Coronavirus in UK

[gazza619]

Your opinion is respectable but the financial loss is going to cause pain and depression that may have a lasting impact for a decade. Knowing how the US and GB work, I wouldn’t be surprised if this leads to a ‘mission to liberate’ certain countries as a cover up to recover the losses.

I am already in a very high band of tax payer, I can only imagine how much more tax I will have to pay to help recover the loss we are suffering. Very early days, I hope and pray for everyone to continue with their jobs/work very soon

Another option for A grade countries like UK, US could be to cut down giving foreign aid for the next few years, reduced spend on defence, and recover losses?

 

[bones]

Another option for A grade countries like UK, US could be to cut down giving foreign aid for the next few years, reduced spend on defence, and recover losses?

A small fraction of the budget contributes to other nations as aid. That’s not going to help the millions who have and will lose jobs, homes and their businesses.

 

[gazza619]

A small fraction of the budget contributes to other nations as aid. That’s not going to help the millions who have and will lose jobs, homes and their businesses.

I dont have the numbers but I am pretty sure billions each year are spent on these elements. It certainly is not a tiny fraction.

 

[bones]

I would take financial loss over people losing their lives. I do understand your point as we do not balance the virus and economic reality. However, being a 1st world country, we can surely lockdown till the deaths, spread minimise. It is a difficult situation for all unfortunately.

Almost everyone would take saving lives over money, no one is going to dispute that here. My problem is the lies and propaganda.

An example, they tell us 31k have died after testing positive for this virus but not one stat to tell us how many of them have died because of it. That is the most important number. From the sounds of it most have who died were already on death’s door.

The nurses and doctors are overwhelmed yet they have time to step outside for clapathons and dancing?

 

[bones]

I dont have the numbers but I am pretty sure billions each year are spent on these elements. It certainly is not a tiny fraction.

It is billions, in the region of 13-15 billion. That comes out to less than 1% of the national budget. It will make a difference but nowhere near what the people need. I remind you, this is the worst recession since the Great Depression so we’ll need a lot more to help people.

 

[MenInG]

Boris Johnson will reveal more detail on his plans to reopen society in England, after unveiling the "first sketch" of his "road map" out of the coronavirus lockdown.

The PM will answer questions from MPs and then the public on Monday while No 10 will publish its 50-page official guidance in Parliament.

Labour's Sir Keir Starmer criticised the PM's plan for lacking clarity.

It comes as Scotland and Wales rejected No 10's new "stay alert" slogan.

In Sunday's televised address to the nation, Mr Johnson announced a "conditional plan" to reopen society, allowing people in England to spend more time outdoors from Wednesday.

The PM also said people who could not work from home - including those in the manufacturing and construction industries - should return to the workplace from Monday but avoid public transport.

Mr Johnson said the government would "modify" lockdown measures over three "careful" steps through to July.

A new Covid Alert System with five levels would influence how quickly the lockdown - which was first announced on 23 March - could be changed.

The first step will allow people to take unlimited amounts of outdoor exercise, sit or sunbathe in parks and play sports with household members from Wednesday.

The changes in guidelines will also allow two people from different households to meet in a park if they stay two metres apart.

He hoped by the second step - "at the earliest by 1 June" - there could be a phased reopening of shops and some primary aged pupils could return to school.

The third step could see some hospitality businesses and other public places reopen - "if the numbers support it" - but not earlier than 1 July.

The prime minister stressed this was all "conditional" on a series of "big ifs" and he would not hesitate to "put on the brakes" if there are further outbreaks of the virus.

Mr Johnson is set to give a statement to Parliament at 15:30 BST on Monday, with more information expected on a Covid-19 alert system, use of face masks, and the return of professional football. He is expected to speak to the public at the Downing Street briefing later.

But Sir Keir said Mr Johnson's speech raised "as many questions as it answers".

'Trying to pull off the impossible'
The prime minister is effectively trying to pull off the impossible. He wants to try to restart normal life, while keeping the virus at bay with limited means to do so.

With no vaccine, the government is reliant on containing any local outbreaks.

But the problem is that even with the extra testing that has been put in place over the past month, there are big holes in the UK's ability to suppress the virus. It takes too long to get test results back - several days in some cases - and those most in need of regular testing, such as care home staff for example, are still reporting they cannot always access tests.

Our ability to trace the close contacts of infected people remains unknown - the piloting of the system, which involves the use of an app and army of contact tracers, has just started on the Isle of Wight. It means we are effectively fighting this "invisible killer" with one hand behind our back.

We are not alone in struggling, similar problems are being encountered by other countries. But we are still some way behind the best prepared and equipped, such as Germany and South Korea.

Labour's shadow business secretary Ed Miliband and shadow employment rights minister Andy McDonald said they were "deeply concerned" about the recommendation that those people unable to work from home should go back to work.

In a letter to Business Secretary Alok Sharma, they said urging staff to return to work with 12 hours' notice and no guidance on how they could stay safe was "irresponsible and wrong".

They called on the government to publish its guidance and ensure it addressed measures such as safe social distancing in the workplace and mandatory Covid-19 risk assessments.

'Stay at home'
Mr Johnson said he had consulted "across the political spectrum, across all four nations of the UK" and that his plan was a "a general consensus on what we could do".

But the leaders of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland - which have their own powers over lockdown measures - have refused to adopt England's new message of "stay alert, control the virus, save lives".

Wales' health minister said there had not been a "four-nations agreement" on the new "stay alert" message and that the advice to "stay at home" in Wales was unchanged.

