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Has Mohammad Amir's pace fallen since returning to cricket?

Stewie said:
he doesnt look that tall. sometimes that plays a role as well. if you are tall and bowling at medium pace with some nip, you can be more than enough to deal with.

I always thought he was around 5'8-5'10 kind of range. I honestly dont think he is over 6 feet.
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See I thought that too. But then I saw him standing next to Asif (6"4) and Butt (5"6), and then you could roughly tell he was 6 ft +, was coming up to Asif's brow.
 
Well this thread was suppose be the discuss of Amir bowling speed. Don't know why Umesh Yadav topic came in. Just look at the age and build of these two. Stop comparing every one with Indian player yes we know they are good really good now please stick to the topic or discuss these speeding issues in other thread
 
To be quite frank who cares about what speed amir bowls in T20s in a game where batsmen are coming after you its better to have variety in your bowling speeds and ability to move the ball and confuse batsmen as that always works better. All this cricket Amir is playing is ultimatley to gain match fitness and game time and he will come back as the quality bowler he was 5 years ago.
 
cricfan14 said:
What I want to know is why he's SO FAR behind the crease in his motion??
[MENTION=138980]TalentSpotterPk[/MENTION], is this going to affect his pace? Maybe he's so concerned with the no ball mindset that he's bowling from WAY far back, to the detriment of his pace and movement? Anyone else have any insight??
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See , he is just beginning so he is careful. Yes it will affect his pace (of the wicket) but won't affect much his speed (from the hand)

After his comeback to Pakistan team after few months you will see that only his entire foot will be behind the line but not as far behind as of now.

Amir's runup has still got same rhythm and also his hand speed is quick. If you have seen bpl than Amir along with Sami and Fidel is the quickest uptil now but not as quick as he was before due to one thing :

In m opinion he has needlessly shortened his runup by 3,4 steps. He needs to revert back to old runup sooner than later than he will bowl 5 to 8 km faster than what he is bowling now.

With such a small runup he cannot bowl many bowls between 145 to 153kph which he is still capable of bowling.

I don't mind him bowling so back from the bowling crease ( for the time being ) but my concern is his runup length. It was perfect in 2010 . It wasn't very long it wasn't very short and it gave him enough momentum to bowl fast.

Alhamdoulillah he still has got the ability of hitting the lengths he wants , swinging the ball , reading batsman and setting up a batsman. Misbah is 42 but it is no mean feat getting Misbah out bowled of a yorker.

So nothing much to worry off. He still is an asset MashaAllah.
 
The yorker he bowled to misbah was pretty damn quick , misbah didn't even begin to get his bat down. He can bowl quick when he wants but his main weapons are his swing and seam.
 
TalentSpotterPk said:
You never agree. I remember you in another thread where you were pleading the case of Aaron being the fastest baller from sub continent and I proved it to be not factual. So it's your aadat and zidd.

I don't want to indulge in any argument with you . I know Aaron, Umesh are fastest bowlers from sub continent . Close the debate .
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He is right here. You are imagining things. He was 85-88mph
 
TalentSpotterPk said:
See , he is just beginning so he is careful. Yes it will affect his pace (of the wicket) but won't affect much his speed (from the hand)

After his comeback to Pakistan team after few months you will see that only his entire foot will be behind the line but not as far behind as of now.

Amir's runup has still got same rhythm and also his hand speed is quick. If you have seen bpl than Amir along with Sami and Fidel is the quickest uptil now but not as quick as he was before due to one thing :

In m opinion he has needlessly shortened his runup by 3,4 steps. He needs to revert back to old runup sooner than later than he will bowl 5 to 8 km faster than what he is bowling now.

With such a small runup he cannot bowl many bowls between 145 to 153kph which he is still capable of bowling.

I don't mind him bowling so back from the bowling crease ( for the time being ) but my concern is his runup length. It was perfect in 2010 . It wasn't very long it wasn't very short and it gave him enough momentum to bowl fast.

Alhamdoulillah he still has got the ability of hitting the lengths he wants , swinging the ball , reading batsman and setting up a batsman. Misbah is 42 but it is no mean feat getting Misbah out bowled of a yorker.

