Why do Muslims not fear death?

[chacha kashmiri]

With the current pandemic and hundreds of people dying Muslims seem to be less emotional and fearful of the ramifications
With their intense outlook on the afterlife and the rewards for them should they die in a plague while fearing their Lord. Are Muslims too unconcerned about current events and the coronavirus death that has plagued mainland Europe and beyond?

 

[ManFan]

It’s more like the virus is not widespread in the Muslim world except Iran.

 

[chacha kashmiri]

It’s more like the virus is not widespread in the Muslim world except Iran.

Malaysia and Qatar are full of cases but no casualties

 

[ManFan]

Malaysia and Qatar are full of cases but no mi casualties

I had a relative just come back from Pakistan (not Sindh) and he said there’s not a care in the world about it.

 

[sweep_shot]

Muslims only should fear God and nothing/nobody else.

 

[Down2Earth]

Muslim's know that their lifespan and death is decreed. How we die is already decided and can't be changed

 

[Pakistanian]

lol yeah, it's hard to convince my elders to take this seriously. Aunties be blowin up whatsapp with their remedies and "Cures" lol, one of them just claimed if you drink water you can trap the coronavirus in your throat preventing it from entering your lungs, the water would wash it down your intestines and digest it others claim if you read x surah x number of times after x prayer you won't get corona lol.

 

[Rana]

Arab tribal culture from the time of the Holy Prophet. The Arabs were known to not be fearful for their lives and this has been inherited throughout centuries

 

[sweep_shot]

I am not afraid of the virus. I simply don't want to infect others (family, friends etc.). If it was just me, I wouldn't have cared.

Again, this virus is generally not that big of a deal unless you are an old person. Hopefully nothing will happen to me and my loved ones.

 

[BreadPakoda]

Muslim's know that their lifespan and death is decreed. How we die is already decided and can't be changed

It can be changed. You just need to jump out of a high rise building. Or if that happens, was it "decided" too?

 

[BreadPakoda]

lol yeah, it's hard to convince my elders to take this seriously. Aunties be blowin up whatsapp with their remedies and "Cures" lol, one of them just claimed if you drink water you can trap the coronavirus in your throat preventing it from entering your lungs, the water would wash it down your intestines and digest it others claim if you read x surah x number of times after x prayer you won't get corona lol.

Sorry, that's ignorance not fearlessness. And its across middle-aged desis, not just Muslims.

 

[thelandofthebravepeople]

I think it has nothing to do with Muslims in particular.

However if you compare muslim countries with western... There has been much more death in muslim countries such as Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq, Libya, Somalia, Pakistan, Palestine etc. Even healthcare is very limited. So you can die from diseases that would easily be cured in western countries.

In Western countries I cannot remember last time the public life was threatened in similar fashion. So they are not as used to threats to life. Maybe therefor there is much more huhah among non muslims.

 

[Justcrazy]

Well fear of this will not help in any way.

 

[Itachi]

Muslims only should fear God and nothing/nobody else.

This is the reason.

If you fear anything else, you will give an entity the attribution that you give to HIM.

 

[Abdullah719]

lol yeah, it's hard to convince my elders to take this seriously. Aunties be blowin up whatsapp with their remedies and "Cures" lol, one of them just claimed if you drink water you can trap the coronavirus in your throat preventing it from entering your lungs, the water would wash it down your intestines and digest it others claim if you read x surah x number of times after x prayer you won't get corona lol.

Chief Minister of Balochistan...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="und" dir="ltr"><a href="https://t.co/tgtY9BdEjs">pic.twitter.com/tgtY9BdEjs</a></p>— Jam Kamal Khan (@jam_kamal) <a href="https://twitter.com/jam_kamal/status/1238861785475751937?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 14, 2020</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Musakhel]

Everything is decreed for the children Of Adam, so when our time comes, we can't do anything about it, just accept it and know you are in Safe hands ( not literally).

 

[GoUgandaCranes]

It can be changed. You just need to jump out of a high rise building. Or if that happens, was it "decided" too?

Yes. Everything is written. Google "taqdeer" and find your answer.

