Can Babar Azam join the group of Fab 4 and make it a Fab 5?

[cricketjoshila]

Kohli, Root, Smith, Williamson were given the name of Fab 4 not only because they were the best batsmen of their sides but performed similar roles they played at almost similar positions and were part of the same age bracket.

Babar is much younger than these while Rohit isnt even a middle order player and is a pretty ordinary test player and stats show that too if we exclude the recent heroics and bashing of teams at home.

Rohit has 2000 odd runs in tests at 32 year of age, so much for the fab 4 audition.

In this thread people have brought in names like Warner (A below average player abroad), QDK (A wicket keeper who doesnt bat in Fab 4 positions in any format including no 7 in tests) etc without understanding what exactly fab 4 is.

Who are the best middle order batsmen across the formats under 31-32 years of age and everyone will get the answer, no point in circling around and trying to bring in names which arent even relevant.

Rohit is an ordinary test player. Ok.

Babbar averaging 36 is a brilliant one?

 

[Titan24]

Rohit is an ordinary test player. Ok.

Babbar averaging 36 is a brilliant one?

When did I say that? If you will check my posts in this thread I have said numerous times that Babar has to do a lot more in tests to come anywhere near to Fab 4 in that format as all 4 are excellent players in tests.

 

[Hyperion66]

People who I consider current fab 4

Smith
Kohli
Kane
Root (Pujara is a half ton away from replacing him)

My ODI Fab 5

Kohli
Rohit
Roy
Stokes
Babar

Now I sincerely hope people will stop misquoting me.

 

[BreadPakoda]

Aek hi batsman hai humaray pass osko bhi tum log nazar laga do

Hum nahi laga rahey. Tumhaarey apne log laga rahey hai. If anything Indians are anti-jinxing him here.

 

[Mobashir]

People who I consider current fab 4

Smith
Kohli
Kane
Root (Pujara is a half ton away from replacing him)

My ODI Fab 5

Kohli
Rohit
Roy
Stokes
Babar

Now I sincerely hope people will stop misquoting me.

That's overall or just Test?

 

[Mobashir]

Discussion was about current situation. I give more weight to test than ODI.


Let's take a look at current situation,

Test rating of Smith : 931
Test rating of Kohli: 928
Huge Gap
Others..



ODI rating of Kohli: 895
Huge gap
Huge gap
Huge gap
ODI rating of Smith: 636

No batsmen is close to Smith and Kohli in Test format. Smith is too far behind Kohli in ODI format. These ratings are most objective despite having many flaws.


Top 5 will be harder to put than simply saying that,

Over all Kohli is far ahead as batsman than others.
In test format Smith is ahead than Kohli and others are far behind.

I am very comfortable making both statements.

Yes it's always hard for people like you who twist everything just to put their own favorites at the top.
Because you know that if you start using the same logic for everyone, you will have guys like Root, Williamson, Warner, Rohit Sharma at the same level or better than Smith as overall batsman and that will look stupid.

But don't worry, you are not the only one to do this, all the indian overhype brigade has to do such things.

 

[Mobashir]

Admit?

No player can score a hundred in every match. I gave you a list of matches where Kohli didn’t get the chance to score a hundred and you simply reinforced it by highlighting those matches.

The matches against South Africa and New Zealand were failures indeed.

Against Australia, he faced 77 balls and got out on the second last ball of the innings. How many runs should he have scored after coming to the crease in the 23rd over and facing 77 balls? I am sorry he didn’t score 122 in 77 balls like Babar Azam would have.

India have a weak middle-order. He struck a hundred run partnership with Dhawan and ensured that India get to a match-winning total. It wasn’t an impact-less or a soft innings.

Against Pakistan, he faced 65 balls and got out in the 48th over. Was those 77 runs a poor effort? In what world? However, it was certainly a poor innings compared to the match-winning 48 in 57 by Babar in response.

Against both Australia and Pakistan, he was on top of the bowling and playing beautifully, and the only reason he didn’t score hundreds was because he ran out of time. You can call it ifs and buts, but remember, this Kohli we are talking about. No batsman in history has been better than him when it comes scoring ODI hundreds.

He didn’t click against Bangladesh but what did you expect him to do when he came to the crease in the 30th over? He was unlucky to not fill his boots against that mediocre attack because Rohit and Rahul had an 180 run opening partnership.

