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Ben Stokes the 'all-rounder'

He's an all-rounder so his competion will be other all-rounders. Mamoon being a mamoon as usual. Every single expert has testified about Moeen's quality yet some kid behind his compueter screen will keep calling him mediocre because he has a beard and some unfortunate soul had the audacity to call him a better cricket than Mamoon's man-crush, Hafeez.
 
The all-rounder role has been forced onto him because England are desperate for a half decent spinner. Someone like James Taylor is x2 the batsman he is and England are well stocked in the pace department so a spin bowling all-rounder fits the bill.

I don't have a crush on Hafeez. He's a good cricketer and that's it. Nothing more nothing less.

However, rating Moeen above him is quite a laughable notion and a product of the beard and the bhai business.
 
Mamoon said:
The all-rounder role has been forced onto him because England are desperate for a half decent spinner. Someone like James Taylor is x2 the batsman he is and England are well stocked in the pace department so a spin bowling all-rounder fits the bill.

I don't have a crush on Hafeez. He's a good cricketer and that's it. Nothing more nothing less.

However, rating Moeen above him is quite a laughable notion and a product of the beard and the bhai business.
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You have admitted that he's your favourite player in a very girly manner so no hiding from this one. I will take this time to say that you have some very mediocre cricketers as your favs. :yk

He was an all-rounders for Worcs before he came up to the first team so it wasn't forced. Moeen's spin is better than Ben's pace bowling so even if England get Monty back into the team, Ali will always be preferred over Stokes.
 
Hafeez is my favorite cricketer in the team today because of his overall contribution. How does that make him a crush of mine? Don't put words in my mouth because your infatuation with :amla bhai and Moeen bhai is Bullet Drive level and we know his relationship with Umar Akmal.

Only a better spinner will usurp Moeen bhai. Monty is good but has terrible attitude so there is no way back for him.
 
Mamoon said:
Hafeez is my favorite cricketer in the team today because of his overall contribution. How does that make him a crush of mine? Don't put words in my mouth because your infatuation with :amla bhai and Moeen bhai is Bullet Drive level and we know his relationship with Umar Akmal.

Only a better spinner will usurp Moeen bhai. Monty is good but has terrible attitude so there is no way back for him.
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No its not, like I already mentioned. Its your love of Hafeez that is reaching BD levels since he's at best, a decent cricket but you make him out to be a great one. My favourites like Ajmal, Amla and Misbah don't need any help from me to make their class known.

He's an all-rounder, only a better all-rounder will be preferred over him (If England don't want two all-rounders in the team). Tredwell can easily replace a pacer in the subcon.
 
Hafeez is a better ODI/T20 cricketer than Misbah. Your obsession with the distinctly average Misbah is unhealthy. Refuting generically with a bland no doesn't change why I rate Hafeez. It's not a man-crush but you clearly seem to have a thing for beards. :amla

You call Hafeez mediocre but then proceed to call Moeen bhai a world class all-rounder and then you further proceed to say it's not about the beard. :sohail
 
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Misbah is not average and is a better batsman than Hafeez and overall, a better player. I didn't rate Pathan and will pick Younis over Inzi and Yousuf anyday so a bland "no" was a fitting reply to your accusation.

Talk about putting words in mouths, when did I call Moeen a world-class allrounder? I just said that I won't comapre him with Hafeez since one has played a lot more cricket than him but you still blatantly lie or reply without thinking.

Mamoon being a mamoon.
 
Both Moeen Ali and Ben Stokes have to play as all rounders and share the 5th bowler 10 overs + some overs that the 4 front line bowlers will not bowl because of phainty. So I don't know what you guys are on?

I am a big Stokes fan, but I have to admit that so far his ODI bowling is not up to standards. He will not be able to bowl full 10 overs so far.

Well Mamoon, if you really think that Hafeeez is a good cricketer then it's high time for you to change sport. Moeen Ali, Stokes are all better cricketers than useless Hafeez.
Hafeez is at best Yardy's level.
 
Pardon, you called him a genuine all-rounder. Unnecessary rephrasing on my part. :usman

Misbah is a highly overrated batsman and Hafeez has much greater contribution in ODIs. There is no doubt who brings more value to the team.
 
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Mobashir said:
Both Moeen Ali and Ben Stokes have to play as all rounders and share the 5th bowler 10 overs + some overs that the 4 front line bowlers will not bowl because of phainty. So I don't know what you guys are on?