Scottish First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said there should be a "simpler" message and stressed the "stay at home" slogan would continue to apply in Scotland.

The Northern Ireland Executive said it would "consider its plan for a phased, strategic approach to recovery" at a meeting on Monday, with politicians there emphasising the "stay at home" message ahead of Mr Johnson's address on Monday.

Some union leaders and business groups have criticised the plans, and called for further clarity.

The National Education Union (NEU) said the idea that some schools could reopen from 1 June was "nothing short of reckless" as the infection rate is still "far too great".

Meanwhile, TUC general secretary Frances O'Grady said the PM's statement would cause workers "a lot of confusion and anxiety", and urged No 10 to provide "clear direction" for staff and employers in the form of "tough" new safety rules.

The British Chambers of Commerce said businesses needed their "practical questions answered so they can plan to restart, rebuild and renew".

It comes as a further 269 people have died in the UK after testing positive for coronavirus, taking the total number of deaths recorded to 31,855.

The government missed its target of 100,000 tests a day for the eighth day in a row, with 92,837 tests on Saturday.

In other developments:

John Apter, the national chairman of the Police Federation of England and Wales, said the PM's plans risk being a set of "loose rules that are left open to interpretation" and difficult to enforce
Further details are expected on the government's plans to impose a 14-day quarantine on people flying into the UK, which the prime minister said yesterday would not apply between France and the UK "at this stage"
The government is expected to announce on Monday that some elite athletes can start an initial phase of restricted group training later this week
The justice secretary has indicated there may be changes to lockdown

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-52612449

 

[Robert]

Another option for A grade countries like UK, US could be to cut down giving foreign aid for the next few years, reduced spend on defence, and recover losses?

UK has been cutting defence spending for decades. We barely meet the 2% GDP NATO target.

Foreign aid can be seen as projection of British soft power abroad. If we help nations stabilise and develop, terrorism will not foment there and we won’t have to spend more on defence.

 

[MenInG]

Raab: UK economy will not be back to work until July at very earliest

The British government said non-essential retailers would not go back to work until June at the earliest while other sectors will not go back to work until July at the earliest, Foreign Secretary Dominic Raab said.

"There's the other changes for things like non essential retail and people going back to school, particularly primary school, which won't start until the earliest on the first of June, subject to conditions," Raab said.

"Starting from the 4th of July at the very earliest, those other sectors where they are inherently more difficult because people are mixing together and it's difficult to maintain the social distancing, we wouldn't be able to say ... that we would start them at least until the 4th of July."

 

[MenInG]

Coronavirus: No haircuts, pubs or restaurants until July at the 'earliest', says Dominic Raab

 

[Rana]

So I guess the Rich outspoken folk will probably pipe down now that Golf courses have opened.

 

[gazza619]

It is billions, in the region of 13-15 billion. That comes out to less than 1% of the national budget. It will make a difference but nowhere near what the people need. I remind you, this is the worst recession since the Great Depression so we’ll need a lot more to help people.

I was also suggesting to cut down on defence budgets of these nations...

Its about time they forget about their long term goal of conquering the world and planet mars..

 

[MenInG]

London underground

 

[Rana]

There never was any regulations preventing people from travelling to work so they'd face no issues.

Barbers will still be shut because they're on the original forceful business closure list (and obviously can't maintain social distancing), would recommend investing in a set of clippers and trying your best!

Golf courses on the border of England and Wales will open partially only to England. The lockstep is not on.

 

[Rana]

Coronavirus: No haircuts, pubs or restaurants until July at the 'earliest', says Dominic Raab

How does Raab and Parliament officials manage to look so immaculate with their haircuts every day? What regulations are they following?

 

[James]

Furlough scheme ends on 30 June, I doubt it will be extended as the cost to underwrite it is huge, people are going to have a rude awakening, most of these jobs will not be available as the whole economy has been destroyed, these viruses are not going to go away, the world will just have to live with it and carry on as best as they can.

Take responsibility for your health, lose weight, stop eating so much, increase your Vit D intake.

The noise in both the mainstream media and on social media has become so deafening and tiresome at this point that I’m tempted to agree with your post. It seems like the virus has now become a part of our day-to-day lives. We don’t even know yet if the lockdown really “worked” or not.

 

[MenInG]

Five further deaths in Scotland

Five more coronavirus deaths have been registered among hospital patients who have tested positive in Scotland, taking the country's total to 1,862.

First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said numbers were usually lower at weekends. She says 13,627 people have now tested positive for the virus in Scotland, a rise of 141 from 13,486 the day before.

There are 1,453 people in hospital with confirmed or suspected Covid-19, down 31 from the previous day, Sturgeon added. Of these patients, 80 are in intensive care, a fall of two.

 

[HitWicket]

Golf courses on the border of England and Wales will open partially only to England. The lockstep is not on.

Again, there's never been any laws or regulations anywhere that mandate golf courses be shut (although some other facilities at the course would need to be). It's the decision of the regional golf bodies (and the individual courses after that) whether they want the courses to be open or not.

 

[MenInG]

Passengers travelling on public transport in London are being told to wear face coverings, such as a scarf, piece of cloth or mask.

