Why have associate nations and new Test members failed in evolving as teams at the top level?

[Major]

When Haroon Lorgat decided to reduce teams in the ICC World Cup 2015, from 14 to 10, there was alot of backlash from cricket fans and from cricket players from these associate nation. The idea back than was, as associates rarely give a performance in ODI cricket, it was better to throw them in T20 cricket as they are more likely to perform well in the T20 format.

Thus, we have seen more associates teams and new test members playing in the world t20. In the current ongoing World T20 2021, we saw 6 new associate teams feature in the group stage while Afghanistan had already been qualified for the Super 12.

However, as the World T20 moves towards the semi final stages, we again see an ICC event where the associate nations and newly made test members are still at the bottom of the table. Meaning that top test nations were able to steal 2 points each from them. Namibia, Scotland, Afghanistan and Bangladesh gave the typical minnow performance.

There were alot of expectations from the Afghan side, especially considering the fact they had bowlers who featured in other t20 events worldwide. Yet, the afghan team can't win games in either t20 world cups or odi world cups.

If one digs deep, post 2000, no associate team or newly made test team has ever improved. Srilanka was probably the last team that evolved and became a top cricketing nation.

The story of associates remains the same. A top associate nation ends up out beating its competitors at the lower level, and when they get thrown in the top level, they are not able to survive and sustain themselves that they go back to the associate circles. Usually they either stay at top in the associate level or just further deteriorate.

Bangladesh and Zimbabwe fail to perform at world stages. Canada, Netherlands and Scotland have been in the cricket system for such a long time yet after some good performances and winning qualifications they again get lost and vanish from the world stage only to return after 10 years with the same old bad performances.

Alot was expected from Ireland after the 2007 World Cup win off Pakistan, but they have never evolved. Afghanistan is also becoming the same story where they have failed to perform at world events post 2010s.

People might give the example of Kenya 2003 but they made it to the semis due to forfeits and after that event, the team just fell apart and didn't feature again after the 2011 World Cup.

This year around we saw Papua New Guinea and Namibia feature, infact Namibia went on to qualify for the Super 12 stages and the 2022 World T20 event.. However, as usual, the story will remain the same. In the longer run, they will be replaced by some other associate nation.

It seems as if, once an associate nation becomes the top associate or even gets the Test membership, they fail to evolve and their winnings in cricket stops there. We might not be seeing any new team come in the top 8, and most likely teams might now get reduced in future ICC T20 World Cups. Funny thing is, Haroon Lorgat was proven right after 10 years.

I still cannot deduce why these associates can't evolve at this level. Alot of expectations from this World T20, but the same old story.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

They're amateurs with barely a single professional

 

[Lonewarrior]

becoz of BCCIICC ......

 

[Cric1234]

The overall strength of the top teams is too much for them more competitive first class cricket and more exposure in T20 leagues will help develop more countries.

Afghanistan have a decent base if they can find a few decent batsmen and fast bowlers others can develop more if their players regularly play against the best players in league cricket.

You can’t expect any of them to win WCs in the next 10 20 years being more competitive and winning matches is a start.

 

[Barragan]

Money!

You need money to be able to train everyday to improve yourself, but how do you do that without a stable income?

Most of the players have to do other jobs to make money, hence less time to train and further develop their skills.

 

[NeVerMind]

Well the issue of Scotland and Ireland is that as soon as they have a world class player among them, England will poach them...so they will never evolve past the stage of filling the numbers in World Cups...

 

[moghul]

Sooner the ICC realized they cannot further expand the cricket to create a new test nation is better. Minnows will remain minnows and they should be treated like ones .

The established test nation are because of their established multigenerational cricketing culture, broad base of followers and domestic cricket FC structure. Bangladesh was the only nation which would check all the dots and was expected to become an established test playing nation in 2-3 decades but why they have not able to progress much , its still a mystery and up for discussion.

Ireland , has very small number of cricket followers , they should never been given a test status and will not get any better . Same can be said about Zimbabwe , particularly after a big number of whites had left the country and not playing in domestic circuit .

Afghanistan , being an unstable country for long time , never had any established domestic cricket infrastructure . Hope peace will retune to them on long term basis and they will be able to establish their domestic FC and other infrastructure , only then we can expect some significant improvement. They are the most talented new cricketing nation and have been able to achieve a lot even with so many domestic issues and even with not having a permanent base.