 

[GoUgandaCranes]

Chief Minister of Balochistan...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="und" dir="ltr"><a href="https://t.co/tgtY9BdEjs">pic.twitter.com/tgtY9BdEjs</a></p>— Jam Kamal Khan (@jam_kamal) <a href="https://twitter.com/jam_kamal/status/1238861785475751937?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 14, 2020</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I need a bigger face and an even bigger palm after reading this. What even ....

 

[Abdullah719]

I need a bigger face and an even bigger palm after reading this. What even ....

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Kindly read closely <br><br>The viral when in throat....not in lungs. And this message is widely shared for betterment and precautions <a href="https://twitter.com/cyalm?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@cyalm</a> <a href="https://t.co/WO3eXJvksY">https://t.co/WO3eXJvksY</a></p>— Jam Kamal Khan (@jam_kamal) <a href="https://twitter.com/jam_kamal/status/1239288900419543040?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 15, 2020</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Birdman]

If Muslims don't fear death then there should not be any Hospitals in Islamic countries. All humans fear death, but some think that it will not happen to them.

 

[shaz619]

We didn't fear at the battle of badr, Salahudeen didn't fear even when the Crusaders had taken Jerusalem and nor did we fear when the Indfidels of south asia drew first flood in the skies; fear is for the hindu and jews, it's for the weak and cowards, it's for all those who lack in height and size, but more importantly the will, desire, ambition and intellectual supremacy. Allah Hu Akbar!

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

If Muslims don't fear death then there should not be any Hospitals in Islamic countries. All humans fear death, but some think that it will not happen to them.

Just because you don't fear death, doesn't mean that you have to hate life. In fact life is also seen as a great blessing, you are not understanding the mindset of Islamic people which is more holistic than simply life vs. death.

 

[Robert]

Muslim's know that their lifespan and death is decreed. How we die is already decided and can't be changed

So why bother to have medicine? Or safety laws?

 

[Mesozoic]

We didn't fear at the battle of badr, Salahudeen didn't fear even when the Crusaders had taken Jerusalem and nor did we fear when the Indfidels of south asia drew first flood in the skies; fear is for the hindu and jews, it's for the weak and cowards, it's for all those who lack in height and size, but more importantly the will, desire, ambition and intellectual supremacy. Allah Hu Akbar!

Cool story bro.

 

[Mamoon]

Do not generalize. Most people fear death, muslims or not.

Plenty of non-Muslims don’t fear death either. It is largely down to personality traits rather than religious inclinations.

 

[Musakhel]

So why bother to have medicine? Or safety laws?

Goes back to the Narration of the Prophet (PBUH)

This saying, as relayed by the scholar Al-Tirmidhi, is an ancient Arab phrase attributed to the prophet Mohammed who, when one day he saw a Bedouin leaving his camel without tethering it, questioned him as to why he was doing this. The Bedouin replied that he was placing his trust in Allah and had no need to tie the camel. The prophet Mohammed then replied, “Tie your camel and place your trust in Allah.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Do not generalize. Most people fear death, muslims or not.

Plenty of non-Muslims don’t fear death either. It is largely down to personality traits rather than religious inclinations.

Personality traits play less a role than what you believe. Obviously if you think that once you die you are just a rotting corpse, then you are probably going to fear death more. This is just common logic.

 

[Forward Defensive Push]

As the numbers start ticking, watch people run for cover. It's not a joke. The threat is real and is coming for each of us.

As I type, total number of confirmed cases is 136 and over 100 in Sindh. Things are entering a new phase. God save everyone!

 

[Mamoon]

Personality traits play less a role than what you believe. Obviously if you think that once you die you are just a rotting corpse, then you are probably going to fear death more. This is just common logic.

Personality traits do have an impact. Plenty of people who perform high-risk stunts are atheists but have little to no fear of death, while on the other hand, you will have a staunch Muslim who would never try to do something risky.

Lifestyle and environment also plays a role. Members of armed forces generally do not fear death (or have tremendous amount of courage) regardless of their religious inclinations.

Believing in afterlife does not make you not fear death. It actually does make you fear death because you are worried about ending up in Hell.

It is human nature to fear death. That is why the vast majority of humans avoid taking risks that could endanger their lives, and why even babies try to protect themselves.

Life-preservation is basic instinct, and members of armed forces, stunt performers and high risk thrill seekers generally have this instinct trained out of them.