The announcement from Transport for London (TfL) also says:

The requirement to maintain 2m (6ft) social distancing wherever possible means that TfL will only be able to carry around 13-15% of the normal number of passengers on the Tube and bus networks even when 100% of services are operating once again

It is working to gradually build up its services and London Underground is aiming to restore the Circle Line and to re-open some of the 37 stations that have been closed for several weeks

Everyone is asked to consider if their journey is necessary before travelling, and to think about the times, routes and ways they travel

People should walk and cycle if they can and new walking and cycling space is being created through the London Streetspace programme
Passengers should carry a hand sanitizer and wash their hands before and after they travel

 

[Rana]

So, can we drive into Wales and Scotland?

 

[Rana]

So the 50 page document has some significant changes underlined, but someone will argue that there are hardly any changes on this thread just to discredit me

 

[HitWicket]

So the 50 page document has some significant changes underlined, but someone will argue that there are hardly any changes on this thread just to discredit me

Just read through the step one (i.e what's in place from Wednesday) section of the document and I don't see a single change to any laws/regulations we had in place already in England, perhaps you'd care to point any out?

 

[Rana]

Just read through the step one (i.e what's in place from Wednesday) section of the document and I don't see a single change to any laws/regulations we had in place already in England, perhaps you'd care to point any out?

No, not for you. You are not rational

 

[HitWicket]

No, not for you. You are not rational

Ah well isn't that convenient, you were happy to debate this over the last few days but as soon as an official document comes out that shows there's no immediate changes to any laws or regulations (as you claimed there would be) suddenly you just want to claim 'yes it does' and run away from discussion on that topic, hilarious.

 

[Rana]

Ah well isn't that convenient, you were happy to debate this over the last few days and as soon as a document comes out that states there's no immediate changes to any laws or regulations (as you claimed there would be) suddenly you just want to claim 'yes it does' and run away from discussion on that topic, hilarious.

You are not worth it I’m afraid.

I have always tried to argue and question the Governments decisions in a constructive manner but you have tried to derail the arguments due to a personal vendetta. I could care less about proving you wrong anymore because your failure is for all to see.

 

[HitWicket]

On a re-read I do concede that there does appear to be one change that will require a change in the laws/regulations, that being allowing people to spent time outdoors without exercising (presumably to include things like picnics and sunbathing as the media seem to be referring to it as). That is quite clearly the only change to any regulations however.

 

[Rana]

There's an update on the furlough scheme coming Tuesday apparently, the indications from the papers have been they'll either try and gradually reduce from the 80% figure or/and they'll only allow businesses in certain areas (hospitality for example) to apply for an extension.

Another example of getting excited at UK handouts which the taxpayer will have to foot the bill for. But I guess you won’t know anything about that

 

[Firebat]

People in England should cover their faces in settings where they can't social distance, the government says

Most international arrivals to the UK to be quarantined for 14 days

PM Boris Johnson will explain the measures to MPs and then give a news conference at 19:00 BST

 

[HitWicket]

Another example of getting excited at UK handouts which the taxpayer will have to foot the bill for. But I guess you won’t know anything about that

Is the alternative of plunging millions into unemployment overnight more attractive to you?

 

[Rana]

Is the alternative of plunging millions into unemployment overnight more attractive to you?

Contradicting yourself now,

Clearly not. I would like them all to work and earn their bread and butter, which they are slowly restarting to do so.

Whilst the furlough scheme has played its role in keeping families afloat during the lockdown (which has began lifting), it is time now to cap it and deal with restoring our economy, plus the debt incurred to the government. Not to further add to this debt because you feel to scared to go to work, or others like you.

 

[Firebat]

UK's plan for exiting the coronavirus lockdown

LONDON (Reuters) - The British government on Monday published its plan for exiting the coronavirus lockdown.

The 51-page document, entitled “Our Plan to Rebuild: The UK Government’s COVID-19 recovery strategy”, gives an outline of how the United Kingdom could come out of lockdown.

Following are the main points:

Spoiler

HOW FAST?
“This is not a short-term crisis. It is likely that COVID-19 will circulate in the human population long-term, possibly causing periodic epidemics. In the near future, large epidemic waves cannot be excluded without continuing some measures.”

“In the near term, we cannot afford to make drastic changes,” the government said.

THE VULNERABLE
- Those in the clinically extremely vulnerable cohort will continue to be advised to shield themselves for some time yet

BACK TO WORK?
- For the foreseeable future, workers should continue to work from home rather than their normal physical workplace, wherever possible

- All workers who cannot work from home should travel to work if their workplace is open.

SCHOOLS
- Schools should prepare to begin to open for more children from 1 June. The government’s ambition is for all primary school children to return to school before the summer for a month if feasible.

TRANSPORT
- Everybody (including critical workers) should continue to avoid public transport wherever possible. Walk or cycle wherever possible. Try and avoid peak times on public transport.

- Social distancing guidance on public transport must be followed rigorously. As with workplaces, transport operators should follow appropriate guidance to make their services COVID-19 Secure; this will be published this week.

INTERNATIONAL TRAVEL
- The government will require all international arrivals not on a short list of exemptions to self-isolate in their accommodation for fourteen days on arrival into the UK. All journeys within the Common Travel Area will also be exempt from these measures.

- These international travel measures will not come into force on 13 May but will be introduced as soon as possible. Further details, and guidance, will be set out shortly, and the measures and list of exemptions will be kept under regular review.

BUBBLES
- UK is looking at how to allow people to expand their household group to include one other household. This could be based on the New Zealand model of household “bubbles”.

NON-ESSENTIAL RETAIL
- Non-essential retail will reopen in phases from June 1.

- After July 4, some remaining businesses could open. Examples include personal care (such as hairdressers and beauty salons) hospitality (such as food service providers, pubs and accommodation), public places (such as places of worship) and leisure facilities (like cinemas).

