Has the ICC skewed both semi-final pitches to favour India and Pakistan?

[SM1989]

It is no secret that an India Pakistan final is a cash cow for the ICC.

In today's semi final, the pitch seemed to favour Pakistan's style of play and NZ struggled.

Adelaide will be a used pitch which will end up favouring India and will be difficult for England especially given their wobbly batting against Sri Lanka.

Is this deliberate? If so is it really fair?

 

[hitthestump]

I'd be lying if i said this didn't cross my mind.

The pitch resembled UAE more than it did Australia. That's very strange for a semi-final they had several days to prepare especially for.

 

[Major]

Both teams played on same pitch.

Pitch needs sun to be baked. These are used pitches, they don't have grass on it either to make it bounce more.

 

[Sherazkhalid]

It is no secret that an India Pakistan final is a cash cow for the ICC.

In today's semi final, the pitch seemed to favour Pakistan's style of play and NZ struggled.

Adelaide will be a used pitch which will end up favouring India and will be difficult for England especially given their wobbly batting against Sri Lanka.

Is this deliberate? If so is it really fair?

Well England is part of Big 3, I wonder if they know what's going on?

 

[world cup captain]

Can the pitch be manipulated so much with in the space of 2-3 days? Pakistan was all but out until Sunday so unless the SA-Ned match was fixed, it's nearly impossible to think that ICC is favor sides.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

Do they want 100k at MCG?. Sounds farfetched but not implausible

 

[jnaveen1980]

They have completely shaved off the grass as well. Their best threat against spin Philips, Conway. That Conway guy can play variety fo sweeps. That run out was a very important scalp from that perspective.

 

[Suleiman]

India/Pak the corporate champions Vs England/NZ the people’s champions?

 

[jnaveen1980]

Can the pitch be manipulated so much with in the space of 2-3 days? Pakistan was all but out until Sunday so unless the SA-Ned match was fixed, it's nearly impossible to think that ICC is favor sides.

yes lol Clean shave. No grass. That is what they did

 

[The Googly]

Too much myths and conspiracy theories I think

 

[jnaveen1980]

NZ still plays all over the world. I am not sure how many plays in franchise cricket. From NZ Kane and Ferguson play in the IPL. Kane was never an enforcer against spin. They probably needed Bracewell in place of Sodhi. You need a bit of bite from the surface. This one was very slow. Even Shadab was ineffective. You can sit back on the backfoot play wherever you want. Bottomline is NZ is not a skillful bowling unit to adapt to different conditions.

 

[Saj]

Win win for ICC if it's an India v Pakistan final.

Nothing would please the ICC more than that final.

 

[charlie007]

I really don’t think ICC can do that. SCG is a historically spin friendly surface, Adelaide does a little but not much. Credit where it’s due, Pakistan played outstanding cricket and won deservingly. Let’s not try taking the sheen off with speculations.

 

[Aman]

Nah, don't think it was deliberate. It's WC so you should be able to adapt and a few other teams played on used pitches in the super 12 stage.

I do hope there is a fresh pitch for the Final so more shots can be played. Thought the pitch wasn't the best for stroke players, Pakistan did decent but we were absolutely rubbish with the ball and had lost the match in the first 4-5 overs.

If England are getting a used pitch in Adelaide, gg lol. A used pitch would favor India and bring India into the game. Their batsmen are like ours and prefer the ball coming onto the bat and clearing the fence.

 

[rhony]

Nothing is skewed. Infact it's a very well thought out process. The super 12 pitches were favoring the western teams with bounce and pace. The semi final venues give equal chance to subcontinent teams. Adelaide and Sydney are the two most friendly surfaces for the subcontinent teams. The final will again be played on a decent pacy surface. This has been the best world cup so far with equal opportunity for all teams and batting/bowling. Toss hasn't played a big part either.