There is no need of lionizing believers.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Personality traits do have an impact. Plenty of people who perform high-risk stunts are atheists but have little to no fear of death, while on the other hand, you will have a staunch Muslim who would never try to do something risky.

Lifestyle and environment also plays a role. Members of armed forces generally do not fear death (or have tremendous amount of courage) regardless of their religious inclinations.

Believing in afterlife does not make you not fear death. It actually does make you fear death because you are worried about ending up in Hell.

It is human nature to fear death. That is why the vast majority of humans avoid taking risks that could endanger their lives, and why even babies try to protect themselves.

Life-preservation is basic instinct, and members of armed forces, stunt performers and high risk thrill seekers generally have this instinct trained out of them.

There is no need of lionizing believers.

I thought we were talking about your average person, but if you are talking about select types who do stunts or enter army, then yes those people will have overcome fear of death through training or supreme confidence in avoiding death.

Many atheists also are at peace with dying if we are not talking in general terms.

 

[troodon]

Because their real life is after life. The heaven described in Islam is also irresistible for any male.

Who wants to be on Earth when Jannat is so appealing...

 

[Mamoon]

I thought we were talking about your average person, but if you are talking about select types who do stunts or enter army, then yes those people will have overcome fear of death through training or supreme confidence in avoiding death.

Many atheists also are at peace with dying if we are not talking in general terms.

What is the evidence that an average Muslims is more courageous in the face of death than an average Christian or an average atheist?

Is there any research that you can direct me to?

 

[Mamoon]

Because their real life is after life. The heaven described in Islam is also irresistible for any male.

Who wants to be on Earth when Jannat is so appealing...

But you have to assume that you will end up in Jannat which is not an easy thing to do, because allegedly even the Prophet PBUH claimed that he doesn’t know what would become of him.

It is core Islamic belief that only Allah SWT knows our fate, and thus every Muslim fears hellfire.

 

[troodon]

But you have to assume that you will end up in Jannat which is not an easy thing to do, because allegedly even the Prophet PBUH claimed that he doesn’t know what would become of him.

It is core Islamic belief that only Allah SWT knows our fate, and thus every Muslim fears hellfire.

For hardcore and brainwashed, they believe they will end up in Jannat. If they have already committed the Sin and they know that they will end up in hell, then there is no point in being a believer and being nice for the rest of their lives.
Martyrdom is regarded very high in Islam. Death for the cause of Allah is the gateway to heaven. This is the belief of many terrible organizations.

I find it funny if the man who brought Islam to Arabs is not sure if he is going to be in heaven, how did people around him believe that they will go there? How did Muhammed convince Sahabas that they will go to heaven and fight for his cause.

 

[Mamoon]

For hardcore and brainwashed, they believe they will end up in Jannat. If they have already committed the Sin and they know that they will end up in hell, then there is no point in being a believer and being nice for the rest of their lives.
Martyrdom is regarded very high in Islam. Death for the cause of Allah is the gateway to heaven. This is the belief of many terrible organizations.

But Cpt. was talking about regular people, not soldiers or jihadis. I am interested in the evidence of how regular Muslims are more courageous in the face of death compared to regular non-Muslims or atheists.

I find it funny if the man who brought Islam to Arabs is not sure if he is going to be in heaven, how did people around him believe that they will go there? How did Muhammed convince Sahabas that they will go to heaven and fight for his cause.

None of the Sahabas truly believed that they are guaranteed jannat apart from the promised ones who were informed beforehand. Obviously, they knew the Prophet PBUH would go to Jannat because he was the greatest Prophet of Islam,

but the point was to project the message that the Prophet himself was only a human being and not a divine figure.

This itself was and is a major attraction point in Islam.

 

[troodon]

But Cpt. was talking about regular people, not soldiers or jihadis. I am interested in the evidence of how regular Muslims are more courageous in the face of death compared to regular non-Muslims or atheists.



None of the Sahabas truly believed that they are guaranteed jannat apart from the promised ones who were informed beforehand. Obviously, they knew the Prophet PBUH would go to Jannat because he was the greatest Prophet of Islam,

but the point was to project the message that the Prophet himself was only a human being and not a divine figure.

This itself was and is a major attraction point in Islam.