Forget about Holland, Scotland, Namibia , PNG and other associate nations, they have very very small cricket followers and not expected to improve much . Their ceiling is very low . ICC should treat them as such .

 

[Joseph Gomes]

Well the issue of Scotland and Ireland is that as soon as they have a world class player among them, England will poach them...so they will never evolve past the stage of filling the numbers in World Cups...

If that is the case, then Scotland shouldn't even have a cricket board. It's not a sovereign nation and doesn't have its own team in the Olympics either. Scotland exists purely to fill a number and get bashed as fodder team. Not very different from what Mumbai/Maharastra would be if it were its own team

 

[iniqbal223]

When Haroon Lorgat decided to reduce teams in the ICC World Cup 2015, from 14 to 10, there was alot of backlash from cricket fans and from cricket players from these associate nation. The idea back than was, as associates rarely give a performance in ODI cricket, it was better to throw them in T20 cricket as they are more likely to perform well in the T20 format.

Thus, we have seen more associates teams and new test members playing in the world t20. In the current ongoing World T20 2021, we saw 6 new associate teams feature in the group stage while Afghanistan had already been qualified for the Super 12.

However, as the World T20 moves towards the semi final stages, we again see an ICC event where the associate nations and newly made test members are still at the bottom of the table. Meaning that top test nations were able to steal 2 points each from them. Namibia, Scotland, Afghanistan and Bangladesh gave the typical minnow performance.

There were alot of expectations from the Afghan side, especially considering the fact they had bowlers who featured in other t20 events worldwide. Yet, the afghan team can't win games in either t20 world cups or odi world cups.

If one digs deep, post 2000, no associate team or newly made test team has ever improved. Srilanka was probably the last team that evolved and became a top cricketing nation.

The story of associates remains the same. A top associate nation ends up out beating its competitors at the lower level, and when they get thrown in the top level, they are not able to survive and sustain themselves that they go back to the associate circles. Usually they either stay at top in the associate level or just further deteriorate.

Bangladesh and Zimbabwe fail to perform at world stages. Canada, Netherlands and Scotland have been in the cricket system for such a long time yet after some good performances and winning qualifications they again get lost and vanish from the world stage only to return after 10 years with the same old bad performances.

Alot was expected from Ireland after the 2007 World Cup win off Pakistan, but they have never evolved. Afghanistan is also becoming the same story where they have failed to perform at world events post 2010s.

People might give the example of Kenya 2003 but they made it to the semis due to forfeits and after that event, the team just fell apart and didn't feature again after the 2011 World Cup.

This year around we saw Papua New Guinea and Namibia feature, infact Namibia went on to qualify for the Super 12 stages and the 2022 World T20 event.. However, as usual, the story will remain the same. In the longer run, they will be replaced by some other associate nation.

It seems as if, once an associate nation becomes the top associate or even gets the Test membership, they fail to evolve and their winnings in cricket stops there. We might not be seeing any new team come in the top 8, and most likely teams might now get reduced in future ICC T20 World Cups. Funny thing is, Haroon Lorgat was proven right after 10 years.

I still cannot deduce why these associates can't evolve at this level. Alot of expectations from this World T20, but the same old story.

Agree with [MENTION=135038]Major[/MENTION]

First solve Bangladesh mystery; why they were treated so better than teams like Pakistan and SriLanka for that matter

Nothing to show for them, just waste important ICC resources

 

[Major]

The overall strength of the top teams is too much for them more competitive first class cricket and more exposure in T20 leagues will help develop more countries.

Afghanistan have a decent base if they can find a few decent batsmen and fast bowlers others can develop more if their players regularly play against the best players in league cricket.

You can’t expect any of them to win WCs in the next 10 20 years being more competitive and winning matches is a start.

how much more exposure? the exposure argument has been going on for years but nothing happens. Bangaldesh has got the most exposure out of all of them

 

[Major]

Money!

You need money to be able to train everyday to improve yourself, but how do you do that without a stable income?

Most of the players have to do other jobs to make money, hence less time to train and further develop their skills.

What about Scotland, Ireland, Nethrlands. They probably get paid decent amounts. Still they haven't improved or evolved. Especially Ireland.

