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Younis Khan should be rated higher than the likes of Joe Root and Kane Williamson!

Red Devil

Red Devil

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We all saw how Willamson fared in spinning conditions in India and now Root is following suit in Bangladesh. Younis is often derided for his supposed 'failures' overseas and yet you never see anyone say the same about these non-Asian players and their inability to play spin.

In addition to being the best player of spin bowling in the world, Younis has also played multiple match winning knocks overseas and has several daddy hundreds all over the world.

Would like to read your thoughts on this, [MENTION=46929]shaz619[/MENTION]. :hafeez2
 
I thought he already was. At least, I rated him pretty high at least in test matches. One of the very best today and easily in top 5 of Pakistan's test batsmen of all time.
 
He is rated better than them.

He is almost ATG level.

Root and Williamson have a trajectory that is higher than Younis.

Seems like they will fall short of it due to their inability to do well in Asia.
 
overall YK is way ahead of them. But Root and KW have 10 years left at least to improve their records.
 
At the same age and stage of career, YK wasn't even close to them. Currently he is way ahead.
 
but as south asian fans we should put the same standards on non SC batsmen failing in Asia that their fans do to our batsmen when they fail overseas. failing on turners should be treated as the same as swinging conditions or bouncy tracks but we often see english n aussie pundits and fans underwrite their teams performances in the SC like oh well it spins a lot its hot n humid its tough for our boys there at least they tried. Its just double standards it doesnt matter how much an SC batsman scores on turners or in theor own conditions they fail outside Asia automatically they are rubbish but that same standard doesnt apply to non asian batsmen. They can bat like tailenders in Asia but as long as they do it at home they are hyped to the moon.
 
YK did better away at their home.

Misbah did better away at their home.

Root and Williamson have been failing to do well in Asia, it's sad. Who knows, they might improve and able to perform better on next tours.
 
There is a difference between career and potential, and the likes of Root and Williamson are rated higher than Younis based on the fact that they have a much higher ceiling.

Younis at the age of 25-26 was way below Root and Williamson, so that's why they are rated higher. Obviously you don't improve exponentially so it doesn't mean they will be well ahead in 10 years time, but their respective career paths so far indicates so.

Of course if they retire today, Younis will be considered a much better batsman.

Anyhow, no doubt Younis is a brilliant player of spin, he hasn't played on such extreme rank turners in a long time.

UAE pitches are much easier to bat on and one can look at the performance of Williamson and Root in the UAE and India/Bangladesh to confirm that.

It will be interesting to see Younis play on such pitches now. Even someone like Amla for all his experience could not score a single hundred against India last year, and he is every bit as good as Younis when it comes to playing spin.

People will refer to Younis' century in Sri Lanka last year on a day 5 pitch but the pitch was a road compared to what Williamson and Root have faced in India and Bangladesh and the quality of bowling was low too.

I don't want to discredit Younis but when you Masood of all people scores a century you know that the condition were friendly and the bowling below par.
 
Red Devil said:
We all saw how Willamson fared in spinning conditions in India and now Root is following suit in Bangladesh. Younis is often derided for his supposed 'failures' overseas and yet you never see anyone say the same about these non-Asian players and their inability to play spin.

In addition to being the best player of spin bowling in the world, Younis has also played multiple match winning knocks overseas and has several daddy hundreds all over the world.

Would like to read your thoughts on this, [MENTION=46929]shaz619[/MENTION]. :hafeez2
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Exactly, Younis is an ATG for me without a doubt. Can the likes of Root and Williamson play the kind of knock Khan did at the Oval away from home to win his country a Test? am not so sure. It's unfortunate he missed some key series in 2010 because he was in his prime then but there is enough evidence to suggest he is a great. People belittle him for not dominating a series away from home yet don't recognise Moyo as an ATG which is a bit hypocritical when you look at the barometer they have set, besides in that same series which moyo played in Younis averaged like 65 or 66 and failed in only one inning everything else was 40+, also missed a test or two in that series for some reason I think
 
Root and williamson have enough years to improve. I think both will do well in Australia,South Africa,etc. Test for them is in the subcontinent. Lets see how root fares in India.

