What lessons can Pakistan T20I team learn from Afghanistan cricket team?

The Bald Eagle

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It's no secret that it was Pakistan NOT India who trained players like Mohammad Nabi and others in the budding stage of Afghanistan cricket. PCB also initially offered them the Pakistan ground facilities to train their players.

But the irony of fate, the once apprentice have emerged as teachers now. So from the Afghanistan's brilliant T20 World Cup campaign 2024, what lessons could PCT draw and learn?

Some areas where Pakistan could learn a thing or two from Afghanistan are following:

*Spin department: No doubt Pakistan lags behind Afghanistan in this area. Pakistan once the land of magician spin players like Saqlain Mushtaq, Mushtaq Ahmed and Usman Qadir, is now producing so called spinners like Shadab Khan and Usama Mir

* Fighting spirit and never give up attitude: Afghanistan players unlike Pakistan have shown great heart recently. Unlike Pakistan team who tend to lose matches after getting into a winning position, Afghanistan have beaten teams like Australia and Bangladesh in a diametrically opposite situation.

*Team Unity: This is a place where we can't even match with Afghanistan at all.


So guys do mention the areas where you feel Pakistan could learn a lot from former novices, Afghanistan.
 
IPL definitely provided the competitive plaform. For instance Rashid khan/Noor Ahmed both won IPL 2022 under Hardik Pandya. They reached final too in 2023. It was an exceptionally competitive. Gurbaaz last season opened for KKR. This season after Phil Salt he replaced him. He was part of the IPL winning team. He made 39 in the IPL final.
 
It's no secret that it was Pakistan NOT India who trained players like Mohammad Nabi and others in the budding stage of Afghanistan cricket. PCB also initially offered them the Pakistan ground facilities to train their players.

But the irony of fate, the once apprentice have emerged as teachers now. So from the Afghanistan's brilliant T20 World Cup campaign 2024, what lessons could PCT draw and learn?

Share your suggestions guys!
PCB and Pakistan has ditched Afghanistan long ago. You can't keep harping about it on how you helped in the start. Asian bloc as a whole was helping Afghanistan. Pakistan being the closest and culturally similar country obviously got to help the most at the start but...

The level of smugness and literal" begging for gratitude" from Afghanistan is really poor behavior. Basic dislike or even hate for India is understandable, but they way Pakistanis openly talk about Afghans as "gaddar" " namak haram" is beyond pathetic and cheap. India hardly had to do anything about it. Case in point are the threads on this forum questioning the intent of Afghans? Apologies for outright bluntness, but beyond disgusting is this attitude.

Taliban is very much an anti-thesis of what India needs in its neighborhood. Pakistan, by its own deeds has pushed Afghanistan (under Taliban) closer to India.
 
Learn? They can’t learn anything. They can only realise that their own brand of cricket which depends on fluke is now being caught up by teams that have started playing international cricket only recently. Whereas Pakistan is a Test nation for the past 60 years.

The only thing Pakistan can realistically do is wake up and understand they are not special, they don’t have the privilege of doing things in their own way because someone else has done their style better than them now. Soon Scotland and Ireland will also overtake Pakistan.
 
Learn? They can’t learn anything. They can only realise that their own brand of cricket which depends on fluke is now being caught up by teams that have started playing international cricket only recently. Whereas Pakistan is a Test nation for the past 60 years.

The only thing Pakistan can realistically do is wake up and understand they are not special, they don’t have the privilege of doing things in their own way because someone else has done their style better than them now. Soon Scotland and Ireland will also overtake Pakistan.
Pakistan cricket still assumes that it cant get any worse. Continue the same trend for a few years, with cricket joining Olympics, Cricket in Pakistan can easily go down what has happened to Hockey.
There needs to be a serious wake up and realize some hard truths.
 
Learn? They can’t learn anything. They can only realise that their own brand of cricket which depends on fluke is now being caught up by teams that have started playing international cricket only recently. Whereas Pakistan is a Test nation for the past 60 years.

The only thing Pakistan can realistically do is wake up and understand they are not special, they don’t have the privilege of doing things in their own way because someone else has done their style better than them now. Soon Scotland and Ireland will also overtake Pakistan.
Gurbaz depsite his poor show against Bangladesh has ability to accelerate like he did against Australia

In world T20 history

Gurbaz 15 matches 344 balls 28 sixes (10th in the list)
Babar 17 matches 549 balls 8 sixes (111th in the list)

Gurbaz has the second highest sixes in this world cup edition 16 sixes only Pooran is ahead with 17 sixes.
 
Learn? They can’t learn anything. They can only realise that their own brand of cricket which depends on fluke is now being caught up by teams that have started playing international cricket only recently. Whereas Pakistan is a Test nation for the past 60 years.

