Western standards of human rights do not apply to India, says Home Minister Amit Shah

[Lonewarrior]

He said that the human rights violations perpetrated by militants and Maoist groups should be viewed ‘with an Indian outlook’.

https://scroll.in/latest/940344/western-standards-of-human-rights-do-not-apply-to-india-says-home-minister-amit-shah

 

[SensiblePakFan]

About time he told the truth.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Agree with this where he says:

The home minister also called for a need to unite the “new concept” of human rights with the traditional one. “I know when I say human rights, people see the meaning as police atrocities and custodial deaths, which is a fact,” Shah said, according to The Hindu. “We have no objections. Every citizen should get the Constitutionally-guaranteed protection. But there are so many other dimensions, which we have to see with different perspectives.

He says there are other dimensions to human rights and they must be "united" (not replaced) with the traditional one.

Don't agree with him on Maoists. They are waging a war against the state but don't harm civilians.

 

[liam26]

He will be the Next Prime Minister of India after Modis next term. Such exciting times ahead.

 

[troodon]

India was never a true secular country.

You have minority appeasement and majority vote bank politics. Then you also have reservations based on caste.

India should stop pretending to be parading as biggest democracy. India at best is a pseudo democracy or wannabe western style democracy. But it cannot be due to various reasons.

 

[Hornbill]

India was never a true secular country.

You have minority appeasement and majority vote bank politics. Then you also have reservations based on caste.

India should stop pretending to be parading as biggest democracy. India at best is a pseudo democracy or wannabe western style democracy. But it cannot be due to various reasons.

India is the world's biggest flawed democracy, media should actually mention democracy rankings of countries while reporting news from countries it will help people to have better understanding about the political situation in those places.

 

[cricketjoshila]

India was never a true secular country.

You have minority appeasement and majority vote bank politics. Then you also have reservations based on caste.

India should stop pretending to be parading as biggest democracy. India at best is a pseudo democracy or wannabe western style democracy. But it cannot be due to various reasons.

One cannot copy paste the model of another country onto India.

We are a big country with a huge population. We have to have our own model.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

India was never a true secular country.

You have minority appeasement and majority vote bank politics. Then you also have reservations based on caste.

India should stop pretending to be parading as biggest democracy. India at best is a pseudo democracy or wannabe western style democracy. But it cannot be due to various reasons.

I think this anomaly would be resolved if India truly became Hindustan. Or if being a 'stan' country sounds to close to Islamic, then my own suggeston of Hindudesh would fit nicely. The majority Hindus of India are currently confused as to their own identity.

 

[Local.Dada]

I think this anomaly would be resolved if India truly became Hindustan. Or if being a 'stan' country sounds to close to Islamic, then my own suggeston of Hindudesh would fit nicely. The majority Hindus of India are currently confused as to their own identity.

Not really. The left says everyone is equal and indulges in minority appeasement which contradicts with secularism but still fundamentally beleive in equality and the so called Right says that there should be a uniform civil code and everyone is equal before the constitution and law. Again the underlying ideology being that of nationhood and equality.

So fundamentally the ideology is same,India is a diverse country and everyone needs to be looked after as one nation one identity regardless of what your culture, religion and language is.

India is a complex country where a dialect and language changes after every 50 kms so you can’t apply the same rules that apply to some other countries.

Shah is spot on and I suggest open up your mind and do some reading outside of this forum or what is taught to you in British “after school programs”

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Not really. The left says everyone is equal and indulges in minority appeasement which contradicts with secularism but still fundamentally beleive in equality and the so called Right says that there should be a uniform civil code and everyone is equal before the constitution and law. Again the underlying ideology being that of nationhood and equality.

So fundamentally the ideology is same,India is a diverse country and everyone needs to be looked after as one nation one identity regardless of what your culture, religion and language is.

India is a complex country where a dialect and language changes after every 50 kms so you can’t apply the same rules that apply to some other countries.

Shah is spot on and I suggest open up your mind and do some reading outside of this forum or what is taught to you in British “after school programs”

That was almost going ok until your last sentence which sort of gave the game away. What makes you think I am attending British "after school programs"? What are they?

Also not everyone has the time or inclination to go reading every Hindutva site which will fall in line with your hero Amit Shah.

 

[AdamM97]

This is where I can somewhat agree with Amit Shah.

Human Rights have their origins in the Magna Carta and the enlightenment ideas of 17th-18th century England and France.

Non-Europeans and Non-Americans will always find it hard to respect ’human rights’ due to cultural clashes.

But denying human rights isn’t an option either to be honest. Non-Europeans just have to learn to reconcile human rights with their cultural/religious norms

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

This is where I can somewhat agree with Amit Shah.

Human Rights have their origins in the Magna Carta and the enlightenment ideas of 17th-18th century England and France.

Non-Europeans and Non-Americans will always find it hard to respect ’human rights’ due to cultural clashes.

But denying human rights isn’t an option either to be honest. Non-Europeans just have to learn to reconcile human rights with their cultural/religious norms

Or they can show how eastern human rights works better. India is not getting good press right now for their "eastern human rights", maybe someone like Shah can demonstrate to westerners how they have got it all wrong?

When we see the riots, lynch mobs going wild, and properties burning, what is it we westerners are missing?

 

[the Great Khan]

That was almost going ok until your last sentence which sort of gave the game away. What makes you think I am attending British "after school programs"? What are they?

Also not everyone has the time or inclination to go reading every Hindutva site which will fall in line with your hero Amit Shah.

I think the bakht above means you go to an after school madrassa to learn the Quraan like my children do.

 

[the Great Khan]

Not really. The left says everyone is equal and indulges in minority appeasement which contradicts with secularism but still fundamentally beleive in equality and the so called Right says that there should be a uniform civil code and everyone is equal before the constitution and law. Again the underlying ideology being that of nationhood and equality.

So fundamentally the ideology is same,India is a diverse country and everyone needs to be looked after as one nation one identity regardless of what your culture, religion and language is.

