Hardik Pandya vs Faheem Ashraf

[Usman Chadda]

Hardik Pandya is already a world-class all-rounder after a handful of international matches, based on his talent (and his nationality ofcourse). Whether he performs or not is irrelevant.

Although, his bowling is eerily similar to Anwar Ali.

 

[Napa]

Best alrounder fails again...


But but but he is the best finisher in world cricket and has better hitting ability than Lala

When Lala had good reflexes and when he was in the mood - he was a treat to watch against pace and spin. And this Pandya guy can only dream of that power against pace.

Lala is currently over 40 and still twice the hitter this joke of a cricket is.

Over everything, Pandya was said to be better than Abdul Razaaq.

Success went to this chap's head pretty quick it seems. Sad because we needed him to in prime form before SA.

He bowled very well today with pace.
Highest speed 144K.

Pandya critics really could use a reality check. This game is being cast as a failure for him. Ignoring everything he has achieved in the past, even considering just this game, bowling figures of 4-0-25-2 in a iT20 game (wkts of the opposing teams highest and third highest scorers) are enough to merit further inclusion in the national team.

 

[Mobashir]

I didn't make him out to be a superstar. I said he has talent and I back him to good.

Unlike you I judge on ability and talent not on which nationality a player is from.

An Indian player performing for some reason gives you nightmares and even praising one is beneath you which is scary.

Time has already started to tell us who judged Pandya on his nationality...

I have no problem praising Indian players when they deserves it. Even when Rohit Sharma used to average in the 20’s I always rated him quite highly and the most dangerous batsman in Indian team.
Dhawan-Sharma- Kohli form a formidable, as good as anyone top three in ODI’s.
Bumrah has started his career exceptionally well in ODI’s also. The two wrist spinners are doing a good job.

 

[Hasan123]

Time has already started to tell us who judged Pandya on his nationality...

I have no problem praising Indian players when they deserves it. Even when Rohit Sharma used to average in the 20’s I always rated him quite highly and the most dangerous batsman in Indian team.
Dhawan-Sharma- Kohli form a formidable, as good as anyone top three in ODI’s.
Bumrah has started his career exceptionally well in ODI’s also. The two wrist spinners are doing a good job.

All rounders take time to develop. Most people were writing Stokes off and them look what happened . Pandaya has shown glimpses of his talent especially with the bat. Had he performed , you would have said it's only vs Sri Lanka.

 

[Mobashir]

All rounders take time to develop. Most people were writing Stokes off and them look what happened . Pandaya has shown glimpses of his talent especially with the bat. Had he performed , you would have said it's only vs Sri Lanka.

I always supported Stokes even before he made his international debut. I have said a lot of time he is the second best player in the world in tests after Steven Smith.

But it’s not because Stokes is good that Pandya will be good. Their batting is at a very different level.

 

[Hasan123]

I always supported Stokes even before he made his international debut. I have said a lot of time he is the second best player in the world in tests after Steven Smith.

But it’s not because Stokes is good that Pandya will be good. Their batting is at a very different level.

Pandaya batting is better than his bowling.

 

[UN talkz]

Both good players...
Both doing fine job for their respective international teams.
That shud be it.

 

[Usman Chadda]

As mentioned among the chest-thumping gibberish, it's better to let them both play a bit more and make an informed opinion. No one's saying Pandya is no good. It's just too early to judge him and Faheem at all.

 

[Railu Katta]

Some posters have already declared Pandya to be better than Afridi and Razzaq

 

[Bewal Express]

2 players whose careers could go either way but more likely will just plateau along with ever hitting the heights promised.

