"Have full faith in my abilities and hard work and hope my suffering ends soon" : Salman Butt

[hadi123]

"Have full faith in my abilities and hard work and hope my suffering ends soon" : Salman Butt

Lahore: Salman Butt clearly remembers the way he was dismissed against Sri Lanka in Lahore in 2009 — the last batsman out in the last Test in Pakistan, before a terror attack on the visiting team's bus scared off touring sides.

Butt, now 32, was run out in the last over of the day for 48. The next morning, on 3 March, militants ambushed the Sri Lankan bus, killing eight people and wounding seven Sri Lankan players and staff.

Eight years on, and with a conviction for spot-fixing behind him, Butt is hoping for a new era for Pakistani cricket, starting with next week's visit of a World XI to play at Lahore's Gaddafi Stadium.

"I remember that Test vividly because on day two we were replying to a 600-plus Sri Lankan total and I had a good opening partnership of 110 with Khurram Manzoor but in the last over of the day I was run out for 48 in a disappointing manner," Butt told AFP.

"The next day we had to continue our innings so in the morning we set off from the hotel for play but after a few minutes the bus changed its route and we returned to the hotel. Later we were told about the incident, that was really shocking.

"Those events changed the whole scene of Pakistan cricket and the isolation has impacted a great deal with both players and fans deprived of international cricket, but I hope the efforts of the PCB and improved security will end this isolation."

Pakistan have not hosted international cricket — barring a short limited-overs series against Zimbabwe in 2015 — since that day.

But hopes are rising that Pakistan's isolation is nearing its end as security continues to improve in the strife-hit nation.

"Those were heartbreaking circumstances," Butt told AFP.

"It's a wonderful feeling when you play before your home crowd and Pakistan's crowds stand out in top three in the world, so finally it's coming back and everyone is happy."

Former Zimbabwe batsman and ex-England coach Andy Flower has assembled a World XI with players from seven countries led by South African skipper Faf du Plessis, with all three matches set to take place in Lahore.

The Pakistan Cricket Board (PCB) hopes the series will go off without a hitch as the country prepares to host Sri Lanka for one Twenty20 international next month and another three T20s against the West Indies in November.

Butt says the fans have been the real losers, deprived of watching top-tier cricket on their home soil.

"The fans of this generation could not see their stars before their eyes and it impeded their progress," said Butt, who led Pakistan at a neutral-venue series against Australia in 2010.

Following the attack, Pakistan was forced to play its home matches in United Arab Emirates, leaving a generation of players like Asad Shafiq, Ahmed Shehzad, Umar Akmal and Azhar Ali without the experience of competing in a home Test match.

That also prevented Pakistan's most successful captain, Misbah-ul-Haq from captaining in a Test on home soil.

With cricket set for a return to Pakistan, Butt is also hoping to mount his own comeback, with selectors considering him for future Tests.

In 2010 Butt's career was almost destroyed when he was hit with a five-year ban and prison sentence, along with pace bowlers Mohammad Asif and Mohammad Amir, for deliberately bowling no-balls as a part of a spot-fixing sting in the Lord's Test against England.

"I have overcome that bad phase and now doing my best in domestic matches to regain my place in the Pakistan team," said Butt.

"I have full faith in my abilities and hard work and hope my sufferings also end sooner than later."

http://www.firstpost.com/firstcrick...-world-xi-tour-hopes-salman-butt-4018593.html

 

[pakistanigoneaussie]

The media lobbying for this guy continues

Forget about the fact he has never shown remorse, people act as if he is Lara reborn

 

[Sherlock]

He's right in the "new era" part. Hopefully that means we won't see him in a Pakistani cap ever again.

 

[Slog]

He's right in the "new era" part. Hopefully that means we won't see him in a Pakistani cap ever again.

he wants to lead this new era

 

[Markhor]

This snake should be given Salim Malik treatment.

I guess when you have political connections in Pakistan like Butt and know the right people then no crime is too great.

 

[joly]

Shameless media that allows this proven "gaddar" and glorifies him

 

[cricfan967]

The irony with this guy making these statements...

 

[Deewana Mastana]

This snake should be given Salim Malik treatment.

I guess when you have political connections in Pakistan like Butt and know the right people then no crime is too great.

In Pakistan, NO crime is too great at all doesn't even matter as to who does it.

 

[Crescent]

Salman deserves to suffer

 

[ads101]

So it's sufferings that he gets to only play domestic cricket. Poor guy, I wonder how the vast majority of cricketers who also only play domestic cricket feel.

 

[Plumb]

To Mr Butt, First realize the suffering you caused the whole nation with your shameful act then talk about what you are suffering. Its unbelievable that the country's media is supporting such people. These kind of people should be given 0 minutes coverage.

 

[waleed88]

To Mr Butt, First realize the suffering you caused the whole nation with your shameful act then talk about what you are suffering. Its unbelievable that the country's media is supporting such people. These kind of people should be given 0 minutes coverage.

Did he bowl those no-balls?

 

[waleed88]

This snake should be given Salim Malik treatment.

I guess when you have political connections in Pakistan like Butt and know the right people then no crime is too great.