India is a complex country where a dialect and language changes after every 50 kms so you can’t apply the same rules that apply to some other countries.

Shah is spot on and I suggest open up your mind and do some reading outside of this forum or what is taught to you in British “after school programs”

so your a racist masquerading as some kind articulated modern Indian.

Amit shah is a liar and a racist. the BJP and the RSS are fascists who hate Muslims and use clever tactics to manipulate a largley uneducated population. If thats what they want to do thats up to them. But dont present them as enlightened or forward looking because they are neither. If you support them you are a racist bigot who should be removed from this forum.

 

[AdamM97]

Or they can show how eastern human rights works better. India is not getting good press right now for their "eastern human rights", maybe someone like Shah can demonstrate to westerners how they have got it all wrong?

When we see the riots, lynch mobs going wild, and properties burning, what is it we westerners are missing?

There are no ”eastern human rights” to be fair.

Human rights are the best rights there is, but easterners will always find it hard to reconcile their religion/culture with basic human rights for various reasons.

Asians need their own scholars and philosophers who can sort such issues out, like Europeans did 200-300 years ago.

Having said that, I admit that Amit Shah is only using such rhetoric to justify the persecution of Muslims.

 

[AdamM97]

Not really. The left says everyone is equal and indulges in minority appeasement which contradicts with secularism but still fundamentally beleive in equality and the so called Right says that there should be a uniform civil code and everyone is equal before the constitution and law. Again the underlying ideology being that of nationhood and equality.

So fundamentally the ideology is same,India is a diverse country and everyone needs to be looked after as one nation one identity regardless of what your culture, religion and language is.

India is a complex country where a dialect and language changes after every 50 kms so you can’t apply the same rules that apply to some other countries.

Shah is spot on and I suggest open up your mind and do some reading outside of this forum or what is taught to you in British “after school programs”

You’re just repeating what every Muslim League supporter said in 1940 lol. The Indian Republic is very diverse, and very rarely has ”India” been united.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I think the bakht above means you go to an after school madrassa to learn the Quraan like my children do.

Yes I went to one of those but finished when I was about 11. I don't see how that would be getting in the way from learning new knowledge presently, even from esteemed scholars such as Amit Shah.

 

[the Great Khan]

Yes I went to one of those but finished when I was about 11. I don't see how that would be getting in the way from learning new knowledge presently, even from esteemed scholars such as Amit Shah.

my son just finished his time there and it has proven to be very useful. His emphasis on that point clearly highlights his anti muslim hate and bigotry. Hence his support for Amit shah.

You see the problem India now has is multifold. its ingrained institutional racism has come pouring out onto the streets in a torrent.

They aspire to be a super power but powers that have achieved such a disticntion have firstly managed to reconcile their own society and its particular inequality. Be it bedouin vs rich city dweller, be it enlightened vs the uneducated working class, and so forth. Interestingly instead of trying to break free of its historical baggage , (an earlier attempt by Nehru and gandhi has now obviously failed, ) they have interpretated history like a thelay wala manual worker would and now we see its consequences..

 

[cricketjoshila]

so your a racist masquerading as some kind articulated modern Indian.

Amit shah is a liar and a racist. the BJP and the RSS are fascists who hate Muslims and use clever tactics to manipulate a largley uneducated population. If thats what they want to do thats up to them. But dont present them as enlightened or forward looking because they are neither. If you support them you are a racist bigot who should be removed from this forum.

Thats your opinion on Amit Shah. You are free to have yours, others are free to have theirs.

Its laughable that you want someone removed just because he differs from your views. And then you talk about human rights.



People have elected bjp, they have the mandate to pass laws. If someone doesn't agree he has the right to challenge the law in the courts. If the court doesn't strike the law down, well he has to keep his peace. That applies to everyone and every government.

Human rights doesn't mean Rights of Muslims. India is a country of 1.5 bn and muslims are not even 200mn so their opinion alone wont run the country. This is not an islamic nation. Minorities suffer immensely in islamic countries and mere statements by a few doesn't do anything. Give equal rights to people in Pakistan, before you talk about another country.

 

[troodon]

I think this anomaly would be resolved if India truly became Hindustan. Or if being a 'stan' country sounds to close to Islamic, then my own suggeston of Hindudesh would fit nicely. The majority Hindus of India are currently confused as to their own identity.

Stan or Sthan is a Sanskrit word meaning place. So nothing wrong with India being called Hindusthan or Hindustan.

I prefer India anyway. Easy to pronounce and spell.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Stan or Sthan is a Sanskrit word meaning place. So nothing wrong with India being called Hindusthan or Hindustan.

I prefer India anyway. Easy to pronounce and spell.

Hindustan sounds better to me, sounds more authentic somehow. India is a European mutation of Sanskrit.

 

[JaDed]

Any religious government will obviously say that.
That’s why right wing in western countries is still more Liberal than Liberals in Conservative countries.

 

[Pakistanian]

Hindustan sounds better to me, sounds more authentic somehow. India is a European mutation of Sanskrit.

Stan or Sthan is a Sanskrit word meaning place. So nothing wrong with India being called Hindusthan or Hindustan.

I prefer India anyway. Easy to pronounce and spell.

India should officially go by 'Bharat', Hindustan and India are both colonial exonyms.

 

[marlonbrowndo]

This person and his supporters are pure evil.

 

[MP2011]

What else did people expect?

 

[srh]

India was never a true secular country.

You have minority appeasement and majority vote bank politics. Then you also have reservations based on caste.

India should stop pretending to be parading as biggest democracy. India at best is a pseudo democracy or wannabe western style democracy. But it cannot be due to various reasons.

+1. India is world's largest democracy is a sham.

 

[the Great Khan]

Thats your opinion on Amit Shah. You are free to have yours, others are free to have theirs.

Its laughable that you want someone removed just because he differs from your views. And then you talk about human rights.



People have elected bjp, they have the mandate to pass laws. If someone doesn't agree he has the right to challenge the law in the courts. If the court doesn't strike the law down, well he has to keep his peace. That applies to everyone and every government.