- The government will carefully phase and pilot re-openings to test their ability to adopt the new COVID-19 Secure guidelines.

MASKS
- The government is now advising that people should aim to wear a face-covering in enclosed spaces where social distancing is not always possible

GOING OUTSIDE
- People can now also spend time outdoors. People may exercise outside as many times each day as they wish. People may drive to outdoor open spaces irrespective of distance.

COMPLIANCE
- The Government is examining more stringent enforcement measures for non-compliance, as it has seen in many other countries.

COST
- These measures are extraordinarily costly and cannot be sustained for a prolonged period of time. As the UK adjusts the current restrictions, the Government will also need to wind down the economic support measures while people are eased back to work.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-h...xiting-the-coronavirus-lockdown-idUKKBN22N1TL

 

[Rana]

A 51 page document outlining how we could come out of lockdown has been published overnight, yet a poster here would argue that no significant changes have taken place just to discredit me

 

[Rana]

-Paid Nannies and child minders can work
-No 14 day quarantine between UK and France travellers

Yet someone here claims that there have been no significant changes

 

[HitWicket]

Contradicting yourself now,

Where exactly?

Clearly not. I would like them all to work and earn their bread and butter, which they are slowly restarting to do so.

Whilst the furlough scheme has played its role in keeping families afloat during the lockdown (which has began lifting), it is time now to cap it and deal with restoring our economy, plus the debt incurred to the government. Not to further add to this debt because you feel to scared to go to work, or others like you.

The furlough scheme has nothing to do with employees, it's an employer dictated scheme. If an employer wants their employees to return (and clearly from a business point of view they will want to get back to normal as soon as possible) and someone doesn't want to return to work they don't get their furlough payments.

People will gradually return to work, there are still many industries and businesses where not everyone is going to be able to safely return to work (or their job is not viable in the the current situation) by the current end of the scheme. By gradually phasing out this scheme (by reducing the amount of furlough pay and allowing people to return part time again reducing the amount of furlough pay) less people will simply find themselves just made redundant because their job cannot currently take place resulting in sudden mass-unemployment.

Are you advocating for (in the very near future) cramming tens of thousands of people into sports stadiums and other venues across the country, having people sat in very close proximity in restaurants, bars/pubs etc. That's very clearly not going to happen and would end in disaster if it did.

 

[HitWicket]

-Paid Nannies and child minders can work
-No 14 day quarantine between UK and France travellers

Yet someone here claims that there have been no significant changes

How is that any different from the regulations last week...? Nannies and child minders were legally free to work last week and travellers between France and the UK were free to do so without quarantine.

 

[Rana]

Where exactly?



The furlough scheme has nothing to do with employees, it's an employer dictated scheme. If an employer wants their employees to return (and clearly from a business point of view they will want to get back to normal as soon as possible) and someone doesn't want to return to work they don't get their furlough payments.

People will gradually return to work, there are still many industries and businesses where not everyone is going to be able to safely return to work (or their job is not viable in the the current situation) by the current end of the scheme. By gradually phasing out this scheme (by reducing the amount of furlough pay and allowing people to return part time again reducing the amount of furlough pay) less people will simply find themselves just made redundant because their job cannot currently take place resulting in sudden mass-unemployment.

Are you advocating for (in the very near future) cramming tens of thousands of people into sports stadiums and other venues across the country, having people sat in very close proximity in restaurants, bars/pubs etc. That's very clearly not going to happen and would end in disaster if it did.

Not once have I advocated thousands of people cramming into small spaces, show me where I have? Or stop lying.

Good to see that you are finally awakening to the changes. Maybe you have safely got out of your bed

 

[Firebat]

What can I do from Wednesday that I couldn’t do before?

The government has published some answers to FAQs on its website including "what can I do on 13 May that I can't do now?".

The answer includes spending time outdoors, meeting one other person from a different household and going to a garden centre.

It comes as we expect to hear more from Boris Johnson very shortly.

You can read the full document here - https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...avirus-outbreak-faqs-what-you-can-and-cant-do

 

[Rana]

How is that any different from the regulations last week...? Nannies and child minders were legally free to work last week and travellers between France and the UK were free to do so without quarantine.

Oh so there is no need to report this as a clarification??? Do you have access to a TV or are you afraid of being infected through a television also?

 

[HitWicket]

Not once have I advocated thousands of people cramming into small spaces, show me where I have? Or stop lying.

Your response to whether you wanted a sudden end to the furloughs scheme that would see a massive amount of people suddenly plunged into unemployment was:

"I would like them all to work and earn their bread and butter, which they are slowly restarting to do so."

For a massive amount of those that would be plunged into unemployment to return to work would require the full opening and operation of these venues, restaurants, bars, pubs etc across the country.

 

[Rana]

PM Johnson about to clarify more

 

[HitWicket]

Oh so there is no need to report this as a clarification??? Do you have access to a TV or are you afraid of being infected through a television also?

Making something clear without changing it is not a change in regulation.

 

[Rana]

Making something clear without changing anything is not a change in regulation.

I’m sorry, your full of...

 

[Rana]

Your response to whether you wanted a sudden end to the furloughs scheme that would see a massive amount of people suddenly plunged into unemployment was:

"I would like them all to work and earn their bread and butter, which they are slowly restarting to do so."

For a massive amount of those that would be plunged into unemployment to return to work would require the full opening and operation of these venues, restaurants, bars, pubs etc across the country.

