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Do runs and wins against Pakistan actually count ?

Hellion

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I think Bangladesh and cricket fans in general learnt a very important lesson today.

It's one thing to feast on minnow bowlers like Naseem and Shaheen and scaredy cat batsmen like Abdullah Shafique in Test cricket.

These don't really count when you face the top teams with real talent and courage.
 
I think Bangladesh and cricket fans in general learnt a very important lesson today.

It's one thing to feast on minnow bowlers like Naseem and Shaheen and scaredy cat batsmen like Abdullah Shafique in Test cricket.

These don't really count when you face the top teams with real talent and courage.
Lol now naseem and shaheen are minnow bowlers how do you even think before writing it?
 
Bangladesh had never beaten Pakistan in test cricket before so it did matter to them.
 
Runs used to count less agaisnt Zim/BD in older era and that's why players who could not perform well agaisnt top teams but had good stats mainly due to minnow bashing were rated lower. It has always been the case and not going to change.

Pakistan has been not a top class bowling side for a while now, but now getting into territory were fans may start giving less weight for runs scored agaisnt Pakistan.

Last 5 years: Bottom two bowling sides and based on last BD-Pak series, safe to say that BD has a better bowling unit.

counts.jpg
 
Runs used to count less agaisnt Zim/BD in older era and that's why players who could not perform well agaisnt top teams but had good stats mainly due to minnow bashing were rated lower. It has always been the case and not going to change.

Pakistan has been not a top class bowling side for a while now, but now getting into territory were fans may start giving less weight for runs scored agaisnt Pakistan.

Last 5 years: Bottom two bowling sides and based on last BD-Pak series, safe to say that BD has a better bowling unit.

View attachment 146491
Kept saying this. Too many folks are attacking the batting lineup.

It's the bowling that is utterly mediocre in Test cricket and costing them heavily.

Scoring 450 odd and losing a Test at home. It has never happened in PAK history before . And it happened against BD of all teams.

After Yasir Shah's decline, this is a minnow bowling attack
 
FOr a very long time one popular filter used by fans is exclusion of Zimbabwe, Bangladesh, Afghanistan as oppositi on. In some cases Windies. Runs/Wickets against these countries would be excluded by fans to measure the performance of players. Pakistan is dangerously close to join that list.
 
Any international run/win counts.

If ICC gives it international status, it counts.

But, performance against top teams obviously counts more.
 
Here is where I feel Pak is a little different from other teams in subcontinent.

Srilanka, Bangladesh and even Afghanistan in white ball and even more so in T20s are perfectly capable of upsetting India on an off day. However they would have to catch India on an off day but very much possible.

With Pak, it is different, suddenly out of nowhere a batsman or bowler produces something out of the world and catches teams off guard. More like a rare on day for them than the off day for opposition. I have seen teams have an off day and giving Pak a chance but them squandering it with even more of an off-day.
 
I get the impression Bangladesh fans are under the delusion that runs and wickets against them actually count.

They need to wake up.
 
Here is where I feel Pak is a little different from other teams in subcontinent.

Srilanka, Bangladesh and even Afghanistan in white ball and even more so in T20s are perfectly capable of upsetting India on an off day. However they would have to catch India on an off day but very much possible.

With Pak, it is different, suddenly out of nowhere a batsman or bowler produces something out of the world and catches teams off guard. More like a rare on day for them than the off day for opposition. I have seen teams have an off day and giving Pak a chance but them squandering it with even more of an off-day.
Basically you are using that "unpredictable" "cornered tigers" theory about Pakistan. lol. I thought this topic was done and dusted. Pakistan was in many many cornered situations in recent times. They just moved to another corner didn't fight.
 
In test cricket , normally we always have 3-4 good teams and then quality drops a lot. Its hard to do well against the top 3-4 teams and it's legendary to do well against the top 3-4 teams in their den. That's why, players who perform agaisnt the top 3-4 teams are rated in a different class and it's elevated to even a greater heights if you do in their dens. Performance against the bottom 3-4 teams is good for stats but it does not add to stature of batsmen or bowlers.

Take Bumrah for example, Avg agasint BD/WI/SL - Avg 10 with 34 wickets.

But no one rates Bumrah high due to these stats
. He is rated high due to so many match and series changing spells in SA, Aus , Eng etc. He could average 24 instead of 20 without ever playing bottom 3-4 teams but it won't change his stature. Bumrah is not going to be rated high due to avearging 10 runs per wicket or lets say if he plays 40 tests against BD/WI/Zim/Afg etc to end up with career avg of 15, he won't be rated for that. He will be always rated for doing well agasint the top teams of his era in their den even if his career avg ends with 24.