Human rights doesn't mean Rights of Muslims. India is a country of 1.5 bn and muslims are not even 200mn so their opinion alone wont run the country. This is not an islamic nation. Minorities suffer immensely in islamic countries and mere statements by a few doesn't do anything. Give equal rights to people in Pakistan, before you talk about another country.

Sorry my friend but his comment at the end where he clearly reveals his prejudice is why i have accused him of being a racist not because his views may differ to my own. if he had not made that comment my response would have been different.

You can have a contrary view on this forum. That is what it is here for, but if you make snide comments that fall under issues of Islamaphobia or racism then you deserve to be called out on it.

 

[the Great Khan]

Thats your opinion on Amit Shah. You are free to have yours, others are free to have theirs.

Its laughable that you want someone removed just because he differs from your views. And then you talk about human rights.



People have elected bjp, they have the mandate to pass laws. If someone doesn't agree he has the right to challenge the law in the courts. If the court doesn't strike the law down, well he has to keep his peace. That applies to everyone and every government.

Human rights doesn't mean Rights of Muslims. India is a country of 1.5 bn and muslims are not even 200mn so their opinion alone wont run the country. This is not an islamic nation. Minorities suffer immensely in islamic countries and mere statements by a few doesn't do anything. Give equal rights to people in Pakistan, before you talk about another country.

you are entitled to your opinion and as mentioned before the pakistani constitution preserves the rights of all minorities. Does that mean it is perfect? of course not. The law is outdated and is based on British law and needs t be changed. the Constitution itself should be reviewed e.g blasphemy laws etc.

However we do not have the right to go around inciting and then taking part in pogroms similar to the ones committed in the 1930's in Germany. They also elected a government and supported such measures.

india and its population should reflect on what is going on because at the end of the day it effects the region not just India.

 

[Stewie]

Thats your opinion on Amit Shah. You are free to have yours, others are free to have theirs.

Its laughable that you want someone removed just because he differs from your views. And then you talk about human rights.



People have elected bjp, they have the mandate to pass laws. If someone doesn't agree he has the right to challenge the law in the courts. If the court doesn't strike the law down, well he has to keep his peace. That applies to everyone and every government.

Human rights doesn't mean Rights of Muslims. India is a country of 1.5 bn and muslims are not even 200mn so their opinion alone wont run the country. This is not an islamic nation. Minorities suffer immensely in islamic countries and mere statements by a few doesn't do anything. Give equal rights to people in Pakistan, before you talk about another country.

I would like to know which minorities are suffering immensely in which Muslim country?

Your own fellow Hindus are living lives of luxury and and earn decent money which they send back to India in gulf states and saudia Arabia. Hardly suffering I would say!
There are indian and hindu workers in Kuwait, Qatar, etc as well as Indonesia, Malaysia etc.

 

[kaayal]

so your a racist masquerading as some kind articulated modern Indian.

Amit shah is a liar and a racist. the BJP and the RSS are fascists who hate Muslims and use clever tactics to manipulate a largley uneducated population. If thats what they want to do thats up to them. But dont present them as enlightened or forward looking because they are neither. If you support them you are a racist bigot who should be removed from this forum.

They don’t really hide it nowadays. It’s pretty open and they are really proud of it.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Sorry my friend but his comment at the end where he clearly reveals his prejudice is why i have accused him of being a racist not because his views may differ to my own. if he had not made that comment my response would have been different.

You can have a contrary view on this forum. That is what it is here for, but if you make snide comments that fall under issues of Islamaphobia or racism then you deserve to be called out on it.

Was his comment islamophobic? If it was then call him out. Surely.

Regarding Shah, his govt has been duly elected by a democratic process, their mandate to make laws cannot be taken away by street demonstrations.

There is a legal way to fight the CAA.

This is only helping BJP .

 

[Local.Dada]

I would like to know which minorities are suffering immensely in which Muslim country?

Your own fellow Hindus are living lives of luxury and and earn decent money which they send back to India in gulf states and saudia Arabia. Hardly suffering I would say!
There are indian and hindu workers in Kuwait, Qatar, etc as well as Indonesia, Malaysia etc.

Can a non-muslim be a head of state in Pakistan or Afghanistan? In fact how have the non-Muslims been treated here?

In fact even Bahrain has given refuge to a lot of Ahmadiyyas who were persecuted in Pakistan. Aren’t they from the Islamic school of thought at least?

Now sure Hindus and other communities from India have moved on to greener pastures of the west but how many communities had to flee from India for persecution?

As far as Hindus working in Gulf countries, yes they earn a living but so they get all rights as the ethnic Arab? In fact not applicable to Muslims of other ethnicities either.

In fact the very conflict happening in India is because Muslims of Muslim dominant counties are not allowed for citizen ship as refugees. They can still apply through a formal process case in point Adnan Sami. The immigration act in fact did not have any special provision for Hindus, it welcomed all “minorities”.

 

[Local.Dada]

Sorry my friend but his comment at the end where he clearly reveals his prejudice is why i have accused him of being a racist not because his views may differ to my own. if he had not made that comment my response would have been different.

You can have a contrary view on this forum. That is what it is here for, but if you make snide comments that fall under issues of Islamaphobia or racism then you deserve to be called out on it.

There was absolutely no prejudice. If you see my earlier comments I am pro-religion as long as it doesn’t interfere with your duties as a citizen and family man.

My comment was a suggestion to the poster to expand his world view. Dare I say I am impressed with most immigrant posters some of them even 2nd gen reciting religious passages like a scholar, however what is the point of such supreme knowledge when you are not up to date with the latest happenings or apply some logic and common sense. That was my point

 

[Stewie]

Can a non-muslim be a head of state in Pakistan or Afghanistan? In fact how have the non-Muslims been treated here?

In fact even Bahrain has given refuge to a lot of Ahmadiyyas who were persecuted in Pakistan. Aren’t they from the Islamic school of thought at least?

Now sure Hindus and other communities from India have moved on to greener pastures of the west but how many communities had to flee from India for persecution?

