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Amir Khan climbs off canvas to beat Samuel Vargas [Update Post #9]

Varun

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Whenever Amir Khan flexes his right hand he sees multiple scars from an operation two years ago in which part of his hip bone was grafted into his broken fist. But, as he prepares to face Samuel Vargas in Birmingham on Saturday night, he says there is no permanent mental damage from the three brutal stoppages on his record – and that, at 31, he still has plenty left in the tank.

“I’ve trained harder than ever before,” says Khan after a punishing first full camp with his trainer, Joe Goossen. “I feel better now than when I was 25. And I hit a lot harder. This is a fight that will tell me what I have left, how far I can go and whether I can go to the next level to the fights like Manny Pacquiao and Kell Brook. But I know I’ve got a lot left in me. If I didn’t I’d walk away.

“Remember Pacquiao was at his peak when he was 31, 32. He was knocking out guys like Miguel Cotto and Antonio Margarito. I remember training and sparring with him then, and he was at his strongest. I’m coming back because I know I can achieve more in the sport before I call it a day. I’m still young, I still feel young.”

Khan believes Vargas is “nowhere near my level” and the evidence of the naked eye and their respective records suggests he is right.

Vargas, a 29-year-old Canadian-Colombian, has 29 victories and only three defeats from 34 fights. However, whenever he has stepped into the highest class, against fighters such as Errol Spence and Danny Garcia, he has been stopped. Khan should win – and comfortably.

He knows there are plenty of doubters – including Vargas, who says Khan is “damaged” from being knocked out by Canelo Álvarez when he unwisely moved up to light-middleweight to fight the Mexican in 2016.

“It’s all mind games,” Khan says. “Vargas has been knocked out himself, he’s been stopped himself. He shouldn’t be in the same ring as me. I need this type of fight to get me going again because my last fight [a one-round stoppage of Phil Lo Greco] was so short and I have had such a long time out of the ring with the hand injury.”

Khan points out he has never lost as a welterweight. And crucially, he seems to have finally realised he does not have to necessarily slug it out every time he is put under pressure – which has been sometimes been his undoing. “Having big balls can get you into trouble,” he says. “You shouldn’t be too happy to have them because they can get you in to trouble.”

Much of Khan’s renewed confidence comes from working with Goossen, an eloquent and flamboyant trainer with several world champions on his CV, including Joel Casamayor, Diego Corrales and Michael Nunn.

The 65-year-old Goossen says Khan is “undoubtedly” the quickest fighter he has ever worked with – “he’s left me going ‘wow’ a few times and that is not easy to do after all these jaded years,”– but believes he has significantly improved Khan’s fitness and made his charge harder to hit.

“Amir is a tremendous athlete,” he says. “But there is a certain point when you get to the top level, some things can get exposed and be exploited. You have to have some defensive subtleties; it’s what keeps you in the game.”

The promoter Eddie Hearn said that how Khan performs against Vargas will determine whether he fights again in December or next year, as well as the identity of his opponent.

Hearn has no doubts Khan can become a world champion again. “A fight with Pacquiao is probably more international than Brook, while Khan versus Brook shuts the whole country down,” he says. “Amir is in the lucky position where it is up to him.”

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2018/sep/07/amir-khan-samuel-vargas-fight
 
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He has been knocked out too many times to be taken seriously as a world champion contender unfortunately and in such dramatic fashion. He lost to a couple of guys he had no business losing against. Definitely an underachiever for the amount of speed and skill he possesses.

However, he has a good fan base so as long as he wins this match there may be some big fights coming soon.

Would love a khan - brook fight!
 
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He has been knocked out too many times to be taken seriously as a world champion contender unfortunately and in such dramatic fashion. He lost to a couple of guys he had no business losing against. Definitely an underachiever for the amount of speed and skill he possesses.

However, he has a good fan base so as long as he wins this match there may be some big fights coming soon.

Would love a khan - brook fight!

One can debate his 'glass chin' or other flaws but his speed is extraordinary. He can throw 3 punchs in a second. It's like watching an anime in real life :yk

 
He has been knocked out too many times to be taken seriously as a world champion contender unfortunately and in such dramatic fashion. He lost to a couple of guys he had no business losing against. Definitely an underachiever for the amount of speed and skill he possesses.

However, he has a good fan base so as long as he wins this match there may be some big fights coming soon.

Would love a khan - brook fight!

You'd think he has been KO'd 8 times when one states 'too many times'. He has 32 wins and just 3 defeats by KO, people forget that. This is why he is rarely the under dog even vs punchers (outside Canelo) because as a betting man do you back the guy with skills or someone looking for a hail mary ?

If we look at those 3 KO's he can be forgiven for the Prescott loss because he was just 19 or 20 years old, he would bounce back a year later to become one of Britians youngest world champions ever and then proved his doubters wrong by taking on the biggest and most skilled puncher between 140-147 in Maidana at the time and beating him. The Canelo KO, be honest no one seriously expected him to beat a guy two weight classes above him.

The Garcia fight I agree that is the biggest blip on his resume for sure and he should have out boxed him, but take nothing away from Danny he was not in the spotlight at the time but we can say now the man is a very talented counter puncher who beat them all really at 140 lb. Amir on the other hand was supposed to rematch Peterson, last minute it was cancelled and he went straight from one camp into another with Garcia which was silly, behind the scenes there were also issues within his team and overall it was just a terrible camp, there is footage on youtube him having sparring wars days before the fight lol Angel Garcia was brilliant in riling Amir up to and when you combine his hot head + poor camp + lack of respect for the little known Garcia at the time it was not going to end well against.

You could say he under achieved I suppose, but when you win an Olympic Boxing medal at 17 there are going to be unrealistic expectations and for someome who has had the spotlight on him from day one he has done alright for himself in the confines of all that attention and pressure, in normal circumstances a fighter would keep a low profile and take time to develop in their early stages which are so crucial but there was Amir headlining shows on free to air TV. It was good for Boxing in our country but perhaps not his career.

