Mamoon
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It is fun, but I'm sure deep down they are all heartbroken.
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Contact the PP Team
Do you support the desi joint family system?
- Thread starter Slog
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It is fun, but I'm sure deep down they are all heartbroken.
endymion248
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All is a pretty big generalization to make. Many are so sick that they can't live at home, others have dementia, others chose to go live in Spain or Bahamas so they made the choice of being far from their kids. Most are still in touch with their kids and friends.
Yes, there is a lot of sad people in old homes but that is probably more down to the fact that many old people are sad (including those living with their kids) than the other way around.
One thing is for sure. If I had dementia then I would never want for my kids to remember my last days as a blank mess that needs to be washed by them and have his diapers changed by them. All the while they have to suffer constant stress trying to balance their own life with slowly seeing their father wither away. I'd rather they visit me once a week and let the professionals deal with the rest.
On the other hand, I wouldn't put my own parents in an old people's home and would try to care for them but that is a purely selfish choice based on my own feelings, not what is best for them. But there is also the difference of culture, they wouldn't want to be in an old people's home because of the way it is seen in Pakistan while I myself don't have a stigma against it.
At the end of the day, everyone has different circumstances. Maybe if you're a rich guy from Pakistan with an army of servants then the idea of an old people's home can seem disgusting. But for many people, it's the better option.
anakin
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What about the existential crisis of kids with devout parents who go out to study actual Science?
Its not as bad as it sounds.... If I have being living in Pakistan, this would be a series issue and I could have being in closet for lot longer... In US things are different...I have being living here for 18 years and married for 16...I was doubter for long time(even when I was in Pakistan), its more or less official for past 6 or so years... Its not like it happened yesterday
My parents does not have big issue with this, my father was socialist, as a kid my home was full of Communist literature(Russian and Chinese translated books, my grand mom use to say, 'china Key Katiboon nay meray betay Ko Ghumra kayak'), he himself was practically an Atheist but for different reasons...He fought all his life against army, he is now retired politician, mainly after Zardari took over the PPP...If you know any core PPP members or founding members they were all border line Atheist, definitely none of them were found of God or religion... Intellect circle of PPP back in 70s/80s was anti religion for most part...I don't agree with them on many things, but there were definitely common grounds...My father knew personally many leftist like Jalib, Faiz, Sheikh Rasheed, J Rahim, he worked with every member of Bhutto family, even in her last visit to USA Benazir went to my home to visit my father... He was president of PPP of Pindi/Islamabad till 81, after that he was in exiled for 8/9 years...We had to change our name to get admission in Pindi schools, it was hard for us to get admission back then...He went to jail from 77 to 81 almost 13 or so time, 39 months in those years...Some of our relatives(in army) told him, don't get captured this time, they will hang you, at that point he left the country through Afghanistan boarder...
My mother is/was a religious person, most female on my father side are, but like my Grand Mom, they still love their kids with same ferocity...I don't think she understands completely what Atheist means, my mom is really cute, she still gives me Pakistani religious toatkay, when you are in parashani, do a Tasbhee of 'Ya Salamo, Ya Kayamo' things like that
I have good relationship with my mother inlaw, I don't discuss too much of religious matter with her anyway... I follow Pakistani dramas a lot and she is my advisor in chief
- Women generally not care too much about politics, specially the ones, who are not that directly involved... Every now and then she tries to convince me to atleast have Rosas...Which I never use to take a break, even while playing cricket in and around 100F here in DC area in summers, for me it was more of a macho thing rather than religious thing, even in Ramzan I hardly ever prayer...My relationship with my father in law is not that great, I am not sure if religion is only bone of contention, he is conservative and I am liberal, religion or not there will be issues...Its not like you will go along with everybody in life... He tried to go the reason route with me, I personally don't mind that... He was thanking me few years back that because of you I have to go through a lot of Islamic literature
... I don't debate with him much in last few years, don't want to be the reason he get heart attack, its of no use frankly, he is too fearful to rationalize his Faith, although he tries to do that at the peripheral of the Faith but too scared to take that logic to the core My kids specially the elder Son who is 13 years old now, understand that his father position better.... I have not forced anything upon him, that's not true for my wife though
... I tell him not to think out of fear but with open mind, I don't care what you end up believing... To me purpose of education is not what to believe but how to think, if education does not change your process of thinking, then it is useless...Also, don't focus too much about your identity, that creates feeling of self pity, it distract you from focusing on what you want to achieve, its like focus on your weakness rather than strength... As long as they get that, its not bad... I don't want them to be narrow minded, I run through the same problem liberal paternal side and conservative maternal side...Its not confusing but at time healthy, it increases your exposure!!Muslim Kids all over the world not just in west have issues growing up in this time, I see a lot of that in Pakistan or my friends here in USA, the ones who are clearly conservative(both parent religious)... Its like the kid from village to a city kid, there is so much baggage to over come, it takes couple of generations...I have seen that with my relatives (who had more money and well off then us), choose to live in village and not focused on education, now regret, their next generation have to make transition and go through a cycle that will take couple of generations...Ask African kids, they have similar problem, for them lack of internal intellect and being behind for centuries is not something they can over come in a generation or two... Muslims being conservative and single track, are making life tough for next generation...