So nothing much to worry off. He still is an asset MashaAllah.
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if you remember in 2009 WC his runup was short when he started, later his action and runnup got changed. From my experience if he is bowling from behind the crease it will effect his pace not a great deal but if he is bowling for eg 90 it will end up as 86 or 85 mph. Because of early jump and ball had to travel a little more
 
endymion248 said:
Don't see what people are on, Amir had an average of around 143 kph in ODIS and T20s.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVNe70C-2iw

I remember that he was also pretty skiddy in the T20 WC final against Sri Lanka. The Dilshan wicket was 145 kph and cranked it up even to 148 kph.
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This.

Not sure why all the crying in this thread. Amir was mostly a 140s bowler, but also bowled in 130s just like Starc does as well.

Starc's top speed is faster and a bit more consistent.

Amir has touched 150s too but he isn't a consistent 150kph bowler.

Also not sure what happened to [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION]. Boult is much slower average speed bowler and even in effort balls can't match Amir's top speeds.
 
Suleiman said:
See I thought that too. But then I saw him standing next to Asif (6"4) and Butt (5"6), and then you could roughly tell he was 6 ft +, was coming up to Asif's brow.
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Butt is definitely taller than 5"6
 
Slog said:
He is right here. You are imagining things. He was 85-88mph
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I watched whole test and odi series against England. He bowled many above 145kph and his average speed was 139 140kph.

People are saying present videos . There are only 3,4 videos of his bowling on England tour and those of his wickets only . On youtube and daily motion all balls of all spells aren't available to prove a point . Next is cricinfo hawkeye graph. That isn't showing the speed. Those who watched him live in tests and ODI's know that he bowled many above 145kph on England tour. Also 16 17 years old Amir who was much skinny in wc 200 bowled one at 148 kph in final and dilshan's dismissal was at 143 or 145kph ball plus one delivery at 146kph.

After England tour we went australia almost immediately and the first ball Amir bowled there in test match was 146 kph. First ball of spell . You can see it on cricinfo commentary still .

So within 2 weeks Amir did not increase his pace from 85 to 91mph.

Than on the Australian tour he bowled 3 deliveries above 150kph with one being 152kph.

You can find this on a 2009 2010 pakpassion thread when I wasn't even a member here .

I don't like to exaggerate and I only state facts and things I have seen .
 
Slog said:
Butt is definitely taller than 5"6
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No he's pretty short. Around 5'6 or 5'7 max. Was standing shoulder to shoulder with Kamran Akmal during the 2010 world t20. Even in the 2006 odi series vs India, Tendulkar and him looked around the same height.

I have the uncanny talent to judge a person's height from the tv :afridi.
 
Statsman said:
Not sure why people are getting so sensitive/ defensive/ intolerant in this thread! You feel Aamir has clocked 90mph+ in England, show some clips and let the discussion end.
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Watch first over of 2009 T20 WC final. All balls above 140, last one 90 MPH, that was in England

http://youtu.be/qNwqbGXusTU

Check out his first fifer in MCG test, reverse swing at 90 MPH. Amir was always 88/90 mph category bowler.

http://youtu.be/hQqKA6_RKEY

In England he reduce his pace to 138ish in test to get more swing out of new ball. My hunch is Asif coached him to give more time to the ball in hand, to get more swing in those conditions.


Also note that his action and run up is very similar to what he has right now. He is still quick was hurrying batsmen more than any other bowler. If Tashin was clocking 135, how Aamir can be in 120s, he appear lot quicker than him in all these matches.

I wonder if Aamir bowling way off the crease is screwing the speed gun?? He is the only one who bowls so far behind the crease. Plus his faster deliveries no speed was registered. Most of his deliveries had no speed.


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TalentSpotterPk said:
Bro he was 17 than. Than with age he improved his pace and became even more impressive and difficult bowler to face.

Why has he shortened his runup ?
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I'm not obsessed or worried with his pace TSP. We have to remember all the cricket he has played so far has been in Asia. When he comes to England, goes to South Africa and Australia I'm sure he'll bowl quicker.
 
Saj said:
I'm not obsessed or worried with his pace TSP. We have to remember all the cricket he has played so far has been in Asia. When he comes to England, goes to South Africa and Australia I'm sure he'll bowl quicker.
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I.A

Boss is never wrong :-)

Do you think his runup is abit shorter than what it was previously ? Like 3 , 4 lesser steps ? Or you think that it has the same length as previous ?