If I am the driver of the bus and I am not sure if I can make it to the destination, how can the passengers believe that they will reach the destination? What is the attraction for the passengers in riding the bus?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

What is the evidence that an average Muslims is more courageous in the face of death than an average Christian or an average atheist?

Is there any research that you can direct me to?

Why or how would I have evidence? I gave only an opinion same as you did, in answer to the question put by OP. I also clarified that many atheists are at peace with death also, as are also many non-Muslims I am sure.

 

[Mamoon]

If I am the driver of the bus and I am not sure if I can make it to the destination, how can the passengers believe that they will reach the destination? What is the attraction for the passengers in riding the bus?

Islam teaches humility and devotion to Allah SWT through observation of His commands.

If the Prophet PBUH were to claim that he is guaranteed heaven because he is the Prophet, would there be any reason or justification for him to personally follow the principles of Islam?

The Prophet PBUH also prayed for himself and his family even though he was the greatest prophet in Islam.

The Prophet PBUH’s claim that he does not know what will become of him does not imply lack of faith; it implies that only Allah SWT has the power and the authority to judge whether someone has fulfilled his/her obligations faithfully or not.

The analogy of the bus driver is flawed because if the bus driver crashes the bus, it is highly likely that you will be get injured or maybe die.

However, in Islam, you are strictly responsible for your individual actions and will not pay a price for the mistakes of others.

 

[Local.Dada]

What is the basis for this statement?

Are we seriously using suicide bombers as an example? I don’t think that is very flattering.

Before I am taken out of context yet again but I see Muslims no different from any other human being. Sure the extremely spiritual ones from any religion may be in peace

Maybe OP you should venture into the Amazon without any supplies who knows you may come back with world changing discoveries. You need to put lack of fear of death to good use too you know

 

[Robert]

Goes back to the Narration of the Prophet (PBUH)

This saying, as relayed by the scholar Al-Tirmidhi, is an ancient Arab phrase attributed to the prophet Mohammed who, when one day he saw a Bedouin leaving his camel without tethering it, questioned him as to why he was doing this. The Bedouin replied that he was placing his trust in Allah and had no need to tie the camel. The prophet Mohammed then replied, “Tie your camel and place your trust in Allah.

Good story.

 

[sweep_shot]

Good story.

Basically, we are encouraged to take all precautions and then rely on God.

In other words, try your best and leave the rest to God.

 

[Ronaldo7]

What is the basis for this statement?

Are we seriously using suicide bombers as an example? I don’t think that is very flattering.

Before I am taken out of context yet again but I see Muslims no different from any other human being. Sure the extremely spiritual ones from any religion may be in peace

Maybe OP you should venture into the Amazon without any supplies who knows you may come back with world changing discoveries. You need to put lack of fear of death to good use too you know

Where did you get the “suicide bomber” thing from?

The OP was clearly talking about the current pandemic SMH

 

[Itachi]

Where did you get the “suicide bomber” thing from?

The OP was clearly talking about the current pandemic SMH

Suicide with any attribute is basically a win over fear of death.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Fair post.

Having belief in Allah does give one a stronger mind in coping with such issues inc death.

Athiests, those who belief in no after life will naturally be more worried.

Muslims also know this was preditcted. They are prob better prepared mentally than most other groups.

 

[majiz]

Surely religion is an expression of a fear of death
I'd argue muslims are more scared than anyone else

 

[KingKhanWC]

Surely religion is an expression of a fear of death
I'd argue muslims are more scared than anyone else

lol.

Religion or a belief in a higher stronger power is not about fear. Its an undestanding as to why we are here.

Lets debate this if you like? No need to argue.

 

[troodon]

Fair post.

Having belief in Allah does give one a stronger mind in coping with such issues inc death.

Athiests, those who belief in no after life will naturally be more worried.

Muslims also know this was preditcted. They are prob better prepared mentally than most other groups.

Believers will be more worried that their behinds will be roasted in hell fires as they know they have committed sins in their life.

Athiests have no such belief in any deity or God. They may die worrying because they do not have any more life to enjoy the worldly pleasures.