Ofcourse! But that's also true for Mohammad Amir, the way PCB made it obvious they went out of the way with the ICC to try to reduce his ban.. these Butts/Gujjars/Akmals, all in the same boat

 

[sshakir411]

Ofcourse! But that's also true for Mohammad Amir, the way PCB made it obvious they went out of the way with the ICC to try to reduce his ban.. these Butts/Gujjars/Akmals, all in the same boat

You're right but Amir accepted guilt before a trial and then showed remorse. Butt only accepted spot fixing after he exhausted all other avenues and it was clear he will not get his ban overturned. Also, his acceptance/apology was far from an apology but rather a statement that he will work to prevent this from happening.

 

[Plumb]

Did he bowl those no-balls?

No he didn't but I would say you just cracked the joke of the century in one liner. He was "The One" who caused the shameful act and should be no where near the Pakistan Team Period. But I wouldn't be surprised if he makes it to the team since we all know how things work in Pakistan.

 

[waleed88]

No he didn't but I would say you just cracked the joke of the century in one liner. He was "The One" who caused the shameful act and should be no where near the Pakistan Team Period. But I wouldn't be surprised if he makes it to the team since we all know how things work in Pakistan.

Yes but did he put a gun to their head and make them do it? Bowlers could've just said no, just like they say no to whenever they don't want to change their field, or want a field when captain doesn't want it, or like they can say no for whatever other reason Salman Butt asks them to do like 'if he doesn't like the color of Amir and Asif's PJ'.. they could've said 'dude bugger off and get a life'

 

[waleed88]

Its like saying 'oh I'm a criminal because he asked me to do it,' or I'm a murderer because my captain asked me to kill someone' what B.S

 

[waleed88]

You're right but Amir accepted guilt before a trial and then showed remorse. Butt only accepted spot fixing after he exhausted all other avenues and it was clear he will not get his ban overturned. Also, his acceptance/apology was far from an apology but rather a statement that he will work to prevent this from happening.

Yes but was he the one who overstepped...?? No he didn't... ask the criminals why they overstepped the line?

 

[sshakir411]

Yes but was he the one who overstepped...?? No he didn't... ask the criminals why they overstepped the line?

Both the criminals who overstepped testified in court to doing so on request of their captain. Even the bookie Mazhar Majeed testified that instructions for the no-ball were given to the captain and not the players. Furthermore, there was clear evidence of Salman agreeing to the deal through sms messages with Mazhar..Also, majority of the marked notes used by the News of the World were found with Salman.

 

[Plumb]

We can go on and on about it but the fact is none of those three should have been allowed. In case of amir He did commit the crime but the fact which makes matter worse is Mr butt never admitted and was shamefully denied all the allegations whereas amir he did accept early and went through a series of rehabilitation and understands what he did was wrong. I think you need to understand the criteria where Amir was, early in his career, young kid and seeing all this for the first time. You need to be in person's shoes to make assumptions like that. No one knows what was told to Amir so that he did this, An experienced top player and team of captain and Amir ll say "dude I am not doing it" as I said you need to be 17 and asks yourself, easier said sitting on the sidelines then in the same situation. Asif had a criminal record so I am not gonna even bring him in the conversation.

 

[Gabbar Singh]

Really feel for him and his 'sufferings'.

 

[RickyG]

Did he bowl those no-balls?

You're right. He's not culpable or guilty of anything. He's the victim here. He should be brought back and made captain.

#Fanboylogic

 

[Suleiman]

Suffering? This guy is living the high life as a convicted fixer playing domestic cricket and having access to state of the arts cricketing training equipment and coaching. Most countries would have him banned for life.

 

[waleed88]

You're right. He's not culpable or guilty of anything. He's the victim here. He should be brought back and made captain.

#Fanboylogic

None of the interviews of anyone suggested that it was only Butt, all 3 were equally involved in this, all 3 served equal sentences, all 3 were all alert and oriented when they performed those actions, all 3 deserve an equal chance to come back based on performances in domestics

 

[waleed88]

Both the criminals who overstepped testified in court to doing so on request of their captain. Even the bookie Mazhar Majeed testified that instructions for the no-ball were given to the captain and not the players. Furthermore, there was clear evidence of Salman agreeing to the deal through sms messages with Mazhar..Also, majority of the marked notes used by the News of the World were found with Salman.

Yes but would the deeds have happened if Amir and Asif used a simple 'NO!'?

Again, the fault lies most with the performer of the actions... and that fault lies with Asif and Amir to perform those actions, I.E murder also implies the same principles... the guy who plans it is equally involved, but the one who committed murder is the main guilty party

 

[Abdullah719]

None of the interviews of anyone suggested that it was only Butt, all 3 were equally involved in this, all 3 served equal sentences, all 3 were all alert and oriented when they performed those actions, all 3 deserve an equal chance to come back based on performances in domestics

Former Pakistan cricket captain Salman Butt has been jailed for 30 months for his part in the conspiracy to bowl deliberate no-balls in last year's Test match against England.

Former world number two Test bowler Mohammad Asif, 28, was jailed for one year and bowler Mohammad Amir, 19, has been sentenced to six months.

