Are fast-bowlers with short height as effective as taller ones?

[Nikhil_cric]

India’s short fast bowling attack lost their last Test series in England, New Zealand and South Africa and only won 2-1 in Australia because Smith and Warner were banned.

Sometimes - very rarely - a short fast bowler who is twice as skilled as a taller one can do well - if he has tall quicks throttling the scoring opportunities at the other end.

You can have one supremely skilled short quick in your attack .... and he has to be great at swing or seam.

Musa Khan is the perfect example of how raw pace in a short man is as useful as a comb is to a bald man.

I agree. The tallest pace attacks usually do best on overseas tours. Look at the OZ attack in Asia, England's attack in Australia/West Indies/Asia etc. Very clear trend there .

 

[Forum363]

That’s exactly what I’m saying.

Stop giving short people false hope of a career as a fast bowler. It’s never going to happen.

You conveniently deleted / ignored the rest of my post. Either you are completely stupid or genuinely trolling if you think that the height of a 6 year old perfectly predicts how tall they would be later in life. You are completely ignoring the effect of genetics, nutrition, hormones, medications, health conditions etc.

Stop pretending to be a knowledgeable guy. You are the typical Pakistani uncle who states his opinion and refuses to change due to ego, stubbornness and a refusal to acknowledge a different point of view.

 

[rollingstoned]

this guy has now moved the goalposts to claim that india lost the test series in England and Saf because their bowlers were shorter but that logic doesn't explain how badly England got spanked in Australia and India when they last toured here or how Australia were fielding for 3 days with their 6 ft 99 attacks last year in the test series against india. Oh but that was all because there was no Smith and Warner you see. You can pick and choose your sample sizes any which way, the best bowlers under 6 ft are a lot better than an attack full of Chris Tremletts and Stuart Clarkes. You can be tall but if you don't have the skills your height isn't going to be of much use anywhere.

 

[tyron_woodley]

height isn't as big a factor. it's reach.
bowlers arm length that counts. some short guys have long arms and that would allow them to bowl from a higher angle. steyn, bumrah etc all have long arms. amir long arms.

 

[MenInG]

Interesting observation from Nasser Hussain on Curran's height:


Another bonus for England is Curran's height.

Curran playing in Barbados last year was a mistake but the fact he is short helps England at Old Trafford because he bowls the full length that brings lbw and the stumps into play.

Jason Holder, who is 6ft 7in, was bowling a full length and only just trimming the bails, so a load of DRS decisions weren't overturned.

Curran, at 5ft 9in, has a different trajectory and brings the stumps into play.

https://www.skysports.com/cricket/n...ing-plans-for-second-test-against-west-indies

 

[sweep_shot]

I believe height definitely helps.

If you are short, you have to overcompensate by bowling more accurately and having more tricks.

 

[MMHS]

I believe height definitely helps.

If you are short, you have to overcompensate by bowling more accurately and having more tricks.

It works oppositely as well - if you are too tall, lots of your good LBW shouts will be turned down.

The key is finding ideal length for your height/release point - that's part of skill.

 

[Kingpin786]

Interesting observation from Nasser Hussain on Curran's height:


Another bonus for England is Curran's height.

Curran playing in Barbados last year was a mistake but the fact he is short helps England at Old Trafford because he bowls the full length that brings lbw and the stumps into play.

Jason Holder, who is 6ft 7in, was bowling a full length and only just trimming the bails, so a load of DRS decisions weren't overturned.

Curran, at 5ft 9in, has a different trajectory and brings the stumps into play.

https://www.skysports.com/cricket/n...ing-plans-for-second-test-against-west-indies

[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] your thoughts?

 

[Junaids]

[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] your thoughts?

Curran’s dad Kevin was much better. Better batsman, faster bowler, 6 inches taller.

Nasser’s got it wrong. A left-armer needs the height to get the batsman nibbling outside off-stump.

A short lefty often struggles - compare Mohammad Amir with Wasim Akram!

 

[Kingpin786]

Curran’s dad Kevin was much better. Better batsman, faster bowler, 6 inches taller.

Nasser’s got it wrong. A left-armer needs the height to get the batsman nibbling outside off-stump.

A short lefty often struggles - compare Mohammad Amir with Wasim Akram!

But boult is also as tall as amir and he is a very good test bowler

 

[angrypathan]

But boult is also as tall as amir and he is a very good test bowler

Not in Australia he's not

 

[Kingpin786]

Not in Australia he's not

so using your logic Rabada is not good as he was poor in India,similarly stark has mediocre record in South Africa,India and UAE

 

[shamaan]

Curran’s dad Kevin was much better. Better batsman, faster bowler, 6 inches taller.

Nasser’s got it wrong. A left-armer needs the height to get the batsman nibbling outside off-stump.

A short lefty often struggles - compare Mohammad Amir with Wasim Akram!

Chawinder vaas ?

 

[Manunited18]

Lol, Steyn 5ft10, morne morkel 6ft6, by the definition of the thread Steyn doesn't stand a chance, as we all know there's no comparison.

