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Younis Khan - a batting coach who does not coach

Mamoon

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Perhaps PCB should offer some clarity on what Younis is doing with the team and what the future holds for him.

He is the batting coach of Pakistan but our batsmen seem more interesting in getting coaching from Yousuf at the NHPC.

Younis himself recently admitted that he does not have the time to work on the batsmen’s techniques during the series and the likes of Haider Ali are keen on working with Yousuf during the time-off.

So it is unclear where Younis fits in and what his job description is. If he is not going to be the one to coach the current players of the Pakistan team then he shouldn’t be called the batting coach.

Perhaps some explanation and clarity on his role by Wasim Khan would be in order. We don’t know what he is getting paid for because apparently, Yousuf is more of the batting coach of the Pakistan team than Younis.

It is total shambles at the moment. First, our bowling coach told us that our bowlers do well at home so perhaps we should accept the awful performances away from home, and then our batting coach told us that he cannot work with the batsmen during the series and they should see Yousuf during their time-off.

As things stand, Younis is Pakistan’s batting coach but he is not the one coaching the Pakistani batsmen.
 
I think they got the description wrong. He is more of a mentor rather than a coach.

He is there to motivate them and clap for the batsmen. He has said this many times during press conferences.
 
Softdil shah

You could predict before the game that he would have no clue on how to play Shamsi in the 2nd ODI. You don’t need to have played international cricket to read that Shah has no answer to Shamsi’s ball that spins away. Or any right arm off spinner who turns it away....

Yet YK has not been able to develop an answer for this and Shah has shown no improvement.
 
Softdil shah

You could predict before the game that he would have no clue on how to play Shamsi in the 2nd ODI. You don’t need to have played international cricket to read that Shah has no answer to Shamsi’s ball that spins away. Or any right arm off spinner who turns it away....

Yet YK has not been able to develop an answer for this and Shah has shown no improvement.

how can such a huge technical deficiency be fixed in under 24 hours... khushdil should not be in the team and going forward he wont be unless he fixes his issues
 
We have far too many non-players travelling with the team.

The senior team just needs a strong manager and a fielding coach to help with the drills.
 
I think you seem to have a misunderstanding regarding the respective roles of Younis and Yousuf. Yousuf is there to work on the more glaring and technical deficiencies of the batsmen. Younis is there to tell them what they are doing right or wrong in the match. There is a fundamental difference. One is working on a broadbased level whereas the other is working on the short-term and immediate future.

Pakistan is lucky to have the services of both in their respective capacities because they are both among the greatest batsmen to ever play for Pakistan.
 
Softdil shah

You could predict before the game that he would have no clue on how to play Shamsi in the 2nd ODI. You don’t need to have played international cricket to read that Shah has no answer to Shamsi’s ball that spins away. Or any right arm off spinner who turns it away....

Yet YK has not been able to develop an answer for this and Shah has shown no improvement.

Pinning every failure on coaches is the same as pinning the blame for your child his exam on his tutor. A teacher can only offer guidance, sooner or later the student has to take responsibility for his own failings.
 
Has OP got the correct Younis? Waqar Younis makes YK look like a workhorse.
 
I have always maintained that the likes of Mohammad Yousuf and Younis Khan should be working at the NHPC with the Under 16 kids, the Under 19s, the Shaheens and the players that the PCB sends there.

They've got it right with Yousuf and we have already seen his impact, but Younis is a waste with the national team.
 
I have always maintained that the likes of Mohammad Yousuf and Younis Khan should be working at the NHPC with the Under 16 kids, the Under 19s, the Shaheens and the players that the PCB sends there.

They've got it right with Yousuf and we have already seen his impact, but Younis is a waste with the national team.

Younis ‘s ego won’t allow him to be with any academy

This job seems to be a way to shut him up (and his backers)

Like most things with Younis though it will end in tears
 
We have far too many non-players travelling with the team.

The senior team just needs a strong manager and a fielding coach to help with the drills.

