Ben Stokes "Harsha ... bringing culture into peoples opinion over a Mankad?"

[MenInG]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Harsha … bringing culture into peoples opinion over a Mankad? <a href="https://t.co/QNyY8K59kP">https://t.co/QNyY8K59kP</a></p>— Ben Stokes (@benstokes38) <a href="https://twitter.com/benstokes38/status/1576128903806345217?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 1, 2022</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Harsha .. 2019 WC final was over 2 years ago, I still till this day revive countless messages calling me all sorts from Indian fans, does this disturb you? <a href="https://t.co/m3wDGM7eU3">https://t.co/m3wDGM7eU3</a></p>— Ben Stokes (@benstokes38) <a href="https://twitter.com/benstokes38/status/1576129737428062208?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 1, 2022</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Is this a culture thing?? ….absolutely not,I receive messages regarding the overthrows from people all over world,as people all over the world have made comment’s on the Mankad dismissal, not just people who are English <a href="https://t.co/m3wDGMpo8b">https://t.co/m3wDGMpo8b</a></p>— Ben Stokes (@benstokes38) <a href="https://twitter.com/benstokes38/status/1576130596149284867?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 1, 2022</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">What about the rest of the worlds reaction to this particular incident?<br><br>England isn’t the only cricket playing nation who have spoken about the ruling . <a href="https://t.co/DlbqlbhSAT">https://t.co/DlbqlbhSAT</a></p>— Ben Stokes (@benstokes38) <a href="https://twitter.com/benstokes38/status/1576138666220523520?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 1, 2022</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[MenInG]

Ben Stokes should watch out now. IPL contracts etc.

 

[Rana]

Why is this Mankad rule a matter of cricketing world war?

The English lady who was run out thought she was out for a stroll in St John’s wood on her way to Regent’s Park

You can’t be so careless about backing up and then cry about it!

 

[MenInG]

Why is this Mankad rule a matter of cricketing world war?

The English lady who was run out thought she was out for a stroll in St John’s wood on her way to Regent’s Park

You can’t be so careless about backing up and then cry about it!

Think you missed the whole debate.

Lot more to it.

 

[James]

Spot on from Stokes.

Excellent comments.

 

[Kaptan]

Well done Harsha. Spot on.

No one having even an iota of cricket acumen should question Dipti/Ashwin. What they did was legal and morally correct.

Not everyone should agree to obey some old English dudes who jointly decided in the 1800s that they would not run someone out in this manner. especially if it is permitted by law.

 

[BunnyRabbit]

Harsha isn't making any sense in his replies to Stokes. From British colonialistation to throwing vitriol being a cultural thing to you can't move the world at your own pace.

 

[Ab Fan]

There is really no point of taking this debate to wholesome level.

It allows as per the rules. If you want to do, you do. If you don't want to do, you don't.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Let's be quite clear here. The only thing cultural about this issue is that in close encounters India deviusly seek to "mankad" the opposition and cross the line.

Going out of your way to try and manufacture this dismissal is where to me it becomes a bit devious.

India's argument here was that the English player did it over 70 times and they warned her, but it was clear from watching the on field play that it was only when the match got too close for comfort that they sought to win at all costs.

Who knows how many times they have tried this in the past?

There is a video of them trying it against Waqar in a closely fought match in Australia.

Even the commentator remarks " looking for the Mankad but it wasn't on"

https://youtu.be/gc5verJFj_o

Is it a cultural issue for Indians to try and manufacture mankads in tight fought scenarios? I would be interested to see what posters who have played club cricket in India have to say - is it something that is taught/encouraged?

 

[Cricfan4eva]

I think Harsha went a bit too deep there.

I am with him completely on how English media/pundits/cricketers think that what they think is the world wide view. While this was a problem a decade or 2 ago when they also ruled ICC. Now its just few irrelevant people treating their "opinions" as facts.

Harsha is giving them too much importance and honestly folks need to give this topic a rest. If England wanna cry about it till 2030, let them do so. We've moved onto Asia Cup and even won our first game lol.

