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Babar Azam - the lack of English debate

As for me, Language is just a tool to communicate and judging a person on English proficiency is inhumane. This is my humble opinion
 
In a sport where there are only a handful of teams playing at a high level you need to be articulate and possess good communications skills as a captain. Especially when it comes to international cricket as you’re representing you country as well. Anyone can learn English and learn it up to a high level of proficiency. We have all seen numerous people from all walks of life whether they’re coming straight from the pind or elsewhere learn English. Babar could easily have hired someone to be his English tutor when he’s not touring or playing. His English could be proficient in less than a year if he really wanted it to be. The fact that he is speaking at a very rudimentary level tells us it’s not a priority for him. I get the argument that we shouldn’t judge people on their ability to speak English, they can speak with their bat etc etc, but let’s look at this pragmatically as well. Learning English isn’t akin to climbing Mount Everest. I wonder what Babar’s literacy level is overall, I’m not trying to spread any rumours but did he even complete his basic schooling?
 
Sarwar89 said:
Messi does not speak English.
Babur’s bat needs to speak.
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Messi plays football. A global sport played by hundreds of nations that have no association & connection with the English language.

In every football press conference, you will have journalists & media personnel from all over the world. No one language has any superiority over the other.

Cricket is different. It is only played in countries that are English speaking or were formally colonized by the British. As a result, English has become the de facto official language of cricket.

As a cricketer, you cannot avoid speaking English. Whether it is at the toss or during the match (speaking to umpires, officials etc.) or after the match speaking to media & doing post match presentations, you will inevitably find yourself in situations where you will have to speak English.

Therefore, it is necessary for the players to work on their English. They don’t need to become Shakespeare but they need to be competent to avoid embarrassing moments like above.

There are many jobs in the world where you need to be proficient in certain languages. Cricket is also a unique sport where one particular language is very dominant & prevalent & we must accept that.

If Babar doesn’t care about English, if he think it is not important & if he is showing his patriotism by speaking Urdu, why does he feel the need to pay his social media team to Tweet in English on his behalf?

Babar’s Twitter handle tweets in perfect English. Babar cannot read a word that comes out of his own Twitter account. Perhaps like Messi, he should also tweet in his local language & if anyone is interested, he/she can translate his tweet.

This whole argument that Babar is not required to speak English & he is proud of his culture goes out of the window after one cursory look at his Twitter handle.
 
The most popular English word in history of Pakistan cricket.

“Definitely”

I think this is the first English word every Pakistani cricketer learns. :)))
 
Mamoon said:
The most popular English word in history of Pakistan cricket.

“Definitely”

I think this is the first English word every Pakistani cricketer learns. :)))
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They use the word bilkul in Urdu all the time.

You would have come across this in your daily dealings as well. Nothing wrong with that or to laugh at.
 
MenInG said:
They use the word bilkul in Urdu all the time.

You would have come across this in your daily dealings as well. Nothing wrong with that or to laugh at.
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It is funny because they overdo it. Almost everyone sentence starts with “definitely” even if it is not needed.

They can also say “of course” instead or mix it up, but “definitely” is definitely the favorite English word of Pakistani players.
 
Mamoon said:
It is funny because they overdo it. Almost everyone sentence starts with “definitely” even if it is not needed.

They can also say “of course” instead or mix it up, but “definitely” is definitely the favorite English word of Pakistani players.
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every*
 
Mamoon said:
It is funny because they overdo it. Almost everyone sentence starts with “definitely” even if it is not needed.

They can also say “of course” instead or mix it up, but “definitely” is definitely the favorite English word of Pakistani players.
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I was gonna say this exact thing.

Forget English. Babar can’t even speak proper Urdu correctly.
 
Mamoon said:
Messi plays football. A global sport played by hundreds of nations that have no association & connection with the English language.

In every football press conference, you will have journalists & media personnel from all over the world. No one language has any superiority over the other.

Cricket is different. It is only played in countries that are English speaking or were formally colonized by the British. As a result, English has become the de facto official language of cricket.

As a cricketer, you cannot avoid speaking English. Whether it is at the toss or during the match (speaking to umpires, officials etc.) or after the match speaking to media & doing post match presentations, you will inevitably find yourself in situations where you will have to speak English.

Therefore, it is necessary for the players to work on their English. They don’t need to become Shakespeare but they need to be competent to avoid embarrassing moments like above.

There are many jobs in the world where you need to be proficient in certain languages. Cricket is also a unique sport where one particular language is very dominant & prevalent & we must accept that.

If Babar doesn’t care about English, if he think it is not important & if he is showing his patriotism by speaking Urdu, why does he feel the need to pay his social media team to Tweet in English on his behalf?