Not having strong or vibrant liberal culture is huge problem in entire muslim world, even in west their is a big gap between liberals and conservatives, they live in their own islands...In US, bible belt and liberal cultures are two parallel cultures, they co-exist but are very divided... Most (if not all) the innovation is fueled by liberal culture, without that US can go back to the level of most asian countries... Pakistan and Muslim in general needs liberals more than anything else, it will take few generations to build that culture but genesis has not happened... Most liberals are isolated or kicked out...This is what happens to liberal muslims or ex-muslims, I see lot of Iranian, Pakistani, middle-eastern liberals, after one or two generations they are completely cut off from the original culture... These guys are well off and many of them are brilliant in Science, business, tech but muslim culture(even in US) cannot leverage them, since they are not part of that community, its loss of Muslims, not really of those individuals... This sort of thing never happens in Jewish culture, where most people are bounded by ethnicity rather than religion, most intellectual Jews are Atheist, but they are still part of the community and enrich it. Muslim are worse in the world at loosing best brain from their community, you need to have more elasticity in you culture to grow
TalentSpotterPk
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Thanks alot for Elaborative Post.Its not as bad as it sounds.... If I have being living in Pakistan, this would be a series issue and I could have being in closet for lot longer... In US things are different...I have being living here for 18 years and married for 16...I was doubter for long time(even when I was in Pakistan), its more or less official for past 6 or so years... Its not like it happened yesterday
My parents does not have big issue with this, my father was socialist, as a kid my home was full of Communist literature(Russian and Chinese translated books, my grand mom use to say, 'china Key Katiboon nay meray betay Ko Ghumra kayak'), he himself was practically an Atheist but for different reasons...He fought all his life against army, he is now retired politician, mainly after Zardari took over the PPP...If you know any core PPP members or founding members they were all border line Atheist, definitely none of them were found of God or religion... Intellect circle of PPP back in 70s/80s was anti religion for most part...I don't agree with them on many things, but there were definitely common grounds...My father knew personally many leftist like Jalib, Faiz, Sheikh Rasheed, J Rahim, he worked with every member of Bhutto family, even in her last visit to USA Benazir went to my home to visit my father... He was president of PPP of Pindi/Islamabad till 81, after that he was in exiled for 8/9 years...We had to change our name to get admission in Pindi schools, it was hard for us to get admission back then...He went to jail from 77 to 81 almost 13 or so time, 39 months in those years...Some of our relatives(in army) told him, don't get captured this time, they will hang you, at that point he left the country through Afghanistan boarder...