He could have scored hundreds against West Indies, Afghanistan and England though.

Was his World Cup as good as it should have been? No, but he wasn’t poor either. Pretty much every batsman in the world would be happy with 5 half-centuries in 9 innings, especially when he was certain to score hundreds in two of these innings.

Nevertheless, even if we accept your argument that Kohli failed in the World Cup and Babar was a million times better, what do we do with this information and what conclusion do we draw? Is the only instance where an inferior player has outperformed a superior player in a tournament?

Finally, please explain what do you mean by “Babar is better on current form”? Babar has been nowhere near Kohli in the last two years and Kohli scored 254 not out on current form.

He came early 5 times in the world cup and didn't score a hundred. I am not even accusing Kohli of not having scored a hundred, you are the only one who brought this missing 2 hundreds because lack of time. I just told you that it doesn't work like this. When a batsman comes in at 150-1 after 25 overs and scores 50 from 55 balls, he is not hurting the opposition.

I have never said Kohli had a poor world cup and if I said so, I made a mistake- but will let you show me where did I say it. Kohli had a good world cup, or very world cup. I said Babar had a better world cup and you started talking about it.

Kohli's 254 was nothing more than a good innings. An innings that will be forgotten coming next year. Kohli's Fifty and 40 something in South Africa in the third test is one of the best he has played, ever. Cricket is not only about big scores but about important and difficult knocks.
There is a reason why Lara's 153 not out is more celebrated than his 400 or his 373.
Same, I will take Inzamam's 93 not out in SA over his 329 against New Zealand.

 

[barah_admi]

The fab four was a fun quotation from a few years a go regarding a group of very good young batsmen in Root, Kohli, Smith and Williamson. They have gone on to become some of the most established batsmen in the post Sanga/Jaya/Younis/Amla/AB generation (the word being used quite liberally here).

Babar Azam is from a different time to those men, is a lot young and if all goes well will probably end his career half a decade after those guys. If we must compare him, it would be with batsmen closer to his time, such as the much joked about Rahul, QDK and so on.

Regardless of terms like Fab 4, fab this, fab that...Babar is one of the very best cricketers on the planet at this time.

 

[MenInG]

Australia are dealing with the likely next member of cricket's batting elite as Pakistan star Babar Azam looks to continue his rich form on the Adelaide Oval.

Babar will walk out on Friday as the most important member of Pakistan's squad, having made up for almost a quarter of their total runs since they arrived in Australia.

His 104 at the Gabba was easily the highlight of Pakistan's tour so far, and it could now be argued Babar has joined the elite pantheon of the world's best four batsmen.

In a game so long dominated by Steve Smith, Virat Kohli, Kane Williamson and Joe Root, there is change in the air.

Root has averaged just 34 since the start of last year and 2017 in 2019. His Ashes were well below par.

In comparison, Babar is clearly climbing the tree.

The world's top-ranked Twenty20 batsmen is now doing it across all three formats.

He is the only player to have averaged above 50 in T20s, one-day internationals and Test cricket since the start of last year.

And while Sunday's knock at the Gabba was just his second Test century, there is every sign there are plenty more to come.

"I am (surprised it was only his second Test ton) because I think he's such a good player," Australia's coach Justin Langer said.

"We saw him during the World Cup and we've seen him before. He's a gun player. And to score a hundred the other day - great respect for him.

"He's one of the guys we have to keep on our toes for. He can take the game away like that.

"And he's only young still. Let's just hope he doesn't get away in this second Test match."

The cousin of wicketkeeping brothers Umal, Adnan and Kamran Akmal, Babar made his Test debut in 2016 after scoring three straight ODI centuries against the West Indies.

His first Test ton should have come against Australia last year, when he was out on 99 in Dubai when he fell lbw to Mitch Marsh.

But on Sunday he played wonderfully through the covers off both the front and back foot, showcasing his balance at the crease.

It will also only increase comparisons between he and Kohli on the sub-continent.

Not that he is ready to hear them yet.

"I don't think it's a fair comparison between Kohli and me, and I say this in all interviews," Babar said.

"He has a lot more matches than me and a lot more experience. When I get the same experience then maybe you can say all that.

"But at this stage the comparison doesn't work.

"I try not to think about it because it only adds more pressure on you."