I am a big Stokes fan, but I have to admit that so far his ODI bowling is not up to standards. He will not be able to bowl full 10 overs so far.

Well Mamoon, if you really think that Hafeeez is a good cricketer then it's high time for you to change sport. Moeen Ali, Stokes are all better cricketers than useless Hafeez.
Hafeez is at best Yardy's level.
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I don't rate Hafeez in Tests at all but in ODIs, he's very useful and important part of the team. The most economical bowler around and our best FTB.

I rate Stokes very much and he will (potentially) be far better than Hafeez and Moeen bhai who is Hafeez level IMO. Not good enough with bat and ball for Tests but can be good in ODIs and T20s.
 
Ali and Stokes are far too young in their cricket careers to compare them with a veteran like Hafeez. Also, Ali is a frontline bowler for England, only Anderson and Broad are better bowlers than him at the moment. The other youngsters are either inferior or on-par with him.
 
Mamoon said:
Pardon, you called him a genuine all-rounder. Unnecessary rephrasing on my part. :usman

Misbah is a highly overrated batsman and Hafeez's has much greater contribution in ODIs. There is no doubt who brings more value to the team.
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Its okay. :)

Misbah > Hafeez. I dare you to try and spin this in any way which will change the statement that Misbah is a better cricketer than Hafeez.

I advise you wait until Hafeez isn't kept out of the team by Manzoor (lol) and Shehzad, who has been criticized in a nasty way by you.
 
Stokes, Hafeez, Amin, Bell and Anderson make for a very low-class fav five.
 
Better cricketer is debatable because Misbah is clearly better in Tests but I was talking about ODIs only and I don't see how Misbah is a better ODI cricketer than Hafeez.

Shehzad and Manzoor are not Test class like Hafeez and I won't be surprised at all if Hafeez returns to the team especially with Rehman looking past it. If Ajmal gets banned, Hafeez will be a lock in which is quite unfortunate. Would weaken the batting and bowling simultaneously.
 
That's not the fav 5. In fact I really don't have a nailed list.

Amin is one of my favorite upcoming Pakistani batsman along with Haris Sohail, Babar Azam, Umar Akmal and Sohaib Maqsood. Nothing more nothing less.
 
Complete all round performance by Ben Stokes in this series.

Four match, away test series in South Africa and he is the man of the series.
Was very good with the bat and also took some very important wickets.

I think he is the most valuable Test cricketer at the moment in the world.
 
Mamoon said:
That's not the fav 5. In fact I really don't have a nailed list.

Amin is one of my favorite upcoming Pakistani batsman along with Haris Sohail, Babar Azam, Umar Akmal and Sohaib Maqsood. Nothing more nothing less.
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First time I see this post. Amin, Sohail, Azam and Akmal are also the 4 I want in the team.
 
Mobashir said:
Complete all round performance by Ben Stokes in this series.

Four match, away test series in South Africa and he is the man of the series.
Was very good with the bat and also took some very important wickets.

I think he is the most valuable Test cricketer at the moment in the world.
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Some awful posts in this thread, Stokes is easily the best all-rounder in the world, I think only a matter of time before he peaks in all three formats. Could be a devastating player in the next few years.

Mitch Marsh is very good, can give him good competition.

Pakistan badly needs an impact all-rounder like them. Enough of pretenders like Anwar, Imad, Yamin, Bhatti etc.
 
Mobashir said:
First time I see this post. Amin, Sohail, Azam and Akmal are also the 4 I want in the team.
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Maqsood is out of my list now, he's going nowhere.

Rest of the list is the same, but Umar Akmal needs to play F/C cricket now because he there is no room for him in ODIs at the moment and Rizwan has emerged as well.

Haris (hope to see him fit soon), Babar and Amin should form the core of our batting in ODIs, but a lack of genuine all-rounder will hurt us.
 
Ben Stokes is the definition of seam up Allrounder for fans/supporters of
Anwar Ali/Hammad Azam/Sohail Tanveer & Bilawal Bhatti.
 
TalentSpotterPk said:
Ben Stokes is the definition of seam up Allrounder for fans/supporters of
Anwar Ali/Hammad Azam/Sohail Tanveer & Bilawal Bhatti.
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None of them have half of his ability with the bat though, so it is an unfair comparison.
 