Also Ben Stokes' insistence like many who are against this, to use the word mankad, when ICC has called it run out... just shows their willful ignorance or rather arrogance of the view they hold on this topic. Once again - just point out, don't care. #KeepWhining

 

[jnaveen1980]

Harsha is dead on. Any other country would not have made a huge deal about this. Nobody remembers Peter Kirsten getting run out this way by Kapil Dev. He gave the warning last match. Peter Kirsten was literally outstanding the crease when Kapil Dev was even before getting near the stumps. If it were an English player all hell will break loose. If you want to get some traction on an issue do it against England.

 

[jnaveen1980]

England decides that format changes. Bring on T20, introduce 100 ball introduce T10. Others merely follow without questioning.

 

[MenInG]

Not sure why Indian player etc make it to some colonial dispute? Its a game of cricket.

 

[NishanKonar]

Sunil Gavaskar correctly said that the Pommies are champion whingers of the world

Just follow the rules. There wud be no problems !

Fist get caught red handed and then try to make it a "spirit of sport " issue

 

[NishanKonar]

Not sure why Indian player etc make it to some colonial dispute? Its a game of cricket.

Indians don't take British snobbery very lightly. Unlike some other nations !

 

[jnaveen1980]

Not sure why Indian player etc make it to some colonial dispute? Its a game of cricket.

It is a legitimate point. Most of the controversial issues get magnified when England is at the receiving end more than any other country. They even threaten people as in this case.


https://www.hindustantimes.com/cric...kad-in-2012-county-match-101621907946025.html

 

[jnaveen1980]

Indians don't take British snobbery very lightly. Unlike some other nations !

What is irking me is they set the Moral standard. I am happy not all English cricketers are like that. First of all, there is no reason to bring morality into the discussion when we talk about a legitimate dismissal that was upheld by the umpire.

 

[pakfan54588]

Would love to see reaction of indian fans when team successful mankind indian player in crunch situation of match .

 

[muqarrab]

Well done Harsha. Spot on.

No one having even an iota of cricket acumen should question Dipti/Ashwin. What they did was legal and morally correct.

Not everyone should agree to obey some old English dudes who jointly decided in the 1800s that they would not run someone out in this manner. especially if it is permitted by law.

There wa sno intention to bowl a legal delivery, don't bring Chanakya on to a cricket field.

 

[Zaz]

What is irking me is they set the Moral standard. I am happy not all English cricketers are like that. First of all, there is no reason to bring morality into the discussion when we talk about a legitimate dismissal that was upheld by the umpire.

There is because the game of cricket isnt just based on black and white rules

It was an elitist sport devised and played by gentlemen of stature in socoety and has unwritten rules re ethics, conduct on the pitch and playing it in the correct spirit

The indians for some reason dont grasp this and think anything goes as per street level

 

[sam_ahm]

Harsha should not have brought culture and country into this, but then again he is a useless commentator and analyst who has no originality. He will only speak good about Indian Cricketers and BCCI, and never has the guts to speak out his mind on anything critical of Indian Cricket Board or players or anyone related to Indian cricket. He is not someone to be taken seriously at all.

PS: On the topic I don't see any problem in Mankading, it is perfectly legal and I stand by deepti and Indian team on this. My views are on Harsha bringing culture into this.

 

[jnaveen1980]

There is because the game of cricket isnt just based on black and white rules

It was an elitist sport devised and played by gentlemen of stature in socoety and has unwritten rules re ethics, conduct on the pitch and playing it in the correct spirit

The indians for some reason dont grasp this and think anything goes as per street level

Not anymore. It has become a highly professional sports. Besides England don't really apply the same yardstick in other type of unfair dismissals or unfair runs, unfair arbitrary rules involving English players. The day an English bowler effecting a run out this way all noise will go away. Hope someone from india put their "morality" to test by standing outside the crease before delivering repeatedly. May be stand at the center of the pitch. What difference it makes if you are a yard outside or 10 yards outside.