He is bowling beautifully though. M.A
 
TalentSpotterPk said:
I.A

Boss is never wrong :-)

Do you think his runup is abit shorter than what it was previously ? Like 3 , 4 lesser steps ? Or you think that it has the same length as previous ?

He is bowling beautifully though. M.A
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I don't think his runup has changed, it was never too long. What he is still doing so good, late swing at 140+, with great length control. He bowls lot of quality deliveries. Even yesterday two boundaries were off the edges. Lot of straight and inswing deliveries which at that pace is quite difficult to play. Junior Khan did that in one series, he is doing that in every match in phatta tracks.

He generates pace from quick arm rotation that surprise batsmen. Because of quick Arm he is getting late swing as well, that is test quality wicket taking deliveries [emoji108][emoji108][emoji108]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
^ if you compare that to Wahab or Johnson they try to throw the ball down hard, that's why they bowl such a good bouncers, their action is tailor made for throwing heavy balls, different bowling style.
Akram used to have quick arm rotation, he was fast for such a short effortless runup, he used to surprise batsmen with pace. This also gave him and Amir great length control and late swing.


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TalentSpotterPk said:
I.A

Boss is never wrong :-)

Do you think his runup is abit shorter than what it was previously ? Like 3 , 4 lesser steps ? Or you think that it has the same length as previous ?

He is bowling beautifully though. M.A
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I will ask him about his run-up soon.

I'm sure when I asked him he said it was the same, but I will ask again.
 
So a thread was opened after seeing his bowling in T20 tamsasha cricket to ask whether his pace has gone down...can the OP chowdhry sahb explain since when did T20 became the place to bowl full tilt?

If you watch any of the highlights from his spells, he is constantly varying his pace and adjusting his line and length to keep the score rate low...not really going full tilt in picking wickets because that usually back fires in T20's; most batsmen use that pace to divert the ball to various parts of the ground and score very rapidly!

He seems to be fine and bowling with the same vigor and brilliance of old
 
I clearly remember him hitting 152.5 in the first Test in Australia. I remember myself and friends talking about it. He also bowled 90mph in the 2009 T20 World Cup. He slowed down in England in 2010. He slowed down a lot more in the subcontinent and didn't hit 140 often. But on his day I know for sure he can hit 145-150. But I also agree it isn't his pace that made him deadly but his control. His pace doesn't look like it has decreased in the BPL. He is a 130-140kph bowler in most conditions. We don't need him bowling 150kph as long as he keeps his control and swing. Shoaib Akhtar was at his fastest in 2003 and bowled complete rubbish because he let the record get to his head in that World Cup.
 
bowled one delivery at 149 in last over of 2009 semifinal
he looks abit down on pace but then again his bowling muscles would need time to develop. The more he bowls the faster he gets. Only time will tell
 
Big challenge for 'bring Amir back because he is once in a lifetime bowler' brigade. How to count his wickets as reflecting his readiness for international cricket, while ignoring the speed gun.
 
he was still the fastest in BPL... i doubt the speedguns are correct.
 
He will crank it up when it matters, not to worry. Even at a low pace he is comfortably one of our better bowlers now.
 
People expect him to crank 150ks on bangla tracks? Plus give him a break
 
That seam position and wrist action is still a joy to watch , the way he squared up the left hander was beautiful , he really hasn't lost any of his skills in the 5 years out of the game.
 
Pakcricket89 said:
Noone is expecting that, But late 120s, early 130s is definite trundling
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Lol Anwar Ali is bowling quicker than him.
I doubt he will have a hard time displacing Anwar Ali let alone thinking he is gonna be the next Wasim.
 
ethan hunt said:
That seam position and wrist action is still a joy to watch , the way he squared up the left hander was beautiful , he really hasn't lost any of his skills in the 5 years out of the game.
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Yeah no doubt about skills, but pace looks down by almost 5kph
 
waleed88 said:
Lol Anwar Ali is bowling quicker than him.
I doubt he will have a hard time displacing Anwar Ali let alone thinking he is gonna be the next Wasim.
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He still has good skills, needs to work hard and get his pace back, until then i dont think he is ready
 