 

[Musakhel]

"Endurance is composed of four attributes: eagerness, fear, piety and anticipation (of death). so whoever is eager for Paradise will ignore temptations; whoever fears the fire of Hell will abstain from sins; whoever practices piety will easily bear the difficulties of life and whoever anticipates death will hasten towards good deeds". Imam Ali

 

[Local.Dada]

So what’s this attribute of not fearing about death useful for?

Since paying money for experimenting on humans might be considered unethical , if some Muslims come out and say hey listen let’s accelerate this process so conduct all your critical experiment of drugs for Cancer,AIDS etc etc or even coronavirus would be a good place to start. That could be used for humanity

Or if Muslims come out and say hey listen let me volunteer to go to mars or something as I have nothing to lose or fear. That could be used for progress of the human race


If you are thinking soldiers then every country has soldiers regardless of their faith. Israel,India,US,UK etc etc. so there are people who don’t fear death of every religion.

If this just comes down to about some bob killing himself while blowing up some building in a crowded area then I don’t see it as a quality to be proud of.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

So what’s this attribute of not fearing about death useful for?

Since paying money for experimenting on humans might be considered unethical , if some Muslims come out and say hey listen let’s accelerate this process so conduct all your critical experiment of drugs for Cancer,AIDS etc etc or even coronavirus would be a good place to start. That could be used for humanity

Or if Muslims come out and say hey listen let me volunteer to go to mars or something as I have nothing to lose or fear. That could be used for progress of the human race


If you are thinking soldiers then every country has soldiers regardless of their faith. Israel,India,US,UK etc etc. so there are people who don’t fear death of every religion.

If this just comes down to about some bob killing himself while blowing up some building in a crowded area then I don’t see it as a quality to be proud of.

The attribute of not fearing death is peace of mind.

 

[Musakhel]

Muslims should not fear death, but most of them do because of love of the Dunya.

 

[chacha kashmiri]

Because their real life is after life. The heaven described in Islam is also irresistible for any male.

Who wants to be on Earth when Jannat is so appealing...

Rabia basri would have disagreed with your logic

 

[chacha kashmiri]

Surely religion is an expression of a fear of death
I'd argue muslims are more scared than anyone else

Muslims seem to be more in fear over an eclipse than the coronavirus
That's my current observation

 

[world cup captain]

Not sure how a poster here has concluded atheists are fearful of death. I do not give two sh**s if I were to die today because nothing will happen afterward except my family will be emotionally hurt.

On the other hand, I argue the opposite. Religious people have a reason to fear death due to uncertainly. What guarantee do religious people have that they will go to heaven instead of hell? Do you count every single deed you have ever committed? How do you scale every deed's significance? There are two many factors in a religious life, which I've lead before.

In regard to the pandemic, religious folks are going nuts on my phone sending me every dua there is for protection against the virus as if there aren't thousands of muslim alims who haven't died of a sickness of some sort already.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Not sure how a poster here has concluded atheists are fearful of death. I do not give two sh**s if I were to die today because nothing will happen afterward except my family will be emotionally hurt.

On the other hand, I argue the opposite. Religious people have a reason to fear death due to uncertainly. What guarantee do religious people have that they will go to heaven instead of hell? Do you count every single deed you have ever committed? How do you scale every deed's significance? There are two many factors in a religious life, which I've lead before.

In regard to the pandemic, religious folks are going nuts on my phone sending me every dua there is for protection against the virus as if there aren't thousands of muslim alims who haven't died of a sickness of some sort already.

You dont care if you die, yet you believe it's only life you will ever have. I wonder if you still feel the same when on your death bed but we will never find out.

Muslims I know, dont see it that way. All Muslims will eventually end up in heaven according to Islamic belief. At least research before spouting rubbish. Thanks

 

[Nadeemp]

Not sure how a poster here has concluded atheists are fearful of death. I do not give two sh**s if I were to die today because nothing will happen afterward except my family will be emotionally hurt.

On the other hand, I argue the opposite. Religious people have a reason to fear death due to uncertainly. What guarantee do religious people have that they will go to heaven instead of hell? Do you count every single deed you have ever committed? How do you scale every deed's significance? There are two many factors in a religious life, which I've lead before.

In regard to the pandemic, religious folks are going nuts on my phone sending me every dua there is for protection against the virus as if there aren't thousands of muslim alims who haven't died of a sickness of some sort already.

