Central Punjab - What's gone wrong?

[ElRaja]

Champions in the first edition of the QeA trophy, joint champions in the second to winning only two games in the whole season this year. Despite getting to play the first half of the season on virtually home grounds CP found itself languishing near the bottom of the table.

whilst southern and Balochistan may claim that they are working with a limited talent pool, Central Punjab is the historic heartland of player development in Pakistan, however in the most worrying twist the team failed to promote and develop any youngsters from the second eleven this season.

a measure of this inability is the contrast between northern (who fielded six players 21 or under in the final) and CP who fielded one player under 25 in a virtually meaningless final league game. and to hammer the final nail in the coffin, Abdullah Shafiq, perhaps the most talented youngster amongst CPs ranks had to leave for Balochistan to get regular cricket and has played more FC games for Pakistan than CP.

So whats gone wrong? is it over reliance on Pakistan pros, and complacency when it comes to talent development? how can a team which scouts talent from 3 of the 5 largest cities in Pakistan find itself unable to identify one player it has developed in three seasons, let alone this season?

Sindh who are often highlighted as being run as an old boys club have in the mean time seen saad khan develop into a first team regular, and given opportune selections to abrar ahmed and dahani over the last two seasons. before mentioning the chances given to omair bin yousuf which he failed to convert this season.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

The problems with the CP cricket team are similar to the problems the region has in general.

Stagnation of ideas, refusal to try anything new, relentless backing of 'seniors' and zero development are things that can be applied to the CP region from both a cricketing and political perspective.

Despite being from the region myself, part of my is delighted that it is happening as hopefully in the next 5 or so years when the majority of established players are not from those major Punjabi Urban Centres, that the grip that the ex-players, media and politicians from that area have on the PK team will also be loosened

 

[moghul]

There are so many players in CP who should not be playing or should be restricted to 1-2 games only. When Azhar Ali, Abid Ali Ahmed Shehzad , Saad Nasim are playing regularly , there won't be much chances left for young players. Particularly don;t understand Saad Nasim playing for CP , what is his future for Pakistan test side and what is his performance has been . Azhar Ali, not only blocking a youngsters in QeA trophy but also in test side, but selectors are spineless.

 

[ethan hunt]

Central Punjab is the true Boys club.
I wouldn't be exaggerating when I say there are better fast bowlers in the city of Lahore itself than the ones picked for the region. Same is true for the batting.

 

[Titan24]

Good thread as with a lot of international cricket going around, sometimes the domestic teams and their internal mechanics are not talked about in detail.

- I think they didn't have enough quality in their backups. Hassan Ali was phenomenal as a pacer/bowling allrounder/ leader last year for Central Punjab and turned it around for them in the last season. There was no one in their ranks to replicate the same performance and energy. Few of the CP guys got selected in Pakistan team and Pak A team, which further showed the vulnerability of their backups.

- Their pace bowling lacked penetration and the only pacer who could have consistently bowled in 140-145kph range in the form of Naseem Shah they traded him/ let him go. Mohammad Ali, Waqas Maqsood etc are decent red ball bowlers in terms of their accuracy and skillset but, a pacer who can rush the batters was missing from their armory.

 

[Xoib]

A lot of hasbeens like Saad nasim and ahmed shehzad should be moved to 2nd xi

 

[ElRaja]

Central Punjab is the true Boys club.
I wouldn't be exaggerating when I say there are better fast bowlers in the city of Lahore itself than the ones picked for the region. Same is true for the batting.

mohammad ali is almost 30 (on paper) himself and seemed the only pacer in the entire team who was promoted from the second xi. one youngster who seemed to have done well was abdul samad, with 400 runs at 80, however he hasnt got a first class game for nearly 3 years, so tough to say what level talent he might be.

mohammad irfan jr seemed to do ok in the second xi comp too, but didnt get even one senior game in the season despite CP bowling not looking all that great.

saad nasim and saif badar on the other hand failed to average 20 in the second elevens and got ample opportunities. someone in CP needs to be held accountable, or at least asked to explain the ratioanle of the decision making, as it appears very arbitrary.

