Which is worse, the Australia ball-tampering scandal or the spot-fixing saga of 2010?

[JattMaula]

Sure but we are not comparing spot fixing and ball tampering controversies for Australian cricket alone here.

This thread is a comparison about the ball tampering incident for Australia and the spot fixing incident for Pakistan. And I maintain that the ball tampering saga damaged the reputation of Australian cricket more than the spot fixing incident did for Pakistan. When the spot fixing saga was unfolding, while people were clearly shocked at a talented youngster falling prey to the bookies, the vibe was more like "here we go, not again" with Pakistan cricket. With Australia, we were witnessing something unprecedented happening and the general reaction among the cricketing media was like "did we just watch what just happened on TV" when Bancroft got caught red handed and the Australian cricket captain nonchalantly admitted to cheating on live TV in the post play press conference.

Only casualties of ball tempering saga was 'Aussie sports exceptionalism'. Their self delusion bursted, nothing more.

Fixing is far far worse in any context.

 

[Last Monetarist]

Fact of the matter is that no one cares about the ball-tampering saga, apart from Cameron Bancroft who paid the ultimate price. Ball tampering will always be treated with a wink and a frown by the authorities as it's not a practice that is considered morally reprehensible at any level of the game, and most cricketers that have played the game to a serious level would have partaken in it in one form or other.

The whole controversy in 2018 was blown up by idiot Australians, including the prime minister, that had no real understanding of the game, and CA in their haste to present a squeaky clean image ahead of the tv rights negotiations with Fox and 7 clamped down hard on it.

No cricket fan in their right mind would have advocated for a year's ban for Smith and Warner when the likes of Faf du Plessis got a slap on the wrist for practically the same offence a few months earlier.

The bigger disgrace for me in the whole saga was not the crime but the punishment.

 

[observer1]

Fact of the matter is that no one cares about the ball-tampering saga, apart from Cameron Bancroft who paid the ultimate price. Ball tampering will always be treated with a wink and a frown by the authorities as it's not a practice that is considered morally reprehensible at any level of the game, and most cricketers that have played the game to a serious level would have partaken in it in one form or other.

The whole controversy in 2018 was blown up by idiot Australians, including the prime minister, that had no real understanding of the game, and CA in their haste to present a squeaky clean image ahead of the tv rights negotiations with Fox and 7 clamped down hard on it.

No cricket fan in their right mind would have advocated for a year's ban for Smith and Warner when the likes of Faf du Plessis got a slap on the wrist for practically the same offence a few months earlier.

The bigger disgrace for me in the whole saga was not the crime but the punishment.

What are you on about ?

Australia - actively change the flow and outcome of a game by tampering a ball with sandpaper. Subsequent series show a massive decline in swing after they were caught cheating. They were putting the opponents at a disadvantage.

Pakistan - effectively disadvantage their own entire team by bowling a handful of no-balls.

I didn't have a problem with Pak players being banned. But to suggest it's worse than sandpapering a ball absolutely asinine.

If anything, Smith and Co should have been banned for longer.

 

[Hasan123]

Pakistani fans will always defend their favorites with no shame.

Amir was a thumb sucking baby and shouldn’t be blamed for fixing because he was influenced by the evil Butt.

Sharjeel is a saint who got framed by Sethi who wanted to make himself look good.

Ajmal was not chucking it was just a conspiracy by BCCI to get him banned.

The list goes on.

Exactly. There is always an excuse. Even when the PSL was postponed, I saw some posters saying it isn't a big deal . The spread of covid19 which could cause deaths isn't a big deal but tampering with a cricket ball is.

 

[Rana]

There are different levels and degrees of cheating just like there are different degrees of crime. In no court of law are all crimes considered equal because “a criminal is a criminal”.

It is not that hard to understand but the problem is that our fans do not live in the real world and cannot overcome their delusional thinking.

I don’t think anyone here needs a lecture on honesty and an unbiased approach on matters from you of all people.

Preach what you do pal.

 

[Last Monetarist]

What are you on about ?

Australia - actively change the flow and outcome of a game by tampering a ball with sandpaper. Subsequent series show a massive decline in swing after they were caught cheating. They were putting the opponents at a disadvantage.