 

[Napa]

Some posters have already declared Pandya to be better than Afridi and Razzaq

Afridi was a great entertainer and likely a very good guy, but it really doesn't require a whole lot to be better than him on the field. Pandya will quite likely end his career out-performing Afridi. Their current averages:

Afridi
Tests: 36.5
ODIs: 23.6
T20Is: 18.0

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...s=1;template=results;type=batting;view=series

Pandya
Tests: 59.3
ODIs: 33.4
T20Is: 10.3

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...s=3;template=results;type=batting;view=series

 

[giri26]

Pandya is not better than anyone at the moment. The guy needs to improve a lot. He is a good player to have in the team if he comes of. He can tonk the ball and bowl few overs with the ball. Would I play him as a batsman alone? I don't think so, would I play him as a third seamer? I don't think so. He has a long way to go before he can be compared with anyone in International cricket. He has had a good start to his career but he needs to keep that up and work on getting more consistent with the bat and the ball.

 

[Syed1]

Afridi was a great entertainer and likely a very good guy, but it really doesn't require a whole lot to be better than him on the field. Pandya will quite likely end his career out-performing Afridi. Their current averages:

Afridi
Tests: 36.5
ODIs: 23.6
T20Is: 18.0

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...s=1;template=results;type=batting;view=series

Pandya
Tests: 59.3
ODIs: 33.4
T20Is: 10.3

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...s=3;template=results;type=batting;view=series

Yes because comparing stats of a guy who played nearly two decades with a guy who is 2 years into his career makes perfect sense.


Heck Pandya averages more than Sachin in tests I'm sure going by your logic he will be better than him too?

 

[Oligochaetes]

WHy dont people watch the whole movie before reviewing it

 

[hadi123]

I think Ashraf was going to be in the 11 anyway but now with Imad Wasim's injury it seems even more likely Faheem Ashraf will actually get a good run of games in this series rather than just being a water boy. A good series in New Zealand will really improve his game as so far he has only done stuff of note against teams like Sri Lanka. This will be, without a doubt, his hardest tour in his young career so far.

 

[owaistabish]

BUMP! Love this guys technique in NZ conditions.

 

[indipper]

BUMP! Love this guys technique in NZ conditions.

Good, reall good. But not Pandya good. Santner would have gone for 3-4 sixes otherwise.

 

[Rayyman]

Good, reall good. But not Pandya good. Slanter would have gone for 3-4 sixes otherwise.

Okay, but don't think Pandya can smash Boult for two fours on his 3rd and 4th balls.

 

[indipper]

BUMP! Love this guys technique in NZ conditions.

Okay, but don't think Pandya can smash Boult for two fours on his 3rd and 4th balls.

Yes because he usually deals in sixes.

 

[owaistabish]

Two different types of batsman.

 

[Rayyman]

Yes because he usually deals in sixes.

He's only hit 3 sixes in his career against New Zealand and they are all against Santner.

 

[Madplayer]

Good, reall good. But not Pandya good. Santner would have gone for 3-4 sixes otherwise.

Even pandya would disagree with you.

 

[indipper]

Even pandya would disagree with you.

Let him face Santner in a critical situation, you'd know.

 

[indipper]

He's only hit 3 sixes in his career against New Zealand and they are all against Santner.

Maybe he was not needed to hit others.

 

[MenInG]

Pandya showing rest of the Indian lineup how its done!

 

[Mamoon]

Fahim may turn out to be a good player for Pakistan, but no matter how much some of our fans insist, he is simply not of the same caliber as Pandya as far as batting is concerned.

Pandya has scaled heights with the bat, i.e. Champions Trophy Final, SL Test, Australia ODI series, this current knock etc. which Fahim is unlikely to get close to.

However, if he can average around 25-30 at a good SR, he will be quite useful for the team. His bowling is irrelevant in my view, because unless he delivers with the bat, he won’t add much to the team.

 

[MenInG]

Fahim may turn out to be a good player for Pakistan, but no matter how much some of our fans insist, he is simply not of the same caliber as Pandya as far as batting is concerned.

Pandya has scaled heights with the bat, i.e. Champions Trophy Final, SL Test, Australia ODI series, this current knock etc. which Fahim is unlikely to get close to.