Babar’s Twitter handle tweets in perfect English. Babar cannot read a word that comes out of his own Twitter account. Perhaps like Messi, he should also tweet in his local language & if anyone is interested, he/she can translate his tweet.

This whole argument that Babar is not required to speak English & he is proud of his culture goes out of the window after one cursory look at his Twitter handle.
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Misbah ul haq was decent in English ? Correct ?
Till this day he is criticized for tuk tuk culture. English was just an add on and he is fairly well educated fella.

Salman butt was also
Ok in English. Imad wasim too. Did it help them in any case.

It is de facto language is another thing. But we cant expect Abdul hafeez kardar or raja or imran majid khan type people everytime.

Right now there are bigger problems in pcb and certainly bigger issues for babur to deal with, given 2022 was not a very good year for him from captaincy perspective.

Ok people can throw in English language issue on top of all other mess pcb babur and team is going through is a bit too much.

I can give you my own example, i am learning Italian language for past 1 year in slow pace, however with full time job & other things going on, it is not very easy cake that i become fluent in it and i am not teenager who tend to grasp language quickly, and some colleagues did tell me they were expecting better fluency in 1 year. Babur has so much to think about so many things.

Anyone remembers mohammad yousuf english in pak tour of Aus in 2009-10 ? That was embarrasing. Babur is better than that. Come on.

Babur’s English if you compare from 2017 till now, there is some improvement.
 
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Trust me if you are a top level player in the world setting up standards for the game no one will question the language you speak. Since babar is not yet such player these questions will pop up.
 
Sarwar89 said:
Misbah ul haq was decent in English ? Correct ?
Till this day he is criticized for tuk tuk culture. English was just an add on and he is fairly well educated fella.

Salman butt was also
Ok in English. Imad wasim too. Did it help them in any case.

It is de facto language is another thing. But we cant expect Abdul hafeez kardar or raja or imran majid khan type people everytime.

Right now there are bigger problems in pcb and certainly bigger issues for babur to deal with, given 2022 was not a very good year for him from captaincy perspective.

Ok people can throw in English language issue on top of all other mess pcb babur and team is going through is a bit too much.

I can give you my own example, i am learning Italian language for past 1 year in slow pace, however with full time job & other things going on, it is not very easy cake that i become fluent in it and i am not teenager who tend to grasp language quickly, and some colleagues did tell me they were expecting better fluency in 1 year. Babur has so much to think about so many things.

Anyone remembers mohammad yousuf english in pak tour of Aus in 2009-10 ? That was embarrasing. Babur is better than that. Come on.

Babur’s English if you compare from 2017 till now, there is some improvement.
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I would say it did help them, why wouldn’t it? English isn’t going to save you from getting sacked or dropped, but that’s not the context we should view it in. Flipping the argument around, Babar’s “bat” has done a lot of talking, has it helped him with his image? No, the debate is still on.

You can’t compare someone who works a regular job learning another language Vs someone with an unlimited pool of resources at his disposal. There’s a video of him interviewing Kane Williamson, I can’t remember where it’s from but it’s fairly recent and Kane is asking him questions, Babar is acting like an idiot and you can clearly see Kane wondering what the hell is going on. As a captain you need to do better, letting your bat talk isn’t enough when you’re speaking on behalf of your country.
 
Who cares about the lack of english, the zero intelligence Mr Dummy Captain has is the bigger worry.
 
Guys throwing in English words when they aren't even needed.

A recipe for ridicule and disaster.
 
Mamoon said:
Messi plays football. A global sport played by hundreds of nations that have no association & connection with the English language.

In every football press conference, you will have journalists & media personnel from all over the world. No one language has any superiority over the other.

Cricket is different. It is only played in countries that are English speaking or were formally colonized by the British. As a result, English has become the de facto official language of cricket.

As a cricketer, you cannot avoid speaking English. Whether it is at the toss or during the match (speaking to umpires, officials etc.) or after the match speaking to media & doing post match presentations, you will inevitably find yourself in situations where you will have to speak English.

Therefore, it is necessary for the players to work on their English. They don’t need to become Shakespeare but they need to be competent to avoid embarrassing moments like above.

There are many jobs in the world where you need to be proficient in certain languages. Cricket is also a unique sport where one particular language is very dominant & prevalent & we must accept that.

If Babar doesn’t care about English, if he think it is not important & if he is showing his patriotism by speaking Urdu, why does he feel the need to pay his social media team to Tweet in English on his behalf?

Babar’s Twitter handle tweets in perfect English. Babar cannot read a word that comes out of his own Twitter account. Perhaps like Messi, he should also tweet in his local language & if anyone is interested, he/she can translate his tweet.

This whole argument that Babar is not required to speak English & he is proud of his culture goes out of the window after one cursory look at his Twitter handle.
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We can’t have everything, should they make Shan Masood captain if this is so important?
 