Pakistan - effectively disadvantage their own entire team by bowling a handful of no-balls.

I didn't have a problem with Pak players being banned. But to suggest it's worse than sandpapering a ball absolutely asinine.

If anything, Smith and Co should have been banned for longer.

It's not about the result, it's about the nature of the crime. The perception of ball tampering has always been that it's a necessary evil to get wickets, as long as the umpires turn a blind eye. It's not a moral failing, and is regarded similar to simulation in football or intentionally dangerous rucking in rugby union. Both are against the laws of the sport, but it's not unethical to bend those laws.

Match-fixing or spot-fixing is denigrating the whole nature of sport as a principle in which the competitors are not doing their utmost to win, nor performing to the best of their abilities. It's fundamentally corrupt in nature.

If someone can't appreciate that distinction, I can't really comment.

 

[El Generico]

Cheating to win is bad but it’s no where close to throwing games for money.

 

[King_Kohli]

Ball tampering is worse than fixing.
How come?

 

[Rana]

Ball tampering is worse than fixing.
How come?

There are things such as subtle ball tampering, all teams do it.

Then there is what Australia did. That was another level of cheating tbh.

 

[MP2011]

If anything, Smith and Co should have been banned for longer.

Agree with this. Imagine the heart burn teams/players will be having after knowing truth about Aussies pacers' real capabilities. Tampering a cricket ball is equivalent to doping in my view, both performance enhancing measures when one is short of real talent to change the outcome of a game and hence these short cuts to success.

 

[Rana]

A lot of people are missing the point of the question in the OP due to their natural bias against Pakistan or a blatant attempt to stand out and be counted.

No one disagrees with Match fixing is worse than Ball tampering. So I would request those people who are behaving like they are the only ‘sensible Pakistanis’ in the room to re-evaluate their institutional bias against Pakistan whilst trying to appease Indians who are simply here to reinforce a delusional superiority of an unblemished character in this matter.

Just like there are different levels of fixing (Match, spot, fancy), similarly there are different levels of ball tampering. There are those fielders that purposely throw the ball on the bounce to the keeper at the edge of the square in order to create further rough and tear on the ball in dry conditions. These players, teams have been warned in the past for this as the umpires are not stupid. There have been others who have applied particular types of saliva (gummy bears and chewing gum saliva) in order to alter the shape and condition of the ball. They have been a warned in the past as well. There are those who casually step on the ball with their spikes to also alter the shape of the ball, they have been called out and accused for attempting to gain an unfair advantage.

And then there is what Cameron Bancroft got caught doing (on the guidance of Captain and vice captain). The man is was caught on camera with a suspicious object in his pocket, and then lying to umpires after having placed that object into his under draws. This is embarrassing, and shameful at the highest level in order to try and gain an unfair advantage. Whilst it may not be ‘cheating’ the public or those who have placed legal bets on the match, it is still a severe act of cheating against the opponent who trust that Australia are playing the game in the correct spirit.

Open your eyes, we are not stupid!

 

[OMB]

Spot fixing was worst. Why do I think so?
It clearly showed that matches were in control of external agencies and not the players.

Compare it to other minor transgressions which was mainly on-field and regular mucking attempted by the players to gain undue advantage. It was always done by all teams sometimes inadvertently, like stepping on the pitch or foul sledging or "crossing 30 yards circle" or "waist high full-tosses" or obstructing runners or fielders.

Ball tampering sits somewhere in between the above. It couldn't be done inadvertently and not was it controlled by agencies outside the game.

Of course no team was totally clean and this is where Aussie's got hit hard and overreacted as it was seen as SAF or subcontinental thing. Wonder how Aussies would react if they discovered age-fudgers in their team?

 

[Local.Dada]

Pakistan has had similar accusations about tampering. It’s just that Australia and world cricket made a big deal about this as some kind of violating spirit of the game etc

No brainer it is spot fixing

 

[Bewal Express]

Is this really a question-One was trying to win matches for their country( however unethically) and the other was selling out your country for money.

 

[OMB]

Ball tampering is as common as speeding up when the radar isn't watching. Illegal and wrong but commonly done.