So you're saying that the captain is responsible for:

- Opposition player analysis
- Bowling plans
- Team meetings
- Team talks
- Batting game plans
- Finding batting/bowling related solutions
- Video analysis on your own players and opposing players
- Being the sounding board/giving advice to your players on adjustments they can make.

Do you think Babar Azam is capable of handling all of that on his own?
 
I have always maintained that the likes of Mohammad Yousuf and Younis Khan should be working at the NHPC with the Under 16 kids, the Under 19s, the Shaheens and the players that the PCB sends there.

They've got it right with Yousuf and we have already seen his impact, but Younis is a waste with the national team.

I disagree. I think they are okay in their own roles. Although in an ideal world Yousuf shouldn't be coaching anyone. He's a malicious and vindictive human being.

Younis is fine. He has always been someone who achieved a lot with limited talent by making adjustments and thinking about his batting a lot. On tour he can provide the right sort of advise to players on making small adjustments.

Yousuf is a more classical batsman. He can help the players on their overall technique and teach them out to play the ball late.
 
I think you seem to have a misunderstanding regarding the respective roles of Younis and Yousuf. Yousuf is there to work on the more glaring and technical deficiencies of the batsmen. Younis is there to tell them what they are doing right or wrong in the match. There is a fundamental difference. One is working on a broadbased level whereas the other is working on the short-term and immediate future.

Pakistan is lucky to have the services of both in their respective capacities because they are both among the greatest batsmen to ever play for Pakistan.

Well said. This is how I view it as well. You can't revamp a technique on tour. You can make clever adjustments. For example how Kohli played Moeen Ali and Leach was very different because they spin the ball in different directions. His technique didn't change but he made a clever adjustment. That is what Younis is there to provide. And that will change match to match wicket to wicket.
 
Younis ‘s ego won’t allow him to be with any academy

This job seems to be a way to shut him up (and his backers)

Like most things with Younis though it will end in tears

He should look at the example of Rahul Dravid and what he is doing for Indian cricket.
 
He should look at the example of Rahul Dravid and what he is doing for Indian cricket.

That would imply that younis is as classy as Dravid.

Given his history, younis is more likely to knife the person who suggests such an idea. He would see it as an affront.
 
Another Younis bashing thread, only Pakistani fans do this to their legends. I reme.ber some posters including Mamoon accusing Younis of trying to take credit for Butler batting performance in the first test, whereas opposite was true as I saw his interview that was used as a basis for this false narrative.
 
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I think you seem to have a misunderstanding regarding the respective roles of Younis and Yousuf. Yousuf is there to work on the more glaring and technical deficiencies of the batsmen. Younis is there to tell them what they are doing right or wrong in the match. There is a fundamental difference. One is working on a broadbased level whereas the other is working on the short-term and immediate future.

Pakistan is lucky to have the services of both in their respective capacities because they are both among the greatest batsmen to ever play for Pakistan.

This. First time I’ve seen any semblance of organization in our setup. There are clear cut roles defined for different individuals and that is just how it should be.
 
That would imply that younis is as classy as Dravid.

Given his history, younis is more likely to knife the person who suggests such an idea. He would see it as an affront.
Or Pakistani setup is as good as in India to allow such smooth systems and training/coaching. Dravid also is probably being paid a lot more and provided first class resources.
Younis has just joined he cannot turn our mediocre batsmen into world class overnight.
 
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Young’s initially applied for the under 19 and under 16 job , but pcb decided to go with ijaz. I feel that would of been the perfect job for him
 
I have argued for a long time that coaches make a minimal, if any difference to players at the higher level. I had the journey with my lad through the county age groups and from experience The best talent needs good pitches, good weather, lots of playing time and most importantly, to play against good players to stretch them. If a good player gets that and is good enough, he will generally make it. YK, along with all the coaches will make a nice living but make no difference. If players need to be coached at the international level something is wrong.
 
Apparently YK job description states that when he is not working with the national team, he will go back to the NHPC and work with the youngsters. He can still play the role that Yousaf is playing
 
So you're saying that the captain is responsible for:

- Opposition player analysis
- Bowling plans
- Team meetings
- Team talks
- Batting game plans
- Finding batting/bowling related solutions
- Video analysis on your own players and opposing players
- Being the sounding board/giving advice to your players on adjustments they can make.