As far as Hindus working in Gulf countries, yes they earn a living but so they get all rights as the ethnic Arab? In fact not applicable to Muslims of other ethnicities either.

In fact the very conflict happening in India is because Muslims of Muslim dominant counties are not allowed for citizen ship as refugees. They can still apply through a formal process case in point Adnan Sami. The immigration act in fact did not have any special provision for Hindus, it welcomed all “minorities”.

You guys really like to beat around the bush, don’t you?

This dude is claiming minorities are “suffering” in Muslim countries. If they are suffering, why don’t thousands, maybe millions of you Hindus leave the gulf and Arab Muslim countries then? You guys are making great living there, whether it’s at a good post in a good firm, or cleaning up sheikh poop! But guys are not suffering!

You guys are not being subjected to terrorism like Muslims are in India. And you have yourself said even a Muslim sect is subjected to unfairness in Pakistan.. so that’s across the board discrimination (not just for Hindus) in the society but that is limited to Pakistan, we have a large population which has inherited the bigot gene for Indians.

There are tons of Christians living in Jordan, Lebanon, Syria, and they are not suffering. People should get their facts right.


And let’s not even discuss CAB.. it’s not designed for Muslims coming into India. Who would want to move there anyway? It’s for Muslims who are already citizens of India but can’t prove it.. it’s a method to take their properties and voting rights and subject them to ridicule to appease the Hindu majority.. please don’t insult our intelligence with your garbage on our forum!

 

[Local.Dada]

You guys really like to beat around the bush, don’t you?

This dude is claiming minorities are “suffering” in Muslim countries. If they are suffering, why don’t thousands, maybe millions of you Hindus leave the gulf and Arab Muslim countries then? You guys are making great living there, whether it’s at a good post in a good firm, or cleaning up sheikh poop! But guys are not suffering!

You guys are not being subjected to terrorism like Muslims are in India. And you have yourself said even a Muslim sect is subjected to unfairness in Pakistan.. so that’s across the board discrimination (not just for Hindus) in the society but that is limited to Pakistan, we have a large population which has inherited the bigot gene for Indians.

There are tons of Christians living in Jordan, Lebanon, Syria, and they are not suffering. People should get their facts right.


And let’s not even discuss CAB.. it’s not designed for Muslims coming into India. Who would want to move there anyway? It’s for Muslims who are already citizens of India but can’t prove it.. it’s a method to take their properties and voting rights and subject them to ridicule to appease the Hindu majority.. please don’t insult our intelligence with your garbage on our forum!

So because a Muslim sect was persecuted that shows uniformity when it comes to persecution? Do you even think what you type?

Your are busy digging theories behind the CAB and NRC and giving all the sinister intentions of the BJP but what is wrong in having a compassionate law that accepts minorities from countries which are Islamic republics which are centered around religious laws that treats other citizens as 2nd class citizens?

Would you refuse a citizenship registry or giving your finger prints for your SSN in Europe or North American countries? would they be ok if you don't have paper work regardless of the religion?

I am not going to dissect the so called sinister motives but on paper these were great moves. It is fine if people have a phobia for BJP and Shah-Modi but there is nothing wrong with these laws and so far who has lost their citizenship?

Let me ask you this if a person doesn't have a PAN card or bank account, a driving license, a passport, an Aadhar card or no proof of properties etc etc in the last 20 odd years or can't prove his parents lived or fore fathers live there then why shouldn't he be viewed with a suspicion? If those kind of people have an issue of losing their citizenship, sorry they don't deserve sympathies.

As far as people who want to move to India last time I checked Adnan Sami did whatever his reasons were and the Bugti guy from Balochistan and Altaf Hussain have applied for asylum who are Pakistani citizens aren't they? These may be small players or big shots I don't know their credentials in Pak but based on what little I know they at least have a handful of following.

 

[Stewie]

So because a Muslim sect was persecuted that shows uniformity when it comes to persecution? Do you even think what you type?

Your are busy digging theories behind the CAB and NRC and giving all the sinister intentions of the BJP but what is wrong in having a compassionate law that accepts minorities from countries which are Islamic republics which are centered around religious laws that treats other citizens as 2nd class citizens?

Would you refuse a citizenship registry or giving your finger prints for your SSN in Europe or North American countries? would they be ok if you don't have paper work regardless of the religion?

I am not going to dissect the so called sinister motives but on paper these were great moves. It is fine if people have a phobia for BJP and Shah-Modi but there is nothing wrong with these laws and so far who has lost their citizenship?

Let me ask you this if a person doesn't have a PAN card or bank account, a driving license, a passport, an Aadhar card or no proof of properties etc etc in the last 20 odd years or can't prove his parents lived or fore fathers live there then why shouldn't he be viewed with a suspicion? If those kind of people have an issue of losing their citizenship, sorry they don't deserve sympathies.

As far as people who want to move to India last time I checked Adnan Sami did whatever his reasons were and the Bugti guy from Balochistan and Altaf Hussain have applied for asylum who are Pakistani citizens aren't they? These may be small players or big shots I don't know their credentials in Pak but based on what little I know they at least have a handful of following.

I will not allow this discussion to be a weapon to criticize Pakistan’s record because yes it’s a tired schtick.. all done and dusted.. the criticism was leveled at all Muslim countries. You can’t keep harping on that just citing pakistan. you can continue to criticize us on a separate thread if you want. And yes I admit it’s justified because we haven’t been great in that regard. But you indians can now take your holier than thou attitude and shove it because you have proven you are far worse than Pakistanis. There are no open calls to go kill Ahmedis or other minorities in even Pakistan with armed goons sent from different areas and provided protection by local authorities. That’s a whole different level of low and is a precursor genocide.

Ahmedis have their places of worship and their holy place in Pakistan. So do christians and Hindus and Sikhs. The government itself never supported any actions against them behind the scene like India did in gujarat in 2002, the killings in Kashmir and now Delhi.