My mother is/was a religious person, most female on my father side are, but like my Grand Mom, they still love their kids with same ferocity...I don't think she understands completely what Atheist means, my mom is really cute, she still gives me Pakistani religious toatkay, when you are in parashani, do a Tasbhee of 'Ya Salamo, Ya Kayamo' things like that
I have good relationship with my mother inlaw, I don't discuss too much of religious matter with her anyway... I follow Pakistani dramas a lot and she is my advisor in chief
My relationship with my father in law is not that great, I am not sure if religion is only bone of contention, he is conservative and I am liberal, religion or not there will be issues...Its not like you will go along with everybody in life... He tried to go the reason route with me, I personally don't mind that... He was thanking me few years back that because of you I have to go through a lot of Islamic literature
My kids specially the elder Son who is 13 years old now, understand that his father position better.... I have not forced anything upon him, that's not true for my wife though
Muslim Kids all over the world not just in west have issues growing up in this time, I see a lot of that in Pakistan or my friends here in USA, the ones who are clearly conservative(both parent religious)... Its like the kid from village to a city kid, there is so much baggage to over come, it takes couple of generations...I have seen that with my relatives (who had more money and well off then us), choose to live in village and not focused on education, now regret, their next generation have to make transition and go through a cycle that will take couple of generations...Ask African kids, they have similar problem, for them lack of internal intellect and being behind for centuries is not something they can over come in a generation or two... Muslims being conservative and single track, are making life tough for next generation...
Not having strong or vibrant liberal culture is huge problem in entire muslim world, even in west their is a big gap between liberals and conservatives, they live in their own islands...In US, bible belt and liberal cultures are two parallel cultures, they co-exist but are very divided... Most (if not all) the innovation is fueled by liberal culture, without that US can go back to the level of most asian countries... Pakistan and Muslim in general needs liberals more than anything else, it will take few generations to build that culture but genesis has not happened... Most liberals are isolated or kicked out...This is what happens to liberal muslims or ex-muslims, I see lot of Iranian, Pakistani, middle-eastern liberals, after one or two generations they are completely cut off from the original culture... These guys are well off and many of them are brilliant in Science, business, tech but muslim culture(even in US) cannot leverage them, since they are not part of that community, its loss of Muslims, not really of those individuals... This sort of thing never happens in Jewish culture, where most people are bounded by ethnicity rather than religion, most intellectual Jews are Atheist, but they are still part of the community and enrich it. Muslim are worse in the world at loosing best brain from their community, you need to have more elasticity in you culture to grow
I shall work on you after December 2016 (Life Permitting)
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endymion248
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Its not as bad as it sounds.... If I have being living in Pakistan, this would be a series issue and I could have being in closet for lot longer... In US things are different...I have being living here for 18 years and married for 16...I was doubter for long time(even when I was in Pakistan), its more or less official for past 6 or so years... Its not like it happened yesterday
My parents does not have big issue with this, my father was socialist, as a kid my home was full of Communist literature(Russian and Chinese translated books, my grand mom use to say, 'china Key Katiboon nay meray betay Ko Ghumra kayak'), he himself was practically an Atheist but for different reasons...He fought all his life against army, he is now retired politician, mainly after Zardari took over the PPP...If you know any core PPP members or founding members they were all border line Atheist, definitely none of them were found of God or religion... Intellect circle of PPP back in 70s/80s was anti religion for most part...I don't agree with them on many things, but there were definitely common grounds...My father knew personally many leftist like Jalib, Faiz, Sheikh Rasheed, J Rahim, he worked with every member of Bhutto family, even in her last visit to USA Benazir went to my home to visit my father... He was president of PPP of Pindi/Islamabad till 81, after that he was in exiled for 8/9 years...We had to change our name to get admission in Pindi schools, it was hard for us to get admission back then...He went to jail from 77 to 81 almost 13 or so time, 39 months in those years...Some of our relatives(in army) told him, don't get captured this time, they will hang you, at that point he left the country through Afghanistan boarder...
My mother is/was a religious person, most female on my father side are, but like my Grand Mom, they still love their kids with same ferocity...I don't think she understands completely what Atheist means, my mom is really cute, she still gives me Pakistani religious toatkay, when you are in parashani, do a Tasbhee of 'Ya Salamo, Ya Kayamo' things like that
I have good relationship with my mother inlaw, I don't discuss too much of religious matter with her anyway... I follow Pakistani dramas a lot and she is my advisor in chief
My relationship with my father in law is not that great, I am not sure if religion is only bone of contention, he is conservative and I am liberal, religion or not there will be issues...Its not like you will go along with everybody in life... He tried to go the reason route with me, I personally don't mind that... He was thanking me few years back that because of you I have to go through a lot of Islamic literature
My kids specially the elder Son who is 13 years old now, understand that his father position better.... I have not forced anything upon him, that's not true for my wife though
Muslim Kids all over the world not just in west have issues growing up in this time, I see a lot of that in Pakistan or my friends here in USA, the ones who are clearly conservative(both parent religious)... Its like the kid from village to a city kid, there is so much baggage to over come, it takes couple of generations...I have seen that with my relatives (who had more money and well off then us), choose to live in village and not focused on education, now regret, their next generation have to make transition and go through a cycle that will take couple of generations...Ask African kids, they have similar problem, for them lack of internal intellect and being behind for centuries is not something they can over come in a generation or two... Muslims being conservative and single track, are making life tough for next generation...
