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Who would win a limited war between India and China?

Who would win a limited war between India and China?


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Keyboard-warriors are on full-force..

I can see Indians- Pakistanis being happy at each other’s misfortune. It’s only natural for them. But what amazes me is cowardice of these posters. Human lives are lost at the border conflict. And most of you would hide inside your house if you meet a barking dog on the street. And yet you have gallbladder to make fun of these soldiers?

How amusing yet typical!

I joined this forum to enjoy and celebrate Pakistan cricket. For me the glass is always half full when it comes to cricket . However I have also seen plenty here from the other side to make me want to take it he p*** because I have learnt that no matter what, I will have to read things that would infuriate me as there are posters who will look for every opportunity to ridicule and demean the country of my parents, my origin.

Countless times, I have seen offers of friendships initiated by Pakistanis rebuffed and insulted by the Indian counterparts everywhere. I have repeatedly read narratives of how Pakistan is a beggar nation, how it’s economy is pathetic, how it’s a terrorist nation and supports terrorism. Who did this? Who says these things? Why do you cry now?
 
I joined this forum to enjoy and celebrate Pakistan cricket. For me the glass is always half full when it comes to cricket . However I have also seen plenty here from the other side to make me want to take it he p*** because I have learnt that no matter what, I will have to read things that would infuriate me as there are posters who will look for every opportunity to ridicule and demean the country of my parents, my origin.

Countless times, I have seen offers of friendships initiated by Pakistanis rebuffed and insulted by the Indian counterparts everywhere. I have repeatedly read narratives of how Pakistan is a beggar nation, how it’s economy is pathetic, how it’s a terrorist nation and supports terrorism. Who did this? Who says these things? Why do you cry now?

Yep. If one reads the comments of Dawn, Youtube, twitter, you will always find them there. Even if the topic has nothing to do with India. And unfortunately majority of the times it is there to mock Pakistanis.
 
For our NRI friend here who believed in the US/Indo alliance was thinking this, heading to the Indian Ocean.

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But got this...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/WATCH?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#WATCH</a> No formal plans on that: White House Press Secretary Kayleigh McEnany when asked if US President Trump will mediate between India and China <a href="https://t.co/F4rV4U02T3">pic.twitter.com/F4rV4U02T3</a></p>— ANI (@ANI) <a href="https://twitter.com/ANI/status/1273326970193850368?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">June 17, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
Global Times not coming in slow...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">17 Indian soldiers having died after a violent encounter with no shots fired indicates their physical conditions were not fit for deployment to such a harsh environment: A PLA veteran <a href="https://t.co/mvpINWyp0j">https://t.co/mvpINWyp0j</a> <a href="https://t.co/nTHh5760H8">pic.twitter.com/nTHh5760H8</a></p>— Global Times (@globaltimesnews) <a href="https://twitter.com/globaltimesnews/status/1273367387321049089?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">June 17, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
The latest breaking news is that John Bolton alleges in his upcoming book that Trump asked Xi for help with reelection. The devil is in the details of course, but this adds a new twist to things. Maybe Trump will flex some muscle towards China in order to distance himself from the allegation, or it may turn out to be the exact opposite.
 
China would win a limited war between the two countries, but India could use soft power to win the longer war using integration, yoga, vegetarian diet which is healthy, and Bollywood celebrities like Priyanka and Aishwairya Rai.
 
China would win a limited war between the two countries, but India could use soft power to win the longer war using integration, yoga, vegetarian diet which is healthy, and Bollywood celebrities like Priyanka and Aishwairya Rai.

I see you left Gandhi off the soft power list after the recent statue toppling drama...
 
Trump then, stunningly, turned the conversation to the coming U.S. presidential election, alluding to China’s economic capability and pleading with Xi to ensure he’d win,” Bolton wrote, in the most in-depth, damaging portrayal by a Trump administration insider to date and just days after former defense secretary Jim Mattis accused the president of trying to divide America.

This doesn’t bode well for those hoping US would attack China in case of a India-China war. Indians should hope for a Biden win.
 
Regardless of who wins the election, looking likely that it would be Biden right now, India would be utter fools to expect any help from the US.
 
New Delhi: A day after inconclusive talks over the face-off in eastern Ladakh, a Major General of the Indian Army is holding talks with Chinese military officers at Galwan valley. The talks being held are in the area where violent clashes between Indian and Chinese soldiers took place on Monday night. 20 soldiers including a Colonel gave their lives for India, while Army sources have said they believe some 45 Chinese soldiers were killed or injured.

At the moment, there are no signs of the Chinese disengaging from the area, sources said. The area is close to the Line of Actual Control or LAC between India and China in eastern Ladakh.

China overran Indian posts in this area in the 1962 war, but since then has not frequently patrolled this area and has not asserted any territorial claims. They now lay claim to the entire Galwan valley, which places them in a direct stand-off with the Indian Army.

Chinese soldiers took "pre-meditated and planned action" that was directly responsible for Monday's clash at Galwan valley, Foreign
India wants restoration of the status quo along the LAC that prevailed before May when the first reports of Chinese incursions started appearing.

Talks between Major Generals of India and China were inconclusive on Wednesday.

In a similar meeting on June 6, Lieutenant General-level talks were held to end the stand-off at Pangong Tso and a number of other areas in eastern Ladakh. In the over four-and-a-half-hour meeting, Indian had pressed for restoration of status quo and immediate withdrawal of a sizeable number of Chinese troops from all the stand-off points.

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/ind...-ladakh-face-off-2248121?pfrom=home-topscroll
 
If these two countries go to war, then Kashmir will get it’s freedom as Pakistan will grab this opportunity.

We tried to “grab the opportunity” in 1965 when India were weakened after getting hammered by China in 1962 and had a weak PM at the helm.

We all saw how that attempt to grab the opportunity panned out. “Lenay ke denay pargaye” and we had to flee from Kashmir to save Lahore, a misadventure that we today proudly celebrate as “Defense Day”.
 
The U.S. are giving India F-21s for China.

And it will take years before these F-21s are mastered by IAF. I drive a BMW, but if you all of the sudden give me submarine, I will be clueless.
 
We tried to “grab the opportunity” in 1965 when India were weakened after getting hammered by China in 1962 and had a weak PM at the helm.

We all saw how that attempt to grab the opportunity panned out. “Lenay ke denay pargaye” and we had to flee from Kashmir to save Lahore, a misadventure that we today proudly celebrate as “Defense Day”.

1965 was too late, it should have been in 1962.

China asked Pakistan to intervene in 1962, but Pak didn’t. And in 1965 Pakistan asked the Chinese to join in but China was reluctant. So now it’s 1-1.

This time, both can start from scratch. But let’s see.
 
And it will take years before these F-21s are mastered by IAF. I drive a BMW, but if you all of the sudden give me submarine, I will be clueless.

Wars are rarely fought in the short-term. Boosting IAF serves USA’s purpose of negating Chinese threat in the region.

Besides, there will be no further escalation now either. India is well aware of the fact that no one is going to join forces with them if they embark on a misadventure.
 
