Best ODI number 3 in history?

[Rana]

General discussion forum. I think without a doubt Babar is Pakistan’s best ODI number 3. Brilliant player and well done for achieving 5k ODI runs the quickest ever.

Overall, my number 1 ODI number 3 was Ricky Ponting. The guy was an absolute class act and a monster player of both pace and spin. Surreal fitness and game awareness. I rate him higher than Kohli personally, who I think is India’s GOAT ODI number 3 and no.2 from what I have seen in cricket.

From what I recall. Lara was batting mainly at number 4 for West Indies but I believe he has played a substantial amount of games for them at number 3 too. High quality player but I don’t think I would rate him higher than Ponting and Kohli.

The Ponting era was pretty much dominated by the brilliant teams of Australia and South Africa, for that matter I think Kallis deserves a special mention as he was the perfect number 3 batsman for them in this Era. He was definitely Ponting’s nemesis for this position in order to establish dominance in world cricket.

I would rate them in this order,

1. Ricky Ponting
2. Virat Kohli
3. Jacque Kallis
4. Brian Lara
5. Kumar Sangakara
6. Joe Root
7. Babar Azam
8. Kane Williamson
9. Steven Smith
10. Rahul Dravid

Thoughts?
[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] [MENTION=53290]Markhor[/MENTION] [MENTION=130037]Titan[/MENTION] [MENTION=147314]topspin[/MENTION] [MENTION=143714]Kroll[/MENTION] [MENTION=56933]ElRaja[/MENTION]

 

[topspin]

Great list. I think one could argue either way on Ponting vs Kohli.

I would add Viv Richards in the list as well. His stats at number 3 (and overall in ODIs) in a less batting friendly era were beyond exceptional. He was way ahead of everyone else during his time, which featured some high quality express bowlers.

Honourable mention: Zaheer Abbas, who was a fine ODI batsman. Averaged 45 at a strike rate of 85 in the similar era to Viv.

The four greatest ODI batsmen in the world are Viv, Kohli, Ponting and Tendulkar.

 

[moghul]

1- Viv Richard
2-Potings

Other were not that good or didn't play at # 3 consistently enough like Lara and Sangacara and Kallis . Babar, not even close to be in that list. What Rahul Dravid is doing in this list ???? Was a great test batter, not in ODI,s could not even make to India's playing 11.

 

[Rana]

1- Viv Richard
2-Potings

Other were not that good or didn't play at # 3 consistently enough like Lara and Sangacara and Kallis . Babar, not even close to be in that list. What Rahul Dravid is doing in this list ???? Was a great test batter, not in ODI,s could not even make to India's playing 11.

Dravid has 10k ODI runs at an average close to 40. He played most of his games at number 3 for them. He was a solid batsman. This is just my opinion, you could argue that he shouldn’t be there tbf

 

[Mamoon]

Kohli for sure.

What sets him apart is that he is the only number three/top order batsman in ODI history who is also a great finisher.

He is Ponting + Bevan and Tendulkar + Dhoni rolled into one. No ODI top order batsman has shaped so many wins with his batting and been there until the end to see off the game.

 

[Rana]

Great list. I think one could argue either way on Ponting vs Kohli.

I would add Viv Richards in the list as well. His stats at number 3 (and overall in ODIs) in a less batting friendly era were beyond exceptional. He was way ahead of everyone else during his time, which featured some high quality express bowlers.

Honourable mention: Zaheer Abbas, who was a fine ODI batsman. Averaged 45 at a strike rate of 85 in the similar era to Viv.

The four greatest ODI batsmen in the world are Viv, Kohli, Ponting and Tendulkar.

Tbh bro I’ve never seen Viv, Miandad and Zaheer…plus Border, Gooch, Crowe bat live so I can’t truly argue that they are better than what I have seen in terms of Ponting, Kallis, Lara and Kohli.

Those who have seen them play live can give you a better judgement. I don’t think referencing stats will do the job here.

However, from what I’ve read and heard, Viv was indeed the ultimate batsman of his era

 

[Kroll]

One and two are solid, I might just err on the side of Kohli who has the special distinction of greatest ODI chaser.