Technics 1210 said:
As the saying goes - it is better to remain silent than to remove all doubt!
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I told the PCB guys to do these press conferences and post match chats in Urdu where needed and translate.

However it seems they think better.

Now players feel as if they have to speak in English and say words in English just to look smarter.
 
He will get better. Till then he should stay clear of figure of speech phrases as it can often be inappropriately used. Just do what Inzi dd. We didn't bat well, bowl well, field well. If they ask again change the order and repeat.
 
I don't understand why Pakistanis tend to throw in a few English words while they are having a conversation in Urdu. Just speak a full sentence of Urdu without throwing in a couple of English words, because you want to sound cool.

I find it embarrassing that our captain is such a poor communicator, not just in English but in Urdu. Surely, PCB need to educate these players in communication skills. Every time Babar speaks, I can't watch because I am so embarrassed.
 
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shaz619 said:
We can’t have everything, should they make Shan Masood captain if this is so important?
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A player who cannot bat or bowl & but speaks good English will obviously not help either.

The key is not to select players based on how well they speak but develop the communication skills of your best players.

It is PCB’s job to make this effort & polish these players. Unlike India & Sri Lanka, Pakistan does not have a strong school cricket culture. You won’t see players like Sangakkara coming through the system who speak better English than most English people.

Babar has been on PCB’s radar since the age of 13. You have to ask why PCB did not groom him. It is their failure not Babar’s.

As soon as a players get in the system, i.e. U19, FC, Pakistan A etc., PCB should also invest in their development in terms of how to handle media, how to polish your public speaking etc.

If it is not feasible then hire a full-time translator. It is better to speak no English than to say that I declared against New Zealand because I wanted to make a below the belt decision. :))) :))) :)))
 
Babar Azam’s main problem isn’t lack of English necessarily. It’s lack of communication skills.

Whether he speaks English, Urdu or Punjabi; this sentences and trains of thoughts are all over the place and he fails to articulate himself.
 
Shoaib Akhtar:

"Cricket is one job and handling media is another job. If you can’t speak, I am sorry but you won’t be able to express yourself on the TV"

"I want to openly say this that Babar Azam should be the biggest brand of Pakistan, but why he hasn’t become the biggest brand in Pakistan? Because he can’t speak"

"Is there any other cricketer who can speak well? Why only me, Shahid Afridi and Wasim Akram get all the advertisements? The reason is that we take it as a job."
 
MenInG said:
Shoaib Akhtar:

"Cricket is one job and handling media is another job. If you can’t speak, I am sorry but you won’t be able to express yourself on the TV"

"I want to openly say this that Babar Azam should be the biggest brand of Pakistan, but why he hasn’t become the biggest brand in Pakistan? Because he can’t speak"

"Is there any other cricketer who can speak well? Why only me, Shahid Afridi and Wasim Akram get all the advertisements? The reason is that we take it as a job."
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Salman Butt responds:

“He is a great player. And for a cricketer, only his cricketing skills give him fame. Yes, the fluency in communication and being an articulate speaker adds to your charisma. But this is not a defect. If you're not an expert in communication, if you're not a natural, it's not a defect"

“He (Babar) is a sensible person. If he doesn't have a command on a secondary language, there is nothing bad about it. Many athletes speak in their mother tongue intentionally when they are at the top of the podium, and ask the translator to convey the message. We should feel proud that we have ownership on our language,” said Butt.

“Yes, there is nothing bad in knowing another language. But Babar ko naa toh kisi draamey ka voiceover karna hai, naa hi TV pe khabrein padhni hain. (But neither does Babar have to give a voiceover for a drama series, nor does he have to read news on television). Babar is himself a brand. He's world no.1 consistently; tell me, how many Pakistan players have done that in last 3-4 decades? The least we can do is to give him the credit he's due. There's no one better than him,”
 
MenInG said:
Salman Butt responds:

“He is a great player. And for a cricketer, only his cricketing skills give him fame. Yes, the fluency in communication and being an articulate speaker adds to your charisma. But this is not a defect. If you're not an expert in communication, if you're not a natural, it's not a defect"

“He (Babar) is a sensible person. If he doesn't have a command on a secondary language, there is nothing bad about it. Many athletes speak in their mother tongue intentionally when they are at the top of the podium, and ask the translator to convey the message. We should feel proud that we have ownership on our language,” said Butt.

“Yes, there is nothing bad in knowing another language. But Babar ko naa toh kisi draamey ka voiceover karna hai, naa hi TV pe khabrein padhni hain. (But neither does Babar have to give a voiceover for a drama series, nor does he have to read news on television). Babar is himself a brand. He's world no.1 consistently; tell me, how many Pakistan players have done that in last 3-4 decades? The least we can do is to give him the credit he's due. There's no one better than him,”
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Butt is so sensitive. Why did he have to be greedy at wrong moment in past?
 
