Hindi Imposition in South India - Factor for Breakup of India?

[rickroll]

Your premises have no basis in reality.
Worry about Afghans taking back KPK
Baloch and Sindhis getting their freedom and
PoK rejoining India while China makes the rest of Pakistan its colony

Yeah sure, I'm the one who is lost without reality and you guys chirping on about Azad Kashmir rejoining India are so well grounded

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Yeah sure, I'm the one who is lost without reality and you guys chirping on about Azad Kashmir rejoining India are so well grounded

There is a higher probability of PoK coming back to Indian control then any split happening within India.

What you have latched on to is a normal healthy debates that happen in any diverse robust democracy. A major constitutional change (which is as per schedule) will and should invite debates and discussions, we have our robust mechanism. You can continue to have your wet fantasies of a broken India. It isn't happening buddy.
You won't know healthy political debate even if it bites you in the ass. Any political debate simply leads to violent protests, regime changes and military coups with ex PM being assassinated or prosecuted to death or put in jail.

PS: There are plenty of facts and background to whats getting debate. But any fact is just waste on you, So not bothered to even share and you dont seem worth trolling either.

 

[rickroll]

There is a higher probability of PoK coming back to Indian control then any split happening within India.

What you have latched on to is a normal healthy debates that happen in any diverse robust democracy. A major constitutional change (which is as per schedule) will and should invite debates and discussions, we have our robust mechanism. You can continue to have your wet fantasies of a broken India. It isn't happening buddy.
You won't know healthy political debate even if it bites you in the ass. Any political debate simply leads to violent protests, regime changes and military coups with ex PM being assassinated or prosecuted to death or put in jail.

PS: There are plenty of facts and background to whats getting debate. But any fact is just waste on you, So not bothered to even share and you dont seem worth trolling either.

1. This thread is not about Pakistan. Look at my post history, I have been highly critical of many things in Pakistan and have been praising good things that India has been doing.

2. I am not some uninformed Pakistani, heck I'm not even Pakistani. I grew up in the US (not some FOB immigrant) and that is what I identify myself as. I am more than well aware than you are about normal healthy debates in a democracy because my country is much more democratic than yours.

I am under no obligation to share any of my background with you but I did you the courtesy of sharing my background.

PS: There are plenty of facts and background to whats getting debate. But any fact is just waste on you - This is exactly what I am saying of you and other Indian posters here. All I ask is that if the current set up is fair for the South Indian states but there was no response to this and only personal attacks from Indians.

Y'all say you care about facts? Then why resort to personal attacks on my background and Pakistan instead of directly answering the question? News flash - THIS THREAD IS NOT ABOUT PAKISTAN

Y'all say you care about facts? Read my first 2 posts and subsequent posts which only have facts?

What is it you think? Just because some of us are of Pakistani origin we are just trolling and are dumb about your country's history? Some of us are not just well read but also in tune with history thanks to having good friends from those parts of India. You think I do not know about India's language act of 1963 and the subsequent protests in Tamil Nadu in 1965? You want facts then have the guts to only debate facts instead of deflecting about Pakistan or personal attacks or some mumbo jumbo comment about this being a democratic process or some subjective statement that your neighbor's cousin is South Indian who is ok with this.

It is NOT a normal democratic process because the democratic power of South India is getting nullified by reducing the power of their MPs in South India. I have also said Pakistan also did this with Bengal and we know what happened in 1971.

Some of you Indians are the ones trolling in this thread. If you don't have the guts or brains to debate facts then accept your truth.

 

[rickroll]

Hindi v Tamil: India's language battle heats up​

Getty

Tamil Nadu Chief Minister MK Stalin has said he will not implement the education policy in his state
A war of words has erupted between the chief minister of a southern Indian state and the federal government over an education policy that, among other things, also deals with what languages children are taught in schools.

The National Education Policy (NEP) 2020 was introduced by Prime Minister Narendra Modi's government five years back and is being implemented in stages. It has made headlines recently after Tamil Nadu Chief Minister MK Stalin alleged that the federal government was penalising his state for refusing to implement it - charges Delhi has denied.