Our governments have just been incompetent across the board and everybody, Shias, sunnis, Ahmedis, Christians, this and that have suffered at the hands of one extremist or another. Even within sunnis, one extremist group likes to kill the other.

But you can come here and look is in the eye when you know deep down inside, that your current ruling party is not engaged in an attempt to systematically marginalize a community that is nearly 15% of your population and trying to wipe them out.

 

[Local.Dada]

I will not allow this discussion to be a weapon to criticize Pakistan’s record because yes it’s a tired schtick.. all done and dusted.. the criticism was leveled at all Muslim countries. You can’t keep harping on that just citing pakistan. you can continue to criticize us on a separate thread if you want. And yes I admit it’s justified because we haven’t been great in that regard. But you indians can now take your holier than thou attitude and shove it because you have proven you are far worse than Pakistanis. There are no open calls to go kill Ahmedis or other minorities in even Pakistan with armed goons sent from different areas and provided protection by local authorities. That’s a whole different level of low and is a precursor genocide.

Ahmedis have their places of worship and their holy place in Pakistan. So do christians and Hindus and Sikhs. The government itself never supported any actions against them behind the scene like India did in gujarat in 2002, the killings in Kashmir and now Delhi.

Our governments have just been incompetent across the board and everybody, Shias, sunnis, Ahmedis, Christians, this and that have suffered at the hands of one extremist or another. Even within sunnis, one extremist group likes to kill the other.

But you can come here and look is in the eye when you know deep down inside, that your current ruling party is not engaged in an attempt to systematically marginalize a community that is nearly 15% of your population and trying to wipe them out.

I am very tempted to comment on the state sponsored comment but since you don't want to discuss and are not comfortable with Pakistan's issues when it comes to minorities, I will respect that and leave it alone.

Now coming to Gujarat 2002. Firstly I do not agree with the loss of any innocent lives be it from any religion. Yes both Hindus and Muslims lost their lives in the riots and what preceded it. It was a law and order issue and you can blame the law and order and in this case the government responsible for running it. That was an admin failure. I personally agree. However this narrative that this killing was a direct order of Modi is ridiculous.

Since it is a cricket website let me give you a cricket example. Firstly I hate the religion angle here because in India we do not care but just for the sake of this argument, Pathan bros and Munaf Patel all made their debut around the same time give or take after the riots during Modi regime in Gujarat. why this is significant? because in India I am sure just like Pakistan the government takes interest in cricketing affairs as there is a lot of money involved. Amit Shah and his son are big power players of Gujarat cricket. I am not sure if they were involved in the affairs then but you get the point.

All these 3 players had decent careers for India, they were backed, well looked after and recommended for national selections. In fact Munaf came from a remote location, scouted and backed. Pathan Bros too come from a middle class family and if I remember correctly, their dad is kind of like a preacher or works in the mosque. If Modi or his government were so anti-muslim with their policies why would they let them evolve?

In fact once the bitterness dies down about the riots Modi even got some backing from the Bohra business community who are Muslims because of his trade policies.

You can have bias and dislike someone but you can't always have these broad views and be stubborn to accept another POV.

 

[Stewie]

I am very tempted to comment on the state sponsored comment but since you don't want to discuss and are not comfortable with Pakistan's issues when it comes to minorities, I will respect that and leave it alone.

Now coming to Gujarat 2002. Firstly I do not agree with the loss of any innocent lives be it from any religion. Yes both Hindus and Muslims lost their lives in the riots and what preceded it. It was a law and order issue and you can blame the law and order and in this case the government responsible for running it. That was an admin failure. I personally agree. However this narrative that this killing was a direct order of Modi is ridiculous.

Since it is a cricket website let me give you a cricket example. Firstly I hate the religion angle here because in India we do not care but just for the sake of this argument, Pathan bros and Munaf Patel all made their debut around the same time give or take after the riots during Modi regime in Gujarat. why this is significant? because in India I am sure just like Pakistan the government takes interest in cricketing affairs as there is a lot of money involved. Amit Shah and his son are big power players of Gujarat cricket. I am not sure if they were involved in the affairs then but you get the point.

All these 3 players had decent careers for India, they were backed, well looked after and recommended for national selections. In fact Munaf came from a remote location, scouted and backed. Pathan Bros too come from a middle class family and if I remember correctly, their dad is kind of like a preacher or works in the mosque. If Modi or his government were so anti-muslim with their policies why would they let them evolve?

In fact once the bitterness dies down about the riots Modi even got some backing from the Bohra business community who are Muslims because of his trade policies.

You can have bias and dislike someone but you can't always have these broad views and be stubborn to accept another POV.

O bhai keep drinking that koolaid they feed you. It is well established how modi allowed this to happen.. didn’t allow any army or police to intervene. Admin failure my behind. You guys really live in another world.

I have videos of Indian police escorting saffron clad thugs beating up people and destroying their homes and ransacking masjids.. police was escorting them..

Why are Muslims only ones to suffer when law and order fails?

Here is one from an Indian source.
. you just google gujarat riots modi inaction and you will see tons of

https://www.theweek.in/news/india/2018/10/08/2002-gujarat-riots-state-govt-delayed-transportation-claims-officer-led-army.html


Modi and his goons ordered these riots.. all these people were brought in from UP.. they didn’t know which house belonged to a Muslim, which business belonged to hindus, etc.. they have them local police to help identify which houses, businesses etc belonged to Muslims so they don’t accidentally hurt hindus.

I don’t know which world you live in, man. Get your head out fo wherever it is stuck. Nothing organized at such an high extent is done in Pakistan.

Kashmir mein to kuch hota hota forun army puhanch jaati hai within hours. In both gujarat and Delhi cases, there were multiple requests for army to intervene but no orders were issues for three days because the whole thing was orchestrated by the government.

Why do you think Modi was refused visa by US? They knew about it too.. it’s no hidden secret.

 

[ReverseHit]

Half of y'all didn't even bother to read, all you read is Shah blah blah and spat out your generic nonsense.

He said we should focus more on the human rights of the victims of Maoist violence, instead of questioning police actions on the Maoists.