Wars are rarely fought in the short-term. Boosting IAF serves USA’s purpose of negating Chinese threat in the region.

Besides, there will be no further escalation now either. India is well aware of the fact that no one is going to join forces with them if they embark on a misadventure.

Lol, if you think Chinese will get scared by USA selling F-21s to India, I am afraid you are very naive.
 
1965 was too late, it should have been in 1962.

China asked Pakistan to intervene in 1962, but Pak didn’t. And in 1965 Pakistan asked the Chinese to join in but China was reluctant. So now it’s 1-1.

This time, both can start from scratch. But let’s see.

It was never too late or early. We need to realize that Kashmir has become a battle of ego for India. They will continue to ensure that Pakistan is not able to grab an inch of Jammu &Kashmir in spite of all the big talk.

Kashmir is also a battle of ego for Pakistan, but we backed ourself into a tight spot when we got conned by India into signing the Simla Agreement, and now we cannot do anything apart from making bombastic speeches.
 
India, China army officers hold talks: Report

Top Indian and Chinese military officers are holding talks in the disputed Galwan Valley to find a resolution to their month-long standoff, India's NDTV network has reported.

The first round of talks held on Wednesday following the killing of 20 Indian soldiers by Chinese troops on Monday had remained inconclusive.

Galwan Valley, which lies along the Line of Actual Control (LAC) between India and China in eastern Indian-administered Ladakh, is claimed by both nations.
 
Source? From what I know it's not happening.

It’s all over. Why do you think it is not happening?

Unless I have missed some very latest development, the arrangement between Lockheed Martin and Tata to produce F-21s in India is still on.
 
It’s all over. Why do you think it is not happening?

Unless I have missed some very latest development, the arrangement between Lockheed Martin and Tata to produce F-21s in India is still on.

post your source or be silent on the issue. They have shelved it as of last month. No F21's.
 
The U.S. are giving India F-21s for China.

the F21'S will not be a threat for China. They are a threat for Pakistan. The IAF will never take on the PLAAF. ever. They barely made it back alive against us. They have zero chance in a EW heavy netcentric environment, where the PLA will take down Indias defences without firing a shot.

You are aware that Chinese equipment was used to jam multiple instances of western hardware during the balakot fiasco? the IAF has zero chance against the PLAAF.
 
Forget sophisticated weapons!


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An image has emerged showing a crude weapon purportedly used by Chinese forces in the fatal brawl along China's disputed border with India on Monday.

The fight in the Galwan Valley left at least 20 Indian soldiers dead and raised tensions between the two powers.

China did not acknowledge any casualties among its forces. Both sides accused the other of an incursion.

The border between the two nations in the region is poorly demarcated and can shift with topographical changes.

The image that emerged on Thursday showed crude weapons that appeared to be made from iron rods studded with nails. It was passed to the BBC by a senior Indian military official on the India-China border, who said the weapons had been used by the Chinese.

Defence analyst Ajai Shukla, who first tweeted the image, described the use of such weapons as "barbarism". The absence of firearms in the clash dates back to a 1996 agreement between the two sides that guns and explosives be prohibited along the disputed stretch of the border, to deter escalation.

The image was widely shared on Twitter in India, prompting outrage from many social media users. Neither Chinese or Indian officials commented on it.

Media reports said troops clashed on ridges at a height of nearly 4,267m (14,000 ft) along a steep terrain, with some soldiers falling into the fast-flowing Galwan river in sub-zero temperatures.

First deaths in four decades

The two sides have brawled along the disputed border in recent weeks, but Monday's clash was the first to lead to fatalities in at least 45 years. Unconfirmed reports in Indian media said at least 40 Chinese soldiers died, but China is yet to issue any information about casualties. Some Indian soldiers are still believed to be missing.

Chinese foreign ministry spokesman Zhao Lijian said India had crossed the border twice, "provoking and attacking Chinese personnel, resulting in serious physical confrontation between border forces on the two sides", the AFP news agency reported.

China on Wednesday claimed "sovereignty over the Galwan Valley region" - a claim rebutted by India as "exaggerated and untenable".

Members of the public in both nations have since staged protests over the clashes in the disputed Himalayan border area, while officials have spoken cautiously and moved towards a diplomatic resolution.

Indian foreign ministry spokesperson Anurag Srivastava said the foreign ministers of both countries had shared a phone conversation on Wednesday on the developments and "agreed that the overall situation should be handled in a responsible manner".

"Making exaggerated and untenable claims is contrary to this understanding," Mr Srivastava was quoted as saying by Press Trust of India news agency.

An Indian government statement after Subrahmanyam Jaishankar's conversation with China's Wang Yi said Chinese forces tried to erect a structure on the Indian side of the de facto border, the Line of Actual Control (LAC).

The statement accused the Chinese of a "premeditated and planned action that was directly responsible for the resulting violence and casualties" and urged China to "take corrective steps".

Meanwhile, a Chinese statement quoted Mr Wang as saying: "China again expresses strong protest to India and demands the Indian side launches a thorough investigation... and stop all provocative actions to ensure the same things do not happen again."

Why were there no guns?
The Galwan river valley in Ladakh, with its harsh climate and high-altitude terrain, lies along the western sector of the LAC and close to Aksai Chin, a disputed area claimed by India but controlled by China.

This is not the first time the two nuclear-armed neighbours have fought without conventional firearms on the border. India and China have a history of face-offs and overlapping territorial claims along the more than 3,440km (2,100 mile), poorly drawn LAC separating the two sides.

The last firing on the border happened in 1975 when four Indian soldiers were killed in a remote pass in the north-eastern state of Arunachal Pradesh. The clash was variously described by former diplomats as an ambush and an accident. But no bullets have been fired since.

At the root of this is a 1996 bilateral agreement that says "neither side shall open fire... conduct blast operations or hunt with guns or explosives within two kilometres of the Line of Actual Control".

But there have been other tense confrontations along the border in recent weeks. In May Indian and Chinese soldiers exchanged physical blows on the border at Pangong Lake, also in Ladakh, and in the north-eastern Indian state of Sikkim hundreds of miles to the east.

India has accused China of sending thousands of troops into Ladakh's Galwan Valley and says China occupies 38,000 sq km (14,700 sq miles) of its territory. Several rounds of talks in the last three decades have failed to resolve the boundary disputes.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-53089037
 
War unlikely, say experts

India and China said they were communicating through military and diplomatic channels, and stressed the importance of their broader relationship. Experts say the two nations were unlikely to head to war, but that easing tensions quickly will be difficult.

On Thursday, India's foreign ministry spokesman Anurag Srivastava said Foreign Minister Subrahmanyam Jaishankar will take part in a trilateral virtual meeting with Russia and China next week.

But the deadly Himalayan clash has also fanned growing anti-Chinese sentiments in India, which were already high because of the coronavirus pandemic, which began in China late last year. India's caseload has climbed to fourth-highest in the world

Emotions were on display in the southern city of Hyderabad, where thousands watched the funeral procession of Colonel B Santosh Babu, one of the casualties in Monday's clash.

An Indian business confederation called for a boycott of 500 Chinese goods, including toys and textiles, to express "strong criticism" of China's action in Ladakh.

