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Are New Zealand bigger chokers in ICC Semi Finals and Finals than South Africa?

Savak

Savak

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I find it funny that the entire world goes on a relentless dig against South Africa for losing vital games in ICC events and failing to win ICC trophies but what about NZ? Apart from the 2000 ICC CT, they have nothing else to show on their resume.
 
New Zealand has achieved a lot in cricket compared to its population size, so it’s fine if they’re getting a little carried away.
 
you forgot the 2021 WTC
even still they are to be praised for consistently punching above their weight for a country with a very small population, in which cricket is not their main sport
 
It was inevitable they would lose In T20 and ODI WCs NZ and SA are a laymans favourite teams generally favoured well supported yet both have zero trophies combined... Hard to believe its like France and Germany in football never winning a tournament...... Cricket has less big teams and 2 teams who are always in the top 5 best teams haven't even won one big tournament.
 
Cric1234 said:
If population had an impact on the quality of teams then Bangladesh would be one of the best teams. :kp :klopp
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80% population of that country is born with a chip on their shoulders, I bet they suck at ludo let alone any outdoor games.

Ontopic: Given the kind of form we’re in right now, we’d pulverize any team. Folks here are too harsh on New Zealand.
 
Most of those tournaments they lost to better teams in Australia and India. And we all know how they lost against England in 2019.

South Africa are called chokers because they lose to inferior teams from winning positions in the most bizarre way...1999 WC semi and the 2015 WC semi..they had both those games in the bag but ended up losing due to sheer pressure. Numerous other examples like the 2011 QF against NZ, 2003 world cup DLS blinder against Sri Lanka.

Let's not even talk about the 30 off 30 choke against India in Barbados.
 
Savak said:
2015 ODI World Cup Finalists
2019 ODI World Cup Finalists
2021 ICC T20 WC Finalists
2022 ICC T20 WC Semi Finalists
2025 ICC CT Finalists
2026 ICC T20 WC Finalists

I find it funny that the entire world goes on a relentless dig against South Africa for losing vital games in ICC events and failing to win ICC trophies but what about NZ? Apart from the 2000 ICC CT, they have nothing else to show on their resume.
Click to expand...
List is getting bigger
 
Savak said:
2015 ODI World Cup Finalists
2019 ODI World Cup Finalists
2021 ICC T20 WC Finalists
2022 ICC T20 WC Semi Finalists
2025 ICC CT Finalists
2026 ICC T20 WC Finalists

I find it funny that the entire world goes on a relentless dig against South Africa for losing vital games in ICC events and failing to win ICC trophies but what about NZ? Apart from the 2000 ICC CT, they have nothing else to show on their resume.
Click to expand...

stats.espncricinfo.com

Team records | Combined Test, ODI and T20I records | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPNcricinfo.com

stats.espncricinfo.com stats.espncricinfo.com

They are still better than SA in ICC knockout matches. South Africa have a terrible W/L ratio in ICC knockout matches, historically .

NZ, PAK and ENG are at a pretty similar level in KO matches
 
Well they didn’t learn a single thing from England’s defeat against India.

The first thing you do is to bat first when you win the toss in a preassure game like a final. And you know how difficult it is to score against Bumrah. Batting first you have more freedom, but in second innings you feel more preassure.

Anyways India just blasted the air out of them, that was carnage, Kiwis will have nightmares the next few days before they play a useless T20 series against the master chokers.
 
Today was a new low, they choked at the toss.
 
IAJ said:
Well they didn’t learn a single thing from England’s defeat against India.

The first thing you do is to bat first when you win the toss in a preassure game like a final. And you know how difficult it is to score against Bumrah. Batting first you have more freedom, but in second innings you feel more preassure.

Anyways India just blasted the air out of them, that was carnage, Kiwis will have nightmares the next few days before they play a useless T20 series against the master chokers.
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They already saw this few times last month. I don't think they will be as sad as South Africa who were good until a point.
 
IAJ said:
Well they didn’t learn a single thing from England’s defeat against India.

The first thing you do is to bat first when you win the toss in a preassure game like a final. And you know how difficult it is to score against Bumrah. Batting first you have more freedom, but in second innings you feel more preassure.

Anyways India just blasted the air out of them, that was carnage, Kiwis will have nightmares the next few days before they play a useless T20 series against the master chokers.
Click to expand...

More shocking for me was the fact they had recently played a T-20 series against India in India a month ago where they were exposed to India's power hitters and bowlers like Bhumrah, Pandya, Arshdeep, Kuldeep, Chakrawarthy, Axar e.t.c. They were very well versed with how India ruthessly goes about their business on Indian wickets, they still did not come up with a proper defensive bowling plan or field setting.

Bowling first sealed the deal in India's favour.
 
New Zealand’s problems haven’t changed much since the 90s. They are a fighting side and as a result are a team that takes out big contenders. But to win a tournament they lack the killer players. They are better than their 90s team, but are still missing key ingredients.
 
NZ plays too much according to process and don't play based on what's happening on the ground. Today first 2 overs were fantastic and yet they changed bowlers. It's like they had decided who is going to bowl which overs in advance.

Anyway, NZ was outplayed by India and it wasn't a case of choking.
 
New Zealand has been choking in the finals of ICC World Cups since 2015.

South Africa has not been in many finals because they tend to choke in the semifinals.
 
Today’s was not choking. They were not in the game after fifth over. There wasnt a single moment after that where they could have won and failed to capitalize on the opportunities. India just steam rolled them. remember they basically won two good matches to reach final.
 