You dont have to be speaking oxford English, but if you cannot speak functional english even after 7 years of international cricket, then you are not trying hard. Sehwag, Harbhajan, Irfan Pathan, Rohit Sharma, Raina etc were poor when they started. Later they improved so that we could easily understand what they are trying to convey.
 
Shoaib Akhtar - a great authority on English Language - making fun of Kamran Akmal's English:

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Wahab Riaz in an interview

"We are a complex type of people, in that sense, we have a tendency to prefer what is not ours rather than what is ours. For instance, even if we have a phone, we tend to like someone else's phone more. It is important to comprehend the use of English language worldwide for communication, but Urdu is the national language of Pakistan"

"Therefore, if someone asks a question in English, whether it be a press conference or post-match conference, there is no need to be shy to answer in Urdu, as it is our national language. On the other hand, gaining knowledge and learning to speak English is necessary, but if one is not able to speak it fluently, speaking in Urdu makes no difference"
 
I’ve said it again and again. Babars problem isn’t language. It’s that he is not articulate and has poor speaking Skills.
 
Once again, Babar unable to express himself in English in post game
 
Not sure if you all watched the end of game interviews with Cummins and Stokes but it's not really about English - more about what you say, in any language
 
In football they have a translator for players who has difficulty with English. Why can't cricket do the same. I've heard alot of Asian players sh+ts their pants if they win mom or have to give press conference. It's kinda unfair on these guys.
 
Babar's not the greatest speaker whether it's Urdu or English.

Seems to say the same sort of thing in most media interractions.

I'm not even sure if we'll see improvement in future.
 
light said:
In football they have a translator for players who has difficulty with English. Why can't cricket do the same. I've heard alot of Asian players sh+ts their pants if they win mom or have to give press conference. It's kinda unfair on these guys.
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I am not talking about English - I am talking about what they have to say (in any language)

Instead of spending money in Harvard, an intensive course in English for a month could have done wonders for his public image
 
Why o Why Babar?

Could have spoken in Urdu in the interview with Harsha?
 
Saj said:
Babar's not the greatest speaker whether it's Urdu or English.

Seems to say the same sort of thing in most media interractions.

I'm not even sure if we'll see improvement in future.
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He seems in his elemement when speaking Punjabi. Laid back and quite funny.
 
Why is lack of English a problem? He can communicate just fine enough for people to understand him.

Score runs and for bowlers be economical and take wickets. Its a cricket game, not a spelling B contest. Sarfi is hilarious at English but he won us a trophy in 2006, 2017 and in psl.
 
He's the best batsman in the world. He can speak in whatever manner he likes. If you don't like it, go listen to a podcast.
 
MenInG said:
Why o Why Babar?

Could have spoken in Urdu in the interview with Harsha?
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I think the players should be allowed to speak in whatever language they feel comfortable speaking.

I hope the broadcasters aren't forcing the players to speak in English.
 
Cricket-lion said:
Wearing a cap or not is minor, it is not an issue. Let people wear what they wish.

Pakistan players not speaking English initially is not an issue. The issue is the inability to progress and refine oneself over the years. There is a lack of will from some players it seems. It not even about English but bringing religion into post match interviews is something that should be avoided.

If you want to be be more marketable, all these things matter. Yet again, when you have a shockingly low literacy rate, should we blame the players? They are a reflection of the society.
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wearing a cap is not a minor issue. Its basic decency that has existed from the 20th century that when you are inside a building, you take off the cap
 
mominsaigol said:
Why is lack of English a problem? He can communicate just fine enough for people to understand him.

Score runs and for bowlers be economical and take wickets. Its a cricket game, not a spelling B contest. Sarfi is hilarious at English but he won us a trophy in 2006, 2017 and in psl.
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Batsman's job is to score run.

Bowler's job is to take wickets and be economical.

But captain's job requires him to communicate with others. All leadership roles require good communication skills.
 
kumjsr said:
Batsman's job is to score run.

Bowler's job is to take wickets and be economical.

But captain's job requires him to communicate with others. All leadership roles require good communication skills.
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And can pakistani cricketers not speak urdu?
 
kumjsr said:
Batsman's job is to score run.

Bowler's job is to take wickets and be economical.

But captain's job requires him to communicate with others. All leadership roles require good communication skills.
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All leadership roles require that the captain is a certainty in the eleven which Babar is

Plus from observation, if you are not respected as a player, then no matter how good a strategist you are, you will lose hold on the team. Babar is respected by all Pakistanis as a great cricketer
 
Major said:
wearing a cap is not a minor issue. Its basic decency that has existed from the 20th century that when you are inside a building, you take off the cap
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In British culture. In Pakistani culture, having your head covered is considered better.