How many of the Pakistanis in here would disagree with the statement if this was Imran talking about focusing on the human rights of the victims of TTP, and not caring about what the army did to get rid of TTP? When Zarb-e-Azab was going on, how many Pakistanis supported the "human rights" of the terrorists?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Half of y'all didn't even bother to read, all you read is Shah blah blah and spat out your generic nonsense.

He said we should focus more on the human rights of the victims of Maoist violence, instead of questioning police actions on the Maoists.

How many of the Pakistanis in here would disagree with the statement if this was Imran talking about focusing on the human rights of the victims of TTP, and not caring about what the army did to get rid of TTP? When Zarb-e-Azab was going on, how many Pakistanis supported the "human rights" of the terrorists?

Imran Khan does not encourage attacks on minorities in his own country, so please use a different whataboutism.

 

[Syed1]

Half of y'all didn't even bother to read, all you read is Shah blah blah and spat out your generic nonsense.

He said we should focus more on the human rights of the victims of Maoist violence, instead of questioning police actions on the Maoists.

How many of the Pakistanis in here would disagree with the statement if this was Imran talking about focusing on the human rights of the victims of TTP, and not caring about what the army did to get rid of TTP? When Zarb-e-Azab was going on, how many Pakistanis supported the "human rights" of the terrorists?

Yes IK is directly supporting Pakistani Muslims to go out and lynch, rape and burn Pakistani Hindus. Has Nazi Modi even made a statement regarding what happened in Delhi?

 

[MP2011]

Yes IK is directly supporting Pakistani Muslims to go out and lynch, rape and burn Pakistani Hindus. Has Nazi Modi even made a statement regarding what happened in Delhi?

When he himself considers their lives not more worthy than a puppy's life then don't you think his stooges will also follow him?

 

[Rajdeep]

Was his comment islamophobic? If it was then call him out. Surely.

Regarding Shah, his govt has been duly elected by a democratic process, their mandate to make laws cannot be taken away by street demonstrations.

There is a legal way to fight the CAA.

This is only helping BJP .

You are right there sir about these organized protests only helping BJP. I thought after 23rd May, those who oppose BJP got smarter and changed their techniques but they are still doing the same mistake as they have done in BJPs 1st term.

Lets be honest most of these protestors have not even read the CAA bill and only protesting bcoz they want to dethrone this govt. If they had read it, they would have known the bill had nothing against Indian muslims.But by organizing these meaningless protests, creating traffic jams, civil disobidience etc. they are just increasing BJPs vote count.

Modi & Shah's USP is issues like Kashmir, hindu-muslim, ram mandir, nationalism etc. They want opposition to fall into their trap and they are falling for it. If I was in opposition (thankfully I am not), I would have played smarter and not even raise these nationalism issues to give Modi/Shah the amunition they are looking for. I would rather protest against this govt on issues that matters to everyone like Jobs, Women empowerment, education, healthcare, finance etc. The amount of time they wasted on Shaheen Bagh, if they had done so by protesting for these real issues...a lot of people would have joined them and questioned the govt. The reason AAP won the Delhi election is exactly due to this. Kejriwal never fall for the nationalism trap and raised issues that matters to people.

But the issue is, in national election there is no smart opposition like Kejriwal. Ths only party that can challenge BJP nationally in Congress. So its imperative for Congress to become strong in order for BJP to lose. But looking at current situation of congress it does not seem to happen. It will be again Rahul Gandhi (LOL) vs Modi in 2024 but where is Rahul Gandhi? Has anyone even heard from him apart from some random statement here n there. There is no way people will vote for him even though they dont like Modi.

Congress has 4 years left to rejuvinate itself or else 400 seats for BJP in 2024. These college protests will create media headlines but have no bearings in national election.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Yes IK is directly supporting Pakistani Muslims to go out and lynch, rape and burn Pakistani Hindus. Has Nazi Modi even made a statement regarding what happened in Delhi?

Tweeting about it doesnt make much difference. Thats Imran.Tweets and Tweets.

 

[Syed1]

Tweeting about it doesnt make much difference. Thats Imran.Tweets and Tweets.

Yeah tweets.... yeh lay bhakht. Like I've said countless times please don't forget your auqaat.

Pakistan to restore, hand over 400 Hindu temples

https://gulfnews.com/world/asia/pakistan-to-restore-hand-over-400-hindu-temples-1.1573614894498

 

[Local.Dada]

Yeah tweets.... yeh lay bhakht. Like I've said countless times please don't forget your auqaat.

Pakistan to restore, hand over 400 Hindu temples

https://gulfnews.com/world/asia/pakistan-to-restore-hand-over-400-hindu-temples-1.1573614894498

What resulted in 400 temples being in that state in the first place. Also press release doesn’t mean things are fixed.

In india Muslim institutions are in charge for their places of worship and same goes for Christian and other minority places of worship. In fact Indian temples are suffering due to government interference instead of privatization.

May be in Pakistan this might be a great news that signals secularism but sorry not impressed

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

What resulted in 400 temples being in that state in the first place. Also press release doesn’t mean things are fixed.

In india Muslim institutions are in charge for their places of worship and same goes for Christian and other minority places of worship. In fact Indian temples are suffering due to government interference instead of privatization.

May be in Pakistan this might be a great news that signals secularism but sorry not impressed

It would suggest that Pakistan is going forwards in attempting to preserve Hindu temples while India is going backwards by demolishing mosques. Obviously diehard Hindutvas aren't going to be impressed, but the more balanced minded on both sides of the border might appreciate it.

 

[Local.Dada]

It would suggest that Pakistan is going forwards in attempting to preserve Hindu temples while India is going backwards by demolishing mosques. Obviously diehard Hindutvas aren't going to be impressed, but the more balanced minded on both sides of the border might appreciate it.

The Mosque that got demolished is viewed as a huge incident in Indian history. in fact it is called black day in India and a big deal is made about it. The Muslim board got a huge compensation which more than made them happy once it was decided to give the land for constructing a temple. In India it is not considered a business as usual destroying minority place of worship.