BABAR AZAM SINCE START OF 2018:

Tests: 865 runs at 50.88

ODIs: 1601 at 50.03

https://www.theadvocate.com.au/story/6515864/babar-set-to-join-crickets-batting-elite/?cs=7660

 

[Mamoon]

He came early 5 times in the world cup and didn't score a hundred. I am not even accusing Kohli of not having scored a hundred, you are the only one who brought this missing 2 hundreds because lack of time. I just told you that it doesn't work like this. When a batsman comes in at 150-1 after 25 overs and scores 50 from 55 balls, he is not hurting the opposition.

I have never said Kohli had a poor world cup and if I said so, I made a mistake- but will let you show me where did I say it. Kohli had a good world cup, or very world cup. I said Babar had a better world cup and you started talking about it.

Kohli's 254 was nothing more than a good innings. An innings that will be forgotten coming next year. Kohli's Fifty and 40 something in South Africa in the third test is one of the best he has played, ever. Cricket is not only about big scores but about important and difficult knocks.
There is a reason why Lara's 153 not out is more celebrated than his 400 or his 373.
Same, I will take Inzamam's 93 not out in SA over his 329 against New Zealand.

I didn’t say anything about hurting or not hurting the opposition. I simply said that he has missed out on hundreds because of not having enough time to bat on occasions, which I proved by highlighting the Australia and Pakistan matches.

Of course you think that Kohli’s 254 was nothing more than a good innings. If it was scored by Babar or some other non-Indian batsman it would have been the innings of the decade. You know very well that runs don’t come free even if the pitch is flat. Scoring 254 not out requires skill, stamina and character among other things.

That is why as I said, it is not possible to have an honest discussion with you when Indian cricketers are involved.

 

[Mamoon]

[MENTION=43051]Mobashir[/MENTION]

One final thing. You are claiming that Babar is in better form at the moment and that Kohli’s 254 two Tests ago was nothing special. So if Babar plays South Africa on a flat Asian pitch today, how many will he score? 354 or 454?

 

[Sidilicious]

Yes it's always hard for people like you who twist everything just to put their own favorites at the top.
Because you know that if you start using the same logic for everyone, you will have guys like Root, Williamson, Warner, Rohit Sharma at the same level or better than Smith as overall batsman and that will look stupid.

But don't worry, you are not the only one to do this, all the indian overhype brigade has to do such things.

Can you please show me where does Babar come in top 5 in current form.

Simply looking at the test stats, he is not even in top 10. Over the last 12 months, Babar averages 39 in Test cricket. Over 24 months, that extends to 50, but is still below Fab 4 (except Root), and Latham and Nicholls (both of who have scored more runs at a higher average than Babar). Heck, even Mayank Agarwal, despite playing fewer tests has scored more runs at a higher average. How is that top 5 material in tests?

Coming to ODI cricket, Babar has done well in the last 12 months, and I can agree that he is in the top 5 ODI batsmen spot currently. However, over 24 months, many other bastmen have outscored and out averaged him in ODI cricket. But importantly, I agree he is currently in top 5 in ODI cricket.

Now, someone who hasnt performed that well in test cricket, cannot be considered a fab 4 material, as its mainly a test criteria. No doubt he will get there, but he is nowhere near it. Currently, players like Pujara have a better chance of getting there than Babar.

 

[bantu]

It looks like Marnus Labuschagne will be getting there before Babar Azam....

 

[zain7077]

It looks like Marnus Labuschagne will be getting there before Babar Azam....

Lol the guys plays one format. Players who excel in all three formats get more recognition. Otherwise people like Rahane Pujara etc would also be members of the elite club. But no.

 

[bantu]

Lol the guys plays one format. Players who excel in all three formats get more recognition. Otherwise people like Rahane Pujara etc would also be members of the elite club. But no.

Fair enough ..

 

[Ab Fan]

I feel de Kock is very underrated as well. Excellent all-format player and is a wicket-keeper, so gets some brownie points for that.

 

[therealAB]

People who I consider current fab 4



My ODI Fab 5

Kohli
Rohit
Roy
Stokes
Babar

Taylor, Warner, Williamson. All very prolific and more proven than Babar. The two New Zealanders also extremely clutch

 

[therealAB]

Lol the guys plays one format. Players who excel in all three formats get more recognition. Otherwise people like Rahane Pujara etc would also be members of the elite club. But no.