 

[angrypathan]

so using your logic Rabada is not good as he was poor in India,similarly stark has mediocre record in South Africa,India and UAE

You're reading too much into what I said. Nevertheless, height is the primary reason for Boult's lack of success in Australia. Wonderful bowler everywhere else.

 

[topspin]

Ask the Australian team and management.

The average height of their pace attack in tests is 6"5.

 

[Kingpin786]

You're reading too much into what I said. Nevertheless, height is the primary reason for Boult's lack of success in Australia. Wonderful bowler everywhere else.

Your statement was confusing

 

[Last Monetarist]

There's no need to be deliberately obtuse about what Hussain meant, the idea that Curran's height allows him to naturally bowl fuller in England isn't that controversial. The possibility that bowling such a length won't help him much in Australia is utterly irrelevant.

 

[Kingpin786]

Ask the Australian team and management.

The average height of their pace attack in tests is 6"5.

And what about indian pace attack all fast bowlers except pandya and ishant sharma are under 6 feet

 

[tyron_woodley]

Lol, Steyn 5ft10, morne morkel 6ft6, by the definition of the thread Steyn doesn't stand a chance, as we all know there's no comparison.

what junaids meant was that a tall (6'2 plus bowler) can still be effective with a poorer skillet compared to a shorter bowler (under 6 foot). The shorter guy would need to have a wide array of bowling skills to be as effective as the lesser skilled tall bowler.

Take steyn vs morkel. steyn is far more skilled than morkel hence he is better. He had to work a lot harder to get to where he was in his prime.

 

[Manunited18]

what junaids meant was that a tall (6'2 plus bowler) can still be effective with a poorer skillet compared to a shorter bowler (under 6 foot). The shorter guy would need to have a wide array of bowling skills to be as effective as the lesser skilled tall bowler.

Take steyn vs morkel. steyn is far more skilled than morkel hence he is better. He had to work a lot harder to get to where he was in his prime.

If you read his previous posts he clearly states short fast bowlers have no future.

 

[tyron_woodley]

If you read his previous posts he clearly states short fast bowlers have no future.

oh yea. In that case I disagree. The fastest bowler was infact on the short side aka Marshall.

If you are short, you have to have physically strong and compact. On certain pitches like the ones in australia and south africa, I believe height is an advantage but steyn was clearly the best bowler even on those type of pitches.

If the tall guy is equally skilled as the short guy which is generally a rarity then the taller guy will have an advantage due to height and bounce.

 

[Bhaijaan]

As proven by Malcolm, Steyn and Shami short height cannot stop you from becoming the greatest fast bowler of your era.

..and that's all i ve got to say about that.

 

[shamaan]

As proven by Malcolm, Steyn and Shami short height cannot stop you from becoming the greatest fast bowler of your era.

..and that's all i ve got to say about that.

Agreed

 

[Manunited18]

As proven by Malcolm, Steyn and Shami short height cannot stop you from becoming the greatest fast bowler of your era.

..and that's all i ve got to say about that.

Also bumrah, hes around 5ft 10, another top class quick

 

[tyron_woodley]

Also bumrah, hes around 5ft 10, another top class quick

I have met boult. he is barely 5'10. I know he is listed as 5'11 but that's rubbish. I am 181 and I looked a good 4 cm taller than him.

 

[MMHS]

As proven by Malcolm, Steyn and Shami short height cannot stop you from becoming the greatest fast bowler of your era.

..and that's all i ve got to say about that.

You can add Trueman (5’10”), RR Lindwall (5’10”) as well in that list. Larwood is also listed as 5’8”, which is slightly shorter than even this Bangladeshi.

Height is important, but it’s not the end of it - watch last time three English pacers of 6’6”; 6’5” & 6’2” being man handled by Aussies at the play ground of tall pacers - WACA.

 

[tyron_woodley]

more than height, stamina, ability to sustain power and skills are more important. If all attributes are equal then yes taller guy has am advantage due to natural bounce. Unfortunately the taller bowlers often dont excel in certain areas like stamina for instance and even power, hence we see average height bowlers dominate in world cricket. You won't see bowlers under 5'9 have success though

 

[Bhaijaan]

Curtly Ambrose's test bowling average vs India is 38+

Fearless men do not bother height and bounce. It is the skill that gets great batsmen out.

It is teams like Australia, NZ,England etc who made a big deal of tall bouncy fast bowlers.

 

[Kingpin786]

Curtly Ambrose's test bowling average vs India is 38+

Fearless men do not bother height and bounce. It is the skill that gets great batsmen out.

It is teams like Australia, NZ,England etc who made a big deal of tall bouncy fast bowlers.

Well said

 

[The Viper]

Sam Curran is bowling well for England. 1-23 is pretty good figures. Maybe height is not everything as some would suggest.

 

[MenInG]

Sam Curran doing really well for his height - bowling bouncers too!

 

[JibranAnsari]

Height is not everything but taller ballers definitely have advantages.

 

[Phantom Menace]

Neil Wagner is I think between 5'9 and 5'10 and he has managed to be an effective bowler in many conditions with skiddy bouncers

 

[Swashbuckler]

I guess time to revisit this question.