The three players have all been ordered to pay compensation towards prosecution costs. Butt, 27, was ordered to pay £30,937, Amir £9,389 and Asif £8,120.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-15573463

 

[RickyG]

None of the interviews of anyone suggested that it was only Butt, all 3 were equally involved in this, all 3 served equal sentences, all 3 were all alert and oriented when they performed those actions, all 3 deserve an equal chance to come back based on performances in domestics

Not really, that's a load of dross. I'm not sure where you get this idea that all three bear the same level of guilt. Yes all three are guilty but they have different circumstances. There's a reason Butt and Asif had harsher sentences. Asif for his past indiscretions and Butt for being the orchestrator as well as captain. The aggravating and mitigating factors don't only apply to their sentences but also to the opportunities they receive in the future.

That's like suggesting a sex offender should be allowed to become a school teacher after completing their sentence just because someone else with a criminal record is allowed to do so.

In any case, my initial response was to your statement about Salman Butt not bowling the no-balls and therefore implying he is innocent.

 

[Eagle_Eye]

Why is butt even being given air time?

Irrelevant individual.

 

[ahmadharis1]

I'd rather have Imran Farhat back on the team

 

[ads101]

You're right but Amir accepted guilt before a trial and then showed remorse. Butt only accepted spot fixing after he exhausted all other avenues and it was clear he will not get his ban overturned. Also, his acceptance/apology was far from an apology but rather a statement that he will work to prevent this from happening.

I disagree with Amir showing remorse. Amir acted in the way that was most beneficial to his case. His best way to get back into the team was to admit his guilt and work with the ICC. This wasn't the case with the other two, who were less assured that they would be drafted back into the team even if they performed in domestic. I'm sure Butt would have acted the same way as Amir if his situation was the same.

None showed remorse as all three initially denied the fixing charges, even hinting towards the conspiracy claims. All three were ready to get off via technicality, it was only when they were convicted (and would get extended sentences/not be drafted back into international cricket otherwise) did they apologise/work with the ICC.

If anything Amir's arguably been the worse. In his interview to the English newspapers, he said that he fixed without knowing (that he was persuaded to fix so that he wouldn't be implicated in fixing), gave his bank details to Butt because he was bored. It doesn't really sound believable or make much sense, more that he's making a sympathy play and shifting the blame onto others in order to make it easier for him to return. At least the other two claimed responsibility.

I do think Butt should be punished more, he was captain, organised the fixing, and recruited others. A more serious crime. I don't however really think Asif did anything worse than Amir, same charge. And yes while drug related offences aren't great, I think they're separate I don't feel that makes him a serial offender as he was caught the same no. of times, once for corruption. Having said that, I'm glad Asif isn't in the team, didn't really want Amir either. Having them play domestic cricket only for the rest of their life was a just punishment IMO.

 

[Junaids]

Do people on this forum not understand Double Jeopardy?

The three Fixers have served their cricket and criminal sentences, and the ICC TWO YEARS AGO declared all three to be fully rehabilitated.

To repunish them for their crimes is not just wrong, it's unlawful according to the ICC.

You can continue to exclude Asif (who was the least guilty of the Three according to the ICC findings) and Butt on the grounds of age or form or fitness.

But if you defy the ICC by extending their exclusion on the basis of what they did, the ICC would not hesitate to suspend Pakistan from world cricket. The ICC communique of 19 August 2015 made that crystal clear, when they cleared Asif and Butt to play when the PCB was publically talking of continuing their bans.

 

[Junaids]

The ICC clearance for Asif and Butt, confirming that they have satisfied all conditions and are free to resume international cricket.......


http://www.sportsintegrityinitiativ...sif-and-butt-will-expire-on-1-september-2015/

 

[Abdullah719]

The ICC clearance for Asif and Butt, confirming that they have satisfied all conditions and are free to resume international cricket.......


http://www.sportsintegrityinitiativ...sif-and-butt-will-expire-on-1-september-2015/

Yes but there is no obligation for the PCB Selection Committee to select anyone. Asif and Butt aren't being blocked from playing domestic cricket, they just haven't been selected for the national team.... so far.

 

[coy0607]

I'm surprised to hear him talk about his 'abilities' considering:

1. his test average of 30.4
2. his last 8 domestic innings read: 20, 4, 0, 0, 33, 2, 7, 3

can someone explain to me what ability Mr. Butt speaks of?

lets not even talk about his fielding 'abilities' for now

 

[Junaids]

Yes but there is no obligation for the PCB Selection Committee to select anyone. Asif and Butt aren't being blocked from playing domestic cricket, they just haven't been selected for the national team.... so far.

I covered that two posts ago.

They can be not selected on the basis of form, fitness or age.

But if they are not selected due to their role in the fix, that is cricket's equivalent of Contempt of Court, and the only place that ends is in Pakistan itself being suspended from cricket.

 

[Abdul]

Hope he suffers for the rest of his life.

 

[Abdullah719]

I covered that two posts ago.

They can be not selected on the basis of form, fitness or age.

But if they are not selected due to their role in the fix, that is cricket's equivalent of Contempt of Court, and the only place that ends is in Pakistan itself being suspended from cricket.

