White Privilege - does it exist?

[RajBan]

Well, I haven’t noticed.

British POC often hold anger about colonialism and the Iraq War and so on which I think is justified, but it is directed at the establishment and not personally at me or mine.

I’ve faced discrimination from other socioethnic groups of white people, mind.

Every body discriminates everybody when they are in majority. However the difference is some communities acknowledge and try to be rational to whatever extent they can even though absolute standards are not possible, while the other set of group simply are indifferent and oblivious of rights of anybody else. And then there is a third category who discriminates gleefully in majority, expects rationality when in minority and calls themselves victims at the slightest opportunity.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Every body discriminates everybody when they are in majority. However the difference is some communities acknowledge and try to be rational to whatever extent they can even though absolute standards are not possible, while the other set of group simply are indifferent and oblivious of rights of anybody else. And then there is a third category who discriminates gleefully in majority, expects rationality when in minority and calls themselves victims at the slightest opportunity.

Can you give your no doubt unbiased opinion on who that third category might be?

 

[RajBan]

Can you give your no doubt unbiased opinion on who that third category might be?

I am talking more in terms of people. It's difficult to generalize the third category as a community as I am pretty sure not one or two community has a patent on the same.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I am talking more in terms of people. It's difficult to generalize the third category as a community as I am pretty sure not one or two community has a patent on the same.

So you were just making a generic point about generic people sometimes gleefully adopting victim mentality when in the minority, and being oblivious of minority rights when they are in the majority. Quite a specific set of characteristics without anybody specific in mind.

 

[RajBan]

So you were just making a generic point about generic people sometimes gleefully adopting victim mentality when in the minority, and being oblivious of minority rights when they are in the majority. Quite a specific set of characteristics without anybody specific in mind.

Not generic. Seen quite a few individuals behave like that

 

[Saj]

Of course discrimination based on the race is bad.

But I believe people use racism and discrimination as a tool to hate on white folks.

Feel free to start a thread on it.

 

[Saj]

I was in a well-known store today waiting in the queue for the checkouts when I noticed an employee was handing out vouchers to all customers. Well most customers, anyway.

As she approached me I noticed her facial expression change and she didn't hand me a voucher, glared at me and walked past me.

I looked at the queue and noticed that I was the only person of colour in the line.

Anyway I wasn't desperate for a voucher and ignored the incident. But then on the way out I noticed she was at the door saying goodbye and thanks to customers leaving the shop.

Again she turned her face at seeing me and ignored me.

I thought I'm not going to let you get away with this again. I smiled and said to her, are the vouchers and the greetings only for people of a certain race? She seemed embarrassed and said "no, I didn't see you." I said to her you clearly saw me but ignored me, not once, but twice.

Anyway her manager was nearby and he came over asking if everything was ok. I said, all is ok with me, but it seems your employee here has a problem greeting people of colour or handing vouchers to them. I made my point smiled and left the store.

I think people shouldn't stay quiet and let these racists get away with it, which is what they expect will happen.

 

[the Great Khan]

I was in a well-known store today waiting in the queue for the checkouts when I noticed an employee was handing out vouchers to all customers. Well most customers, anyway.

As she approached me I noticed her facial expression change and she didn't hand me a voucher, glared at me and walked past me.

I looked at the queue and noticed that I was the only person of colour in the line.

Anyway I wasn't desperate for a voucher and ignored the incident. But then on the way out I noticed she was at the door saying goodbye and thanks to customers leaving the shop.

Again she turned her face at seeing me and ignored me.

I thought I'm not going to let you get away with this again. I smiled and said to her, are the vouchers and the greetings only for people of a certain race? She seemed embarrassed and said "no, I didn't see you." I said to her you clearly saw me but ignored me, not once, but twice.

Anyway her manager was nearby and he came over asking if everything was ok. I said, all is ok with me, but it seems your employee here has a problem greeting people of colour or handing vouchers to them. I made my point smiled and left the store.

I think people shouldn't stay quiet and let these racists get away with it, which is what they expect will happen.