Not having strong or vibrant liberal culture is huge problem in entire muslim world, even in west their is a big gap between liberals and conservatives, they live in their own islands...In US, bible belt and liberal cultures are two parallel cultures, they co-exist but are very divided... Most (if not all) the innovation is fueled by liberal culture, without that US can go back to the level of most asian countries... Pakistan and Muslim in general needs liberals more than anything else, it will take few generations to build that culture but genesis has not happened... Most liberals are isolated or kicked out...This is what happens to liberal muslims or ex-muslims, I see lot of Iranian, Pakistani, middle-eastern liberals, after one or two generations they are completely cut off from the original culture... These guys are well off and many of them are brilliant in Science, business, tech but muslim culture(even in US) cannot leverage them, since they are not part of that community, its loss of Muslims, not really of those individuals... This sort of thing never happens in Jewish culture, where most people are bounded by ethnicity rather than religion, most intellectual Jews are Atheist, but they are still part of the community and enrich it. Muslim are worse in the world at loosing best brain from their community, you need to have more elasticity in you culture to grow
Muslims are not very different. As long as you go to friday prayers and don't outright say you're an atheist, most will leave you alone.
There is big difference, Muslims have too much focus on literalism and laws like blasphemy and apostasy are still very active in 21st century....
Nobody literally follows Bible or Thora, those books are more violent than Quran...
Plus if you are Atheist that's a big issue in Muslim community even for non religious gathering. Which is different in other communities. Again liberal culture inside Muslim communities all around the world has not developed or regressed a lot, part of this has to do with rise of Wahabis, who are relevant as long as people obey Quran literally...
In west religious institutions were lot more powerful few centuries ago, when people were into literalism, now it's much less, other institutions have taken over...
For example many Zionist are not necessarily believe in Jew as religion...They may be Atheist but believe in cause of Zion. They want to protect Jew as race or community, at the same time openly bash religion as ideology...
There are two kind of homes, although that is not right term for it...
First is old age care facilities, you can even buy insurance for such care when you are young as well. This is targeted towards people who cannot take care of themselves, mostly acute health condition, these types of facilities are rare, these are expensive for govt. to maintain...
Second kind is senior citizen communities, which is more of a life style choice, those communities are marketed towards seniors, like suburban life style is marketed towards families with kids and down town of singles...
In US, one home where you live for generations like we have 'Abahi Ghar' is a rare or even non existent concepts, you change home as phases of your life change....
As young adults(without marriage), you live by yourself and experience life among people with same age group and interests, this is creative and exploration phase of life, people like to live in down town or similar env even in suburbs... Idea is you are more mobile and dynamic with little baggage...this also means parents are less interfering, which is critical part of your development, you discover and build your own personality, sooner you do it better it is...
When you have family many moves to Suburbs or similar communities, there schools, parks and businesses that feed Eco system of those family...if families stay there forever like after kids it disturb the Eco system, let me explain that issue:
When lot of punjabis move to south hall London some 30/40 years ago, they made it their new home, which means they were not willing to move out as they age... This causes as issue, schools (primary, secondary and high) at that times were made with Major portion of population having kids, when that changes it effects the schools quality, if instead of 10 you need only five schools, all services around it looses business too, instead of vibrant it becomes stale community, plus the income of older people comes down, that also effects the business....Now even second generation Desies don't want to live there, because it's not attractive to live there...this is start of gosht town, Detroit run into similar problem for different reason, crash of auto industry... Town here are more dynamic and breathable then back home... In our DC area they are projecting issues in few areas if Desi population specially South Indian did the same thing what punjabis did in south hall
This sort of problem happens to quite a few communities specially where immigrants population is more since we come from different culture... Here people scale down from big houses "(single family with 4/5 bedroom and 1/4 or 1/2 acre lot) to small ones (2 bedroom condo with no lot) once they are not needed...In Pakistan scaling down means you are poor now, it's considered very bad, here it's phase of life.
