Classical Music of Pakistan & India

[Mohammed Rafi]

This is my first post. I have visited this forum before and even used to post under a previous ID some time ago but the forum has clearly changed a lot since then and there appears to be a whole host of new users visiting.

For my first thread, I would like to discuss the topic of classical music in Pakistan. I have long been interested in the klassiki mosiqi of Pakistan but the current dearth of interest in classical music is extremely sad. There is very little interest in this art in Pakistan any more. I am sure that the more knowledgeable posters here are aware that a number of leading musicians came to Pakistan in the aftermath of partition (although, of course, many also remained in India). However, many found that the atmosphere was not conducive to the flowering of this art. Sadly many remained unappreciated. Famously, Bade Ghulam Ali Khan even returned to India (following a spat with a radio official). I hope we can use this thread to open up a useful and educative dialogue for those users who maintain an interest in this sphere of music, or merely those who wish to learn more about this art.

To begin, I am sharing a few of my favourite pieces with other readers on the forum. I hope these will generate some good debate.

Raag Lalit - Ustad Ashiq Ali Khan & Ustad Umeed Ali Khan
[utube]9CD5BAGZnVM[/utube]
These two gentlemen were absurdly talented and both very well known for their work. Their duets were the stuff of legend but both were also immensely successful solo vocalists too. Ustad Umeed Ali Khan suffered from deafness in his later years and died in penury. A great shame - but one common amongst the artistic community of Pakistan

Raag Multani - Ustad Bare Ghulam Ali Khan
[utube]OcmksUWjB3U[/utube]
Surely, this fellow needs no introduction. A giant amongst classical singers, but often a divisive and highly controversial personality.

Raag Sham Kalyan - Malika e Mosiqi Roshanara Begum
[utube]TUbFEAO1K_I[/utube]
I have never heard a more skilled voice in my lifetime. Timing is superb, amazing taans. What a shame we could not give this artist the respect she deserved.

Bajuband Khul Khul Jaye - Ustad Amanat Ali Khan Qasoori (brother of Ustad Bare Ghulam Ali Khan)
[utube]4uQZ89DzNjg[/utube]
Famous thumri in raag bharivi by another fine artist of the Patiala-Kasoor Gharana.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Very educational thread. Unfortunately the knowledge of our classical music is missing in the present youth. Our music is cyclical and depends on melody, as opposed to the the western which is linear and uses harmony. Raagas are basically moods, and there are hundreds of raagas. I can identify only a handful.

Btw which gharanas are prevalent in Pakistan?

 

[Saqs]

Welcome. This thread has [MENTION=22846]Nostalgic[/MENTION] and [MENTION=2071]saadibaba[/MENTION] written all over it.

 

[Mohammed Rafi]

Very educational thread. Unfortunately the knowledge of our classical music is missing in the present youth. Our music is cyclical and depends on melody, as opposed to the the western which is linear and uses harmony. Raagas are basically moods, and there are hundreds of raagas. I can identify only a handful.

Btw which gharanas are prevalent in Pakistan?

A great numbers of gharanas were present at the time of partition. The most notable amongst these as the Qasoor-Patiala gharana (really a hybrid gharana chiefly represented by the likes of Ustad Bare Ghulam Ali Khan and his brothers (Ustad Barkat Ali Khan, Ustad Amanat Ali Khan etc). Also very successful was the Patiala gharana, represented by Ustad Akhtar Hussain Khan and his famous sons, Ustad Amanat Ali Khan and Ustad Fateh Ali Khan and their sons. There was a famous rivalry between Amanat Ali-Fateh Ali and Ustad Nazakat Ali-Salamat Ali of Sham Chorasi Gharana (a small town in Hoshiyarpur). Other gharanas which were well represented included Gwalior (Ustad Umeed Ali), Kirana Gharana of Ustad Abdul Karim Khan and Ustad Abdul Waheed Khan fame (Roshanara Begum), and several others including the Delhi gharana, Qawal Bachon Ka Gharana, Talwandi Gharana etc. In terms of instrumentalists, a wide number of gharanas are again present, including the famous Punjab gharana of tabla players (Ustad Shoukat Hussain Khan) and Amritsar gharana of Sarangi Nawaz (Ustad Nathu Khan). Representatives of these gharanas exist on both sides of the border.

Many of our leading intellectuals, including Faiz Ahmad Faiz and his good friend the famous composer Khursheed Anwar were extremely keen to promote and preserve classical music but ultimately found it very difficult to do so in an unresponsive environment.

 

[CricketCartoons]

...
Many of our leading intellectuals, including Faiz Ahmad Faiz and his good friend the famous composer Khursheed Anwar were extremely keen to promote and preserve classical music but ultimately found it very difficult to do so in an unresponsive environment.

Thank you for this post.

Is it true that the gharanas were formed to preserve the classical music during the British rule? I read that Ustads took it upon themselves to preserve their art and knowledge during the bad political climate, and hence formed gharanas.