For that to happen, PCB would have to be stupid enough to claim that they have banned them.

All they need to do is just not select them (if that's what they want).

However, Butt's presence at NCA etc. seems to suggest he is in line for selection anyway.

 

[Junaids]

I'm surprised to hear him talk about his 'abilities' considering:

1. his test average of 30.4
2. his last 8 domestic innings read: 20, 4, 0, 0, 33, 2, 7, 3

can someone explain to me what ability Mr. Butt speaks of?

lets not even talk about his fielding 'abilities' for now

That is highly creative to the point of being Fake News.

The article in question is absolutely specific that Salman Butt is only being considered for a Test recall.

So what are his last First Class innings?

QEA Final Second Innings: 105 Not Out (won the Final)
QEA Final First Innings: 125 (after Mohammad Asif's 4-29 dismissed Habib Bank for 236 all out)
QEA Semi Final Second Innings 33
QEA Semi Final First Innings 11

So Salman Butt's last 4 First Class innings - in the biggest two matches playable - saw him score 274 runs at an average of 90.67.

 

[Junaids]

You're right but Amir accepted guilt before a trial and then showed remorse. Butt only accepted spot fixing after he exhausted all other avenues and it was clear he will not get his ban overturned. Also, his acceptance/apology was far from an apology but rather a statement that he will work to prevent this from happening.

You are confusing the Cricket Trial and the Criminal Trial, and your facts are actually wrong.

These are the Facts:

1. All three players maintained their innocence to the ICC Tribunal - including Mohammad Amir.
2. Amir only pleaded Guilty in his criminal trial, but the honesty that involved was a joke anyway, as
a) he continued to claim to have been born on 13 April 1992, to avoid being sent to an adult prison, and
b) he refused to give evidence of his crimes anyway at a Newton Hearing, leading the Judge to question the sincerity of his Guilty plea.

SOURCE: http://www.thelawpages.com/court-cases/Mohammad-Amir-7586-1.law

3. The ICC Tribunal was clear that Mohammad Asif - not Amir - was the only one of the three to initially reject the corrupt approach, and that Asif - not Amir - was the only one to refuse to accept corrupt payments.

 

[mak36]

That is highly creative to the point of being Fake News.

The article in question is absolutely specific that Salman Butt is only being considered for a Test recall.

So what are his last First Class innings?

QEA Final Second Innings: 105 Not Out (won the Final)
QEA Final First Innings: 125 (after Mohammad Asif's 4-29 dismissed Habib Bank for 236 all out)
QEA Semi Final Second Innings 33
QEA Semi Final First Innings 11

So Salman Butt's last 4 First Class innings - in the biggest two matches playable - saw him score 274 runs at an average of 90.67.

But if we use your methodology, if we take out the two centuries what is his average?

 

[Junaids]

Can I just add the Judge's comments, in which he doubted the sincerity of Mohammad Amir's Guilty plea?

1. Mohammad Amir admitted only to the delivery of 2 no-balls at Lords for cash, and denied any fix at The Oval, in spite of SMS messages which suggested that he offended there too.

2. The Judge wrote in his findings: "I REFUSE TO ACCEPT THAT BASIS OF PLEA ON THE MATERIAL I HAVE SEEN. THERE ARE CERTAINLY TEXTS AND THE LIKE WHICH SUGGEST THAT AMIR'S FIRST AND ONLY INVOLVEMENT WAS NOT LIMITED TO LORD'S, IT WAS NOT AN ISOLATED AND ONE OFF EVENT."

SOURCE: http://www.thelawpages.com/court-cases/Mohammad-Amir-7586-1.law

In effect, the astonishing aspect of the Amir, Asif, Butt case is that the only player who has been restored to the national team was, in the opinion of the Judge, the most guilty, and the one who offended for the longest.

And both cricket and the Law let him off with a shorter sentence for being just 18 years old - which is widely considered also to be highly questionable!

 

[coy0607]

That is highly creative to the point of being Fake News.

The article in question is absolutely specific that Salman Butt is only being considered for a Test recall.

So what are his last First Class innings?

QEA Final Second Innings: 105 Not Out (won the Final)
QEA Final First Innings: 125 (after Mohammad Asif's 4-29 dismissed Habib Bank for 236 all out)
QEA Semi Final Second Innings 33
QEA Semi Final First Innings 11

So Salman Butt's last 4 First Class innings - in the biggest two matches playable - saw him score 274 runs at an average of 90.67.

wanna talk about tests?

1. Butt averaged 30.4 after an extended run in Tests during his prime - thats a lower test batting average than Shahid Afridi, Imran Nazir, Imran Farhat

2. In the last Quaid-E-Azam trophy, he was no. 6 on the run getters table with an average of 49- not exactly setting the world on fire

What makes Butt a more suitable candidate for Test selection than

Fawad Alam (who averages a lot more over a much much longer period) or
Usman Salahuddin or Imam-ul-Haq (both of whom scored more runs than Butt in QEA and are significantly younger)

its quite easy to pick select innings to make a batsmen look good. You can do that with most domestic cricketers...