On the contrary living with parents is considered that you are big failure, it's like if you are in Pakistan and not married till 30/35, people considered there is something wrong with you. Same thing here if you are 30 and living with parents, there is something wrong with you... Btw: marrying you cusion is like incest marriage, nobody does it.... [emoji40][emoji40][emoji40]
Off course those rules are different for immigrants, but our second or third generation adopt new culture...it's not fair to force kids to adopt a culture they have no interaction or knowledge about, they will always be confused and out of place... It's very similar to when you make transition from village culture to city, very hard for first generation, but second generation does not hold on to village culture otherwise they stuck in past, neither here nor there... I have seen that in Pakistan, it's not easy for people who go through these transitions.[emoji27][emoji27][emoji27]
Which culture is good or bad is very subjective thing, they get surprise by our cultural values and we buy there...There culture is better for making most out of every individual in the society, culture focus on developing every individual, that's why focus on equal opportunity(without race, religion, gender etc) has also developed over time... Individual freedom is valued a lot more here, to tell you the truth what freedom and privacy means I only learned here, still struggles at time to implement those ideas in my own life and for people around me...[emoji46][emoji46][emoji46]
Our culture was good in agricultural era, when in group unity was more important than individual creativity, it's hard to develop a vibrant and creative culture with those traditions and idols [emoji854][emoji854][emoji854]
Slog
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One shouldn't really make assumptions of what anyone feels deep down when they really don't have a clue
Many of these western oldies actually prefer to stay at these places.
You're painting a rosy image of the old desi aunty living with her sons as if all that happens is her playing with the grand kids and seeing rabbits skip across the lawn. In reality there is a lot of family politics involved in desi households where there is joint family which could make anyone go mad least of all old people.
Suleiman
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Before I went to the US I used to think similarly. And yes it is partially true that once some American kids grow up, they leave their parents behind completely to start anew somewhere else. However few American parents from what I have noticed also seem to distance themselves from their kids early on as well, and are much harsher in comparison to desi parents when it comes to laad pyar. At times even kick their children out of the house as soon as they hit 18.
#GreenRoars
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Watching mirror, yeah?
Mamoon
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That is because they know that when these kids grow up, they will toss them into Old Homes. So yes it's a cycle - Western kids don't get the same nurturing as desi kids and in turn, they don't give the same respect and care to their elders when they grow old.
It is one of the worst aspects of the Western society.
Mamoon
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You don't have to defend everything that is not good about the West/U.S.
You might like it a lot and have respect for it since you got educated there, but please don't play the apologist at every opportunity.
Like I said in my previous posts in response to Suleiman, their society has evolved in such a way that dumping people in Old Homes has become acceptable and even expats with desi values eventually find it okay as well.
However, that is not how human beings are programmed. We are not lone wolves and are always in the need of the love and respect of our families.
So that the old gentlemen and gentlewomen might seem happy on the surface playing cards and sharing stories, it is quite cynical to assume that deep down they aren't sad and depressed at all and this is what they like.
Yes, they might prefer this because of how their families will be treating them, but that doesn't mean it's the right thing to do.
All this desi family politics is no excuse for dumping parents in Old Homes. Yes desi family politics can get dirty at times and go to great extremes, but in the majority of families, people still take care of their elders in their old age because it is part of our desi values.
Desi society is backward in many ways, but the respect for elders is one thing that stands out and that is why this Old People's Home culture hasn't developed in desi countries and never will.
Mamoon
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You don't watch a mirror, you look at it.
When I look at a mirror, I see a very good looking and successful man, which makes me happy.
However, I do feel heartbroken when I look at the state of Pakistan cricket and Pakistan in general.
Slog
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Thought I'd revive this threead based on the Amir Khan controversy recently
Hahaha this is exactly whats playing out
Hahaha this is exactly whats playing out
TalentSpotterPk
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As a Single Male Child of my parents I would like to live with my parents after marriage.