Rizwan's ship is sinking very fast unless he resurrects it in next two odi's otherwise sword of getting dropped is hanging on his neck.

If Rizwan doesn't score in next two games than he along with Sohaib will definitely be dropped for Pakistan Odi squad to England with Umar Akmal making a comeback if he scores 2,3 fifties in PSL and with a comeback of fawad alam or any newbie from domestic cricket.

Personally don't want to lose Rizwan the brilliant athlete and fielder but I am afraid if your captain isn't Afridi and you aren't his top 2 buddies than nothing can stop you from getting dropped if you are a youngster and haven't scored runs in last 3 odi series. So this series will be his last if he doesn't score.
 
Mamoon said:
None of them have half of his ability with the bat though, so it is an unfair comparison.
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None of them have even half the ability of Ben stokes as a bowler aswell. Hence if our Barometer for seam up Allrounder is Ben Stokes (which should be) than none of these 4 can be considered as an Allrounder in international cricket.
 
TalentSpotterPk said:
None of them have even half the ability of Ben stokes as a bowler aswell. Hence if our Barometer for seam up Allrounder is Ben Stokes (which should be) than none of these 4 can be considered as an Allrounder in international cricket.
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That is indeed a problem. As I mentioned in my previous posts, lack of proper all-rounder seam or spin (Imad is a pretender too) is going to hurt us very badly.

Yes Hafeez was a chucker but he did bring great balance to the team. All-rounders are huge assets and we are lagging behind other teams in this department as well. So much for the 'we are the most talented nation' nonsense.
 
Mamoon said:
Some awful posts in this thread, Stokes is easily the best all-rounder in the world, I think only a matter of time before he peaks in all three formats. Could be a devastating player in the next few years.

Mitch Marsh is very good, can give him good competition.

Pakistan badly needs an impact all-rounder like them. Enough of pretenders like Anwar, Imad, Yamin, Bhatti etc.
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As a batsman, Marsh is more solid. That I gives it to him. But has the Strike Rotation problems like Abdul Razaaq. And you need those shots even in Test cricket to succeed.

As a Test bowler, Stokes is way ahead of Marsh as he is a better wicket taker.

Not saying that Marsh is bad, he is also very good but Stokes is ahead.

The day England decided to not take Stokes and KP at the 15 world cup, they lost it. It could have been an entierely different story with these two in it.
 
Mobashir said:
As a batsman, Marsh is more solid. That I gives it to him. But has the Strike Rotation problems like Abdul Razaaq. And you need those shots even in Test cricket to succeed.

As a Test bowler, Stokes is way ahead of Marsh as he is a better wicket taker.

Not saying that Marsh is bad, he is also very good but Stokes is ahead.

The day England decided to not take Stokes and KP at the 15 world cup, they lost it. It could have been an entierely different story with these two in it.
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Not a very good analogy perhaps but Marsh and Stokes are like Mahmood and Razzaq.

Mahmood had the ability and technique with the bat to be a top 5 batsman in Test cricket and was certainly more solid, but he could not match the explosiveness of Razzaq and his ability to turn the match in a session.

Marsh and Stokes are similar. The former has better technique and is a more accomplished batsman, but the latter is more devastating.

Overall, I'll take Stokes too.
 
Very good series for Stokes. Just needs to iron out how he wants to bat and if being aggressive is always the right thing to be when your team is in trouble. At times it is and the opposition is on the back foot, but at other times he gets out when he really shouldn't. He's still young though but his batting has been very enjoyable.
 
Great series for him, match-winning performances and ends with a batting average over 50 and a bowling average under 30. He does tend to be inconsistent so hopefully he won't perform against Pakistan. :amir
 
What a game-changing player he has developed into.

Some terrible posts by New Zealand posters in this thread by the way, rating the likes of Neesham and Corey Anderson above him and calling Stokes a nothing cricketer. :yk2

This thread was always destined to go wrong in the long run. Always.

Ashwin statistically might be the best all-rounder in Tests but I would put Stokes ahead of him because he is way more impactful with the bat.

I hope that Australia persist with Mitch Marsh because although he is not as good as Stokes, he's a better player than what he has shown so far and Australia are unlikely to produce a more promising all-rounder for some time.