 

[ahmedwaqas92]

Have Zero faith in your abilities and more importantly you,r Shady no good for nothing, immoral, character. I hope you never don the star and crescent again !!

I will be absolutely disgusted if this mastermind criminal is allowed back to represent Pakistan at the highest level.

 

[Junaids]

wanna talk about tests?

1. Butt averaged 30.4 after an extended run in Tests during his prime - thats a lower test batting average than Shahid Afridi, Imran Nazir, Imran Farhat

2. In the last Quaid-E-Azam trophy, he was no. 6 on the run getters table with an average of 49- not exactly setting the world on fire

What makes Butt a more suitable candidate for Test selection than

Fawad Alam (who averages a lot more over a much much longer period) or
Usman Salahuddin or Imam-ul-Haq (both of whom scored more runs than Butt in QEA and are significantly younger)

its quite easy to pick select innings to make a batsmen look good. You can do that with most domestic cricketers...

Two things.

Firstly, as I keep saying, I don't want a batsman as old as Salman Butt (or Fawad Alam) in the team. I don't want players the wrong side of 30: I'll take Azhar Ali (and tell him to retire or be dropped by December 2018) and Sarfraz Ahmed, and that's it for Over-30's.

I won't even pick Yasir Shah after his serial failures at Old Trafford, Edgbaston, Hamilton, Brisbane, Melbourne and Sydney - I'll invest in the promise of Shadab Khan instead.

So I agree - I'd rather have Imam-ul-Haq than Salman Butt too.

Usman Salahuddin I'm yet to be convinced by. He got 3 centuries in 17 innings last season, a ratio of one every 5.67 innings - a passable but moderate 17.6% of his innings were centuries.

Fawad Alam I wouldn't touch with a bargepole. He's almost as old as Salman Butt, but was nowhere near the team for almost all the time that Butt was a regular, because he was never as good. He has a bizarre technique, but he also scored only 1 century in each of the last 2 domestic First Class seasons.

Last season Fawad Alam's century scoring ratio was 1 per 11 innings - a hopeless 9.1% of his innings were centuries last season . The year before it was 1 century in 14 innings, a pathetic 7.1% of his innings were centuries.

Meanwhile Salman Butt scored 4 centuries in 16 First Class innings last season - a grossly superior ratio of 4 innings per century, an excellent 25% of his First Class innings were centuries.

Secondly, as I showed, Salman Butt is the same age as Azhar Ali and much younger than Misbah. And when they played together, he scored an almost identical number of runs - which tells you much more than comparing averages across eras.

 

[Teshi98]

Two things.

Firstly, as I keep saying, I don't want a batsman as old as Salman Butt (or Fawad Alam) in the team. I don't want players the wrong side of 30: I'll take Azhar Ali (and tell him to retire or be dropped by December 2018) and Sarfraz Ahmed, and that's it for Over-30's.

I won't even pick Yasir Shah after his serial failures at Old Trafford, Edgbaston, Hamilton, Brisbane, Melbourne and Sydney - I'll invest in the promise of Shadab Khan instead.

So I agree - I'd rather have Imam-ul-Haq than Salman Butt too.

Usman Salahuddin I'm yet to be convinced by. He got 3 centuries in 17 innings last season, a ratio of one every 5.67 innings - a passable but moderate 17.6% of his innings were centuries.

Fawad Alam I wouldn't touch with a bargepole. He's almost as old as Salman Butt, but was nowhere near the team for almost all the time that Butt was a regular, because he was never as good. He has a bizarre technique, but he also scored only 1 century in each of the last 2 domestic First Class seasons.

Last season Fawad Alam's century scoring ratio was 1 per 11 innings - a hopeless 9.1% of his innings were centuries last season . The year before it was 1 century in 14 innings, a pathetic 7.1% of his innings were centuries.

Meanwhile Salman Butt scored 4 centuries in 16 First Class innings last season - a grossly superior ratio of 4 innings per century, an excellent 25% of his First Class innings were centuries.

Secondly, as I showed, Salman Butt is the same age as Azhar Ali and much younger than Misbah. And when they played together, he scored an almost identical number of runs - which tells you much more than comparing averages across eras.

What is the logic behind dropping someone over a certain age provided he is performing consistently. Tendullar from age of 35 to 38 was infact best batsmen in world and sangakara too peaked at wrong side of 30's. Azhar ali is a pretty solid test batsmen who has a compact technique. Your logic of dropping players after certain age may be justified for ones who rely on reflexes but for someone like azhar ali who is having proper technique i do not see the reason why should he be dropped after next year if he is performing well.

 

[adil_909]

This guy is a joke. If he ever wears a Pakistan shirt again I'll quit supporting the national team. And I suspect I'm not the only one. Pakistani media MUST stop giving him a platform.

 

[Abdullah719]

Usman Salahuddin I'm yet to be convinced by. He got 3 centuries in 17 innings last season, a ratio of one every 5.67 innings - a passable but moderate 17.6% of his innings were centuries.

Usman Salahuddin and Haris Sohail are two of the most regular hundred scores in Pakistani FC cricket. They score a FC hundred every ~7.8 innings on average. That's better than all of the other batsman around the national team, including Azhar, Butt, Sami, Babar, Shafiq, Fawad and yes, also far better better than Umar Akmal.