The only thing Pakistan can realistically do is wake up and understand they are not special, they don’t have the privilege of doing things in their own way because someone else has done their style better than them now. Soon Scotland and Ireland will also overtake Pakistan.
First of all we need to add some top quality proper spinners into our side as this area has been letting us done for long now
 
From a more cricketing pov and non philosophical,

If Pakistan have sworn that they will not improve their batting intent and standards to match the top teams of the world, then they must give up this fascination of picking 3 genuine seamers every game and rely on part time spinners to defend their customary “10-20 runs short” batting.

Take a punt and pick your best Test class spinners in white ball format and play 2 of them. Don’t worry about how long the tail is.

If Nauman Ali and Abrar are your best, most controlled spinners in red ball cricket, you have to draft them into your white ball sides. Give yourself the best chance to win games in the middle overs. Afghanistan’s spinners are the pillars of their success. Mohammad Nabi is no part timer like Shadab or Iftikhar. He was Afghanistan’s star cricketer before Rashid Khan emerged.
 
Pick proper spinners.

Reliance on nothing spinners like Shadab, Imad and Nawaz over the last 5-6 years has caused severe damage to Pakistan.

Also, don’t fast track players on PSL and league performances if they are not interested in FC cricket.

Just do these two things Pakistan will get significantly better. Emotional melodrama of brand of cricket and style etc. means absolutely nothing.

There is no such thing as style/brand of cricket, intent etc.
 
First of all we need to add some top quality proper spinners into our side as this area has been letting us done for long now
I was saying before the 2023 World Cup that Pakistan should have taken their best, most in control spinner to the World Cup and should have banked on him to bowl 10 overs for 30-40 runs, and take 2-3 wickets as their key bowler.

Babar and Co just don’t see cricket the way I do. Usama Mir, Shadab, Usman Qadir offer no control. They are always liable to give 1 or 2 overs of 15+ runs at any point.

Your best spinners in the country are Nauman, Abrar and Sajid Khan. There are people here who had an issue with me calling out Iftikhar’s intentional injustice towards Sajid Khan for Peshawar in the T20 national cup. Iftikhar was benching Sajid so that he can play as the frontline spinner for the team. How the hell do you wish to develop spinners for white ball cricket when these people are in charge of your cricket?? Why was Usman Tariq representing KPK 2nd XI under Rizwan’s leadership??

These are the deep rooted issues inside your domestic structure. The wrong kind of players are being promoted and now you can’t find the players you want
 
Fitness. Afghanistan team probably have the fittest Asian team currently. Fitter than India. They run between the wickets like cheetahs.

Also, Afghans seem more charged up/motivated (particularly when they do not play India). Modern day Pakistan team seem a bit on the timid side. Pakistan's timid era began after 2016 I feel.
 
From a more cricketing pov and non philosophical,

If Pakistan have sworn that they will not improve their batting intent and standards to match the top teams of the world, then they must give up this fascination of picking 3 genuine seamers every game and rely on part time spinners to defend their customary “10-20 runs short” batting.

Take a punt and pick your best Test class spinners in white ball format and play 2 of them. Don’t worry about how long the tail is.

If Nauman Ali and Abrar are your best, most controlled spinners in red ball cricket, you have to draft them into your white ball sides. Give yourself the best chance to win games in the middle overs. Afghanistan’s spinners are the pillars of their success. Mohammad Nabi is no part timer like Shadab or Iftikhar. He was Afghanistan’s star cricketer before Rashid Khan emerged.
SR of Afghanistan’s top 5 batsmen in this World Cup:

Gurbaz 126
Zadran 109
Omarzai 112
Naib 103
Nabi 83

And yet, they are in the semifinals. This proves that buzzwords like intent, aggression and style of cricket etc. mean absolutely nothing.

Everything depends on the conditions and match situation. Afghanistan have batted slowly but they have batted according to their strengths and what the situation demanded from them.

Hence proven that there is more than one way to skin the cat and those who always moan about SR need to sit down.
 
This isn't a history forum do some research. It's not rocket science where most of these players learnt cricket and where millions of Afghans have lived for 5 decades.
Kinda validating my point brother :p. Nothing else.
Many posters like you feel some sort of entitlement that Afghans somehow "owe" every little success to Pakistan but somehow ignore all the hardships geo political activities of Pakistan have inadvertently inflicted on them.
You could have very well be speaking in the cringey Bollywood style dialogue "hamaare tukdon par pale hain yeh Afghan" the essence of your post would not change.
 
SR of Afghanistan’s top 5 batsmen in this World Cup:

Gurbaz 126
Zadran 109
Omarzai 112
Naib 103
Nabi 83

And yet, they are in the semifinals. This proves that buzzwords like intent, aggression and style of cricket etc. mean absolutely nothing.

Everything depends on the conditions and match situation. Afghanistan have batted slowly but they have batted according to their strengths and what the situation demanded from them.

Hence proven that there is more than one way to skin the cat and those who always moan about SR need to sit down.
Great strike rates,

Like Pakistani batsmen.

But where is Pakistan? Who are they playing in the Semis?
 
Great strike rates,

Like Pakistani batsmen.