Younis almost atg level, but at root and williamsons age he didn't have the record they did. Better to make comparison when Root and Williamson careers are over.
 
YK can score 100 against any country in overseas. Root and KW do not know how to play spin
 
Mamoon said:
There is a difference between career and potential, and the likes of Root and Williamson are rated higher than Younis based on the fact that they have a much higher ceiling.

Younis at the age of 25-26 was way below Root and Williamson, so that's why they are rated higher. Obviously you don't improve exponentially so it doesn't mean they will be well ahead in 10 years time, but their respective career paths so far indicates so.

Of course if they retire today, Younis will be considered a much better batsman.

Anyhow, no doubt Younis is a brilliant player of spin, he hasn't played on such extreme rank turners in a long time.

UAE pitches are much easier to bat on and one can look at the performance of Williamson and Root in the UAE and India/Bangladesh to confirm that.

It will be interesting to see Younis play on such pitches now. Even someone like Amla for all his experience could not score a single hundred against India last year, and he is every bit as good as Younis when it comes to playing spin.

People will refer to Younis' century in Sri Lanka last year on a day 5 pitch but the pitch was a road compared to what Williamson and Root have faced in India and Bangladesh and the quality of bowling was low too.

I don't want to discredit Younis but when you Masood of all people scores a century you know that the condition were friendly and the bowling below par.
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Really!!!! Root does not have any clue against any decent spinners. His pathetic performance against Bangladesh spinners tells how over rated he is. Even Bravo is better than him
 
Root played well in his first tour of India, and was hardly horrible this tour of Bangladesh; so let's not be so quick to dismiss him. He was also batting while sick today.

Williamson however is by far the most overrated of the 'future four' batsmen; Smith and Kohli are significantly better than him but I see a lot of people rating him ahead of those two.
 
Mamoon said:
There is a difference between career and potential, and the likes of Root and Williamson are rated higher than Younis based on the fact that they have a much higher ceiling.

Younis at the age of 25-26 was way below Root and Williamson, so that's why they are rated higher. Obviously you don't improve exponentially so it doesn't mean they will be well ahead in 10 years time, but their respective career paths so far indicates so.

Of course if they retire today, Younis will be considered a much better batsman.

Anyhow, no doubt Younis is a brilliant player of spin, he hasn't played on such extreme rank turners in a long time.

UAE pitches are much easier to bat on and one can look at the performance of Williamson and Root in the UAE and India/Bangladesh to confirm that.

It will be interesting to see Younis play on such pitches now. Even someone like Amla for all his experience could not score a single hundred against India last year, and he is every bit as good as Younis when it comes to playing spin.

People will refer to Younis' century in Sri Lanka last year on a day 5 pitch but the pitch was a road compared to what Williamson and Root have faced in India and Bangladesh and the quality of bowling was low too.

I don't want to discredit Younis but when you Masood of all people scores a century you know that the condition were friendly and the bowling below par.
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None of us have a crystal ball which guarantees that Root and Williamson will be well ahead of YK in 10 years time. Ajantha Mendis had a terrific start to his career, not sure if that was an indication that he'd surpass Murali one day but that's just an example. Anyhow Root especially has not done enough for me at the moment to suggest he is set to become an ATG in the future. I was just looking at Root's record few months back, was shocked (given the hype) to find that he only has 2 centuries away from home and not a single in spin friendly conditions.

As far as future prospects are concerned Rahane is a level ahead of the likes of Root and Williamson.

It's also important to note that Younis Khan is well past his prime, despite that he remains a world class bat; if this is what he can do past his prime imagine what he'd have done had he not missed some of those key series in 2010. No doubt it's tougher to play on rank turners and maybe at this stage in his career he'd struggle at first but then he'd adapt, spin is his forte though.
 
YK is already at ATG level.. yes there should be some standards before awarding any1 with this level.. but one thing important about KW and root is no one will deny their potential to be ATG.
 