Right on. Great post

 

[Yossarian]

Lifestyle and environment also plays a role. Members of armed forces generally do not fear death (or have tremendous amount of courage) regardless of their religious inclinations.

It's called being brainwashed so as to ensure that the soldier will obey orders no matter what. Can't have them thinking for themselves and disobeying orders from above. Even when they see tens of thousands of their comrades dying around them every day, with many more wounded, as they won, and then lost, and then won, and lost, again and again, back and forth, a few hundreds yards of land, as was the case in WW1.

Read about the Battle of the Somme, where more than three million men fought in the battle and one million men were wounded or killed

At the end of the Battle, British and French forces had penetrated 10 km (6 mi) into German-occupied territory.

Yep. First step when joining the military. Get that desire to think for themselves, make their own decisions and not obey orders, out of them.

 

[Nadeemp]

It's called being brainwashed so as to ensure that the soldier will obey orders no matter what. Can't have them thinking for themselves and disobeying orders from above. Even when they see tens of thousands of their comrades dying around them every day, with many more wounded, as they won, and then lost, and then won, and lost, again and again, back and forth, a few hundreds yards of land, as was the case in WW1.

Read about the Battle of the Somme, where more than three million men fought in the battle and one million men were wounded or killed

At the end of the Battle, British and French forces had penetrated 10 km (6 mi) into German-occupied territory.

Yep. First step when joining the military. Get that desire to think for themselves, make their own decisions and not obey orders, out of them.

If you think for yourself you can join an army or a religious group for that matter

 

[world cup captain]

You dont care if you die, yet you believe it's only life you will ever have. I wonder if you still feel the same when on your death bed but we will never find out.

Muslims I know, dont see it that way. All Muslims will eventually end up in heaven according to Islamic belief. At least research before spouting rubbish. Thanks

What's wrong with believing that there is only one life? Since there is no divine meaning to life, whatever I do, at the end of time, does not matter.

Some people need to believe in something/someone in order to live hence why I do not speak much about atheism unless provoked.

As far as your fact-checking goes, I live in a devoted muslim family where nothing is above Islam and they do not hold the belief that every muslim goes to heaven instantly (one does time in hell based on actions in life).

If muslims were not fearful of death, then why would muslims seek medical help to lengthen their lives rather than quickly go to a magical land where everything they could ever want exists? If I believed in this magical land, I would want and be happy to have my family die as quickly as possible to live happily ever after. Instead, I think it is bogus and would like them to be around.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Personality traits play less a role than what you believe. Obviously if you think that once you die you are just a rotting corpse, then you are probably going to fear death more. This is just common logic.

Except that it isn't as obvious as that. It has a lot to do with personality traits, upbringing. I believe that that death is the end and i don't fear it at all.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Except that it isn't as obvious as that. It has a lot to do with personality traits, upbringing. I believe that that death is the end and i don't fear it at all.

I wouldn't expect you to claim anything else.

 

[Mamoon]

It's called being brainwashed so as to ensure that the soldier will obey orders no matter what. Can't have them thinking for themselves and disobeying orders from above. Even when they see tens of thousands of their comrades dying around them every day, with many more wounded, as they won, and then lost, and then won, and lost, again and again, back and forth, a few hundreds yards of land, as was the case in WW1.

Read about the Battle of the Somme, where more than three million men fought in the battle and one million men were wounded or killed

At the end of the Battle, British and French forces had penetrated 10 km (6 mi) into German-occupied territory.

Yep. First step when joining the military. Get that desire to think for themselves, make their own decisions and not obey orders, out of them.

While I don’t disagree with the premise of what you are trying to say, calling them “brainwashed” is disrespectful.

Following orders and putting their country’s honor above their personal safety is a basic requirement of serving in the armed forces.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Armed forces also are well known for suffering from Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, if we don't want to lionise Muslims, then we should also be fair in our assessment of army personnel.

Many of them join the army with a romantic view of adventure and serving their country, only to find out that the realities of war are very different to the dream.

 

[Mamoon]

Armed forces also are well known for suffering from Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, if we don't want to lionise Muslims, then we should also be fair in our assessment of army personnel.

Many of them join the army with a romantic view of adventure and serving their country, only to find out that the realities of war are very different to the dream.