Players like Stokes and Marsh can lead the revival of all-rounders in Test cricket. Hope we can find our own version soon.
 
Lots of humble pie should now be force-fed down many throats as a result of this thread.

England's MVP quite comfortably at the moment.
 
shaz619 said:
I'd say its between Shakib, Moeen and Stokes. Shakib is still probably no.1 given his consistency over a long period
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Shakib's batting has gone down in Test cricket, Stokes is better than Shakib in Test & T20, he is the firestarter. Stokes provides more entertainment in T20s and Test. He has the mean look, Tats, aggressiveness and he can sledge anyone and makes them feel lonely in the cricket pitch :(
 
Mamoon said:
The all-rounder role has been forced onto him because England are desperate for a half decent spinner. Someone like James Taylor is x2 the batsman he is and England are well stocked in the pace department so a spin bowling all-rounder fits the bill.

I don't have a crush on Hafeez. He's a good cricketer and that's it. Nothing more nothing less.

However, rating Moeen above him is quite a laughable notion and a product of the beard and the bhai business.
Click to expand...

Still think Hafeez > Moeen
 
Very talented player, still more to come from him I feel. But much improved in the last 1 year or so. Certainly the best all rounder in the world.
 
Quality player across all formats of the game..

England must be pleased to have him..
 
World class allrounder.

All formats combined I would put Stokes 2nd, just behind Shakib. Shakib has been consistent for the last 8 years or so. Averages 39 in tests with bat, 32 with ball with 5ers against every team he played. 35 in ODIs with bat, 28 with ball. 25 with bat in T20Is and 19 with ball.

Stokes has the ability to overtake Shakib with time. Has age on his side as well. It needs to be see how consistent he will be over the years
 
Ashraful_Rox said:
Shakib's batting has gone down in Test cricket, Stokes is better than Shakib in Test & T20, he is the firestarter. Stokes provides more entertainment in T20s and Test. He has the mean look, Tats, aggressiveness and he can sledge anyone and makes them feel lonely in the cricket pitch :(
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He has been consistent over a bigger sample :mv Stokes got a long way to go before catching up to shakib, his verbal skills are world class though and better than Mo/Shakib who are a little SAWWFT in comparison
 
Executioner said:
World class allrounder.

All formats combined I would put Stokes 2nd, just behind Shakib. Shakib has been consistent for the last 8 years or so. Averages 39 in tests with bat, 32 with ball with 5ers against every team he played. 35 in ODIs with bat, 28 with ball. 25 with bat in T20Is and 19 with ball.

Stokes has the ability to overtake Shakib with time. Has age on his side as well. It needs to be see how consistent he will be over the years
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You only mentioned Shakif after seeing that I called him the no.1 first either that or you're just a biased BD fan, but we should look to my posts as the gospel truth as the neutural and most objective poster on PP
 
Executioner said:
World class allrounder.

All formats combined I would put Stokes 2nd, just behind Shakib. Shakib has been consistent for the last 8 years or so. Averages 39 in tests with bat, 32 with ball with 5ers against every team he played. 35 in ODIs with bat, 28 with ball. 25 with bat in T20Is and 19 with ball.

Stokes has the ability to overtake Shakib with time. Has age on his side as well. It needs to be see how consistent he will be over the years
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Sakhib is good but stokes is much more impactful. There is no way Sakhib is making that 258 that Stokes did vs South Africa.
 
Never thought I'd see the day Stokes become a world-class allrounder. A rare breed in cricket and we should be very thankful to have them here.
 
Saurav said:
Still think Hafeez > Moeen
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Moeen is better at the moment but he has to keep this up. Hafeez himself has gone through various purple patches in his career with the bat, but consistency is the key.

Moeen has to do a lot more to be considered on par with someone like Stokes, because he has failed with both bat and ball quite consistently and spectacularly.

Other than the string of ducks following his hundred in Australia, Stokes has been quite consistent. Moeen has only shown consistency in the last 4-5 matches.

Hafeez though is not really an all-rounder anymore, but if he passes his bowling test and occupies the all-rounder in the middle-order, there is no reason why he can't be better than Moeen again.

That however is unlikely to happen. Once a chucker, always a chucker.
 
Mamoon said:
Moeen is better at the moment but he has to keep this up. Hafeez himself has gone through various purple patches in his career with the bat, but consistency is the key.