The other thing, when you challenge yourself you are bound to lose here and there. Foreman, Duran and Hearns have all been stopped, but that don't make them bums; these days you lose a few and the world turns upside down, I also blame Floyd for this because he made being undefeated such a big deal that fighters now are not willing to take more risks; something which Amir can never be accused of not doing enough, his resume overall is fantastic having fought more world champions then any other British fighter active very good opponent qualitu, has won home and away whilst holding a unfied world championship.

But yeah he can get carried away in the ring and his defence is poor more then anthing else, when tagged meets fire with fire which is silly. However, none of his fights have evee been boring and that's another aspect we overlook from a viewers POV.

Am not sure if he can be champion again, I share your doubts for now but he will still end his career as a British boxing legend who has accomplished a great deal in his career and done so much for Boxing in the UK.
 
He has been knocked out too many times to be taken seriously as a world champion contender unfortunately and in such dramatic fashion. He lost to a couple of guys he had no business losing against. Definitely an underachiever for the amount of speed and skill he possesses.

However, he has a good fan base so as long as he wins this match there may be some big fights coming soon.

Would love a khan - brook fight!

Underachieved? He was a unified light welterweight champion who fought everyone worthy in his division. The guy has done more than the majority of fighters out there.
 
You'd think he has been KO'd 8 times when one states 'too many times'. He has 32 wins and just 3 defeats by KO, people forget that. This is why he is rarely the under dog even vs punchers (outside Canelo) because as a betting man do you back the guy with skills or someone looking for a hail mary ?

If we look at those 3 KO's he can be forgiven for the Prescott loss because he was just 19 or 20 years old, he would bounce back a year later to become one of Britians youngest world champions ever and then proved his doubters wrong by taking on the biggest and most skilled puncher between 140-147 in Maidana at the time and beating him. The Canelo KO, be honest no one seriously expected him to beat a guy two weight classes above him.

The Garcia fight I agree that is the biggest blip on his resume for sure and he should have out boxed him, but take nothing away from Danny he was not in the spotlight at the time but we can say now the man is a very talented counter puncher who beat them all really at 140 lb. Amir on the other hand was supposed to rematch Peterson, last minute it was cancelled and he went straight from one camp into another with Garcia which was silly, behind the scenes there were also issues within his team and overall it was just a terrible camp, there is footage on youtube him having sparring wars days before the fight lol Angel Garcia was brilliant in riling Amir up to and when you combine his hot head + poor camp + lack of respect for the little known Garcia at the time it was not going to end well against.

You could say he under achieved I suppose, but when you win an Olympic Boxing medal at 17 there are going to be unrealistic expectations and for someome who has had the spotlight on him from day one he has done alright for himself in the confines of all that attention and pressure, in normal circumstances a fighter would keep a low profile and take time to develop in their early stages which are so crucial but there was Amir headlining shows on free to air TV. It was good for Boxing in our country but perhaps not his career.

The other thing, when you challenge yourself you are bound to lose here and there. Foreman, Duran and Hearns have all been stopped, but that don't make them bums; these days you lose a few and the world turns upside down, I also blame Floyd for this because he made being undefeated such a big deal that fighters now are not willing to take more risks; something which Amir can never be accused of not doing enough, his resume overall is fantastic having fought more world champions then any other British fighter active very good opponent qualitu, has won home and away whilst holding a unfied world championship.

But yeah he can get carried away in the ring and his defence is poor more then anthing else, when tagged meets fire with fire which is silly. However, none of his fights have evee been boring and that's another aspect we overlook from a viewers POV.

Am not sure if he can be champion again, I share your doubts for now but he will still end his career as a British boxing legend who has accomplished a great deal in his career and done so much for Boxing in the UK.

Good post.

I especially agree with the Garcia bit. There needs to be a rematch.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">&#55358;&#56650; KHAN DOWN &#55358;&#56650;<br><br>Amir Khan is put down right on the bell at the end of the second round, after earlier dropping Vargas! In to the third. <br><br>&#55357;&#56570; Watch <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/KhanVargas?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#KhanVargas</a> live on Sky Sports Action now<br>&#55357;&#56562; Or follow here: <a href="https://t.co/HOy8jzD96n">https://t.co/HOy8jzD96n</a> <a href="https://t.co/GQy9bKl2J4">pic.twitter.com/GQy9bKl2J4</a></p>— Sky Sports Boxing (@SkySportsBoxing) <a href="https://twitter.com/SkySportsBoxing/status/1038538570137518081?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 8, 2018</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Amir Khan survived a second-round knock down with a unanimous points win over Samuel Vargas in Birmingham.<a href="https://t.co/b10YbZhK3E">https://t.co/b10YbZhK3E</a> <a href="https://t.co/jPHeLcus0l">pic.twitter.com/jPHeLcus0l</a></p>— BBC Sport (@BBCSport) <a href="https://twitter.com/BBCSport/status/1038550966247858176?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 8, 2018</a></blockquote>
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If only Khan had power to compliment his speed and composure when under attack. Lennox Lewis also had a shaky chin but his size, knock out power and great boxing skills neutralized it.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">�� KHAN DOWN ��<br><br>Amir Khan is put down right on the bell at the end of the second round, after earlier dropping Vargas! In to the third. <br><br>�� Watch <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/KhanVargas?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#KhanVargas</a> live on Sky Sports Action now<br>�� Or follow here: <a href="https://t.co/HOy8jzD96n">https://t.co/HOy8jzD96n</a> <a href="https://t.co/GQy9bKl2J4">pic.twitter.com/GQy9bKl2J4</a></p>— Sky Sports Boxing (@SkySportsBoxing) <a href="https://twitter.com/SkySportsBoxing/status/1038538570137518081?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 8, 2018</a></blockquote>
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any video of khan knock down of vargas in the 3rd round, i only watched from the 7th round and on wards
 
Far from convincing...yet he wants to fight Pacquio? Laughable.
 
Far from convincing...yet he wants to fight Pacquio? Laughable.

Isn't Pacquio himself past his peak? The fights Khan is talking about are all guys who have their best days behind them, including himself. He did a job today, but showed that his KO power doesn't translate to the very top level. That said, he has enough speed and ability to hurt guys to make him a very dangerous opponent to anyone if he could learn to fight smarter.
 