What harm has Junaid Khan done? He should come back in the side too now that this trundler is set to get his 128kph pies back at the International level.
 
waleed88 said:
What harm has Junaid Khan done? He should come back in the side too now that this trundler is set to get his 128kph pies back at the International level.
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Junaid has no skills and no pace

Amir has skills but at this pace he also cant come back
 
Pakcricket89 said:
Junaid has no skills and no pace

Amir has skills but at this pace he also cant come back
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What skills? His skill set is evident against Bangla babies but I worry what will happen when he bowls at the top level. Will he be villified like all the other 128kph bowlers in our team? I am worried what has he got that he is considered the next Wasim? I fail to see anything special.
His fans talk about him like he is Harry Potter the chosen one.
 
Pakcricket89 said:
Junaid has no skills and no pace

Amir has skills but at this pace he also cant come back
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That's what happend to Junaid 4years into his International career.
I worry Amir is destined for a similar fate or even worse since he is starting off at the pace Junaid has declined to.
 
waleed88 said:
That's what happend to Junaid 4years into his International career.
I worry Amir is destined for a similar fate or even worse since he is starting off at the pace Junaid has declined to.
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Junaid never has shown great skills with the ball bar one Series against India

Aamir will not be effective in the long run, if he doesnt regain his pace, but he will do better than Junaid because of a better skill set and better bowling brain

At present I think both should not be in the team because on lacks everything and other lacks pace
 
Pakcricket89 said:
Junaid never has shown great skills with the ball bar one Series against India

Aamir will not be effective in the long run, if he doesnt regain his pace, but he will do better than Junaid because of a better skill set and better bowling brain

At present I think both should not be in the team because on lacks everything and other lacks pace
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How do you know what will happen in the future? Do you have a crystal ball with you?

I can clearly suggest to you pages on this foru. where people thought Junaid was as good as Amir but he turned out another false hope.

How do you know what happens down the line? If he gets found for spot fixing again or any other criminal offense? Why is he being given the next Wasim Akram tag. He could turn out to be just another trundler. That is a possibility you dont see.
 
waleed88 said:
How do you know what will happen in the future? Do you have a crystal ball with you?

I can clearly suggest to you pages on this foru. where people thought Junaid was as good as Amir but he turned out another false hope.

How do you know what happens down the line? If he gets found for spot fixing again or any other criminal offense? Why is he being given the next Wasim Akram tag. He could turn out to be just another trundler. That is a possibility you dont see.
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Well no one needs a crystal ball, to see Aamir was and is vastly superior talent to Junaid. That being said i dont think Amir's present form deserves any comparison with Wasim and neither have i compared him with any great bowler. Amir will go down the route of being an average trundler if he doesnt regain his pace. He wont be successful in tests with this pace but still would do well in ODIs with 2 new ball rule.

I dont need to see those threads on Junaid, i just know that people overrated him based on one series. After and before that he never has got the ball to swing with control even in helpful conditions.
 
Please don't make us suffer through this garbage pace attack any longer. Please, just bring back Amir.
 
Amir needs to hit the gym with Taskin and Zia. Looks way too skinny.
 
No improvement in Pace since getting dropped unless he isn't in rhythm at the moment.

Mostly operating in range of 83 to 85 mph at the moment.
 
Different bowler these days to the long-haired teenager who we saw in 2009 and 2010. Back then he was hitting 140kph with ease.

These days his speed is around 135kph and looks to work batsmen out rather than blast them out.

We all want to see the 2009 and 2010 version but I don't think we will see that version again.
 
Don't really care about the pace ATM. Its the line and length which made dip in his performance.
 
Saj said:
Different bowler these days to the long-haired teenager who we saw in 2009 and 2010. Back then he was hitting 140kph with ease.

These days his speed is around 135kph and looks to work batsmen out rather than blast them out.

We all want to see the 2009 and 2010 version but I don't think we will see that version again.
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Takes true heart and passion to want to bowl fast for your country and blast batsmen out. Now days bowlers are just more practical and are cognizant of the fact that there is so much international cricket, T-20 leagues being played around the world and that they need to bowl within themselves for the most part to last longer.
 