Over reading. Paranoid post. Clearly the lockdown has affected your mentally. Please seek help

 

[HitWicket]

I’m sorry, your full of...

Can I clarify then, are you claiming that making something clear, without changing regulations, is infact a change in regulation?

Over reading. Paranoid post. Clearly the lockdown has affected your mentally. Please seek help

So again to clarify, what alternative option are you proposing:

1) A sudden cut off of the furloughs scheme resulting in a sudden unemployment rise.
2) The opening (and normal operation) of all those venues listed above to allow everyone across the country to return to work.

 

[Rana]

Can I clarify then, are you claiming that making something clear, without changing regulations, is infact a change in regulation?



So again to clarify, what alternative option are you proposing:

1) A sudden cut off of the furloughs scheme resulting in a sudden unemployment rise.
2) The opening (and normal operation) of all those venues listed above to allow everyone across the country to return to work.

Send your questions into the PM please, they may select your questions in the press briefing.

 

[HitWicket]

Send your questions into the PM please, they may select your questions in the press briefing.

The government have already made their viewpoints relevant to the above clear through the released document and their indication to the media that the furlough scheme won't abruptly end at the end of June, I was looking for your opinions/answers if you don't mind giving them?

 

[Rana]

The government have already made their viewpoints relevant to the above clear through the released document and their indication to the media that the furlough scheme won't abruptly end at the end of June, I was looking for your opinions/answers if you don't mind giving them?

Well it’s not something to celebrate. And if you feel that an end the the scheme means mass gatherings, so be it.

That doesn’t mean I am advocating death before you draw up a sick conclusion. This is wartime.

 

[MenInG]

 

[Rana]

Kier Starmer is gun. Labour has a proper leader

 

[HitWicket]

Well it’s not something to celebrate. And if you feel that an end the the scheme means mass gatherings, so be it.

That doesn’t mean I am advocating death before you draw up a sick conclusion. This is wartime.

A sudden end to the scheme doesn't necessarily mean mass gatherings, the most likely outcome would be mass unemployment from all those businesses who don't currently have the work available for their employees and therefore cannot justify keeping them on the books.

In that case the only realistic counter to prevent that mass unemployment would be to permit these gatherings and premature opening of venues so that the employees of businesses in these sectors can return. Ultimately that would clearly result in conditions that are prime for the wide-spread transmission of the virus, driving up the R value and quite possibly bringing to the fore again the risk of overwhelming the NHS.

The alternative is to extend the furlough scheme in a way that reduces the cost of it and allows people to gradually return to work (even if in reduced capacity) as their job becomes viable again. As time goes on the risk obviously decreases. Despite that we will clearly see some unemployment whenever this scheme ends, the aim should be to reduce that in a way that works in tandem with reducing the health risks.

Kier Starmer is gun. Labour has a proper leader

Agreed, there's light and day between the clarity in the way he and Boris speak. The way he individually picks apart each point is brilliant and presumably comes from his previous legal experience.

 

[princeuk]

Nicola Sturgeon has made it perfectly clear that she is goig to do her own thing than follow Boris Johnson, She doesnt want to compromise on peoples lives for the sake of ending of the lockdown and I agree with her, we might, or might not be ending the lockdown the same as england.

Five further deaths in Scotland

Five more coronavirus deaths have been registered among hospital patients who have tested positive in Scotland, taking the country's total to 1,862.

First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said numbers were usually lower at weekends. She says 13,627 people have now tested positive for the virus in Scotland, a rise of 141 from 13,486 the day before.

There are 1,453 people in hospital with confirmed or suspected Covid-19, down 31 from the previous day, Sturgeon added. Of these patients, 80 are in intensive care, a fall of two.

 

[Rana]

Nicola Sturgeon has made it perfectly clear that she is goig to do her own thing than follow Boris Johnson, She doesnt want to compromise on peoples lives for the sake of ending of the lockdown and I agree with her, we might, or might not be ending the lockdown the same as england.

Therefore England’s taxpayer should not be responsible for Scotland’s economy.

 

[James]

Is it time for [MENTION=2016]Rana[/MENTION] and [MENTION=139981]HitWicket[/MENTION] to call a truce? At each other’s figurative throats in every thread it seems. Chill out gents.

 

[MenInG]

There's a blast from the past for Boris Johnson as he fields - via video link - a question from former Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn.

Mr Corbyn says the PM's roadmap will worsen inequality, and says restrictions should not be eased until the crisis is "under control".

He says the current plan will give employers "carte blanche" to make people go to work without “proper consideration” of safety.

But the prime minister rejects that, saying the new advice on going to work is only a "change of emphasis" from what was in place before.

He says safety is a "vital issue" but new guidelines for workplaces will ensure they can be "Covid-secure".

 

[KingKhanWC]

What can I do from Wednesday that I couldn’t do before?

The government has published some answers to FAQs on its website including "what can I do on 13 May that I can't do now?".

The answer includes spending time outdoors, meeting one other person from a different household and going to a garden centre.

It comes as we expect to hear more from Boris Johnson very shortly.

You can read the full document here - https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...avirus-outbreak-faqs-what-you-can-and-cant-do

The most confused government I've ever seen and now they confusing the public. lol

A lot of people in the UK have had enough and are living life as normal as they possibly can.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Is being done?

Got any statistical evidence of a rise in alcoholism?

I would say it is possible that there has been a rise in mental illness but we simply won’t know until the GP surgeries come properly back on line and referrals to mental health services resume.