I hope and pray that It works out.
InshaAllah.
I hope and pray that It works out.
InshaAllah.
Slog
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You, your parents, grandparents, uncles from father's side (who have young families)
usually when the kids start to reach 15-16, the brothers' (or yours) family moves out to their own place and the cycle repeats 10-15 years later when the kids have their own children..
Grandparents usually stick to one's son and keep visiting others
Donal Cozzie
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Can't speak for all families but in Ireland and in my family literally everybody moves out after college if financially possible, however they remain within 30 mins - hour of the parents so they can visit and call in regularly.
My mothers parents live literally next door to me (that I will concede is a rarity possible due only to my mothers side being farmers and thus owning the land we built our current house on) whereas my fathers parents lived about a 10 minute drive away.
Granted I'm from a rural town in Ireland (big size town of 20,000 by our standards) so again, may not be possible in cities, but for people to imply as they're doing that virtually all western people either a) move away and disappear forever or b) dump them in homes is disingenuous. My father visited his father when he was alive most days during his lunch break, and we had him over at our place every Sunday for dinner and to watch the sports on the TV and such. This tradition went on for over a decade until his passing a couple of years back.
Old people want love and care but they arent kids, they also want some independence. I think we've reached the perfect medium here, keep within driving distance while not living together either. Everybody needs space, couldnt imagine a house with so many relatives together, would drive me insane but hey thats culture, every country is different.
Again I realise this is not possible for everybody, and in a small country such as mine I consider myself lucky that its nigh on impossible to be too far away to ever visit, but thats how it is. To suggest that the west is some corporate world of massive sky scrapers devoid of emotion or love is just completely wrong, just as describing the desi joint family system as some utopian existence of harmony is, I'm sure in many cases, also completely wrong.
My mothers parents live literally next door to me (that I will concede is a rarity possible due only to my mothers side being farmers and thus owning the land we built our current house on) whereas my fathers parents lived about a 10 minute drive away.
Granted I'm from a rural town in Ireland (big size town of 20,000 by our standards) so again, may not be possible in cities, but for people to imply as they're doing that virtually all western people either a) move away and disappear forever or b) dump them in homes is disingenuous. My father visited his father when he was alive most days during his lunch break, and we had him over at our place every Sunday for dinner and to watch the sports on the TV and such. This tradition went on for over a decade until his passing a couple of years back.
Old people want love and care but they arent kids, they also want some independence. I think we've reached the perfect medium here, keep within driving distance while not living together either. Everybody needs space, couldnt imagine a house with so many relatives together, would drive me insane but hey thats culture, every country is different.
Again I realise this is not possible for everybody, and in a small country such as mine I consider myself lucky that its nigh on impossible to be too far away to ever visit, but thats how it is. To suggest that the west is some corporate world of massive sky scrapers devoid of emotion or love is just completely wrong, just as describing the desi joint family system as some utopian existence of harmony is, I'm sure in many cases, also completely wrong.
I used to support it too but I don't anymore. I think after marriage you should move out. A couple need their privacy and you can't have that with your family members around and with how old fashioned and bad Pakistani culture is, we all know there will always be problems between your wife and your family. I completely disagree with the notion that is quite prevalent in the Asian culture that marriage is between two families. I completely disagree with that. Marriage is always between two people and you don't want anyone even your beloved parents coming in the way of it. I think men should move out after marriage not only for the sake of their own married life but also to have a better relationship with their parents because when you aren't no longer always dependent on your parents, you will appreciate and respect them more.
WC-Passion
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I think that after marriage it should just be you, you're wife, kids (if you decide to have them) and parents. Personally think any further is just too much and will be very difficult to handle. Having a mega sized family seems like a really chaotic idea and if you want to stay together in some way, you should just live in a close area rather than being all in one house.
Personally hate the idea of putting eldery parents into old people's homes and it is definetly one of part of the western culture I despise. I think the cycle of being born, growing to 18, getting kicked out, leaving your parents in old people's homes when they need care and then kicking your own children out for them to do it to you, just seems depressing and completely pointless. There are some backwards parts to general desi culture but the idea of proper respect and love for your parents is something I will never go away from.