 

[Joseph Gomes]

If England can't beat India at Adelaide, they dont deserve to be champion. Full stop. You can expect to be champion yet whine about pitch. Aslo Adelaide isn't a new venue, everybody knows how it plays.

 

[Aman]

NZ still plays all over the world. I am not sure how many plays in franchise cricket. From NZ Kane and Ferguson play in the IPL. Kane was never an enforcer against spin. They probably needed Bracewell in place of Sodhi. You need a bit of bite from the surface. This one was very slow. Even Shadab was ineffective. You can sit back on the backfoot play wherever you want. Bottomline is NZ is not a skillful bowling unit to adapt to different conditions.

Can't complain about it, probably would have been mad had we not gotten a favorable pitch for the WTC which helped us to win our first world championship.

Sometimes it works for you, other times it doesn't.

 

[rhony]

NZ still plays all over the world. I am not sure how many plays in franchise cricket. From NZ Kane and Ferguson play in the IPL. Kane was never an enforcer against spin. They probably needed Bracewell in place of Sodhi. You need a bit of bite from the surface. This one was very slow. Even Shadab was ineffective. You can sit back on the backfoot play wherever you want. Bottomline is NZ is not a skillful bowling unit to adapt to different conditions.

I think that's not a fair assessment. What you are underrating is Pak's bowling which was the super star in yesterday's game. And it's astonishing that Pak bowling came up trumps with their best bowler Shadab having a bad a day. The fielding matched the bowling intensity and that's what turned the game. While NZ was batting, it seemed that the pitch had demons. There were none. It was a bit slower with lower bounce but definitely not sluggish.

 

[Minnowbasher]

Then CT17 was also rigged. Remember the Cardiff pitch vs England? Was more like Sharjah than Sofia Gardens

 

[Aman]

I think that's not a fair assessment. What you are underrating is Pak's bowling which was the super star in yesterday's game. And it's astonishing that Pak bowling came up trumps with their best bowler Shadab having a bad a day. The fielding matched the bowling intensity and that's what turned the game. While NZ was batting, it seemed that the pitch had demons. There were none. It was a bit slower with lower bounce but definitely not sluggish.

The ball did not come onto the bat, the fact 3 sixes were hit in the entire match tells you that. Phillips was out to a delivery which stopped on him. Pakistan batted well but were largely helped by our bowlers bowling all over the place.

The match was won/lost by the bowling and fielding of both teams.

 

[Rana]

It is possible but NZ bowled so bad


So, So bad


So, so, so bad

 

[GLORY OF '92]

Then CT17 was also rigged. Remember the Cardiff pitch vs England? Was more like Sharjah than Sofia Gardens

Lol.

Like Waqar said long tournaments inevitably you'll get used pitches in the SF and final.

No conspiracy just reality.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Can't complain about it, probably would have been mad had we not gotten a favorable pitch for the WTC which helped us to win our first world championship.

Not a single yorker was executed with precision. Not a single slower ball was executed with precision. Also bowling speeds of these two very slow. On a slow pitch like this, this was even slower. They need to let go of these two test specialists. Cummins is something similar to that. Doesn't have skills to be successful in T20. Look at Sam Curran and his change ups. Accurate bouncer, slower ones, swinging yorker. HE is not exactly express. He has added so much variations to his bowling

 

[Aman]

It is possible but NZ bowled so bad


So, So bad


So, so, so bad

Yeah, everyone goes on about our batting but a lot of that had to do with Pakistan bowling really well and being great in the field. You probably saved 10-15 runs there and then the run out of Conway which cost us more runs.

152 was a defendable score, but we just bowled absolute filth in the first 4-5 overs and then we dropped the chances we had. We did not deserve to win.

