Would ECB continue to play if a Pakistani staff member had tested positive?

[hoshiarpurexpress]

as news came in, Ravi Shastri is in isolation due to COVID positive.
If it was some Pakistan staff who had tested positive, would ECB have still continued the test match.
Thoughts ?

 

[James]

Yes, the ICC Match Referee would have overseen the unencumbered continuation of the match.

 

[Rana]

Yes, the ICC Match Referee would have overseen the unencumbered continuation of the match.

Yeah right...

 

[Bewal Express]

In England yes because there are millions at stake for the ECB, but safety would take "precedence" if it was in PK.

 

[Rana]

They would have continued the tour if they were hosting Pakistan because it’s their Moolah on the line

But they will run home like chickens if there is even a single positive test in the ground staff let alone the actual cricketers on tours to places like South Africa, Pakistan, Bangladesh or Sri Lanka

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

Yes, the ICC Match Referee would have overseen the unencumbered continuation of the match.

I have to say if this was in Pakistan/Bangladesh, the English players would have been on their flights back home.

 

[Rana]

“Safety will take precedence”

“Mental well being of players will need to be considered”

Just some of the new ways of demonstrating elite privilege in sport

 

[OMB]

What do you think BCCI will do if it found a English backroom staff testing positive?

 

[Varun]

They would have continued the tour if they were hosting Pakistan because it’s their Moolah on the line

But they will run home like chickens if there is even a single positive test in the ground staff let alone the actual cricketers on tours to places like South Africa, Pakistan, Bangladesh or Sri Lanka

It's one thing playing the victim card on the basis of actual events, and another to start sobbing on hypotheticals and fiction.

Pakistan had a successful 3-test series last year to England despite the Covid issue, did they not?

Three members of Pakistan tour party to England test positive for Covid-19

Pakistan’s tour of England appears to be in the balance, with three of their players having tested positive for Covid-19 and a further batch of results set to be published in the next 24 hours.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...tan-tour-party-england-test-positive-covid-19

 

[Rana]

It's one thing playing the victim card on the basis of actual events, and another to start sobbing on hypotheticals and fiction.

Pakistan had a successful 3-test series last year to England despite the Covid issue, did they not?

Well done Einstein for proving my point even though you didn’t understand at all

 

[James]

They would have continued the tour if they were hosting Pakistan because it’s their Moolah on the line

But they will run home like chickens if there is even a single positive test in the ground staff let alone the actual cricketers on tours to places like South Africa, Pakistan, Bangladesh or Sri Lanka

Rubbish.

 

[Rajdeep]

It has nothing to do with India or Pakistan, its the rule of the land.

As per UK law, you no longer need to self isolate even though you are in contact with someone having the virus as long as you test negative.

Since all the players tested negative, there is no reason why the series should not continue. It dosent matter which country the player is from.

So yes...ECB would have continued the tour even if the touring team was Pakistan.

 

[Rana]

Rubbish.

Oh so that’s why they ran home from South Africa???

 

[OMB]

Everyone is vaccinated now isnt it?

 

[Bewal Express]

Rubbish.

Look at the SA series and the quick flight home but the same players played their ravaging pandemic in Ind with a more virulent strain.

 

[Last Monetarist]

The English players ran away from South Africa due to false positive coronavirus tests among the opposition. It's asinine to deny the privileged position a few boards hold in international cricket.

 

[Varun]

On a lighter note: Ravi Shastri tests positive and none of the players testing positive means 2 things:

1. Coach is not interacting with the players.
2. Ravi Shastri drinks alone.

 

[Major]

Depends upon many factors.

If the arrangements are poor, where everyone is allowed to go out of hte bubble and mingle that offcourse. The reason why PSL was cancelled the second time was because of this. You will have staff and players coming out positive thats not an issue, but once you get 6+ people coming out positve than it will be an issue

 

[Major]

Look at the SA series and the quick flight home but the same players played their ravaging pandemic in Ind with a more virulent strain.

I think you have to keep in mind that was 2020. Back than one positive case would become alarming which would result in decisions that when we look back now were maybe not needed.

The PSL at the time got cancelled due to rumors that Alex Hales maybe got it.