Hasan123 said:
Root and williamson have enough years to improve. I think both will do well in Australia,South Africa,etc. Test for them is in the subcontinent. Lets see how root fares in India.

Younis almost atg level, but at root and williamsons age he didn't have the record they did. Better to make comparison when Root and Williamson careers are over.
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I'm talking about the best batsmen in the world currently. If you ask someone who's the best batsman in the world right now, you'll see Root and Williamson's name pop up but people tend to ignore Younis. Let's leave potential and projections aside for a second.
 
Adil_94 said:
but as south asian fans we should put the same standards on non SC batsmen failing in Asia that their fans do to our batsmen when they fail overseas. failing on turners should be treated as the same as swinging conditions or bouncy tracks but we often see english n aussie pundits and fans underwrite their teams performances in the SC like oh well it spins a lot its hot n humid its tough for our boys there at least they tried. Its just double standards it doesnt matter how much an SC batsman scores on turners or in theor own conditions they fail outside Asia automatically they are rubbish but that same standard doesnt apply to non asian batsmen. They can bat like tailenders in Asia but as long as they do it at home they are hyped to the moon.
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Top post man. That's exactly the point of this thread.
 
YK should be applauded for scoring daddy hundreds on pitches that the current crop of ATG so frequently fail on. We saw in the PSL how international bats failed on the UAE pitches against half decent spin
 
Red Devil said:
Same here. Rahane has proven himself in all conditions unlike Root and Williamson
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I said Rahane before him, he stole it from me. He was thinking of mentioning the Motorway King first.

Anyhow YK is on another level and is ranked no.2 for a reason as much as it will make certain folk burn, that too past his prime! this is like Ali knocking out George Foreman; that's how good Younis Khan's miraculous performances have been, he should have faded away by now. Imagine what he'd have done if he didn't miss some key series in his prime. He embodies the fact that class is permanent.
 
Younis is up there as close to being called as ATG if he delivers in Australia.

However, Cook is behind both Root and Williamson potentially and skill wise too.

Amla, AB De Villiers, Younis , Root, Smith, Kane and Kohli are the best players going around in the world across all formats.

Cook isn't up there with those guys, not to forget, he is a poor odi player too.
 
shaz619 said:
I said Rahane before him, he stole it from me. He was thinking of mentioning the Motorway King first.

Anyhow YK is on another level and is ranked no.2 for a reason as much as it will make certain folk burn, that too past his prime! this is like Ali knocking out George Foreman; that's how good Younis Khan's miraculous performances have been, he should have faded away by now. Imagine what he'd have done if he didn't miss some key series in his prime. He embodies the fact that class is permanent.
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He's easily their best bat in Tests. Better than the overhyped Motorway King.

I just hate the double standards when people discredit YK's performances at home but rate others as the best in the world based on the runs they scored in their own backyards.
 
Mamoon said:
There is a difference between career and potential, and the likes of Root and Williamson are rated higher than Younis based on the fact that they have a much higher ceiling.

Younis at the age of 25-26 was way below Root and Williamson, so that's why they are rated higher. Obviously you don't improve exponentially so it doesn't mean they will be well ahead in 10 years time, but their respective career paths so far indicates so.

Of course if they retire today, Younis will be considered a much better batsman.

Anyhow, no doubt Younis is a brilliant player of spin, he hasn't played on such extreme rank turners in a long time.

UAE pitches are much easier to bat on and one can look at the performance of Williamson and Root in the UAE and India/Bangladesh to confirm that.

It will be interesting to see Younis play on such pitches now. Even someone like Amla for all his experience could not score a single hundred against India last year, and he is every bit as good as Younis when it comes to playing spin.

People will refer to Younis' century in Sri Lanka last year on a day 5 pitch but the pitch was a road compared to what Williamson and Root have faced in India and Bangladesh and the quality of bowling was low too.

I don't want to discredit Younis but when you Masood of all people scores a century you know that the condition were friendly and the bowling below par.
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Ajmal made fool out of Amla. Enough said
 
To me, Younis is the best test batsman of recent times.