 

[shane]

I really hope my national team picks me to represent my country so that I stop suffering.

 

[msb314]

He has served his time and deserves to be given another chance if he performs at the domestic level.

 

[msb314]

Have Zero faith in your abilities and more importantly you,r Shady no good for nothing, immoral, character. I hope you never don the star and crescent again !!

I will be absolutely disgusted if this mastermind criminal is allowed back to represent Pakistan at the highest level.

Yes Amir should never play for Pakistan again.

Oh wait....

 

[Junaids]

What is the logic behind dropping someone over a certain age provided he is performing consistently. Tendullar from age of 35 to 38 was infact best batsmen in world and sangakara too peaked at wrong side of 30's. Azhar ali is a pretty solid test batsmen who has a compact technique. Your logic of dropping players after certain age may be justified for ones who rely on reflexes but for someone like azhar ali who is having proper technique i do not see the reason why should he be dropped after next year if he is performing well.

And yet India with Tendulkar lost 4-0 in consecutive 4 match series in England and Australia!

I think you misunderstand the rationale for carefully managing the number of 30+ players in any team.

You don't keep Player A in the team until Player B is better, because that destroys the balance of the team and means your team goes through Transition Phases in which it loses a lot.

The purposes of constant evolution and De Facto age capping are:

1. Minimise the number of new players ever inducted at any one time.

2. Minimise the number of deteriorating older players ever needing to be replaced at any one time.

3. Ensure that infighting and captaincy intrigue is minimised because the number of senior players is tiny.

4. Ensure that the coach and captain control the dressing room and the culture by minimising the number of senior players.

5. Ensure that players are inducted young and given time to develop.

My Pakistan team in England next May would probably be:

1. Sami Aslam
2. Azhar Ali
3. Babar Azam
4. Asad Shafiq
5. Haris Sohail (if fit)
6. Sarfraz Ahmed (c/wk)
7. Aamer Yamin
8. Shadab Khan
9. Mohammad Amir
10. Hasan Ali
11. Mohammad Abbas

 

[Teshi98]

And yet India with Tendulkar lost 4-0 in consecutive 4 match series in England and Australia!

I think you misunderstand the rationale for carefully managing the number of 30+ players in any team.

You don't keep Player A in the team until Player B is better, because that destroys the balance of the team and means your team goes through Transition Phases in which it loses a lot.

The purposes of constant evolution and De Facto age capping are:

1. Minimise the number of new players ever inducted at any one time.

2. Minimise the number of deteriorating older players ever needing to be replaced at any one time.

3. Ensure that infighting and captaincy intrigue is minimised because the number of senior players is tiny.

4. Ensure that the coach and captain control the dressing room and the culture by minimising the number of senior players.

5. Ensure that players are inducted young and given time to develop.

My Pakistan team in England next May would probably be:

1. Sami Aslam
2. Azhar Ali
3. Babar Azam
4. Asad Shafiq
5. Haris Sohail (if fit)
6. Sarfraz Ahmed (c/wk)
7. Aamer Yamin
8. Shadab Khan
9. Mohammad Amir
10. Hasan Ali
11. Mohammad Abbas

Tendulkar in eng and aus series was older than 38 years and not in the age bracket i mentioned. The points you mentioned deserve a good discussion but i feel that you can not exactly follow the above steps easily. The fab four in indian batting order remained in team for huge period of time and new talents kept coming in team occasionally. However it did not take much time for indian batting line up to restablish its superority despite players on wrong side of 30 playing together for long.
Also the environment of team may be pleasant even with the seniors if they do not have ego. Youngsters doing great in domestics deserve a chance but as long as a old established player is doing well i do not see the need to replace him.

 

[Flat_Track_Bully]

He's angling for a test recall. Would be better than Shehzad. We do have an opener issue in tests.

 

[ads101]

He's angling for a test recall. Would be better than Shehzad. We do have an opener issue in tests.

We have quite a few options for test. Azhar already should lock down an opener spot. Then to fight for the remaining spot we have Sami Aslam, Fakhar Zaman and Shehzad. So we do have other options. I'd rather try out Fakhar and Sami before we return to Butt.

 

[the Great Khan]

his suffering should never end. He can earn a living on the circuit but he should forget about playing for his country.

 

[Cryin Out Loud]

His 'suffering', LOL.

This guy, seriously, has issues. His statements reflect a stupendous selfishness and complete disregard for anything other than himself, to level almost psychopathic in nature.

 

[Junaids]

It's completely his own fault, but he has "suffered" a lot. Deservedly.

Jail.

Disgrace.

Loss of status.

Loss of wealth.

In court in England when his first son was born.

Career ruined.

 

[Monsee]

Hopefully career ruined for good and never given a chance at the highest level...he deserves all the hate he gets and some more. The fact that he was the ring leader, captain, main influencer etc. is not the main issue, it is his in your face lies till the very end that got everyone to start hating him!