Personally hate the idea of putting eldery parents into old people's homes and it is definetly one of part of the western culture I despise. I think the cycle of being born, growing to 18, getting kicked out, leaving your parents in old people's homes when they need care and then kicking your own children out for them to do it to you, just seems depressing and completely pointless. There are some backwards parts to general desi culture but the idea of proper respect and love for your parents is something I will never go away from.
kingusama92
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There are good and bad examples of each.
You have to determine each situation on its own merit.
You have to determine each situation on its own merit.
IgnitedMind
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Nope, hate it . Kills your individuality..our society anyway is good at that. dont need hundred people having a say in my day to day life
kingusama92
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In Pakistan, I've noticed some have 10-15 people living in a single large house. 2-3 brothers + their families + parents.
Anyone living like that? How is it like?
Anyone living like that? How is it like?
SwingIsKing
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I feel quite sad that for the next generation, in my case at least, our kids won't have all these cousins and relatives. I'm quite fortunate Alhamdulillah to get along with all my family and it would feel very strange now to not have them all.
How do people even feel comfortable living with so many people? I mean I get it living with your parents and siblings but uncles and aunts and cousins. Seriously? 15-20 people living in a household is too much overkill. How are you even supposed to have your privacy with that many people in the house?
15-20 people living in a household is too much overkill. How are you even supposed to have your privacy with that many people in the house?
Madplayer
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Its a cycle which all nuclear families have to go through. Especially talking about the subcontinent scenario. At some point nuclear families do become joint families and then break into further nuclear families and the process goes on in a circle.
For example at First you have a nuclear family :
2 parents + 2 kids ( son and younger daughter)
son gets married and has kids. Sister is yet to be married. So here a nuclear family has reached a stage where it becomes a joint family. And then the cycle goes on where the younger sister is married off. And the children grow up, get married and form separate nuclear families.
For example at First you have a nuclear family :
2 parents + 2 kids ( son and younger daughter)
son gets married and has kids. Sister is yet to be married. So here a nuclear family has reached a stage where it becomes a joint family. And then the cycle goes on where the younger sister is married off. And the children grow up, get married and form separate nuclear families.
Donal Cozzie
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Something tells me this kind of family structure wouldn't catch on in Japan.
world cup captain
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Belawal2014
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Well, I live in Canada with my 3 brothers and my parents. The rest of the extended family is in Pak, so in my case, I do.
desirous of desire
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We live in a joint family system with the family of my chachu and it is not a pleasant experience. Our source of income is same and a fixed money is not allocated for both of families. you can spend as much as you like it even on the expense of other family.We feel we are being robbed of our right by my chacha side of family as they spend much more than us.
But perhaps they feel the same about us and the point is being so close to each other all the life perhaps has ended the chance to miss each other, to see the pleasant and smiling face every time you meet your cousin or your uncle.you value less.
My father and chachu dont quarrel but they also dont feel the same affection as they did before.It is a house of silence. Things are kept hidden that are not worthy of being secret.Politics is exhausting. We are getting a new house and starting a business from scratch just because we have become tired of this sad and strange atmosphere for as long as 20 years. While you care about other family you dont want to show because you will be misunderstood for wanting something secretly in reward or you will be considered cunning.
My father has learned not to do the same thing what my grandfather did in his life. He wants us to get separate homes to live in future.
ahmedwaqas92
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My father doesn't believe in Joint Family System so he's laid down the law for both me and my brother. The day we get married, we'd have to officially 'move out'
Although I love my parents and am ever grateful for their up bringing I guess it's better this way and people would value relations more in such a scenario......
Although I love my parents and am ever grateful for their up bringing I guess it's better this way and people would value relations more in such a scenario......
Madplayer
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Yes, i mentioned it in subcontinent context. But can u explain why you mentioned japan in particular?
kingusama92
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Thanks for sharing.
Makes sense, I always assumed that many people in one house could take a turn for the worse.
Slog
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do your brothers have their own families?
Belawal2014
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Nope, we're all pretty young I'd say (23,22,20,18) and all unmarried.