Now in 2021, oneway they started to curb postponement is catching the positive ones and isolating them while letting tours continue

 

[MenInG]

All England players, umpires are now in danger from the Indian team.

This is the height of carelessness and absolutely stupid.

The India Coach is not ordinary backroom staff - he would have total access to all team members.

 

[Bewal Express]

I think you have to keep in mind that was 2020. Back than one positive case would become alarming which would result in decisions that when we look back now were maybe not needed.

The PSL at the time got cancelled due to rumors that Alex Hales maybe got it.

Now in 2021, oneway they started to curb postponement is catching the positive ones and isolating them while letting tours continue

But you know as well as I that you could have people dying on the streets but if the players see $ they will play. Would Eng have called off the tour to Ind as they did with SA . No chance

 

[Varun]

All England players, umpires are now in danger from the Indian team.

This is the height of carelessness and absolutely stupid.

The India Coach is not ordinary backroom staff - he would have total access to all team members.

How about the fact that the entire Indian squad was in danger when they landed in England in the first place?

 

[Usman]

To be honest, if Pakistan was touring England and this would have happened, the tour would have continued.

In the UK, all restrictions are gone and the spread of Covid is high. This is the position which the government deems acceptable. So Ravi catching Covid is no big deal, when you look at the way the government is handling the pandemic. Whether the government is right or wrong is an entirely seperate matter.

Had the tour been happening in Pakistan, then there is every chance England would have pulled out. Today's play would have almost certainly been cancelled, which would have quickly led to overall cancellation of the tour. Without doubt the privileged teams adopt double standards.

 

[James]

The Indian players and England players aren’t in danger from Covid, they are young and fit athletes. When they have tested negative as well, there is no particular risk to the game continuing. These things happen.

 

[OMB]

But you know as well as I that you could have people dying on the streets but if the players see $ they will play. Would Eng have called off the tour to Ind as they did with SA . No chance

Different yardsticks in different time and in different tours. Doesn't necessarily mean that we can draw parallels
We all have become more confident than we were in 2020. That fear of Covid has receded as so many of us have got the virus and recovered.

 

[MenInG]

The Indian players and England players aren’t in danger from Covid, they are young and fit athletes. When they have tested negative as well, there is no particular risk to the game continuing. These things happen.

Then why have the pretense of bubbles and covid protocols?

 

[Major]

But you know as well as I that you could have people dying on the streets but if the players see $ they will play. Would Eng have called off the tour to Ind as they did with SA . No chance

yes the $ does play a factor and we have the IPL example there.

But in this case its hard to say considering the fact that it was 2020 and many still didnt know how to react. I would assume most probably the tour to India would had been called off if it was in 2020 and a few of the staff and players came out positive.

Yes, if nowadays it happens where we have learned how to isolate on tour than it would mean hypocrisy.

 

[James]

Then why have the pretense of bubbles and covid protocols?

They don’t have that stuff anymore in the UK. Attendances are at full capacity and players, staff etc don’t bubble. It’s just normal life here now.

 

[James]

Different yardsticks in different time and in different tours. Doesn't necessarily mean that we can draw parallels
We all have become more confident than we were in 2020. That fear of Covid has receded as so many of us have got the virus and recovered.

Spot on.

 

[Bewal Express]

Different yardsticks in different time and in different tours. Doesn't necessarily mean that we can draw parallels
We all have become more confident than we were in 2020. That fear of Covid has receded as so many of us have got the virus and recovered.

The only yardstick players use is $.

 

[Rana]

The only yardstick players use is $.

$pot on

 

[OMB]

They don’t have that stuff anymore in the UK. Attendances are at full capacity and players, staff etc don’t bubble. It’s just normal life here now.

Isn't that being overconfident? perhaps asking for trouble.

Players tested negative so playing. Still movement of people should be controlled

 

[Major]

They don’t have that stuff anymore in the UK. Attendances are at full capacity and players, staff etc don’t bubble. It’s just normal life here now.

do you think that what Sri Lanka cricket board did with Mendis, Gunathilkha and Dickwella was justified? As they had breeched the bubble and were mingling outside

 

[OMB]

$pot on

Thats what I said. Players want to play now, that fear has gone away.