 

[Hasan123]

Ball tampering is as common as speeding up when the radar isn't watching. Illegal and wrong but commonly done.

This is a point I have made. Ball tampering is cheating but it happens, it’s just about who gets caught and who doesn’t. I think stripping Warner and Smith of leadership roles and them missing that year’s IPL was enough punishment. Can’t remember any other player being banned for a year due to ball tampering.

 

[observer1]

It's not about the result, it's about the nature of the crime. The perception of ball tampering has always been that it's a necessary evil to get wickets, as long as the umpires turn a blind eye. It's not a moral failing, and is regarded similar to simulation in football or intentionally dangerous rucking in rugby union. Both are against the laws of the sport, but it's not unethical to bend those laws.

Match-fixing or spot-fixing is denigrating the whole nature of sport as a principle in which the competitors are not doing their utmost to win, nor performing to the best of their abilities. It's fundamentally corrupt in nature.

If someone can't appreciate that distinction, I can't really comment.

You're conflating cheating the spirit of the game to cheating the opponents. A schoolboy can appreciate the distinction. I am of the opinion the latter is worse as you are putting your opponents at an unfair advantage.

I personally have no issues with some of the mild manipulation players have done in the past and got in trouble for. I do have a problem when a team are literal sandpaper and are sanding a cricket ball.

 

[observer1]

Spot fixing was worst. Why do I think so?
It clearly showed that matches were in control of external agencies and not the players.

Compare it to other minor transgressions which was mainly on-field and regular mucking attempted by the players to gain undue advantage. It was always done by all teams sometimes inadvertently, like stepping on the pitch or foul sledging or "crossing 30 yards circle" or "waist high full-tosses" or obstructing runners or fielders.

Ball tampering sits somewhere in between the above. It couldn't be done inadvertently and not was it controlled by agencies outside the game.

Of course no team was totally clean and this is where Aussie's got hit hard and overreacted as it was seen as SAF or subcontinental thing. Wonder how Aussies would react if they discovered age-fudgers in their team?

Bowling a few no-balls doesn't mean "matches were in control of external agencies". This wasn't Azaruddin or Cronje of the 90's where several players were throwing games. It's a couple of chancers making a few quid by bowling a few no-balls in their spell. They deserved punishment - But at no point did they gain an unfair advantage over their opponents like the Aussies were doing.

 

[happydavy]

Is it even a comparison? Selling your country vs cheating to help your country. The only point of creating this thread would be to somehow equate shame the Pakistan trio brought with Australian act, otherwise in any sane person mind it's not even a comparison. Cheating to win is not same as treachery.

 

[Mamoon]

A lot of people are missing the point of the question in the OP due to their natural bias against Pakistan or a blatant attempt to stand out and be counted.

No one disagrees with Match fixing is worse than Ball tampering. So I would request those people who are behaving like they are the only ‘sensible Pakistanis’ in the room to re-evaluate their institutional bias against Pakistan whilst trying to appease Indians who are simply here to reinforce a delusional superiority of an unblemished character in this matter.

Just like there are different levels of fixing (Match, spot, fancy), similarly there are different levels of ball tampering. There are those fielders that purposely throw the ball on the bounce to the keeper at the edge of the square in order to create further rough and tear on the ball in dry conditions. These players, teams have been warned in the past for this as the umpires are not stupid. There have been others who have applied particular types of saliva (gummy bears and chewing gum saliva) in order to alter the shape and condition of the ball. They have been a warned in the past as well. There are those who casually step on the ball with their spikes to also alter the shape of the ball, they have been called out and accused for attempting to gain an unfair advantage.

And then there is what Cameron Bancroft got caught doing (on the guidance of Captain and vice captain). The man is was caught on camera with a suspicious object in his pocket, and then lying to umpires after having placed that object into his under draws. This is embarrassing, and shameful at the highest level in order to try and gain an unfair advantage. Whilst it may not be ‘cheating’ the public or those who have placed legal bets on the match, it is still a severe act of cheating against the opponent who trust that Australia are playing the game in the correct spirit.

Open your eyes, we are not stupid!

There is no need of this word salad because it doesn’t change the fact that you are clutching at straws.

Here is the deal:

Cheating your teammates and your own fans > cheating the opposition.