They are lionized because their is actual proof of them overcoming their fear of death and exhibiting courage.

When it comes to average Muslims, there is zero proof that they are more courageous in the face of death compared to average non-Muslims or atheists.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

They are lionized because their is actual proof of them overcoming their fear of death and exhibiting courage.

When it comes to average Muslims, there is zero proof that they are more courageous in the face of death compared to average non-Muslims or atheists.

Well I think you have to compare like with like. If you are talking about average Muslims then you have to compare with average non-Muslims. If you are talking about army troops, then of course there are Muslim army troops as well.

 

[Mamoon]

Well I think you have to compare like with like. If you are talking about average Muslims then you have to compare with average non-Muslims. If you are talking about army troops, then of course there are Muslim army troops as well.

Yes.

There is no evidence that an average Muslim is less fearful of death than an average non-Muslim/atheist.

There is also no evidence that Muslim soldiers are less fearful of death than non-Muslim/atheist soldiers.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Yes.

There is no evidence that an average Muslim is less fearful of death than an average non-Muslim/atheist.

There is also no evidence that Muslim soldiers are less fearful of death than non-Muslim/atheist soldiers.

Except that Muslim soldiers tend to be fighting with much lesser military equipment and against overwhelming odds so I suppose that might suggest they fear death less.

 

[Yossarian]

While I don’t disagree with the premise of what you are trying to say, calling them “brainwashed” is disrespectful.

Following orders and putting their country’s honor above their personal safety is a basic requirement of serving in the armed forces.

Since you don't disagree (and therefore presumably agree) with my premise that a soldier's mindset has to be such that he will obey his superiors orders no matter what. That means even if he has no idea how that task fits into the bigger picture, and thinks those orders will get him killed for certain, he must still obey them without question. Even if he completely detests his immediate superior(s), and believes him to be incompetent and hates him, he will still obey his order that will result in his certain and futile death.

So if he's not 'brainwashed' into completely having that mindset, what else would you call the process that leads to him having that absolute and unquestioning attitude towards obeying orders? I'd guarantee that he didn't start out like that.

 

[Mamoon]

Except that Muslim soldiers tend to be fighting with much lesser military equipment and against overwhelming odds so I suppose that might suggest they fear death less.

So the Sikhs in Pakistan military refuse to fight in wars against superior enemies?

And would the Hindus and Sikhs in the Indian military refuse to fight India decides to wage war against the vastly superior U.S. military?

India got battered by China in 1962 when they had three times the forces that India had. Did the non-Muslims members of the Indian forces refuse to fight?

 

[Mamoon]

Since you don't disagree (and therefore presumably agree) with my premise that a soldier's mindset has to be such that he will obey his superiors orders no matter what. That means even if he has no idea how that task fits into the bigger picture, and thinks those orders will get him killed for certain, he must still obey them without question. Even if he completely detests his immediate superior(s), and believes him to be incompetent and hates him, he will still obey his order that will result in his certain and futile death.

So if he's not 'brainwashed' into completely having that mindset, what else would you call the process that leads to him having that absolute and unquestioning attitude towards obeying orders? I'd guarantee that he didn't start out like that.

Of course they don’t start out like that. The fear of death is trained out of them.

The term “brainwashing” has a negative connotation to it so I would prefer to call it loyalty and bravery.

 

[Yossarian]

Of course they don’t start out like that. The fear of death is trained out of them.

The term “brainwashing” has a negative connotation to it so I would prefer to call it loyalty and bravery.

But fear of death is not necessarily trained out of them, but simply the fact that, now, obeying orders absolutely and unquestioningly supersedes everything else.

Well "The fear of death is trained out of them" and not "brainwashing" is just semantics. The objective, the method and results are the one and the same.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

So the Sikhs in Pakistan military refuse to fight in wars against superior enemies?

And would the Hindus and Sikhs in the Indian military refuse to fight India decides to wage war against the vastly superior U.S. military?

India got battered by China in 1962 when they had three times the forces that India had. Did the non-Muslims members of the Indian forces refuse to fight?

How many Sikhs and Hindus do you see actually fighting against overwhelming odds? I can hardly judge on something which has never happened in recent history. India were fairly quickly subjugated by China, I agree. What do you want me to say about that?