Is Babar Pakistani or English? How about you?
 
MenInG said:
I am not talking about English - I am talking about what they have to say (in any language)

Instead of spending money in Harvard, an intensive course in English for a month could have done wonders for his public image
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some people are not meant for certain things no matter how hard they try.

Shan masood is not meant to play cricket no matter how hard he tries.

Babar Is a great cricketer but good communication skills just dont come to him. His brothers speak better than he does.

So why waste effort in doing something which you will not succeed in. He is well respected by his team despite his limited communication skills which shows that man-manangement and communication skills are two different things.

And tbh Babar looks humble and honest when speaking. The guy just won the ICC Cricketer of the year. Do people want him to act cocky and narcissistic like Shoaib Akhtar?
Only in an low illiteracy country like Pakistan and India can you gain fans by acting like Shoaib Akhtar.

Babar is humble and honest, let him be
 
Mamoon said:
Messi plays football. A global sport played by hundreds of nations that have no association & connection with the English language.

In every football press conference, you will have journalists & media personnel from all over the world. No one language has any superiority over the other.

Cricket is different. It is only played in countries that are English speaking or were formally colonized by the British. As a result, English has become the de facto official language of cricket.

As a cricketer, you cannot avoid speaking English. Whether it is at the toss or during the match (speaking to umpires, officials etc.) or after the match speaking to media & doing post match presentations, you will inevitably find yourself in situations where you will have to speak English.

Therefore, it is necessary for the players to work on their English. They don’t need to become Shakespeare but they need to be competent to avoid embarrassing moments like above.

There are many jobs in the world where you need to be proficient in certain languages. Cricket is also a unique sport where one particular language is very dominant & prevalent & we must accept that.

If Babar doesn’t care about English, if he think it is not important & if he is showing his patriotism by speaking Urdu, why does he feel the need to pay his social media team to Tweet in English on his behalf?

Babar’s Twitter handle tweets in perfect English. Babar cannot read a word that comes out of his own Twitter account. Perhaps like Messi, he should also tweet in his local language & if anyone is interested, he/she can translate his tweet.

This whole argument that Babar is not required to speak English & he is proud of his culture goes out of the window after one cursory look at his Twitter handle.
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Cricketers are there to play cricket, not to become William Shakespeare.

Babar is only a sportsman, yet has better English than Modi who is PM.

Most sports stars social media accounts are run by others, this is common knowledge to most.
 
Bilal7 said:
In British culture. In Pakistani culture, having your head covered is considered better.

Is Babar Pakistani or English? How about you?
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Wait what?
This has nothing to do with British culture. Its something that is applied overall..

There is no Pakistani culture.

Also, if you talking about Islamic culture, there is a difference between wearing a turban or a scull cap.

A t-cap is something that is part of the western culture aswell, so if we gonna go down that route than lets associate those things properly.

Its a basic rule in dressing, you dont wear a T-cap inside a building. Its rude and makes you look foolish. Its nothing to do with culture. Its just like a person wearing sun glasses at night is deemed to look like an idiot. Or how a person wears a T-Cap over shalwar kameez as it doesnt go well..

The fact that Haris Sohail went to a University wearing a cap inside the building, just shows the lack of education these guys have.
 
Major said:
Wait what?
This has nothing to do with British culture. Its something that is applied overall..

There is no Pakistani culture.

Also, if you talking about Islamic culture, there is a difference between wearing a turban or a scull cap.

A t-cap is something that is part of the western culture aswell, so if we gonna go down that route than lets associate those things properly.

Its a basic rule in dressing, you dont wear a T-cap inside a building. Its rude and makes you look foolish. Its nothing to do with culture. Its just like a person wearing sun glasses at night is deemed to look like an idiot. Or how a person wears a T-Cap over shalwar kameez as it doesnt go well..

The fact that Haris Sohail went to a University wearing a cap inside the building, just shows the lack of education these guys have.
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Covering your head is considered a positive thing in Islamic culture and by extension, in Pakistani culture. The type of hat doesn't matter as much as the act of having your head covered.

You are speaking from a Western/British perspective and even that is changing. Go look at how some of the biggest African American boxers and MMA fighters dress for their interviews.

Babar and the rest of his teammates have no reason to follow the culture and fashion of the West. For them and most Pakistanis, wearing a cap indoors is a non-issue.
 
KingKhanWC said:
Cricketers are there to play cricket, not to become William Shakespeare.

Babar is only a sportsman, yet has better English than Modi who is PM.

Most sports stars social media accounts are run by others, this is common knowledge to most.
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Brother, to be fair, this issue is something that shouldn't be brushed aside.