As if he was a world class player bar 1-2 teams in all formats is def another reason why I don't even get why he gets any support at all for a return

 

[Cryin Out Loud]

....... The fact that he was the ring leader, captain, main influencer etc. is not the main issue, it is his in your face lies till the very end that got everyone to start hating him!

............

Hate is strong word but, apart from that, I couldn't agree more. It does seem that Salman Butt lied when he thought it would help him, spoke the truth only when he thought it would help him, expressed remorse for effect and now is showcasing himself as the wrong man.

I'm willing to bet that once he retires he will recant his admission of guilt, claiming he was framed again.

 

[Junaids]

Hate is strong word but, apart from that, I couldn't agree more. It does seem that Salman Butt lied when he thought it would help him, spoke the truth only when he thought it would help him, expressed remorse for effect and now is showcasing himself as the wrong man.

I'm willing to bet that once he retires he will recant his admission of guilt, claiming he was framed again.

Which, if you read the English Judge's remarks I posted above, is almost precisely what he found in the case of Mohammad Amir.

Amir claimed to be Not Guilty when he thought he might get away with it, then admitted some guilt in return for a reduced sentence, but denied further guilt that the Judge stated he had evidence that proved Amir's additional guilt.

And yet all along, if Mohammad Amir was lying about his age, he was continuing to lie on oath in court in order to avoid time in an adult prison.

I would argue that Amir and Butt were not just guilty of the same crime as one another, they switched the telling of the truth on and off at their own convenience to try to get better treatment. Saying that one was more remorseful than the other is a big stretch - especially now that the Judge's rejection of Amir's Guilty plea is now in the public domain at last.

 

[Hasan123]

All3 should have been banned for life in the 1st place. Now all 3 are available to play, if he performs in domestic cricket he could come back. I would rather give Sami Aslam and Imam a chance then go back to Butt.

 

[Rana]

All3 should have been banned for life in the 1st place. Now all 3 are available to play, if he performs in domestic cricket he could come back. I would rather give Sami Aslam and Imam a chance then go back to Butt.

I agree but Sami Aslam actually needs to lift his bat for me to consider him as a viable option. His strike rate of 30 simply isnt good enough

 

[Hasan123]

I agree but Sami Aslam actually needs to lift his bat for me to consider him as a viable option. His strike rate of 30 simply isnt good enough

Agreed , he was more fluent apparently in the Pakistan cup. So he should be called up for the next test series and let's see what happens.

 

[Amir]

None of the interviews of anyone suggested that it was only Butt, all 3 were equally involved in this, all 3 served equal sentences, all 3 were all alert and oriented when they performed those actions, all 3 deserve an equal chance to come back based on performances in domestics

If the mob boss orders the hit, is he equally involved too or less involved?

Butt playing domestic cricket alone is a big enough deal. He is allowed to make a living and takes the spot of someone who could make the national team (as the main purpose of domestic cricket is to build towards the national team). We can let him earn a living but we don't have to select him.

 

[Plumb]

The fact that we are even discussing this guy is an insult to pakistan cricket and pakistan itself. Good bye Mr Butt..

 

[sshakir411]

Butt doing as good a job as the Akmals in pushing his selection through his online/media mafia.

 

[coy0607]

He's angling for a test recall. Would be better than Shehzad. We do have an opener issue in tests.

what issue?

Azhar is among the most dominant openers in the world, and Fakhar has the potential to be a David Warner type opener.

 

[zulfiqar]

I think Amir is just as guilty as Butt to be honest, but he got a recall based on evidence that he will still be a high performer at the international level (which he is still trying to prove, and has shown enough glimpses of as to continue getting a shot in the squad).

Asif would be allowed back if he was younger I'm pretty sure. Also, Asif had other offenses in the past that have him in the bad books of management. In the case of Salman Butt, I don't think selectors are convinced he's a better opener than the ones we have got right now. If our openers start failing, and Butt is the best option, I am sure the selectors will pick him and it would be fine by me.

 

[zulfiqar]

The point is that, though he is probably facing discrimination for the crime he committed (and already served a sentence for), it's not the primary reason for his exclusion at the moment. Poor Fawad Alam can't get a shot in the side even though he's a top performer and shows promise that he can handle international cricket, just on some unknown disciplinary grounds. Butt needs to make a stronger case for his inclusion, to overcome the discrimination he's facing, and I'm sure people will start to support him.

Till then, he has to work on his game and avoid the media. He's turning people against himself by trying to claim that he's the best option when he's clearly not. Reminds me of Kamran Akmal at this point (or Imran Nazir). He's joining the list of people who feel they were hard done by, when the entire world seems to think they weren't good enough.

 

[waleed88]

If the mob boss orders the hit, is he equally involved too or less involved?

Butt playing domestic cricket alone is a big enough deal. He is allowed to make a living and takes the spot of someone who could make the national team (as the main purpose of domestic cricket is to build towards the national team). We can let him earn a living but we don't have to select him.

Yes but the mob boss helds his henchman on a ransom, if they don't do as he pleases he can get them killed. Butt has no such authority over his star bowlers who were the actual reason he won the solitary test match. If only they will be the apple of his eye, if Butt lured them into it, then ofcourse their conscience gave in and it felt right to them. Says by the margin of the no-ball by Mohammad Amir, he smelled those 12000 pounds in his pocket

 

[waleed88]

The fact that we are even discussing this guy is an insult to pakistan cricket and pakistan itself. Good bye Mr Butt..