 

[JibranAnsari]

Mankading is legal and this should be it.

The non striker leaves the crease early and gives him a lot of margin in tight singles.

Either declare it illegal or take it like a man.

 

[Hextro]

Who knows how many times they have tried this in the past?

There is a video of them trying it against Waqar in a closely fought match in Australia.

Even the commentator remarks " looking for the Mankad but it wasn't on"

https://youtu.be/gc5verJFj_o

Disgusting move by that Indian bowler. You can tell by the bowlers run-up that he never had the intention to bowl the ball, he was looking and waiting for the Mankad even before he started his run-up.

Someone needs to tell these bowlers(who are mostly Indians) that if they can't take the heat they better get out of the kitchen. If your in a pressure situation you need to learn to tough it out like the rest of the bowlers do. Don't resort to underhand tactics.

Mankading requires no skill, even a kindergartener can do it.

 

[Kaptan]

There wa sno intention to bowl a legal delivery, don't bring Chanakya on to a cricket field.

Don't leave the crease below ball is bowled. If you do so, bowler has right to run you out. You don't need to be Chanakya to understand this.

Every other argument is crap.

 

[MP2011]

Only one doing anything illegal that day was that English lady, worse was English captain calling Dipti liar.

What Dipti did was perfectly legal and alright. Don't know why is she being pilloried for doing something perfectly legal!

Even MCC couldn't shut those up who are calling Dipti cheat. If even they couldn't who is Harsha?

 

[MP2011]

Don't leave the crease below ball is bowled. If you do so, bowler has right to run you out.

How difficult is this to understand? Is it rocket science that you can't leave your crease (and gain unfair advantage over bowler)? Its illegal to do so and hence you're liable to be punished (in form of being dismissed) which that English lady did on that day.

Really hilarious to see people calling Dipti cheat and letting that lady go scot free even when she was the one who tried to gain unfair advantage.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Disgusting move by that Indian bowler. You can tell by the bowlers run-up that he never had the intention to bowl the ball, he was looking and waiting for the Mankad even before he started his run-up.

Someone needs to tell these bowlers(who are mostly Indians) that if they can't take the heat they better get out of the kitchen. If your in a pressure situation you need to learn to tough it out like the rest of the bowlers do. Don't resort to underhand tactics.

Mankading requires no skill, even a kindergartener can do it.

Amazing to see Sachin stand and clap it.

But I can guarantee Indians would throw hissy fits if someone attempted to get Sachin out like that.

Deviously attempting Mankad is ingrained into Indian cricketing culture.

 

[MP2011]

Nobody remembers Peter Kirsten getting run out this way by Kapil Dev. He gave the warning last match. Peter Kirsten was literally outstanding the crease when Kapil Dev was even before getting near the stumps. If it were an English player all hell will break loose. If you want to get some traction on an issue do it against England.

Don't know whether you know this or not but Kepler Wessels (then SA captain) hit Kapil on his shin with bat for this reason. Had it been an English player, all hell would have broken lose.

However as we were during early '90s, we meekly let that pass and swept it under the carpet even when SA were newbies in international cricket and they owed that tour to us for bailing them out after they got readmitted into international cricket. Ali Bacher and Clive Llyod were accomplices in that episode.

If anything, we should have made that a big issue for an opposition captain hitting a visiting player intentionally and that too with bat. That was far worse than most other incidents on a cricket field. Predictably, we caved in.

 

[Corridor of Uncertainty]

It appears every issue in India nowadays is about restoring lost pride and getting the respect of a global powerhouse.

Majority of Indians certainly see it that way, even if rest of the world may not have the same position.

Cricket is just seen in this context.

If Mankad had been done by Smith on Hardik, and Indian board had protested, I am pretty sure Indians would have stood in line behind that opinion too. And the tonality of comments reflects 1000s of years of hurt.