Do you think Babar Azam is capable of handling all of that on his own?



- Opposition player analysis - need analyst to do that. They come cheap and sell by the dozen these days.
- Bowling plans - Yes
- Team meetings - Yes
- Team talks - Yes
- Batting game plans - Yes
- Finding batting/bowling related solutions - Yes
- Video analysis on your own players and opposing players - Analyst job
- Being the sounding board/giving advice to your players on adjustments they can make. - each player has to take self responsibility. Analysts, captain, fellow players are there to support.

Do you think Babar Azam is capable of handling all of that on his own?
Yes, but remember the responsibilities need to be shared between captain and vice captain. Rizwan can step in.
 
He is there to scribble in his notebook for the cameras and ensure Bic don’t suffer a loss with schools closed around the world.
 
Only and only in Pakistan a coach keeps his job after saying he has no time to coach.
 
He should look at the example of Rahul Dravid and what he is doing for Indian cricket.

To be fair Dravid is earning more money in that role than Younis is for the national team. If dravid eas offered peanuts for that role like it is in Pakistan I doubt we’d be seeing him no matter how much of a good person dravid is
 
I disagree. I think they are okay in their own roles. Although in an ideal world Yousuf shouldn't be coaching anyone. He's a malicious and vindictive human being.

Younis is fine. He has always been someone who achieved a lot with limited talent by making adjustments and thinking about his batting a lot. On tour he can provide the right sort of advise to players on making small adjustments.

Yousuf is a more classical batsman. He can help the players on their overall technique and teach them out to play the ball late.

In that case, in that ideal world even Younis Khan shouldn't be coaching anyone.

Didn't he put a knife on his coach's throat.

Didn't he threat PCB of quitting test cricket just to get his place in ODi world cup and used his friends in media to build the pressure on PCB.

If Yousuf is malicious human being, Younis isn't a saint either.
 
In that case, in that ideal world even Younis Khan shouldn't be coaching anyone.

Didn't he put a knife on his coach's throat.

Didn't he threat PCB of quitting test cricket just to get his place in ODi world cup and used his friends in media to build the pressure on PCB.

If Yousuf is malicious human being, Younis isn't a saint either.

Younis is a confrontational person you're right. He has had his run ins.

But Yousuf is the same guy who sent Fawad Alam back in the middle of a tour to prove a point. He also instigated a mutiny against his captain and brought the Quran into it.

I just don't think someone like Yousuf should be placed in a position of power because he could undermine deserving talented players like he has in the past.
 
None of the coaches appointed by the new regime are satisfactory. They are just employed to stop them talking about the PCB on talk-shows.
 
Younis is a confrontational person you're right. He has had his run ins.

But Yousuf is the same guy who sent Fawad Alam back in the middle of a tour to prove a point. He also instigated a mutiny against his captain and brought the Quran into it.

I just don't think someone like Yousuf should be placed in a position of power because he could undermine deserving talented players like he has in the past.

These sort of unstable characters should be kept well away from youngsters, or made to beg on their hands and knees for a job. Instead we reward these chancers with high paying positions. It's disgusting.
 
Come on, when you compare our batting fortunes compare to bowling then Younis Khan has in no way failed in the same way that Waqar has failed with the bowlers.

In tests Pakistan have been able to hold onto the same middle/lower order which has generally performed ok. Fawad and Azhar have rediscovered some form. Rizwan and Faheem have kicked on. Yasir is batting well.

Let's just compare that to Waqar, who has overseen every single fast bowler under his wing becoming discarded except for Shaheen.

If we want to get the knives out they have to come for MisWaq first then we can talk about Younis Khan.
 
I remember OP writing a long essay about how you cannot coach or teach batting at the international level, because the technique has already become muscle memory by that point (to which I somewhat agree). Don't get what all the belly aching is about.
 
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Younis is a confrontational person you're right. He has had his run ins.