But where is Pakistan? Who are they playing in the Semis?
Pakistan didn’t get past the group stage because they brought up back two frauds on public demand who were advertised as mentally strong match winners.

But mentally strong match winner #1 conceded 19 runs in a Super Over vs USA including 3 sides while mentally strong match winner #2 batted at a SR of 65 vs India when Pakistan needed run a ball and all he needed to do was bat at 80-85, and he couldn’t even manage that.

The important lesson for Pakistan was to not bring back expired players just because they bark on TV and say things the gullible public want to hear.

It is always easy to make bullish statements on TV when you are not under pressure to prove yourself. However, it is a different ball game when you are in the moment and have to seize the moment before it runs way.

We all know what Amir would have said if he was on TV and Hassan Ali had bowled that Super Over.

We all know what Imad would have said if he was on TV and Nawaz would have played that innings vs India.

More importantly, we all know what you would have said.
 
Pakistan didn’t get past the group stage because they brought up back two frauds on public demand who were advertised as mentally strong match winners.

But mentally strong match winner #1 conceded 19 runs in a Super Over vs USA including 3 sides while mentally strong match winner #2 batted at a SR of 65 vs India when Pakistan needed run a ball and all he needed to do was bat at 80-85, and he couldn’t even manage that.

The important lesson for Pakistan was to not bring back expired players just because they bark on TV and say things the gullible public want to hear.

It is always easy to make bullish statements on TV when you are not under pressure to prove yourself. However, it is a different ball game when you are in the moment and have to seize the moment before it runs way.

We all know what Amir would have said if he was on TV and Hassan Ali had bowled that Super Over.

We all know what Imad would have said if he was on TV and Nawaz would have played that innings vs India.

More importantly, we all know what you would have said.
So the lesson Pakistan can learn from here is,

“Do not bring back two players who were heavily critical of your team from outside, otherwise Babar and Rizwan’s tuk tuk will not be enough to get Pakistan through to the next round”

That’s basically the lesson?
 
After ct 2017 finals, kohli learnt the lesson and added attacking wrist spinners (kd and chahal).Kohli took additional responsibility for the tail and he batted magnificently through out the period.Pak needs a leader instead of captian to fix all the issues and a lot of them are self inflicted. pak used to score come back wins regularly in any format of the matches,now they are far few and very rare.it shows the hunger and fightback.
 
After ct 2017 finals, kohli learnt the lesson and added attacking wrist spinners (kd and chahal).Kohli took additional responsibility for the tail and he batted magnificently through out the period.Pak needs a leader instead of captian to fix all the issues and a lot of them are self inflicted. pak used to score come back wins regularly in any format of the matches,now they are far few and very rare.it shows the hunger and fightback.
Yes. Building a T20 team is a niche skill. You don't necessarily have to pick the best players and build it. You have to pick players for roles. Ofcourse you still have to have strong eye testing skills to judge whether someone is fit for that role.
 
So the lesson Pakistan can learn from here is,

“Do not bring back two players who were heavily critical of your team from outside, otherwise Babar and Rizwan’s tuk tuk will not be enough to get Pakistan through to the next round”

That’s basically the lesson?
Their tuk tuk took Pakistan to the semifinal & final in the last two editions. Their took is not the problem because Pakistan has bigger problems that hold the team back and Amir & Imad did nothing to address those problems.
 
Their tuk tuk took Pakistan to the semifinal & final in the last two editions. Their took is not the problem because Pakistan has bigger problems that hold the team back and Amir & Imad did nothing to address those problems.
Right, so you reaffirm that Pakistan shouldn’t take players who criticise on TV if they wish for the Tuk Tuk of Babar and Rizwan to take them through to the semis.


Absolute genius!
 
Fitness - Afghans are improving every match when it comes to fitness. They field with intent on the ground , although their skills need refinement which is understandable.


Spinners - obvious

Batting intent- again obvious. They don't bat for stats
 
Where is t
PCB and Pakistan has ditched Afghanistan long ago. You can't keep harping about it on how you helped in the start. Asian bloc as a whole was helping Afghanistan. Pakistan being the closest and culturally similar country obviously got to help the most at the start but...

The level of smugness and literal" begging for gratitude" from Afghanistan is really poor behavior. Basic dislike or even hate for India is understandable, but they way Pakistanis openly talk about Afghans as "gaddar" " namak haram" is beyond pathetic and cheap. India hardly had to do anything about it. Case in point are the threads on this forum questioning the intent of Afghans? Apologies for outright bluntness, but beyond disgusting is this attitude.

Taliban is very much an anti-thesis of what India needs in its neighborhood. Pakistan, by its own deeds has pushed Afghanistan (under Taliban) closer to India.

Where is the smugness shown by Pakistanis?
It seems the pain is with you and your compatriots. Make no mistake Pakistan helped Afghanistan in many ways.
You just want to downplay it to push your own agenda.
 
Fitness. Afghanistan team probably have the fittest Asian team currently. Fitter than India. They run between the wickets like cheetahs.