The problems with the CP cricket team are similar to the problems the region has in general.

Stagnation of ideas, refusal to try anything new, relentless backing of 'seniors' and zero development are things that can be applied to the CP region from both a cricketing and political perspective.

Despite being from the region myself, part of my is delighted that it is happening as hopefully in the next 5 or so years when the majority of established players are not from those major Punjabi Urban Centres, that the grip that the ex-players, media and politicians from that area have on the PK team will also be loosened

i was going to mention that perhaps the way CP is being run is a microcosm of how the PCB was being run too. until these transparent pathways were developed it was extremely difficult to see the routes player development was taking.

 

[Markhor]

Without direct knowledge of what's happening on the ground it's difficult to talk about flaws in pathways, the strength of club and school cricket etc so I'll stick to analysing performances.

In 20/21, Hasan Ali and Waqas Maqsood were the driving forces of their attack taking 84 wickets at 20. This year, they lost Hasan while Waqas' form declined. Zafar Gohar didn't replicate his County form, with only Muhammad Ali averaging below 30.

They lost a key AR in Qasim Akram, their 4th best batsman and handy with the ball in 20/21, to A/U19 cricket - the latter I find strange as surely FC cricket would be better for his development ?

Batting looked thin - the Abid Ali situation was unfortunate, but the other seniors Azhar Ali and Hussain Talat didn't perform. Azhar must call it quits now. Despite very flat pitches in the first half of the tournament, averaging 32 and not a single ton is poor from a Test player ! Usman Salahuddin after finishing the A tour of Sri Lanka start of Nov, bizarrely didn't feature at all.

Neither did CP have a gun young batter to replace Abdullah Shafiq - which begs the question of selection. Do PCB/Nadeem Khan control selections centrally or do the regions determine them ? If we're selecting players based on locality - then surely Sialkot-born Mohammad Huraira should play for CP ?

Regardless, it seems CP don't have the pipeline of players the likes of KPK and Northern have coming from the 2nd XI and U19 system. Why that's so is the question. Too many distractions in the urban centres for young kids ?

 

[Last Monetarist]

Usman Salahuddin after finishing the A tour of Sri Lanka start of Nov, bizarrely didn't feature at all.

Salahuddin broke his thumb in Sri Lanka and couldn't regain fitness in time for the remaining rounds of the QeA this season.

 

[Saj]

Usman Salahuddin has been a big loss for them due to injury.

He was one of their mainstays with the bat and more often than not carried their batting.

 

[Bewal Express]

Central Punjab is the true Boys club.
I wouldn't be exaggerating when I say there are better fast bowlers in the city of Lahore itself than the ones picked for the region. Same is true for the batting.

Name the guys who should be playing

 

[Angrez Pakistani]

Half of their first 11 was only available on unresponsive conditions of Punjab. As soon as the tournament moved to Karachi and the results starting to come along nicely, CP lost half of its team to the Bangladesh tour.
They have a very stagnant brand of cricket and none of their youngsters are exciting. They were the most boring side of this tournament.

 

[KingOfPakBreakfast]

Half of their first 11 was only available on unresponsive conditions of Punjab. As soon as the tournament moved to Karachi and the results starting to come along nicely, CP lost half of its team to the Bangladesh tour.
They have a very stagnant brand of cricket and none of their youngsters are exciting. They were the most boring side of this tournament.

I understand that Abdul Razzaq was their coach for this year. Given his success at KPK last year, I was expecting better. He did after all, develop the likes of Mohammed Waseem, Arshad Iqbal and Mohammad Imran last year. However, we didn't see anything of the sort this year.

As a tangent, I'm glad that PCB switched around most of the domestic coaches this year (barring Basit and Faisal Iqbal, who disappointed last year anyway). In this way you saw the actual coaching ability of these guys.