And welcome to PP. Na fankaar tujhsa tere baad aaya, [MENTION=137588]Mohammed Rafi[/MENTION] tu bahut yaad aaya.

 

[saadibaba]

Talking of classical music, saw Ustaad Raees Khan in a recent episode of Coke Studio. He is married to Bilquis Khanam of 'Anokha Ladla' fame. Apparently, they met at a function in Karachi where they both performed held by one of my relatives. There was quite an age difference between them but they hit it off. That was his 4th marriage. He went back to India with her but soon both of them came back and he applied for Pakistani nationality. Nice story, isn't it.

 

[amna350]

Classical music of Pakistan and India is most famous in the world.

 

[JaDed]

Bump, thanks to youtube able to google what actually Gharanas meant and how were they formed.

The one mentioned in Bade Ustad Ghulam Ali is the one that did one commercial song for Mughal e Azam and took 25 k rupees at that time.

The voice modulation is remarkable.

 

[JaDed]

Classical music of Pakistan and India is most famous in the world.

Except in India and Pakistan it is more popular in Europe, but I also think its about maturity which comes with age.

I have recently been listening to a lot of Sitar from Hindustani classic and Pandit RaviShankar,Ustaad Vilayat Khan, Ustaad Shahid Parvez Khan are tremendous.

Among new ones Anoushka has been trying fusions and is amazing as well.

 

[MenInG]

Asad Amanat Ali Khan was my favourite from Pakistan

 

[Dingolfy]

Carnatic music is still ardently followed in South India.

 

[JaDed]

Carnatic music is still ardently followed in South India.

Yes, but much less than 90s, surprisingly I see South Indians in America keeping alive the tradition of BharatNatyam and Carnatic music.

 

[PakLFC]

One singer who always seems to be ignored is/was Pankaj Udhas. Don't know why that is when he had a wonderful voice much like mines.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Carnatic is a Very conservative musical form that cannot be easily adopted to a pop singing style. Only appeals to dinosaur purists these days. [MENTION=137142]JaDed[/MENTION]

 

[CricketCartoons]

Carnatic is a Very conservative musical form that cannot be easily adopted to a pop singing style. Only appeals to dinosaur purists these days. [MENTION=137142]JaDed[/MENTION]

Every weekend I attend Veena recital accompanied by a mridangam. Everything else seems garbage in comparison.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Every weekend I attend Veena recital accompanied by a mridangam. Everything else seems garbage in comparison.

As long as there are no vocals, it is fine.

 

[Sidilicious]

Except in India and Pakistan it is more popular in Europe, but I also think its about maturity which comes with age.

I have recently been listening to a lot of Sitar from Hindustani classic and Pandit RaviShankar,Ustaad Vilayat Khan, Ustaad Shahid Parvez Khan are tremendous.

Among new ones Anoushka has been trying fusions and is amazing as well.

I don’t think the first part is true. Over the last few years there seems to have been a resurgence in classical music.

 

[JaDed]

Carnatic is a Very conservative musical form that cannot be easily adopted to a pop singing style. Only appeals to dinosaur purists these days. [MENTION=137142]JaDed[/MENTION]

I do agree that it cannot be adopted but it helps in creating better music and I'm someone that trained in Carnatic for 3-4 years as a kid and its terribly boring esp not being from the culture but I do respect the art of it, it is being passed well.

I don’t think the first part is true. Over the last few years there seems to have been a resurgence in classical music.

I mean the % wise, Europeans attend these concerts way more and remember them but again just my view.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

I do agree that it cannot be adopted but it helps in creating better music and I'm someone that trained in Carnatic for 3-4 years as a kid and its terribly boring esp not being from the culture but I do respect the art of it, it is being passed well.

I was forced into it by my parents and I absolutely despised it. I respect the ability of those who are exponents of the art but it just will never appeal to the next generation unless it accepts change. Purists simply won't put up with anything other than the boring , ultra-nasal singing that everyone indulges in [MENTION=137142]JaDed[/MENTION]

 

[JaDed]

I was forced into it by my parents and I absolutely despised it. I respect the ability of those who are exponents of the art but it just will never appeal to the next generation unless it accepts change. Purists simply won't put up with anything other than the boring , ultra-nasal singing that everyone indulges in [MENTION=137142]JaDed[/MENTION]

Haha yeah, that's why I'm more attracted to Hindustani there is more emphasis on the instruments unlike Carnatic which is all vocal mostly also as per my reading Hindustani separated from Carnatic and evolved on its own with Gharanas and all.

I'm in love with Sitar and Sarod but I think its my internal bias towards hearing Hindustani , a lot of Hindi songs actually use the Raag of Hindustani music to make songs.. but yea they need to evolve.