Personally I find all this jingoism extremely tedious - from anyone.

This is sport. There is banter and there is vitriol. Nobody except the ultras like the ultras.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

Really disturbing to hear from Stokes that indian fans call him stuff because of those overthrows. India had nothing to do with that final so why are Indian fans still getting triggered over that? Is it because Pandya couldn't achieve what Stokes has achieved in his career so far? Stokes should be careful he is putting his IPL career on line.

 

[shady]

Good on Stokes to call him out for this. It’s bad enough that India is often the only country that employs the mankad, but to act holier than thou about it is really off-putting.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

It appears every issue in India nowadays is about restoring lost pride and getting the respect of a global powerhouse.

Majority of Indians certainly see it that way, even if rest of the world may not have the same position.

Cricket is just seen in this context.

If Mankad had been done by Smith on Hardik, and Indian board had protested, I am pretty sure Indians would have stood in line behind that opinion too. And the tonality of comments reflects 1000s of years of hurt.

Personally I find all this jingoism extremely tedious - from anyone.

This is sport. There is banter and there is vitriol. Nobody except the ultras like the ultras.

Have been saying this from the start. Things and logics would have been a lot different had this happened to an Indian player. I was surprised to read comments from some posters here asking world cricket to bow down to India/BCCI and asking them to either adapt or perish.

These arrogant fans have polluted this great sport. There is no place for bullies in cricket.

 

[Corridor of Uncertainty]

Have been saying this from the start. Things and logics would have been a lot different had this happened to an Indian player. I was surprised to read comments from some posters here asking world cricket to bow down to India/BCCI and asking them to either adapt or perish.

These arrogant fans have polluted this great sport. There is no place for bullies in cricket.

Irony is, India bring so much to cricket. An excellent team in every format, new skills, genuine superstars.

They don't need to do this.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Disgusting move by that Indian bowler. You can tell by the bowlers run-up that he never had the intention to bowl the ball, he was looking and waiting for the Mankad even before he started his run-up.

Someone needs to tell these bowlers(who are mostly Indians) that if they can't take the heat they better get out of the kitchen. If your in a pressure situation you need to learn to tough it out like the rest of the bowlers do. Don't resort to underhand tactics.

Mankading requires no skill, even a kindergartener can do it.

Hold on there lol All the heat is on twitter. Actual heat happened on the ground which England couldn't take. None of the Indian player cared about that. Harmanpreet Kaur fittingly shut that English press guy up. It is just a twitter debate. England is the one who is unable to take the heat here.

 

[jnaveen1980]

It appears every issue in India nowadays is about restoring lost pride and getting the respect of a global powerhouse.

Majority of Indians certainly see it that way, even if rest of the world may not have the same position.

Cricket is just seen in this context.

If Mankad had been done by Smith on Hardik, and Indian board had protested, I am pretty sure Indians would have stood in line behind that opinion too. And the tonality of comments reflects 1000s of years of hurt.

Personally I find all this jingoism extremely tedious - from anyone.

This is sport. There is banter and there is vitriol. Nobody except the ultras like the ultras.

I am okay with Indian player getting run out this way. Legitimate dismissal.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

For once Harsha actually made a very pertinent and insightful point instead of stating the obvious, which he usually does. And all Stokes did was prove his point by jumping on all over it.

Fact of the matter is this, no one has reacted to this entire deal as vociferously as the English players and media. And the reason is fairly simple. They see themselves as the 'custodians of the game', who feel it is their God-given right to tell us what's right and wrong.

If that is really the case, then why don't they direct this same level of anger at the MCC that has upheld this rule for decades instead of making passive-aggressive statements every week to show how morally superior they are: "I would never do something like this to win a match"....yeah well then you're stupid.

Rather than preaching to us, English players should learn to stay in their crease.

The ESPNCricinfo journalist Peter Della Penna recently shared a thread on Twitter where he shared atleast 8-9 photos of Charlie Dean leaving her crease throughout the innings before the ball was even bowled. If anything, she is lucky that she wasn't run-out much earlier.