Slog
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haha then its not joint family per se lol
Joint family system seems to work in Pakistan where the culture supports it. As many people in Pak are unemployed without a monthly salary or landowners it is advantageous on many levels to live in a large group of people. In Pak cities amongst the more elite this joint family system is more or less obsolete, couples after marriage prefer to live on there own if their elders are happy.
In the west unless you're part of a wealthy family with a big house it is now uncommon for Pakistanis to be living in a joint family system. The other side is if there is great unemployment in the family they will need a main earner to provide for them until circumstances improve thereby a family system has to be enforced.
Ideally it would be better to stay together in a large home as long as you are given your own privacy by the elders. This is cost effective as well as everyone being looked after, in modern Europe amongst the majority community loneliness is a major problem now for those who are abandoned by their kid's. There is no reason to live separately if everyone in the family gets on well otherwise it's better to buy another home. Often absence makes the heart grow fonder.
Don't lump all so called desi's together. I am only speaking on behalf of us Pakistanis here who are much more conservative then the Indians and that's a good thing. To the Indian's they'll just follow whatever system is trendy amongst the majority British and Americans.
In the west unless you're part of a wealthy family with a big house it is now uncommon for Pakistanis to be living in a joint family system. The other side is if there is great unemployment in the family they will need a main earner to provide for them until circumstances improve thereby a family system has to be enforced.
Ideally it would be better to stay together in a large home as long as you are given your own privacy by the elders. This is cost effective as well as everyone being looked after, in modern Europe amongst the majority community loneliness is a major problem now for those who are abandoned by their kid's. There is no reason to live separately if everyone in the family gets on well otherwise it's better to buy another home. Often absence makes the heart grow fonder.
Don't lump all so called desi's together. I am only speaking on behalf of us Pakistanis here who are much more conservative then the Indians and that's a good thing. To the Indian's they'll just follow whatever system is trendy amongst the majority British and Americans.
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HussainRx8
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I support a variant of it. I prefer having parents live with one of the kids. Although I don't think it's a good idea having multiple families (excluding parents) live under the same roof.
My wife and I both work. My parents have lived with us from the beginning (a decision we reached mutually). It has worked out perfectly thus far.
My wife and I both work. My parents have lived with us from the beginning (a decision we reached mutually). It has worked out perfectly thus far.
JaDed
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Stop living in your bubble and without being here stop making such remarks.Indians conservative is dependent on areas for example Marwari-Gujarathis majority of them still live in joint family systems,similarly across India its dependent on various factors.
Only places where i have seen join family system to be non-existent are metros in India and that too many of them live nearby.
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JaDed
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Joint family systems can be good incase you want to go through economic slowdowns or crash but personally haven't heard of any family that in last 20 years that has been peaceful and without any issues.
People are ambitious nowadays also the amount of jealousy,envy are very high usually among families one can imagine how it must be among joint families.
People are ambitious nowadays also the amount of jealousy,envy are very high usually among families one can imagine how it must be among joint families.
Did I touch a sore nerve that is offending you for some reason that you are responding by making such remarks. What "bubble" are you talking about? By ad large you people do what the west says in terms of culture and such things. Why are you in denial??
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JaDed
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The west?We like going opposite of the west,when West was having the capitalization character we were socialist now when they are going against globalization ,Indians are pro the same.
Without even being here stop making your massive assumptions.
Thankfully I am not in India but I have had the displeasure to visit. I am talking of culture here and traditions like democracy, raving about the greatness of secularism and westernisation of your culture amongst other thing's I'd rather not mention here. As for the family system that is the topic here your India now also propagates single mother culture as much as the west and you know it! Boyfriend/girlfriend culture has become as common there as it is in the west. Old people's homes are also doing well in India thank you very much. Hooray to the Indian family system!
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JaDed
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Some of the points are agreeable and its mostly related to metros,in the same logic if only cities are concerned our population numbers and GDP per capita would be high as well not to forget literacy.
In rural and smaller towns there is a joint family system still prevalent.
Rural India has still retained it's soul and tradition. Long may it continue for the sake of your people remaining true to yourselves. Imitation is the greatest form of flattery has never been more true when it comes to Indian envy of western culture. Why have you people become coconuts?? I am not talking off population or GDP that is not the topic here.
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