Also, Afghans seem more charged up/motivated (particularly when they do not play India). Modern day Pakistan team seem a bit on the timid side. Pakistan's timid era began after 2016 I feel.

Not only fitness, but the mindset where such attributes should have been considered a given. Can you imagine the shamelesness and lack of professionalism which led to the selection of Azam Khan?

That is why in my post I said self respect and pride in the flag. Because you lack both when you make joke selections like such because his father was Moin Khan.
 
It's no secret that it was Pakistan NOT India who trained players like Mohammad Nabi and others in the budding stage of Afghanistan cricket. PCB also initially offered them the Pakistan ground facilities to train their players.

But the irony of fate, the once apprentice have emerged as teachers now. So from the Afghanistan's brilliant T20 World Cup campaign 2024, what lessons could PCT draw and learn?

Some areas where Pakistan could learn a thing or two from Afghanistan are following:

*Spin department: No doubt Pakistan lags behind Afghanistan in this area. Pakistan once the land of magician spin players like Saqlain Mushtaq, Usman Qadir and Usman Qadir, is now producing so called spinners like Shadab Khan and Usama Mir

* Fighting spirit and never give up attitude: Afghanistan players unlike Pakistan have shown great heart recently. Unlike Pakistan team who tend to lose matches after getting into a winning position, Afghanistan have beaten teams like Australia and Bangladesh in a diametrically opposite situation.

*Team Unity: This is a place where we can't even match with Afghanistan at all.


So guys do mention the areas where you feel Pakistan could learn a lot from former novices, Afghanistan.
Professionalism.
 
Afghans have played next to no FC cricket.

Rashid Khan has became the best leg spinner in the world despite playing less first class games than Usman Qadir.

It's the same right across the team.

This should blow the myth right out of the water about FC being essential for T20 cricket and it should be a huge wake up call for the PCB before they implement their draconian policies.
 
*Spin department: No doubt Pakistan lags behind Afghanistan in this area. Pakistan once the land of magician spin players like Saqlain Mushtaq, Mushtaq Ahmed and Usman Qadir, is now producing so called spinners like Shadab Khan and Usama Mir
Agreed. I too miss players like Saqlain Mushtaq, Usman Qadir and Usman Qadir.
 
Right, so you reaffirm that Pakistan shouldn’t take players who criticise on TV if they wish for the Tuk Tuk of Babar and Rizwan to take them through to the semis.


Absolute genius!
Select players who want to play for the team and ready to toil in domestic cricket. Amir and Imad don’t fit the bill. They both retired for a reason.

When you go back to retired players who have only come back because there is no league cricket around these days, you deserve humiliation.
 
Afghans have played next to no FC cricket.

Rashid Khan has became the best leg spinner in the world despite playing less first class games than Usman Qadir.

It's the same right across the team.

This should blow the myth right out of the water about FC being essential for T20 cricket and it should be a huge wake up call for the PCB before they implement their draconian policies.
I don't know why do they mix up first class cricket with white ball cricket.
FC is totally different, these old minds need to change their cricketing perspective.
 
Pakistan should maybe pick more Pashtun batters . They are strong and can probably hit big sixes .
 
Entered the thread expecting a writeup full of humility, but then "It's no secret that Pakistan NOT India..." made the rest seem quite disingenuous, no offense.

Perhaps the first thing to learn is to give someone credit without blowing your own trumpet at every given opportunity.
 
Where is t


Where is the smugness shown by Pakistanis?
It seems the pain is with you and your compatriots. Make no mistake Pakistan helped Afghanistan in many ways.
You just want to downplay it to push your own agenda.
Do I have to point to the obvious threads questioning the integrity of Afghan players?
Is every hard reality check a part of agenda ?
Will you accept if I take the trouble of tagging the specific posts?
 
Pakistan should maybe pick more Pashtun batters . They are strong and can probably hit big sixes .

I always felt this sort of thinking hurt Pakistan in the past. Batsmen need technique first, being big and strong is useless without it. It's one of the reasons why you had so many arguments raging around Lahore vs Karachi.
 
Select players who want to play for the team and ready to toil in domestic cricket. Amir and Imad don’t fit the bill. They both retired for a reason.

When you go back to retired players who have only come back because there is no league cricket around these days, you deserve humiliation.

They retired because they were good enough to earn big money abroad and didn't want to lose out financially by being tied to international commitments. Maybe they shouldn't have been recalled, but that isn't the reason Pakistan performed so poorly, as they were probably among the better performers through the tournament.

It seems like you are sticking to this theme to prove yourself right, but domestic cricketers would probably behave exactly the same once they got some recognition. What do you propose, just keep selecting new players for every tournament?
 
They retired because they were good enough to earn big money abroad and didn't want to lose out financially by being tied to international commitments. Maybe they shouldn't have been recalled, but that isn't the reason Pakistan performed so poorly, as they were probably among the better performers through the tournament.