"while off-licence sales of alcohol soared 31.4% in volume terms"

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...il-sales-to-record-low-but-alcohol-sales-rise

I personally know of many women drinking wine every night, men driking bottles of spirits every night which shows in the increase of sales.

Mental illness will be at an all time high, everyday I see people who look broken.

They want to break your spirit(no pun) and have managed to do so to many people.

They have lost my support for sure.

Timing is everything. In my opinion it’s not that they have done the wrong things - it’s that they have done them at the wrong times. i.e far too late. They were too slow to lock the country down and too reactive.

If they had proactively implemented the same kind of lockdown at the beginning of March, my guess is that there would have been far less than 30,000 dead and we would be looking at a full summer lifting of the lockdown in June.

For me it's not the timing.

UK is 5th or 6th richest nation. Should have followed tGermany, test almost everyone, isolate those infected and after a short period let those who are low risk carry on their normal lives.

What people are missing is this government has made serious cuts for years and now their policies have helped kill people and ruin the economy. Sure damage was to be done but again Germany arent in such a bad position, yet we are.

Irony is Britain helped defeat Hitler, now what nation is far superiour in every way , yet we have become a 2nd world country. Not sure Great should be part of Britain anymore.

Heck, Pakistan has done a better job and it's a poor country with a weak healthcare system.

 

[Rana]

Is it time for [MENTION=2016]Rana[/MENTION] and [MENTION=139981]HitWicket[/MENTION] to call a truce? At each other’s figurative throats in every thread it seems. Chill out gents.

I am going to voice my opinion regardless of how it may upset people. And I will continue to defend my views.

-I am pleased to see the 51 page document which is essential to restoring normalcy.

-I will continue to champion the voice of those who are seriously worried about our economy and the mental health of our public

-I will also challenge those who support orchestrated dancing NHS staff videos during a nationwide pandemic.

Anyone who wants to engage in debates with me is free to do so with caution, because I won’t lie down so easily.

 

[HitWicket]

"while off-licence sales of alcohol soared 31.4% in volume terms"

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...il-sales-to-record-low-but-alcohol-sales-rise

Statistically with the closure of all licensed premises this pretty much means average alcohol consumption has remained pretty stable compared to before lockdown.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Statistically with the closure of all licensed premises this pretty much means average alcohol consumption has remained pretty much stable compared to before lockdown.

Link?

 

[HitWicket]

Link?

In 2017, 31% of all alcohol (by volume of pure alcohol) was sold in the ‘on-trade’; that is licensed premises like pubs, bars and restaurants.

https://www.drinkaware.co.uk/research/data/consumption-uk/

 

[KingKhanWC]

https://www.drinkaware.co.uk/research/data/consumption-uk/

This is 2020 and Im alluding to stats under lockdown. Ive shown stats under lockdown an increase of alcohol sales.

 

[HitWicket]

This is 2020 and Im alluding to stats under lockdown. Ive shown stats under lockdown an increase of alcohol sales.

I highly doubt there's been a drastic change in where people consume their alcohol in the last 3 years.

Surely your point is comparing peoples consumption of alcohol consumption in lockdown to their alcohol consumption out of lockdown? Assuming the alcohol consumption stats in 2017 are similar to they would have been this year we've seen roughly a 31% decrease in alcohol sales in lockdown due to the closure of licensed premises, which pretty much negates the 31.4% increase of alcohol sales in shops to show the average alcohol sales per person hasn't really changed that much during lockdown.

 

[KingKhanWC]

I highly doubt there's been a drastic change in where people consume their alcohol in the last 3 years.

Surely your point is comparing peoples consumption of alcohol consumption in lockdown to their alcohol consumption out of lockdown? Assuming the alcohol consumption stats in 2017 are similar to they would have been this year we've seen roughly a 31% decrease in alcohol sales in lockdown due to the closure of licensed premises, which pretty much negates the 31.4% increase of alcohol sales in shops to show the average alcohol sales per person hasn't really changed that much during lockdown.

Its a totally different sitaution in lockdown, people are more stessed. We need actual data from the lockdown, any stats outside this cant be used to compare. If you feel they can , we will just have to disagree.

 

[HitWicket]

Its a totally different sitaution in lockdown, people are more stessed. We need actual data from the lockdown, any stats outside this cant be used to compare. If you feel they can , we will just have to disagree.

But to establish whether alcohol consumption has increased during lockdown you need to compare to alcohol consumption outside lockdown? How else are you going to establish if lockdown has increased consumption?

 

[Rana]

Its a totally different sitaution in lockdown, people are more stessed. We need actual data from the lockdown, any stats outside this cant be used to compare. If you feel they can , we will just have to disagree.

Good point. I’m guessing alcohol sales in supermarkets and off-license stored increased dramatically as many people would be drinking a lot more Monday to Thursday as compared to the usual high consumption on the weekends.

Your point about depression on an all time high leading to alcohol consumption is equally valid.

 

[The Viper]

About 136,000 people in England currently infected with COVID-19: study

Around 136,000 people in England are currently infected with COVID-19, according to early results from the first large-scale study in Britain into the spread of the disease.

Britain’s Office for National Statistics said it estimated that about 0.24%, or one in 400, of England’s population were carrying the disease during the April 26-May 8 survey period.

But there is a wide range of uncertainty around the true number of people infected, which the ONS said could range from 76,000 to 225,000 at a standard 95% confidence interval.

The figures are based on the first 7,000 results from a study covering 25,000 people in 10,000 households chosen at random across England.