But Yousuf is the same guy who sent Fawad Alam back in the middle of a tour to prove a point. He also instigated a mutiny against his captain and brought the Quran into it.

I just don't think someone like Yousuf should be placed in a position of power because he could undermine deserving talented players like he has in the past.

I am not defending Yousuf here. My only question was, by those standards how Younis Khan is fine. Can we have someone in our dressing room who is so emotional and immature that he might put a knife on your throat if he doesn't like what you're saying.

You know how big drama would have been created due to Younis, had Grant Flower reported that incident to the police.
 
Definitely bit more clarity is required regarding the role. If it just the mentoring, temperamental and game awareness aspect unfortunately its also something seemed missing with regards to youngsters like Imran Butt, Hussain Talat, Haider Ali and Khushdil Shah. Only Rizwan is someone who has improved in recent times but, every other young batsman is yet to show any improvement as with regards to the mental side of the things.

Yes we cant just put blames on coaches but, one would expect atleast some improvement in any aspect of the young batsmen which unfortunately hasn’t been much visible.

Also I am always surprised by a common narrative to defend coaches that players are not that great and they should be doing better themselves as well but, then when a coach applies for the role he knows what he is getting into. So questions will obviously be asked if a coach cant bring in improvement in some aspects, as if its all going to come down to the players and coach cant make a difference or add anything than he shouldnt have applied for the job as having a coach or not having one is irrelevant in such a scenario.

Overall, the PCB management needs to bring in more clarity and Younis has to talk about what improvements he has brought in and what are his plans. National level coaching is much more than just technical aspects and those other aspects currently dont look great as well.
 
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I remember OP writing a long essay about how you cannot coach or teach batting at the international level, because the technique has already become muscle memory by that point (to which I somewhat agree). Don't get what all the belly aching is about.

Question, when was the last time the OP put up a post complimenting anything about Pakistan's cricket? A post without any negativity. Not a backhanded compliment. Or not even positive but just a constructive post that included his thoughts or suggestions on how to improve a player or a system.

Reminds me of Roy Keane on Sky Sports. Literally will find just about anything to moan about.
 
I think you seem to have a misunderstanding regarding the respective roles of Younis and Yousuf. Yousuf is there to work on the more glaring and technical deficiencies of the batsmen. Younis is there to tell them what they are doing right or wrong in the match. There is a fundamental difference. One is working on a broadbased level whereas the other is working on the short-term and immediate future.

Pakistan is lucky to have the services of both in their respective capacities because they are both among the greatest batsmen to ever play for Pakistan.

That is my understand as well, hence the confusion and the lack of clarity.

Do you not think Misbah can do the same job that Younis is currently doing with Younis getting replaced by a proper, specialized fielding coach?

Who is the fielding coach these days?
 
I doubt it. Mamoon loves Shastri and what he does.

No that's halal.

A head coach is essentially a cheerleader. Shastri is a genius at man management.

However, specialized coaches cannot be cheerleaders. Bharat Arun cannot cheerlead the bowlers and tell them how talented they are how proud he is, he cannot play the Shastri role.

He has to devise strategies and tactics with the bowlers and he has done a great job on that front. The Indian bowling unit always seems to have a plan.
 
I remember OP writing a long essay about how you cannot coach or teach batting at the international level, because the technique has already become muscle memory by that point (to which I somewhat agree). Don't get what all the belly aching is about.

Yes, so why is Younis with the team and in what capacity when he himself has admitted that he doesn’t have the time to coach these batsmen.

Younis should also sit in the NHPC with Yousuf so that he can help raw players like Haider and other domestic players work on their game.

Whatever he is doing with the national team can also be achieved by Misbah and Younis’ slot can be taken over by a fielding coach who can give these players some proper fielding practice like Rixon.
 
This whole “mentor” stuff is hard to get your head around as well. Seems to be just an excuse to give someone a job.

There is no reason why Misbah himself cannot be a “mentor” to the batsmen, and if PCB does not think that he can do that effectively because Younis was a much better player, then make Younis the head coach.