I worked in the BBC for nearly 3 years. I can tell you it exists..and I'll leave it at that..

 

[Saj]

Had to go to a hotel today to interview someone.

There was a security guy at the door. I said hello to him and explained that I was there to do an interview and showed him my pass. He looked me up and down and said I couldn't go in. I asked why and he mumbled some rubbish. I asked him to explain why I couldn't go in. He said because everyone going in is a resident at the hotel.

I said I have watched you for the last few minutes and you weren't asking anyone (all white folk) if they were residents at the hotel and I come here and suddenly you stop me from going in.

Anyway I walked past him and said if you have a problem with me going in, tell the hotel manager and I will speak with him without any problem.

Surprise surprise, he shut up and didn't even speak to the hotel manager.

 

[daytrader]

Starbucks ordered to pay $26m to manager fired ‘for being white’

A jury has awarded $25.6 million (£20 million) in damages to a Starbucks manager who claimed she was sacked for being white.

Shannon Phillips was fired in the aftermath of a furore following the arrest of two black customers at a Philadelphia branch of the coffee chain in 2018.

According to her lawyer, Ms Phillips was a “sacrificial lamb” as Starbucks struggled to contain the torrent of bad publicity.

The coffee behemoth had shut branches and ordered staff to undergo racial bias training as it found itself the target of nationwide protests.

Ms Phillips was not involved in the Philadelphia incident which triggered outrage when the two men, who had been waiting for a friend, were led away in handcuffs.

Supervising about 100 Starbucks outlets in the region, Ms Phillips was ordered to put a white store manager at the branch on administrative leave as the company tried to repair the reputational damage it had suffered.

She refused to do so because he was not involved in the incident and because allegations that he had been involved in discriminatory conduct were untrue.

In her lawsuit, Ms Phillips, who had worked for Starbucks for 13 years, alleged that the company targeted her and other white employees in and around Philadelphia as part of its attempt at damage control.

At the same time, the manager of the branch who triggered the outcry, and was black, faced no disciplinary action.


...
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/worl...p&cvid=8473babda1924178b7a96e59478e0311&ei=22

 

[daytrader]

Affirmative action: US Supreme Court overturns race-based college admissions

The US Supreme Court has ruled that race can no longer be considered as a factor in university admissions.

The landmark ruling upends decades-old US policies on so-called affirmative action, also known as positive discrimination.

It is one of the most contentious issues in US education.

Affirmative action first made its way into policy in the 1960s, and has been defended as a measure to increase diversity.

US President Joe Biden said he "strongly" disagreed with Thursday's much-anticipated decision.

"We cannot let this decision be the last word," he said. "Discrimination still exists in America."

"This is not a normal court," he added of the nine justices, who are ideologically split between six conservatives and three liberals.

Education Secretary Miguel Cardona told BBC News that the court "took away a very important tool that university leaders used to ensure diversity on campus".

"However what it didn't take away is the intent to ensure that our colleges are made up of beautifully diverse students, much like our country is," he continued, adding that the White House will issue guidance to universities with instruction on how to legally maintain diversity.

The ruling covered two cases involving admissions at Harvard and the University of North Carolina (UNC). The court ruled 6-3 against UNC and 6-2 against Harvard.

The justices sided with an organisation called Students for Fair Admissions, founded by legal activist Edward Blum.

The group argued before the court last October that Harvard's race-conscious admissions policy violated Title VI of the 1964 Civil Rights Act, which bars discrimination based on race, colour or national origin.

...
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-65886212

 

[BouncerGuy]

Labour backs idea of teaching children about white privilege

Labour has backed the idea of teaching children about white privilege with a shadow minister saying it is “a good idea”.

Shadow culture secretary Thangam Debbonaire said children need “the opportunity to ask difficult questions sometimes of our nation’s history”, insisting it would not be “undermining” Britain.

She was asked about children’s charity Barnado’s, which was criticised for publishing a “guide for parents” about white privilege.