 

[ElRaja]

In 20/21, Hasan Ali and Waqas Maqsood were the driving forces of their attack taking 84 wickets at 20. This year, they lost Hasan while Waqas' form declined. Zafar Gohar didn't replicate his County form, with only Muhammad Ali averaging below 30.

which was kinda my point, central are reliant on players whose development they didst necessarily have anything to do with.

Neither did CP have a gun young batter to replace Abdullah Shafiq - which begs the question of selection. Do PCB/Nadeem Khan control selections centrally or do the regions determine them ? If we're selecting players based on locality - then surely Sialkot-born Mohammad Huraira should play for CP ?

afaik the local region has first pick, but if another region chooses to select one from another region who isnt local then they get the player. northern have taken gambles by giving lots of youngsters chances, as a northern supported id be peeved off if the pcb rejigged it and sent huraira to CP. coincidentally waqas ahmed and raza hasan of sialkot have been with northern as well, so i think sialkot may come under the northern region.

anyone have any idea which districts each region has claims over?

Regardless, it seems CP don't have the pipeline of players the likes of KPK and Northern have coming from the 2nd XI and U19 system. Why that's so is the question. Too many distractions in the urban centres for young kids ?

but thats not the whole story, they didnt give there two or three best second team performers even one FC game. if those players languish in second xi they fail to develop, and block spots other talented players may be able to take up.

 

[Markhor]

afaik the local region has first pick, but if another region chooses to select one from another region who isnt local then they get the player. northern have taken gambles by giving lots of youngsters chances, as a northern supported id be peeved off if the pcb rejigged it and sent huraira to CP. coincidentally waqas ahmed and raza hasan of sialkot have been with northern as well, so i think sialkot may come under the northern region.

anyone have any idea which districts each region has claims over?

Sialkot comes under Central Punjab according to this:

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...tic-cricket-structure&p=10474165#post10474165

If it's the case CP had first dibs on local youngsters like Huraira but passed on them then that reflects poorly on their selection processes.

but thats not the whole story, they didnt give there two or three best second team performers even one FC game. if those players languish in second xi they fail to develop, and block spots other talented players may be able to take up.

So I'm just scanning at CP's best 2nd XI performers this season with bat and ball. To be honest, most of the 2nd XI batsmen don't have a case for FC selection based on their existing FC records, but 2 of their 3 leading 2nd XI bowlers were promoted:

Mohammad Waheed (2nd XI bat avg 145; FC avg 21)
Abdul Samad (2nd XI bat avg 78; FC avg 12)
Asfand Mehran (2nd XI bat avg 72; FC avg 14)
Imran Dogar (2nd XI bat avg 58; FC avg 18).

Mohammad Irfan jnr (2nd XI bowl avg 20; FC bowl avg 23) - wasn't picked for QEA.
Mohammad Ali (2nd XI bowl avg 22) - was picked for QEA, and was CP's best bowler as mentioned above.
Nisar Ahmad (2nd XI bowl avg 23) - played 2 QEA games and averaged 35 with ball.

IMO the 2nd XI competition is of dubious quality, primarily consisting of leftover dross of the old FC setup. However it seems CP are doing okay with their U19s - CP Blues topped Pool B in the 3-Day National U19 Championship. So hopefully CP will promote some of that crop ?

Overall, the fact we're having these debates is a good sign and part of the natural evolution of the system. It's much easier with 6 Regional FC teams and a condensed pool of talent to hold teams accountable than the previous hotchpotch of countless departments and regions. The deadwood are, and will, continue to be filtered out because there's no hiding place now !

 

[ElRaja]

Sialkot comes under Central Punjab according to this:

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...tic-cricket-structure&p=10474165#post10474165

If it's the case CP had first dibs on local youngsters like Huraira but passed on them then that reflects poorly on their selection processes.

fair enough. i think we can treat sialkot as an frontier city lol, both regions ostensibly have dibs on it.