But why do fans rate Root and Williamson more? Root and Williamson not only plays tests but 2 other forms where both are quality. They have to shift from one form to other. Younis doesn't.

The same way Shakib is considered a world class bowler in tests. He averages 32.5 which is much higher than his counterparts. He does have around 15 five wicket hauls. But it's the sheer fact that he bowls in all 3 format of the game and does well in all of them and has to shift all of a sudden

A good reason why also Kohli is rated over Vijay even as a test batsman.

Being able to deal with the massive load of different forms of cricket as well
 
In the test format, YK is currently better than those two.
 
Having said that, playing well on rank turners is different than playing well in UAE or similar pitches. Can anyone cite few rank tuners pitches where YK played in recent years?
 
Kane at 26 is carrying a mediocre team and is also responsible for leading the side.

Captaincy has clearly taken a toll on him. I just don't think he's a strong enough character to handle the pressures of leading a struggling team and maintain batting form. He even mentioned earlier that he was struggling with the workload.

I wouldn't be surprised if he steps down after a poor Test series against Pakistan. IMO, it would be for the better. Kane the batsmen is more important to us than Kane the captain.
 
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Red Devil said:
He's easily their best bat in Tests. Better than the overhyped Motorway King.

I just hate the double standards when people discredit YK's performances at home but rate others as the best in the world based on the runs they scored in their own backyards.
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The double standards are understandable from [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] at least he is upfront about it and hasn't denied his strong dislike for Younis Khan so we all can't expect him to be objective.

England is also his second favourite team and he has emphasised that in recent times so he ought to overly hype a Joe Root; whom I rated highly but realise that he got a long way to go and that the hype isn't justified currently.

I'd say besides Mamooh most advocate Younis Khan's greatness but he also falls under their radar at times given that we don't give him enough credit while Root and Williamson are overrated.
 
Aman said:
Kane at 26 is carrying a mediocre team and is also responsible for leading the side.

Captaincy has clearly taken a toll on him. I just don't think he's a strong enough character to handle the pressures of leading a struggling team and maintain batting form. He even mentioned earlier that he was struggling with the workload.

I wouldn't be surprised if he steps down after a poor Test series against Pakistan. IMO, it would be for the better. Kane the batsmen is more important to us than Kane the captain.
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Definitely needs to step down as captaincy and it has clearly affected his batting, I rate him a lot higher then Joe Root
 
moghul said:
Only in Asia.
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Well, YK has played 70-75% of cricket in Asia and other two have played 75% outside of Asia. Currently, Rahane is the best Asian batsman outside of Asia , but all cricket is not played outside of Asia.
 
shaz619 said:
Definitely needs to step down as captaincy and it has clearly affected his batting, I rate him a lot higher then Joe Root
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Judging by his post match interview, the teams performances are definitely getting to him. He can't trust anyone in the batting lineup and feels he has to do it alone. Before he didn't think too much and looked to just bat and bat without too much thought of what was to come.
 
Aman said:
Judging by his post match interview, the teams performances are definitely getting to him. He can't trust anyone in the batting lineup and feels he has to do it alone. Before he didn't think too much and looked to just bat and bat without too much thought of what was to come.
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Now you know what Misbah felt like :)) The problem is there are not many alternatives, they're not going back to Ross Taylor that's for sure.
 
shaz619 said:
Now you know what Misbah felt like :)) The problem is there are not many alternatives, they're not going back to Ross Taylor that's for sure.
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True.

Latham or Southee could be worth a punt, or you could have 3 different captains. That would make things less stressful for Kane.
 