In Pakistan, the mode of communication at our schools is English. All subjects are taught in English. Only urdu is taught in its own language and in some schools Islamiat is taught in English. While for the rest of the subjects, Maths, Social Sciences, Other sciences the mode of communication is English.

Often we bring the example of Football players but back home those football players language communication at school is in their mother tongue. In Pakistan its not like that.

Thus, a when a state representative fails to speak in English, we Pakistani's know that his lack of education is being exposed. No, usually speaking in English does not have a link with education as even an uneducated person can also speak English, but in Pakistan, the Pakistani people know that because the mode of communication at our schools is English, thus, if a person has studied uptil 12th grade and has done FSC, he should know basic English (accent and dialect doesnt matter).

Babar or any sports man in Pakistan not being able to speak English only exposes are education system.

Now this is the job of the concerning sports body and the parliamentarians that no person should get to represent the state without a 12 years of education. If a bill existed, PCB should had implemented that bill that before a person represents Pakistan u19 they have 10 years of education and any cricketer that is a professional should had 12 years of education. This way the communication issue also gets solved, and these cricketers also learn how to think and conduct themselves in public. Now adays, the cricketers that act as fools on social media are the uneducated lot. Umar Akmal, Younis khan etc. While guys like Misbah and Rashid Latif represent themselves and talk well with others because of their education.

These guys represent the nation and should have basic education atleast.

Modi's English issue is more related to his accent and dialect and not what he says in English. His English is good, he was a teacher in the past aswell. But his accent is what is being judge and to be fair you cant judge a persons accent. Accent and talking in English are two different things.

If we fix the school enrollment problem of Pakistan, trust me, a quatre of our problems get solved through it. Issues related to sectarian violence etc get solved through it.

Thus, till the time we dont have Cricketers with atleast 12 years of education and plus till the time the mode of communication in schools will stay in English, Cricketers that cant speak English will rightly be bashed.

And the solution isn't to change the mode of communication (a big drawback when it comes to research), but to actually increase the enrollment numbers
 
Bilal7 said:
Covering your head is considered a positive thing in Islamic culture and by extension, in Pakistani culture. The type of hat doesn't matter as much as the act of having your head covered.

You are speaking from a Western/British perspective and even that is changing. Go look at how some of the biggest African American boxers and MMA fighters dress for their interviews.

Babar and the rest of his teammates have no reason to follow the culture and fashion of the West. For them and most Pakistanis, wearing a cap indoors is a non-issue.
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no its not. Plz dont make up stuff and add additions to Islam.

Look at Hajj and Umrah, no one wears baseball caps there.

People used to cover their head in the prophets time as it was the Middle east and it was hot, and it was only woren when outdoors. No one wears caps indoors only paindus do.

Its just like sun glasses. You dont wear sun galsses at night.

Babar and Co do need to follow basic etiquettes when representing the nation. They are the nations representative, they need to follow basic etiquettes. Wearing Sun glasses indoors, wearing caps in doors makes them look like idiots and paindus
 
Major said:
no its not. Plz dont make up stuff and add additions to Islam.

Look at Hajj and Umrah, no one wears baseball caps there.

People used to cover their head in the prophets time as it was the Middle east and it was hot, and it was only woren when outdoors. No one wears caps indoors only paindus do.

Its just like sun glasses. You dont wear sun galsses at night.

Babar and Co do need to follow basic etiquettes when representing the nation. They are the nations representative, they need to follow basic etiquettes. Wearing Sun glasses indoors, wearing caps in doors makes them look like idiots and paindus
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I'm not debating fiqh with someone like you. I'm just pointing out the reality. No one cares about taking their hat off in Pakistan, that is a Western concept and only the biggest burgers and wannabe white bois would even adhere to such rules in Pakistan anyways.

Equating a hat to sunglasses is nonsensical because you can't see out of sunglasses at night. A hat is a fashion statement that does not have such negatives.

Babar is representing the nation and acting like most Pakistanis would. Maybe it's you who needs to learn about Pakistani culture.
 
My point is simple

Babar probably wants to express himself but cannot do because English is limited

Why not give him that chance?
 
Its sad to see so many Asians from India and Pakistan have some sort of inferiority complext built within. Im not sure if this is a reu
Major said:
Brother, to be fair, this issue is something that shouldn't be brushed aside.

In Pakistan, the mode of communication at our schools is English. All subjects are taught in English. Only urdu is taught in its own language and in some schools Islamiat is taught in English. While for the rest of the subjects, Maths, Social Sciences, Other sciences the mode of communication is English.

Often we bring the example of Football players but back home those football players language communication at school is in their mother tongue. In Pakistan its not like that.

Thus, a when a state representative fails to speak in English, we Pakistani's know that his lack of education is being exposed. No, usually speaking in English does not have a link with education as even an uneducated person can also speak English, but in Pakistan, the Pakistani people know that because the mode of communication at our schools is English, thus, if a person has studied uptil 12th grade and has done FSC, he should know basic English (accent and dialect doesnt matter).