The term refers to inherent advantages possessed by white people over non-white people on the basis of their race, with examples including a lower likelihood of being stopped and searched by police.

The Barnado’s guide encouraged parents to “start the conversation with others who are interested and willing to learn” and to “teach your white friends, family and colleagues about their privilege”.

Ms Debonnaire was asked whether she supported the guide, and told BBC Radio 4’s World at One programme: “We need education that allows children the opportunity to question, to ask difficult questions sometimes of our nation’s history.

"That’s a strong country that’s able to look at itself and its history and say ‘are there things we could have done differently? Are there things we regret? Are there even things that we’re sorry about?

“But also are there things we can learn so that we make a stronger, better country for the future?”

Ms Debbonaire went on to say that “encouraging children to be questioning is a good idea” and is “part of any really good education”.

And she added: “Questioning our symbols thinking about what they mean doesn’t mean that you’re undermining them.

“It means that you’re looking at them and thinking, how can I appreciate these symbols and what their meaning is?”

Her comments stand in stark contrast with culture secretary Lucy Frazer, who has said the idea of white privilege is a “debate” and not a fact.

While education secretary, Ms Frazer told LBC radio: “We’ve basically said: ‘Look, here’s what we should be teaching, we should have balanced debate’.

“There is a lot of debate in the country, we should be able to have those debates. We should be able to have those open discussions, but you shouldn’t be teaching things as fact that are debates.”

Outspoken backbench Tory MP Jonathan Gullis went further, saying anyone using the term should be reported to the Home Office as an extremist.

The Independent in 2021 obtained a leaked recording in which Mr Gullis said anti-racism campaigners using the term should be referred to the government’s Prevent programme – which is meant to track down potential terrorists.

Ms Debbonaire’s embrace of the sometimes controversial term came as Labour attacked the Tories for engaging in constant culture wars in a bid to stoke division ahead of this year’s general election.

Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer used a speech to set out his opposition to years of the Conservatives “waging war” on institutions such as the National Trust and tjhe Royal National Lifeboat Institution (RNLI).

He condemned the Tories’ “McCarthyite” anti-woke attacks on British institutions as he promised to end years of “divisive” culture wars should he win the next election.

Ms Debbonaire was asked whether it marked a change of footing for Labour, but insisted the party “has always wanted to defend our national institutions… whether that is the National Trust or the BBC”.
​

SOURCE: The Independent

 

[khanz141]

100% it exists

In corporate America, If you are white then you have to be just average at your job and very easily you can move up the ladder in your career but for any other color, you really have to be exceptional to get that promotion or you hear thousands of excuses why it can't happen. It's something I have experienced multiple times in my career.

 

[Mamoon]

These days, the greatest privilege is LGBQT. They are mentally sick, mad people but they will have their way in the western world in almost every field.

 

[Mamoon]

White privilege exists but this privilege would exist in non-white culture but except that non-whites are not developed enough to impose this privilege.

For example, people blaming corporate America for bias towards white employees. Same would happen in corporate Pakistan if you had Africans working alongside Pakistani employees. Who would be more likely to get fired due to bad performance? Obviously the Africans.

It is human nature to protect your own. To protect the majority. Don’t blame white privilege when your country is not developed or advanced enough to attract workers from other countries.

Don’t blame the West when you or your parents had to leave your home country for the West to live a better life.

It is funny that people who complain about white privilege and discrimination make a million excuses if you ask them why don’t they return to their home countries if they are so bothered and impacted by the white privilege and discrimination in the West.

They won’t admit it but deep down they accept the fact that in spite of the white privilege and discrimination, they have lived and are living a much better life in the West than they other parents did in their home countries.

All this talk is limited to social media only. In the real world, they are standing in line to get their western passports renewed with smiles on their faces.

 

[sweep_shot]

It used to be a thing in the past. I think it is less now.

I live in Canada and white population here is now less than 70%. Other 30%+ are visible minorities/aboriginals.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Africans have black privilege in Africa. Indians have Indian privilege in India. Pakistanis have Pakistani privilege in Pakistan.