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shaz619 said:
Exactly, Younis is an ATG for me without a doubt. Can the likes of Root and Williamson play the kind of knock Khan did at the Oval away from home to win his country a Test? am not so sure. It's unfortunate he missed some key series in 2010 because he was in his prime then but there is enough evidence to suggest he is a great. People belittle him for not dominating a series away from home yet don't recognise Moyo as an ATG which is a bit hypocritical when you look at the barometer they have set, besides in that same series which moyo played in Younis averaged like 65 or 66 and failed in only one inning everything else was 40+, also missed a test or two in that series for some reason I think
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MoYo's career is a bit of tragic one. His career was cut short as soon as he hit his peak. He had a record breaking year at the age of 32 in 2006 and in 2007, his relationship with PCB went South. He only played 17 Tests after 2006 and that too in patches.

If he would have played consistently till 2012-2013 which he would have had he not soured his relationship with the PCB, in my opinion, he could have finished as an ATG.

The worst part is that he got into a fight with the PCB over getting ignored for the inaugural World T20 which pushed him towards ICL and that was it for him. :facepalm:
 
shaz619 said:
None of us have a crystal ball which guarantees that Root and Williamson will be well ahead of YK in 10 years time. Ajantha Mendis had a terrific start to his career, not sure if that was an indication that he'd surpass Murali one day but that's just an example. Anyhow Root especially has not done enough for me at the moment to suggest he is set to become an ATG in the future. I was just looking at Root's record few months back, was shocked (given the hype) to find that he only has 2 centuries away from home and not a single in spin friendly conditions.

As far as future prospects are concerned Rahane is a level ahead of the likes of Root and Williamson.

It's also important to note that Younis Khan is well past his prime, despite that he remains a world class bat; if this is what he can do past his prime imagine what he'd have done had he not missed some of those key series in 2010. No doubt it's tougher to play on rank turners and maybe at this stage in his career he'd struggle at first but then he'd adapt, spin is his forte though.
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Mendis' comparison is off. He was a mystery spinner who had one great year, but as soon as his mystery deliveries were studied by the opposition, he was nullified.

There is nothing mysterious about Root and Williamson. They are outstanding, classical young batsman who should only get better from here.

It is also important to note that Younis Khan was not good enough to be a regular member in the playing XI and be a prominent batsman in world cricket till 2005 when he was around 27-28 officially, even though he made his debut in 2000.

That is because he repeatedly got exposed by ATG bowlers like Ambrose, Walsh, Pollock, Donald etc., and couldn't even score on the flat Sharjah pitches against Australia in 2002.

It was only around 2005 when he got a lot of matches against India and the ATG bowlers retired/declined that he found his feet at this level.

Rahane is brilliant too and him, Kohli, Root, Williamson and Smith are in the same class as far as Tests are concerned.
 
Hamzakhalid said:
Ajmal made fool out of Amla. Enough said
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Amla has handled Ajmal well in Tests, and he has done well against pretty much every spinner in Tests.

Yes he had made a fool out of him in an ODI in South Africa but Amla can look like a fool against anyone in Limited Overs under pressure.

He is a fantastic player of spin.
 
Kane already has like 4 tons in spin friendly, spinner heavy Asian/UAE games. You guys are making him out to be far more inept than he is.
 
GudduBadmash said:
YK should be applauded for scoring daddy hundreds on pitches that the current crop of ATG so frequently fail on. We saw in the PSL how international bats failed on the UAE pitches against half decent spin
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Troll alert, but the likes of Root, Kohli, Williamson and Smith did not play in the PSL. Lesser batsmen than Younis certainly failed though.
 
Shafi said:
Really!!!! Root does not have any clue against any decent spinners. His pathetic performance against Bangladesh spinners tells how over rated he is. Even Bravo is better than him
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The pitches play a big part. Root look unflustered against our spinners in the UAE, where he looked more comfortable against Yasir (whom we call the best Test spinner in the world) than he did against Shakib and Mehedi on Bangladeshi pitches.

Same Root will look comfortable against these spinners in Dubai or Abu Dhabi.
 
People overrate our spin playing capabilities a lot. We have not played a genuine rank turner for years but still every now and then, we collapse against spinners.

Tahir, Craig, Herath, Rashid and Bishoo. All of them have managed to destroy us every now and then on pitches that are far from rank turners.