Flip side with clear example: Waqar with 36 tests agasint top 4 batting sides of his era( Aus, SA, WI, Ind ) averages 29. At same time against the bottom 4 sides of his era( BD/Zim/SL/NZ) he has 200 plus wickets with average of 19. Him averaging 19 count for lot less and his stature is lower due to not doing well against the top sides. It's not even in their dens, just the opposition.


In short, runs and performance against Pakistan counts for stats, but not for stature in the last 5 years. They are not really BD or Zim level of older era but heading into that direction. If current trajectory continues for another 5-10 years then I will personally stop counting runs or performacne against Pakistan. Pakistan's bowling had been in a continuous decline for the last 20-30 years, but it's alarming bad now. Hopefully we see a reversal.
 
Basically you are using that "unpredictable" "cornered tigers" theory about Pakistan. lol. I thought this topic was done and dusted. Pakistan was in many many cornered situations in recent times. They just moved to another corner didn't fight.
The last example of that 'unpredictable' nature of our cricket was when we destroyed South Africa in a must win match in the T20WC 2022. That was the last Pakistan team neutrals enjoyed watching.

Since then, the team has spiraled downwards at an alarming rate in all formats and to be honest we are as good as a minnow in Test cricket.
 
Trend is looking bad, earlier I posted the last 5 years.

Here is the Last 3 years of bowling average of all teams. If it remains in below the likes of WI, BD etc for a long period then not just me, most fans will stop counting runs/performance against Pakistan. If you are going to avg near 40 as bowling unit then it means you give around 800 runs in one test to opposition. How much will it count then?

last3PakBowling.jpg
 
I get the impression Bangladesh fans are under the delusion that runs and wickets against them actually count.

They need to wake up.
The good thing is the players themselves aren't.

They ironically didn't even take pakistan seriously. My guess is that in the first Test they were ready for a fight but by the 5th day they figured these guys can't really read rana, mahmud or spin so no point.
 
Kept saying this. Too many folks are attacking the batting lineup.

It's the bowling that is utterly mediocre in Test cricket and costing them heavily.

Scoring 450 odd and losing a Test at home. It has never happened in PAK history before . And it happened against BD of all teams.

After Yasir Shah's decline, this is a minnow bowling attack
Bro you raised a great point dont you think after yasir shah pak should have included leg spinner to fill the gap?
 
Basically you are using that "unpredictable" "cornered tigers" theory about Pakistan. lol. I thought this topic was done and dusted. Pakistan was in many many cornered situations in recent times. They just moved to another corner didn't fight.
Yes they are unpredictable and mercurial. Difference is I don’t feel it is a compliment.
 
In test cricket , normally we always have 3-4 good teams and then quality drops a lot. Its hard to do well against the top 3-4 teams and it's legendary to do well against the top 3-4 teams in their den. That's why, players who perform agaisnt the top 3-4 teams are rated in a different class and it's elevated to even a greater heights if you do in their dens. Performance against the bottom 3-4 teams is good for stats but it does not add to stature of batsmen or bowlers.

Take Bumrah for example, Avg agasint BD/WI/SL - Avg 10 with 34 wickets.

But no one rates Bumrah high due to these stats
. He is rated high due to so many match and series changing spells in SA, Aus , Eng etc. He could average 24 instead of 20 without ever playing bottom 3-4 teams but it won't change his stature. Bumrah is not going to be rated high due to avearging 10 runs per wicket or lets say if he plays 40 tests against BD/WI/Zim/Afg etc to end up with career avg of 15, he won't be rated for that. He will be always rated for doing well agasint the top teams of his era in their den even if his career avg ends with 24.

Flip side with clear example: Waqar with 36 tests agasint top 4 batting sides of his era( Aus, SA, WI, Ind ) averages 29. At same time against the bottom 4 sides of his era( BD/Zim/SL/NZ) he has 200 plus wickets with average of 19. Him averaging 19 count for lot less and his stature is lower due to not doing well against the top sides. It's not even in their dens, just the opposition.