 

[Major]

Well the issue of Scotland and Ireland is that as soon as they have a world class player among them, England will poach them...so they will never evolve past the stage of filling the numbers in World Cups...

This poaching argument is to be very honest flawed.

Had Gary Ballence stayed in Zimbabwe, it would had done him no good. His team still would had been bad

Ireland got Ed joyce back, yet they couldn't perform at top level and kept on dominating in low level cricket.

This is like Rashid Khan existing. If he leaves the Afghan team, the performance of Afghanistan won't get affected at top level as its still bad.

Sooner the ICC realized they cannot further expand the cricket to create a new test nation is better. Minnows will remain minnows and they should be treated like ones .

The established test nation are because of their established multigenerational cricketing culture, broad base of followers and domestic cricket FC structure. Bangladesh was the only nation which would check all the dots and was expected to become an established test playing nation in 2-3 decades but why they have not able to progress much , its still a mystery and up for discussion.

Ireland , has very small number of cricket followers , they should never been given a test status and will not get any better . Same can be said about Zimbabwe , particularly after a big number of whites had left the country and not playing in domestic circuit .

Afghanistan , being an unstable country for long time , never had any established domestic cricket infrastructure . Hope peace will retune to them on long term basis and they will be able to establish their domestic FC and other infrastructure , only then we can expect some significant improvement. They are the most talented new cricketing nation and have been able to achieve a lot even with so many domestic issues and even with not having a permanent base.

Forget about Holland, Scotland, Namibia , PNG and other associate nations, they have very very small cricket followers and not expected to improve much . Their ceiling is very low . ICC should treat them as such .

I remember the hate Haroon Lorgat got, even i hated him for what he was doing back than. But now looking back, it made sense.

There has been no improvement, and each icc tournament we see more associate games than actual games.

 

[the Great Khan]

The problem is the ICC and the rich boards. Ultimately they don't want cricket to become a truly global power sport. The advent of t20 suddenly gave cricket the chance to expand into territory that it had never before. But due to the power of domestic boards and their leagues they have actively worked to prevent this.

The ICC should be actively going into new territories or associate territories and helping setup cricket structures. The rich boards should be providing funds to enable this.

A new funding model needs to be crated to bring in more money for associate and weaker nations to help them build and promote the game in schools and grass roots.

The t20 format should be the doorway into the rest of the formats. It should be in the Olympics and we need to get it into places like Malaysia China , and to help European teams like Holland Scotland and Ireland.

The fact is Ireland should be a top white ball team by now..we need more effort to promote the game there and no poaching for England. In South Asia Nepal should be helped along with Bangladesh. They need to review why Bangladesh has t developed and help them get their programmes right.

In South East Asia the game should be promoted heavily in Malaysia and Indonesia. Also Singapore and Hong Kong are doorways into China. The ICC is asleep at the wheel and is just a events company now..

 

[Varun]

Ireland and Afghanistan are still relatively new.

Give them more time. At least as much time as given to Bangladesh and they'll leave those no-hopers in the dust.

 

[Major]

The problem is the ICC and the rich boards. Ultimately they don't want cricket to become a truly global power sport. The advent of t20 suddenly gave cricket the chance to expand into territory that it had never before. But due to the power of domestic boards and their leagues they have actively worked to prevent this.

The ICC should be actively going into new territories or associate territories and helping setup cricket structures. The rich boards should be providing funds to enable this.

A new funding model needs to be crated to bring in more money for associate and weaker nations to help them build and promote the game in schools and grass roots.

The t20 format should be the doorway into the rest of the formats. It should be in the Olympics and we need to get it into places like Malaysia China , and to help European teams like Holland Scotland and Ireland.

The fact is Ireland should be a top white ball team by now..we need more effort to promote the game there and no poaching for England. In South Asia Nepal should be helped along with Bangladesh. They need to review why Bangladesh has t developed and help them get their programmes right.

In South East Asia the game should be promoted heavily in Malaysia and Indonesia. Also Singapore and Hong Kong are doorways into China. The ICC is asleep at the wheel and is just a events company now..

But what is the gurantee that more investment from icc will allow these teams to become top teams?

Bangladesh has been getting funding and ireland has a first class structure in place.