Its as much an insult as Amir playing for us.. the actual bowler of the no-balls

 

[Monsee]

Amir and Asif at least came from non-privelaged, less educated, poor back grounds who were not very well connected either...what is Mr. Butt's excuse?

I don't really care for who was more talented and not, Butt was the most established, captain of the Nat'l side, had the world in front of him, was already earning quite well (had earned decently as well); with his well educated back ground, he should have seen the end of any such endeavors!

I watched some of his TV show appearences after his return to Pak (was only able to see only just enough before I felt like punching him or throwing up at his attitude) and that pompous attitude, that upty body language, that 'hoax theories of how he was setup' etc. It still makes me mad and now I have to relive all that if he ever gets back in to the team, pfff

 

[waleed88]

Amir and Asif at least came from non-privelaged, less educated, poor back grounds who were not very well connected either...what is Mr. Butt's excuse?

I don't really care for who was more talented and not, Butt was the most established, captain of the Nat'l side, had the world in front of him, was already earning quite well (had earned decently as well); with his well educated back ground, he should have seen the end of any such endeavors!

I watched some of his TV show appearences after his return to Pak (was only able to see only just enough before I felt like punching him or throwing up at his attitude) and that pompous attitude, that upty body language, that 'hoax theories of how he was setup' etc. It still makes me mad and now I have to relive all that if he ever gets back in to the team, pfff

It was a setup, its called entrapment, look it up
Alot of football players of smaller leagues were also targets of the 'fake sheikh' Mazhar Majeed (were they also uneducated?), which is why his evidence was eventually deemed null and void and all his cases to be reviewed

 

[waleed88]

Even Atherton argued on their behalf in a sky sports interview, would they have done it had they known they were being filmed? It just proves they were caught red handed

 

[waleed88]

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/jan/14/fake-sheikh-spot-fixing-players-no-action-cps

'Thirteen footballers who were arrested over allegations of spot-fixing after an undercover sting by Mazher Mahmood will face no further action. The players, including the former Premier League striker DJ Campbell and the former Portsmouth defender Sam Sodje, were detained in dawn raids by the National Crime Agency after Mahmood’s Sun on Sunday exposé in December 2013.

In a front-page sting headlined Ex-Prem Stars In Match Fix Probe, a number of players were accused of agreeing to earn bookings in exchange for tens of thousands of pounds. The Crown Prosecution Service confirmed on Wednesday the players are to face no further action due to there being insufficient evidence to provide a realistic prospect of conviction.

The decision is an embarrassing blow to the National Crime Agency, which arrested the footballers hours after receiving evidence handed over by Mahmood. The investigation faltered in July last year following the collapse of the Tulisa Contostavlos trial over concerns about evidence provided by the so-called Fake Sheikh.'

 

[waleed88]

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/jan/15/pakistan-spot-fixing-fake-sheikh

(January 2015) :

'The case made global headlines and led to intense scrutiny on the scale of the problem of spot-fixing within sport, given the explosion of unregulated betting markets in Asia and the Far East facilitated by the internet and mobile phones.However, some regarded the sentences as severe given it was highly unlikely any bets were ever placed.

The modus operandi of Mahmood, better known to his readers as the Fake Sheikh, has come under scrutiny since the collapse of the Tulisa Contostavlos trial last July. The trial of the pop star and TV presenter over drugs charges was halted amid concerns about Mahmood’s evidence.

Earlier this week, it emerged that 13 footballers who were arrested over spot-fixing allegations after a sting by Mahmood would face no further action.

The players, who included former Birmingham City striker DJ Campbell and the former Portsmouth defender Sam Sodje, were detained in dawn raids by the National Crime Agency following a front page story in the Sun on Sunday in December 2013.'

 

[Monsee]

It was a setup, its called entrapment, look it up
Alot of football players of smaller leagues were also targets of the 'fake sheikh' Mazhar Majeed (were they also uneducated?), which is why his evidence was eventually deemed null and void and all his cases to be reviewed

I have read about this and known the details too, no need to read it again!

Whether entrappment or not, Butt knew the fate of Malik, Azhar, Jadeja, Cronje etc. and being from an educated back ground had better idea not to do it...this does not make the other two any less liable. I still (personally) cannot come around to accepting Butt in Pak XI and am barely there with Amir in the team!

 

[Black Zero]

Cannot wait Salman to return.
Finest opener we had after Saeed.
One of very few who can play in testing conditions.

 

[Monsee]

LOL, ..finest opener who could barely average 30 in tests, amazing!

 

[waleed88]

I have read about this and known the details too, no need to read it again!

Whether entrappment or not, Butt knew the fate of Malik, Azhar, Jadeja, Cronje etc. and being from an educated back ground had better idea not to do it...this does not make the other two any less liable. I still (personally) cannot come around to accepting Butt in Pak XI and am barely there with Amir in the team!

Sadly, 95% on this forum see only one culprit out of 3 in this case. Talk about selective hatred