So I'm just scanning at CP's best 2nd XI performers this season with bat and ball. To be honest, most of the 2nd XI batsmen don't have a case for FC selection based on their existing FC records, but 2 of their 3 leading 2nd XI bowlers were promoted:

Mohammad Waheed (2nd XI bat avg 145; FC avg 21)
Abdul Samad (2nd XI bat avg 78; FC avg 12)
Asfand Mehran (2nd XI bat avg 72; FC avg 14)
Imran Dogar (2nd XI bat avg 58; FC avg 18).

Mohammad Irfan jnr (2nd XI bowl avg 20; FC bowl avg 23) - wasn't picked for QEA.
Mohammad Ali (2nd XI bowl avg 22) - was picked for QEA, and was CP's best bowler as mentioned above.
Nisar Ahmad (2nd XI bowl avg 23) - played 2 QEA games and averaged 35 with ball.

IMO the 2nd XI competition is of dubious quality, primarily consisting of leftover dross of the old FC setup. However it seems CP are doing okay with their U19s - CP Blues topped Pool B in the 3-Day National U19 Championship. So hopefully CP will promote some of that crop ?

saad khan had terrible FC stats before his selection for sindh this season, but he did very well. lets not forget a lot of these guys started their fc careers on terrible substandard pitches, so using their FC states from the pre revamp era not to select them, but then to select players who were terrible in teh second xi (and dont necessarily have great fc stats) comp doesnt make sense to me.

relying on under 19 sounds like a bit of crap shoot to me, how much influence can the region have on development of these players? minimal imo.

Overall, the fact we're having these debates is a good sign and part of the natural evolution of the system. It's much easier with 6 Regional FC teams and a condensed pool of talent to hold teams accountable than the previous hotchpotch of countless departments and regions. The deadwood are, and will, continue to be filtered out because there's no hiding place now !

definitely. also makes it very easy to see the different cricketing philosophies across the country. before the revamp i would never have imagined KP, Northern, CP and Sindh to play in such different ways.

 

[Greenstorm]

Central Punjab and Sindh are most corrupt regions in Pakistan. Their cricket teams are a reflection of that.

 

[Seen Sheen]

Good thread. I had been itching to make a thread specifically on the fast bowling woes of CP but resisted thinking that it was probably only me who found their lack of talent extremely underwhelming. Now I see that many posters share the same concern.

I have been following all the regions since the revamp and I got to say that the region with least exciting cricketers has to be CP. It is extremely disappointing to see that the region that has the biggest player pool - and which in the past - has produced so many fast bowlers, struggle as much as they have, especially this season. Their fast bowling seems to the worst and least talented; all the bowlers look decent club level bowlers at best. Always an eye-sore seeing the highlights of CP matches. The fast bowling last season was literally carried by one guy, Hasan Ali and he somehow got the best out of the limited bowling resources.

Now I don't know if the cupboard is totally bare when it comes to fast bowling or the usual nepotism and parchi mafia is at play in the region. I simply refuse to believe that the historic centre of fast bowling in Pakistan can't even produce solid first-class level bowlers and the likes of Muhammad Ali, Bilawal Iqbal, Ahmed Bashir. Northern keep giving new pacers chances every season and frankly whoever they play looks streets ahead of any of the laborious CP pacers.

CP really needs some imaginative and youth-centric approach in the upcoming season if they are to improve on their poor performance this season. Perhaps, they need to look at their coaching setup especially the ones that are managing the lower levels as I seem that's where the problem lies; the coaches working there are either not honest or simply poor talent scouters. PCB probably should interfere and make sure that the whole process of team selection, throughout the different levels (club, city, second XI, first XI) is transparent and competitive. Otherwise, I wouldn't be surprised if they finish bottom of the table next season.

 

[Da_Future_Knick]

Fringe international players who aren’t all that great in domestic matches either. Most of them play selfishly in order to receive a national call up which effects CP in many ways.

The introduction of younger players who are determined and hungry will be a step in the right direction.