 

[Hitman]

Between Viv and Kohli.

 

[topspin]

Tbh bro I’ve never seen Viv, Miandad and Zaheer…plus Border, Gooch, Crowe bat live so I can’t truly argue that they are better than what I have seen in terms of Ponting, Kallis, Lara and Kohli.

Those who have seen them play live can give you a better judgement. I don’t think referencing stats will do the job here.

However, from what I’ve read and heard, Viv was indeed the ultimate batsman of his era

I have a lot of respect for this type of judgement because what ends up happening is some misinformed ignoramus will end up saying so and so from an era of lower standard (for example 1930s) is better "because they have better average". I'm refraining from disclosing any real life examples because I know this thread will end up getting derailed from the old era hype brigade.

The Misbah vs Inzamam should also serve a lesson that you don't just look at stats at face value. Honestly I thought I heard it all

 

[Justcrazy]

If Viv is in the list , there can be no question.

 

[ElRaja]

General discussion forum. I think without a doubt Babar is Pakistan’s best ODI number 3. Brilliant player and well done for achieving 5k ODI runs the quickest ever.

Overall, my number 1 ODI number 3 was Ricky Ponting. The guy was an absolute class act and a monster player of both pace and spin. Surreal fitness and game awareness. I rate him higher than Kohli personally, who I think is India’s GOAT ODI number 3 and no.2 from what I have seen in cricket.

From what I recall. Lara was batting mainly at number 4 for West Indies but I believe he has played a substantial amount of games for them at number 3 too. High quality player but I don’t think I would rate him higher than Ponting and Kohli.

The Ponting era was pretty much dominated by the brilliant teams of Australia and South Africa, for that matter I think Kallis deserves a special mention as he was the perfect number 3 batsman for them in this Era. He was definitely Ponting’s nemesis for this position in order to establish dominance in world cricket.

I would rate them in this order,

1. Ricky Ponting
2. Virat Kohli
3. Jacque Kallis
4. Brian Lara
5. Kumar Sangakara
6. Joe Root
7. Babar Azam
8. Kane Williamson
9. Steven Smith
10. Rahul Dravid

Thoughts?

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] [MENTION=53290]Markhor[/MENTION] [MENTION=130037]Titan[/MENTION] [MENTION=147314]topspin[/MENTION] [MENTION=143714]Kroll[/MENTION] [MENTION=56933]ElRaja[/MENTION]

the majority of modern ODIs are not pressure games, and in the last few years, rarely feature the best xi outside of ICC comps.

my top 3
viv
kohli
ponting

i say this because kohli and viv had this destructive side to their game which left opposition in tatters mentally, viv pips it because he has a hundred in an odi wc final. punter has massive accolades and a very long career.

babar simply doesn't have the sample size, however, hes on the right track and he can overcome that if he plays a pivotal role in the upcoming world cup. if he can guide pak to a win with a meaningful WC, like 500 runs id say hed be be very firmly on his way to ending his career as one of the top 3 of all time.

 

[Rana]

One thing about Lara was,

The guy fired about the crowed whenever he was on song and on a mission to bat for his team. I don’t think I’ve seen a player fire up the crowed like he used to when he played his best shots. Absolute Stone Cold Steve Austin level pops! Goosebumps

 

[Markhor]

I would pick Kohli.

Viv was more a #4 batsman.

 

[jeetu]