Source Al Jazeera
 
India's Hindutva government clearly didn't learn their lesson year with Pakistan; couldn't aim straight and ended up destroying trees.

In which figment of an imagination does one think India would stand a chance against China, give Pakistan's befitting response last year?

This all electioneering.
 
Will India Side With the West Against China? A Test Is at Hand

The United States and its allies have long wanted India’s help in confronting China. Now, a deadly border clash seems likely to push India in that direction.

For years, the United States and its allies have tried to persuade India to become a closer military and economic partner in confronting China’s ambitions, painting it as a chance for the world’s largest democracy to counterbalance the largest autocracy.

This week, the idea of such a confrontation became more real as Indian and Chinese soldiers clashed in the worst violence on the countries’ border in 45 years, leaving 20 Indian troops dead and causing an unknown number of Chinese casualties.

Prime Minister Narendra Modi has publicly reveled in the prospect of a more muscular role for India in the region and the world. But analysts say the new tensions with China will be the starkest test yet of whether India is ready — or truly willing — to jostle with a rising power bent on expanding its interests and territory.

With China facing new scrutiny and criticism over the coronavirus pandemic, Indian officials have recently seemed emboldened, taking steps that made Western diplomats feel that their goal of an India closer to the West was starting to be realized. And some believe the friction with China will push India even further in that direction.
This month, India signed a major defense agreement with Australia that allows both countries to use each other’s military bases. And it is expected to invite Australia to join naval exercises it conducts with Japan and the United States, to strengthen efforts by the so-called Quad — Australia, Japan, the United States and India — to counter China’s projection of sea power in the region.

India’s campaign for a larger profile in multinational organizations has also moved quickly. On Wednesday, it was elected unopposed to a nonpermanent seat on the United Nations Security Council. And in May, it won the chair of the World Health Organization’s executive board, where it promptly supported calls to investigate the origins of the coronavirus — an inquiry China had fought to block.

But India is still well behind China when it comes to military and economic power. That may give India’s leaders pause over the prospect of an armed escalation on their disputed Himalayan border, where the bloody clashes broke out this week.

“India will have to deploy all three — military, economic and political options,” said the president of the New Delhi-based Observer Research Foundation, Samir Saran, who is close to India’s foreign minister. “China is a large and powerful country, and a sustained response to their aggression will have to include all of these.”

“The defense of liberalism and democracy and an international open system will play out between India and China,” he said.

Chinese and Indian generals continue to meet along the border to discuss de-escalation efforts. And Indian officials acknowledged on Friday that the night before, China released 10 Indian soldiers seized during the fighting. (Later, China’s foreign ministry spokesman said he did not know of any prisoners being taken, but did not explicitly deny India’s announcement.)

But the troop buildup is continuing, with villagers in the area and satellite imagery indicating that both sides are still sending in reinforcements. On Friday, Mr. Modi scheduled a closed-door meeting with top opposition leaders to discuss what India will do next.

While India’s military is one of the world’s largest, it has failed to modernize and stay competitive. This year, India announced a military budget of nearly $74 billion, compared with Beijing’s $178 billion. In India’s case, much of that spending is going to pay pensions.

Economically, India has become more willing to use its vast market as a lever to pressure China. In April, it passed legislation requiring government approval for any investments from Chinese entities, a setback for China as its companies look abroad for growth. And Reuters reported on Thursday that India planned to raise tariffs on Chinese goods.

Diplomats expect India to prevent the Chinese telecommunications giant Huawei from entering its market to build a 5G wireless network. The United States accuses Huawei of aiding the Chinese government in cyberespionage, and it has urged its allies to block the company’s 5G development.

Although India’s potential buying power gives it one way to slap at China, it has nowhere near the spending and lending capacity that China has used to increase its global influence.

Still, Indian officials have embraced the idea of being a democratic counterbalance to China, and the coronavirus has offered a chance to push that narrative as countries fume over Beijing’s handling of the pandemic.

Indian political figures went on the offensive after the pandemic began, criticizing China’s authoritarian system and its lack of transparency as the coronavirus spread beyond the city of Wuhan, where it is widely thought to have begun.

Vijay Gokhale, who recently retired as India’s foreign secretary and is still close to the government, wrote a lengthy opinion piece this month in which he blasted China’s handling of the pandemic. “The shortcomings of the regime,” he wrote, “will further fuel a debate on the superiority of the Chinese model as an alternative to democracy. Will this form the ideological underpinning for the birth of a new Cold War?”

The pandemic also gave Mr. Modi a chance to tap his country’s giant pharmaceutical industry to strengthen diplomatic ties. Diplomats stationed in India say that in the early days of the crisis, he and his foreign minister were “constantly working the phones” to offer countries help with medicines.

One Western diplomat felt that the coronavirus crisis had made India more eager to build stronger relationships to help it deal with China, and that diplomacy with India was going more smoothly than ever before.

“Everyone is more willing, privately, to talk about what to do with China in a post-Covid world,” the diplomat said, speaking on condition of anonymity. “The ways that China has influenced that world order can now more easily be discussed as we are all trying to figure out what the new world order is.

“India represents one path,” the diplomat added, “and China represents another.”

A photo released Wednesday by the Indian government showed Prime Minister Narendra Modi paying tribute to the Indian soldiers killed in the border clash.

A photo released Wednesday by the Indian government showed Prime Minister Narendra Modi paying tribute to the Indian soldiers killed in the border clash.Credit...India Government Press Information Bureau, via Associated Press
More immediately, India faces the prospect of an escalation at the border, where China had been building up its forces before the violence this week. On Wednesday, Mr. Modi broke his silence to promise a tough response.

“India wants peace,” he added, “but if provoked, India is capable of giving a befitting reply.”

China’s push at the border is not an isolated show of strength. Since the pandemic’s start, China has flexed harder on many different fronts: It sank a Vietnamese shipping boat, harassed Malaysian oil rig operations and tightened its control over Hong Kong in hopes of stamping out the pro-democracy movement there.

But India has several reasons to feel particularly hemmed in by China. Over the past decade, China has heavily courted India’s neighbors, unraveling New Delhi’s influence on its own doorstep.

As Indian and Chinese troops clashed in the Himalayas, Nepal’s government simultaneously claimed a sliver of territory on its border that India considers its own. India’s defense minister recently suggested that Nepal’s border actions were taken at the behest of China.

In Pakistan, India’s archrival, China is building huge infrastructure projects, some in territory that the Indian government disputes. With every project built, China is making it harder for India to hold on to its territorial claims.

And right off India’s southern coast, China took possession of a port in Sri Lanka after that country could not pay its debt to Beijing. Some Indian officials fear that China could militarize the port, which Sri Lanka denies.

“India went from having a monopoly of political and military power in the region to dealing with a marketplace of competition where China is increasingly predominant,” said Constantino Xavier, a fellow at the Brookings Institution. He predicted that the new wave of border violence would prompt India to push back harder.

Some see China’s buildup on the border as a calculated effort to keep India’s aspirations in check.