It seems like you are sticking to this theme to prove yourself right, but domestic cricketers would probably behave exactly the same once they got some recognition. What do you propose, just keep selecting new players for every tournament?
What he is suggesting is, as long as you don’t select players who do not wish to lick Babar’s boots…you will advance to the next round through Babar and Rizwan’s tuk tuk
 
There seems to be huge conflict of interest in PCB with Babar Azam and his companies and agents. I dont know the full details but that seems to ruin lot of team harmony. It sounds similar to what CSK and Srinivasan were doing and got banned about 10 years in IPL.
 
That history/past don't matter.

Cake cutting every silly T20 record is not necessary.
And qudrat ka nizam is not everything. :inti
 
They retired because they were good enough to earn big money abroad and didn't want to lose out financially by being tied to international commitments. Maybe they shouldn't have been recalled, but that isn't the reason Pakistan performed so poorly, as they were probably among the better performers through the tournament.

It seems like you are sticking to this theme to prove yourself right, but domestic cricketers would probably behave exactly the same once they got some recognition. What do you propose, just keep selecting new players for every tournament?
Better performers?

Both played starring roles in the two defeats that led to Pakistan’s elimination. Bringing them back was a waste of time because they don’t make Pakistan a better team.

They retired for selfish interests and they came back for selfish interests as well. PCB shouldn’t have opened the door for them but I hope they learn their lesson and don’t repeat the same mistake again.
 
They need to play better T20 leagues and not every league.

Canada Global T20 looks like tier-3.
 
Afghans are probably best at knowing their own limitations. They know their game very well and always try to play within that limited scope. As they kept improving, the limits have widened and they are able to win more games. They don't act live Divas and believe in the collective. Their mental strength in crunch situations was questionable but they seem to be improving a lot in that aspect too.
 
They need to play better T20 leagues and not every league.

Canada Global T20 looks like tier-3.

The more they play in various leagues, the more they earn.

They are likely to play in as many leagues as possible (to maximize earnings).
 
The more they play in various leagues, the more they earn.

They are likely to play in as many leagues as possible (to maximize earnings).
Understandable, but skill wise they aren’t improving, Shaheen has really not been upto the mark since 2022.

Many players don’t even seem to want to play for the country.
This is the most Toxic I have seen Pakistan cricket be since 2010.
 
Understandable, but skill wise they aren’t improving, Shaheen has really not been upto the mark since 2022.

Many players don’t even seem to want to play for the country.
This is the most Toxic I have seen Pakistan cricket be since 2010.

Vast majority of the cricketers would probably prioritize earnings.

These guys are professional cricketers. Can't blame them.
 
Afghanistan players appear to be more intelligent than their Pakistani counterparts so they efficiently work on improving their game. Despite residing in refugee camps at Pakistan's mercy, the majority of their players are fluent in English. In contrast, the majority of Pakistani players struggle to speak Urdu proficiently, often coming across as intellectually challenged. Babar Azam always embarrasses himself during post match presentations.
 
Lets be honest, yes Pakistan helped Afghanistani players and cricketers early on when they were not considered a full ICC member but Afghani's have been able to take their game to the next level after getting sustained support from the ICC, BCCI and getting IPL experience.
 
I always felt this sort of thinking hurt Pakistan in the past. Batsmen need technique first, being big and strong is useless without it. It's one of the reasons why you had so many arguments raging around Lahore vs Karachi.
Ideally , yes. But your technical batters don't really have the power so far.
 
Play for the team. Not for personal records

A big problem with Pakistan cricket is the obsession with ICC rankings & with it focus on personal milestones. Look at the way Rizwan celebrated his 50 against Canada. That was extremely embarrassing & a sorry portrayal of the state of affairs in the Pakistan dressing room


U will never see Afghan players do such things
 
Their tuk tuk took Pakistan to the semifinal & final in the last two editions. Their took is not the problem because Pakistan has bigger problems that hold the team back and Amir & Imad did nothing to address those problems.
Their tuktuk didn't take Pakistan anywhere excluding the Nedtherlands game where Rizwan made 49. It was everyone else that carried them otherwise before the nZ SF.

These 2 were helplessly reliant on everyone else especially haris during the Bangladesh game to take them over.

Infact babar's innings against Bangladesh was match losing.

It was the bowling that was carrying + outside factors such as Nedtherlands helping Pakistan out
 
Pakistan don’t have spinners to implement the Afghan strategy. If they have 2 world class spinners with the excellent T20 fast bowlers they have, Babar-Rizwan approach should have worked for Pakistan in these pitches. Afghan fast bowlers have matched Pak fast bowlers. Afghan spinners and Pak spinners there is not even a comparison. Batting is more or less the same.
 
Do these things.

1) Have the selectors actually watch the game. Azam Khan having finn Allen statistics in PSL means nothing if he can't even play a Drive. All he can do is swing for the stands and that'll never work in international cricket for very obvious reasons. Someone like Abdullah shafiq or saud shakeel would have been a better bet due to technical prowess and actual cricketing shots.