Min 2000 runs at no.3 batting position

Player	Span	Mat	Runs	Avg	SR	100
Babar Azam	2016-2023	81	4547	64.95	89.59	18
V Kohli	2009-2023	212	10777	60.2	94.7	39
IVA Richards	1976-1986	52	2418	57.57	86.88	5
F du Plessis	2012-2019	82	3941	55.5	88.34	11
SPD Smith	2014-2023	80	3765	54.56	86.71	11
JE Root	2013-2022	93	3971	54.39	89.57	11
Mohammad Yousuf	2000-2010	45	2042	53.73	79.05	5
KS Williamson	2010-2023	129	5802	50.89	81.38	11
IJL Trott	2009-2013	63	2585	49.71	77.97	4
BC Lara	1992-2007	109	4447	45.84	85.98	12
JH Kallis	1997-2014	204	7774	45.72	73.74	13
Zaheer Abbas	1974-1985	48	2009	45.65	85.74	6
KC Sangakkara	2001-2015	243	9747	44.71	80.5	18
GA Hick	1991-2001	58	2182	44.53	75.26	5
DM Jones	1985-1994	132	5100	43.58	72.07	7
RT Ponting	1995-2012	335	12662	42.48	80.73	29
Mohammad Hafeez	2005-2017	56	2051	41.02	82.1	7
Inzamam-ul-Haq	1991-2003	61	2033	39.09	68.54	2
R Dravid	1996-2011	112	4000	38.83	69.6	7
MS Atapattu	1996-2007	122	4142	38.35	66.33	4
Rahmat Shah	2014-2022	74	2635	37.11	70.19	4
M Azharuddin	1985-2000	68	2036	36.35	68.18	2
RB Richardson	1983-1995	131	3984	35.25	64.89	4
RR Sarwan	2001-2013	86	2531	35.15	70.58	0
SP Fleming	1995-2007	69	2118	34.16	68.87	0
Ijaz Ahmed	1987-2000	74	2144	31.52	78.44	6
AP Gurusinha	1986-1996	111	3282	30.96	60.26	1
Younis Khan	2000-2015	125	3526	30.13	72.47	6

Min 500 runs at no.3 batting position in World Cup

Player	Span	Mat	Runs	Avg	SR	100
Shakib Al Hasan (BAN)	2019-2019	8	606	86.57	96.03	2
IVA Richards (WI)	1979-1983	11	584	83.42	78.38	2
SPD Smith (AUS)	2015-2019	8	557	79.57	89.69	1
KC Sangakkara (SL)	2003-2015	23	1174	73.37	89.14	5
F du Plessis (SA)	2015-2019	13	762	69.27	87.88	2
KS Williamson (NZ)	2015-2019	19	812	58	75.81	2
V Kohli (IND)	2011-2019	18	807	53.8	87.62	1
JH Kallis (SA)	1999-2011	17	691	53.15	80.25	1
RT Ponting (AUS)	1996-2011	42	1723	46.56	79.73	5
BC Lara (WI)	1996-2007	13	535	44.58	92.4	2

 

[JibranAnsari]

I dont think any batsman can rival virak kohli in ODIs , the king of chases.

 

[Titan24]

Solid list.

It has to be Virat Kohli. Extraordinary consistency along with the ability to perform under pressure even in big chases sets him apart. His mental strength, ability to shift gears as per the requirements and intentionally increasing his shot range as the game demands while piercing the gaps has been just exceptional to say the least.
In 9 knockout matches as of 2021 where Kohli scored 20+ India won 6 out of them and in 6 where he scored less than 20 India was able to win just 2. His presence and demeaner at a crease keeps the opposition on the backfoot as they know he can change the game and momentum any time. There have been many quality players but, he is one of a kind.

As a Pak fan have to talk about Babar. Babar Azman in my opinion is really good as well as it stands but, as his career progresses further he needs to produce more knocks in big tournaments, matches and deciders where he changes the games. Its not like he hasn't but, considering his capability needs to produce more of what we can call Babar effect in big games. He is 28 so many more years to do so.

 

[U$ofA]

Excellent list of players. But it is really between Richards, Kohli and Ponting.

For me it's Kohli. For his mental strength, ability to handle pressure, number of gears, and what sets him ahead of other two, finishing.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

In olden battles there would be an initial small scale skirmish on the battlefire before the real thing began.

In ODI cricket I feel thats what the job of a number 3 is. When he arrives at the crease you need to get the feeling that now the actual battle is beginning.

There are only two players who I feel really capture that - Ponting and Kohli. Kohli in particular, when he at the crease you feel that now the game is on. The opposition, the fans and the commentary team know that the match hinges on this wicket.

Thats why I think he is the best number 3. When he marches to the crease then its on!

 

[GLORY OF '92]

Ponting and its not even close.