He can also do what he Misbah is currently doing as coach and also do this mentoring stuff.

It is the usual case of Pakistan having too many cooks in the dressing room and none of them seeing to be doing their job.

I wish we could see the team meetings and a full day of training from start to finish.

It would be interesting to see what Misbah and Younis do, how they divide the tasks, what they tell the players, who writes stuff on the whiteboard, who analyses the videos of opposition bowlers, who analysis the videos of Pakistani batsmen, how this whole mentoring of Younis works etc.
 
Yes, so why is Younis with the team and in what capacity when he himself has admitted that he doesn’t have the time to coach these batsmen.

Younis should also sit in the NHPC with Yousuf so that he can help raw players like Haider and other domestic players work on their game.

Whatever he is doing with the national team can also be achieved by Misbah and Younis’ slot can be taken over by a fielding coach who can give these players some proper fielding practice like Rixon.

You cannot undo the years of muscle memory within a few weeks or months, if even that is possible, especially given our dheet bunch. All he can do is give minor pointers or adjustments according to the situation and it is on the batsmen IF they can execute it.

Given Younis's diva personality and past I would rather him not be near our u19 or younger players in domestics and if PCB HAVE to give him a role I much prefer it would rather just be this quasi batting coach/mentor thing he has atm as he will be dealing mostly with the prima donnas like him anyways.
 
Mentor = a coach who doesn’t want to take responsibility and be held accountable.

This mentor drama works at franchise level when you have the likes of Viv sitting in the dugout of Quetta. It helps the profile of the league.

In international, you will be held accountable and will face the music. This mentoring baloney has no place at this level.

While Younis previously claimed that if our batting fails he will be criticized by the fans, his latest statement clearly indicates that he is not prepared to shoulder the blame for Pakistan’s shoddy batting.
 
I remember OP writing a long essay about how you cannot coach or teach batting at the international level, because the technique has already become muscle memory by that point (to which I somewhat agree). Don't get what all the belly aching is about.

Obviously, his opinions change with agenda. The guy even repeated what I said about coaching at the higher level. He tried to pretend that he knew that coaching wasn't like its understood by the fans. I bet you any money he hasn't spent a minute with a pro player and asked him about his experiences. The reason I know what happens is because when you have to pay for your kids coaching, you start to evaluate the benefits of being caoched and ask around. And the more I asked these ex players, the more I realised that at the county level the coaching as understood, doesn't exist.
 
A head coach is essentially a cheerleader. Shastri is a genius at man management.

However, specialized coaches cannot be cheerleaders. Bharat Arun cannot cheerlead the bowlers and tell them how talented they are how proud he is, he cannot play the Shastri role.

He has to devise strategies and tactics with the bowlers and he has done a great job on that front. The Indian bowling unit always seems to have a plan.

Have you ever met an ex player or a current one, and discussed coaching with them.
 
[MENTION=1269]Bewal Express[/MENTION]

Not sure what you are talking about here. You cannot “coach” an experienced player with years of experience in FC cricket how to old a bat and how to grip a ball.

You cannot even tinker with their techniques that much because it will ruin them. For example, if you change Fawad’s technique today, he will stop scoring whatever little runs he is producing, and he will inadvertently return to his usual technique under match pressure because that is what he knows best, that is how he plays the game.

However, when you become a coach, you have to accept that you will face the music when the players are not performing even if it is not your fault.

Haider Ali’s case is different. He is a young kid with no proper FC experience and no technique. He is playing on instincts and he needs help, and he has decided to seek help from the guy sitting in the NHPC rather than the official “batting coach” of the Pakistan cricket team.

Younis has made it clear that he doesn’t have the time to work with the batsmen during a series and during the off-season, they are working with Yousuf, so where does Younis fit in?

He is clearly freeloading and is not adding anything to the team. This “mentoring” nonsense that he does can be done by Misbah as well.
 
What exactly a mentor does and why team needs a mentor ? A "malshiya" could have been more useful.

To work with the bats regarding the mindset, the major difference between the best and the level down is related to that.
 