2) No more dosti yaari, the fact babar went out of his way to protect shadab of all people over abrar and frequently hid behind the he's an allrounder clause when sheddy didn't even bowl in most games is despicable. Even in 2023 wc babar did this.

3) start playing your best 11 period and if that means kicking babar and rizwan out so be it. I've told people this multiple times, Babar had been out of it since 2022 in t20, since 2022 unless you play in pindi against 3rd rate teams, he's absolutely dreadful in t20 be it at no 3 or opening and No hiding behind the whole but he's better then the rest is not a viable excuse.

You don't keep trash because one trash happens to be slightly less smelly then the other trash, You take the entire trash out plain and simple.

Grassroot selections are needed, you have players like abrar, zafar gohar, sajid khan, Tayyab tahir, Saud Shakeel, Abdullah shafiq sitting out four UAE representatives (Usman), Balochi representatives (Hasebullah), Saya representatives or Children of people in high positions (Shan or Azam khan) or the Misbah group (Chacha and Rizwan)
 
Pakistan don’t have spinners to implement the Afghan strategy. If they have 2 world class spinners with the excellent T20 fast bowlers they have, Babar-Rizwan approach should have worked for Pakistan in these pitches. Afghan fast bowlers have matched Pak fast bowlers. Afghan spinners and Pak spinners there is not even a comparison. Batting is more or less the same.

The last time Pakistan had a world class limited overs spin attack was when they had the services of a pre-15 degree Ajmal, Hafeez and an in form Afridi. Guaranteed 12 economical and wicket taking overs in T-20 cricket and 30 economical wicket taking overs in ODI cricket.
 
Do I have to point to the obvious threads questioning the integrity of Afghan players?
Is every hard reality check a part of agenda ?
Will you accept if I take the trouble of tagging the specific posts?
Only the afghan players know their own integrity and intentions,not you or me.
All i said was Pakistan got the afghans on the road when they were newbies and helped them along the way, that surely counts for something, sure other countries have jumped in later.
Dont downplay Pakistans contributions to Afghanis, rest they achieved and worked for themselves.
 
Babar single-handedly destroyed Pakistan’s white ball cricket by insisting on two preposterous notions:

1. Sidelined full time spinners like Abrar in order to play his close friend Shadab who is bits and pieces spinner and a fake all rounder.

2. Insisted to open the innings while aggressive openers like Fakhr Zaman and others were pushed down the order. This lunacy even created a situation where Pakistan’s entire middle order was made up of openers.

If Pakistan can fix these two issues, it will begin to regain its credibility.
 
Only the afghan players know their own integrity and intentions,not you or me.
All i said was Pakistan got the afghans on the road when they were newbies and helped them along the way, that surely counts for something, sure other countries have jumped in later.
Dont downplay Pakistans contributions to Afghanis, rest they achieved and worked for themselves.
I admit that Pakistan nurtured Afghan cricket, still doesn't excuse some of the stuff said by pak fans about the Afghans
 
Their tuk tuk took Pakistan to the semifinal & final in the last two editions. Their took is not the problem because Pakistan has bigger problems that hold the team back and Amir & Imad did nothing to address those problems.
I partially agree regarding 2021 even though I have a lot to say against but I wont since I don't want to go there. But please elaborate how did the tuktuk twins took the side to final in 2022?

If it was one of the typical fanboys I wouldn’t even bother to ask but since It's you who I distinctly remember used to be one of the sharpest critics of the entire RizBar circus I just couldn't hold myself.
 
Why is everyone arguing about What Ifs?

Aka if it wasn't for Pakistan Afghanistan cricket wouldn't a thing?

You could say the same about Pakistan aka if it wasn't for Jinnah fighting for the 1947 partition, Pakistan cricket wouldn't a thing and we'd be India?

Or if Bangladesh never separated we'd have Litton das playing for Pakistan?

What ifs don't matter. Pakistan was the one who did it first but Afghanistan is currently the one thays doing it better, plain and simple.
 
I am still recovering from the WC defeat. Pakistan needs to hammer then in CT. I want the game closed out in 10 overs.
 
It's no secret that it was Pakistan NOT India who trained players like Mohammad Nabi and others in the budding stage of Afghanistan cricket. PCB also initially offered them the Pakistan ground facilities to train their players.

But the irony of fate, the once apprentice have emerged as teachers now. So from the Afghanistan's brilliant T20 World Cup campaign 2024, what lessons could PCT draw and learn?

Some areas where Pakistan could learn a thing or two from Afghanistan are following:

*Spin department: No doubt Pakistan lags behind Afghanistan in this area. Pakistan once the land of magician spin players like Saqlain Mushtaq, Mushtaq Ahmed and Usman Qadir
😑Man I know some of you guys are really naive & started watching from Misbah era but please let us all be enlightened since when & how Usman Qadir became a magical spinner & earned the right to be tagged along with Pak's GOAT spinners??
Other than being son of a legend & buddy buddy with Babar what exactly are his qualities & achievements to be bestowed with such magnificent honours?
, is now producing so called spinners like Shadab Khan and Usama Mir

* Fighting spirit and never give up attitude: Afghanistan players unlike Pakistan have shown great heart recently. Unlike Pakistan team who tend to lose matches after getting into a winning position, Afghanistan have beaten teams like Australia and Bangladesh in a diametrically opposite situation.