Isn't Pacquio himself past his peak? The fights Khan is talking about are all guys who have their best days behind them, including himself. He did a job today, but showed that his KO power doesn't translate to the very top level. That said, he has enough speed and ability to hurt guys to make him a very dangerous opponent to anyone if he could learn to fight smarter.

Pacquiao has enough speed and power and a better chin to get Khan out of there, Khan has to fight the perfect flawless fight which i don't think he can do.
 
Pacquiao has enough speed and power and a better chin to get Khan out of there, Khan has to fight the perfect flawless fight which i don't think he can do.

Pacquiao is a short arm pressure fighter who is shot. He was past his best 5 years ago. Khan would be far quicker and has a better reach to bust him up badly before the fight even reaches 12 rounds in my opinion.
 
Isn't Pacquio himself past his peak? The fights Khan is talking about are all guys who have their best days behind them, including himself. He did a job today, but showed that his KO power doesn't translate to the very top level. That said, he has enough speed and ability to hurt guys to make him a very dangerous opponent to anyone if he could learn to fight smarter.

Pacquio is a top tier fighter- Khan is not. Even this ‘past he’s peak’ Pacquio would school Khan. We all know the real reason he wants the Pac fight.

I was at the arena..I can tell you watching him live, Khan has fast hands..but that’s it. A lot of the time he looked wild in tbe ring.
 
Don't see Amir Khan reaching the top when he goes down to nobody's. A fighter's career is very short, Amir has to arrange big fights very soon otherwise his dreams will fade away. No matter what Pakistan is proud off him, we need role model's in Sport outside Cricket.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="fr" dir="ltr">Congrats champ <a href="https://twitter.com/amirkingkhan?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@amirkingkhan</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/KhanVargas?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#KhanVargas</a> &#55358;&#56650;&#55358;&#56650;&#55358;&#56650;</p>— Shoaib Malik (@realshoaibmalik) <a href="https://twitter.com/realshoaibmalik/status/1038551184687022081?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 8, 2018</a></blockquote>
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Pacquio is a top tier fighter- Khan is not. Even this ‘past he’s peak’ Pacquio would school Khan. We all know the real reason he wants the Pac fight.

I was at the arena..I can tell you watching him live, Khan has fast hands..but that’s it. A lot of the time he looked wild in tbe ring.

I agree with your assessment of Khan, I consider him a nuisance to top fighters rather than a top fighter himself because he doesn't have a good chin. I haven't seen much of Pacquio much recently, but he was all about high pressure and energy, so if that's gone, what's he got left?
 
Khan is at the tail end of his career and a Pac fight offers a bigger payday then Brook. Plus I personally believe it is a better fight, considering Brook hasn't made welter in a while and offers no belts.

Khan v Pac sells in UK, US or Asia. Massive, massive fight.
 
I've been lucky enough to have watched Joe Calzaghe, Haye, Froch and Lewis all live. But never got the chance to watch Amir Khan. In many ways this fight with Vargas was almost like a tribute of his career because it showed him at his very best and worst, we all know he has quick hands but it is magnified when you're there in attendance, blink and you miss a lightning combination and it's more evident when you're taking a couple of pictures during the action to.

The atmosphere was incredible, I know that Birmingham has a sizeable asian population but 80% of people there were white / black / mixed race, very decent male / female ratio, elderly men and women in addition to disabled individuals, then you had those of asian origin including Pakistanis and Indians. A very diverse audience from all walks of life, you always get those who are there purely to see AK get KO'd to but majority of such individuals were silenced by the supporters.

As for the fight itself, it's important to note first that this was Khan's real comeback fight after a very long lay off when Greco gave him just 40 seconds. Furthermore, it had been 3 years since he last boxed more then 6 rounds ! so this 12 rounder would have done him a world of good because Amir is desperate for time in the ring at this stage of his career. So while the performance was far from perfect it's important to factor that in. He started very fast as usual, dropped Vargas and got caught with a counter; his instinct is always to fight fire with fire but to begin with he was just too reckless, once he had settled he was very effective in boxing at range and bust up the tough Columbian pretty bad, it was great to see him move laterally especially during the second half of the fight because while the tank had ran out of gas I didn't think he could keep it up and on a couple of occasions was visibly tired and tried to bob/weave from the corner. He's a very tough fighter to win rounds against which is why I never bother scoring his fights, it's a simple equation to beat Amir! you have to knock him out! at the top level he can't afford to make more then a couple of mistakes with his questionable chin and poor defence, he needs to keep his hands up when he is moving laterally.

But overall it was a good outing for him and like I said earlier, he is never in a dull fight, has a big heart and very good resume which is why he remains so popular. The audience got their money's worth and you always do regardless of whether he's in a 12 rounder, 39 sec 1st Rd demolition or in Victory/Defeat.

Goosen is a great trainer but Amir was caught between two styles here, Goosen is very offensive oriented and thrives on walking of the inside which Amir tried to do at times but it wasn't working so much for him because it doesn't come natural, you can't really teach an old dog new tricks and it's unfortunate that all the hard work which was done with Virgil has been wasted. Still, we need to give these two time together but I thought Virgil did very well especially on the survival front, Amir got caught but he was up straight away which was foolish, you should take the 8 count and then get up, hold to weather the storm and not go crazy trying to respond. Many mention his poor ring generalship, but I see more of an issue with his heart and not being able to help himself; if you have listened to him on punditry for sky he has been incredibly insightful, I remember when everyone laughed when he was explaining why Fury would beat Wladmir in Germany prior to the fight; he's a good student of the game but when he gets in that ring his heart takes over and the poor defence combined with amazing offence while will have failure and success make him must see TV.

