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Do New Zealand deserve to make it to the 2019 World Cup semi-finals?

Bhaijaan

Bhaijaan

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They lost badly in their last games

It’s always a likeable team but Pakistan showed more heart towards the end
 
MZ definitely don’t deserve to go through

NZ deserve to go through because they have the required points. But if they didn’t go through then they wouldn’t have anything to cry about either because they got lucky with a point against India and have come unstuck against every decent team
 
They were extremely lucky as they had their earlier matches against comparatively weaker teams and india match got washed out. otherwise they would have packing their bags rightnow
 
They don't

We got unlucky with washout vs SL and they got lucky with their washout

having said that, we should have beaten WI or at least not lost so badly
 
Lucky to get qualified got a rain point against India
Almost lost to WI
But they didn’t lose games like Pakistan did by huge margin
So we can’t blame
 
Pakistan should not have lost that match against WI or made a close match of the AFG one knowing well they need a better NRR.

NZ obliterated the weaker teams and on that metric alone maybe they deserve the semis spot more than Pakistan.
 
MisbahTheGreat said:
They don't

We got unlucky with washout vs SL and they got lucky with their washout

having said that, we should have beaten WI or at least not lost so badly
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Win vs Lanka would have taken us to 10 points now
So yeah the game which we were more expected to win got washed out . Unlucky Pakistan this time
 
Asif321 said:
Win vs Lanka would have taken us to 10 points now
So yeah the game which we were more expected to win got washed out . Unlucky Pakistan this time
Click to expand...

I wouldn't be so sure of Pakistan defeating SL...dont forget they defeated England, who are suddenly favorites now... that match could have gone any way...
 
Ofcourse they do. The numbers don't lie and the format is fine. Beating weaker teams is also important, and NZ did that comprehensively in their earlier games.

They will, however, need to pull off a miracle to qualify for the final. Just terrible batting in their last three games.
 
Australia is going to the final without breaking a sweat. No way is NZ beating them in the semi-final.
 
Nope only Pakistan deserves to go through. Rest of the teams have all been so lucky. India, England and New Zealand did not deserve to go through to semis over Pakistan. The way they played against afghanistan without any luck and still won a close match shows the character and professionalism of Pakistan team who don't have any luck just performances.
 
If they are sitting in the top 4 at the end of the league stage they deserve it.
 
These type of threads were started for India, England, new Zealand and Australia.

So my million dollar question who deserved semi final spots 🤣
 
I think you can argue they have been lucky, in a straight shoot out with Pakistan if you look at what has made the difference:

- Pakistan rained off vs Sri Lanka, and New Zealand rained off vs England
- New Zealand playing Afg and SL on green / wet wickets - they definitely would not have won with such margins if playing them at this end of the tournament
- Faf du Plessis and David Miller not taking Williamson's wicket in the SA game
- A few inches vs West Indies and minus 2 points

They have been beaten convincingly by Australia, England and Pakistan (the three times in top 5 that they have played).

I believe a semi final of Pak vs Aus and England vs India was probably better, but the bottom line is 1 team does tend to get a lucky route and they can be dangerous in the knockouts.

I guess support now shifts to England as someone living here
 
If they’re qualifying then they deserve it, plain and simple
 
They do because they know their weakness and play according to it, while our players are too casual and don't care of NRR even now.
If you loose to WI by 13 overs should be kicked out from next World Cup.
 
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If only brathwaide finished the game of for the WI
 
LondonFan said:
I think you can argue they have been lucky, in a straight shoot out with Pakistan if you look at what has made the difference:

- Pakistan rained off vs Sri Lanka, and New Zealand rained off vs England
- New Zealand playing Afg and SL on green / wet wickets - they definitely would not have won with such margins if playing them at this end of the tournament
- Faf du Plessis and David Miller not taking Williamson's wicket in the SA game
- A few inches vs West Indies and minus 2 points

They have been beaten convincingly by Australia, England and Pakistan (the three times in top 5 that they have played).

I believe a semi final of Pak vs Aus and England vs India was probably better, but the bottom line is 1 team does tend to get a lucky route and they can be dangerous in the knockouts.

I guess support now shifts to England as someone living here
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Stopped reading aftee nz got washed out vs england...lol
 
Well if we can expect to make it despite the performance in teh initial games then why not NZ!!!
 
With all due respect you want a team in semi final who would put up a great fight and stands a good chance of going all the way.

NZ doesn’t seem like that team. They are the team everyone is fancying to smash in the semis now.
 
They will probably meet Australia in semis and beat them and then meet England and beat them also. Revenge time!
 
Yes if they finish 4th.

They got the points and weren't hammered badly as much as Pakistan.