 

[OMB]

do you think that what Sri Lanka cricket board did with Mendis, Gunathilkha and Dickwella was justified? As they had breeched the bubble and were mingling outside

Did they not break the rules? Were penalised for breaking rules. not for mingling outside.

 

[Junaids]

as news came in, Ravi Shastri is in isolation due to COVID positive.
If it was some Pakistan staff who had tested positive, would ECB have still continued the test match.
Thoughts ?

Yes. The UK has given up on valuing human life and is now letting the virus rip like a banana republic.

They don’t have that stuff anymore in the UK. Attendances are at full capacity and players, staff etc don’t bubble. It’s just normal life here now.

Exactly.

The British people somehow tolerate almost 40,000 new cases per day and over 1,000 deaths per week.

They have run up the white flag of surrender and are living life as if it was normal. But it isn’t.

And every sports match with a crowd of over 20,000 probably leads to deaths. Every single one.

It’s just shocking. I was shocked when India did this in April and tolerated 4 million deaths, and I’m appalled that the UK is following suit.

And they comfort themselves with the incorrect belief that their are still somehow “leading” with vaccines, even though Israel has discovered that vaccines aren’t enough without distancing and capacity caps and masks - and Israel used the most effective vaccine on everyone, whereas 50% of British people are vaccinated with a less effective jab which has failed to obtain approval in the USA and New Zealand and has been phased out already in Canada and will be discontinued in Australia from next month!

So no, a country that reckless would not treat India and Pakistan differently!

 

[Major]

Did they not break the rules? Were penalised for breaking rules. not for mingling outside.

they did, but james is saying that players and staff dont bubble anymore, so kkeeping that in mind what the SL players did was it really that much of a crime IF the situation in England is such that you dont have to be part of bubble.

Or atleast that happened now, would the England fans consider that wrong?

 

[James]

Isn't that being overconfident? perhaps asking for trouble.

Players tested negative so playing. Still movement of people should be controlled

There are still Track & Trace rules.

Ravi tested positive on an LFT so is isolating, then the players took 2 LFTs each (all tested negative).

Next step — Ravi will take a PCR test (which provides a far more reliable result). If he tests negative, he comes out of isolation and that’s it.

If Ravi tests positive though, then any close contacts will have to isolate and take PCR tests as well. This is when we could see Covid substitutes in the Test match/series.

 

[OMB]

There are still Track & Trace rules.

Ravi tested positive on an LFT so is isolating, then the players took 2 LFTs each (all tested negative).

Next step — Ravi will take a PCR test (which provides a far more reliable result). If he tests negative, he comes out of isolation and that’s it.

If Ravi tests positive though, then any close contacts will have to isolate and take PCR tests as well. This is when we could see Covid substitutes in the Test match/series.

yes, btw PCR tests have been conducted. If that comes positive, then we can expect substitutes

 

[OMB]

they did, but james is saying that players and staff dont bubble anymore, so kkeeping that in mind what the SL players did was it really that much of a crime IF the situation in England is such that you dont have to be part of bubble.

Or atleast that happened now, would the England fans consider that wrong?

Rules

No Participants = No Game: Close contacts and Self Isolation
NHS Test and Trace and the self-isolation of close contacts remains in place at Step 4 and will affect
participant availability. Examples of close contact include:
• face-to-face contact under 1 metre for any length of time
– including talking to someone or being coughed on
• being within 1 metre of each other for 1 minute or longer
• being within 2 metres of each other for more than 15 minutes in total in 1 day
• travelling in the same vehicle

If a participant tests positive on a team there is not a need for the other players or officials to self-isolate, unless they were in close contact, have been contacted by test and trace, they develop symptoms or test positive themselves. Therefore, players, officials and clubs should consider how they can reduce the likelihood of close contact occurring.
The ECB has provided a decision making framework to help clubs and leagues navigate self-isolation
decisions, please refer to this.