 

[Aman]

Not a single yorker was executed with precision. Not a single slower ball was executed with precision. Also bowling speeds of these two very slow. On a slow pitch like this, this was even slower. They need to let go of these two test specialists. Cummins is something similar to that. Doesn't have skills to be successful in T20. Look at Sam Curran and his change ups. Accurate bouncer, slower ones, swinging yorker. HE is not exactly express. He has added so much variations to his bowling

We were straight up bad with the ball lol. Think everyone knows it. We weren't able to put on any pressure or get anything done right in the field.

 

[jnaveen1980]

I think that's not a fair assessment. What you are underrating is Pak's bowling which was the super star in yesterday's game. And it's astonishing that Pak bowling came up trumps with their best bowler Shadab having a bad a day. The fielding matched the bowling intensity and that's what turned the game. While NZ was batting, it seemed that the pitch had demons. There were none. It was a bit slower with lower bounce but definitely not sluggish.

It was sluggish. Ball came at a much slower pace. Especially Ferguson's 150k deliveries. They were like buffet balls after pitching. Pitch never had demons. Only one wicket fell from both innings due to actual skill. Shaheen shah taking out Finn Allen. Even there he was trying to be aggressive. Pretty good delivery. But other than that no batsman was in any trouble. That is why 152/4 is a bizzarre score. You got 6 wickets in tank. You make only 152?

 

[Suleiman]

The ball did not come onto the bat, the fact 3 sixes were hit in the entire match tells you that. Phillips was out to a delivery which stopped on him. Pakistan batted well but were largely helped by our bowlers bowling all over the place.

The match was won/lost by the bowling and fielding of both teams.

Actually NZ missed out on a couple of freebie deliveries. They buckled under the pressure. If they smashed those full tosses and leg stump half volleys we may be looking at 15-20 more runs to chase.

Shaheen, Waseem, Naseem all got away with a few deliveries

 

[Aman]

Actually NZ missed out on a couple of freebie deliveries. They buckled under the pressure. If they smashed those full tosses and leg stump half volleys we may be looking at 15-20 more runs to chase.

Shaheen, Waseem, Naseem all got away with a few deliveries

Yeah, we did miss out on a lot of freebies too. But that was probably due to pressure. Kane was just bad, he could not put the bad balls away.

 

[GLORY OF '92]

It was sluggish. Ball came at a much slower pace. Especially Ferguson's 150k deliveries. They were like buffet balls after pitching. Pitch never had demons. Only one wicket fell from both innings due to actual skill. Shaheen shah taking out Finn Allen. Even there he was trying to be aggressive. Pretty good delivery. But other than that no batsman was in any trouble. That is why 152/4 is a bizzarre score. You got 6 wickets in tank. You make only 152?

NZ were too conservative and Williamson and Neesham are dead wood.

175 and no way we were chasing that.

Also yeah Boult and Southee are finished.

 

[GLORY OF '92]

Yeah, we did miss out on a lot of freebies too. But that was probably due to pressure. Kane was just bad, he could not put the bad balls away.

That's the concern if we get play England or India won't miss those.

Chasing 180 for us at the MCG would be a big task.

 

[Aman]

NZ were too conservative and Williamson and Neesham are dead wood.

175 and no way we were chasing that.

Also yeah Boult and Southee are finished.

Tbh I don't want to make of it. Whether they misread the conditions and thought 150 was a good score or it was just our bowling make a under par score look well under par. So much went wrong lol.

We were bad with the ball, but it went down to the last over because Pakistan took it deep. Maybe if we weren't so bad early on with the ball and took our catches, who knows 150 could have been a good score.

 

[GLORY OF '92]

Tbh I don't want to make of it. Whether they misread the conditions and thought 150 was a good score or it was just our bowling make a under par score look well under par. So much went wrong lol.

We were bad with the ball, but it went down to the last over because Pakistan took it deep. Maybe if we weren't so bad early on with the ball and took our catches, who knows 150 could have been a good score.

I don't think 150 was par. It was 170 minimum. They got the par score wrong like last year v Aus in the final and in the 2019 final. Bad habit.