 

[Mamoon]

How many Sikhs and Hindus do you see actually fighting against overwhelming odds? I can hardly judge on something which has never happened in recent history. India were fairly quickly subjugated by China, I agree. What do you want me to say about that?

Are you suggesting that if there is a war between Pakistan and India, the non-Muslim contingent in the Pakistani armed forces would be less inclined to sacrifice their lives for the nation?

I wonder how the non-Muslim members of the Pakistani armed forces, who take great pride as defenders of the country, would feel about your ridiculous assertion that Muslim soldiers fear death less.

 

[kk1992]

Everyone fear death, muslim or non-muslim but for different reasons.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Are you suggesting that if there is a war between Pakistan and India, the non-Muslim contingent in the Pakistani armed forces would be less inclined to sacrifice their lives for the nation?

I wonder how the non-Muslim members of the Pakistani armed forces, who take great pride as defenders of the country, would feel about your ridiculous assertion that Muslim soldiers fear death less.

No I am not suggesting that, might be the non-Muslim soldiers would be prepared to sacrifice their lives despite the fear. In fact you could say that is an even greater mark of courage.

 

[Local.Dada]

No I am not suggesting that, might be the non-Muslim soldiers would be prepared to sacrifice their lives despite the fear. In fact you could say that is an even greater mark of courage.

Define courage? It takes great courage to take up responsibility and protect your family by working hard too. It is not as easy as it sounds. Plenty of people take the high road.

Don’t doctors and nurses require courage especially with what’s going on right now? Do they need religious tenets for that?

I have seen this false equivalence of what’s the difference between a religious terrorist or soldier as they both die for a cause. While one is sacrificing his life to protect his home and his family the other is attacking innocent folk on some beliefs that he cannot even validate. When one is fighting against some one who has an equal chance of killing him the other is attacking unsuspecting people .

I don’t call that courage to be honest

 

[Thomaskutty]

Except that Muslim soldiers tend to be fighting with much lesser military equipment and against overwhelming odds so I suppose that might suggest they fear death less.

^ lol I've never heard of this interpretation before.
I think you might be watching too many of those turkish tv shows based on Ottomans/Crusades. It's called fiction for a reason, captain. Unless what you've said is based on some incidents or wars in history we don't know about.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Define courage? It takes great courage to take up responsibility and protect your family by working hard too. It is not as easy as it sounds. Plenty of people take the high road.

Don’t doctors and nurses require courage especially with what’s going on right now? Do they need religious tenets for that?

I have seen this false equivalence of what’s the difference between a religious terrorist or soldier as they both die for a cause. While one is sacrificing his life to protect his home and his family the other is attacking innocent folk on some beliefs that he cannot even validate. When one is fighting against some one who has an equal chance of killing him the other is attacking unsuspecting people .

I don’t call that courage to be honest

Why does courage need to be defined? Has anybody said that it is reserved only for Muslims? It seems OP asked a specific question about Muslim outlook on death, and posters are now demanding recognition for non-Muslim soldiers, doctors and nurses, atheists and so on.

Dear friends you may have it. Courage is indeed on display across many professions and belief systems. Just because (believing) Muslims appear to show bravery in the face of death, does not mean that quality is not present among non-Muslims, many of whom believe in their cause more than agnostic Muslims.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

^ lol I've never heard of this interpretation before.
I think you might be watching too many of those turkish tv shows based on Ottomans/Crusades. It's called fiction for a reason, captain. Unless what you've said is based on some incidents or wars in history we don't know about.

I don't watch Turkish tv shows. I was thinking of British troop accounts of Afghan mujahideen that they worked alongside during the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. One account in particular where the British commander recalled an Afghan in flip flops facing off against a Soviet helicopter with an AK47, standing in the open firing away until he got vapourised. I think there was even a Rambo film which was made in tribute to the Mujahideen bravery in the face of death.

 

[Greenstorm]

^ lol I've never heard of this interpretation before.
I think you might be watching too many of those turkish tv shows based on Ottomans/Crusades. It's called fiction for a reason, captain. Unless what you've said is based on some incidents or wars in history we don't know about.

Muslim resistance in Kashmir, Afghanistan, Palestine, Pakistan(against India), Chechnya are some of the recent examples.