Icc has made the qualifiers very easy for any team to play and perform.

Making cricket an olympic sport means we will be habing another cricket tournament which i believe we dont need.

Afghanistan has been helped by pcb in the past, but their growth stopped as soon as it comes to playing big league cricket.

 

[Major]

Ireland and Afghanistan are still relatively new.

Give them more time. At least as much time as given to Bangladesh and they'll leave those no-hopers in the dust.

They arnt. Ireland has been there for the last 15 years.

The scenes are so bad that they couldnt qualify for the super 12s and lost to namibia, which is another team that would cease to exist in top league from 8 years from now.

Afghanistan back in 2010 world t20 were a new and weak side. But 10 years later in 2021, even after finding good players the afghanistan team performance in world t20 is still the same. They still cant manage to win games against good sides.

 

[silentkiller187]

I think you need structure in all formats which gives a pathway for succcess, I.e. at present what’s the benchmark or how do you get test status? We need multiple divisions in all formats, a clear promotion relegation structure, and proper support for teams moving up or down these divisions.

Also we need to move away from boards only arranging tours which they feel will be profitable, at first there will be loses to start with but in the long run it will be beneficial to all parties

 

[Major]

I think you need structure in all formats which gives a pathway for succcess, I.e. at present what’s the benchmark or how do you get test status? We need multiple divisions in all formats, a clear promotion relegation structure, and proper support for teams moving up or down these divisions.

Also we need to move away from boards only arranging tours which they feel will be profitable, at first there will be loses to start with but in the long run it will be beneficial to all parties

I think for test status, you have to play the intercontinental cup final and beat the 10th test rank team

 

[Lonewarrior]

told this 1000 times , Cricket is dying becoz of BCCICC greed ..... it wont grow, its gonna further decline in coming decades ..... only 4/5 teamous will be left to play with each other ..... thats it.

 

[bujhee kom]

Agree with [MENTION=135038]Major[/MENTION]

First solve Bangladesh mystery; why they were treated so better than teams like Pakistan and SriLanka for that matter

Nothing to show for them, just waste important ICC resources

BD was fast tracked due to the great economy. We are now a $400bn plus economy, 2* Pk's and per capita 25-30% more than India. The great economy (8%+ growth) will mean BPL becomes the #2 league in 5-10 years. This is the value of the economic miracle. Already BCB is probably the 4th richest board and soon will be in the big 4 in money terms.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Thats just the way it is and the way it is going to be for a while....however it is absolutely necessary that the ICC continue to take steps to grow the game. The way this world cup has been structured has been excellent. I wouldn't be too hard on the associate's sides as the pitches were probably far different to what they have experienced previously. The ICC should keep this format going forward.

In fact, had Bangladesh not royally messed this up then the groups would have been a lot fairer and even. If you put Scotland into the other group I genuinely think they may have managed to sneak a win against Windies/Sri Lanka. Similarly, Bangladesh v Namibia would have been a good game too.

 

[street cricketer]

Don't buy the ICC is killing the game excuse.

What explains the decline in Sri lankan and West Indian cricket, and the failure of growth of Bangladesh cricket given all of these boards get a share that's not too different from England or Australia.

 

[bujhee kom]

BD have regressed from the great side of 2015. Lions are old now. BD will be back, we recently steamrolled Aus n NZ and will be a force again.

 

[Major]

Thats just the way it is and the way it is going to be for a while....however it is absolutely necessary that the ICC continue to take steps to grow the game. The way this world cup has been structured has been excellent. I wouldn't be too hard on the associate's sides as the pitches were probably far different to what they have experienced previously. The ICC should keep this format going forward.

In fact, had Bangladesh not royally messed this up then the groups would have been a lot fairer and even. If you put Scotland into the other group I genuinely think they may have managed to sneak a win against Windies/Sri Lanka. Similarly, Bangladesh v Namibia would have been a good game too.

this world cup had too many one sidded minnow games. It was boring. I would prefer a quaterfinal system infact where minnows can have the luck factor.

In a league system there are too many one sided meaningless games

 

[NeVerMind]

This poaching argument is to be very honest flawed.

Had Gary Ballence stayed in Zimbabwe, it would had done him no good. His team still would had been bad

Ireland got Ed joyce back, yet they couldn't perform at top level and kept on dominating in low level cricket.