However very unlikely they will beat Aus in the semi or any of the other 2 teams.
 
NZ have a much better run rate then Pak that is the most important point. It is a very close thing for sure but in my opinion they have just about done enough for a place in the semi's. Again I have to emphasise how Pak lost to West Indies where as NZ just about defeated them, that is how close it was. Only thing we can argue about is when teams finish on equal points the head to head result should come before run rate. Although having defeated both England and NZ going out on run rate is very upsetting. Pak knew about the rules before the tournament began.
 
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Well one can also make an argument for Bangladesh going to semis ahead of the Kiwis in their current form... if anything even Lanka are probably in better form then the Kiwis...

However, we only have ourselves to blame. We should have at least batted 50 overs against the Windies.
 
Nz did not play good cricket, but more importantly played smart cricket. They knew they could lose against the Big 3 so made sure they didnt give it away against the weaker teams. That shows intelligence.

Pak on the other hand played brainless cricket against WI & Afghanistan, even though they punched above their weight against England & NZ. That cost them
 
Why not? They were higher ranked team and was favorite for the 4th spot for most non Pakistani posters here. In this WC, Kiwis actually have played really, really poor, otherwise they were always the most favorites to join the top 3.

Only team that has under performed in this WC is SAF, otherwise rest are doing exactly what is expected - at least for poster who knows their cricket, and don't come here to troll. I think, I had multiple posts here regarding the final standing, which more or less was consistent through-out : ENG, IND, AUS to make the cut certainly; AFGs certainly & SRL had no chance and rest 5 to fight for the last spot. Kiwis were a bit lucky and smartly they got their nose ahead at the start, just kept floating.

No, surprise here; rather I'll be surprised if we finish at 5th on the table.
 
No they do not. All they have done this tournament is bully the minnows, sneak through against the mid-range teams and get pounded by the better teams. And, as usual, they have had all the luck in the world which included the abandoned match against India.

I think Bangladesh probably deserved it more than NZ. Pakistan have been OK but they were automatically eliminated after the debacle against the WI.
 
Yes. Winning close games is still winning. They may have been a little fortunate to have their rained off match against India, but can't hold that against them. World Cup should have reserve days.
 
Oh and they deserve Shoaib Malik as they next batting coach
 
IMMY69 said:
Well one can also make an argument for Bangladesh going to semis ahead of the Kiwis in their current form... if anything even Lanka are probably in better form then the Kiwis...

However, we only have ourselves to blame. We should have at least batted 50 overs against the Windies.
Click to expand...

Last 3 games NZ have been made to look like boys by the big teams.
 
Look at the rules for qualification for semi finals. If they fulfil the rules and finish in top four then they deserve to make it to the world cup semi finals.

Subjective judgements, like they only defeated weaker opponents and lost to stronger opponents does not wash. Every win gets you same number of points irrespective to the quality of opponent. And the margin of victory/ defeat determines the NRR. If New Zealand win enough matches and with reasonable margins to have 11 points with good NRR, and other competing team fails to match their points, then New Zealand definitely deserves to be in the semi final. Or in case of equal points, if New Zealand are good enough to have better NRR then too they qualify. What is there to say that they do not deserve to qualify ?

Points ar given for winning the matches. NRR gets calculated on the basis of margins of results. There is no place for subjective judgements to decide deserving qualifiers. Those who have higher points and better NRR qualifies. That is all.

If this kind of logic was applied during 1992 world cup, then there were "deserving" teams then too that failed to qualify for semi final. And Pakistan did not deserve to be in the semifinals in 1992 going by your subjective yardsticks that you are seeking to apply here.
 
dildilpak said:
Nz did not play good cricket, but more importantly played smart cricket. They knew they could lose against the Big 3 so made sure they didnt give it away against the weaker teams. That shows intelligence.

Pak on the other hand played brainless cricket against WI & Afghanistan, even though they punched above their weight against England & NZ. That cost them
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All of Kiwis victories were close.
So that puts an end to that
 
IMMY69 said:
All of Kiwis victories were close.
So that puts an end to that
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Even if they were close victories, the important thing is they didnt lose. Instead of blaming NZ lets put the blame where it rightly belongs - our pathetic performance in the first half of the cup.
 
freelance_cricketer said:
Last 3 games NZ have been made to look like boys by the big teams.
Click to expand...


I agree and said so in the match thread.
They’re a team with only one sort of on form batsmen and lacking in confidence...
My point is that on current form you would probably have them 07th on the table, behind Pakistan, Bangladesh and maybe even Sri Lanka.

Having said that they beat the smaller teams and got lucky against India so have the points to take them into the semis....