“China doesn’t particularly want India to succeed,” said Tanvi Madan, the director of the India Project at the Brookings Institution. “A weaker India will do less strategically in its own neighborhood, allowing China to step in more; and it will engage less in places like East Africa or in regional institutions, posing little challenge to China.”

China has also been sensitive about the prospects of closer ties between India and the West.

On Wednesday, Global Times, a mouthpiece for the Chinese Communist Party, published an editorial claiming that the United States had given Mr. Modi’s government false confidence, and that it would ultimately abandon India.

“The resources that the U.S. would invest in China-India relations are limited,” the editorial read. “What the U.S. would do is just extend a lever to India, which Washington can exploit to worsen India’s ties with China.”

Despite warm meetings between Mr. Modi and President Trump, their countries’ relationship has at times been rocky. But given China’s increasingly hard line in territorial disputes, some Indian officials fear there may be little choice but to look West.

In an opinion piece on Tuesday, Mr. Gokhale, the former Indian foreign secretary, said that countries could no longer ignore Beijing’s transgressions and must choose between the United States and China.

“In the post-Covid age,” he wrote, “enjoying the best of both worlds may no longer be an option.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/19/world/asia/india-china-border.html
 
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The stand-off between India and China along the Line of Actual Control (LAC) in Ladakh region has created a tense situation at the international border. There have been efforts from both sides to defuse the tension but no breakthrough has been achieved so far.

Indications are that the situation might deteriorate further. So, it becomes important to compare the military might of the two countries. On paper, the Chinese military appears to be stronger than India. But in reality, Indian soldiers are better equipped to fight in extreme climates, according to an analysis published in HT’s sister publication Hindustan.

It is a well-known fact that China spends more on the defence sector. In 2019, it allocated $261 billion for the defence sector. In comparison, India spent a little over $71 billion.

China might have more weapons, but India is ahead in terms of number of soldiers. India has around 34 lakh soldiers whereas China has 27 lakh. The Belfer Centre for Science and International Affairs in Harvard Kennedy School says that India’s Air Force is more powerful than China’s.

The Mirage 2000 and Sukhoi 30 that India have give Indian Air Force an edge over China’s J10, J11 and Su-27 fighter jets. India also has all-weather multirole aircraft, whereas only the J10 in China has this capability.

India also has more experience in fighting wars then China. It has fought many wars with Pakistan over the years and won all of them. China, on the other hand, fought the last war in Vietnam in 1979.

When it comes to high altitude warfare, India is better prepared than China here too. There are many aircraft in India which are capable of flying at high altitudes, whereas Chinese pilots have to fly with limited supplies and fuel due to difficult weather conditions in their airbases near Tibet.

Both India and China are nuclear powered countries. What makes this comparison interesting is that India keeps on participating in war exercises with other big countries like the US, France, the UK etc. The Americans can help Indians with intelligence inputs in case the situation deteriorates further. China, on the other hand, has been fighting many countries on too many fronts, the latest being on the spread of the coronavirus disease.

https://www.hindustantimes.com/indi...ence-forces/story-OHXDNM1X3al4DBSohTgZRI.html
 
A war that could be catastrophic for the loser and for the region.
 
_b24219d2-b24e-11ea-87e9-7390d9ea5414.jpg



The stand-off between India and China along the Line of Actual Control (LAC) in Ladakh region has created a tense situation at the international border. There have been efforts from both sides to defuse the tension but no breakthrough has been achieved so far.

Indications are that the situation might deteriorate further. So, it becomes important to compare the military might of the two countries. On paper, the Chinese military appears to be stronger than India. But in reality, Indian soldiers are better equipped to fight in extreme climates, according to an analysis published in HT’s sister publication Hindustan.

It is a well-known fact that China spends more on the defence sector. In 2019, it allocated $261 billion for the defence sector. In comparison, India spent a little over $71 billion.

China might have more weapons, but India is ahead in terms of number of soldiers. India has around 34 lakh soldiers whereas China has 27 lakh. The Belfer Centre for Science and International Affairs in Harvard Kennedy School says that India’s Air Force is more powerful than China’s.

The Mirage 2000 and Sukhoi 30 that India have give Indian Air Force an edge over China’s J10, J11 and Su-27 fighter jets. India also has all-weather multirole aircraft, whereas only the J10 in China has this capability.

India also has more experience in fighting wars then China. It has fought many wars with Pakistan over the years and won all of them. China, on the other hand, fought the last war in Vietnam in 1979.

When it comes to high altitude warfare, India is better prepared than China here too. There are many aircraft in India which are capable of flying at high altitudes, whereas Chinese pilots have to fly with limited supplies and fuel due to difficult weather conditions in their airbases near Tibet.

Both India and China are nuclear powered countries. What makes this comparison interesting is that India keeps on participating in war exercises with other big countries like the US, France, the UK etc. The Americans can help Indians with intelligence inputs in case the situation deteriorates further. China, on the other hand, has been fighting many countries on too many fronts, the latest being on the spread of the coronavirus disease.

https://www.hindustantimes.com/indi...ence-forces/story-OHXDNM1X3al4DBSohTgZRI.html

Good and interesting info but it still doesn’t shed a light on why Indian soldiers got beaten up in straight hand to hand fight?

Is it poor training, poor equipment, weaker physique/malnutrition or all of these???

Indians should seriously pay attention to the physical fitness of their soldiers.
 
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I put, no clear victor because I didn't wanna put that Chinese would whoop our ****. Scarily, if Modi gets heat, he would use our soldiers to his political advantage and order a small attack on the Chinese, claim great exagerrated victory which will keep our people and media happy.
 
A significant change in Rules of Engagement (ROE) by the Indian Army following the Galwan Valley skirmish that left 20 Indian soldiers dead gives “complete freedom of action” to commanders deployed along the contested Line of Actual Control (LAC) to “handle situations at the tactical level,” two senior officers said on Saturday on condition of anonymity.

The commanders will no longer be bound by restrictions on the use of firearms and will have full authority to respond to “extraordinary situations” using all resources at their disposal, said one of the officers cited above.

The amendment in ROE comes after Indian and Chinese soldiers engaged in their first deadly conflict in 45 years in Galwan Valley on June 15, resulting in death of 20 Indian army troops and several Chinese casualties.

In his remarks during an all-party meeting on Friday, Prime Minister Narendra Modi said the army had been given the freedom to take necessary steps along the border and India had conveyed its position (to China) through diplomatic means.

“With the changes in the ROE, there’s nothing that limits the ability of Indian commanders to take whatever action they deem necessary on the LAC. ROE have been amended to address the brutal tactics being employed by Chinese troops,” said the second officer cited above.

The seven-hour Galwan Valley clash marked the first time India suffered combat fatalities in an incident involving Chinese troops since 1975. Changes in ROE were imminent after a series of violent clashes along the border, with the army finally deciding not to restrict the scope of response of its soldiers after the June 15 clash, the second officer said.

“Two violent clashes took place in Pangong Tso (May 5-6) and Galwan Valley (around mid-May) before the June 15 skirmish in eastern Ladakh. On all occasions, they came in huge numbers and assaulted our troops with iron roads and nail-studded clubs. Our troops fought back fearlessly but the ROE had to be revisited,” he said.