Wherever you are in majority, you will have that privilege.

America has been a white nation since 1700's. Of course white people have that privilege. It is changing now as Liberals flooded the country with millions of colored people.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Present white people as a community are the least racist and the most accommodating of any other race or community.

 

[khanz141]

White privilege exists but this privilege would exist in non-white culture but except that non-whites are not developed enough to impose this privilege.

For example, people blaming corporate America for bias towards white employees. Same would happen in corporate Pakistan if you had Africans working alongside Pakistani employees. Who would be more likely to get fired due to bad performance? Obviously the Africans.

It is human nature to protect your own. To protect the majority. Don’t blame white privilege when your country is not developed or advanced enough to attract workers from other countries.

Don’t blame the West when you or your parents had to leave your home country for the West to live a better life.

It is funny that people who complain about white privilege and discrimination make a million excuses if you ask them why don’t they return to their home countries if they are so bothered and impacted by the white privilege and discrimination in the West.

They won’t admit it but deep down they accept the fact that in spite of the white privilege and discrimination, they have lived and are living a much better life in the West than they other parents did in their home countries.

All this talk is limited to social media only. In the real world, they are standing in line to get their western passports renewed with smiles on their faces.

That is the most absurd thing I ever heard, it almost makes no sense. You want people to get out of a Western country just because they are not white??

Living a happy life doesn't meant you deny that white privilege doesn't exist.

 

[Mamoon]

That is the most absurd thing I ever heard, it almost makes no sense. You want people to get out of a Western country just because they are not white??

Living a happy life doesn't meant you deny that white privilege doesn't exist.

If white privilege and the discrimination was such a major problem for you people, you would have left your adopted home and returned to where you or your parents came from.

But clearly, you lot realize that in spite of the white privilege and discrimination, living in the western countries is more beneficial for you than returning to your homeland.

Therefore, there is no purpose in complaining about it.

 

[MK7Z]

If white privilege and the discrimination was such a major problem for you people, you would have left your adopted home and returned to where you or your parents came from.

But clearly, you lot realize that in spite of the white privilege and discrimination, living in the western countries is more beneficial for you than returning to your homeland.

Therefore, there is no purpose in complaining about it.

Basically what you are saying is. " If you don't like it go back to where you come from" obviously without the expletives that normally come with that sentence.

White Privilege exists in all forms of life especially in the UK. What you find is that non whites have to work twice as hard in such scenarios. I have many examples where I have witnessed it and hated it but that doesn't mean I am going to go crying back to my motherland.

Change takes effort and sacrifice and if we want the situation to improve then we must champion change in any way we can for our future generations. Our parents went through daily racism and discrimination when they 1st came here but they rode it out so that my generation can build a future for us. We are in a better state than we were then.

I'd hope that in 20 years from now white privilege is not around as much but if we run away then the likelihood of that decreases.

By merely affirming its existence is not justification to go back to where I come from which for most people is the UK anyway.

 

[Mamoon]

Basically what you are saying is. " If you don't like it go back to where you come from" obviously without the expletives that normally come with that sentence.

White Privilege exists in all forms of life especially in the UK. What you find is that non whites have to work twice as hard in such scenarios. I have many examples where I have witnessed it and hated it but that doesn't mean I am going to go crying back to my motherland.

Change takes effort and sacrifice and if we want the situation to improve then we must champion change in any way we can for our future generations. Our parents went through daily racism and discrimination when they 1st came here but they rode it out so that my generation can build a future for us. We are in a better state than we were then.

I'd hope that in 20 years from now white privilege is not around as much but if we run away then the likelihood of that decreases.

By merely affirming its existence is not justification to go back to where I come from which for most people is the UK anyway.

It is not white privilege. It is (insert majority) privilege and it exists in every country, but white privilege is highlighted more because western countries attract millions of immigrants because they can offer a quality of life that their home countries cannot.

This privilege will always be there. It is human nature and it cannot be eradicated, but when you look at the number of immigrants living and thriving in the West, it is not difficult to accept that in spite of this privilege, white people as a community are extremely accommodated and nowhere near as racist as the ungrateful immigrants like to claim.