The Kell fight is a possibility but a win over Manny does more for his legacy, it is true that Manny is not what he use to be but he would still beat 80-85% of welters and looked fantastic vs Lucas recently. But at the same time it's not a bad fight for Amir at all and it's one I'd like to see, Manny would start as the favourite but it's a very winnable fight for Amir as well.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Congratulations to <a href="https://twitter.com/amirkingkhan?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@amirkingkhan</a> and Sammy Vargas on a great fight - the fight recorded the biggest live UK audience on subscription TV (non PPV) in boxing history �������� <a href="https://t.co/MQqHembfLU">pic.twitter.com/MQqHembfLU</a></p>— Eddie Hearn (@EddieHearn) <a href="https://twitter.com/EddieHearn/status/1038741470726053889?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">9 September 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
[MENTION=43583]KingKhanWC[/MENTION]
 
Another point to add to my earlier post is that Khan was out of shape by his standards at 147 compared to previous weigh ins, he can be forgiven given how long it has been since he fought at this weight then again while he may have looked out of shape, depending on the training he did it may not have mattered as much if you're doing more sparring then strength/conditioning, Goosen is very old fashioned in his methods but this may have been key in getting the endurance at a level which would enabled those 12 rounds but moving forward he could certainly improve anyhow.

Sammy Vargas while his resume doesn't set the world on fire he is a very good contender, his only defeats have been to world champions although vs Spence and Garcia he had a total of 2-3 weeks notice. Against Amir he was given a full training camp and respect as an opponent, fair play to him he came to fight to and showed so much heart; he took a severe beating but refused to quit for the sake of Canada :)) [MENTION=138254]Syed1[/MENTION] he repeatedly pointed out how Greco was a disgrace to your country and he wasn't going to leave the arena in the same way. In the end even a rusty Amir had too much class for him, and he showed a lot of heart to, never easy getting up off the canvas and carrying on but he got the job done. Vargas am sure will come again as a fringe contender.
 
I want see Khan fight Kell first because if he can't beat Kell at 147, he doesn't deserve to fight Manny. His deal with Hearn is 3 fights and apparently he signed with him to get closer to Kell so he has one fight left on the deal to make it happen.

We've seen Khan chase Manny and Floyd for too long and he just needs to beat what gets put infront of him first. Hearn sees the money that could be made from Brook vs Khan and what Hearn says goes in boxing so I think that fight will be next.
 
I've been lucky enough to have watched Joe Calzaghe, Haye, Froch and Lewis all live. But never got the chance to watch Amir Khan. In many ways this fight with Vargas was almost like a tribute of his career because it showed him at his very best and worst, we all know he has quick hands but it is magnified when you're there in attendance, blink and you miss a lightning combination and it's more evident when you're taking a couple of pictures during the action to.

The atmosphere was incredible, I know that Birmingham has a sizeable asian population but 80% of people there were white / black / mixed race, very decent male / female ratio, elderly men and women in addition to disabled individuals, then you had those of asian origin including Pakistanis and Indians. A very diverse audience from all walks of life, you always get those who are there purely to see AK get KO'd to but majority of such individuals were silenced by the supporters.

As for the fight itself, it's important to note first that this was Khan's real comeback fight after a very long lay off when Greco gave him just 40 seconds. Furthermore, it had been 3 years since he last boxed more then 6 rounds ! so this 12 rounder would have done him a world of good because Amir is desperate for time in the ring at this stage of his career. So while the performance was far from perfect it's important to factor that in. He started very fast as usual, dropped Vargas and got caught with a counter; his instinct is always to fight fire with fire but to begin with he was just too reckless, once he had settled he was very effective in boxing at range and bust up the tough Columbian pretty bad, it was great to see him move laterally especially during the second half of the fight because while the tank had ran out of gas I didn't think he could keep it up and on a couple of occasions was visibly tired and tried to bob/weave from the corner. He's a very tough fighter to win rounds against which is why I never bother scoring his fights, it's a simple equation to beat Amir! you have to knock him out! at the top level he can't afford to make more then a couple of mistakes with his questionable chin and poor defence, he needs to keep his hands up when he is moving laterally.

But overall it was a good outing for him and like I said earlier, he is never in a dull fight, has a big heart and very good resume which is why he remains so popular. The audience got their money's worth and you always do regardless of whether he's in a 12 rounder, 39 sec 1st Rd demolition or in Victory/Defeat.

Goosen is a great trainer but Amir was caught between two styles here, Goosen is very offensive oriented and thrives on walking of the inside which Amir tried to do at times but it wasn't working so much for him because it doesn't come natural, you can't really teach an old dog new tricks and it's unfortunate that all the hard work which was done with Virgil has been wasted. Still, we need to give these two time together but I thought Virgil did very well especially on the survival front, Amir got caught but he was up straight away which was foolish, you should take the 8 count and then get up, hold to weather the storm and not go crazy trying to respond. Many mention his poor ring generalship, but I see more of an issue with his heart and not being able to help himself; if you have listened to him on punditry for sky he has been incredibly insightful, I remember when everyone laughed when he was explaining why Fury would beat Wladmir in Germany prior to the fight; he's a good student of the game but when he gets in that ring his heart takes over and the poor defence combined with amazing offence while will have failure and success make him must see TV.

The Kell fight is a possibility but a win over Manny does more for his legacy, it is true that Manny is not what he use to be but he would still beat 80-85% of welters and looked fantastic vs Lucas recently. But at the same time it's not a bad fight for Amir at all and it's one I'd like to see, Manny would start as the favourite but it's a very winnable fight for Amir as well.

Finally saw the fight and Ive got to say Amir looked a bit out of shape. Its understandable after being out for so long. i really dont want to see him fight Kell before Manny. He deserves a big stadium superfight against one of the all time greats. Kell is a jobber. ENd of but he can get lucky and possibly beat Khan. It would tarnish Khans legacy. I would look to fight Manny and then fight Kell. Then retire. The Kell fight looks good for the UK audience but the Manny fight is an international blockbuster. They have to make that one happen.

And if Amir can get back into some kind of shape we could be in for one hell of a battle. Kell brook is a nobody and should be seen as a nobody.

As for this fight I thought he did ok and agree with your assessment. He looked tired near the end though but was never in trouble even when he got hit. Just looked a bit out of shape. He took a few good shots too. Which really confuses me. I mean we have seen him take some big bangs but then get taken out too..

The Canello fight was the biggest mistake of his career in my book. But I feel for him. Nobody wanted to fight him so he went for the big one.
 
Finally saw the fight and Ive got to say Amir looked a bit out of shape. Its understandable after being out for so long. i really dont want to see him fight Kell before Manny. He deserves a big stadium superfight against one of the all time greats. Kell is a jobber. ENd of but he can get lucky and possibly beat Khan. It would tarnish Khans legacy. I would look to fight Manny and then fight Kell. Then retire. The Kell fight looks good for the UK audience but the Manny fight is an international blockbuster. They have to make that one happen.