 

[Ab Fan]

After 2019 WC Final, the Kiwis fans said that the outcome of the match and tournament being decided based on some boundary count rule is rubbish.

Then we had our English fans telling us go and read the rules before you show up for a WC Final game. Maybe they should read the rules themselves before whining on Twitter that they will never do this and that.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

For once Harsha actually made a very pertinent and insightful point instead of stating the obvious, which he usually does. And all Stokes did was prove his point by jumping on all over it.

Fact of the matter is this, no one has reacted to this entire deal as vociferously as the English players and media. And the reason is fairly simple. They see themselves as the 'custodians of the game', who feel it is their God-given right to tell us what's right and wrong.

If that is really the case, then why don't they direct this same level of anger at the MCC that has upheld this rule for decades instead of making passive-aggressive statements every week to show how morally superior they are: "I would never do something like this to win a match"....yeah well then you're stupid.

Rather than preaching to us, English players should learn to stay in their crease.

The ESPNCricinfo journalist Peter Della Penna recently shared a thread on Twitter where he shared atleast 8-9 photos of Charlie Dean leaving her crease throughout the innings before the ball was even bowled. If anything, she is lucky that she wasn't run-out much earlier.

Maybe the reason that nobody has reacted so vociferously as the English media...is because the match was against England??

Quite an obvious point isn't it.

 

[MenInG]

Am guessing will be hearing about this also

"Poor Decision": Yuvraj Singh Lashes Out At Controversial Run-Out Of Pooja Vastrakar In Women's Asia CupDuring India Women's Asia Cup match against Sri Lanka on Saturday, Pooja Vastrakar was adjudged run-out by the third umpire in what was a tight call.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Maybe the reason that nobody has reacted so vociferously as the English media...is because the match was against England??

Quite an obvious point isn't it.

I guess you started watching yesterday and have no knowledge of how the English media reacted when Wasim and Waqar started reverse-swinging the ball and made England's batters look like tail-enders, or the kind of baseless accusations that were floated against Murali's action when he came to England and ran through them by taking 16 wickets in a single test match.

So yeah, I'd say that a bad justification that I am not buying.

 

[Kroll]

Some people have missed the point, Stokes was talking about the culture and colonialism that Bogle started harping on about not as much about the mankad itself. I'm with Stokes on this

 

[Colorblind Genius]

Some people have missed the point, Stokes was talking about the culture and colonialism that Bogle started harping on about not as much about the mankad itself. I'm with Stokes on this

Exactly!
Very, very poor of Bogle.
Ironically enough, he commentates in ENGLISH that's his bread n butter. When will he stop that?

 

[RexRex]

Playing the race/colonialism card is so tacky and cheapens the debate. Harsha Bhogle is just being a thin-skinned phool here.

I remember him complaining about how shabbily he was treated by the stewards at Lords during the mid 90s as a freshie. He has been harbouring a victim complex ever since at the slightest of disagreements involving Brits and cricket.

 

[Officer Barbrady]

Sounds like harsha has also been losing his marbles

 

[jnaveen1980]

Playing the race/colonialism card is so tacky and cheapens the debate. Harsha Bhogle is just being a thin-skinned phool here.

I remember him complaining about how shabbily he was treated by the stewards at Lords during the mid 90s as a freshie. He has been harbouring a victim complex ever since at the slightest of disagreements involving Brits and cricket.

Irony died a thousand times lol

 

[jnaveen1980]

Maybe the reason that nobody has reacted so vociferously as the English media...is because the match was against England??

Quite an obvious point isn't it.

What about Butler run out in the IPL. Butler was representing an IPL side. Not England. Even then they were crying.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

I guess you started watching yesterday and have no knowledge of how the English media reacted when Wasim and Waqar started reverse-swinging the ball and made England's batters look like tail-enders, or the kind of baseless accusations that were floated against Murali's action when he came to England and ran through them by taking 16 wickets in a single test match.