This is like Rashid Khan existing. If he leaves the Afghan team, the performance of Afghanistan won't get affected at top level as its still bad.

I remember the hate Haroon Lorgat got, even i hated him for what he was doing back than. But now looking back, it made sense.

There has been no improvement, and each icc tournament we see more associate games than actual games.

How is it a flawed argument? Sure Ed Joyce and the likes of Dougie Brown went back to Scotland once they were no longer needed, but the best years of their playing lives was used up by England. So any young players coming up had no one to look up to and learn from in the changing rooms. And if you are good for a long time like Eoin Morgan, you ain't coming back.

I don't blame the players though. They want to maximise their playing days with the best so obviously they will come to England. But it will never allow the likes of Scotland and Ireland to prosper.

 

[Babeikh]

As others have said it ultimately comes down to money.

In order to develop to a standard where you are competing with the best, you need money to invest in infrastructure, grounds, academies, marketing so you can actually get people interested in the sport. You need to develop a proper pathway and domestic structure for players. The imbalance is so large that an associate nation can only ever dream of being a good associate team, really. They aren't going to be able to develop to a level where they will regularly compete even with the likes of Bangladesh.

Bangladesh is the most disappointing really. They have had a lot of exposure, two decades now of test cricket, cricket culturally embedded in society etc yet they are still so poor.

 

[Cric1234]

how much more exposure? the exposure argument has been going on for years but nothing happens. Bangaldesh has got the most exposure out of all of them

Do all Bangladesh players play in IPL PSL BBL and other leagues or just a few same can be said for Afghanistan their first class systems are lower quality compared to the top teams players need more exposure against better quality of cricket regularly to improve.

 

[Barragan]

What about Scotland, Ireland, Nethrlands. They probably get paid decent amounts. Still they haven't improved or evolved. Especially Ireland.

No they actually don't.

They at tops earn $15-20k which is nowhere near enough.

 

[Bewal Express]

It's called cricket culture. Its said in Rugby that the All Blacks have over a 100 years institutional memory and that creates knowledge and a culture of succes, well none of this can be said about the new cricket members. Only Afg will be a long term success

 

[bujhee kom]

As others have said it ultimately comes down to money.

In order to develop to a standard where you are competing with the best, you need money to invest in infrastructure, grounds, academies, marketing so you can actually get people interested in the sport. You need to develop a proper pathway and domestic structure for players. The imbalance is so large that an associate nation can only ever dream of being a good associate team, really. They aren't going to be able to develop to a level where they will regularly compete even with the likes of Bangladesh.

Bangladesh is the most disappointing really. They have had a lot of exposure, two decades now of test cricket, cricket culturally embedded in society etc yet they are still so poor.

Bangladesh has focussed on economy. Cricket will improve as the board gets richer and richer. BCB can dictate to all boards bar BCCI by 2027/30.

 

[Babeikh]

Bangladesh has focussed on economy. Cricket will improve as the board gets richer and richer. BCB can dictate to all boards bar BCCI by 2027/30.

Pretty atrocious considering it's been over 20 years of focusing and they still can't dictate to Ireland let alone every board bar BCCI

 

[bujhee kom]

^
You can confusing on-field and off-field aspects. BCB will have the money to amplify its voice due to the great economy. After IPL, BCB will be the 'money league' - plenty of taka!

 

[Babeikh]

^
You can confusing on-field and off-field aspects. BCB will have the money to amplify its voice due to the great economy. After IPL, BCB will be the 'money league' - plenty of taka!

Well if it has been 20 years and BCB is still on same level as Zimbabwe cricket board I doubt they will reach Sri Lanka cricket board level by 2027, but good luck believing that if it makes you feel better !

 

[ElRaja]

the teams which were promoted to international status when tests were the premier format made the step up, even sri lanka had a long history of long form cricket prior to getting test status.

its hard enough building a team for one format, by chopping and changing to different formats you make player development for non-professional boards nearly impossible.

also teams are generally promoted to internationals when they have a crop of good individual players together, that is no guarantee that they will continue to produce that level of player, like zimbabwe and to an even more stark extent kenya.

even afg are competitive because a lot of their players had access to club cricket in KP, and ireland likewise with england.