 

[Kroll]

Then CT17 was also rigged. Remember the Cardiff pitch vs England? Was more like Sharjah than Sofia Gardens

Still doesn't excuse not beating a mediocre Pakistan ODI side, Azhar Ali as opener? lol.

 

[jnaveen1980]

NZ were too conservative and Williamson and Neesham are dead wood.

175 and no way we were chasing that.

Also yeah Boult and Southee are finished.

Their lack of depth may be one reason. But still switching gears shouldn't have taken that long. With Kane the gear was always 2nd gear. Mitchell was waging a lone battle. Kane was still focusing on quick 2s right till the end. There will always be questions about how they paced the innings. They needed Philips to have stayed there or even Conway both of who is better at picking up the pace at the right time. Pakistan nailed 3 of their best players who could have produecd an impact innings. Conway , Finn Allen, Philips.

 

[rhony]

It was sluggish. Ball came at a much slower pace. Especially Ferguson's 150k deliveries. They were like buffet balls after pitching. Pitch never had demons. Only one wicket fell from both innings due to actual skill. Shaheen shah taking out Finn Allen. Even there he was trying to be aggressive. Pretty good delivery. But other than that no batsman was in any trouble. That is why 152/4 is a bizzarre score. You got 6 wickets in tank. You make only 152?

It felt sluggish because of the lengths the Pak bowlers were bowling. Pak went with Yorker, back of a length or slower ball option. NZ went full. They tried to adjust later but the lack of pace was a fodder for Rizwan's cross batted strokes. The amount of yorkers bowled by Pak mixed with Slower ones never let NZ run off with the game. Just look at the way they kept Neesham quiet at the end with those slower bouncers and yorkers. Was fascinating to watch.

 

[GLORY OF '92]

Still doesn't excuse not beating a mediocre Pakistan ODI side, Azhar Ali as opener? lol.

In those conditions Azhar was a solid opener.

 

[jnaveen1980]

It felt sluggish because of the lengths the Pak bowlers were bowling. Pak went with Yorker, back of a length or slower ball option. NZ went full. They tried to adjust later but the lack of pace was a fodder for Rizwan's cross batted strokes. The amount of yorkers bowled by Pak mixed with Slower ones never let NZ run off with the game. Just look at the way they kept Neesham quiet at the end with those slower bouncers and yorkers. Was fascinating to watch.

yes already told there is skill level difference. Mitchell still made a match out of it. He was able to negotiate anything thrown. He came down the wicket mostly to neutralize slowness.Kane was just stuck on the crease.

 

[Aman]

yes already told there is skill level difference. Mitchell still made a match out of it. He was able to negotiate anything thrown. He came down the wicket mostly to neutralize slowness.Kane was just stuck on the crease.

We didn't bat deep so it explains Kane anchoring, still feel Bracewell would have been good to have in the team. Decent bowling option and is good for quick runs.

 

[SM1989]

Then CT17 was also rigged. Remember the Cardiff pitch vs England? Was more like Sharjah than Sofia Gardens

Possibly. ICC wanted an India Pak final back then as well perhaps.

 

[Mamoon]

There is no doubt. We saw this in the 2017 CT as well. Today it was ICC vs NZ, tomorrow it will be ICC vs England.

Jos Buttler was asked if he wants to see a Pakistan vs India final. How disrespectful is that?

 

[Kroll]

It's a load of baloney, NZ can beat Pakistan on any pitch, just that Pakistan were the better team today regardless of conditions.

 

[MP2011]

NZ were too conservative and Williamson and Neesham are dead wood.

175 and no way we were chasing that.

Also yeah Boult and Southee are finished.

Williamson was never a T20 player. That he is still playing this format (as captain too) means Kiwis will perhaps not win any world tournament with him at helm.

As for Neesham, only if he was as prolific on a cricket ground as he is on Twitter!

Boult is very hittable especially in T20s where conditions don't aid him. Southee is still very economical more often than not.