No one to blame but ourselves, and maybe the weather too
 
dildilpak said:
Even if they were close victories, the important thing is they didnt lose. Instead of blaming NZ lets put the blame where it rightly belongs - our pathetic performance in the first half of the cup.
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I’m not blaming them at all...
Thing is you said they played it smart but the games they won were close, they could have and probably should have lost to the Windies which then would have meant Pakistan would be in the semis..
 
shane said:
No they do not. All they have done this tournament is bully the minnows, sneak through against the mid-range teams and get pounded by the better teams. And, as usual, they have had all the luck in the world which included the abandoned match against India.

I think Bangladesh probably deserved it more than NZ. Pakistan have been OK but they were automatically eliminated after the debacle against the WI.
Click to expand...

They played calculated cricket where we played who cares types.Its like a family work hard to survive while a gamblers spent his saving to casino for fun and hoping to be rich. In the long run hard work person will be always better of than those damn care or gambler type of people.
 
IMMY69 said:
I’m not blaming them at all...
Thing is you said they played it smart but the games they won were close, they could have and probably should have lost to the Windies which then would have meant Pakistan would be in the semis..
Click to expand...

I can equally say that Pakistan could have won against Australia, but lost it in the end. It dug its own grave.
 
dildilpak said:
I can equally say that Pakistan could have won against Australia, but lost it in the end. It dug its own grave.
Click to expand...

Or you could say Pakistan batted like rabbits got in the headlights against the Windies when all they needed to do was to shut shop and bat out overs...
Or stop picking a “senior” so-called batsmen who averages 11 in England
 
Before the World Cup, I would have said South Africa deserved to be in semi-final. But, as of now, NZ definitely is the 4th best team.
 
Scraped through in their wins against BD, SA and WI. Lost to PAK, AUS and ENG. Got lucky with rain in their India match. Also got lucky that Pak had rained off match against lowly SL and not one of the big sides.


They will be easy game for whoever plays them in the semi.
 
Shafi said:
They played calculated cricket where we played who cares types.Its like a family work hard to survive while a gamblers spent his saving to casino for fun and hoping to be rich. In the long run hard work person will be always better of than those damn care or gambler type of people.
Click to expand...


I don’t think they played calculated cricket.
They just about beat the lesser teams and ended up with 11 points.
Pakistan were brainless in their very first game and that cost us our NRR...
 
IMMY69 said:
Or you could say Pakistan batted like rabbits got in the headlights against the Windies when all they needed to do was to shut shop and bat out overs...
Or stop picking a “senior” so-called batsmen who averages 11 in England
Click to expand...

True that.
 
They deserve to get through. Stop being bitter. Losing a game inside 35 overs is embarrassing and ultimately has cost.

Even if you don't think they deserve no amount of complaining is going to change that.
 
I think BD played impressive cricket thru out the tourney, though missed out on a few critical sessions that mattered the most.
 
NZ did their thing pretty well, they won close games, thrashed weaker sides like SL and Afghanistan.

However, I do think they had luck on their side. They won close games against BD, WI and SA which is also to their credit but they have also had rain going their way with walking away with a washout to India whilst Pak/BD had washout against SL.

Anyways, the worry is NZ just went missing in the latter half of the tournament. Their wins against BD, WI, SA weren't convincing tbh. Their batting has been the 2nd/3rd worst in this tournament tbh,
 
Not really, but neither did we deserve it so it doesn't matter.

NZ won against weak oppositions and had a wash out against India. Cricket favours the fortunate.
 
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Of course they deserve it played to there strengths - beat the poor teams lost to the better teams.

Pak = inconsistent
 
Pakistan lost badly to WI who didn't win another game. They scraped through against Afg who didn't win even a single game. Does a team like that deserve to be in SF ?

NZ lost to Eng and Aus who are among top 3 at least. They lost to Pak who atleast ended up middle of table.

So overall NZ are definitely most deserving of those two.
 
MMHS said:
Why not? They were higher ranked team and was favorite for the 4th spot for most non Pakistani posters here. In this WC, Kiwis actually have played really, really poor, otherwise they were always the most favorites to join the top 3.

Only team that has under performed in this WC is SAF, otherwise rest are doing exactly what is expected - at least for poster who knows their cricket, and don't come here to troll. I think, I had multiple posts here regarding the final standing, which more or less was consistent through-out : ENG, IND, AUS to make the cut certainly; AFGs certainly & SRL had no chance and rest 5 to fight for the last spot. Kiwis were a bit lucky and smartly they got their nose ahead at the start, just kept floating.

No, surprise here; rather I'll be surprised if we finish at 5th on the table.
Click to expand...