From the 16th August, those who have been fully vaccinated for at least two weeks, and under 18s, will not have to self-isolate, unless they test positive for COVID or develop symptoms, in which case they must isolate. There must also be a two-week gap between your second vaccination and this exemption coming
into effect. If you are over 18 and not fully vaccinated, you will still need to isolate if you come into close
contact with someone with COVID.
You must always follow self-isolation instructions from NHS Test and Trace.

extension://bfdogplmndidlpjfhoijckpakkdjkkil/pdf/viewer.html?file=https%3A%2F%2Fresources.ecb.co.uk%2Fecb%2Fdocument%2F2021%2F07%2F19%2Ff732d8f3-d8b9-44cf-b5fe-77518c128029%2FRecreational-Cricket-COVID-Guidance-in-England-Step-4-July-1-.pdf

https://www.ecb.co.uk/covid-19

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Rubbish.

Not at all. When money is on the line, covid, mental health and fatigue go out the window.

 

[Junaids]

yes, btw PCR tests have been conducted. If that comes positive, then we can expect substitutes

Which is completely nonsensical, like every aspect of the British response to this pandemic.

The players are not in a bubble. Only the “current” positive player would be replaced, even though both his teammates and replacement by any rational criteria are themselves “close contacts” who should be in isolation.

It’s just horrifying. Especially when you consider that even amongst vaccinated British people, half of them were jabbed with a vaccine which has 60% effectiveness v the Delta strain.

There are 66 million people in the UK.

23 million are unvaccinated.

22 million are fully vaccinated with AstraZeneca, which is 60% effective against the current strain.

21 million are fully vaccinated with the Pfizer or Moderna jabs.

So there is a 66% chance that every driver, cleaner, waiter or cook who encounters these two teams is either unvaccinated or undervaccinated.

It’s an extraordinary situation.

 

[Varun]

It’s just shocking. I was shocked when India did this in April and tolerated 4 million deaths, and I’m appalled that the UK is following suit.

Eh? Mathematically challenged are you?

 

[OMB]

Which is completely nonsensical, like every aspect of the British response to this pandemic.

The players are not in a bubble. Only the “current” positive player would be replaced, even though both his teammates and replacement by any rational criteria are themselves “close contacts” who should be in isolation.

It’s just horrifying. Especially when you consider that even amongst vaccinated British people, half of them were jabbed with a vaccine which has 60% effectiveness v the Delta strain.

There are 66 million people in the UK.

23 million are unvaccinated.

22 million are fully vaccinated with AstraZeneca, which is 60% effective against the current strain.

21 million are fully vaccinated with the Pfizer or Moderna jabs.

So there is a 66% chance that every driver, cleaner, waiter or cook who encounters these two teams is either unvaccinated or undervaccinated.

It’s an extraordinary situation.

Most countries have started opening up. I guess ECB is only following a diktat here

 

[Junaids]

Eh? Mathematically challenged are you?

4 million deaths is the internationally accepted Indian Covid death toll up to late July.

Source: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-57888460

You may disagree, but it’s the widely accepted number.

 

[Titan24]

Not sure if its the right question. Pak series is one of the better money makers for ECB and they would have tried to go ahead in such a case to maximize their revenues just like possibly any other board in such a situation. So their actions/decisions have nothing to do with Ind, Pak, NZ etc rather whats at stake and whats the risk they are willing to take.

Question should have been whether Eng would have continued if they were the visiting team in any other country.

 

[Junaids]

Most countries have started opening up. I guess ECB is only following a diktat here

Most countries which are successfully opening up have:

1. Vaccinated a larger percentage of the population than the UK.

2. Vaccinated them with more effective vaccines than the UK.

The proof of the pudding is in the statistics - and the UK has recorded in the last seven days:

37,578 new cases per day
120 deaths per day.

It begs a question as to how it can possibly be safe to play to packed crowds and without a bubble.

Covid has made the UK into a Failed State like Somalia or Afghanistan. And yet they don’t appear to have noticed!

 

[globalcitizen]

Ok we understand some are living in a cave and don't know what's happening in UK.
England have long now decided to follow herd immunity. So irrespective of teams they would have taken same decision

SL players were breaking curfew and team protocols by going out at 1230 and that required a different yardstick to be applied and don't draw parallels.