And if Amir can get back into some kind of shape we could be in for one hell of a battle. Kell brook is a nobody and should be seen as a nobody.

As for this fight I thought he did ok and agree with your assessment. He looked tired near the end though but was never in trouble even when he got hit. Just looked a bit out of shape. He took a few good shots too. Which really confuses me. I mean we have seen him take some big bangs but then get taken out too..

The Canello fight was the biggest mistake of his career in my book. But I feel for him. Nobody wanted to fight him so he went for the big one.

Why does he deserve a big fight? He should stick to fighting guys in he’s league.. i.e, Brook. We all know why he is desperate to fight Manny.

You said nobody wanted to fight him...ask yourself why.
 
Finally saw the fight and Ive got to say Amir looked a bit out of shape. Its understandable after being out for so long. i really dont want to see him fight Kell before Manny. He deserves a big stadium superfight against one of the all time greats. Kell is a jobber. ENd of but he can get lucky and possibly beat Khan. It would tarnish Khans legacy. I would look to fight Manny and then fight Kell. Then retire. The Kell fight looks good for the UK audience but the Manny fight is an international blockbuster. They have to make that one happen.

And if Amir can get back into some kind of shape we could be in for one hell of a battle. Kell brook is a nobody and should be seen as a nobody.

As for this fight I thought he did ok and agree with your assessment. He looked tired near the end though but was never in trouble even when he got hit. Just looked a bit out of shape. He took a few good shots too. Which really confuses me. I mean we have seen him take some big bangs but then get taken out too..

The Canello fight was the biggest mistake of his career in my book. But I feel for him. Nobody wanted to fight him so he went for the big one.

Without a doubt he deserves a fight against a living legend and a consensus first ballot personified hall of famer, a loss to Kell wouldn't hurt Khan's legacy he has achieved more then majority of British fighters who have ever laced a pair and is actually on the brink of a HOF induction should be triumph over someone like a Manny, but he will go down as a British Legend without a doubt. But I agree, there is risk and little reward as far as legacy is concerned when it comes to Kell, it's not a fight I have as much interest in compared to a Manny fight.

He could improve his shape, but at this stage the concern is more do with getting rounds under his belt because if he's doing more sparring / old fashioned training then strength / conditioning (this could also explain your ? regarding confusion) it is a good thing however you are right because he could certainly do with a another training camp before a top fight but looks like he will be going straight into a stadium encounter. Also, he keeps mentioning the Vargas knockdown was flash but man it was hard and that 60 seconds break at the bell was just so precious for his recovery. Credit to Goosen, remained calm in the corner.
 
Why does he deserve a big fight? He should stick to fighting guys in he’s league.. i.e, Brook. We all know why he is desperate to fight Manny.

You said nobody wanted to fight him...ask yourself why.

Why does he not deserve a fight with Manny and explain this bit 'we all know why he is desperate to fight Manny' ?? Also, what has Kell achieved that puts him in Amir;s league ?
 
Great great exciting fight, AK always gives you your money's worth. Even the tools who hate, they will always contribute to his pay check by showing up because deep down they can't help seeing a British Legend and action packed fighter in all his glory live in the second city [MENTION=865]Big Mac[/MENTION]

Fitting that this song was used for his entrance music:


Can't have been about the hating tools right :yk2

99% of the blokes who critique him with senseless rubbish:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">'Khan's chin is sh*te, he needs to finish Vargas off now, that's what I would do.' <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/KhanVargas?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#KhanVargas</a> <a href="https://t.co/nw9yHxvznQ">pic.twitter.com/nw9yHxvznQ</a></p>— Paddy Power (@paddypower) <a href="https://twitter.com/paddypower/status/1038545340402753536?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 8, 2018</a></blockquote>
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:)))
 
Why does he deserve a big fight? He should stick to fighting guys in he’s league.. i.e, Brook. We all know why he is desperate to fight Manny.

You said nobody wanted to fight him...ask yourself why.

Lol, why does he not deserve a fight? He's beaten fighters that Kell wouldnt last ten minutes with. Kell Brook is a overblown, overhyped local fighter. He is not an international name. Most people outside the isles dont know or care who he is. Khan is known around the world and a fight with Manny would be massive. Khan has done his time, and deserves a big superfight. He's a multiple world champion and at one time was touted as the best in his division. Kell Brook? err remind me who he has actually fought? other than the triple GGG fight who has he really beaten? Nobody..He doesnt deserve a shot at Khan and should quietly go back to Sheffield and do us all a favour..
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">'Khan's chin is sh*te, he needs to finish Vargas off now, that's what I would do.' <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/KhanVargas?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#KhanVargas</a> <a href="https://t.co/nw9yHxvznQ">pic.twitter.com/nw9yHxvznQ</a></p>— Paddy Power (@paddypower) <a href="https://twitter.com/paddypower/status/1038545340402753536?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 8, 2018</a></blockquote>
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Where did you find a photo of me? :mv
 
Lucky to survive the fight considering he was just avoiding contact in the last 3-4 rounds, and his legs were jelly right before the end of round 10. Not to mention he was knocked out in the second round. A more clinical boxer would've taken him to the cleaners. His punches were fast but did not damage to Vargas who was the only one who showed intent and wanted to fight not running offf from punches like Khan was.
 
Lucky to survive the fight considering he was just avoiding contact in the last 3-4 rounds, and his legs were jelly right before the end of round 10. Not to mention he was knocked out in the second round. A more clinical boxer would've taken him to the cleaners. His punches were fast but did not damage to Vargas who was the only one who showed intent and wanted to fight not running offf from punches like Khan was.

It's called boxing and not a street brawl :facepalm:

I like Khan, but am not a great fan of his. It's irritating when people hate him blatantly without appreciating his class.

He owned Maidana. Not many can claim that.
 
Lucky to survive the fight considering he was just avoiding contact in the last 3-4 rounds, and his legs were jelly right before the end of round 10. Not to mention he was knocked out in the second round. A more clinical boxer would've taken him to the cleaners. His punches were fast but did not damage to Vargas who was the only one who showed intent and wanted to fight not running offf from punches like Khan was.