Look at how much Bishoo has troubled us in this series. Now imagine him bowling to us in the Indian/Bangladeshi rank turners.

On an Indian/Bangladeshi rank turner, the likes of Azhar, Aslam and Shafiq have no chance against Ashwin, Jadeja, Mehedi, Shakib etc., but of course Pakistan will compete very well in India and certainly win in Bangladesh because Yasir will create havoc too.

Only Younis who himself has not been tested on rank turners in years and to an extent Misbah and Sarfraz have a chance of scoring on the Indian/Bangladeshi style turners.
 
I think people are underrating Williamson here. As a supporter of England and Root, I myself can say he is pretty overrated but Williamson is more than capable enough to score runs everywhere in the world. As some people above have stated, his batting has deteriorated due to captaincy responsibilities. Back when Mcculum was captain, IIRC he scored a bilstering 192 where the same Root against the same attack couldn't score a single 100.

If one were to actually compare the performance of non Asian batsmen with the asian batsmen overseas, I would say Joe Root is in the Misbah Ul Haq category as of now...both of whom are brilliant at their respective 'home' venues with not as much dominance away, let alone overseas big impact scores (I obviously would rate Joe overall higher as a batsman due to being so brutal at home as opposed to Misbahs baby 100s). On the other hand Kane Williamson is rivalling YK due to daddy hundreds away...192 in UAE is like that 218 at Oval imo. Having said that, Both YK and Kane aren't the best around either. That title belongs to Don Amla.
 
Mamoon said:
Mendis' comparison is off. He was a mystery spinner who had one great year, but as soon as his mystery deliveries were studied by the opposition, he was nullified.

There is nothing mysterious about Root and Williamson. They are outstanding, classical young batsman who should only get better from here.

It is also important to note that Younis Khan was not good enough to be a regular member in the playing XI and be a prominent batsman in world cricket till 2005 when he was around 27-28 officially, even though he made his debut in 2000.

That is because he repeatedly got exposed by ATG bowlers like Ambrose, Walsh, Pollock, Donald etc., and couldn't even score on the flat Sharjah pitches against Australia in 2002.

It was only around 2005 when he got a lot of matches against India and the ATG bowlers retired/declined that he found his feet at this level.

Rahane is brilliant too and him, Kohli, Root, Williamson and Smith are in the same class as far as Tests are concerned.
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It might be off but the point stands, we don't know for sure that Root and Williamson will be in contention for ATG status 10 years from now.

Younis can be forgiven for that, how many batsman came in at the Test level and dominated from the word go? Younis evolved, adapted and got better. The ATG bowlers never got to bowl at Younis in his prime, they were lucky to bowl at a pretty green batsman.

Rahane is a level above the rest, then there's Williamson, Smith etc don't know where I'd put the Motorway King. Yeah it was a big shame that Moyo's career ended prematurely but it's strange how you won't give him the tag of an ATG when he dominated in an away series, you give that a great deal of emphasis.

Younis hasn't dominated an away series in that fashion but has achieved a lot more then Yousef, so who's greater in your opinion? you probably will say neither are ATG's but Moyo is better.

But hey, you say that Moyo would have achieved a lot more had his career not ended tragically and also based on that he must be better then Younis Khan in your opinion in addition to his skill levels but you also play down the fact that it was also tragic that Younis never got to play in some key series in 2010.

At this moment in time it's also important to note that Khan is past his prime yet ranked no.2, just think what he'd have achieved in 2010 by god I fear the slaughter which the bowlers would be subjected to on those away tours.
 
Moyo would've been Sangakkara level had he extended his career. Both were very similar batsmen and at a similar level when playing. Considering how low the quality of cricket became 2010 onwards, there's no doubt Moyo would've been piling up 100s for fun. Especially in ODIs.
 
Mamoon said:
People overrate our spin playing capabilities a lot. We have not played a genuine rank turner for years but still every now and then, we collapse against spinners.

Tahir, Craig, Herath, Rashid and Bishoo. All of them have managed to destroy us every now and then on pitches that are far from rank turners.