In short, runs and performance against Pakistan counts for stats, but not for stature in the last 5 years. They are not really BD or Zim level of older era but heading into that direction. If current trajectory continues for another 5-10 years then I will personally stop counting runs or performacne against Pakistan. Pakistan's bowling had been in a continuous decline for the last 20-30 years, but it's alarming bad now. Hopefully we see a reversal.
Why is that a reason you think pak always had spinners after yasir shah left pak bowling was never the same as Nikhil
In test cricket , normally we always have 3-4 good teams and then quality drops a lot. Its hard to do well against the top 3-4 teams and it's legendary to do well against the top 3-4 teams in their den. That's why, players who perform agaisnt the top 3-4 teams are rated in a different class and it's elevated to even a greater heights if you do in their dens. Performance against the bottom 3-4 teams is good for stats but it does not add to stature of batsmen or bowlers.

Take Bumrah for example, Avg agasint BD/WI/SL - Avg 10 with 34 wickets.

But no one rates Bumrah high due to these stats
. He is rated high due to so many match and series changing spells in SA, Aus , Eng etc. He could average 24 instead of 20 without ever playing bottom 3-4 teams but it won't change his stature. Bumrah is not going to be rated high due to avearging 10 runs per wicket or lets say if he plays 40 tests against BD/WI/Zim/Afg etc to end up with career avg of 15, he won't be rated for that. He will be always rated for doing well agasint the top teams of his era in their den even if his career avg ends with 24.

Flip side with clear example: Waqar with 36 tests agasint top 4 batting sides of his era( Aus, SA, WI, Ind ) averages 29. At same time against the bottom 4 sides of his era( BD/Zim/SL/NZ) he has 200 plus wickets with average of 19. Him averaging 19 count for lot less and his stature is lower due to not doing well against the top sides. It's not even in their dens, just the opposition.


In short, runs and performance against Pakistan counts for stats, but not for stature in the last 5 years. They are not really BD or Zim level of older era but heading into that direction. If current trajectory continues for another 5-10 years then I will personally stop counting runs or performacne against Pakistan. Pakistan's bowling had been in a continuous decline for the last 20-30 years, but it's alarming bad now. Hopefully we see a reversal.
Why do you think this happen because pak always had great spinners coming after yasir shah pak bowling was never the same hopefull abrar can continue that legacy.
 
Bro you raised a great point dont you think after yasir shah pak should have included leg spinner to fill the gap?
Forget leg spinner. Any quality spinner who is Test class would be fine. I have not seen a single spinner who can cut it at this level, Abrar included
 
Yes they are unpredictable and mercurial. Difference is I don’t feel it is a compliment.
Except they are no more unpredictable than any other team. That USA fast bowler Ali khan picked one team to beat in world cup. He picked Pakistan was the team to beat
 
Kept saying this. Too many folks are attacking the batting lineup.

It's the bowling that is utterly mediocre in Test cricket and costing them heavily.

Scoring 450 odd and losing a Test at home. It has never happened in PAK history before . And it happened against BD of all teams.

After Yasir Shah's decline, this is a minnow bowling attack
Agree, Pakistan's batting is not great but not that bad. Bowling has been really bad. You can't be hanging into the last 1-2 spot in bolwing avg as unit and hope to do well in test fromat.

You have to pick 20 wickets in test to win. It's not ODI/T20 where you outbat opposition to win matches.
 
Agree, Pakistan's batting is not great but not that bad. Bowling has been really bad. You can't be hanging into the last 1-2 spot in bolwing avg as unit and hope to do well in test fromat.

You have to pick 20 wickets in test to win. It's not ODI/T20 where you outbat opposition to win matches.
Exactly. Bowling matters more in Tests where 20 cheap wickets is a must. In LOI's you need aggressive, deep batting lineups more than bowling.

PAK have got it twisted. Their white ball bowling is decent but batting is mediocre. Test match batting is decent but bowling is mediocre.
 
Why is that a reason you think pak always had spinners after yasir shah left pak bowling was never the same as Nikhil

Why do you think this happen because pak always had great spinners coming after yasir shah pak bowling was never the same hopefull abrar can continue that legacy.
I don't follow domestic of Pakistan so take my view with a grain of salt, but based on what I have seen,

1 - Pakistan needs to stop preparing really dead wickets. It's not good for skill development of batsmen or bowlers. It's only good for boosting batsmen stats but no genuine Pakistani fans are getting fooled by this. Everyone can look up away performacne of batsmen.

2 - Play full time spinners in every match, be it limited overs or test. I have seen Pakistan playing no full time spinner in most matches in recent years. You can't develop spinners that way.