 

[Jazx]

General discussion forum. I think without a doubt Babar is Pakistan’s best ODI number 3. Brilliant player and well done for achieving 5k ODI runs the quickest ever.

Overall, my number 1 ODI number 3 was Ricky Ponting. The guy was an absolute class act and a monster player of both pace and spin. Surreal fitness and game awareness. I rate him higher than Kohli personally, who I think is India’s GOAT ODI number 3 and no.2 from what I have seen in cricket.

From what I recall. Lara was batting mainly at number 4 for West Indies but I believe he has played a substantial amount of games for them at number 3 too. High quality player but I don’t think I would rate him higher than Ponting and Kohli.

The Ponting era was pretty much dominated by the brilliant teams of Australia and South Africa, for that matter I think Kallis deserves a special mention as he was the perfect number 3 batsman for them in this Era. He was definitely Ponting’s nemesis for this position in order to establish dominance in world cricket.

I would rate them in this order,

1. Ricky Ponting
2. Virat Kohli
3. Jacque Kallis
4. Brian Lara
5. Kumar Sangakara
6. Joe Root
7. Babar Azam
8. Kane Williamson
9. Steven Smith
10. Rahul Dravid

Thoughts?

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] [MENTION=53290]Markhor[/MENTION] [MENTION=130037]Titan[/MENTION] [MENTION=147314]topspin[/MENTION] [MENTION=143714]Kroll[/MENTION] [MENTION=56933]ElRaja[/MENTION]

How could you miss viv richards!

 

[Rana]

How could you miss viv richards!

Boss man. I mentioned this earlier

I haven’t honestly seen Viv bat so I personally cannot claim he is better than Ponting or Kohli. I just can’t

 

[Jazx]

Boss man. I mentioned this earlier

I haven’t honestly seen Viv bat so I personally cannot claim he is better than Ponting or Kohli. I just can’t

Hmmm makes sense.
Even i didn't watched him live, only saw the highlights and clippings. But as per the stats and the impact he had in that era, he should be in top 3 in ODIs.

 

[Rana]

Ponting and its not even close.

Yeah I think people are underwriting Ponting here

3 world cups as the number 3 is a huge, Huge achievement

 

[Rana]

Min 2000 runs at no.3 batting position

Player	Span	Mat	Runs	Avg	SR	100
Babar Azam	2016-2023	81	4547	64.95	89.59	18
V Kohli	2009-2023	212	10777	60.2	94.7	39
IVA Richards	1976-1986	52	2418	57.57	86.88	5
F du Plessis	2012-2019	82	3941	55.5	88.34	11
SPD Smith	2014-2023	80	3765	54.56	86.71	11
JE Root	2013-2022	93	3971	54.39	89.57	11
Mohammad Yousuf	2000-2010	45	2042	53.73	79.05	5
KS Williamson	2010-2023	129	5802	50.89	81.38	11
IJL Trott	2009-2013	63	2585	49.71	77.97	4
BC Lara	1992-2007	109	4447	45.84	85.98	12
JH Kallis	1997-2014	204	7774	45.72	73.74	13
Zaheer Abbas	1974-1985	48	2009	45.65	85.74	6
KC Sangakkara	2001-2015	243	9747	44.71	80.5	18
GA Hick	1991-2001	58	2182	44.53	75.26	5
DM Jones	1985-1994	132	5100	43.58	72.07	7
RT Ponting	1995-2012	335	12662	42.48	80.73	29
Mohammad Hafeez	2005-2017	56	2051	41.02	82.1	7
Inzamam-ul-Haq	1991-2003	61	2033	39.09	68.54	2
R Dravid	1996-2011	112	4000	38.83	69.6	7
MS Atapattu	1996-2007	122	4142	38.35	66.33	4
Rahmat Shah	2014-2022	74	2635	37.11	70.19	4
M Azharuddin	1985-2000	68	2036	36.35	68.18	2
RB Richardson	1983-1995	131	3984	35.25	64.89	4
RR Sarwan	2001-2013	86	2531	35.15	70.58	0
SP Fleming	1995-2007	69	2118	34.16	68.87	0
Ijaz Ahmed	1987-2000	74	2144	31.52	78.44	6
AP Gurusinha	1986-1996	111	3282	30.96	60.26	1
Younis Khan	2000-2015	125	3526	30.13	72.47	6