Any way I am quoting this while explaining to a guy who equated Veena Malik to women Olympic champion from India but hope this post may benefit a few other reasonable folk

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

The Mosque that got demolished is viewed as a huge incident in Indian history. in fact it is called black day in India and a big deal is made about it. The Muslim board got a huge compensation which more than made them happy once it was decided to give the land for constructing a temple. In India it is not considered a business as usual destroying minority place of worship.

Any way I am quoting this while explaining to a guy who equated Veena Malik to women Olympic champion from India but hope this post may benefit a few other reasonable folk

The only people your posts benefits are the other bots from India, but keep them coming, it provides entertainment value for the rest of us.

 

[InziRules]

The Mosque that got demolished is viewed as a huge incident in Indian history. in fact it is called black day in India and a big deal is made about it. The Muslim board got a huge compensation which more than made them happy once it was decided to give the land for constructing a temple. In India it is not considered a business as usual destroying minority place of worship.

Any way I am quoting this while explaining to a guy who equated Veena Malik to women Olympic champion from India but hope this post may benefit a few other reasonable folk

So true. I am glad that minorities are safe in India, as evidenced by how people gave roses to people after going into their houses in Delhi and how Kashmiris are given Lux Violet scented soaps every few days as a gift....

 

[Local.Dada]

So true. I am glad that minorities are safe in India, as evidenced by how people gave roses to people after going into their houses in Delhi and how Kashmiris are given Lux Violet scented soaps every few days as a gift....

Kashmir is a territorial dispute not a religious one at-least Thats how the rest of the world including india views it.

Who is right or wrong is a different debate but seems like only pakistanis view it as a religious issue.

Now if Indian government takes over Kashmir you may agree or disagree with it but I find this whole Islamic identity of Kashmir funny because the word Kashmir itself comes from the sage and ascetic called Maharishi Kashyap. Any ways india is a secular country and if they think Kashmir is a part of it then it will be secular like rest of India where all communities and ethnicities co exist and if any guy indulges in religious radicalism will be dealt with the way it should be.

As far as Delhi goes there is no state sponsored genocide. People who keep harping on it have no idea what a state sponsored genocide means. It is a law and order issue and sure may be some Muslims were hurt and they are Indian citizens and that is as bad as Hindus being hurt in it because these are Indian citizens at the end of the day. I think Pakistani folk may only view things from a Muslim angle and may feel moved by Muslims getting hurt but as an Indian it pains me to see any Indian citizens getting hurt and hope the govt and police do their job.

 

[InziRules]

As far as Delhi goes there is no state sponsored genocide. People who keep harping on it have no idea what a state sponsored genocide means. It is a law and order issue and sure may be some Muslims were hurt and they are Indian citizens and that is as bad as Hindus being hurt in it because these are Indian citizens at the end of the day. I think Pakistani folk may only view things from a Muslim angle and may feel moved by Muslims getting hurt but as an Indian it pains me to see any Indian citizens getting hurt and hope the govt and police do their job.

You act like it's a black and white think. It's either state sponsored genocide or nothing bad at all, just a slight law and order issue. There's a huge grey area in between, none of which is morally right. The Indian state is allowing and fanning flames of hatred.

 

[Local.Dada]

You act like it's a black and white think. It's either state sponsored genocide or nothing bad at all, just a slight law and order issue. There's a huge grey area in between, none of which is morally right. The Indian state is allowing and fanning flames of hatred.

Firstly Delhi is run by AAP and not BJP for starters.

Now if the central govt really had an agenda to do ethnic cleansing of Muslims ala Hitler/Nazis, do you think they will send in some local out of shape vandals to beat up some guys and then have someone shoot a video and post it on social media?

Even some poor African counties or during the whole Bangladesh movement when the dictators or crazy rulers decided to do ethnic cleansing against a community they used army and more discreet and sophisticated methods. In fact they started off by killing the elite and influential folk from the target minority community and you think the ones who run a country like India will have a handful of goons bashing around helpless poor/middle class folk if that is their intention?

Use some common sense.

 

[InziRules]

Firstly Delhi is run by AAP and not BJP for starters.

Now if the central govt really had an agenda to do ethnic cleansing of Muslims ala Hitler/Nazis, do you think they will send in some local out of shape vandals to beat up some guys and then have someone shoot a video and post it on social media?

Even some poor African counties or during the whole Bangladesh movement when the dictators or crazy rulers decided to do ethnic cleansing against a community they used army and more discreet and sophisticated methods. In fact they started off by killing the elite and influential folk from the target minority community and you think the ones who run a country like India will have a handful of goons bashing around helpless poor/middle class folk if that is their intention?

Use some common sense.

Did I use the word agenda? Did I say the government sent in people? I used the word, "allowed". I know reading comprehension is a problem in Bhakhts.....

 

[Local.Dada]

Did I use the word agenda? Did I say the government sent in people? I used the word, "allowed". I know reading comprehension is a problem in Bhakhts.....

Again what do you mean allowed? the state police and law order is controlled by the state government which is AAP and not BJP. Yes the center will be responsible if the problem gets out of hand and they don't intervene and it is the state govt. responsibility to seek center intervention.

India is not like Pakistan where one institution controls everything like the Army. We have independent state govt. that have enough power to disagree with the center.

 

[InziRules]

Again what do you mean allowed? the state police and law order is controlled by the state government which is AAP and not BJP. Yes the center will be responsible if the problem gets out of hand and they don't intervene and it is the state govt. responsibility to seek center intervention.

India is not like Pakistan where one institution controls everything like the Army. We have independent state govt. that have enough power to disagree with the center.

Did I use the word Federal government either?

I said government, which can be state or Federal...

 

[MenInG]

US Secretary of State Antony Blinken said the United States was monitoring what he described as a rise in "human rights abuses" in India by some officials, in a rare direct rebuke by Washington of New Delhi.