Vargas was actually a pretty decent fighter, not some bum who was going to be knocked over in a round or two and he has a pretty solid chin. Khan's weakness is he doesn't have that sort of punch resistance, but against that he does have lighting speed and skill, and that is why he won every round despite the knock down, and also why he will pose a problem for fighters even at the highest level.
 
It's called boxing and not a street brawl :facepalm:

I like Khan, but am not a great fan of his. It's irritating when people hate him blatantly without appreciating his class.

He owned Maidana. Not many can claim that.

I dunno who that is but what is relevant right now he is well past his prime
 
Vargas was actually a pretty decent fighter, not some bum who was going to be knocked over in a round or two and he has a pretty solid chin. Khan's weakness is he doesn't have that sort of punch resistance, but against that he does have lighting speed and skill, and that is why he won every round despite the knock down, and also why he will pose a problem for fighters even at the highest level.

The question then is why none of the commentators were really impressed by what he is done? I like it and understand that we as Pakistanis really want Khan to do well, but everyone said that at the world class level Khan's performance was nothing better than a 5 of a 6.
 
Things to admire about Khan is how he manages to bounce back from devastating knock out's. Also i don't think you can accuse him of ducking anyone, he is someone who has fought all comers.
 
The question then is why none of the commentators were really impressed by what he is done? I like it and understand that we as Pakistanis really want Khan to do well, but everyone said that at the world class level Khan's performance was nothing better than a 5 of a 6.

The commentators also have biases but they are right about this fight and Amir has admitted it. A 6.5 is about right. What really winds me up is people like Froch and Nelson mouthing off. Froch claims Amir was just doing it for a pay cheque? hunh? and Nelson saying he isnt world class anymore because you know he should know what world class is being a overhyped blown up cruiser weight who never fought anyone of any world class stature.Then we have One eyed Kell bechara who nobody outside "Sheffel'ld" cares about...
 
The commentators also have biases but they are right about this fight and Amir has admitted it. A 6.5 is about right. What really winds me up is people like Froch and Nelson mouthing off. Froch claims Amir was just doing it for a pay cheque? hunh? and Nelson saying he isnt world class anymore because you know he should know what world class is being a overhyped blown up cruiser weight who never fought anyone of any world class stature.Then we have One eyed Kell bechara who nobody outside "Sheffel'ld" cares about...

Commentators might have biases, but it was very obvious to see Khan trying to avoid Vargas in the las 3-4 rounds which I saw for myself.. including a 10th round jelly when he was caught with a punch right before the bell. That didn't need any commentator for me to describe because Khan was avoiding a confrontation and just playing for time..
 
Commentators might have biases, but it was very obvious to see Khan trying to avoid Vargas in the las 3-4 rounds which I saw for myself.. including a 10th round jelly when he was caught with a punch right before the bell. That didn't need any commentator for me to describe because Khan was avoiding a confrontation and just playing for time..

And whats your point? This is boxing tactics. Floyd use to hug people for last several rounds. Its not a brawl.
 
I've been lucky enough to have watched Joe Calzaghe, Haye, Froch and Lewis all live. But never got the chance to watch Amir Khan. In many ways this fight with Vargas was almost like a tribute of his career because it showed him at his very best and worst, we all know he has quick hands but it is magnified when you're there in attendance, blink and you miss a lightning combination and it's more evident when you're taking a couple of pictures during the action to.

The atmosphere was incredible, I know that Birmingham has a sizeable asian population but 80% of people there were white / black / mixed race, very decent male / female ratio, elderly men and women in addition to disabled individuals, then you had those of asian origin including Pakistanis and Indians. A very diverse audience from all walks of life, you always get those who are there purely to see AK get KO'd to but majority of such individuals were silenced by the supporters.

As for the fight itself, it's important to note first that this was Khan's real comeback fight after a very long lay off when Greco gave him just 40 seconds. Furthermore, it had been 3 years since he last boxed more then 6 rounds ! so this 12 rounder would have done him a world of good because Amir is desperate for time in the ring at this stage of his career. So while the performance was far from perfect it's important to factor that in. He started very fast as usual, dropped Vargas and got caught with a counter; his instinct is always to fight fire with fire but to begin with he was just too reckless, once he had settled he was very effective in boxing at range and bust up the tough Columbian pretty bad, it was great to see him move laterally especially during the second half of the fight because while the tank had ran out of gas I didn't think he could keep it up and on a couple of occasions was visibly tired and tried to bob/weave from the corner. He's a very tough fighter to win rounds against which is why I never bother scoring his fights, it's a simple equation to beat Amir! you have to knock him out! at the top level he can't afford to make more then a couple of mistakes with his questionable chin and poor defence, he needs to keep his hands up when he is moving laterally.

But overall it was a good outing for him and like I said earlier, he is never in a dull fight, has a big heart and very good resume which is why he remains so popular. The audience got their money's worth and you always do regardless of whether he's in a 12 rounder, 39 sec 1st Rd demolition or in Victory/Defeat.

Goosen is a great trainer but Amir was caught between two styles here, Goosen is very offensive oriented and thrives on walking of the inside which Amir tried to do at times but it wasn't working so much for him because it doesn't come natural, you can't really teach an old dog new tricks and it's unfortunate that all the hard work which was done with Virgil has been wasted. Still, we need to give these two time together but I thought Virgil did very well especially on the survival front, Amir got caught but he was up straight away which was foolish, you should take the 8 count and then get up, hold to weather the storm and not go crazy trying to respond. Many mention his poor ring generalship, but I see more of an issue with his heart and not being able to help himself; if you have listened to him on punditry for sky he has been incredibly insightful, I remember when everyone laughed when he was explaining why Fury would beat Wladmir in Germany prior to the fight; he's a good student of the game but when he gets in that ring his heart takes over and the poor defence combined with amazing offence while will have failure and success make him must see TV.

The Kell fight is a possibility but a win over Manny does more for his legacy, it is true that Manny is not what he use to be but he would still beat 80-85% of welters and looked fantastic vs Lucas recently. But at the same time it's not a bad fight for Amir at all and it's one I'd like to see, Manny would start as the favourite but it's a very winnable fight for Amir as well.