He will by playing ODI before too long, carved up the domestic comp

 

[Hyperion66]

Taylor, Warner, Williamson. All very prolific and more proven than Babar. The two New Zealanders also extremely clutch

I said 'My' fab 4 brother, notice the emphasis on 'My'.

 

[therealAB]

I said 'My' fab 4 brother, notice the emphasis on 'My'.

Well obviously its yours. Basically everything written on this forum is personal opinion. Just because it is your opinion doesn't mean that it cannot be challenged

 

[Aman]

There should be a Fab 5 alright, but not with Babar

 

[Aman]

Truth be told, there's really a big 3 and that consists of Kohli, Smith and Warner.

Can be a big 4 with Rohit who on his days is better than all of them in LOIs and can score runs like them on roads in Test cricket.

 

[Ab Fan]

Truth be told, there's really a big 3 and that consists of Kohli, Smith and Warner.

Can be a big 4 with Rohit who on his days is better than all of them in LOIs and can score runs like them on roads in Test cricket.

Warner is no match to Smith/Kohli, averages below 30 in five countries, that's atrocious.

 

[Relic]

Truth be told, there's really a big 3 and that consists of Kohli, Smith and Warner.

Can be a big 4 with Rohit who on his days is better than all of them in LOIs and can score runs like them on roads in Test cricket.

This isn't a LOI fab 4 is it?
You have to be good in all formats. Rohit isn't good in test cricket.

Don't forget that Warner is facing a minnow bowling attack AT HOME. Even azhar's scored a 300 lol

 

[Majid Khan]

It would be great if Babar could score big 100s and 200s - but then we talking about a team where other batsmen look like they have achieved success once they reach a quarter-century (25) landmark.

 

[BlueBeamer]

This thread looks more like a joke with every passing day. There are atleast 10 batsmen in world cricket who would make the fab 4 ahead of babar. No sane person would pick him in his test team atm.

 

[FlickedOffHips]

Babar has joined the Fab 4.

Joe Root has left the chat(for now).

 

[Mobashir]

This thread looks more like a joke with every passing day. There are atleast 10 batsmen in world cricket who would make the fab 4 ahead of babar. No sane person would pick him in his test team atm.

I think being part of the fab 4 or best batsmen in the world on career is one thing, and in that regard, Babar is far behind others.

On the other hand if he doesn't make the best XI in the world on current form, everyone will at least pick him in the second best XI. Let's say the first XI reads as
3. Williamson
4. Smith
5. Kohli
6. Stokes

Who will be the 3, 4, 5 and 6 ahead of him in the second XI?

 

[Bel_Homme]

Babar is a star and definitely top 5 bat in the world. Also, like Kohli he looks pleasing to the eyes as well, something you dont associate with Smith and Warner. I do rate him above Root and Williamson on current form. Its not Babar's fault that rest of his team mates are club level cricketers. Situation he is in reminds me of Sachin in 90s when he was the lone gun slinger for Indian batting.

 

[BlueBeamer]

I think being part of the fab 4 or best batsmen in the world on career is one thing, and in that regard, Babar is far behind others.

On the other hand if he doesn't make the best XI in the world on current form, everyone will at least pick him in the second best XI. Let's say the first XI reads as
3. Williamson
4. Smith
5. Kohli
6. Stokes

Who will be the 3, 4, 5 and 6 ahead of him in the second XI?

Latham, Pujara, Rahane, Ross

 

[ikky47]

Latham, Pujara, Rahane, Ross

Joe Root ahead of Babar Azam on current form in test cricket?! you must be having a laugh . Joe Root is averaging less than Azam in tests since the start of 2018.

 

[Mobashir]

Latham, Pujara, Rahane, Ross

Latham is an opener.
Rahane is no way near Babar in any format.

 

[Mobashir]

Joe Root ahead of Babar Azam on current form in test cricket?! you must be having a laugh . Joe Root is averaging less than Azam in tests since the start of 2018.

Ross Taylor he is talking about.

 

[BlueBeamer]

Latham is an opener.
Rahane is no way near Babar in any format.

Very rarely can you make a team of players from different countries and make them bat in their desired positions. Someone gets promoted up the order or demoted to keep balance.

 

[AAli98]

Too flashy hence only 2 centuries. In the mould of Bairstow/bavuma

 

[dhump]

He is only doing good for his case these days so let's wait and watch. His situation reminds me of Tendulkar and India back in the 90s, not that I am comparing him with Tendulkar I just think the rest of Pakistani batsman's are horrible in comparison to him.