No matter what extent you go to cheat the opposition and now matter how carefully and meticulously you plan to tamper with the ball, it will never be a bigger crime than cheating your own teammates and your fans by sabotaging the chances of your own team of winning the match.

It is not a hard concept to understand. Unfortunately, some people are struggling with it due to their desperation to defend Pakistani players at all costs.

 

[observer1]

There is no need of this word salad because it doesn’t change the fact that you are clutching at straws.

Here is the deal:

Cheating your teammates and your own fans > cheating the opposition.

No matter what extent you go to cheat the opposition and now matter how carefully and meticulously you plan to tamper with the ball, it will never be a bigger crime than cheating your own teammates and your fans by sabotaging the chances of your own team of winning the match.

It is not a hard concept to understand. Unfortunately, some people are struggling with it due to their desperation to defend Pakistani players at all costs.

Can you show me were anyone is defending the Pakistani players?
Many feel cheating a game to win is far worse than bowling a no-ball. None of them are good.

 

[Mamoon]

Can you show me were anyone is defending the Pakistani players?
Many feel cheating a game to win is far worse than bowling a no-ball. None of them are good.

The people who are clutching at straws to somehow convince the world that the crime of Smith/Warner/Bancroft was worse than that of Butt/Asif/Amir/Sharjeel are the ones defending the Pakistani players.

Those who feel that cheating a game to win is far worse than bowling a no-ball feel that way because they do not understand the gravity of the situation.

It is not simply about bowling a no-ball; it is about deliberately conceding runs to the opposition which can potentially hamper the chances of your team winning the match.

That is why spot-fixing is a bigger crime than ball-tampering. Both are cheating, but the former potentially hurts the chances of your team winning the match while the latter is intended to boost your team’s chances of winning the match.

When Amir and Asif bowled the no-balls, they deliberately conceded 2 extra runs. Pakistan could have lost the Test by 2 runs.

Moreover, they could have dismissed the batsmen on those two no-balls and those batsmen could have gone on to score big runs after that reprieve, allowing them win the match for their team.

That is why spot-fixing is a bigger crime than ball-tampering and cannot be brushed aside as simply “bowling a no-ball”, since the potential implications are far greater.

What the Pakistani trio did in 2010 was by no means worse than Afridi did in Australia earlier that year (when he bit the ball) and that is why a player guilty of spot-fixing will always receive a harsher punishment than a player guilty of ball-tampering.

Spot-fixing is the second biggest crime a cricketer can do on the field. The biggest crime of course is match-fixing, where you ensure from your end that you contribute to your team losing the match.

Spot-fixing is a lesser offense than match-fixing, but it is a far greater offense than ball-tampering. There is no argument and debate over it at all.

 

[Mesozoic]

So sad that Amir was jailed just for "bowling a no-ball".

 

[Indiafan]

Bowling a few no-balls doesn't mean "matches were in control of external agencies". This wasn't Azaruddin or Cronje of the 90's where several players were throwing games. It's a couple of chancers making a few quid by bowling a few no-balls in their spell. They deserved punishment - But at no point did they gain an unfair advantage over their opponents like the Aussies were doing.

Baffling mentality. These players cheated fans like you while you were cheering them on. They were wearing your country's colors and representing your country while bowling for a bookie

I mean if it came out that Imran and his team cheated to win the 1992 World cup, I am sure every Pakistani still would be cheering for them because they did it for their country

To me such mentality comes from a lack of self respect and pride. I personally would never every respect a player who cheated me and my country. It is not a few no balls to me but what they represent. That while i was cheering for them, while they wore the color of my country and represented my country, they bowled for a bookie

I will always respect a player who cheats so that his country wins over someone who bowled for a bookie while representing the country

Also, this mentality seems to be the majority here, which makes me think Pakistani team will take a long time to be up to speed with other countries. This lack of standards and morals is damaging to young players. I personally believe if Asif had not been "pardoned" 4-5 times because of his "talent", Amir would never ever have fixed.