Moeen has to do a lot more to be considered on par with someone like Stokes, because he has failed with both bat and ball quite consistently and spectacularly.

Other than the string of ducks following his hundred in Australia, Stokes has been quite consistent. Moeen has only shown consistency in the last 4-5 matches.

Hafeez though is not really an all-rounder anymore, but if he passes his bowling test and occupies the all-rounder in the middle-order, there is no reason why he can't be better than Moeen again.

That however is unlikely to happen. Once a chucker, always a chucker.
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Hafeez is done for international cricket.
 
Hasan123 said:
Sakhib is good but stokes is much more impactful. There is no way Sakhib is making that 258 that Stokes did vs South Africa.
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With bat - yes. Shakib is not a world class batsman. He can play some clutch knocks but struggles against moving ball or vs offies on a square turner. Shakib's true strength is superb RBW. With ball in hand Shakib is probably among the top 3 spinners who bowls in all formats(Neck and neck with Ashwin) currently

Must also be added that Stokes is going through a purple patch while Shakib isn't. Stats will tell you Shakib has better performance in both disciplines in all 3 formats though Stokes is much better than what his stats suggest in terms of bowling.

However, a Bangladeshi like myself would kill for a pace bowling allrounder like Ben Stokes. Has to do with that we don't have half decent pace-bowling allrounder let alone a quality one
 
shaz619 said:
I'd say its between Shakib, Moeen and Stokes. Shakib is still probably no.1 given his consistency over a long period
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Great thing about Stokes is that he's improved a lot in recent times and he's constantly improving. Has a much higher ceiling than these two. Won't be long before his batting average goes above 40.
 
shaz619 said:
Flintoff is my favourite so hopefully he doen't get better then him :yk Stokes can't possibly have a series of the magnitude Flintoff did vs AUS in 2005 :afridi
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I think Stokes is already a better batsman then Flintoff ever was. As catchers, about the same I think. Fintoff had that three-year purple patch when he got 'contrast swing' at high speed, but otherwise was a stock bowler who only got three fivefers. I thinik Stokes will end up with more matchwinning bowling spells.
 
Executioner said:
With bat - yes. Shakib is not a world class batsman. He can play some clutch knocks but struggles against moving ball or vs offies on a square turner. Shakib's true strength is superb RBW. With ball in hand Shakib is probably among the top 3 spinners who bowls in all formats(Neck and neck with Ashwin) currently

Must also be added that Stokes is going through a purple patch while Shakib isn't. Stats will tell you Shakib has better performance in both disciplines in all 3 formats though Stokes is much better than what his stats suggest in terms of bowling.

However, a Bangladeshi like myself would kill for a pace bowling allrounder like Ben Stokes. Has to do with that we don't have half decent pace-bowling allrounder let alone a quality one
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Shakib has good stats no doubt but Stokes is impact is much more felt. I don't remember loads of times Sakhib played fantastic knocks or bowled brilliant spells. No doubt he is underated but he's just not as impactful as stokes imo.

Yes Bangladesh could do with a stokes type all rounder it could move them to a different place in test cricket
 
Hasan123 said:
Shakib has good stats no doubt but Stokes is impact is much more felt. I don't remember loads of times Sakhib played fantastic knocks or bowled brilliant spells. No doubt he is underated but he's just not as impactful as stokes imo.

Yes Bangladesh could do with a stokes type all rounder it could move them to a different place in test cricket
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Shakib is impactful with ball, Stokes with bat. However Shakib has played several impactful knocks with bat but you can expect Stokes to do it with frequently

Shakib is a world class bowler. Decent batsman

Stokes is a world class batsman. Decent bowler.
 
Stokes seems like a batting all-rounder to me. His batting is already better than Flintoff's. However, he is just an average bowler.

England are lucky to have Stokes, Ali, and Bairstow in the late middle order.
 
C Morris is only capable competition to Stokes as far as fast bowling all rounder is concerned.
 
Stokes batting has audacity but not much impact.. Has failed to deliver when mattered.

Has been a good fifth test bowler
 
I don't like him as a person , shows hie emotions far too much.But he is impactful with bat and ball. This thread was always going to serve humble pie, even when he was going through a poor patch I felt he would turn it around.
 
He is not impactful with the bat at all in test match cricket. I did a deep dive on his stats just a month back.

All his runs come on flat non-result pitches.
 
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