Great read.

I wasn't able to view this live as I was travelling but my brother was there and he also said the atmosphere was amazing.

Having watched the fight, I thought Amir put in a lot of hard work and was happy to attack and not hold back until the last couple of rounds, which is understandable. I cant really add much more than what you have written.

So, what's next for Amir? Brook , Manny or do you feel he needs another good outing before such fights?
 
Great read.

I wasn't able to view this live as I was travelling but my brother was there and he also said the atmosphere was amazing.

Having watched the fight, I thought Amir put in a lot of hard work and was happy to attack and not hold back until the last couple of rounds, which is understandable. I cant really add much more than what you have written.

So, what's next for Amir? Brook , Manny or do you feel he needs another good outing before such fights?

Ideally he should have another outing but I think in Amir's case it may be better at this stage of his career for him to target a big fight because it will make him focus a lot more mentally, he has stated himself that while he trains extremely hard for every fight he took Vargas very lightly mentally because he was expected to knock him out.

I made a point regarding his shape that it may or may not be an indication of his endurance level especially if he did more sparring and tactical work with Goosen compared to strength / conditioning which would explain why he was able to get through the fight on am empty tank and this has been confirmed recently in an interview [MENTION=253]the Great Khan[/MENTION] Amir said he did zero strength / conditioning, with Goosen being his new coach it was important for them to spend as much time together possible; his coach has reiterated the importance of in-fighting defensively (check out BBC podcast with Bunce/Costello) and Khan also made the point in that interview after the Greco fight how it was vital for him to keep his hands up when moving off his back foot from the inside, but in the fight itself he failed to do this.

Khan even with a suspect chin should not just be a British Great but one of the greatest of all time, as an amateur against the advice of his amateur boxing governing body he would enter the junior olympics as a baby to win the gold, the year he won the olympic silver he fought 40 times with little rest between bouts beating grown men who were a lot more experienced and then in the final vs Kindelan who was arguably the greatest amateur in lightweight history he was exceptionally measured in the way he set up his combination punches, he didn't just blast you out, he was composed, patient and also gave his defence a great deal of importance.

As a pro his ring generalship regressed due to the spotlight on him and poor management of his career but that's not to say we never saw moments of brilliance, there was the Kotelnik fight, people forget that first world title fight was his debut at 140 lb, he hadn't grown into the weight and Kotelnik was much much bigger then him, it was a boxing master class and then we saw him throw one of the best body punches we had ever seen against the dangerous Maidana, maintained distance and displayed courage rarely seen from a British fighter when he was knocked out on his feet in Round 10 somehow surviving to win on points. In the last 10 years there have only been two people who have tested Floyd Mayweather, Oscar and Maidana, just ask Maidana what was the hardest fight of his career and he will say Amir because Floyd required two fights to convince the public he had beaten him.

Then there was Collazo, Alexander, Judah and Paul Malignagi, all highly skilled fighters that were made to look very ordinary when the odds were so much closer, no one would have predicted such domination. People keep saying styles make fight, while that is true to an extent but find me orthodox fighters who are extremely passionate about facing southpaws, the reason why Amir has a 100% record against them is due to the huge number of southpaws he had to prepare for in Europe during his amateur days in addition to the sparring sessions with Manny which certainly helped.

He should definitely have done so much better but that tends to overlook his ridiculous achievements, he will end his career as one of the all time greats to have come out the UK and the most action packed UK fighter in history (we always seem to forget this criteria when judging fighters at times), the phrase 'never in a dull fight' comes to mind, it would often be used in newspapers / posters in the 1900s to hype crowd pleasing fighters, Amir is a throwback to that era, his combination of flaw and brilliance make him one of the most exciting fighters in history, for this very reason Gatti finds himself in the Hall of Fame and Amir is not too far away from Boxing's greatest honour.

Regarding the commentary team, they were biased primarily because they need to sell Kell Brook as an Amir Khan opponent and sky have been very desperate to push this fight. Froch has always been an Amir critic because he has never made as much money or enjoyed such notoriety globally, he is a very bitter man and I say that despite being one of his biggest fans when it comes to his boxing career, was there in attendance when he beat Pascal in Nottingham and have followed his career from the days when he use to be on Amir Khan's under card! that should also give you an idea of where his dislike stems from. Since Amir is going to continue fighting it would be a great feeling if Amir shafts sky, matchroom and Kell by ending his career with the Manny fight.

A lot has been made of Amir's performance, it was hardly perfect but like I said earlier it has been close to 3 years since he fought over the 12 round distance so it is understandable. Speaking from a Boxing POV, those rounds would have done him the world of good and his preparation for the next fight will be much better, so it's not out of this world to suggest that we would see an even better Amir Khan. Beyond this you will find many criticise him, but they still contributed to his pay check and go their money's worth on the night; even they can't deny the spectacle of his fights which are always entertaining.

But my personal opinion is that he should retire, many have said that knock down by Vargas was flash, but it wasn't, it was a hard knock down and Amir got caught flush, what's worse is that even at this stage of his career he refuses to take the 8 count and is up straight away despite his experience and work with around 5 different trainers, watch every single knock down in his career and he does the same thing again and again, all the hard work Virgil Hunter did with on survival have also disappeared it seems because there are core fundamentals.

Amir throughout his career has relied on two factors mostly, his heart and raw talent; this explains the lack of consistency but when he chooses to rely on the ring generalship we saw against Kindelan at the age of 17/18 in the pro game, he can be incredible. I really don't believe that Amir has taken anything away from all those trainers, all his failure and success has been a direct consequence of his own actions as far as the fighting itself is concerned, I would only see someone like the legendary Emmanuel Steward getting the absolute best out of Amir not due to his exceptional boxing knowledge, focus on developing in-ring IQ / maximising strengths but his knack for knowing what makes a fighter tick.