However, if he can average around 25-30 at a good SR, he will be quite useful for the team. His bowling is irrelevant in my view, because unless he delivers with the bat, he won’t add much to the team.

How many Tests has Faheem played out of interest?

Just because he is Pakistani doesn't make him a failure by default.

 

[DRsohail]

Fahim may turn out to be a good player for Pakistan, but no matter how much some of our fans insist, he is simply not of the same caliber as Pandya as far as batting is concerned.

Pandya has scaled heights with the bat, i.e. Champions Trophy Final, SL Test, Australia ODI series, this current knock etc. which Fahim is unlikely to get close to.

However, if he can average around 25-30 at a good SR, he will be quite useful for the team. His bowling is irrelevant in my view, because unless he delivers with the bat, he won’t add much to the team.

Fahim may be better layer but we have t wait .u should not be biased....ATM pandya has proven himself and playing a blinder.

 

[Mamoon]

How many Tests has Faheem played out of interest?

Just because he is Pakistani doesn't make him a failure by default.

Chances are slim. It is not usual for a Pakistani batsman to be better than his Indian counterpart, and Pandya is already doing incredible things with the bat.

 

[thelandofthebravepeople]

I don't understand the comparison. What has Faheem done so far? Only 4 ODI and 4 T20. Let Faheem play for 1-2 years and build a record before you can draw comparisons.

 

[Mamoon]

Fahim may be better layer but we have t wait .u should not be biased....ATM pandya has proven himself and playing a blinder.

It was obvious since the Champions Trophy that he is a terrific prospect. Few bad games and everyone was on his back, but such people are not meant to be taken seriously.

People hated on him because he is Indian, since a lot of people here a phobia of Indian players. If he was English, Australian or South African, he would be rated much higher.

 

[Mamoon]

Speaking of bias, there is no comparison between Pandya and Fahim at this point, and only one select group of people have exhibited their bias over the last few months.

 

[DRsohail]

It was obvious since the Champions Trophy that he is a terrific prospect. Few bad games and everyone was on his back, but such people are not meant to be taken seriously.

People hated on him because he is Indian, since a lot of people here a phobia of Indian players. If he was English, Australian or South African, he would be rated much higher.

he is better player but Fahim has the potential to match him..i saw him stroking the ball effortlessly today..have u seen anyone from pak like that...but yes pandya is going to be a good al rounder if he plays like this.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Faheem looked very comfortable against Boult today. This lad is a special talent and can only get better I believe. We wouldn't have won the match, but it would have been exciting to watch Fakhar and Faheem bat together.

 

[Mamoon]

he is better player but Fahim has the potential to match him..i saw him stroking the ball effortlessly today..have u seen anyone from pak like that...but yes pandya is going to be a good al rounder if he plays like this.

The chances of Fahim matching Pandya are low. Very low.

 

[7sins]

One lucky innings and people bump this thread again we will talk after the three test matches

 

[MenInG]

The chances of Fahim matching Pandya are low. Very low.

Based on what? Ilm-ul-Ghaib?

 

[Mamoon]

Based on what? Ilm-ul-Ghaib?

History.

 

[jnaveen1980]

One lucky innings and people bump this thread again we will talk after the three test matches

Pandya may or may not be good against him. But you need a bit of luck even for top order to survive here. He has survived. It is a good knock.

 

[babajee]

Pandya is no match for Faheem

 

[Mamoon]

Obviously.

 

[Cryin Out Loud]

I saw Faheem play briefly today. He has some moves, that's for sure. But whether he has the stamina, will, discipline, we'll see.

 

[babajee]

Obviously.

You may laugh. But just keep waiting.

Faheem is an ATG talent

 

[DRsohail]

History.

Going by history ,how many pace allrounders india has produced post kapil?

 

[Virat_Kohli_fan]

Going by history ,how many pace allrounders india has produced post kapil?