[MENTION=1269]Bewal Express[/MENTION]

Not sure what you are talking about here. You cannot “coach” an experienced player with years of experience in FC cricket how to old a bat and how to grip a ball.

You cannot even tinker with their techniques that much because it will ruin them. For example, if you change Fawad’s technique today, he will stop scoring whatever little runs he is producing, and he will inadvertently return to his usual technique under match pressure because that is what he knows best, that is how he plays the game.

However, when you become a coach, you have to accept that you will face the music when the players are not performing even if it is not your fault.

Haider Ali’s case is different. He is a young kid with no proper FC experience and no technique. He is playing on instincts and he needs help, and he has decided to seek help from the guy sitting in the NHPC rather than the official “batting coach” of the Pakistan cricket team.

Younis has made it clear that he doesn’t have the time to work with the batsmen during a series and during the off-season, they are working with Yousuf, so where does Younis fit in?

He is clearly freeloading and is not adding anything to the team. This “mentoring” nonsense that he does can be done by Misbah as well.

I am not sure why you tagged me in, I have been saying this for years. Unlike you I get out to games, talk to people and see what's happening. Look at my posts and you will see what i have said about coaching being overrated from way back. We talent need spotters, not coaches. Then the talent needs to play on good wickets. If they need guidance on certain things, it should be available.
My point is about your poorly constructed agendas which are obvious to anyone that is unfortunate to read one of your posts. It's the reason I try to avoid them on here( not on timepass )unless there are glaringly silly.
 
Misbah and Waqar are far worse than Younis. At least this guy try. Waqar is there for years still not a single achievement.
 
He's worked wonders on Mohammad Rizwan. Anyone with half a braincell can see Rizwan now has a super successful sweep shot in his armoury and there is no better sweeper in world cricket than YK

Even AB and Sanga admitted to changing and mending their sweep based off Younis
 
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If he doesn't have time to work with the senior players during tours then what's the point of wasting his coaching talent.

Surely he would be better served working at the NHPC where he has all the time in the world to work with as many players as he wants.
 
He's worked wonders on Mohammad Rizwan. Anyone with half a braincell can see Rizwan now has a super successful sweep shot in his armoury and there is no better sweeper in world cricket than YK

Even AB and Sanga admitted to changing and mending their sweep based off Younis

Rizwan has been piling up the runs in domestic cricket and for the A team long before Younis became the batting coach/mentor or whatever his role with the team is. He also scored 2 hundreds in 5 ODIs against Australia.

Rizwan’s improvement as a batsman and his good form has coincided with the timeframe of Younis’ involvement with the team and not exactly an outcome of his coaching. He has always swept the ball well. His main issue is he gets into awkward positions when pacers bowl into his body, and it is still happening but he is fighting it out because he is gritty.
 
I am not sure why you tagged me in, I have been saying this for years. Unlike you I get out to games, talk to people and see what's happening. Look at my posts and you will see what i have said about coaching being overrated from way back. We talent need spotters, not coaches. Then the talent needs to play on good wickets. If they need guidance on certain things, it should be available.
My point is about your poorly constructed agendas which are obvious to anyone that is unfortunate to read one of your posts. It's the reason I try to avoid them on here( not on timepass )unless there are glaringly silly.

I tagged you because I didn’t know what you were trying to say and I don’t read your posts on this side of the forum. Now that you have clarified I agree with what you said.
 
National team batting coach does not fix technical issues mainly because that requires one on one attention with all players. There’s no time for that. His job is to come up with a strategy on how to play the opposition bowlers and develop a batting plan for the match at hand. Only the players can comment how he’s doing on that front.
 
He's worked wonders on Mohammad Rizwan. Anyone with half a braincell can see Rizwan now has a super successful sweep shot in his armoury and there is no better sweeper in world cricket than YK

Even AB and Sanga admitted to changing and mending their sweep based off Younis

Agreed. Yes Rizwan was already on the ascendency. But it would be foolish to assume Rizwan did benefit from Younis Khan’s presence especially when you consider they have very similar mental toughness and grit in them.
 
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