*Team Unity: This is a place where we can't even match with Afghanistan at all.


So guys do mention the areas where you feel Pakistan could learn a lot from former novices, Afghanistan.
 
Ideally , yes. But your technical batters don't really have the power so far.

And the powerful batters don't have the technique. Let's put it this way, when Pakistan needed 15 runs off a super over against the USA, what use was Chacha Ifti's muscle when he couldn't land the middle of the bat on two full tosses? Would Babar with his technique not have handled it better? Or any batsman who actually had a proper technique?

Imad Waseem and Muhammad Nawaz are known for hitting huge sixes, and actually got picked on the back of their batting, but they will miss 5 balls out of 6 because they lack technique to hit all around the wicket against all types of bowling.
 
Babar single-handedly destroyed Pakistan’s white ball cricket by insisting on two preposterous notions:

1. Sidelined full time spinners like Abrar in order to play his close friend Shadab who is bits and pieces spinner and a fake all rounder.

2. Insisted to open the innings while aggressive openers like Fakhr Zaman and others were pushed down the order. This lunacy even created a situation where Pakistan’s entire middle order was made up of openers.

If Pakistan can fix these two issues, it will begin to regain its credibility.

I don't like to speculate on who is responsible for picking spinners for their batting ability, but it's been responsible for a lot of Pakistan's awful results. We've seen Muhammad Nawaz and Shadab getting picked consistently despite very poor bowling records against any half decent side. All because they hit the odd nice six in meaningless matches.
 
No lessons to learn from them.

Afghanistan deliberately underperform against India. At least Pakistan always gives its best.
 
SR of Afghanistan’s top 5 batsmen in this World Cup:

Gurbaz 126
Zadran 109
Omarzai 112
Naib 103
Nabi 83

And yet, they are in the semifinals. This proves that buzzwords like intent, aggression and style of cricket etc. mean absolutely nothing.

Everything depends on the conditions and match situation. Afghanistan have batted slowly but they have batted according to their strengths and what the situation demanded from them.

Hence proven that there is more than one way to skin the cat and those who always moan about SR need to sit down.
That is called match awareness which Pakistan completely lack.
 
Don’t take advice from Tuktuk players like Misbah or take Tuktuk players to t20 World Cup for example Ifthikhar Ahmed Chacha
 
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Pakistan team can learn quite a few things from Afghans. Like their hunger to excel at this sport, listening to their coaches and act right away, even though people are making fun of that antique thing done by naib but there are many other things trott would have told his squad and they responded.
 
They need to play better T20 leagues and not every league.

Canada Global T20 looks like tier-3.
Have you not seen how greedy they are by destroying their injury ridden bodies just for some money?

If you held a T20 Cup in your street with a few thousand dollars, I guarantee one of these lot will sign up for it.
 
PCB and Pakistan has ditched Afghanistan long ago. You can't keep harping about it on how you helped in the start. Asian bloc as a whole was helping Afghanistan. Pakistan being the closest and culturally similar country obviously got to help the most at the start but...

The level of smugness and literal" begging for gratitude" from Afghanistan is really poor behavior. Basic dislike or even hate for India is understandable, but they way Pakistanis openly talk about Afghans as "gaddar" " namak haram" is beyond pathetic and cheap. India hardly had to do anything about it. Case in point are the threads on this forum questioning the intent of Afghans? Apologies for outright bluntness, but beyond disgusting is this attitude.

Taliban is very much an anti-thesis of what India needs in its neighborhood. Pakistan, by its own deeds has pushed Afghanistan (under Taliban) closer to India.

This is all due to Pakistani media; it has blinded its population. There is also a thriving culture of taking pride in others' success or blaming others.

  1. Nabi and the entire first generation were young boys when they started with Afghanistan U19. Hamid Hassan was a chubby fat boy back then. These two were the first Afghans to get a chance in Pakistan's domestic circuit for one season, just a few matches, after they had been at MCC for more than a year. Nabi is also the one who could afford playing in a local academy with Umar Gul. Rest of the first generation were kids in refugee camps and had no access to the club structure. They played tape ball cricket between themselves and were first introduced to hardball and proper pitches in Afghanistan.