Please note that I said as a community. Of course there are racist groups and individuals but as an overall community, it cannot be that bad when you look at the number of immigrants and expats living in the West and acquiring a western passport remains the number one goal for a vast majority of Pakistanis and others.

This is why, it is pretty pointless to talk about white privilege when clearly it can’t be a big problem when you look at the numbers.

 

[KingKhanWC]

It is not white privilege. It is (insert majority) privilege and it exists in every country, but white privilege is highlighted more because western countries attract millions of immigrants because they can offer a quality of life that their home countries cannot.

This privilege will always be there. It is human nature and it cannot be eradicated, but when you look at the number of immigrants living and thriving in the West, it is not difficult to accept that in spite of this privilege, white people as a community are extremely accommodated and nowhere near as racist as the ungrateful immigrants like to claim.

Please note that I said as a community. Of course there are racist groups and individuals but as an overall community, it cannot be that bad when you look at the number of immigrants and expats living in the West and acquiring a western passport remains the number one goal for a vast majority of Pakistanis and others.

This is why, it is pretty pointless to talk about white privilege when clearly it can’t be a big problem when you look at the numbers.

I think there is more white privilege in India and Pakistan. White folks seems to be treated as superiour humans on many occasions.

 

[Technics 1210]

I think there is more white privilege in India and Pakistan. White folks seems to be treated as superiour humans on many occasions.

Spot on. Seems to me the usual suspects have no idea of what white privilege means.

 

[Mamoon]

I think there is more white privilege in India and Pakistan. White folks seems to be treated as superiour humans on many occasions.

There is a lot of white privilege in India and Pakistan. It is true, but there is also a good reason for it.

The British changed the culture and the socio-economic, political, academic and sporting dynamics of the subcontinent. We are still utilizing their infrastructure.

When Quaid-e-Azam liberated the newly formed nation of Pakistan from imperial Britain, the people of Pakistan decided to repay him by leaving Pakistan to sing God Save The Queen to get their hands on the British passport.

Those who that stayed back, either by choice or due to lack of opportunity, lived and worked in a system that was left behind by the British.

 

[Mamoon]

Spot on. Seems to me the usual suspects have no idea of what white privilege means.

White privilege is not rocket science. People understand what it means. If we were to summarize it one sentence, it is simply the benefits and advantages white people enjoy over others under the same circumstances.

But it is important understand the ramifications of white privilege. Perhaps you do understand it but you don’t want to talk about it because it doesn’t suit your narrative.

How many non-white people have left or continue to leave the West because of white privilege? Surely there can’t be many.

Similarly, millions of non-whites like yourself continue to live in the West and have no intention or desire or need to return to where you came from which means that white privilege isn’t a significant problem or a hurdle for you and your families.

Furthermore, if it is a problem, you do understand that you are living a better life in a white privileged society than you would in your home country which is why you are happy to continue to live in the West.

Therefore, there is no point in talking about white privilege until the day people like you decided to leave the West because you can no longer cope with it.

 

[MK7Z]

White privilege is not rocket science. People understand what it means. If we were to summarize it one sentence, it is simply the benefits and advantages white people enjoy over others under the same circumstances.

But it is important understand the ramifications of white privilege. Perhaps you do understand it but you don’t want to talk about it because it doesn’t suit your narrative.

How many non-white people have left or continue to leave the West because of white privilege? Surely there can’t be many.

Similarly, millions of non-whites like yourself continue to live in the West and have no intention or desire or need to return to where you came from which means that white privilege isn’t a significant problem or a hurdle for you and your families.

Furthermore, if it is a problem, you do understand that you are living a better life in a white privileged society than you would in your home country which is why you are happy to continue to live in the West.

Therefore, there is no point in talking about white privilege until the day people like you decided to leave the West because you can no longer cope with it.

I think you need to look at the reason of immigration and how people ended up in the west. Also while you are at it read up on the British History.

