusted.

Of course, if you have favorites or an agenda, then you can't appreciate the good results.

 

[kk1992]

This time around Waqar has an advantage, Pakistan gets to play their home games in Pakistan.

Pakistan will not turn in to world beating team over night but playing home games at home will definitely help the players an the coach.

 

[zulfiqar]

It's so hard to figure out who to credit here but yes Shaheen is improving for sure! The rest of the guys I can't say much about - we need way more sample size.

 

[Sherlock]

Absolutely. I've criticised Waqar as a coach of the national side, but have been reluctant to be equally critical of his bowling coach stint because we've seen him get results from the bowlers.

I like how the bowlers are getting the swing back in their bowling. A bowler without seam/swing is useless in the longer format, and it doesn't matter how quick they are.

But they'll be games where the bowlers don't do the job and the knives will be out for Waqar. That's just the way out fanbase is unfortunately.

 

[Saj]

Hasnain looking better
Shaheen looking better
Naseem looking better
Abbas looking confident again

Can't argue about that.

 

[Hasan123]

Yes, and the pathetic time we had under Mickey Arthur can be praised and trusted.

Of course, if you have favorites or an agenda, then you can't appreciate the good results.

This is nothing to do with Mickey.

Your the 1 with an agenda. You praise Misbah for just breathing and question anyone who dares to have a different opinion from you.

When things go wrong you'll blame everyone except your precious Misbah. Waqar and Misbah have a pathetic record in terms of development. If you can't see that than there is only 1 person with an agenda.

Your problem is you only see things from Misbah point of view.

 

[Titan24]

Hasnain looking better
Shaheen looking better
Naseem looking better
Abbas looking confident again

Can't argue about that.

Exactly. There is progress and that is what one wants to see, consistency will come with time and more matches for the young bowlers but they seem to be improving which is important at this stage.

 

[Savak]

Hasnain looking better
Shaheen looking better
Naseem looking better
Abbas looking confident again

Can't argue about that.

Abbas looks a shell of himself, he is like the Zulfiqar Babar in the line up. Too early to say anything on Hasnain, yes Shaheen and Naseem look better.

 

[aloo paratha]

Abbas looks a shell of himself, he is like the Zulfiqar Babar in the line up. Too early to say anything on Hasnain, yes Shaheen and Naseem look better.

Abbas just took 3/52 in the test match, after bowling 35 overs... Average of 17, economy less than 2...

 

[Blistering Barnacle]

I'm willing to accept the premise of this thread, if the OP is willing to accept in return that Waqar was terrible in Aus.

 

[topspin]

This is nothing to do with Mickey.

Your the 1 with an agenda. You praise Misbah for just breathing and question anyone who dares to have a different opinion from you.

When things go wrong you'll blame everyone except your precious Misbah. Waqar and Misbah have a pathetic record in terms of development. If you can't see that than there is only 1 person with an agenda.

Your problem is you only see things from Misbah point of view.

Lol the irony when he accuses someone else of holding an agenda when he's the most agenda driven poster on PP.

Indeed, the Misbah-Waqar duo have a pathetic record of developing players and this was very much evident Post 2011 WC up until the 2015 WC.

[MENTION=134608]Hawkeye[/MENTION] how do you justify the selections of Musa and Imran Khan for the recently concluded Australia tour?

 

[HappyWarsFan]

Lol the irony when he accuses someone else of holding an agenda when he's the most agenda driven poster on PP.

Indeed, the Misbah-Waqar duo have a pathetic record of developing players and this was very much evident Post 2011 WC up until the 2015 WC.

[MENTION=134608]Hawkeye[/MENTION] how do you justify the selections of Musa and Imran Khan for the recently concluded Australia tour?

Even as a Misbah fan I really don't like how he keeps giving musa and IK chances in the squad. They are terrible selections for sure and I'd pick Ehsan and sameen in their place. Also don't agree with his choice of spinner (Bilal) and batsmen (Haris over fawad???) . I do like most of his selections though, like picking Abid Ali, Naseem, Rizwan, etc.

Also his tactics I feel a lot suited for winning in Asia.

 

[topspin]

Even as a Misbah fan I really don't like how he keeps giving musa and IK chances in the squad. They are terrible selections for sure and I'd pick Ehsan and sameen in their place. Also don't agree with his choice of spinner (Bilal) and batsmen (Haris over fawad???) . I do like most of his selections though, like picking Abid Ali, Naseem, Rizwan, etc.

Also his tactics I feel a lot suited for winning in Asia.

It was a no brainer for Ehsan Adil and Sameen Gul to have been the two bowlers given the nod over TTF Imran Khan and Musa, who averaged 45-50 in the last season of FC cricket.

Fawad Alam deserves to play the second test at the very least.

I'll give credit to Misbah for persisting with Shan Masood. He's easily Pakistan's best opener in red ball cricket. I know Abid Ali has started his test career with a bang but I cannot see him average 38-40 in both Australia and South Africa like his opening partner did over the last 12 months because of his faltering technique.

If Misbah wants to be successful in Asia, he will need to drop Yasir Shah sooner rather than later. The best option would be to replace him with Zafar Gohar.

 

[Hasan123]

Lol the irony when he accuses someone else of holding an agenda when he's the most agenda driven poster on PP.

Indeed, the Misbah-Waqar duo have a pathetic record of developing players and this was very much evident Post 2011 WC up until the 2015 WC.

[MENTION=134608]Hawkeye[/MENTION] how do you justify the selections of Musa and Imran Khan for the recently concluded Australia tour?

I like Misbah but I won't blindly defend him . In fact when it comes to developing and managing talent I would never trust him with that.