  2. Afghanistan used Pakistani facilities, if I am not wrong, on 2 or 3 occasions. The first time, they played against small Peshawar-based teams, where they prepared for an ACC tournament. They were so unfamiliar with hard ball that in one of the 50 overs matches they were allowed to bad twice, as they got all out too quickly. The other times, under Kabir Khan, they paid PCB for the facilities. The price was high, and Pakistanis started taking credit for Afghan cricket. Hamid Shinwari (head of the board) sought Sri Lanka's help and rented their facilities for the next two camps. PCB and ACB relations ended here.
Then came the UAE. Sharjah Stadium authorities allowed ACB to use their facilities without payment. UAE-based Afghan businessmen paid the hotel bills.

Later on, India provided facilities free of charge, and then again a contract was signed with the UAE board that they would provide facilities in return for Afghanistan playing white-ball cricket against the UAE team each year. Now again, ACB has turned towards BCCI, and they have been promised several venues for home matches free of charge, with all ticket money going into the pockets of ACB.

3. Teams from Afghanistan have participated in two tournaments: a low-profile night Ramadhan tournament called the MA Shah Lephone Night Trophy and a second-grade domestic tournament. In the first instance, they PAID their entry fee at the last moment as Khaliqdad and Allahdad couldn't find sponsors. The AYCA team was not connected to the ACB, but had players such Hamid Hassan, Samiullah Shinwari, Shahzad, Abdullah Mazari etc.. The second time, Afghan businessman Najib Zarab paid the $50,000 entry fee for the second-grade T20 domestic tournament.

4. Among the most prominent coaches from Pakistan, Kabir Khan saw himself as an Afghan. He got paid a low amount, and it was a matter of pride for him to coach Afghanistan.
  • Rashid Latif got paid $12,000 monthly. ACB sought a coach, Rashid applied, and ACB saw him as the best-suited candidate. Afghans provided a job for a Pakistani and paid for his services. If not him, another would have taken the job. The choice, if I recall correctly, was between Gary Kirsten's brother (Peter Kirsten) and Rashid.
  • Inzi was paid $15,000 monthly. Again, ACB sought a coach, and Inzi was among those who applied. In the end, he didn't even finish his term and went back to the PCB.
  • There was also another Pakistani coach whose name I cannot recall. He was provided by the ACC (they paid his salary and highly regarded him) for short terms twice. A very humble person.
 
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Have you not seen how greedy they are by destroying their injury ridden bodies just for some money?

If you held a T20 Cup in your street with a few thousand dollars, I guarantee one of these lot will sign up for it.
It’s unfortunate, but i think only country actually affected by leagues is PCT, but considering PCB contracts are really good now not to forget the fame they already get in Pak (advertising money), I think it’s something to do with agencies representing them that’s making them do this.
 
One thing i really hate about fans here is the ott reaction to everything.

Afghanistan wins and gets into the semi finals, and pakistan losses and we see threads and posts pop up talking about what we can learn from so and so, and how so and so is better than Pakistan.

Before i start, let me remind you that im a big fan of Afghanistan cricket and even tend to back them when playing against Pakistan and have been following their team since 2008. Posters who know me here can also vouch how i always back afghanistan.

So i will just say it simple here. Afghanistan fluked their way into the semis. Simple as that.

The problem with the Afghanistan team is that they are playing literally without any batters. Only ibrahim and gurbaz are the two batters they have got, rest of the players are bits and pieces just making the numbers. Afghanistan has failed to produce batters and they have only added these bits a pieces just for striking the ball and against Bangladesh they even failed in that.

Gulbaddin has been playing for Afghanistan since 2008. Even back than he was added in the team as a power hitter cause he was into body building. His avg doesnt even go above 20.
Azmatullah cant bat, nabi is past his expiration date.

Karim jannat is also a rubbish batter and now they have bought Kharote who is another allrounder that is primary a bowler.

There are guys like Darwish Rasooli and Bahir Shah that are pure batters but get ignored.

Against Australia, the Australians bottled it. There was no way a guy like Gulbaddin should be taking 4 wickets, thats like faheem ashraf taking a fiver.

Afghanistan is doing well because their bowlers have played alot of cricket in West indies during the CPL and plus because they play spinners alot, their bowling automatically suits these conditions.

Fazalhaq is better than Shaheen for me, he is that good, bur you take fazalhaq out and if naveen has no assistance from the pitch, the pace bowling gets stranded.

There is nothing to learn for Pakistan from the Afghans, simple as that.

The difference between Pakistan and Afghanistan is that, Afghanistan has stopped producing players. They have become abit stunted since 2019. They are still playing their own version of ttfs because back in Afghanistan no new batters or pacers are being produced. They are producing spinners but no batters or pacers.

Pakistan is still producing players, our issue is on the political side, where any random person can become chairman after 1 year, and his focus is to undo what the person before him did and try to do the complete opposite so that they could win credit for it.
 
Afg team played as a 'team' which even teams like India and England failed to do. They mostly relied on individual performance where as these Afghani boys, might not be the best of the best in the world but the support each individual showed each other is unmatched in this world cup. Take the last 2 match for example, the intent to kill AUS/BD chance to be able to qualify for the semi, you could see it in the way the whole team played. It's not just Pakistan, any team would benefit from applying this in their own team
 
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