 

[Mamoon]

Bowling a few no-balls doesn't mean "matches were in control of external agencies". This wasn't Azaruddin or Cronje of the 90's where several players were throwing games. It's a couple of chancers making a few quid by bowling a few no-balls in their spell. They deserved punishment - But at no point did they gain an unfair advantage over their opponents like the Aussies were doing.

What is worse? Doing something that gives your team unfair advantage over your opponents or doing something that gives the opponents unfair advantage over your team?

I cannot bellies this needs to be explained.

 

[Babeikh]

Cheating is always bad but spot fixing goes beyond cheating as it is a violation of the social contract that exists between competitor and the wider society - the fans etc, it completely undermines the very purpose of sport.

Yes it is still wrong but I think most people would probably ball tamper etc if they knew they were going to get away with it or if they knew nobody would find out.

Spot fixing though it really takes quite a morally bankrupt pathetic individual to do. To secretly script the action just to earn some extra cash.

Personally I think ball tamperers should be punished by ICC with bans of a few games whereas fixers should never be allowed to play cricket at any level (ok, apart from back garden cricket with their kids) every again. Or be involved with cricket actually, so no coaching or administrative positions etc

 

[MenInG]

What is worse? Doing something that gives your team unfair advantage over your opponents or doing something that gives the opponents unfair advantage over your team?

I cannot bellies this needs to be explained.

Sounds like its OK to be corrupt as long as you are competent argument showing up in a different colour.

Fact is both ball tampering and fixing are Equally bad.

The main point of spectator sport is to present a sporting spectacle where all opponents have equal chances to do their best.

If the outcome of the match is changed by actions of anyone on the field - for whatever reason - the spectators are being cheated.

That is all that matters - which is the fact that spectators are assured that what they are witnessing is untainted by any unfair advantage.

 

[Rana]

There is no need of this word salad because it doesn’t change the fact that you are clutching at straws.

Here is the deal:

Cheating your teammates and your own fans > cheating the opposition.

No matter what extent you go to cheat the opposition and now matter how carefully and meticulously you plan to tamper with the ball, it will never be a bigger crime than cheating your own teammates and your fans by sabotaging the chances of your own team of winning the match.

It is not a hard concept to understand. Unfortunately, some people are struggling with it due to their desperation to defend Pakistani players at all costs.

You keep doing what you do pal.

Don’t read the argument, and continue to enforce your institutional bias. Hope it gives you the mental peace that you deserve

 

[Gilly]

Sounds like its OK to be corrupt as long as you are competent argument showing up in a different colour.

Fact is both ball tampering and fixing are Equally bad.

The main point of spectator sport is to present a sporting spectacle where all opponents have equal chances to do their best.

If the outcome of the match is changed by actions of anyone on the field - for whatever reason - the spectators are being cheated.

That is all that matters - which is the fact that spectators are assured that what they are witnessing is untainted by any unfair advantage.

So players like Imran and Wasim who tampered with the ball are just as bad as Asif, Butt and Amir.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

If fixing and ball tampering are equivalent, the Wasim/Waqar and Imran as guilty as Asif and Butt..
lol.. Strawman arguments.

 

[MenInG]

So players like Imran and Wasim who tampered with the ball are just as bad as Asif, Butt and Amir.

Firstly - who told you they tampered? That is a serious allegation and is libelous - seems to be bandied about by some people here as and when they feel like.

Secondly - my view is that instead of getting into semantics of what whether it is fixing/tampering etc - think of why it is wrong

The spectators go to a game to watch a fair game being played.

ANY action which stops that from happening is WRONG.

 

[OMB]

Bowling a few no-balls doesn't mean "matches were in control of external agencies". This wasn't Azaruddin or Cronje of the 90's where several players were throwing games. It's a couple of chancers making a few quid by bowling a few no-balls in their spell. They deserved punishment - But at no point did they gain an unfair advantage over their opponents like the Aussies were doing.

Bowling a few no balls lol is giving an external agency control of the game. What makes you sure that it will stop at few no balls, tomorrow it can be throwing a wicket or spilling a catch etc.
Seems you are trying to justify spot fixing as in your mind it is an isolated incidence. If you only knew the influence bookies had and the money they were rolling in.
I am not saying Ball tampering isnt bad. Sandpaper and spot fixing both are against the spirit of the game. However question was which one is worse?
Relatively speaking spot fixing is worse.