 

[ikky47]

Babar has been averaging higher since the start of 2018 than Taylor, Rahane and Pujara out of the names mentioned the only one with a higher average is Latham. Even on current form Babar is better bat than all of them except Pujara and that is due to Pujara's heroics against Aus last year.

 

[Abdullah]

It's not good for Bobby to be playing with this shambles

 

[jnaveen1980]

Babar has been averaging higher since the start of 2018 than Taylor, Rahane and Pujara out of the names mentioned the only one with a higher average is Latham. Even on current form Babar is better bat than all of them except Pujara and that is due to Pujara's heroics against Aus last year.

Are you sure? Faf, Dekock, Mayank, Rohit, Jadeja average more than him since 2018. He still has a long long way to go. Judging by the crap batsmen he bats alongside it is very difficult for him to go beyond a certain level. You need to reel out big hundreds. Multiple hundreds.

 

[Relic]

Are you sure? Faf, Dekock, Mayank, Rohit, Jadeja average more than him since 2018. He still has a long long way to go. Judging by the crap batsmen he bats alongside it is very difficult for him to go beyond a certain level. You need to reel out big hundreds. Multiple hundreds.

Firstly some of your claims are wrong. Faf and De kock averaged 20 odd in 2018 and 40 odd in 2019. That ain't more than Babar's average.

Rohit averaged 20 odd in 2018 (because of the away tours) while he now averages 80 in 2019. I wonder why...
Reason: Home tours

I'd like to say good stuff about Mayank but the fact is that he scored 243 against Bangladesh which heavily inflated his average. But he also scored a 200 vs SA (at home) so i'll give him props for that

As for Jadeja, Babar and his stats for the last 2 years are pretty similar. But his average is more because he has more not outs. He's scored 650+ runs in 17 innings while Babar has scored 850+ in 20 innings.

 

[Relic]

I'm expecting Babar to score 4 hundreds in his next 4 matches. The reason being he'll be playing Sri Lanka and Bangladesh. So that should help his record a bit but then people will start saying that he bumped up his record by playing with minnows (albeit Sri Lanka is ranked higher than Pakistan)

 

[jnaveen1980]

Firstly some of your claims are wrong. Faf and De kock averaged 20 odd in 2018 and 40 odd in 2019. That ain't more than Babar's average.

Rohit averaged 20 odd in 2018 (because of the away tours) while he now averages 80 in 2019. I wonder why...
Reason: Home tours

I'd like to say good stuff about Mayank but the fact is that he scored 243 against Bangladesh which heavily inflated his average. But he also scored a 200 vs SA (at home) so i'll give him props for that

As for Jadeja, Babar and his stats for the last 2 years are pretty similar. But his average is more because he has more not outs. He's scored 650+ runs in 17 innings while Babar has scored 850+ in 20 innings.

Century is a century. Minnow or not minnow. There are certain strong teams play like minnows in certain conditions. If you ask me BD seamers bowled slightly better than SA seamers. Hard to believe right? That is the fact.

 

[Relic]

Century is a century. Minnow or not minnow. There are certain strong teams play like minnows in certain conditions. If you ask me BD seamers bowled slightly better than SA seamers. Hard to believe right? That is the fact.

LOL. Now you're justifying performances against minnows as well.

You still haven't told me why you were lying about De Kock and Du Plessis having a higher average than Babar from 2018 until now.

 

[sindhiboy]

Currently, yasir shah is a run machine. He will probably join the fab 5 before babar

 

[andy0204]

Latham is an opener.
Rahane is no way near Babar in any format.

Rahane averages 44 in tests which is better than Babar.

 

[jnaveen1980]

LOL. Now you're justifying performances against minnows as well.

You still haven't told me why you were lying about De Kock and Du Plessis having a higher average than Babar from 2018 until now.

Didn't lie. Checked the wrong window. You can ignore them. Agarwal, Nichols, Latham, Labu many are ahead of him during this phase. Too bad Shaw got banned. In 2 tests he is averaging 118. Even in one dayers several ahead of him during this phase. Shakib has crazy numbers during this phase. Purely in terms of average Imam has better average than him. He is not close to the very top in any format in terms of average. Sure he accumulated runs in all formats. Kudos to him. But not far and above everyone except the fab 4 or as someone say he has not really "replaced" root. He will eventually get there. But absolutely not there yet. Can he farm the strike and attack from this end as wickets are tumbling? We will see tomorrow.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Rahane averages 44 in tests which is better than Babar.