 

[moghul]

BD have regressed from the great side of 2015. Lions are old now. BD will be back, we recently steamrolled Aus n NZ and will be a force again.

Great side ?? Yes, By BD standard . Stream rolled Aus and NZl ?? ? on those third class wickets, how many games your team won in WC , lost even to Scotland, shameful.

Problem is not only with BD team , their fans are also to be blamed , they don't demand some good overseas performance from the team, they are happy with their team beating Zimb and other teams on low quality home wickets.

 

[moghul]

Bangladesh has focussed on economy. Cricket will improve as the board gets richer and richer. BCB can dictate to all boards bar BCCI by 2027/30.

Stop dreaming , your team is going down the hill , your players are getting richer and losing every match out side BD.

 

[Babeikh]

Great side ?? Yes, By BD standard . Stream rolled Aus and NZl ?? ? on those third class wickets, how many games your team won in WC , lost even to Scotland, shameful.

Problem is not only with BD team , their fans are also to be blamed , they don't demand some good overseas performance from the team, they are happy with their team beating Zimb and other teams on low quality home wickets.

Delusion has been Bangladesh's problem. They actually think they are great - i'd laugh but it's actually very sad.

 

[Joseph Gomes]

BD was fast tracked due to the great economy. We are now a $400bn plus economy, 2* Pk's and per capita 25-30% more than India. The great economy (8%+ growth) will mean BPL becomes the #2 league in 5-10 years. This is the value of the economic miracle. Already BCB is probably the 4th richest board and soon will be in the big 4 in money terms.

China is the second largest economy in the world, and Bangladesh is closer to them in cricket achievement than top 8 test nations. It's absurd how talentless Bangladesh cricketers are. Money can't buy talent or humility I suppose.

 

[Major]

the teams which were promoted to international status when tests were the premier format made the step up, even sri lanka had a long history of long form cricket prior to getting test status.

its hard enough building a team for one format, by chopping and changing to different formats you make player development for non-professional boards nearly impossible.

also teams are generally promoted to internationals when they have a crop of good individual players together, that is no guarantee that they will continue to produce that level of player, like zimbabwe and to an even more stark extent kenya.

even afg are competitive because a lot of their players had access to club cricket in KP, and ireland likewise with england.

Ireland cricket is a joke.. newer teams are getting ahead of them.

Afg is yet to win matches in icc tournaments. They have been the biggest joke in the icc tournament.

A problem with afg is the political interference when it comes to icc selection. During the whole year asghar captains the team, when its time for icc tournaments, some afg officials intervenes and makes captains of his choice

 

[sweep_shot]

Lack of support is the main reason.

Apart from Bangladesh, no other associate received any significant support over the past 25 years.

Look at Ireland. They lost their main player to England (Eoin Morgan). Associates/weak teams often lose their players to county cricket and whatnot.

 

[sam_ahm]

There is a thread on twitter and it explains in some very good points why associates haven't done well in T20 cricket.

It is a myth that just because it is T20, the associates and new test nations will cause more upsets. Huge myth.

1. If you look at the record of Bangladesh, Ireland, even Zimbabwe, they perform much better in ODIs than in T20s. One reason for this is that most main test playing nation players play around 50 T20s a year if we include T20 leagues. Associates and New test playing nation players barely play 10-15 and are mostly not part of any major leagues.

There are no leagues in ODIs, have never been so the gap in ODIs is less because most teams play similar number of games each year.

2. In the last 18 months due to COVID, associates + Zim, Ire have played very little T20 cricket, esp the associates.

3. Test nations now plan better against associate nations, they no longer take them for granted

4. Most test playing nations have words best coaches and infrastructure in T20 leagues these days, something associates have been deprived of.

I keep hearing Bangladesh's example. Truth is Bangladesh have done well on numerous occasions. 2017 CT semi finals, Twice in Asia Cup runners up, beating the likes of South Africa and WI in 2019 WC. Home Test wins over England and Australia. Multiple series wins over SLN and WI etc...

But T20s have evolved a lot, teams like Bangladesh, Ireland, Zimbabwe, Scot and Netherlands have not focussed much on T20s, instead they still do well in ODIs. Scotland have even beaten England in an ODI 3 yrs ago. Zimbabwe beat Pak last year in an ODI. Ireland have recently beaten South Africa.