Forward troops keep their guns slung on their backs with the magazines in pouches and not clipped on.

“Since soldiers are allowed to carry weapons while patrolling the LAC, it is inherent that they can use the firearms in unprecedented situations like the attack in Galwan Valley,” said former Northern Army commander Lieutenant General ** Jaswal (retd).

The government said on Thursday that soldiers involved in the June 15 clash with Chinese troops were carrying weapons and ammunition but did not open fire as they were following border agreements between the two countries -- a remark that came in response to a question from Congress leader Rahul Gandhi on whether the Indian soldiers were sent in “unarmed”.

“Let us get the facts straight. All troops on border duty always carry arms, especially when leaving post. Those at Galwan on 15 June did so. Long-standing practice (as per 1996 & 2005 agreements) not to use firearms during faceoffs,” external affairs minister S Jaishankar tweeted, responding to a post by Gandhi earlier this week.

Border agreements from 1996 and 2005 between India and China disallow the use of firearms during face-offs. Article 6 of the agreement on confidence-building measures in the military field along the LAC, signed by India and China in November 1996, states that both sides will not open fire or “conduct blast operations or hunt with guns or explosives within two kilometers from the Line of Actual Control”.

Top retired commanders and China watchers, however, said that Galwan clash and last month’s Pangong Tso brawl were not classical face-offs between rival troops but were extremely violent attacks on Indian soldiers.

https://www.hindustantimes.com/indi...inary-times/story-pCcFAcSAkMRschq50Tom1L.html
 
HYDERABAD: India has detected unusual movement of China’s People’s Liberation Army Air Force (PLAAF) along the border in Ladakh and put in place its own strategy to respond to any contingency, Chief of Air Staff Air Chief Marshal RKS Bhadauria said on Saturday.

In Hyderabad for the combined graduation day parade at Air Force Academy, Dundigal, he said the Indian Air Force (IAF) was aware of China’s air bases and the deployment along the LAC. “During summer, there are usual exercises. But at this time, we have noticed more than usual deployment. We have taken necessary action,” he said while explaining why IAF had moved its aircraft to the forward air bases.

Asked if India would go to war with China, the air chief said: “No, we are not at war with China. But we are prepared for any contingency. All efforts are being made to solve the situation at the LAC peacefully.”

In the backdrop of the biggest confrontation with Beijing in over five decades on June 15 in which 20 Indian soldiers, including a Colonel, were killed, the IAF chief said these were “unacceptable Chinese actions”. “We will never let the sacrifice of our braves of Galwan go in vain,” he asserted.

Asked if China had an advantage over India, the air chief said, “Rest assured, our armed forces are capable of handling the situation.”
However, Bhadauria would not go into details on whether the Chinese army had crossed 2km into the LAC. “Have faith in the Indian Army. It has come out with information about what happened. We don’t have to give any message to the adversary because the adversary knows our capacity,” he said and added that air patrolling in the Ladakh region has been increased.

On indigenous production of aircraft for India, he said the design of LCA Mk2 is progressing and in next 15 years, IAF will have 300 aircraft all manufactured indigenously. “We have to now create an eco-system for manufacturing,” he said.

As many as 123 graduating officers were awarded the President’s Commission during the the combined graduation parade on Saturday. Eleven officers of the Indian Navy and Coast Guard also earned their wings apart from two officers of Vietnam Air Force, who too passed out.

In his speech, the Air Chief paid tributes to Colonel Santosh Babu and 19 soldiers who were killed in the clash with Chinese soldiers. “Their gallant actions in a highly challenging situation have demonstrated our resolve to protect the sovereignty of our country – at any cost,” he said.

He said the graduating officers would go straight to their units and not take a break. “The security scenario in our region mandates our armed forces to remain prepared and vigilant at all times,” he added.

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com...e-detected-iaf-chief/articleshow/76488427.cms
 
New Delhi: India and China will hold top military talks on the Chinese side of the border to discuss the Galwan face-off and other points of dispute. Lieutenant General-level talks will be held at Moldo on the Chinese side of Chushul in eastern Ladakh.
"All issues will be discussed including Galwan and the Fingers area," said army sources.

The last time a meeting at this level was held was on June 6, when India and China agreed to pull back troops in attempts to de-escalate after weeks of tension and build-up.

On June 15, 20 soldiers died and 76 were injured in a deadly clash that broke out over the Chinese refusing to remove a tent as part of what was agreed on June 6. Indian soldiers were assaulted with crude and barbaric weapons used by the Chinese troops, including nail-studded clubs, spiked rods and stones. Army sources said 45 Chinese soldiers were killed or injured in the brawl along Galwan River.

Yesterday, at a meeting between Defence Minister Rajnath Singh, Chief of Defence Staff Bipin Rawat and three service chiefs, it was decided that army would change its rules of engagement with the Chinese at the Line of Actual Control (LAC). Field commanders have been empowered to sanction use of firearms under ''extraordinary'' circumstances.

"India wants peace but will retaliate if provoked by the Chinese," sources said after the meeting.

Prime Minister Narendra Modi had earlier also said the Army has been given full freedom to deal with the on-ground situation.

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/sen...-to-be-discussed-2250096?pfrom=home-topscroll
 
India-China Border Face-off Latest News Live Update: The Corps Commanders of the Indian and Chinese armies are holding another round of talks at the Chushul-Moldo border personnel meeting point in eastern Ladakh to de-escalate the ongoing tension between the two countries due to the Galwan clashes last week. The first meeting between Lt General Harinder Singh, Commander of the XIV Corps with his Chinese counterpart Maj General Liu Lin, Commander of South Xinjiang Military Region, had taken place on June 6 at the same place.

Meanwhile, the BJP today responded to senior Congress leader Manmohan Singh’s letter to Prime Minister Narendra Modi, and urged his party to “stop insulting our forces”. “Dr Manmohan Singh belongs to the same party which: Helplessly surrendered over 43,000 km of Indian territory to the Chinese!” BJP president J P Nadda tweeted.

In his letter to Modi, Singh said that the prime minister “must always be mindful of the implications of his words” and must not allow China to “use his words as a vindication of their position” on the present standoff along the Line of Actual Control (LAC).

Earlier in the day, Defence Minister Rajnath Singh left for Russia for a trilateral meeting with China this morning. Moscow is emerging a key player amid the tension between New Delhi and Beijing. Over the last few weeks, Moscow has been more engaged with New Delhi.

https://indianexpress.com/article/i...st-news-live-updates-border-tensions-6470292/
 
India, China commanders meet after border clash amid calls for boycott of Chinese goods

NEW DELHI (Reuters) - Indian and Chinese military commanders met on Monday to try to ease tensions at their disputed Himalayan border as the public mood hardened in India for a military and economic riposte following the worst clash in more than five decades.

Major Indian traders called for a boycott of Chinese goods and the state of Maharashtra, home to India’s financial capital of Mumbai, put three initial investment proposals from Chinese companies worth 50 billion rupees ($658 million) on hold, just days after signing the agreements.