Min 500 runs at no.3 batting position in World Cup

Player	Span	Mat	Runs	Avg	SR	100
Shakib Al Hasan (BAN)	2019-2019	8	606	86.57	96.03	2
IVA Richards (WI)	1979-1983	11	584	83.42	78.38	2
SPD Smith (AUS)	2015-2019	8	557	79.57	89.69	1
KC Sangakkara (SL)	2003-2015	23	1174	73.37	89.14	5
F du Plessis (SA)	2015-2019	13	762	69.27	87.88	2
KS Williamson (NZ)	2015-2019	19	812	58	75.81	2
V Kohli (IND)	2011-2019	18	807	53.8	87.62	1
JH Kallis (SA)	1999-2011	17	691	53.15	80.25	1
RT Ponting (AUS)	1996-2011	42	1723	46.56	79.73	5
BC Lara (WI)	1996-2007	13	535	44.58	92.4	2

Punter wins it in the World Cup list. His runs contributed in 3 World Cup wins

 

[VForVendetta]

Viv
Ponting
Kohli
Lara
Rest of them were either too inconsistent, stat padders or soft accumulators for the most part including Babar. Dravid wasn't an exceptional ODI talent,but he made the most of his limitations & had a really respectable career. I genuinely feel had he been non-indian he would have been respected much more. Kallis imo is one of the most overrated & overhyped batsmen of all time. A terrific test batsman but an absolute selfish & impactless ODI batsman who only piled useless runs after runs over the years. Root & Smith have similar issues. Both had an exceptional world cup(SS 15, JR 19) where they led their team to glory but just couldn't take their career to the next level. Babar needs to make such statement in an icc tournament which he still hasn't been able to do.

 

[sweep_shot]

I vote for Ricky Ponting.

Was amazing in both Test and ODI.

 

[Ab Fan]

Virat Kohli is my answer.

 

[heddie19]

Viv
Ponting
Kohli
Babar
Kallis
Sangakkara
Williamson
Root

 

[Hitman]

It's between Viv and Kohli. I'd go for Viv, just by a hair.

 

[shariqnoor]

In terms of stats and match winning innings, nobody comes close to Kohli.

But in terms of box-office, Lara stands undisputed. He's the GOAT of box-office batsmen. Never seen anyone like him.

 

[Firebat]

I'd go Kohli over Viv and Ponting, but that Viv swagger is iconic and unmatched.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

i will go with Sangakara and Hashim Amla both batsman were renowned for his elegance and consistency at No. 3. Complete players in all formats and had a remarkable ability to adapt to different conditions.

 

[Rana]

i will go with Sangakara and Hashim Amla both batsman were renowned for his elegance and consistency at No. 3. Complete players in all formats and had a remarkable ability to adapt to different conditions.

They were very good but they couldn’t lead their sides to silverware like Ponting did 3 world cups in a row.

 

[Rana]

Min 2000 runs at no.3 batting position

Player	Span	Mat	Runs	Avg	SR	100
Babar Azam	2016-2023	81	4547	64.95	89.59	18
V Kohli	2009-2023	212	10777	60.2	94.7	39
IVA Richards	1976-1986	52	2418	57.57	86.88	5
F du Plessis	2012-2019	82	3941	55.5	88.34	11
SPD Smith	2014-2023	80	3765	54.56	86.71	11
JE Root	2013-2022	93	3971	54.39	89.57	11
Mohammad Yousuf	2000-2010	45	2042	53.73	79.05	5
KS Williamson	2010-2023	129	5802	50.89	81.38	11
IJL Trott	2009-2013	63	2585	49.71	77.97	4
BC Lara	1992-2007	109	4447	45.84	85.98	12
JH Kallis	1997-2014	204	7774	45.72	73.74	13
Zaheer Abbas	1974-1985	48	2009	45.65	85.74	6
KC Sangakkara	2001-2015	243	9747	44.71	80.5	18
GA Hick	1991-2001	58	2182	44.53	75.26	5
DM Jones	1985-1994	132	5100	43.58	72.07	7
RT Ponting	1995-2012	335	12662	42.48	80.73	29
Mohammad Hafeez	2005-2017	56	2051	41.02	82.1	7
Inzamam-ul-Haq	1991-2003	61	2033	39.09	68.54	2
R Dravid	1996-2011	112	4000	38.83	69.6	7
MS Atapattu	1996-2007	122	4142	38.35	66.33	4
Rahmat Shah	2014-2022	74	2635	37.11	70.19	4
M Azharuddin	1985-2000	68	2036	36.35	68.18	2
RB Richardson	1983-1995	131	3984	35.25	64.89	4
RR Sarwan	2001-2013	86	2531	35.15	70.58	0
SP Fleming	1995-2007	69	2118	34.16	68.87	0
Ijaz Ahmed	1987-2000	74	2144	31.52	78.44	6
AP Gurusinha	1986-1996	111	3282	30.96	60.26	1
Younis Khan	2000-2015	125	3526	30.13	72.47	6