3 - Pacers need to play longer format domestic. I am just guessing they don't play enough based on how they bowl in test matches in 2nd or 3rd spell. I am not sure if pacers play enough long format to develop stamina. It's useless to show aggresion for 20 balls in T20. You need to be able to turn it on on 4th or 5th day of test as well. It comes with practice. Wasim/Waqar used to play lots of first class matches.

Just these three steps should help. Not saying that team will become world beater, but it will be a good start.
 
Yes all runs count.

It may become a bit of a factor when deciding how two players fare head to head.

I mean take out Bangladesh and Zimbabwe and Joe Root is quite to close to Tendulkar in terms of overall runs scored and you will see that Kallis the best batter of all time.

Take them out and you will see Warne performed way more against the top sides than Murali.

But overall what are the metrics that people remember?
 
Exactly. Bowling matters more in Tests where 20 cheap wickets is a must. In LOI's you need aggressive, deep batting lineups more than bowling.

PAK have got it twisted. Their white ball bowling is decent but batting is mediocre. Test match batting is decent but bowling is mediocre.
I suspect its inter-related. They bowl defensively in white ball and do the same in test. That approach is still fine in white ball but you can't pick 20 wickets regularly with bowling defensively in test. Now, lack of skill is present but just an observation on how they approach bowling. I follow limited Pakistan's matches, but that's my observation.
 
But overall what are the metrics that people remember?

Tons and 5-fers in strong opposition's den. That's what I personally remember. Now if it results in win then remember more for every team. I remember KP taking Indian spinners on in series they won back in 2013 in India. I remember YK scoring heavily to level the series in Eng. I remember Bumrah series changing spells in Aus. I remmeber legendary spells of Steyn in India.

I hardly pay attention to volume of runs or wickets etc. I mean how many fans talk about Jayawardhane, he has close to 12K runs and not really memorable for me. I don't really care about SRT volume of runs or tons. I do remmber him playing gun kncoks in pretty much every tours of SA, Aus, Eng etc. That's what I remember.

I still remmeber Jamal bowling well in Aus despite Paksitani losing 0-3. Just trying to give some examples because Jamal is just a new player and I remember.
 
Yes all runs count.

It may become a bit of a factor when deciding how two players fare head to head.

I mean take out Bangladesh and Zimbabwe and Joe Root is quite to close to Tendulkar in terms of overall runs scored and you will see that Kallis the best batter of all time.

Take them out and you will see Warne performed way more against the top sides than Murali.

But overall what are the metrics that people remember?
Kallis was woeful against Australia. That was a big black spot on his resume ! You cannot lay claim to being the best if u underperform against the best team of ur era !
 
It’s not in the nature of a true Sanatani to be arrogant and look down upon anyone , especially those going through rough patch. Ancient Brahmins always emphasised on Vinamrata.

Pakistan is not a minnow yet.
They’re a mid bottom level team but they have some great talent like Babar Azam, Haris Rauf etc.

Haris Rauf plays in Big Big league in Australia.
 
It’s not in the nature of a true Sanatani to be arrogant and look down upon anyone , especially those going through rough patch. Ancient Brahmins always emphasised on Vinamrata.

Pakistan is not a minnow yet.
They’re a mid bottom level team but they have some great talent like Babar Azam, Haris Rauf etc.

Haris Rauf plays in Big Big league in Australia.
no one will take you seriously if you call Haris Rauf a great talent. At best he is a mid
 
nobody really bothers now the way we are declining! maybe Pakistan win against USA now will become an achievement.
 
It does matter for mediocre teams like Bangladesh, Afghanistan, Ireland and Ethiopia.
 
It will only count if you are Afghanistan, Bangladesh, zimbabwe etc otherwise no one really cares.
 
It counts for a lot less where even Pakistani batting is scoring 550 runs and then opposition is 400-500 for 3-4 wickets.
 
Runs used to count less agaisnt Zim/BD in older era and that's why players who could not perform well agaisnt top teams but had good stats mainly due to minnow bashing were rated lower. It has always been the case and not going to change.

Pakistan has been not a top class bowling side for a while now, but now getting into territory were fans may start giving less weight for runs scored agaisnt Pakistan.

Last 5 years: Bottom two bowling sides and based on last BD-Pak series, safe to say that BD has a better bowling unit.