"We regularly engage with our Indian partners on these shared values (of human rights) and to that end, we are monitoring some recent concerning developments in India including a rise in human rights abuses by some government, police and prison officials," Mr Blinken said on Monday in a joint press briefing with US Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin, Foreign Minister Subrahmanyam Jaishankar and Defense Minister Rajnath Singh.

Mr Blinken did not elaborate. Mr Singh and Mr Jaishankar, who spoke after Blinken at the briefing, did not comment on the human rights issue.

Mr Blinken's remarks came days after US Representative Ilhan Omar questioned the alleged reluctance of the US government to criticize Prime Minister Narendra Modi's government on human rights.

"What does Modi need to do to India's Muslim population before we will stop considering them a partner in peace?" Ms Omar, who belongs to President Joe Biden's Democratic Party, said last week.

Several Indian states have passed or are considering anti-conversion laws that challenge the constitutionally protected right to freedom of belief.

In 2019, the government passed a citizenship law that critics said undermined India's secular constitution by excluding Muslim migrants from neighbouring countries. The law was meant to grant Indian nationality to Buddhists, Christians, Hindus, Jains, Parsis and Sikhs who fled Afghanistan, Bangladesh and Pakistan before 2015.

In the same year, it revoked the special status of Jammu and Kashmir in a bid to fully integrate the Muslim-majority region with the rest of the country.

Recently Karnataka banned wearing the hijab in classrooms in the state.

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/u-s...linken-says-2880171#pfrom=home-ndtv_topscroll

 

[ex-q-zit]

Promise You Uniform Civil Code Will Be Implemented In Himachal: Amit Shah

Nagrota/Una (Himachal Pradesh): Uniform Civil Code will be implemented in Himachal Pradesh and all irregularities in the salary system of government employees will be looked into if the BJP comes back to power, Union Home Minister Amit Shah said on Sunday.

Addressing polls rallies in the hill state, Mr Shah said this election is not about electing MLAs or the chief minister, but making India "a strong and a great country under Prime Minister Narendra Modi".

"If you elect the Jai Ram Thakur government, I promise you that the common civil code will be implemented in Himachal Pradesh. No one can stop it," he said.

In his poll rally at Mehatpur in Una, Mr Shah urged people to elect Satpal Satti and help him become a minister.

"Kindly help make a strong and prosperous India with your vote," he said. "The BJP has put in all its efforts to accomplish this."

Mr Shah said Himachal Pradesh was not just "Dev Bhoomi" but also "Veer Bhumi" as brave mothers of the state sent their sons to protect the country's boundaries. "I salute this land," he added.

The BJP in its election manifesto for the hill state has also promised 33 per cent reservation for women in government jobs, new educational institutions, and sops for various segments.

Urging women to encourage their daughters to study at least up to Class 12, Mr Shah said the government will gift them two-wheelers. "She will ride to school in the morning and also help you bring vegetables home in the evening," the home minister said.

During an election rally at Nagrota in Kangra district earlier in the day, Mr Shah claimed that the BJP will win both the lower and upper parts of Himachal Pradesh. Traditionally, Congress has been a strong contender in the upper parts of the state.

He also took a swipe at the poll guarantees given by the Congress in its manifesto, saying the people of Himachal Pradesh will not believe in that party's poll guarantees.

"Who will believe in their guarantees? They ruled for 10 years but only indulged in big scams. Now they are making guarantees to befool the innocent people of Himachal Pradesh," he said.

To woo the electorate in this segment of the state, the home minister highlighted the Centre's surgical air strikes against Pakistan, construction of Ram temple in Ayodhya, implementation of 'One Rank, One Pension' and abrogation of Article 370 in Kashmir.

"Did you not want a grand Ram Temple in Ayodhya? The Congress party did not want a Ram Mandir even after 75 years," he said, alleging that the grand old party ignored religious sites because of its vote bank and appeasement policies.

As voters in Himachal Pradesh have been following a tradition of not repeating the government for a second consecutive term, Mr Shah urged them to break the norm and elect the BJP once again to ensure that it becomes the "number one state" in the country.

Mr Shah also vowed to make the hill state drugs-free in five years.

Hailing Prime Minister Narendra Modi, Mr Shah said his stature had grown globally.

The home minister claimed that when Indian students were stranded in Ukraine during its war with Russia, Modi had called up presidents of the two countries and asked them to stop the war for a couple of days so that Indians could be evacuated.

"This is unprecedented for the world. Our students were evacuated safely," Mr Shah said.

The home minister also made a mention of the development work and government initiatives like Himcare health scheme and Jal Jeevan Mission to ensure safe drinking water.

Lauding Chief Minister Jai Ram Thakur, Mr Shah said the state attracted an investment of ₹ 44,000 crore under his leadership.

NDTV

 

[ex-q-zit]

"Rioters Taught Lesson In 2002...Permanent Peace In Gujarat": Amit Shah

Ahmedabad: Union Home Minister Amit Shah on Friday said anti-social elements earlier indulged in violence in Gujarat as the Congress supported them, but after the perpetrators were "taught a lesson" in 2002, they stopped such activities and the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) established "permanent peace" in the state.

Parts of Gujarat had witnessed large-scale violence in 2002 following the train burning incident at Godhra railway station in February that year.

Addressing a rally in Mahudha town of Kheda district in support of BJP candidates ahead of the next month's Assembly elections, Mr Shah alleged, "During the Congress rule in Gujarat (before 1995), communal riots were rampant. Congress used to incite people of different communities and castes to fight against each other. Through such riots, Congress had strengthened its vote bank and did injustice to a large section of the society." Mr Shah claimed that Gujarat witnessed riots in 2002 because perpetrators became habitual of indulging in violence due to the prolonged support they received from the Congress.

"But after they were taught a lesson in 2002, these elements left that path (of violence). They refrained from indulging in violence from 2002 till 2022. BJP has established permanent peace in Gujarat by taking strict action against those who used to indulge in communal violence," the Union minister said.

Thanking Prime Minister Narendra Modi for abrogating Article 370 from Jammu and Kashmir, Mr Shah alleged that the Congress was against it because of its "vote bank".

NDTV