 

[JattMaula]

People are still seriously debating this?

I'm lost for words. Really concerning situation if people can't understand why spot-fixing is worse than ball tempering.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

Firstly - who told you they tampered? That is a serious allegation and is libelous - seems to be bandied about by some people here as and when they feel like.

Secondly - my view is that instead of getting into semantics of what whether it is fixing/tampering etc - think of why it is wrong

The spectators go to a game to watch a fair game being played.

ANY action which stops that from happening is WRONG.

Waqar was the first player ever at the Test and International level to be suspended and fined for tampering the ball during the match against South Africa, under the ICC Code of Conduct. He was working on the ball with his nails. It is out in the open.

Fixing is way way above in terms of cheating your country for a few quids.

 

[MenInG]

Waqar was the first player ever at the Test and International level to be suspended and fined for tampering the ball during the match against South Africa, under the ICC Code of Conduct. He was working on the ball with his nails. It is out in the open.

Fixing is way way above in terms of cheating your country for a few quids.

Calling someone a ball-tamperer as if he was constantly doing it versus talking about a specific instance are 2 different things. You know exactly what you are writing.

Once again fixing/cheating etc are all terms that mean that the outcome of the game is changed by unfair means.

In that sense, these are all the same.

 

[Mamoon]

Sounds like its OK to be corrupt as long as you are competent argument showing up in a different colour.

Fact is both ball tampering and fixing are Equally bad.

The main point of spectator sport is to present a sporting spectacle where all opponents have equal chances to do their best.

If the outcome of the match is changed by actions of anyone on the field - for whatever reason - the spectators are being cheated.

That is all that matters - which is the fact that spectators are assured that what they are witnessing is untainted by any unfair advantage.

No they are not. Ball-tamperers cheat the opposition; fixers cheat their own teammates.

Ball-tampering sabotages the chances of the opposition winning the match; fixing sabotages the chances of your own team.

This is why a ball-tamperer will never receive a harsher punishment than a fixer.

 

[Mamoon]

Firstly - who told you they tampered? That is a serious allegation and is libelous - seems to be bandied about by some people here as and when they feel like.

Secondly - my view is that instead of getting into semantics of what whether it is fixing/tampering etc - think of why it is wrong

The spectators go to a game to watch a fair game being played.

ANY action which stops that from happening is WRONG.

Imran Khan stated in his autobiography that he tampered with the ball. So would you agree that he is a bigger criminal than Butt, Asif and Amir?

 

[BreadPakoda]

Calling someone a ball-tamperer as if he was constantly doing it versus talking about a specific instance are 2 different things. You know exactly what you are writing.

Once again fixing/cheating etc are all terms that mean that the outcome of the game is changed by unfair means.

In that sense, these are all the same.

We don't know if Ozzies were doing it constantly either.

 

[MenInG]

Imran Khan stated in his autobiography that he tampered with the ball. So would you agree that he is a bigger criminal than Butt, Asif and Amir?

Did he tamper with the ball in international cricket? Which games did he tamper the ball in?

Also I feel you are unable to understand what I am saying.

ALL efforts to change the outcome of a game are EQUALLY bad.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

Cheating against opposition Vs Cheating against your own team. I think Spot Fixing is worse.

 

[Mamoon]

Did he tamper with the ball in international cricket? Which games did he tamper the ball in?

Also I feel you are unable to understand what I am saying.

ALL efforts to change the outcome of a game are EQUALLY bad.

Once again - all efforts to change the outcome of a game are not equally bad. The distinction between cheating your teammates and cheating your opponents matters.

It is not only a matter of opinion but it also has legal implications, which is fixers always get a lengthier ban compared to tamperers.

Imran stated in his book that he tampered with the ball using bottle-caps. It is common knowledge that the “art” of reverse-swing passed from to Sarfaraz Nawaz to Imran to Wasim/Waqar was achieved with doctoring with the ball using bottle-caps.

It is not merely an allegation. If fans want to live in denial it is up to them.

 

[Gilly]

Did he tamper with the ball in international cricket? Which games did he tamper the ball in?

Also I feel you are unable to understand what I am saying.