But still interested to see how Ravi tests go and what could be implication in next few days.

 

[Junaids]

Ok we understand some are living in a cave and don't know what's happening in UK.
England have long now decided to follow herd immunity. So irrespective of teams they would have taken same decision

SL players were breaking curfew and team protocols by going out at 1230 and that required a different yardstick to be applied and don't draw parallels.

But still interested to see how Ravi tests go and what could be implication in next few days.

We know that herd immunity is impossible with the Delta variant.

Israel vaccinated its entire population with a vaccine that is 88% effective with Delta, and is giving booster third jabs, and is vaccinating kids. And the virus is out of control, every ICU bed is full, and in a population 1/7 of the UK there are 8,000 cases and 25 deaths every day - equivalent to 56,000 cases and 175 deaths per day in the UK.

So you are telling me that the (lack of) safety for cricketers and spectators in England is based upon a discredited fantasy of herd immunity?

Maybe it’s time to refuse to tour England.

 

[SangasCoverDrive]

do you think that what Sri Lanka cricket board did with Mendis, Gunathilkha and Dickwella was justified? As they had breeched the bubble and were mingling outside

It was before July 19th I guess. UK ended all the restrictions after 19th July

 

[cricketjoshila]

All England players, umpires are now in danger from the Indian team.

This is the height of carelessness and absolutely stupid.

The India Coach is not ordinary backroom staff - he would have total access to all team members.

How about the fact that 1000s are attending matches in the grounds and some even running to the pitch?

 

[Junaids]

How about the fact that 1000s are attending matches in the grounds and some even running to the pitch?

I totally agree with you.

Let me be fair on this.

The BCCI ran the 2020-21 England tour of India safely and responsibly.

The ECB has completely abdicated responsibility for the safety of the two teams in England this summer and the crowds.

The failure to provide a duty of care to the players, staff and fans is an absolute disgrace.

 

[SangasCoverDrive]

Players have got it and recovered, most of the population is vaccinated, those who get it while being vaxxed hardly feel any symptoms so it’s not that deep, just get on with it

 

[Junaids]

Players have got it and recovered, most of the population is vaccinated, those who get it while being vaxxed hardly feel any symptoms so it’s not that deep, just get on with it

Just to be clear.

The Brazilian authorities removed 4 Argentina players from the pitch in a World Cup Qualifier today because the UK is considered - even by Brazil !!!!!!!! - to be an ultra-high risk country where Covid is out of control.

Those players had been in the UK and were supposed to be in quarantine as a result.

To be precise with the vastly exaggerated UK vaccination program:

31.8% of the population is fully vaccinated (with an 88% effective vaccine).
33% of the population is undervaccinated (they took a 60% effective vaccine).
34.8% of the population is unvaccinated or partially vaccinated.

In other words, 67.8% of British people remain in danger of serious illness or death from Covid.

The British people seem incapable of understanding that this is not a virus to which vaccination makes you immune, it is a virus in which Pfizer and Moderna protect you against serious illness or death and AstraZeneca protects just over half the people who take it - slightly more than the Chinese and Russian vaccines.

The British are acting as if they have vaccinated themselves out of the pandemic, and they are wrong.

A third of their population isn't vaccinated, another third of the population got a second rate stopgap vaccine which doesn't work for 40% of the population against current variants and isn't even allowed to be used in the USA, Canada and New Zealand, plus they are ignoring that kids are acting as a massive reservoir for neverending transmission to more vulnerable people.

You have semi-developed countries like Uruguay which are actively revaccinating people who got 2 doses of AstraZeneca with Pfizer, while the UK hides behind thinking that AstraZeneca is keeping half the population safe.

And yet the UK is now wide open with a partially protected population, and the virus running riot and a thousand people dying each week.

 

[Junaids]

There is a serious point in my earlier post.

Cricket is economically controlled by the Big Three countries, two of which have basketcase national responses to the Covid pandemic.

Does cricket have a duty of care to its players, their families and the spectators? Or is it enough to say "the players choose to play, we just abide by the local (lack of) safety regulations and that's all we are required to do".