At one point Rahane was averaging 50. Then two bad years pushed him to 40 average. Now he is climbing back again.

 

[Relic]

Didn't lie. Checked the wrong window. You can ignore them. Agarwal, Nichols, Latham, Labu many are ahead of him during this phase. Too bad Shaw got banned. In 2 tests he is averaging 118. Even in one dayers several ahead of him during this phase. Shakib has crazy numbers during this phase. Purely in terms of average Imam has better average than him. He is not close to the very top in any format in terms of average. Sure he accumulated runs in all formats. Kudos to him. But not far and above everyone except the fab 4 or as someone say he has not really "replaced" root. He will eventually get there. But absolutely not there yet. Can he farm the strike and attack from this end as wickets are tumbling? We will see tomorrow.

Labu is good and all but he hasn't performe THAT good out of Aus. In the Ashes, he did well but still didn't score a century. In the series in the UAE, he did alright iirc but didn't score a century. So his sample size is too small. Let him play more games and we'll see how good he actually is. But the signs look promising.

As for Babar, I think he'll get to bat twice tomorrow (if it doesn't rain a lot), so we will see how he does

 

[Sin Nombre]

Counting all formats, this is how batters rate

Smith/Kohli
daylight
KW
Taylor/Warner/QdK/Rohit/Babar
Root/Faf/Pujara


Indian fans need to recognize Babar is comfortably in the same class as Ross Taylor, Warner, De Kock and Rohit across all formats.

 

[shariqnoor]

This series could be the making of Babar Azam. This is extremely similar to the making of Virat Kohli in 2014 series in Australia on the Test match stage where he hammered 4 centuries and announced his arrival.

Babar needs to go on and make a century here today. It's imperative for his Test stature and then go on and slam another couple of centuries against SL at home.

 

[Relic]

This series could be the making of Babar Azam. This is extremely similar to the making of Virat Kohli in 2014 series in Australia on the Test match stage where he hammered 4 centuries and announced his arrival.

Babar needs to go on and make a century here today. It's imperative for his Test stature and then go on and slam another couple of centuries against SL at home.

And then a couple against Bangladesh. He'll be at 7 hundreds in no time lol.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Babar is top 3, all formats considered. If you wanna put Warner ahead, that's understandable.

 

[zain7077]

This series could be the making of Babar Azam. This is extremely similar to the making of Virat Kohli in 2014 series in Australia on the Test match stage where he hammered 4 centuries and announced his arrival.

Babar needs to go on and make a century here today. It's imperative for his Test stature and then go on and slam another couple of centuries against SL at home.

He’ll run out of partners. Same happened in NZ

 

[OffDrive]

No Babar is not in the top 5 lets alone the top 10, he is a very good batsman but anyone can look good when the rest of the batsmen are so crap.

 

[Relic]

No Babar is not in the top 5 lets alone the top 10, he is a very good batsman but anyone can look good when the rest of the batsmen are so crap.

You mean he's not in the top 10 let alone in the top 5

 

[OffDrive]

You mean he's not in the top 10 let alone in the top 5

That too.

 

[Mobashir]

What an innings by Babar again, unfortunately couldn't get the hundred. But still, he is doing wonderfully in this series after the 1st innings of the first test. I love the level of concentration he is showing.

Unfortunately there are just 2 test matches, that's going to hurt him in the long term. To not get enough opportunities against the big teams.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

What an innings by Babar again, unfortunately couldn't get the hundred. But still, he is doing wonderfully in this series after the 1st innings of the first test. I love the level of concentration he is showing.

Unfortunately there are just 2 test matches, that's going to hurt him in the long term. To not get enough opportunities against the big teams.

Needed to go on though.

Got out at the wrong time and the wrong place.

Because Yasir wasn't getting out.

 

[Mobashir]

Needed to go on though.

Got out at the wrong time and the wrong place.

Because Yasir wasn't getting out.

Yes, agree. It isn't perfect yet.
Actually, it was a very good ball, it moved out a little bit.

 

[Mobashir]

O'Keefe just said that Babar Azam's drive is better than Kohli, Williamson, and Root. He has lost it!