Britain’s government is slowly starting to ease coronavirus restrictions - including encouraging more people to return to work - but like many countries has said it needs to ensure this does not accelerate the spread of the disease.

The pilot survey is led by the University of Oxford and the University of Manchester alongside U.S. health data company IQVIA (IQV.N) and public health laboratories, and will expand over the next year to cover Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.

Survey participants are being tested weekly for the first five weeks, and monthly thereafter, in order to help track how fast COVID-19 is spreading.

The results only show people who are currently infected with COVID-19, not those who have recovered from the disease.

Some 1.4 million people have been tested since the outbreak of the disease in Britain, of whom 223,000 have tested positive, according to government data.

The ONS survey is also collecting blood samples. These will allow researchers to check if people have antibodies indicating past infection, once suitable tests become available.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ly-infected-with-covid-19-study-idUSKBN22N2P7

 

[bones]

-I am pleased to see the 51 page document which is essential to restoring normalcy.

-I will continue to champion the voice of those who are seriously worried about our economy and the mental health of our public

-I will also challenge those who support orchestrated dancing NHS staff videos during a nationwide pandemic.

For me the opening up of parks is huge - expect a huge rise in people going with their kids who have been prisoners in their own homes for 2 months unnecessarily. Also the meeting of your mum or dad will be read as meeting both mum and dad, which again is huge. Now these incompetent monkeys have finally bowed to the ever increasing pressures that you can’t decide whether or not people can meet family.

The economy is blown to pieces, these sheep are happy with furlough schemes but have no idea how we’ll pay it back. Taxes and austerity for at least a decade and once again the fit, young and healthy will foot the bill for these old timers. Typical tories (I’m not labour btw). Everyone has been asking the wrong questions and I am fed up with it.

As for the dancing and clapping my dumb neighbours joined in on this crap. Fair to say I know know who the idiots to avoid are now. Not only is it a total waste of time like a minutes silence is but to do it when hospitals are supposed to be overwhelmed? What takes the biscuit is when you ask them why we are we clapping for them when actually helping them would do a lot more wouldn’t it? What is actually gained by doing it? Nothing.

 

[Robert]

"while off-licence sales of alcohol soared 31.4% in volume terms"

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...il-sales-to-record-low-but-alcohol-sales-rise

I personally know of many women drinking wine every night, men driking bottles of spirits every night which shows in the increase of sales.

Mental illness will be at an all time high, everyday I see people who look broken.

They want to break your spirit(no pun) and have managed to do so to many people.






For me it's not the timing.

UK is 5th or 6th richest nation. Should have followed tGermany, test almost everyone, isolate those infected and after a short period let those who are low risk carry on their normal lives.

What people are missing is this government has made serious cuts for years and now their policies have helped kill people and ruin the economy. Sure damage was to be done but again Germany arent in such a bad position, yet we are.

Irony is Britain helped defeat Hitler, now what nation is far superiour in every way , yet we have become a 2nd world country. Not sure Great should be part of Britain anymore.

Heck, Pakistan has done a better job and it's a poor country with a weak healthcare system.

Britain saw fit to elect a lazy and incompetent PM.

Germany spends a lot more than us on health care and is led by a scientist instead of some classics type.

 

[Robert]

This is 2020 and Im alluding to stats under lockdown. Ive shown stats under lockdown an increase of alcohol sales.

Of course there has been, the pubs are shut! )

 

[Rana]

For me the opening up of parks is huge - expect a huge rise in people going with their kids who have been prisoners in their own homes for 2 months unnecessarily. Also the meeting of your mum or dad will be read as meeting both mum and dad, which again is huge. Now these incompetent monkeys have finally bowed to the ever increasing pressures that you can’t decide whether or not people can meet family.

The economy is blown to pieces, these sheep are happy with furlough schemes but have no idea how we’ll pay it back. Taxes and austerity for at least a decade and once again the fit, young and healthy will foot the bill for these old timers. Typical tories (I’m not labour btw). Everyone has been asking the wrong questions and I am fed up with it.

As for the dancing and clapping my dumb neighbours joined in on this crap. Fair to say I know know who the idiots to avoid are now. Not only is it a total waste of time like a minutes silence is but to do it when hospitals are supposed to be overwhelmed? What takes the biscuit is when you ask them why we are we clapping for them when actually helping them would do a lot more wouldn’t it? What is actually gained by doing it? Nothing.

The past few days on this thread have been frustrating. I think some people are in denial of change and do not want it. It feels like they want you to feel as if you are a murderer for wanting normalcy to resume. As if wanting the economy back is a major crime because you are preferring money over lives.

Nobody here has yet commented on Professor Chris Witty’s remarks by the end of yesterday’s conference. How is sending children back to school something that people think is going to kill people?

 

[IMMY69]

Of course there has been, the pubs are shut! )

Exactly...

That was a dumb stat to bring up...

Average Excess deaths 30 odd thousand higher then in other years.
That’s the stat we should all be worried about.

 

[Rana]

Of course there has been, the pubs are shut! )

His point on Depression leading to access alcohol consumption is valid.

 

[MenInG]

Deaths in care homes falling in England and Wales

The number of deaths linked to coronavirus in care homes in England and Wales has fallen, figures show.

The Office for National Statistics analysis showed there were 2,423 fatalities where the virus was mentioned on the death certificate in the week ending 1 May - down from nearly 2,800 the week before.

More than 8,300 deaths in care homes have been linked to virus since the epidemic started.