Afghanistan is probably the only team that may yet do well in T20s over ODIs because most of their batters are sloggers.

T20s are actually very monotonous, there is no excitement in a T20 except to watch some sixes and some last over finishes. No where near the various stages of a game you experience in ODIs or tests.

 

[ElRaja]

Ireland cricket is a joke.. newer teams are getting ahead of them.

Afg is yet to win matches in icc tournaments. They have been the biggest joke in the icc tournament.

A problem with afg is the political interference when it comes to icc selection. During the whole year asghar captains the team, when its time for icc tournaments, some afg officials intervenes and makes captains of his choice

morgan, rankin, the o'brien brothers, porterfield, dockrell, stirling etc are pbly one of the best groups of players produced by an associate team, all afaik were local irish players, and all were developed in pre test status ireland.

newer teams are getting ahead of them for the reason i stated, they had all this talent show up in one go, which got them test status, and then the follow up talent wasnt as good, but this pattern has historically repeated for all teams after sri lanka.

 

[Major]

morgan, rankin, the o'brien brothers, porterfield, dockrell, stirling etc are pbly one of the best groups of players produced by an associate team, all afaik were local irish players, and all were developed in pre test status ireland.

newer teams are getting ahead of them for the reason i stated, they had all this talent show up in one go, which got them test status, and then the follow up talent wasnt as good, but this pattern has historically repeated for all teams after sri lanka.

the mentioned players performed againast associates, when it came to playing agianst top teams, these players collectively did nothing. They will do an upset or two in a tournament but they never were capable of reaching semis.

Striling was mounting runs whole year round, as soon as the world t20 came he choked.

 

[DHONI183]

I know that I´m going to sound very harsh and mean, and I do sound that way most of the times, but the increased number of minnows has actually ruined the T20 World Cup for me, as prior to that, every edition of the said tournament had been absolutely dream ones for me. In fact, it was the presence of such competitive T20 World Cup editions which made me put this particular tournament on par with football in terms of entertainment and thrill. I´m all for expanding and globalising the game, but we´ve to be honest here. Just look at it, Group One of the Super 12 round provided more closely fought encounters solely based on the fact that it had no genuine minnow with the exception of Bangladesh. We all also know as to why the recent ODI World Cup was much celebrated, enjoyed, admired, and praised, and the reason for that is the lack of these minnows. The ICC Champions Trophy too has/had always provided much more fun and great matches due to the same reason. The quality of cricket on display should be prioritised over quantity, and there´re no two ways about it. The matches from Group Two were an absolute horror to watch, to be honest here.

If indeed a compromise had to be made, then the Super 10 format should´ve been stuck with, with each group having one of these associate teams, and that would´ve sufficed. My idea on the expansion of cricket would be that these associates teams should be played against in the warm-up matches, and a certain number of bilateral ODI or T20I series should be allotted to them by the ICC in which the top teams should be made bound to play a certain number of matches against these teams. If these associate teams then win these matches and improve their overall ranking, then fair enough, they should automatically qualify for these big tournaments - or any similar or other system should be introduced to recognise their progress. This way, at least the quality of cricket on display in global events would be less compromised, I believe.

 

[Major]

Lack of support is the main reason.

Apart from Bangladesh, no other associate received any significant support over the past 25 years.

Look at Ireland. They lost their main player to England (Eoin Morgan). Associates/weak teams often lose their players to county cricket and whatnot.

again, posts like lack of support or money makes no sense.

Had Ireland kept Morgan with them, what is the gurantee they would had been the worlds best?

Ireland got Ed joyce back.

Afg has Rashid Khan and Mujeeb yet it losses matches, Nepal has sandeep yet it cant even qualify for icc tournament.

 

[sweep_shot]

Afg has Rashid Khan and Mujeeb yet it losses matches, Nepal has sandeep yet it cant even qualify for icc tournament.

Comparing Ed Joyce to Eoin Morgan is not right. Morgan is a 2-time World Cup winner (2010 World T20 and 2019 ODI WC). Morgan is a modern ODI great.

Afghanistan is a war-torn country. They have done pretty well considering what they are going through.

By support, I mean more international games against top teams. How many games do these associates play? They need to play more to get better.