If India plays to their potential this NZ will lose 10 out of 10. We saw that in recent series. India deliberately dropped a batsman just to check how we react. We lost. But but for a run out INdia would have won that too. NZ relies on 3 guys. One of them is proper hack. Seifert. Allen has weakness aginst left arm spin. Philips also has issue against left arm spin. That's it. Everyone else is ODI players. NOt T20 players. They don't have Boult class bowler either.
 
New Zealand has been acting like spoilers in ICC tournaments by stopping teams in the SFs that would have had a better chance of beating the other finalist.

In the 2015 World Cup, NZ (299 runs) beat South Africa by 18 runs in the SF, who one felt had a better chance of beating Australia in the final.

In the 2019 World Cup, they did the same thing; beat India, who would have had a better chance of beating England in the final. In the final, New Zealand managed a below-par 241. It is another matter that England did not bat well themselves and were rescued by Stokes in the end.....crawled to a tie.
 
AZulfi said:
New Zealand has been acting like spoilers in ICC tournaments by stopping teams in the SFs that would have had a better chance of beating the other finalist.

In the 2015 World Cup, NZ (299 runs) beat South Africa by 18 runs in the SF, who one felt had a better chance of beating Australia in the final.

In the 2019 World Cup, they did the same thing; beat India, who would have had a better chance of beating England in the final. In the final, New Zealand managed a below-par 241. It is another matter that England did not bat well themselves and were rescued by Stokes in the end.....crawled to a tie.
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THey got lucky in 2019 against India. They were given a new day to start the match. SO fresh early damp conditions overwhelmingly helped bowlers like Henry in the next day. If they match had gone on the same day India would have won it comfortably with no assistance for bowlers.
 
2015 and 2026 wcs are not choking by any means.They were not in any contest and got mauled by much stronger units.2019 was a very unlucky one. 21 - its all about toss and bowling team won all the time.even then they got a good score ( 190 i think).
 
AZulfi said:
New Zealand has been acting like spoilers in ICC tournaments by stopping teams in the SFs that would have had a better chance of beating the other finalist.

In the 2015 World Cup, NZ (299 runs) beat South Africa by 18 runs in the SF, who one felt had a better chance of beating Australia in the final.

In the 2019 World Cup, they did the same thing; beat India, who would have had a better chance of beating England in the final. In the final, New Zealand managed a below-par 241. It is another matter that England did not bat well themselves and were rescued by Stokes in the end.....crawled to a tie.
Click to expand...
NZ was party poopers
 
jnaveen1980 said:
If India plays to their potential this NZ will lose 10 out of 10. We saw that in recent series. India deliberately dropped a batsman just to check how we react. We lost. But but for a run out INdia would have won that too. NZ relies on 3 guys. One of them is proper hack. Seifert. Allen has weakness aginst left arm spin. Philips also has issue against left arm spin. That's it. Everyone else is ODI players. NOt T20 players. They don't have Boult class bowler either.
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How on earth SA lose to these jokers?
 
jnaveen1980 said:
If India plays to their potential this NZ will lose 10 out of 10. We saw that in recent series. India deliberately dropped a batsman just to check how we react. We lost. But but for a run out INdia would have won that too. NZ relies on 3 guys. One of them is proper hack. Seifert. Allen has weakness aginst left arm spin. Philips also has issue against left arm spin. That's it. Everyone else is ODI players. NOt T20 players. They don't have Boult class bowler either.
Click to expand...
Eng, Aus, westidies,SA all are better t20 teams than NZ....they are on par with pakistan
 
Savak said:
More shocking for me was the fact they had recently played a T-20 series against India in India a month ago where they were exposed to India's power hitters and bowlers like Bhumrah, Pandya, Arshdeep, Kuldeep, Chakrawarthy, Axar e.t.c. They were very well versed with how India ruthessly goes about their business on Indian wickets, they still did not come up with a proper defensive bowling plan or field setting.

Bowling first sealed the deal in India's favour.
Click to expand...
If they batted first and scored 180...they are in game..... everything look fishy
 
Mesozoic said:
Most of those tournaments they lost to better teams in Australia and India. And we all know how they lost against England in 2019.

South Africa are called chokers because they lose to inferior teams from winning positions in the most bizarre way...1999 WC semi and the 2015 WC semi..they had both those games in the bag but ended up losing due to sheer pressure. Numerous other examples like the 2011 QF against NZ, 2003 world cup DLS blinder against Sri Lanka.

Let's not even talk about the 30 off 30 choke against India in Barbados.
Click to expand...
That 30 of 30 was unforgettable..... klaseen and miller on crease...fully set....even if all 5 overs bowled by bumrah it should have been cakewalk....
 
New Zealand always get beaten by better sides. It's not like they are snatching defeat from the jaws of victory like South Africa. Also they were robbed in 2019.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
They batted timidly against average spinners at Eden Gardens. That is where they lost. 210 was par total. Then they just had to get rid of openers. That's it. They did neither of it.
Click to expand...
SA were just unlucky....they beat NZ 9 out of 10 times.....
 
NZ never really looked like they gonna win the cup. 2015 also it was Southafrica who choked . 2021 they were no match to Australia . 2019 was probably their best side. This WC also . SA were much better team . SA probably took it too lightly. India and SA clearly were two best teams this WC
 
Saffers wanna give away the choking tag but Kiwis haven’t really lost games from winning positions.. Saffers have consistently done that as recently as 2024
 
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