Pakistani bowlers tend to drop their pace after initial burst of 1-2 series. They don't have strong bodies that can endure the real fast bowling.
 
I thought he bowled with good pace and good control today. Looks to be getting back to good form. Wont be surprised if he bowls out SA in the first session in the morning.
 
He still doesn't look fit. His initial spells are sensational to say the least, but then he tapers off and struggles with his rhythm.
 
Saj said:
Different bowler these days to the long-haired teenager who we saw in 2009 and 2010. Back then he was hitting 140kph with ease.

These days his speed is around 135kph and looks to work batsmen out rather than blast them out.

We all want to see the 2009 and 2010 version but I don't think we will see that version again.
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You probably know why he cannot be Amir of 2009, he has chronic knee problems, that was also discussed in media during English summer(I assume you would know lot more details than we do, that stuff cannot be fixed by diet and Gym), whatever we can get out of him in next 2-4 years is what we hope for. WC, series win in England would be on my list.

There is a reason we need fourth seamer and 5+2+3 combination, test team needs to develop around that model, that way we can make most out of our tier 1 bowlers and batters and can win close games...
 
Reasons for Mohammad Amir's lack of pace?

Is it fitness?

Or when he was dropped someone in the domestic tried to alter something?

Is Azhar Mahmood at fault?

Or

Amir is not interested anymore?

To see demise of such an extraordinary bowler is really sad.
 
Lack of workload management, look at the amount of overs he has bowled from 2016 to now. His lack of fitness and strength to blame as well.
 
The commentators were praising him for lowering his pace as the pitch wasnt receptive to pace.
 
There has definitely been a drop in pace. to the tune of 5 km/hr or more on average. The teenager in Australia was bowling at 145 comfortably in 2009/10
 
Mohammad Amir should be traveling with the WC squad strictly on a tourist visa.

I couldn't believe when I first noticed on telly his considerable drop in pace vs SA. He was never much tall to begin with, now him being robbed off of his pace & grunting after every delivery makes me wanna cry.

His whippy action, rapid pace, vicious in-swing made him a lethal bowler. I think too much t20 cricket, poor diet & wrong management could be the reason.

The only other player I remember who lost his pace such alarmingly was Peter siddle, who went from a 140+ strike bowler to 130+ trundler within a couple of years.
 
Grunge101 said:
There has definitely been a drop in pace. to the tune of 5 km/hr or more on average. The teenager in Australia was bowling at 145 comfortably in 2009/10
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Yes no idea what is the reason but I personally feel very sad to see demise of such a good bowler
 
I cannot believe how someone so good can become so mediocre. Still walks into the side ahead of toddlers Shaheen and Hasnain.
 
Its safe to say Amir is now turning out to be another Mohd Sami, started his career with a bang but then regressed beyond redemption.
 
There is something wrong with his bowling as a whole. Other than the pace, hes not getting the ball to come back into the right handers, something he seemed to do at will in the first half of his career. There will be the odd occasion like CT against India when he somehow gets it going..but otherwise hes just being a mediocre left arm medium pacer who's reasonably accurate but poses no threat at all.
 
If you analyze his bowling pre ban and post ban there are some key differences

1. He ran up to the wicket faster when he bowled well before and after ban.

2. His shoulder was almost touching his neck meaning his arm came
Down straight much more consistently before ban compared to now when he falls away. This according to fast bowling coaches is one of the Keys of generating pace

3. He bowled to take wickets before ban. He is bowling to save runs after ban

4. His wrist used to snap to generate pace and swing. He doesn’t do it anymore. I believe this is where coaching has failed him. It’s a coaching and mental thing. You don’t lose a skill like that

5. When this wrist is at the very top of his delivery stride before coming down, before the ban you could see the ball’s edge towards the umpire thus indicating the correct wrist position . Now the edge of the ball is away from the umpire, he will get no swing as his wrist position is incorrect
 
I think plenty of it was that it was a warm up match on a flat wicket.
As shown in the CT2017 final, Amir in big games and situations will bring out his best.
 
He has lost pace and swing but from the opening spell that we saw in warm up game I think he was trying to get that pace and swing. And you could see hint of swing on that flat pitch.
 
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