He's not a pace bowling all rounder, he's a batting all rounder who bowls pace.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Just checked Faheem Ashram stats. He is more a bowler than a batsman from what i see. List A avge 16, First class avge 30. Just 4 ODIs. 2 t20s. Doesn't exactly look like a fit player.

 

[DRsohail]

He's not a pace bowling all rounder, he's a batting all rounder who bowls pace.

waaw whats that?

 

[DRsohail]

Just checked Faheem Ashram stats. He is more a bowler than a batsman from what i see. List A avge 16, First class avge 30. Just 4 ODIs. 2 t20s. Doesn't exactly look like a fit player.

do u know on what number he bats in domestics...thats sorry states of affairs in pak cricket.

 

[Virat_Kohli_fan]

waaw whats that?

Kapil , Imran , Hadlee etc. were bowling all rounders, they could bat but bowling was their far stronger suit. Pandya is not like that, his stronger suit is his batting.

 

[DRsohail]

Kapil , Imran , Hadlee etc. were bowling all rounders, they could bat but bowling was their far stronger suit. Pandya is not like that, his stronger suit is his batting.

OK so how many india have produced like that???

 

[lehen]

Pandya looked the best batsman from both sides by Miles in this match.Sadly that can not prevent a 3.5 day defeat for Us

 

[jnaveen1980]

OK so how many india have produced like that???

Irfan was the only one who came close. But his bowling rapidly disintegrated since his debut. He was also an okay batsman. Prabakar is another guy who was an opener and a support bowler for Kapil.

 

[Virat_Kohli_fan]

OK so how many india have produced like that???

See, typically India's problem is producing good pace bowlers, they do produce good batsman time to time. Pandya is not breaking this trend, he isn't much of a bowler, so at least in theory India should be able to produce such guys.

 

[DRsohail]

See, typically India's problem is producing good pace bowlers, they do produce good batsman time to time. Pandya is not breaking this trend, he isn't much of a bowler, so at least in theory India should be able to produce such guys.

Thats the point i was trying to say indirectly.

 

[Napa]

Let's not compare gully mohallah level players like Pandya with Fahim.

I second this wholeheartedly! Very well said brother

Ganguly and Tendulkar were better more effective bowling options then Pandya

Lala is currently over 40 and still twice the hitter this joke of a cricket is.

Over everything, Pandya was said to be better than Abdul Razaaq.

Success went to this chap's head pretty quick it seems. Sad because we needed him to in prime form before SA.

I don't think the problem is within his head, he is just not good enough for international cricket.
Don't think he will play in South Africa, I will love him to play as I support South Africa, but India will go with Rohit Sharma at 6.

It appears Pandya has burrowed deep in the psyche of a few Pakistani posters. It is going to be a long 10 to 15 years for them as Pandya keeps delivering.

The point with Pandya is that he is mentally exceptional. Just watch his face when he plays. I have not seen another player display the concentration he shows, whether batting or bowling.

I didn't make him out to be a superstar. I said he has talent and I back him to good.

Unlike you I judge on ability and talent not on which nationality a player is from.

An Indian player performing for some reason gives you nightmares and even praising one is beneath you which is scary.

You along with [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] at least go by what you see on the field. Kudos to you two.

 

[babajee]

Just checked Faheem Ashram stats. He is more a bowler than a batsman from what i see. List A avge 16, First class avge 30. Just 4 ODIs. 2 t20s. Doesn't exactly look like a fit player.

Pakistan domestic stats are irrelevant.

 

[in_cutter]

Pandya is no doubt a special talent. Haters will hate.

But Faheem has the potential to be that gun allrounder we desperately need.

 

[Bewal Express]

Pandaya showed a side that i didnt know he had- a willingness to play fast bowlers and not just hit spinners.

 

[Markhor]

There is no comparison between Pandya and Ashraf.