Babar or any sports man in Pakistan not being able to speak English only exposes are education system.

Now this is the job of the concerning sports body and the parliamentarians that no person should get to represent the state without a 12 years of education. If a bill existed, PCB should had implemented that bill that before a person represents Pakistan u19 they have 10 years of education and any cricketer that is a professional should had 12 years of education. This way the communication issue also gets solved, and these cricketers also learn how to think and conduct themselves in public. Now adays, the cricketers that act as fools on social media are the uneducated lot. Umar Akmal, Younis khan etc. While guys like Misbah and Rashid Latif represent themselves and talk well with others because of their education.

These guys represent the nation and should have basic education atleast.

Modi's English issue is more related to his accent and dialect and not what he says in English. His English is good, he was a teacher in the past aswell. But his accent is what is being judge and to be fair you cant judge a persons accent. Accent and talking in English are two different things.

If we fix the school enrollment problem of Pakistan, trust me, a quatre of our problems get solved through it. Issues related to sectarian violence etc get solved through it.

Thus, till the time we dont have Cricketers with atleast 12 years of education and plus till the time the mode of communication in schools will stay in English, Cricketers that cant speak English will rightly be bashed.

And the solution isn't to change the mode of communication (a big drawback when it comes to research), but to actually increase the enrollment numbers
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Modi cant spell a simple word which 5 years old can here in the UK. The point is he is a statesman, thus its important for him to speak English, Babar is not.

You've wrote some strange comments which honestly come across as inferiority complex. No Pakistani should be ashamed if their cricket captain, football captain or any sporting figure is not fluent in a foreign language inc English. Its not their job to shows Pakistans education or lack of. You have even bought in sectarianism in this debate. lol.

Pak cricket captains job is to win matches for his country, to win tournaments, to lead from the front on the field and be an inspiration off the field to his team.

You seem to be wanting to shift the blame from the crooks who have looted the nation, on to Babar for not speaking fluent English. Please just stop lol.
 
Major said:
Brother, to be fair, this issue is something that shouldn't be brushed aside.

In Pakistan, the mode of communication at our schools is English. All subjects are taught in English. Only urdu is taught in its own language and in some schools Islamiat is taught in English. While for the rest of the subjects, Maths, Social Sciences, Other sciences the mode of communication is English.

Often we bring the example of Football players but back home those football players language communication at school is in their mother tongue. In Pakistan its not like that.

Thus, a when a state representative fails to speak in English, we Pakistani's know that his lack of education is being exposed. No, usually speaking in English does not have a link with education as even an uneducated person can also speak English, but in Pakistan, the Pakistani people know that because the mode of communication at our schools is English, thus, if a person has studied uptil 12th grade and has done FSC, he should know basic English (accent and dialect doesnt matter).

Babar or any sports man in Pakistan not being able to speak English only exposes are education system.

Now this is the job of the concerning sports body and the parliamentarians that no person should get to represent the state without a 12 years of education. If a bill existed, PCB should had implemented that bill that before a person represents Pakistan u19 they have 10 years of education and any cricketer that is a professional should had 12 years of education. This way the communication issue also gets solved, and these cricketers also learn how to think and conduct themselves in public. Now adays, the cricketers that act as fools on social media are the uneducated lot. Umar Akmal, Younis khan etc. While guys like Misbah and Rashid Latif represent themselves and talk well with others because of their education.

These guys represent the nation and should have basic education atleast.

Modi's English issue is more related to his accent and dialect and not what he says in English. His English is good, he was a teacher in the past aswell. But his accent is what is being judge and to be fair you cant judge a persons accent. Accent and talking in English are two different things.

If we fix the school enrollment problem of Pakistan, trust me, a quatre of our problems get solved through it. Issues related to sectarian violence etc get solved through it.

Thus, till the time we dont have Cricketers with atleast 12 years of education and plus till the time the mode of communication in schools will stay in English, Cricketers that cant speak English will rightly be bashed.

And the solution isn't to change the mode of communication (a big drawback when it comes to research), but to actually increase the enrollment numbers
Click to expand...
You are so MISTAKEN if you think that subjects are actually being taught in English and that fluency in English shows you went to school.

Rashid Latif is educated but can't speak a word of English. I was seeing highlights of a match from the 90s between Pakistan and India- India won that match and in the post match interview, Ravi Shastri asks Rashid Latif to share his thoughts as he was captain and Rashid Latif said ' I speak my language yeah' and started conversing in Urdu
Even when PTV had foreign English speaking ex-cricketers on their show, Rashid Latif never spoke a word in English. Not because he loves his national language but because he knows he will embarrass himself if he does.