Min 500 runs at no.3 batting position in World Cup

Player	Span	Mat	Runs	Avg	SR	100
Shakib Al Hasan (BAN)	2019-2019	8	606	86.57	96.03	2
IVA Richards (WI)	1979-1983	11	584	83.42	78.38	2
SPD Smith (AUS)	2015-2019	8	557	79.57	89.69	1
KC Sangakkara (SL)	2003-2015	23	1174	73.37	89.14	5
F du Plessis (SA)	2015-2019	13	762	69.27	87.88	2
KS Williamson (NZ)	2015-2019	19	812	58	75.81	2
V Kohli (IND)	2011-2019	18	807	53.8	87.62	1
JH Kallis (SA)	1999-2011	17	691	53.15	80.25	1
RT Ponting (AUS)	1996-2011	42	1723	46.56	79.73	5
BC Lara (WI)	1996-2007	13	535	44.58	92.4	2

Ponting arguably the GOAT no. 3 in World cups. 42 matches averaging 45.6 in an era where he faced:

Akram
Waqar
Saqlain
Shoaib Akhtar
Pollock
Donald
Klusenar
Steyn
Morkel
Ntini
Vaas
Muralitharan
Herath
Vettori
Bond
Flintoff
Gough
Swann
Zaheer Khan
Irfan Pathan
Harbajhan
Kumble

Some of the world class ODI bowlers from this time period

 

[Ab Fan]

i will go with Sangakara and Hashim Amla both batsman were renowned for his elegance and consistency at No. 3. Complete players in all formats and had a remarkable ability to adapt to different conditions.

They were very good but they couldn’t lead their sides to silverware like Ponting did 3 world cups in a row.

Amla was opener, not 3 in ODIs.

 

[Ab Fan]

My top 5 for #3 position in bilateral ODIs are :-

Kohli
Viv( he was more ideal no 4 than #3)
Ponting( benefited with an extremely strong team)
Lara
Babar

 

[MANU ROY]

definitely Virat Kohli

 

[gazza619]

Kohli without a shadow of doubt

 

[RidiculousMan]

Although it's close between Viv Richards and Virat Kohli in my opinion. I would just slightly put Kohli ahead here because he has more experience playing in that particular position, while Sir Viv played at no. 3 and 4. More at no. 4.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

Viv Richards.. The best. Far ahead of his era and the only batter who put genuine fear in bowlers mind and heart.
Kohli/Ponting are great too.. But Viv was just so destructive.

 

[WicketLord]

Kohli for his incredible consistency

 

[owenhcricket]

Ponting for sure, with a good argument for Viv but Kohli is a distant, distant third.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

Viv Richards.. The best. Far ahead of his era and the only batter who put genuine fear in bowlers mind and heart.
Kohli/Ponting are great too.. But Viv was just so destructive.

I have never seen Viv play live as he retired before even I was born. But those Youtube videos and cricket classic shows on TV.. man Viv hit a mean ball. Crazy Destructive.. Couple of his innings in Australia where he took down Rodney Hogg and Lilee etc were exhilarating. Wish I had seen him play live.