Ashraf may well turn out to be a handy allrounder but its clear Pandya is ahead right now. Make the comparison when Ashraf scores a similar knock at Newlands against this rampaging pace attack.

 

[Hasan123]

Some people on this forum look really stupid now. Pandaya is a talent and will be a fantastic all rounder.

 

[Mobashir]

Pandya has played a splendid innings, nothing to say about it, it was really brilliant.

 

[Markhor]

Some posters have already declared Pandya to be better than Afridi and Razzaq

Can you name one Test knock from Afridi and Razzaq outside Asia against the quality of attack like Pandya's 93 vs SA in Newlands today ?

Pandya's development into one of Asia's premier ARs seems hard for Afridi fans in particular to swallow. This guy is a proper AR, Afridi was the epitome of bits and pieces.

 

[Romali_rotti]

Kapil Dev in the making, with the BAT atleast ... I am quite pleased

 

[Madplayer]

Pandya often finds himself in situations where he has nothing to lose for example 7 down or i down. This is a time where he can go after the bowling and maximize the runs and hence his natural stroke play helps him , for which he should be given credit.

However it would be interesting to see him bat in challenging conditions when all is not lost and there is plenty of batting left for India. Will he play his natural game and go after the bowling in such a situation? I expect him not to do that and that would be the time when his defensive technique (average by the look of it) would be tested.

 

[Oligochaetes]

Simply put he has scored 90 after Steyn, Morkel, Rabada and Philander reduced India to 92-7. That deserves praise.

 

[blue_champion]

I had no idea who Ashraf was till I saw the odi match yesterday...my only response to this thread is really???

Pandya might have overtaken some
Pakistani great batsmen with this performance leave alone some upcoming player

 

[blue_champion]

Pandya often finds himself in situations where he has nothing to lose for example 7 down or i down. This is a time where he can go after the bowling and maximize the runs and hence his natural stroke play helps him , for which he should be given credit.

However it would be interesting to see him bat in challenging conditions when all is not lost and there is plenty of batting left for India. Will he play his natural game and go after the bowling in such a situation? I expect him not to do that and that would be the time when his defensive technique (average by the look of it) would be tested.

You haven’t seen his innings against Australia last year then where he he won the man of the series.... none of those knocks where slogging in the death type scenarios..they were all calculated finishes almost like a in prime Dhoni.

 

[GoUgandaCranes]

It appears Pandya has burrowed deep in the psyche of a few Pakistani posters. It is going to be a long 10 to 15 years for them as Pandya keeps delivering.

The point with Pandya is that he is mentally exceptional. Just watch his face when he plays. I have not seen another player display the concentration he shows, whether batting or bowling.



You along with [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] at least go by what you see on the field. Kudos to you two.

The absolute lack of quality in recent Pakistani cricketers has made Pakistani fans hail anyone from the green side, even with an iota of talent to cricketing stratosphere. Shehzad being better than Tendulkar, Akmal Jr. being an absolute beast etc. etc.

The truth is, in terms of cricketing talent production, India are at the moment on an entirely different level to us while we are super mediocre and even below average.

Pandya is scary good and not just that, he can be the ultimate new face of Indian cricket. It is a fact that many Pakistani fans don't want this to happen, i.e. the one area where we were far superior to India - all rounders who could bowl seam and hit big - is now going to skew in India's direction as well.

That said, Pandya must continue to work hard, Azhar Mehmood of all people has two stunning centuries against RSA in RSA and that too against an equally good bowling line-up Donald, Pollock, Kallis, Klusener, and Fani Devilliers etc. This is the era of hyperbole though so I guess while Mehmood will be forgotten, Pandya will be immortalised.

 

[Madplayer]

You haven’t seen his innings against Australia last year then where he he won the man of the series.... none of those knocks where slogging in the death type scenarios..they were all calculated finishes almost like a in prime Dhoni.

Key words - challenging conditions

 

[cricketjoshila]

Key words - challenging conditions

Conditions in Cape Town againist Morkel Steyn and Rabada are not challenging enough?