View attachment 146491
Scary thing is that this screenshot doesn't have stat from the current test match :inti
 
Runs used to count less agaisnt Zim/BD in older era and that's why players who could not perform well agaisnt top teams but had good stats mainly due to minnow bashing were rated lower. It has always been the case and not going to change.

Pakistan has been not a top class bowling side for a while now, but now getting into territory were fans may start giving less weight for runs scored agaisnt Pakistan.

Last 5 years: Bottom two bowling sides and based on last BD-Pak series, safe to say that BD has a better bowling unit.

View attachment 146491
Pakistan drops below Bangladesh with this test:

1728474876000.png
 
So in the last 5 years, Pakistan has

  • Highest bowling avg among 9 countries.
  • Most expensive run rate among 9 countries
  • Highest score given to opposition among 9 countries.
 
Historically, performance agasint the top 4-5 teams always got rated much higher than the performance against the bottom 3-4 teams. That's why when posters use career average, it's not very meaningful if you don't have runs/performacnes against the top 4-5 sides.

Pakistan has been a low tier test team for a while now, but competing strongly for the bottom spot is a recent trend. In past, BD/Zim were excluded when having any serious stats discussions and there were reasons for that.

I am not making any conclusion based on 1-2 matches. Any team can go for big runs on flat wickets. But if you average near 40 for periods like 5-10 years then you are just stats boosting oppurtunity for all oppositions.

Corrected point 2 and 3, which makes it even worse

I don't count those countries due to low number of tests. These nine countries have played lots of tests.
 
Even 556 seems inadequate when you have a Pakistani bowling attack.
Normally it will be enough and not enough time are left for results, but Eng bats fast so they make up for time.
 
Normally it will be enough and not enough time are left for results, but Eng bats fast so they make up for time.
Batting fast I can understand. But a bowling attack that can only take 3 wickets in 100 overs while getting attacked is just awful
 
Batting fast I can understand. But a bowling attack that can only take 3 wickets in 100 overs while getting attacked is just awful

Pakistan's bowling has not been good for a while, but on super roads many good bowlers also struggle.

Having said that, I agree that if you are getting attcked for 100 overs then it does create chances, but I did not watch the test fully and don't know if Pakistan created chances.
 
We are not at the stage where runs against Pakistan have an asterix.

We are however probably at the stage where runs IN Pakistan should have an asterix beside them indicating that these should be analysed further.


Agree somewhat but Pakistan has been easiest place for visiting batsmen even before current era.

1995 - 2018 ( exluding current lot )

InPak.jpg
 
They count beautifully. We will host a big party on PP the day he overtakes Tendulkar's run tally and we shall pay special homage to his epic Multan innings October 2024.
 
This thread title reminds me of a sikilar titles few years ago, I feel India was on receiving end then.
 
They count beautifully. We will host a big party on PP the day he overtakes Tendulkar's run tally and we shall pay special homage to his epic Multan innings October 2024.
You should had done that with BD smacking Pak to oblivion in your home as well, and to make it better they got smacked by India just soon after.
 
I don't know about tests and other teams however runs for Pakistan in T20s and ODIs should never count unless it is a ICC tournament
 
There are 38 better batsmen in India compared to Babar. So we are okay with this.
If that’s true, then it is a shame that you have been carrying the corpse of Kohli in Test cricket for 4 years now and the likes of KL Rahul are still playing for India. Perhaps you could summon some of these 38 better batsmen to replace your deadweights.
 
If that’s true, then it is a shame that you have been carrying the corpse of Kohli in Test cricket for 4 years now and the likes of KL Rahul are still playing for India. Perhaps you could summon some of these 38 better batsmen to replace your deadweights.
Its ok carrying Current Kohli is better than carrying Babar . At least Kohli won a World Cup with top score in finals during this period. An over the hill Kohli is > than anytime Babar
 
Its ok carrying Current Kohli is better than carrying Babar . At least Kohli won a World Cup with top score in finals during this period. An over the hill Kohli is > than anytime Babar
I wouldn't have Kohli in my Test team right now, even if I'm picking a Pakistan XI, so not sure why you are thumping your chests
 
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As we care about what you think about india or Indian team .

First care about Pakistan cricket teams who are becomes minnows .
I wouldn't have Kohli in my Test team right now, even if I'm picking a Pakistan XI, so not sure why you are thumping your chests like hanuman in London zoo.
 
I wouldn't have Kohli in my Test team right now, even if I'm picking a Pakistan XI, so not sure why you are thumping your chests like hanuman in London zoo.
Had some respect for your contributions. The moment you made a religious remark ,think you lost respect as well as discussion at same time.
 