Well we are talking about the WC so what does it matter if they were excellent before the tournament? They are playing like minnows and should not be in the semis..... I would be Ok with Pak or for that matter BD to be in the semi as they would provide a tougher opposition to the other team.
 
How many of us are going to watch Aus Vs NZ game? I can assure you this would be the least exciting match in the whole WC.
 
BakuGM said:
Well we are talking about the WC so what does it matter if they were excellent before the tournament? They are playing like minnows and should not be in the semis..... I would be Ok with Pak or for that matter BD to be in the semi as they would provide a tougher opposition to the other team.
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They earned it, can't question their right. It's not guaranteed that Kiwis would have lost to IND or we/PAK would have won against SRL. Also, PAK'll lose to BD most likely - that makes them 2 points clear of the chasing pack. No complaints.
 
Look folks, we can blame it on the wash-out versus Sri Lanka all that we want to, and also on Brathwaite, South Africa too (for not winning against New Zealand a match which they should´ve won from one position), or even Donald Trump, but you can replay this whole situation the next 100 years and the result will be the same even in 2119. Here´s why.....

1. If all these ICC tournaments were merely decided on net run-rates, trust me, New Zealand would´ve won every single one of them by now. Teams like Australia wouldn´t even get a sniff, and simply because New Zealand are world famous for beating the life out of minnows and weaker teams. It has always been so in every world cup that I remember. No chance!

2. If all these ICC tournaments were merely decided on net run-rates, trust me, Pakistan would end up even below minnows. The problem has always been that Pakistan lose matches by big margins in big tournaments, and win very narrowly even against minnows on the other hand.

Therein lie the problems, as simple as that.
 
Also, God, there was so much to work with for our experts and fans out there if India had lost by 119 runs today instead of New Zealand. So much really....

* Lockie Ferguson, one of the stars of the tournament not playing today due to an "injury." Just replace the player with Bumrah in your mind.

* Nicholls not reviewing an LBW call which always looked to be going over the stumps. Just replace him with Rohit in your mind.

* Taylor´s needless "risky" attempted second run which led to his run out. Replace him with Kohli in your mind.

Perfect recipe, and it would also have been argued that the match was fixed as back as in 1947.

However, the harsh truth just is that the better team won. On their day (I repeat, on their day), no team comes close to this England team, and New Zealand were never a match for them. Still though, a reversed toss result could´ve given them a massive opportunity.
 
Without rain, I think Pakistan could have made it to the semis, even after the WI 'performance'. But destiny is destiny...

I don't think New Zealand will make it to the final.
 
Luck plays part in all sports more so in cricket.People shouldn't grudge NZ getting to semis.ENG,AUS and India desreve to go through.NA,BD and Pakistan deserve the fourth spot.These three teams played well but none were outstanding.
 
Did New Zealand deserve to qualify for the 2019 World Cup semis?

It will be a cakewalk for any team facing NZ in the SF, their performance is well below par and qualified with lucky points.

I think Pakistan got hard done by luck.
 
They did proper minnow bashing and secured a good enough NRR. Scraped through on their wins against mid table teams SA, WI and BD. Then were decimated by all the good teams (Pak, Aus, Eng). The rained off match against India came as a God send for them.

Whoever they meet in the semi will have a free-pass to the final.
 
Most unlucky WC ever watched since I started watching cricket. NZ has been pathetic against the big teams. PAK was picking up good steam.

Such a shame.
 
Yes. They were the fourth most deserving team after India, Australia and England.
 
They have always made it to the quarter finals / semis in WC tournaments. I think the top 4 are truly deserving for a shot at the title.
 
They deserve to go through. And even if you think they don't, you can cry as much as you want but it wont change things. Why does a team who dropped the most catches , lost to a team who won 2 games and lost to that team inside 35 overs , lost to their rivals with ease deserve to go through? We are out because we don't deserve it.

Just accept it. If you want change in Pakistan cricket, you need to accept we arent good enough to compete for the WC . If you want to play the victim card which most of our fans will , nothing in Pakistan cricket will change.
 
[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION]

Their performance speaks otherwise.
 
I'm loving the salt here. You are damn right we deserved to go through. We didn't tell you to be trash against the West Indies or to not beat teams with a high RR like Afghanistan or even us.

Are we the weakest out of the top 4? Sure. It doesn't mean we didn't deserve to be there.
 
Yes - the table does not lie. It ranks the teams by performance through the tournament. New Zealand are statistically the 4th best team by the parameters set out at the outset of the tournament.

All other arguments are moot.

If Pakistan deserved it, we should have beaten one of Australia, India or West Indies. Simple as that.
 
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