India said 20 of its soldiers were killed in a clash last Monday with Chinese troops in a major escalation of a weeks-long standoff between the nuclear-armed Asian giants in the western Himalayas.

An Indian government source said commanders met in Moldo, on the Chinese side of the Line of Actual Control, the de facto border dividing India’s Ladakh region from the Chinese held Aksai Chin.

The meeting lasted several hours, with the Indian side pushing China to withdraw its troops back to where they were in April, a second Indian government source said.

China, in previous rounds of talks, had asked India to stop all construction work in what it says is Chinese territory.

Soldiers fought with rocks, metal rods and wooden clubs at the Galwan Valley last Monday after a weeks-long standoff.

China has not disclosed how many casualties it suffered, though an Indian minister has said around 40 Chinese soldiers may have been killed.

Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Zhao Lijian told a briefing in Beijing on Monday that the two sides were in communication through diplomatic and military channels.

Many in India have called for Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s nationalist government to show it will not be bullied, remembering their country’s humiliation in a brief border war against China in 1962.

Members of an Indian traders’ body made a bonfire of Chinese goods at a market in New Delhi, pushing for a nationwide boycott of products made in China.

The Confederation of All India Traders (CAIT), which represents some 70 million traders, has asked federal and state governments to support a boycott of Chinese goods and cancel government contracts awarded to Chinese companies.

“The entire nation is filled with extreme anger and intensity to give a strong befitting response to China not only militarily but also economically,” CAIT National General Secretary Praveen Khandelwal wrote in a letter to chief ministers of some Indian states.

In prosperous Maharashtra, the government said it was putting three investment plans, including from Great Wall Motor Co, on hold.

“In the current environment we will wait for the federal government to announce a clear policy regarding these projects,” industries minister Subhash Desai said.

China is India’s second-biggest trading partner, with bilateral trade worth $87 billion in the fiscal year ending March 2019, and a trade deficit of $53.57 billion in China’s favour, the widest India has with any country.

The editor-in-chief of China’s Global Times newspaper warned that the “nationalists of India need to cool down”.

“China’s GDP is five times that of India, military spending is three times,” Global Times editor Hu Xijin said in a post on Twitter.

The Global Times is published by the People’s Daily, the official newspaper of China’s ruling Communist Party.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ls-for-boycott-of-chinese-goods-idUSKBN23T16R
 
Indian jets fly over Galwan as China again blames India for clash

Indian fighter jets have roared over a flashpoint Himalayan region as part of a show of strength even as China again accused India of provoking the border clash earlier this month that killed at least 20 soldiers.

Indian jets regularly took off on Wednesday from a military base in Leh, the main Indian town in the contested Indian-administered Ladakh region, and headed towards the mountainous border 240km (150 miles) away.

There were also checkpoints on main roads outside Leh and a frenzy of military activity around the main town, which lies at an altitude of 3,500 metres (11,500 feet).

Residents reported long lines of military trucks and artillery on roads near Leh.

"We now have a good strength present in the area," an official of the Indian army's Northern Command told AFP news agency on condition of anonymity, referring to the reinforcements.

Tashi Chhepal, a retired Indian army captain who has served in the area and is based in Leh, said the mobilisation was unprecedented in a sensitive region touching Pakistan as well as China.

"I haven't seen this kind of military movement before," he told AFP.

'Unilateral provocation'
Meanwhile, China's defence ministry on Wednesday said the June 15 border clash in the disputed Galwan Valley was caused by the Indian side.

Chinese troops had taken "defensive measures and determinedly counterattacked against the Indian side's violent actions, successfully protecting national sovereignty and territorial integrity", the Chinese ministry said on its social media account.

The Indian actions violated a consensus between the two countries and were a unilateral provocation, it said.

Chinese foreign ministry spokesman Zhao Lijian also asserted that the confrontation occurred on China's side of the Line of Actual Control (LAC) - the de facto border dividing the two nuclear powers - and that Indian forces had illegally entered Chinese territory.

"The responsibility is entirely not on the Chinese side," Zhao said at a daily news briefing on Wednesday.

"The reckless actions by the Indian military seriously violated agreements signed between the two countries and seriously violated the basic principles of international relations. They were evil in nature and the consequences were severe," Zhao said.

Asked why China was offering such a lengthy defence of its position when the two sides had already agreed to reduce tensions, Zhao said it was to counter a "large amount of fake news" on the matter being circulated by Indian diplomats and the country's media.

An Indian federal minister earlier this week claimed 40 Chinese soldiers were also killed in the Galwan Valley clash, but did not provide any evidence. China has not released any information on casualties on its side.

After the latest round of talks between military commanders on Monday and Tuesday, Zhao had earlier said the two sides had "agreed to take necessary measures to promote a cooling of the situation".

Experts say a major reason behind India-China tensions is New Delhi's unilateral move last year to abrogate the partial autonomy of the former Jammu and Kashmir state, which also included the disputed areas in Ladakh region.

China has also objected to India inaugurating the 255km (158-mile) Darbuk-Shyok-Daulat Beg Oldie (DSDBO) road, built along the LAC, last year.

China, which saw the move as a threat to its interests in the region, is attempting to assert control over the territory along the border that is not clearly defined in places, according to the experts.

In all, China claims some 90,000 square kilometres (35,000sq miles) of territory in India's northeast, including the Indian state of Arunachal Pradesh, with its traditionally Buddhist population.

India says China occupies 38,000sq km (15,000sq miles) of its territory in the Aksai Chin Plateau in the western Himalayas, including a part of the Ladakh region.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020...china-blames-india-clash-200624105950727.html
 
China has deployed large numbers of troops and weapons along a disputed Himalayan border in violation of bilateral agreements, India's foreign ministry has said, accusing Beijing of escalating tensions and triggering a deadly clash last week.

"At the heart of the matter is that since early May, the Chinese side had been amassing a large contingent of troops and armaments along the LAC," foreign ministry spokesman Anurag Srivastava said in a briefing in New Delhi on Thursday, referring to the Line of Actual Control (LAC), the de facto border between the Asian nuclear powers.

Srivastava said "this is not in accordance with the provisions of our various bilateral agreements," referring to treaties that include a 1993 one that dictates that both sides will maintain limited border deployments.

India had "to undertake counter deployments" because of the Chinese buildup, he said as New Delhi acknowledged for the first time it has matched Beijing in massing troops at their contested Himalayan border.

China has blamed India for the clash - the deadliest between the two nuclear-armed neighbours for at least five decades - and said Indian troops attacked Chinese officers and soldiers.

Responding to the heightened Chinese presence last month, India also deployed a large number of troops along the LAC, Srivastava said, leading to face-offs in the Ladakh region of the western Himalayas.

On June 15, Indian and Chinese troops brawled for several hours in the Galwan Valley, using stones and sticks with nails embedded in them to beat each other, killing 20 Indian soldiers and injuring at least 76 more. China has not disclosed how many casualties its troops suffered.

The neighbours have blamed each other for the high-altitude battle. After senior military commanders held parleys this week, both sides have since agreed to disengage their troops on the disputed border.