I finished the first book of carnatic music btw, all the Geethams without interest just because my parents forced me to sometimes I sing randomly almost PTSDish.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Haha yeah, that's why I'm more attracted to Hindustani there is more emphasis on the instruments unlike Carnatic which is all vocal mostly also as per my reading Hindustani separated from Carnatic and evolved on its own with Gharanas and all.

I'm in love with Sitar and Sarod but I think its my internal bias towards hearing Hindustani , a lot of Hindi songs actually use the Raag of Hindustani music to make songs.. but yea they need to evolve.

I finished the first book of carnatic music btw, all the Geethams without interest just because my parents forced me to sometimes I sing randomly almost PTSDish.

Yeah even I prefer Hindustani. The singers actually are trained to be melodic and soulful and it's not just showing off their virtuosity and skill.

 

[JaDed]

Bump! Wo jo ham mein tum mein.

Beghum Akhtar also known as Malika-E-ghazal on Indian side.

Momin the lyricist was a physician,astrologer wonder if during those years those professions were in partnership. @KB

 

[JaDed]

Prabha Atre, Jamuna Kinara Mora Gaon!

 

[Bigboii]

Bump! Wo jo ham mein tum mein.

Beghum Akhtar also known as Malika-E-ghazal on Indian side.

Momin the lyricist was a physician,astrologer wonder if during those years those professions were in partnership. @KB

What's with you and good music you are into hip hop and classical too

Respect!

 

[JaDed]

What's with you and good music you are into hip hop and classical too ��

Respect!

Lol thanks, probably says more about my mood swings I got into this side of desi classical music only 2-3 years ago guess with age, still not into EDM though(except maybe a couple of songs of KSHMR).

 

[KB]

Momin the lyricist was a physician,astrologer wonder if during those years those professions were in partnership. @KB

Perhaps more relevant is the financial independence Momin had. He had inherited wealth and this financial freedom permitted him to pursue his interests, extending well beyond the practice of Unani medicine which ran in the blood, to poetry, astrology, singing, flute playing and chess.

Financial independence also meant that unlike many other poets of his day he did not have to spend much time writing qasidas in praise of patrons and benefactors.

 

[JaDed]

Perhaps more relevant is the financial independence Momin had. He had inherited wealth and this financial freedom permitted him to pursue his interests, extending well beyond the practice of Unani medicine which ran in the blood, to poetry, astrology, singing, flute playing and chess.

Financial independence also meant that unlike many other poets of his day he did not have to spend much time writing qasidas in praise of patrons and benefactors.

Oh thanks for the info, always hard to judge past from the today's view point.

 

[Runner Up]

Insha Ji utho ab kooch karo is one of the best song I have ever listened. I bet no one can sing like Ustad Amanat Ali very natural. Remember there was no sound system or software at the that time when he sang the song.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/I1roLYDDUAw" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[marlonbrowndo]

The 2 best male music artists of the last 100 years were both Pakistani

 

[Nostalgic]

Insha Ji utho ab kooch karo is one of the best song I have ever listened. I bet no one can sing like Ustad Amanat Ali very natural. Remember there was no sound system or software at the that time when he sang the song.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/I1roLYDDUAw" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

What makes this one particularly poignant is that it turned out to be the last ghazal for poet and singer alike.

Ibn-e-Insha, the poet, was being treated for Hodgkins' Lymphoma in London, and on his deathbed, composed this, along with another poem hinting at his imminent demise, "Ab Umar ki Naqdi Khatam Hui." While he was unconscious, a writer friend of his found this poem on his bedside table at the hospital, and immediately faxed it to the papers in Pakistan, where it was published on the front pages with the news that Ibn-e-Insha was nearing his end.

Amanat Ali Khan too passed away after singing this, with no other performance, TV or otherwise, between this and his death.

This ghazal is therefore something of the Scottish Play of our musical history.

 

[desirous of desire]

What makes this one particularly poignant is that it turned out to be the last ghazal for poet and singer alike.

Ibn-e-Insha, the poet, was being treated for Hodgkins' Lymphoma in London, and on his deathbed, composed this, along with another poem hinting at his imminent demise, "Ab Umar ki Naqdi Khatam Hui." While he was unconscious, a writer friend of his found this poem on his bedside table at the hospital, and immediately faxed it to the papers in Pakistan, where it was published on the front pages with the news that Ibn-e-Insha was nearing his end.

Amanat Ali Khan too passed away after singing this, with no other performance, TV or otherwise, between this and his death.

This ghazal is therefore something of the Scottish Play of our musical history.

Didnt know it. I thought this song was just Asad Amanat Ali khan's last performance. Didnt know about his father.

 

[Nostalgic]

Didnt know it. I thought this song was just Asad Amanat Ali khan's last performance. Didnt know about his father.

And I didn't know it was Asad Amanat Ali's last performance too!

Since this ghazal is jinxed/cursed, I would urge everyone never to hum it, just in case...

 

[Bigboii]

The 2 best male music artists of the last 100 years were both Pakistani

hallelujah
Preach on it brotha