ALL efforts to change the outcome of a game are EQUALLY bad.

So Afridi biting on the ball which is trying to change the outcome of the game just as bad as match fixing?.

 

[Varun]

Said it before and I'll say it again.

Cheating to lose is worse than cheating to win. The former instance also involves the underworld and other such nefarious elements.

 

[Buffet]

For me,

Amir or Hansie's actions are far worse than Waqar's/Smith's actions.

 

[NishanKonar]

Lol at some of the comments here

Cheating your own nation is always much worse than cheating our opponents !

 

[observer1]

Bowling a few no balls lol is giving an external agency control of the game. What makes you sure that it will stop at few no balls, tomorrow it can be throwing a wicket or spilling a catch etc.
Seems you are trying to justify spot fixing as in your mind it is an isolated incidence. If you only knew the influence bookies had and the money they were rolling in.
I am not saying Ball tampering isnt bad. Sandpaper and spot fixing both are against the spirit of the game. However question was which one is worse?
Relatively speaking spot fixing is worse.

I'm not defending anyone. They deserved to be banned.

I'm saying in the scope of things, Australia potentially altered entire series because of their cheating.

 

[observer1]

It's not about the result, it's about the nature of the crime. The perception of ball tampering has always been that it's a necessary evil to get wickets, as long as the umpires turn a blind eye. It's not a moral failing, and is regarded similar to simulation in football or intentionally dangerous rucking in rugby union. Both are against the laws of the sport, but it's not unethical to bend those laws.

Match-fixing or spot-fixing is denigrating the whole nature of sport as a principle in which the competitors are not doing their utmost to win, nor performing to the best of their abilities. It's fundamentally corrupt in nature.

If someone can't appreciate that distinction, I can't really comment.

Sanding the paper is a necessary evil?

Yoi right, you need not comment

 

[Last Monetarist]

You're conflating cheating the spirit of the game to cheating the opponents. A schoolboy can appreciate the distinction. I am of the opinion the latter is worse as you are putting your opponents at an unfair advantage.

Not really.

To use the football analogy, it's the difference between an egregious dive by Mohamed Salah when he's not been touched and Harry Kane diving when he feels a slight tug on his shirt. Both are cheating the opponent and betting on the official not able to spot that fact. Ball-tampering falls very much in the same category.

 

[Last Monetarist]

Sanding the paper is a necessary evil?

Yoi right, you need not comment

Casual sophistry isn't going to help you.

 

[MenInG]

2018 - March 24th

All hell broke loose when on day three of the Cape Town Test, Cameron Bancroft and Steven Smith admitted to ball-tampering after TV cameras picked up Bancroft trying to shove a small yellow object - which turned out to be sandpaper - down his trousers, having earlier used it on the ball. At a press conference after play that day, Smith said the team's leadership group had discussed tampering while looking for a way to get the ball to reverse. Cricket Australia had Smith and David Warner, his vice-captain, step down from their posts on day four of the Test - a day when South Africa wrapped up a huge win, with Morne Morkel, playing his final series, taking career-best figures of 9 for 110. The board then banned Smith and Warner, who they said had hatched the whole plan, for a year, and Bancroft for nine months from international and domestic cricket.

 

[Ashraful_Rox]

Unpopular opinion: Bowling a few no balls for financial freedom is not cheating, it's a step towards sustainable future. I wonder who ratted them out? ICC was harsh on Asif, Amir & Butt. After loosing magician Asif Pakistan cricket just became more dull.

Asif didn't fix to loose, he fixed for a few no balls which is all right. Ball tampering is blatant cheating

 

[sweep_shot]

Fixing is much worse obviously.

Ball tampering is also a despicable act.

 

[Rana]

Unpopular opinion: Bowling a few no balls for financial freedom is not cheating, it's a step towards sustainable future. I wonder who ratted them out? ICC was harsh on Asif, Amir & Butt. After loosing magician Asif Pakistan cricket just became more dull.

Asif didn't fix to loose, he fixed for a few no balls which is all right. Ball tampering is blatant cheating

They were definitely throwing games too

 

[Kianig89]

Lords 2010 our worst Test followed by Sydeny 2010 Mohail 11 our worst Odi