But in satellite images reviewed by Reuters news agency, China appears to have added new structures near the site of the Galwan Valley clash that India says is on its side of the LAC. These include camouflaged tents or covered structures and a potential new camp under construction with walls or barricades.

"Peace and tranquility in the border areas is the basis of our bilateral relationship," said Srivastava, demanding that China follow up on its pledge to cool tensions. "A continuation of the current situation would only vitiate the atmosphere."

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020...-numbers-disputed-border-200626031842005.html
 
China reinforced its troops near the Indian border with mountain climbers and martial arts fighters shortly before a deadly clash this month, state media reported.

Tensions in the mountainous border terrain are common between the two nuclear-armed neighbours, but this month's fighting was their deadliest encounter in nearly 50 years.

Five new militia divisions, including former members of a Mount Everest Olympic torch relay team and fighters from a mixed martial arts club, presented themselves for inspection at Lhasa, the capital of Tibet, on June 15, official military newspaper China National Defense News reported.

State broadcaster CCTV showed footage of hundreds of new troops lining up in the Tibetan capital.

Tibet commander Wang Haijiang said the Enbo Fight Club recruits would "greatly raise the organisation and mobilisation strength" of troops and their "rapid response and support ability," China National Defence News reported, although he did not explicitly confirm their deployment was linked to ongoing border tensions.

Later that day, Indian and Chinese troops brawled for several hours in the Galwan Valley in Ladakh, using stones and nail-studded clubs to beat each other, killing 20 Indian soldiers and injuring at least 76 more.

The clash on June 15 was the deadliest conflict between the two sides in 45 years. China has not said whether it suffered any casualties.

The neighbours have continued to blame each other for the high-altitude battle.

Pointing fingers

India said on Thursday that it had reinforced its troops in the contested Himalayan border region, saying it was matching a similar buildup by China.

Chinese state media have in recent weeks highlighted military activity, including high-altitude anti-aircraft drills in the Tibet region bordering India.

The new troops were recruited with the aim of "strengthening the border and stabilising Tibet", China National Defence News said.

India claims Chinese troops ambushed Indian soldiers and forced them down a ridge where they had gone to remove a Chinese "encroachment".

Indian traders to boycott Chinese products

A bilateral accord prevents the use of guns but the fighting, with rudimentary weapons, was still fierce.

China has, in turn, accused Indian soldiers of twice crossing the Line of Actual Control, the de facto border, provoking its troops.

The two countries fought a war over the border in 1962. There is an understanding between the nuclear-armed neighbours that their troops in the disputed and inhospitable region will not use firearms.

China claims about 90,000 square kilometres (35,000 square miles) of territory in India's northeast, while India says China occupies 38,000 square kilometres (15,000 square miles) of its territory in the Aksai Chin Plateau in the Himalayas, a contiguous part of the Ladakh region.

India unilaterally declared Ladakh a federal territory, carving it out of Indian-administered Kashmir in August 2019. China was among the countries to condemn the move, raising it at forums including the UN Security Council.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020...-lac-deadly-clash-report-200628073902603.html
 
One thing is clear, if anyone is in conflict with India they have to appear stronger, do what’s necessary on ground and stay silent. Indian media and Modi would claim a victory on paper while its opponents would have achieved its goals too.
 
China Ready For A Two Front War With US In South China Sea & India-China Border

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">If <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/India?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#India</a> wants to take advantage of US support in border dispute with <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/China?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#China</a>, it is terribly mistaken, as the Chinese PLA is fully prepared & capable of defending on multiple fronts including China-India border, South China Sea and Taiwan Straits:analysts.<a href="https://t.co/CFm8g4ceqg">https://t.co/CFm8g4ceqg</a> <a href="https://t.co/nTBJ22jgQM">pic.twitter.com/nTBJ22jgQM</a></p>— Global Times (@globaltimesnews) <a href="https://twitter.com/globaltimesnews/status/1277238529832206336?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">June 28, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Chinese experts state that Washington had long been dreaming to play India as a card in its strategy to counter and contain China, and it has now got the chance to use Indian hardliners as fodder as China-India border tensions escalate.

However, experts claim that it is wishful thinking that the US would come to Indian aid and counter Chinese troops in the South China Sea so that New Delhi could intensify skirmishes and pin down China at the border.

The report concludes by saying that the US will not get involved in a full-scale war with China and India will only be used as a cannon fodder between the clash of two giants, while also subtly asserting that Beijing is ready on all fronts to counter the enemies.
 
And Aus too in Pacific.. was just watching how Chinese waited so long to do all this, Xi apparently has taken biggest Military reform since 1950's if this pays off with the world dealing with Pandemic , China would rule the world economically.

Not sure where Russia stands but China's one major friend is Germany due to economic clout.

Read an article on oilprice as well apparently China is the winner of oil price lol.


https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/The-Country-That-Won-The-Oil-War.html


Also this:

The listed arm of China National Offshore Oil Corporation (CNOOC) said on Monday that it had made a significant discovery of oil and natural gas in the eastern part of the South China Sea.

https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Chinese-Oil-Major-Strikes-It-Big-In-South-China-Sea.html

Time itna acha chalraha hai China ka!
 
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China is able to do this as well without any repercussion, talk about the daring!
 
[MENTION=151127]Manunited18[/MENTION] who is a fan of China good times for your fav country bud..
 
China ready for world scrutiny as well, wondering if China's economy is actually larger than others think.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-53230391


China has passed a controversial security law giving it new powers over Hong Kong, deepening fears for the city's freedoms, the BBC has learned.

Last month China announced it would impose the law, which criminalises any act of secession, subversion, terrorism or collusion with foreign forces.

The move comes after angry protests last year - sparked by another law - which became a pro-democracy movement.

Critics say the new law poses an even greater threat to Hong Kong's identity.

They warn it will undermine Hong Kong's judicial independence and destroy the city's freedoms, which are not available in mainland China.

Hong Kong was handed back to China from British control in 1997, but with a unique agreement which guaranteed certain freedoms.

The bill has sparked demonstrations in Hong Kong and drawn international condemnation since it was announced by Beijing in May.

But China says the law is needed to tackle separatist activity, subversion, terrorism and collusion with foreign elements - and rejects criticism as interference in its affairs.

Image copyrightAFP
Image caption
Critics warn the law will shut down dissent
China's new law: Why is Hong Kong worried?
Beijing to set up new security office in Hong Kong
The security law was fast-tracked to come into effect before Wednesday, which marks the anniversary of the handover from Britain to China and is usually marked by large-scale political protests.

It was passed unanimously on Tuesday morning by the Standing Committee of the National People's Congress in Beijing and is expected to be added to Hong Kong's Basic Law later in the day.

One of the city's most prominent activists, Joshua Wong, reacted by saying he would quit the pro-democracy group Demosisto he spearheaded until now.

Fellow activists Nathan Law and Agnes Chow also said they'd quit the group.

What is the new law?
China has not officially confirmed the law has been passed, and the text of the bill has also not been made public, but some details have emerged.

It would make criminal any act of secession, subversion of the central government, terrorism and collusion with foreign or external forces.