 

[HuzaifaE]

Absolutely iconic performance. An on fire, frightening pace quartet on a seaming deck with his team in tatters, and he singlehandedly keeps the contest within touching distance. That innings alone might be better than anything Fahim ever manages with the bat, there is simply no comparison as of now.

 

[blue_champion]

Key words - challenging conditions

So you mean to say a young player cannot be rated until he performs on a green track or a minefield or take wickets on a flat track???

It hasn’t even been 2 years since his debut,already has a test 100 and 2 50s and a man of the series against a top side in Odis and many such clutch knocks . You are just basing your assumption on a couple of innings(Seeing How there is a time warp situation going on with a lot of posters here I am willing to bet only 1)

 

[blue_champion]

[MENTION=138254]Syed1[/MENTION] won’t make an appearance here now for a while by the look of it

Anyway good to see a lot of reasonable Pakistani posters giving credit where due.

 

[Syed1]

[MENTION=138254]Syed1[/MENTION] won’t make an appearance here now for a while by the look of it

Anyway good to see a lot of reasonable Pakistani posters giving credit where due.

Same way you were slapped around in the match thread yesterday?

 

[blue_champion]

Same way you were slapped around in the match thread yesterday?

Is that how you felt? The way the same reference was used time and again for every unrelated topic was not a very flattering reflection but then again you need to be bright enough to realize that

 

[Madplayer]

So you mean to say a young player cannot be rated until he performs on a green track or a minefield or take wickets on a flat track???

It hasn’t even been 2 years since his debut,already has a test 100 and 2 50s and a man of the series against a top side in Odis and many such clutch knocks . You are just basing your assumption on a couple of innings(Seeing How there is a time warp situation going on with a lot of posters here I am willing to bet only 1)

First of all i am only talking about tests. And Ofcourse we can rate him based on what he is doing right now. He is a good all rounder and has lots of potential.

I just raised a point in my post that he had nothing to lose today and he often finds himself in such positions where he has the license to go after the bowling without caring for his wicket. Its because he sees that a lot of wickets have fallen already and he takes it upon himself to maximise the runs by hitting out. Even in some ODIs this has been the case. This doesnt allow him to be tested defensively in such conditions.

Today was a classic case of it. His hitting ability is not even in question. We all know he is good with that. You will know what i am saying the day he is required to bat defensively in hostile conditions to save a match or to support a front line batsman.

 

[Madplayer]

Conditions in Cape Town againist Morkel Steyn and Rabada are not challenging enough?

Joshila sahab aap rehne do yaar. Pehle pichle posts padh lo.

 

[indipper]

Fahim may turn out to be a good player for Pakistan, but no matter how much some of our fans insist, he is simply not of the same caliber as Pandya as far as batting is concerned.

Pandya has scaled heights with the bat, i.e. Champions Trophy Final, SL Test, Australia ODI series, this current knock etc. which Fahim is unlikely to get close to.

However, if he can average around 25-30 at a good SR, he will be quite useful for the team. His bowling is irrelevant in my view, because unless he delivers with the bat, he won’t add much to the team.

Agreed. He is the most perfect allrounder I have seen in my life. Imran could bat but was hit or miss with bat. Kallis was a batter but gul-ish with ball. Razzaq was all hit or miss. Pandya does everything in a perfect manner. Give me 11 like him and I will win you as many WC as you want.


Faheem should look to cross Razzaq and try to be within Pandya's class. Kohli needs BCCI's domination to stay alive, Pandya doesnt.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Some people on this forum look really stupid now. Pandaya is a talent and will be a fantastic all rounder.

People who deny the talent of both players haven't watched much cricket. Although I would class Pandya as a batting all-rounder than a genuine one. Incredible innings under pressure. Hats off.

 

[ataullah]

pandya rode his luck today. If faheem had that luck he could have done the same.