So yeah, I'd say that a bad justification that I am not buying.

You spoke specifically about the mankad situation during the woman LOI.

Now you are widening the net to include the history of the game

I can think of similar incidents to those that you have described when Indian media/board went nuts.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

What about Butler run out in the IPL. Butler was representing an IPL side. Not England. Even then they were crying.

I dont follow IPL enough to know/care.

The fact is that mankading is within the laws of the game and quite legitimate...I support this.

What I am uneasy with is 'manufacturing' a dismissal through mankading.

I feel Deepti Sharma set out to mankad her, and went into her run with the full intention of not bowling the ball...but for running out the English batter.

This method of deliberately setting out on your run up specifically for mankading seems to be uniquely Indian. You can see it in the video I shared in a previous post

And that to me is just not cricket.

 

[jnaveen1980]

I dont follow IPL enough to know/care.

The fact is that mankading is within the laws of the game and quite legitimate...I support this.

What I am uneasy with is 'manufacturing' a dismissal through mankading.

I feel Deepti Sharma set out to mankad her, and went into her run with the full intention of not bowling the ball...but for running out the English batter.

This method of deliberately mankading seems to be uniquely Indian.

Well when you see a player walking out of the crease willy nilly a gazillion times you don't really have to warn her. Second of all what is the perfect way of "running out" a backing up player. You tell me. There is no perfect way. You can do it on the spur of the moment. plan it and do it. No different from sliding the ball deliberately down the leg side on seeing a batsman repeatedly coming down. Was it planned? Heck yea. It was.

 

[Rajdeep]

Ben Stokes is absolutely spot on. Poor stuff from Harsha, as usual.

 

[Suleiman]

Get ICC to change the rules instead of getting hurt at the players. Hate the game, not the player.

 

[Robert]

If Indian players want to live by the Mankad, they can die by it. Just Mankad them back, see how they like it.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

I think Harsha Bhogle still hasn't recovered from that tweet by Amitabh Bachchan few years ago. He is trying too hard to sound patriotic now.

 

[WengerOut]

If you want to uphold the "spirit" of the game, do not be selective about it. Dont wait for the umpire if you nick it. Refuse the overthrow runs if it ricocheted of the bat, Do not put jellies on the pitch while opponents are batting. Stop importing good players from other nations etc etc. If you cannot, then please play by the rules and dont be the judge.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Ben Stokes cannot stomach that Bhogle put out the truth regarding the culture and mentality thing.

English still don't understand, they cannot bully India or Bcci, they will get back everything they throw at us, in the DOUBLE.

 

[MenInG]

Ben Stokes cannot stomach that Bhogle put out the truth regarding the culture and mentality thing.

English still don't understand, they cannot bully India or Bcci, they will get back everything they throw at us, in the DOUBLE.

Is that the normal Indian reply nowadays, threats and all?

 

[James]

English still don't understand, they cannot bully India or Bcci, they will get back everything they throw at us, in the DOUBLE.

What sorts of things are England being threatened with here specifically?

 

[Nikhil_cric]

This outdated colonial sport needs to modernise and modrrnise quickly. The spirit of the game nonsense needs to be binned for good.

Mankading, selectively punishing pitches based on old fashioned ideals is not the way forward. A lot of English/Australian fans may not like it but the sport has to move on

 

[KingOfPakBreakfast]

What sorts of things are England being threatened with here specifically?

Mankading is legal, and hand wringing around the morality of it is tedious. What is more tedious is that most Indian cricket fans have made this a hill they choose to die on. Jingoism is tiring, and you are allowed to have nuanced views that don’t blindly back your comrade. Won’t make you any less saffron.

Also, I care zero about the morality of mankading, but am concerned about the widespread effects of using it. If major matches and big wickets were decided by mankading, it would seriously affect the sport as a spectacle. Which is why we watch sports.