A new national security office in Hong Kong would deal with national security cases, but would also have other powers such as overseeing education about national security in Hong Kong schools.

The Hong Kong government will be required to carry out most enforcement under the new law, but Beijing will be able to overrule the Hong Kong authorities in some cases.
 
What ?? China wants to go to war with India because they think US will support India ?? This is crazy, dont these Chinese read Pak Passion ? Pakistanis here guarantee US wont come to India's aid.. :P

Anyway..

My dream:::: hopefully the whole world will unite, let the Xenophobia increase by the millions and split China up, liberate Tibet, save the Ughyur Muslims (UMMAHH) make China USSR part -2...

Lets go world...
 
This global times is a mouthpiece of China state media. They are paid to project the might of CCP. The fact is no one even cares for this junk media outlet. Many leaders around world don’t even care to answer questions if it’s from global times or xinhua. Yesterday it happened with Scott Morrison earlier with Trump.

Anyway there won’t be any war and CCP are just trying to put up a false brave face. Seems like their leader has an itch to go for a war and their citizens are scratching and facepalming themselves because of CCP. Reality is facing many countries united will be a nightmare.

There are lots of war mongering statements by this media but some of you here don’t see that but harmless statements elsewhere are seen as war mongering. Talk about hypocrisy.

China should only stick to trade and economic war and their only best bet here..
 
Kashmir can get independence if China and Pakistan jointly attack India (provided India doesn't get outside help).
 
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Kashmir can get independence if China and Pakistan jointly attack India (provided India doesn't get outside help).

You think the Chinese love Kashmiri Muslims so much more than Uyghur Muslims that they will attack India and pay with the blood of their soldiers to "liberate" Kashmiri Muslims?
 
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You think the Chinese love Kashmiri Muslims so much more than Uyghur Muslims that they will attack India and pay with the blood of their soldiers to "liberate" Kashmiri Muslims?

No. I didn't say that. China may look to weaken India because India is a threat to China.

Again, these are all hypothetical scenarios. A full-blown military conflict is unlikely.
 
No. I didn't say that. China may look to weaken India because India is a threat to China.

Again, these are all hypothetical scenarios. A full-blown military conflict is unlikely.

You wrote "Kashmir can get independence if China and Pakistan jointly attack India". Short of a full blown war in which the Indian Army is ejected from Kashmir (which is fanciful as the Indian Army is more than capable of holding Kashmir), your statement makes no sense.
 
You wrote "Kashmir can get independence if China and Pakistan jointly attack India". Short of a full blown war in which the Indian Army is ejected from Kashmir (which is fanciful as the Indian Army is more than capable of holding Kashmir), your statement makes no sense.

Actually, if China and Pakistan attack India together, India has very little chance. China alone can destroy India.

Only way India can win is if they get help from USA/NATO.
 
Actually, if China and Pakistan attack India together, India has very little chance. China alone can destroy India.

Only way India can win is if they get help from USA/NATO.

That China can destroy India is your opinion. Less than a hundred years ago, tiny Japan thoroughly thrashed China. My point was that it is delusional to think the Chinese care enough about Kashmir to go to war with India over it.
 
You wrote "Kashmir can get independence if China and Pakistan jointly attack India". Short of a full blown war in which the Indian Army is ejected from Kashmir (which is fanciful as the Indian Army is more than capable of holding Kashmir), your statement makes no sense.

I neither care about China nor I care about India. I simply stated what I feel should happen on paper.

China has superior military power than India on paper.
 
I neither care about China nor I care about India. I simply stated what I feel should happen on paper.

China has superior military power than India on paper.

And my point was that it is pointless discussing what may happen on paper when there is a zero chance of it happening in the real world.

On paper, the US and Russia could nuke China if it went to war with India, but that isn't going to happen either.
 
That China can destroy India is your opinion. Less than a hundred years ago, tiny Japan thoroughly thrashed China. My point was that it is delusional to think the Chinese care enough about Kashmir to go to war with India over it.

Lol do you mean china still has same military power as it had 100 years ago , go and check what millitary assets china had 100 years ago and what they own now
 
Clouds of war hanging over the region - not good this.
 
Actually, if China and Pakistan attack India together, India has very little chance. China alone can destroy India.

Only way India can win is if they get help from USA/NATO.

I asked this question on another thread. What's stopping Pakistan? This is the best chance for them to settle the Kashmir.
 
I asked this question on another thread. What's stopping Pakistan? This is the best chance for them to settle the Kashmir.

No. This would be the worst possible scenario for Pakistan, India and even China.

Even if Pakistan/China attack India from both fronts it will be a pyrrhic victory for us.

The best chance will come when some sane leaders rule both Pakistan/India at the same time and peoples of both country are educated.

Kashmir should be an independent country, with their own government and no manipulation from externals.

Forza to my Kashmiri brothers 🍀
 
I asked this question on another thread. What's stopping Pakistan? This is the best chance for them to settle the Kashmir.


Imran khan is not pro-war. The guy genuinely wants peace in the region. I'll give him credit where it's due.

Pak army chief has no other option that to listen to the supreme leader of his nation. Otherwise, we would have already seen Bajwa having a nice cup of tea in Anantnag.
 
20 soldiers killed, 5 abducted by the Chinese.

India is clearly winning this battle. I think the digital strike by them was a stroke of genius and has really put China on the back foot.
 
I asked this question on another thread. What's stopping Pakistan? This is the best chance for them to settle the Kashmir.

Your question is trolling but I'll give my honest view. The reason is our economy really. Its finally showing signs of recovery after decades of mismanagement. I'd even say the Chinese have been a god-send here by distracting India who seemed to be itching for war for last 2 years. Right now Imran Khan's attention is fully on the economy, especially Karachi. India is playing a negligible part in any discourse in our media right now, its mostly been Karachi and the rains or political dramas. The only time I hear the word India is when I come on PP.

Pakistan can only attack if India is on its knees or by being defensive if they try any misadventure like Abhinandan. Our foreign reserves are small and any war would be dragged out and it'd take decades to recover our economy. The current PA stance, instead of pre-emptive strikes, is therefore purely defensive when it comes to actual war, our financial situation means we can't actively go out all guns blazing and risk a dragged, prolonged war.
[MENTION=253]the Great Khan[/MENTION] can elaborate more as he's more knowledgeable on such issues.
 
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No. This would be the worst possible scenario for Pakistan, India and even China.

Even if Pakistan/China attack India from both fronts it will be a pyrrhic victory for us.

The best chance will come when some sane leaders rule both Pakistan/India at the same time and peoples of both country are educated.

Kashmir should be an independent country, with their own government and no manipulation from externals.

Forza to my Kashmiri brothers 🍀

A pyrrhic victory is better than losing before fighting. If action isnt taken now, soon there will be nothing left to fight for.
 
its not not going to be a limited war. previously in 62, the terrain and technology was such that you could only bring a fraction of your forces to the battlefield.

Now you can bomb the enemy at long range.

So who wins a war between China and India?
answer: Pakistan wins either way. irrespective of the result.
 
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