Has it occurred to you that the likelihood is that people cant just go back to their motherland? Syrians, Iraqis ( kurds) Somalis, yemenis, Jamaicans, Africans even Pakistanis and Indians. The reason they can't is because of the country they are in and what they have done to their motherland. So why cant they complain about white privelage? An example of white privelage is invading and attacking countries without ramifications

 

[KingKhanWC]

There is a lot of white privilege in India and Pakistan. It is true, but there is also a good reason for it.

The British changed the culture and the socio-economic, political, academic and sporting dynamics of the subcontinent. We are still utilizing their infrastructure.

When Quaid-e-Azam liberated the newly formed nation of Pakistan from imperial Britain, the people of Pakistan decided to repay him by leaving Pakistan to sing God Save The Queen to get their hands on the British passport.

Those who that stayed back, either by choice or due to lack of opportunity, lived and worked in a system that was left behind by the British.

You version of events, which also confirms you see certain folks superiour.

Another version is the Brits colonised, turned the richest land into one of the poorest. Some decided to move to improve their families economic conditions instead of staying in a nation to indulge in corruption to improve those conditions.


You'd move now even if economically ok, if you could.

Privilege can also be seeing others as superior.

 

[Mamoon]

I think you need to look at the reason of immigration and how people ended up in the west. Also while you are at it read up on the British History.

Has it occurred to you that the likelihood is that people cant just go back to their motherland? Syrians, Iraqis ( kurds) Somalis, yemenis, Jamaicans, Africans even Pakistanis and Indians. The reason they can't is because of the country they are in and what they have done to their motherland. So why cant they complain about white privelage? An example of white privelage is invading and attacking countries without ramifications

Those displaced by war in the Middle East and Afghanistan cannot be grouped with Pakistanis, Indians and others whose home countries are perfectly livable.

These people left for the West not because they were displaced but because of better opportunities - to enjoy a relatively better standard of living, better lifestyle, better security and better future for their children.

That is perfectly reasonable and absolutely nothing wrong with it, but then these people shouldn’t complain about white privilege because (a) if it was such a big hurdle for them they would come back to Pakistan/India and (b) in spite of the white privilege, they are enjoying a better life than they would have in Pakistan/India.

 

[Mamoon]

You version of events, which also confirms you see certain folks superiour.

Another version is the Brits colonised, turned the richest land into one of the poorest. Some decided to move to improve their families economic conditions instead of staying in a nation to indulge in corruption to improve those conditions.


You'd move now even if economically ok, if you could.

Privilege can also be seeing others as superior.

You see the whites as superior, which is why you carry a passport that bears allegiance to the queen and you pay taxes to the British government than have funded the War on Terror and killed millions of Muslims.

You also pay you taxes to a government that supports Israel.

I might leave Pakistan in the future if I outlive my parents and I come across a good opportunity in the West or in the Gulf but if I do go to the West I will have no issues with white privilege.

I shouldn’t expect the same treatment as the majority. I have a lot of family in the UK, they moved in the 80s and 90s and I find it funny when they talk about white privilege but when you ask them why they don’t come back to Pakistan if that white privilege is such a problem, they start making a million excuses.

 

[MK7Z]

You see the whites as superior, which is why you carry a passport that bears allegiance to the queen and you pay taxes to the British government than have funded the War on Terror and killed millions of Muslims.

You also pay you taxes to a government that supports Israel.

I might leave Pakistan in the future if I outlive my parents and I come across a good opportunity in the West or in the Gulf but if I do go to the West I will have no issues with white privilege.

I shouldn’t expect the same treatment as the majority. I have a lot of family in the UK, they moved in the 80s and 90s and I find it funny when they talk about white privilege but when you ask them why they don’t come back to Pakistan if that white privilege is such a problem, they start making a million excuses.

It's a King now

 

[Mamoon]

It's a King now

I know, but that doesn’t matter. What matters is the crown, and people of Pakistan who have pledged allegiance to the crown after Quaid-e-Azam liberated them from the crown should not be complaining about white privilege.