Lastly, the Indians have set a dangerous precedent with this. If India’s big, effective players start getting mankaded in crucial matches, I’d like joshila and the team India super friends to keep that same energy about the rules.

 

[Zaz]

Is that the normal Indian reply nowadays, threats and all?

Seems like it is bully, intimidate and threaten

Just what we've come to expect from new india

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

Ben Stokes cannot stomach that Bhogle put out the truth regarding the culture and mentality thing.

English still don't understand, they cannot bully India or Bcci, they will get back everything they throw at us, in the DOUBLE.

Keep these bhojpuri movies dialogues in your pocket please. No one is trying to bully India/BCCI here. And cricket is still alive because of England.

 

[Golden arm]

Let's be quite clear here. The only thing cultural about this issue is that in close encounters India deviusly seek to "mankad" the opposition and cross the line.

Going out of your way to try and manufacture this dismissal is where to me it becomes a bit devious.

India's argument here was that the English player did it over 70 times and they warned her, but it was clear from watching the on field play that it was only when the match got too close for comfort that they sought to win at all costs.

Who knows how many times they have tried this in the past?

There is a video of them trying it against Waqar in a closely fought match in Australia.

Even the commentator remarks " looking for the Mankad but it wasn't on"

https://youtu.be/gc5verJFj_o

Is it a cultural issue for Indians to try and manufacture mankads in tight fought scenarios? I would be interested to see what posters who have played club cricket in India have to say - is it something that is taught/encouraged?

I think that's where the spirit of game is focused on. Trying to manufacture mankading is really bad.

 

[MenInG]

The running out of Charlie Dean by Deepti Sharma at the non-striker's end during the Lord's ODI last week is still being talked about, and fans and pundits are still debating whether this particular mode of dismissal is in 'spirit of cricket'. Ravichandran Ashwin, who had also run-out Jos Buttler during the 2019 Indian Premier League in the same fashion, on Saturday spoke about the entire incident, saying he sees this particular mode of dismissal as "bowlers revolution".

Speaking on his YouTube channel, Ashwin spoke about the subject matter in detail, and before directly speaking about the incident, the off-spinner said: "In the beginning, the whole world saw it that way. But now, most of them have started realising that the bowlers didn't commit any crime there. Many of them have started asking why you are asking questions to the innocent instead of asking the person who should be guilty. Only a certain section of the people seems to have a problem with this."

"In my opinion, they always play the victim card. But whenever there is something new happening, there will be some resistance to change by a few people and that is understandable," he added.

Further talking about the incident, Ashwin said: "Yes, I am talking about the run-out at the non-striker's end done by Deepti Sharma dismissing Charlie Dean. I have already spoken enough on this subject already. So let me be short and sweet today. Risk vs Reward. Just like how a batter knows when he steps out of the crease against a spinner or a pacer that a wicketkeeper can dismiss them by stumping. Likewise, a non-striker should also know that he can be dismissed run-out legitimately if they keep stepping out of the crease and taking that extra yard."

"We should teach the kids right from when they are young on this. Because in today's world of competitive cricket, I spoke about this during the Ahmedabad Test match when the pitch issue' was brought up on what was a good pitch. I told 'do not control the narratives'. Because a certain section of people consciously chooses to instill in others how they should think about a certain thing. They control their narratives. There are many articles on this exact subject. In fact, I see this as a bowler's revolution," he stated.

After winning the Lord's ODI, Harmanpreet Kaur had backed her player Deepti, saying whatever happened was "within the rules" and she showed great game awareness.

NDTV

 

[Ashmal]

Usual cringe by the BCCI cheerleader Bhogle

 

[Waleed93]

It is unfortunately written in the rules and allowed by the ICC, so can't do much about this.

However, I would love to see the reactions from some keyboard warriors here if Virat, or Sachin in the past got out in this manner.

 

[Kaptan]

I think that's where the spirit of game is focused on. Trying to manufacture mankading is really bad.

How can someone manufacture run out? Can someone manufacture bowled or caught too?