 

[Sidilicious]

This series could be the kick start of Babar Azam changing the fab 4 into fab 5. Though he would need to do this more often before being classified as fab 5.

 

[WhenSultansBowled]

This series could be the kick start of Babar Azam changing the fab 4 into fab 5. Though he would need to do this more often before being classified as fab 5.

Also he must learn to score daddy 100s to compensate for our fragile batting.

 

[Relic]

I'd say it was a good series for Babar. He finished with an average of over 50 so that's a positive. He needs fo score big hundreds though.
Should have gotten his 100 in the first innings.
It was always going to be difficult for him to bat twice in a day

 

[zain7077]

Brilliant series for Babar. 213 runs across 2 tests and 1 being a pink ball. Would have sounded much better if he got two tons instead of the 97.

 

[Sidilicious]

Also he must learn to score daddy 100s to compensate for our fragile batting.

Yeah, the kid is not a finished article. Thats why it was very premature to call him a fab 5. To be a fab 5, one needs to have been doing well consistently and Babar Azam has just started that. Its up to him to step it up, and get in the tier 1 of batsmen, or remain in the tier below the fab 4. He seems to have all the ingredients, but needs to get on with it now. Lets hope this is a start.

 

[Ab Fan]

Latham is an opener.
Rahane is no way near Babar in any format.

Rahane's inning in Lords is the inning I am yet to see from Babar.

 

[Mobashir]

Rahane's inning in Lords is the inning I am yet to see from Babar.

Who is better according to you?
Babar or Rahane?

 

[Varun]

Who is better according to you?
Babar or Rahane?

Rahane. Has done it for longer and with more success.

 

[Ab Fan]

Who is better according to you?
Babar or Rahane?

Rahane started his test career brilliantly by hitting hundreds in England, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia and West Indies in his first tour only and establishing himself as the next Dravid due to his successful overseas performance. Unfortunately, being a mediocre player of spin, he couldn't replicate the success in India because of which he lost the confidence and turned out to be a dud in his second tour as well.

I think in terms of their spin playing ability, both are similar and against pace bowling, both of them were very similar at age of 25-26, however Rahane has not been able to replicate the success for a longer time and getting overshadowed by better and stronger mentality players like Pujara and Kohli hasn't done any good for him.

From the higher Indian batting standards point of view, he has turned out to be a failure for us as he did got the luxury to bat at the best possible position in the test team. But the way I see it, they were/are having equal potential at age of 25-26.

 

[Mobashir]

Rahane. Has done it for longer and with more success.

You keep ignoring the way Babar is playing.

Rahane started his test career brilliantly by hitting hundreds in England, South Africa, New Zealand, Australia and West Indies in his first tour only and establishing himself as the next Dravid due to his successful overseas performance. Unfortunately, being a mediocre player of spin, he couldn't replicate the success in India because of which he lost the confidence and turned out to be a dud in his second tour as well.

I think in terms of their spin playing ability, both are similar and against pace bowling, both of them were very similar at age of 25-26, however Rahane has not been able to replicate the success for a longer time and getting overshadowed by better and stronger mentality players like Pujara and Kohli hasn't done any good for him.

From the higher Indian batting standards point of view, he has turned out to be a failure for us as he did got the luxury to bat at the best possible position in the test team. But the way I see it, they were/are having equal potential at age of 25-26.

Actually I don't want to engage in a debate of Rahane vs Babar. Just wanted to see how the "Kohli is overall better than Smith" brigade apply their rules in other cases.

Hard to apply for you when it comes to your own countrymen.

 

[TurkishCricketFan]

Babar has to be supported by his teammates even to be considered a part of the elite when it comes to Test cricket. He has done well this tour but sadly all of his runs have come in "Garbage Time" with no meaningful impact to the result whatsoever.

It is certainly not his fault that his team has already lost the match by the end of 2nd session of the first day but you have to have meaningful, memorable knocks that touches your supporters/opponents emotionally to be considered elite. (even if you lose in the end)

 

[Ab Fan]

You keep ignoring the way Babar is playing.

Actually I don't want to engage in a debate of Rahane vs Babar. Just wanted to see how the "Kohli is overall better than Smith" brigade apply their rules in other cases.

Hard to apply for you when it comes to your own countrymen.

Actually no, it's a spot on comparison made by you. Just like Kohli is a better overall bat than Smith, Babar will also be a better overall bat than Rahane.