I wouldn't have Kohli in my Test team right now, even if I'm picking a Pakistan XI, so not sure why you are thumping your chests like hanuman in London zoo.
I wouldn't have Babar even in a first class team in India, forget about our test team. I wonder how Pakistan is carrying the white elephant Babar
 
Had some respect for your contributions. The moment you made a religious remark ,think you lost respect as well as discussion at same time.
Considering he is from Peshawar, he would have gone through some traumatic experience in his childhood that's why he behaves so weird.
 
Which is better test knock - Sehwag 309 vs pakistan (2004) or Brooks 317 vs pakistan (2024) at same ground Multan.
@Buffet @Nikhil_cric @RedwoodOriginal @DeadlyVenom
Sehwag 309 because that Pakistan team and that bowling attack had some level of legitimacy attached to it. And also because back then this kind of video-game batting was not something that you saw that often. Even on dead-flat wickets batters batted with some level of caution. Sehwag was a trail-blazer in that sense. He also inadvertently managed to end the career of Saqlain in this match with the brutal beating he meted out to him. Which is no small feat because in my opinion Saqlain is one of the greatest spinners this game has ever seen. His career had begun lagging at that point but Sehwag undoubtedly put the final nail in the coffin.
 
Sehwag 309 because that Pakistan team and that bowling attack had some level of legitimacy attached to it. And also because back then this kind of video-game batting was not something that you saw that often. Even on dead-flat wickets batters batted with some level of caution. Sehwag was a trail-blazer in that sense. He also invertedly managed to end the career of Saqlain in this match with the brutal beating he meted out to him. Which is no small feat because in my opinion Saqlain is one of the greatest spinners this game has ever seen. His career had been lagging at that point but Sehwag undoubtedly put the final nail in the coffin.
Saqlain, the first bowler to bowl a legitimate doosra without the need to chuck and cheat. Gun bowler.
 
Sehwag 309 because that Pakistan team and that bowling attack had some level of legitimacy attached to it. And also because back then this kind of video-game batting was not something that you saw that often. Even on dead-flat wickets batters batted with some level of caution. Sehwag was a trail-blazer in that sense. He also inadvertently managed to end the career of Saqlain in this match with the brutal beating he meted out to him. Which is no small feat because in my opinion Saqlain is one of the greatest spinners this game has ever seen. His career had begun lagging at that point but Sehwag undoubtedly put the final nail in the coffin.
That was just the start of his carnage against spinners. His best onslaught was against Murali and Herath at Brabourne where he scored 287 runs in 2.5 sessions of a day.
 
Saqlain, the first bowler to bowl a legitimate doosra without the need to chuck and cheat. Gun bowler.
Better not to start this debate as it is a controversial topic. Personally speaking, my view on this is that ICC has destroyed off-spin bowling with their rule changes over the years. Some might think otherwise and call it chucking. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
 
They shouldn’t count. It would have been a travesty if Brook beat Lara’s record here vs this attack.

Yes Lara’s was on a flat pitch, but it was against an attack that had battered them all series.
 
Difficult to compare but

Shoaib > Shaheen
Shabbir > Naseem
Saqlain > Abrar

So I'll lean towards Sehwag's knock.
Shoaib Akhtar, Mohmmad sami, Shabbir Ahmed, Abdul razzaq ,Saqlain - This was the bowling attack of Pakistan.

They Were not great but surely better than current Pakistan attack .
 
Shoaib Akhtar, Mohmmad sami, Shabbir Ahmed, Abdul razzaq ,Saqlain - This was the bowling attack of Pakistan.

They Were not great but surely better than current Pakistan attack .

Yeah they were better than this attack for sure.

But again comparing across eras is tough.
 
That was just the start of his carnage against spinners. His best onslaught was against Murali and Herath at Brabourne where he scored 287 runs in 2.5 sessions of a day.
I think it was Ashwin who said once that Sehwag didn't consider spinners to be bowlers. The guy had an amazing level of arrogance and confidence and almost always backed it up. I didn't see his Bradourne knock but I do remember seeing his double ton at Galle. This was when Ajantha Mendis had come onto the scene and was bamboozling everyone. In that innings all the Indian batters were struggling to get to double digits and Sehwag ended up carrying his bat through that innings as he smashed a double century against a bowling attack that featured the likes of Vaas, Murali and Mendis.
 
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