Just stay behind the crease before the ball is delivered. It's probably the easiest way to nullify a mode of dismissal in the game of cricket. Where the runner has full control of the outcome and the bowler can do nothing.

 

[Kaptan]

It is unfortunately written in the rules and allowed by the ICC, so can't do much about this.

However, I would love to see the reactions from some keyboard warriors here if Virat, or Sachin in the past got out in this manner.

If Virat or anyone in the Indian team tries to cheat and gets out in this manner. Most of us will not support him.
Virat may act like a spoiled brat on the pitch, but he is not a cheater.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Is that the normal Indian reply nowadays, threats and all?

Where is the threat? If the english player or their media are going to come at Indians they are going to get it back. They are in no position to bully Indians.

 

[cricketjoshila]

What sorts of things are England being threatened with here specifically?

For starters Bhogle called out the mentality and culture.

So if the English players and media thought they will be bullying Indians, they are wrong.

 

[Zaz]

If Virat or anyone in the Indian team tries to cheat and gets out in this manner. Most of us will not support him.
Virat may act like a spoiled brat on the pitch, but he is not a cheater.

Cheat? Thats a strong accusation

Hundreds on players have overtime left the crease a fraction esrly including many indian players over the years anticipating the ball to be delivered

Are they cheats now Should they have been mankaded?

Its funny how indian fans are quick to defame others but arent ever willing to criticise their own players and board for low behaviour

 

[DeadlyVenom]

What sorts of things are England being threatened with here specifically?

Irate tweets. Comments under cricinfo articles that only a certain demographic finds funny.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

If Virat or anyone in the Indian team tries to cheat and gets out in this manner. Most of us will not support him.
Virat may act like a spoiled brat on the pitch, but he is not a cheater.

Cheat? Have you ever played cricket? Have you never seen any international player including Indians leave the crease like that?

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

For starters Bhogle called out the mentality and culture.

So if the English players and media thought they will be bullying Indians, they are wrong.

Which statement or tweet made you think like that? Where are they bullying?

 

[Waleed93]

If Virat or anyone in the Indian team tries to cheat and gets out in this manner. Most of us will not support him.
Virat may act like a spoiled brat on the pitch, but he is not a cheater.

Virat is definitely not a cheat, but I honestly don't believe most Indian fans will behave and react the same way they are doing right now.

A minority of them like you may call a spade a spade, but most fans, especially the Twitter warriors and some joshila types here will not stop their rona dhona if an Indian batsman gets out in such fashion.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Irate tweets. Comments under cricinfo articles that only a certain demographic finds funny.

Thats why the English captain has come out to comment.

 

[Kaptan]

Cheat? Thats a strong accusation

Hundreds on players have overtime left the crease a fraction esrly including many indian players over the years anticipating the ball to be delivered

Are they cheats now Should they have been mankaded?

Its funny how indian fans are quick to defame others but arent ever willing to criticise their own players and board for low behaviour

Benefit of doubt can be given to the runner when
a) He/she is marginally out and
b) Is not a regular offender

Even if the above two situations are true and the bowler decides to run him out. It should be considered out. This situation is similar to when a fielder appeals for a catch when the ball just touches the ground and the fielder is not sure if he has taken the catch cleanly, you can't really call the fielder a cheater at the same time you will have to follow the rules and give it not out.

But if the runner is leaving the crease intentionally and/or doing it repeatedly, then he/she is a cheater.

 

[muqarrab]

Don't leave the crease below ball is bowled. If you do so, bowler has right to run you out. You don't need to be Chanakya to understand this.

Every other argument is crap.

Again, there was no intention to bowl, it was distasteful and straight up cheating.

 

[JaDed]

Would love to see reaction of indian fans when team successful mankind indian player in crunch situation of match .

What would be our reaction? It’s literally based on our player’s name, I keep seeing this as a statement from Pak fans but what are you talking about?

Mankading happens even in IPL..

 

[cricketjoshila]

Just so that posters know, according to rules its Run out.