This series we didn't have a single 5'11" quick bowler forget giants, still did ok I guess.

Some of them weren't fully fit:

Umesh in 2nd innings, MCG (calf strain)
Saini after those 7 overs in 1st innings, Gabba (groin strain)
Bumrah in 2nd innings, SCG (abdominal strain)
Shami didn't bowl in 2nd innings Adelaide after his arm got broken by Cummins

Thakur is a bits and pieces cricketer who may never start in another test for India, good option for T20s. Natarajan will play ODIs, T20s and be a net bowler for the test squad, won't play another test barring some miracle.

Bumrah 5'10"

Shami 5'9"

Siraj 5'10"

Umesh 5'10"

Saini 5'9"

Thakur 5'8"

Natarajan 5'9"

Gabba is supposed to be Australia's fortress, the bounciest pitch. Many great attacks have come to this venue in the past 30 years. Most recently a bowling attack with sum total 4 tests experience (out of which 1 where Thakur limped out after delivering 10 balls on morning of day 1 and never came to the field again). So here is a statistic:

Only for the third time in the last 32 years across 32 Tests, Australia have been bowled out in each innings of a Test at the Gabba - the other instances came against WI in 1992/93 and against NZ in 2008/09.

 

[JaDed]

I guess professional planning can help against best sides and their batsmen, I don’t wanna say “data” but clearly bowling plans have to be laid out for bowlers and they have to stick to it, Shami has had issues doing it , Bumrah hasn’t.

I think we were doing it in LOI for a while now but somehow in tests we were not delivering that well, under Rahane in tests we did see plans being executed and multiple strategies to fall back on.

Hopefully Kohli utilizes similar strategies esp going for a win/draw , there are lot of times when it seems we play with a do or die approach in tests..(probably not entirely true).

 

[Hyperion66]

I do not consider anyone less than 7.5 feet as a fast bowler. Fast bowler should have a massive upper body well supported by daddy long legs.

 

[MenInG]

Marco Jansen & Mohammad Zeeshan 6ft 8in (2.032m)

Some of the other tall-heighted bowlers in history over the years are Mohammad Irfan (2.16m), Boyd Rankin (2.04 m), Kyle Jamieson (2.03 m), Joel Garner (2.03 m), Morne Morkel (1.96 m) to name a few.

 

[PakLFC]

Better to be of average height both as a batsman and bowler. Tall bowlers rarely make great ones other then perhaps Joel Garner.

 

[wrongun]

Marco Jansen & Mohammad Zeeshan 6ft 8in (2.032m)

Some of the other tall-heighted bowlers in history over the years are Mohammad Irfan (2.16m), Boyd Rankin (2.04 m), Kyle Jamieson (2.03 m), Joel Garner (2.03 m), Morne Morkel (1.96 m) to name a few.

Curtly Ambrose... Jason Holder... Billy Stanlake currently in Oz bowls very, very quick at that height.

 

[shah_1]

Virat Kohli mentioned height factor advantage of SA fast bowlers. All of them are very tall

 

[pakfan54588]

Sam curran was best bowler in recent worldcup .He is proving skill matters most rather than just height

 

[shamaan]

Virat Kohli mentioned height factor advantage of SA fast bowlers. All of them are very tall

Shaheen doesn't use his height to his advantage.

 

[Fenrir]

Malcolm Marshall was not tall but he was a deadly bowler.Dale Steyn is not tall,took a lot of wickets at a good average.Tall bowlers have an advantage but relatively short bowlers can still be successful if they have good pace snd right skills.

 

[TheSultan]

Some of the mist destructive bowlers in history were under 6ft. Marshall, Steyn. Shoaib Akhtar was either 5’ 11 or 6. Dead, Waqar similar.

On the other hand you get bowlers like Holder who are extremely tall but extremely mediocre too.

I think height is overplayed. Yes being tall has it’s advantages, but a shortish bowler who’s 140+, can swing the ball is fine.

 

[ElRaja]

how is this even a thread? i hear the Malcolm marshall point all the time, the guy was 5 ft 11, that is not short by any stretch of the imagination.

the topic is about short fast bowlers, that's 5 ft 9 or under, and it is plain as day being around 6ft is ideal for all out pace, however being taller gives you a wider variety of weapons to play with, its one of the reasons why asif's seam movement was so deadly, he could pitch it a tad fuller since he was taller.

and the question was originally about test cricket, what sam curran has achieved in the wc is great, but he will never be able to replicate that form in tests, where someone like stokes, the taller stronger guy, is far more effective.

also tall guys tend to have far more economic actions, the only fast bowlers to have taken more than 500 wickets, all were taller than 6ft 2.

pace demon, ideal height around 6ft, if ur pace is sub express, ideal height is 6ft 3 and above, sub 5 ft 9 inch, you are very unlikely to make it as a specialist test fast bowler.

 

[Cricket-lion]

I prefer taller fast bowlers, that is 5 ft 10 and over. They able to use their height to advantage and extract bounce from the pitch. This indeed can be very uncomfortable for many batsman. I think this is more important in the longer formats.