Moreover, although very few in history have bounced back from the devastating KO's Amir has suffered they do affect you big time and there is so much millage on his clock, he might be in his early 30s but he has been in the game a long long time having turned amateur as a pup. I can guarantee you that the Canelo KO loss is still in the back of Amir's mind and that's just so dangerous, if you watch him he's always rushing in when it comes to every thing he does be it attack / defence, doing something simple as walking back to his corner or getting up from there, he just doesn't seem relaxed, again the lay off plays a part but my gut feeling is that he is an accident waiting to happen. Am one of his biggest fans but there really isn't anything to prove anymore, were it not for that 60 second break we could be paying tribute to the end of his boxing career right now but he lives to fight another day unfortunately in this very dangerous sport.
 


Check both interviews out guys, both were very insightful especially the one with Spencer of sky although there was some clear bias. Amir answers majority of the questions very well.
[MENTION=43583]KingKhanWC[/MENTION] [MENTION=253]the Great Khan[/MENTION]
 
Vargas was actually a pretty decent fighter, not some bum who was going to be knocked over in a round or two and he has a pretty solid chin. Khan's weakness is he doesn't have that sort of punch resistance, but against that he does have lighting speed and skill, and that is why he won every round despite the knock down, and also why he will pose a problem for fighters even at the highest level.

The likes of Spence and Garcia also gave this bloke 2-3 weeks notice, for this fight he was given a full training camp of 10 weeks; it was the biggest fight of his career almost like a world title fight and he used the time to prepare very very well and fought with so much courage and displayed skill to, even for a performance which wasn't Amir's best, Vargas was on the receiving end of severe punishment, just look at the state of his face, cuts / bruises every where and a broken nose. We always criticise a specific performance but never spare a thought for the on who lost or what he would be going through, am sure that not only was Vargas shattered physically but emotionally to, you never want to see anyone take that bad a beating and the ref should have stopped the fight earlier. Vargas was never going to quit, his fellow Canadian Le Greco disgraced the country in his view and he was not going to be another Greco, he fought with a lot of heart and will in a foreign land amongst an intimidating crowd.
 
[MENTION=46929]shaz619[/MENTION]

Interesting interviews and Amir makes sense fighting Manny will be a bigger global fight than Brook, he also has a championship belt to his name. He could have responded better when Spence said Pacman is near 40 etc by saying even at this age he could beat Brook easily which is not wrong. Manny of course isn't the same fighter but his skill, speed and ability is there to beat most of those in his weight category.

As for Amir you make some great points as to why he should retire and he has nothing to prove but I would like him to at least have one last title fight but for this he needs to be focused, in great shape and be working hard with his coach. Does he really have the desire is the real question?
 
[MENTION=46929]shaz619[/MENTION] thanks for those..yes I saw those vids a few days ago as they appeared on my youtube feed.

Whats interesting is that the Manny fight will be a title fight. And Amir has said if he wins he'll fight Brook but I think if he loses he'll retire. He should and should go down as one of our best ever fighters. But the inherent bias within British society wont let that happen. The way spencer was hyping up the Brook fight. "oh the british public wont forgive you". Amir's answer was pretty damning "I dont fight for them I fight for myself". I think he's pretty much had it with the racist yob British boxing public. I hope he fights Manny and if he wins sets up a fight with either Spence or a rematch with Garcia. Then bows out and retires!

He'll make a really good Sky pundit and could actually become a regular on our boxing screens..gets very excited and will have some really good insights.

Also his work for charity and his work in pakistan is very admirable.

Overall Kell is a nobody fighter compared to Amir. If he gets the Manny fight everyone will talk about the day they saw Amir and Manny fight. Not many will really remember the brook fight.
 
[MENTION=46929]shaz619[/MENTION]

Interesting interviews and Amir makes sense fighting Manny will be a bigger global fight than Brook, he also has a championship belt to his name. He could have responded better when Spence said Pacman is near 40 etc by saying even at this age he could beat Brook easily which is not wrong. Manny of course isn't the same fighter but his skill, speed and ability is there to beat most of those in his weight category.

As for Amir you make some great points as to why he should retire and he has nothing to prove but I would like him to at least have one last title fight but for this he needs to be focused, in great shape and be working hard with his coach. Does he really have the desire is the real question?

You're right, Manny would still beat pretty much every welter out there and give the champions a serious test. He looked absolutely sensational in his last fight and made the dangerous Mathysse retire, the speed was still there and as the old saying goes, power is the last thing you lose but Manny was moving very well and displayed his excellent in ring IQ. We all know he was robbed vs Jeff Horn and Bradley, the only losses have been to Floyd (he fought him with an injured shoulder) and Marquez who can truly boast the most impressive victory over Manny since Morales in 2005. Manny has a knack for making world class fighters look like chumps which takes away from his pedigree at times as he gets older especially when people begin to judge you a lot more superficially, it's funny that Spencer guy mentioning his age when Manny is under 40 and his company sky making sure to overly hype AJ's win over a genuine 40+ Wladmir as if it were the second coming of the christian messiah. Spencer is a good bloke and better then morons like Nelson, he was trying his best to be objective whilst spewing the narrative handed to him by sky.

We always say one more and that one more sometimes can prove to be your most spectacular downfall, we've seen it with Ali, Hatton, Roy Jones Jnr; this list goes on, simply there are rarely happy endings in Boxing mate and you need to get out while you're able to. Khan has so much mileage on his clock despite being a young man and I don't question his desire, he desperately wants to become world champion and beat one of the top welters, the Garcia loss still hurts him and as he said in that interview a win over the legendary Manny who is the biggest figure in the history of our sport since Muhummad Ali himself would erase that loss and in my opinion ensure a place in the hall of fame. But to quote Oscar De La Hoya after his defeat to Manny in 2008, 'there comes a time when the heart wants to fight but the body just doesn't respond' , that quote is from a decade ago but I still remember it :)) so poignant, I will never question Amir's heart or desire but my instinct is that his abilities may potentially have diminished and the mileage he has accumulated on the clock has caused significant wear/tear in the head to, Boxing is an unforgiving sport and those blows just add to your physical and mental toll. I"ll be honest, watching him destroy Le Greco even in that dump Liverpool :yk before an incredible atmosphere, I said to myself he should walk away on that high. But fighters like Khan are throwback warriors, they will always look to right the wrongs even if it means risking everything. In this situation he needs saving from himself.
 
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