Look at how much Bishoo has troubled us in this series. Now imagine him bowling to us in the Indian/Bangladeshi rank turners.

On an Indian/Bangladeshi rank turner, the likes of Azhar, Aslam and Shafiq have no chance against Ashwin, Jadeja, Mehedi, Shakib etc., but of course Pakistan will compete very well in India and certainly win in Bangladesh because Yasir will create havoc too.

Only Younis who himself has not been tested on rank turners in years and to an extent Misbah and Sarfraz have a chance of scoring on the Indian/Bangladeshi style turners.
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Those batsman are the few whom we know for sure are world class vs spin, no one else overrates the ability of a shafiq or azhar vs spin. Batting on rank turners is a challenge even for the best.
 
AlizeeFan said:
Guess who has more hundreds outside Asia?

Motorway King

or

Younis Khan
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Lets rephrase that question:

Who has more hundreds outside Asia on flat pitches with no lateral movement?

The Motorway King off course!
 
I think one point posters misses out is that guys like Yousuf have failed in spinning tracks of India and SL apart from failing in Aus and SA where he avgs sub 30.

Even Sangakkara has struggled in India.

On other hand, Younis has been a highly successful performer everywhere he has played in Asia.

He has a brilliant avg in India and that includes a knock of a top ceiling i.e. 267 at Bangalore.

He has done well in Sl and chased down 370 odd not far ago.

One of the clutch players going around who scores when matters unlike Yousuf.

IMO, there is simply no comparison between Moyo and Yk and a better comparison would be between Sanga and YK as far as tests are concerned.

In odis, its not up for debate obviously.
 
Red Devil said:
He's easily their best bat in Tests. Better than the overhyped Motorway King.

I just hate the double standards when people discredit YK's performances at home but rate others as the best in the world based on the runs they scored in their own backyards.
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Before YK's double at Oval, he had nothing special to show for his performances outside Asia. 5 hundreds, 1 against Zim, 1 against Eng, 1 in WI and all on flat pancake. 1 in SA which almost most of the good batsman have now and 1 hundred in NZ.

Even your motorway king had 1 hundred in SA and NZ and 6 hundreds on flat pitches.
 
YK is already ATG and the best player of spin in the world. Too bad we won't get to see him one last time vs India.
 
AlizeeFan said:
That would be Cheteswar Pujara atm.
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Pujara certainly has the most decisive footwork when it comes to playing spin but Younus almost smells the ball off the pitch when it is spinning. Different strokes, but I rate YK a bit higher.
 
I expect him to fail in Aus and NZL in most of his innings..(just like he failed most of times in UK) and score big in one match (on "suitable" pitch)
 
The amount of hype around Root and others is unbelievable. I think that's the reason a lot of posters including myself think that they are overrated. I have no problem in accepting that they are very talented who might one day become greats of the game but I have a big problem when someone ridicules ATGs like Amla and Younis who are clearly much superior batsmen.
 
And it is laughable if anybody thinks Yousuf was as good as Younis or Sanga.

Sanga was the best in the world in the last decade, was undisputed #1 in tests and may be a #2 in ODIs after Kohli. He scored the most runs since 2005. He was a very selfless team player who had tremendous work ethics and amazing fitness. Yousuf, was polar opposite.

And when comparing him to Younis, one just needs to see who won more matches for Pakistan when they both played together. Yousuf averaged in 30s while Younis averaged in like 90s in matches won.
 
Root and Williamson both will surpass him in tests.

They're not there yet, obviously. But one is 40 years old the other 2 are in their mid 20s, and considering their ages they've already done very well for themselves yet still have plenty of time to improve and achieve greater accolades.
 
Mamoon said:
People overrate our spin playing capabilities a lot. We have not played a genuine rank turner for years but still every now and then, we collapse against spinners.

Tahir, Craig, Herath, Rashid and Bishoo. All of them have managed to destroy us every now and then on pitches that are far from rank turners.

Look at how much Bishoo has troubled us in this series. Now imagine him bowling to us in the Indian/Bangladeshi rank turners.