I really don't know what to say to your suggestion that primary education should be compulsory for cricketer. Even now the talent pool is LIMITED, make it more limited by filtering players like BABAR, NASEEM, SHAHEEN.

They are cricketers. Let them play cricket. Which they are really good at.
If this was not a country full of GORA COMPLEX, no one would even care how they speak.

As long as they are not harassing someone, stalking someone, fixing, killing someone, they are carrying themselves just fine. This doesn't come from education at school BUT through education at home.

Plus some people would still act like idiots even if you give them an education. Knowing how many components air consists of wouldn't really stop sectarian violence or any other evil in the society.
 
Bilal7 said:
I'm not debating fiqh with someone like you. I'm just pointing out the reality. No one cares about taking their hat off in Pakistan, that is a Western concept and only the biggest burgers and wannabe white bois would even adhere to such rules in Pakistan anyways.

Equating a hat to sunglasses is nonsensical because you can't see out of sunglasses at night. A hat is a fashion statement that does not have such negatives.

Babar is representing the nation and acting like most Pakistanis would. Maybe it's you who needs to learn about Pakistani culture.
Click to expand...
this is basic etiquettes, to label basic etiquettes as burger and wannabe white boi that is a typical immature and paindu comment i would expect from someone who is immature.

Our representatives should know basic etiquettes
 
Major said:
you are not even bothering to understand what i am saying. I am trying to be respectful here and if you cant be respectful in a discussion than there is no point than i guess..
Click to expand...

It makes no sense.

You are disrespecting the Pakistani captain, because you feel he has a responsibility to speak English in order to help some Pakistani insecurity, its coming across as some sort of inner colonialism mentally.

Babar is a good role model, a class batsmen, if he wins the World Cup for Pakistan, he could speak gibberish for all I care and almost all Pakistanis will feel the same.

Cricketers have enough pressure esp captains of Pakistan without people attacking them for their language skills.

If we met, I could criticise your English but I wouldn't as its not your first language, same goes for any cricketer from Pakistan;
 
I am more worried about his continuous failures in tournaments as a batsman than his English skills.
 
KingKhanWC said:
Cricketers are there to play cricket, not to become William Shakespeare.

Babar is only a sportsman, yet has better English than Modi who is PM.

Most sports stars social media accounts are run by others, this is common knowledge to most.
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I’m sure the likes of Messi and Neymar don’t run their social media handles themselves but if you check their handles, most of the time (if not always) the language used is Spanish/Portugese.

What is stopping Babar’s social media team from posting in Urdu?

Surely, if Babar is that proud of his mother tongue and culture, why isn’t his team posting in Urdu?
 
Mamoon said:
I’m sure the likes of Messi and Neymar don’t run their social media handles themselves but if you check their handles, most of the time (if not always) the language used is Spanish/Portugese.

What is stopping Babar’s social media team from posting in Urdu?

Surely, if Babar is that proud of his mother tongue and culture, why isn’t his team posting in Urdu?
Click to expand...
He should speak whatever language he feels the most comfortable in. I’d rather get a better interview in Urdu than him not be able to properly convey his thoughts due to speaking English.

Makes no difference. I speak multiple languages - and if I was playing cricket in Pakistan I would probably choose to do interviews in Urdu. If I was playing in an English speaking country, I’d speak English. And if I was in a country that I did not know the primary language of I would speak whatever I am most comfortable with to a translator.
 
160KPH said:
He should speak whatever language he feels the most comfortable in. I’d rather get a better interview in Urdu than him not be able to properly convey his thoughts due to speaking English.

Makes no difference. I speak multiple languages - and if I was playing cricket in Pakistan I would probably choose to do interviews in Urdu. If I was playing in an English speaking country, I’d speak English. And if I was in a country that I did not know the primary language of I would speak whatever I am most comfortable with to a translator.
Click to expand...
When Ravi shastri asked questions during caption meets , shastri used English language for all the caption but he used Hindi for Babar but surprisingly Babar answer in English which was just embarassing . shastri used Hindi just becouse Babar can comfortable.
 
There is no big deal whether he speaks English or not, it's our colonial hangover and inferiority complex. No one bothers if Muller or Messi speaks English in post-match conferences.
 
Devadwal said:
When Ravi shastri asked questions during caption meets , shastri used English language for all the caption but he used Hindi for Babar but surprisingly Babar answer in English which was just embarassing . shastri used Hindi just becouse Babar can comfortable.
Click to expand...
I appreciate that from Ravi. I think it’s okay if Babar wants to work on his English and answer in English but it does not affect the way I view him.
 
Speaking English is not the criteria to be a good player. Babar should focus on his cricket and leave this English speaking hassle. We don't need good English, we need good scores and some technical captaincy. that's all.
 
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