 

[MP2011]

Dropping Babar first ball he faced was really a dampener from NZ's perspective. Even though Babar hadn't done anything in this tournament till yesterday, imagine Babar going in first over and the pressure it puts on rest of the batting lineup.

 

[Suleiman]

Still doesn't excuse not beating a mediocre Pakistan ODI side, Azhar Ali as opener? lol.

Tbf Azhar gave the performance of his life in that game despite being a mediocre ODI opener that match aside.

 

[Corridor of Uncertainty]

I'd be lying if i said this didn't cross my mind.

The pitch resembled UAE more than it did Australia. That's very strange for a semi-final they had several days to prepare especially for.

NZ scored 150+ in this game. Could have scored much more.

Many matches haven't gone beyond 130 in the tournament including some of Pakistan's games.

Also Pakistan beat NZ at home on their pitches too.

This in my opinion is a myth.

Most assertions in this tournament complete myths. Some 50:50 umpiring decisions for example.

This is a tournament for conspiracy theory after conspiracy theory - relentless, unending but worst of all, without evidence. A juggernaut that the sub continent thrives on.

 

[IamIndian]

Convey's run out and dropped catch of Babar were the turning points., Convey just choked on both occasions, typical South african!

 

[Kianig89]

The capricious nature of some armchair critics is such that had they batted 1st, they would trumpet that Pakistan got the easy route of batting 1st so they won it now we've chased it the skewing of pitch comes in,

 

[Energy]

Good thread once again. Very articulate, and insightful.

If it's a bouncy track and our players don't adjust well, then it's our fault, lack of practice and therefore well deserved humiliation. If a different track and our players adjust better than the opposition, then it's ICC and Pluto aligning into the planetarium.

That too easily showing disregard that Pakistan completely outplayed the opposition in all departments. It was a one sided victory, clinical. It was kind of a soft slap on the face of the opponents for not turning up, but it seems the slap is actually registered on different body parts of other individuals.

Insecurity is a disease.

 

[basitmian]

Actually its the story of every WC, pitches start out to be fast and quick in the beginning but when they get used alot they tend to be dry and slower. Fast bowlers have better say in the beginning but spinners have a more say towards the end of the WC.

 

[SamNJ]

Can't help but think that. Why SFs were not scheduled in Brisbane, Perth or Hobart. They wanted to give India a chance to reach semis against Aus, NZ or England.
And now used pitches. Seriously ?
If England win today it will be their win against ICC not just Indian team.

 

[Sarwar89]

Can't help but think that. Why SFs were not scheduled in Brisbane, Perth or Hobart. They wanted to give India a chance to reach semis against Aus, NZ or England.
And now used pitches. Seriously ?
If England win today it will be their win against ICC not just Indian team.

Should not be a problem for England
They beat Pakistan in 4-3 in t20 series in Pakistan.

They play in ipl as well and psl, they are familiar with these surfaces.

 

[SamNJ]

Should not be a problem for England
They beat Pakistan in 4-3 in t20 series in Pakistan.

They play in ipl as well and psl, they are familiar with these surfaces.

Absolutely but India's best chances are still on Adelaide or Sydney tracks. You agree ?

 

[hitthestump]

There is no doubt. We saw this in the 2017 CT as well. Today it was ICC vs NZ, tomorrow it will be ICC vs England.

Jos Buttler was asked if he wants to see a Pakistan vs India final. How disrespectful is that?

Perhaps it's time for MENSA to have a review of their assessment processes.

 

[Corridor of Uncertainty]

Chalo another conspiracy theory laid to rest.

PP and its capacity to invent stuff.

 

[Visaal-E-Yaar]

There is no doubt. We saw this in the 2017 CT as well. Today it was ICC vs NZ, tomorrow it will be ICC vs England.

Jos Buttler was asked if he wants to see a Pakistan vs India final. How disrespectful is that?

My my my my