On an Indian/Bangladeshi rank turner, the likes of Azhar, Aslam and Shafiq have no chance against Ashwin, Jadeja, Mehedi, Shakib etc., but of course Pakistan will compete very well in India and certainly win in Bangladesh because Yasir will create havoc too.

Only Younis who himself has not been tested on rank turners in years and to an extent Misbah and Sarfraz have a chance of scoring on the Indian/Bangladeshi style turners.
Click to expand...

You really dont understand cricket at all.

Can you even define a rank turner?

YK has scored masses of runs playing against spin in the second innings. The UAE is where spinners have taken as much wickets as spinners take in India or anywhere else.

YK is one of the greatest players of spin of all time. Root and Williamson will never get close to his skills against spin but can match them on pace bowling pitches.
 
Been saying this for a long time. Kohli gets bagged here despite having a better overseas record than both of them. Both Kohli and Rahane need to do a bit of HTBing to increase their average.
 
Suleiman said:
Root and Williamson both will surpass him in tests.

They're not there yet, obviously. But one is 40 years old the other 2 are in their mid 20s, and considering their ages they've already done very well for themselves yet still have plenty of time to improve and achieve greater accolades.
Click to expand...

I would bet my house on YK ending up with more centuries than both of them.
 
Its worth reminding the people who keep saying YK needs to prove himself in Australia that he was one of our best averaging batsman on the 2004-05 tour against McGrath, Warne and co.
 
KingKhanWC said:
You really dont understand cricket at all.

Can you even define a rank turner?

YK has scored masses of runs playing against spin in the second innings. The UAE is where spinners have taken as much wickets as spinners take in India or anywhere else.

YK is one of the greatest players of spin of all time. Root and Williamson will never get close to his skills against spin but can match them on pace bowling pitches.
Click to expand...

A Rank Turner is a pitch that has sharp turn starting from day one.

In the UAE the turn is slow and is easier to play contrary to India/BD.

Instead of accusing people of not understanding cricket you should refine your own understanding.
 
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KingKhanWC said:
YK has scored masses of runs playing against spin in the second innings. The UAE is where spinners have taken as much wickets as spinners take in India or anywhere else.
Click to expand...

And he has scored runs in such conditions in UAE?

His 100s in 2nd inn in UAE

103 v Aus - Pak ended up with 286-2 (78 overs)
118 v Eng - Pak 354-6 (95 overs)
131 v SA - Pak 343-3 (117 overs)
127 v Eng - Pak 365 (152 overs)

All his 100s (in any inn) have came in conditions where spinners have struggled to pick wickets. Toughest was probably the one against Eng where run scoring was slow, but turn spinners couldn't get wickets quickly either.

Otherwise you can pick any inning where spinners dominated Pakistani batting and you would find that Younis hasn't scored there.

Just a list of his 100s with all team score
213 - 570/4
153 - 472
136 - 383 (Spinners had figure of 159-3 and even Ajmal struggled to pick wickets later)
131 - 343-3
127 - 365 (152 overs) His best inning against spin
122 - 340 (Pacers took most of the wickets)
118 - 354-6 (Ali and Rashid picked up 4-192)
106 - 454
103 - 286-2
100 - 566

Only 1 inning where spinners had upper had hand and younis scored a ton and it was on a slow turner.

Pakistan has collapsed many times when there was lot of support for bowlers and Younis had been missing in those.
 
AlizeeFan said:
And he has scored runs in such conditions in UAE?
Click to expand...

and just to add if Pak is dismissed below 340 in this inn against WI, this will be first time in UAE that Younis Khan will have a fifty in matches where Pakistan is dismissed below 340

Asad Shafiq has a century, Misbah has few fifties, even Hafeez has some innings when Pakistan were dominated by opposition in UAE, but Younis is doing it for first time here.

He scores big when ball isn't turning sharply, but that's the advantage with him and he does it consistently. However credit should be given to other batsmen for leading the pack in adverse scenarios.
 
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