We saw Euro 2020 act as the biggest superspreader event of the European pandemic, with measurable spikes at multiple times and locations (Scottish fans who went to London, Finnish fans who went to Russia, etc etc).

And yet because people love sport, nobody is holding UEFA accountable and financially liable for the hundreds (or more likely thousands) of deaths their tournament caused.

The current New South Wales outbreak started with a single case, a limo driver who drove an infected American pilot from Sydney airport to a city centre hotel. That ONE CASE has so far caused 108 deaths.

Euro 2020 almost certainly caused far more fatalities. We will never know which spectators at the Tests this summer developed mild Covid and then passed it on to more vulnerable friends or family who died of it. But you can bet your bottom dollar that it is happening.

 

[MenInG]

Ravi Shastri's positive Covid test came soon after he and his squad attended a busy book launch - without getting dispensation from the ECB.

 

[dildilpak]

Ravi Shastri's positive Covid test came soon after he and his squad attended a busy book launch - without getting dispensation from the ECB.

I was amazed about this too- how could you have Shastry launching his book with outsiders present right in the middle of a series? Yes, the teams might be all vaccinated, but did nobody advise them about breakthrough cases? Pretty brainless of BCCI to allow this.

I am confused about the ever changing Covid protocols in England - the other day SL cricketers were given harsh bans because they broke the protocols. But now teams are having private events without any care in the middle of the series. Isnt the host country responsible for upholding the protocols anymore?

 

[MenInG]

The Indian cricket team secured a thumping win over England in the 4th Test at the Oval but things aren't all well at the management level. The news of head coach Ravi Shastri, fielding coach R Sridhar and bowling coach Bharat Arun testing positive for Covid-19 has left the Board of Control for Cricket in India (BCCI) miffed.

Head coach Shastri and captain Virat Kohli had both recently went to a public event in England for the launch of the former's book. According to a report in the Times of India, Kohli and Shastri didn't take approval from England & Wales Cricket Board (ECB) for the same. The BCCI will now reportedly seek an explanation from Kohli and Shastri over their action.

"Photos from the event have been shared with BCCI officials. The board will probe the matter. This incident has left the board embarrassed. The coach and the captain will be asked to explain the circumstances after the fourth Test at Oval. The team's administrative manager Girish Dongre's role is also under the scanner," a top BCCI official was quoted as saying by TOI on Monday.

"The BCCI is in touch with ECB and trying to ensure the series is completed without any further incidents. As of now, everyone is hoping that Shastri recovers soon. There is a selection meeting for the T20 World Cup on Wednesday. Maybe the matter will be raised there," the official added.

With the UK government deciding to end all restrictions, the ECB also removed strict bio-bubble restrictions for the series against India. BCCI secretary, wary of the situation, had asked the players to avoid attending any public event during their stay in England in order to minimise the risk of contracting Covid-19.

Yet, with their latest actions, Shastri and Kohli seem to have defied the instructions from Shah. The entire situation has, hence, left the Indian board miffed, and now a strict bio-bubble regulation will be in place for the 5th and the final Test of the series in Manchester.

"This wasn't an official event that either of the boards had organised. This incident is all the more unsettling because BCCI secretary Jay Shah had written to every team member before the series, asking them to be cautious and refrain from attending crowded events. The action of the team hasn't gone down well with the board," the official said.

"There will be a proper bubble in Manchester. There's the IPL coming up in UAE five days after the fifth Test finishes. The players will have to move in a bubble to UAE, else they will have to serve quarantine period upon reaching Dubai. Hopefully, there won't be any further incidents once the team enters the bubble," the official said.

According to the regulations set for the series, the players and support staff are allowed to go for walkarounds in places where there isn't much crowd. With Kohli and Shastri defying the instructions, even the ECB has been disappointed.

There is a possibility that Shastri contracted the virus at the event he attended for his book launch. The possibility of catching Covid-19 through the common hotel lift is also being seen as a source.

 

[MenInG]

The Daily Mail even spoke to a person who had attended the book launch about the scenes from the event in terms of the Covid-19 protocols.

“It was horrid. No one wore masks, apart from waiting staff. It left me feeling very uncomfortable. Everyone there went over to Shastri to meet him”