My only point of explanation in my previous post was that at age of 26, we had similar expectations from Babar as it was for Rahane. Both excellent players of pace bowling, had started off well overseas, Rahane even had hundreds everywhere in his first overseas cycle and both were a little susceptible vs spin but assuming they are from sub continent, we felt Rahane would sort this out. Unfortunately, he turned out to be a massive under-achiever for us. Hopefully, Babar will fulfill that potential.

I don't think me or any Indian would deny that Babar won't be an overall better bat than Rahane, it's basically you guys who keep denying on Smith/Kohli comparison even if the difference in ODIs+ T20s is much bigger than in Tests it is.

 

[shantanu]

maybe. In lOI and t20 I would say they are on par. Babar has no support whereas kohli has rohit dhawan etc in odi. That's something that needs to be factored in as well. Put babar in india and maybe he would have won the semi final for india.
I like kohli but he is a choker in odi. He is a test great for sure and that's what I really care about anyway.

Test cricket always reigns supreme. Test cricket is real cricket.

Babar just started so he has some catching up to do. Let's see how far babar can go. His recent 100 reminded me of kohli's in 2014. The year which kohli transcended to greatness.

He is the greatest ODI bat of all time. He has scored more not out hundreds in the most difficult situations imaginable.
Statistically so.
Stop pandering mate.

What planet??

 

[andy0204]

He is the greatest ODI bat of all time. He has scored more not out hundreds in the most difficult situations imaginable.
Statistically so.
Stop pandering mate.

What planet??

Viv is the greatest Odi bat of all time.

 

[Mobashir]

Actually no, it's a spot on comparison made by you. Just like Kohli is a better overall bat than Smith, Babar will also be a better overall bat than Rahane.

My only point of explanation in my previous post was that at age of 26, we had similar expectations from Babar as it was for Rahane. Both excellent players of pace bowling, had started off well overseas, Rahane even had hundreds everywhere in his first overseas cycle and both were a little susceptible vs spin but assuming they are from sub continent, we felt Rahane would sort this out. Unfortunately, he turned out to be a massive under-achiever for us. Hopefully, Babar will fulfill that potential.

I don't think me or any Indian would deny that Babar won't be an overall better bat than Rahane, it's basically you guys who keep denying on Smith/Kohli comparison even if the difference in ODIs+ T20s is much bigger than in Tests it is.

It's because the method is completely flawed. If we take this method without talking about your favorites players, like Kohli, you will yourself find it hard to implement.

For example, Smith is better in Test than Root. Root is better than Smith in ODI's/T20's. So that will make both of them equal players. When the reality is even if Smith retires today from ODI'/T20's he is a such superior batsman than Root.

The test match exploits that Smith has done are out of this world material, never seen before like innings one after the other makes him incomparable to any other batsman.

 

[Mobashir]

He is the greatest ODI bat of all time. He has scored more not out hundreds in the most difficult situations imaginable.
Statistically so.
Stop pandering mate.

What planet??

Ho really? Can we have a list of those hundreds in very difficult conditions please?

 

[geraltofrivia]

Lol. Babar averages 37 in test cricket. Rahane is so superior it's not even a competition.

 

[geraltofrivia]

Ho really? Can we have a list of those hundreds in very difficult conditions please?

bhai tu rehne de. your team got reamed in the same place where india was victorious a year back.

 

[Ab Fan]

It's because the method is completely flawed. If we take this method without talking about your favorites players, like Kohli, you will yourself find it hard to implement.

For example, Smith is better in Test than Root. Root is better than Smith in ODI's/T20's. So that will make both of them equal players. When the reality is even if Smith retires today from ODI'/T20's he is a such superior batsman than Root.

The test match exploits that Smith has done are out of this world material, never seen before like innings one after the other makes him incomparable to any other batsman.

Not sure why you are bringing Root's numbers here. Root is well behind Smith and Kohli test format taken into consideration.

Williamson, Root and Smith are several leagues below Kohli as a limited overs batsmen.

Kohli is not several leagues below Smith as test batsmen. He is actually well ahead of Root and Williamson in test cricket and only behind Smith as test batter.

 

[Hawkeye]

Babar has done well on this tour, but not enough to make everyone go "woahhh" for him.

We know he's quality, us PAK people, but for others to recognize him, he needs to announce himself in a proper way.

This was a chance. A 150 from him would have done that.