The number of hospital deaths has been falling since the second week of April.

 

[the Great Khan]

Another option for A grade countries like UK, US could be to cut down giving foreign aid for the next few years, reduced spend on defence, and recover losses?

simple, cut foreign aid and provide debt relief. End of.

 

[the Great Khan]

For me the opening up of parks is huge - expect a huge rise in people going with their kids who have been prisoners in their own homes for 2 months unnecessarily. Also the meeting of your mum or dad will be read as meeting both mum and dad, which again is huge. Now these incompetent monkeys have finally bowed to the ever increasing pressures that you can’t decide whether or not people can meet family.

The economy is blown to pieces, these sheep are happy with furlough schemes but have no idea how we’ll pay it back. Taxes and austerity for at least a decade and once again the fit, young and healthy will foot the bill for these old timers. Typical tories (I’m not labour btw). Everyone has been asking the wrong questions and I am fed up with it.

As for the dancing and clapping my dumb neighbours joined in on this crap. Fair to say I know know who the idiots to avoid are now. Not only is it a total waste of time like a minutes silence is but to do it when hospitals are supposed to be overwhelmed? What takes the biscuit is when you ask them why we are we clapping for them when actually helping them would do a lot more wouldn’t it? What is actually gained by doing it? Nothing.

Taxes and austerity will not work. They will have to spend. there is no other option. Even senior Tories are saying this. They will need to initiate a Marshall plan like situation where they can borrow on the cheap as interest rates are low, spend on infrastructure, communication and rebuild businesses. Austerity will destroy whats left. They can pay over the long term.

Once the economy gets back on its feet, which it will once the virus' back has been broken, they can look to make strategic savings in some areas. If they pursue austerity they will destroy the economy.

 

[MenInG]

Further 50 coronavirus deaths in Scotland

A total of 1,912 patients have died in Scotland after testing positive for coronavirus, up by 50 from Monday.

First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said 13,763 people in Scotland have now tested positive for the virus, a rise of 136 from the day before.

As of last night 1,618 patients were in hospital with confirmed or suspected Covid-19, up 165 from 1,453 the previous day, Sturgeon added. Of these, 81 are in intensive care - an increase of one.

However, she stressed the rise in cases is being driven by patients suspected of having the virus, with confirmed cases down 14 in 24 hours to 1,131.

The rise in suspected cases in hospitals is being looked into, the First Minister added, as she cautioned against any "undue concern".

 

[MenInG]

The UK scheme to pay wages of workers on leave because of coronavirus will be extended to October, Chancellor Rishi Sunak said.

He said the government backed workers and companies going into the lockdown, and would support them coming out.

Mr Sunak confirmed that employees will continue to receive 80% of their monthly wages up to £2,500.

But he said the government will ask companies to "start sharing" the cost of the scheme from August onwards.

Mr Sunak rejected suggestions some people might get "addicted" to furlough if it was extended.

Some 7.5 million workers are now covered by the scheme, up from 6.3 million last week, he said.

The chancellor told the Commons that from August, the scheme would continue for all sectors and regions of the country but with greater flexibility to support the transition back to work, he said.

Employers currently using the scheme would be able to bring furloughed employees back part-time.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-52634759

 

[MenInG]

 

[Firebat]

Further 350 deaths in hospitals in England

Another 350 people who tested positive for Covid-19 have died in hospitals in England.

The total number of confirmed coronavirus deaths has risen to 23,709, NHS England said.

Of the 350 deaths announced today, 44 occurred on 11 May, 90 occurred on 10 May and 44 occurred on 9 May.

The figures also show 92 of the newly announced deaths took place between 1 May and 8 May, 76 took place in April, while the remaining four deaths occurred in March, with the earliest occuring on 17 March.

NHS England releases updated figures each day showing the dates of every coronavirus-related death in hospitals in England, often including previously uncounted deaths that took place several days or even weeks ago.

This is because of the time it takes for deaths to be confirmed as testing positive for Covid-19, for post-mortem examinations to be processed and for data from the tests to be validated.

There have been a further nine deaths of patients who tested positive for Covid-19 in Northern Ireland, bringing fatalities to 447.

The latest UK-wide figures are expected later.

 

[Firebat]

Train station ticket worker dies after being spat at

A railway ticket office worker died of coronavirus after being spat at while on duty, it has emerged.

Belly Mujinga, 47, was on the concourse of Victoria station in London in March when a member of the public who said he had Covid-19 spat and coughed at her and a colleague.

Within days of the assault, both women fell ill with the virus.

Ms Mujinga, who had underlying respiratory problems, was admitted to Barnet Hospital and put on a ventilator but died on 5 April, her trade union, the Transport Salaried Staffs Association (TSSA), said.

British Transport Police said an inquiry had been launched to trace the man who spat at the pair.

 

[MenInG]

Another 16 Covid-19 deaths recorded in Wales

Public Health Wales (PHW) said a total of 1,132 people have died in Wales after testing positive for coronavirus, an increase of 16 on Monday's figures.

A further 105 people have tested positive for Covid-19, bringing the total number of positive cases in Wales to 11,573.

PHW has previously said Wales seems to have "passed the peak" of cases.

To date, 49,583 tests for coronavirus have been carried out in Wales, with 30,907 tests coming back negative.

The Office for National Statistics (ONS) also gives details of those registered as confirmed or suspected to have died from Covid-19 using death certificates, and its latest figure, for the week ending 9 May, puts the total at 1,641 in Wales.