A section of the policy recommends that students learn three languages. It doesn't mention any language specifically, but adds that at least two should be "native to India".

Stalin has cited a number of reasons for not implementing the NEP. But it is his allegation that the three-language policy will lead to the imposition of Hindi - the northern Indian language that is the most widely spoken in India - in his state that has dominated headlines recently.

India, where states are mostly organised on linguistic lines, has nearly two dozen official languages, including Hindi, Tamil and English. But southern states have often protested against efforts by successive federal governments to privilege Hindi over other languages.

It is an especially sensitive issue in Tamil Nadu, which has historically been at the forefront of such protests.

The issue led to heated exchanges in India's parliament on Monday, with federal Education Minister Dharmendra Pradhan accusing Stalin and his party members of "mischief".

"Their only job is to raise language barriers. They are undemocratic and uncivilised," Pradhan said, sparking protests by Stalin's party, the Dravida Munnetra Kazhagam, in Tamil Nadu.

What is the controversy about?​

Education is a part of the constitution's "concurrent" list, which means that both the federal and state governments can make and enact laws around it. Schools and colleges follow different syllabi and rules depending on who oversees them - the federal or state governments.

The National Education Policy aims to promote and regulate education in India and the government updates it occasionally, with the NEP 2020 being the fourth iteration.

The three-language formula has found place in the NEP from its first version in 1968 and has often faced pushback from states, including Tamil Nadu. Many of its recommendations were not legally binding on state-run schools - Tamil Nadu, for instance, teaches only two languages, English and Tamil, in schools it runs. The state's leaders have argued that learning their mother tongue, Tamil, helps children learn subjects better while English opens up more promising opportunities.

Tamil Nadu government schools have also performed well over the years on surveys measuring parameters including access to education and quality of infrastructure.

The latest NEP says that the "three-language policy will continue to be implemented" but adds that - unlike earlier versions - there will be "greater flexibility" and that "no language will be imposed on any state".

Getty Images
Tamil Nadu says teaching only two languages, Tamil and English, has served it well
But Stalin and his party - who say they are not against Hindi itself - have argued over the past few weeks that the policy's eventual aim is to force the language on non-Hindi-speaking states.

The chief minister wrote on X last month that Hindi - which emerged as a standardised language for easy communication during the British era - ended up dominating other languages and dialects spoken in northern India, such as Bhojpuri and Awadhi.

His party's MP Kanimozhi Karunanidhi also recently questioned why a student should be forced to learn three languages.

"Students have enough burden in schools. You have to learn so many subjects, and on top of that you are forced to learn three languages instead of two," she told the Indian Express newspaper.

But Pradhan has denied allegations that the policy will force Hindi through.

"We have never said in NEP 2020 that only Hindi will be there; we have only said that education will be based on mother tongue - in Tamil Nadu, it will be Tamil," he told reporters last week.

So why is this so important?​

The latest controversy has been exacerbated by Tamil Nadu's claims that it has not been allotted its share of funds for Samagra Shiksha Abhiyan - a school education programme partially funded by the federal government - due to the state's refusal to implement the NEP.

The Hindu newspaper reported last August that the federal government had asked Tamil Nadu to sign a memorandum of understanding (MoU) to participate in the scheme. However, according to the MoU, participating in the scheme meant that the state had to adopt NEP 2020 "in its entirety".

In December, a junior federal minister told parliament that Tamil Nadu did not sign the MoU for the scheme despite agreeing initially - a claim the DMK denied, saying it never agreed to do so.

In February, Stalin wrote a letter to Prime Minister Narendra Modi, asking him to urgently release the funds, amounting to around 21.5bn rupees ($247m; £191m).

Why is language such a sensitive topic in India?​

India is one of the world's most linguistically diverse countries and some estimates say thousands of languages are spoken here.

But there are only 22 official languages, with Hindi - spoken by more than 46% of the population - being the most widely used, according to the last census held in 2011.

After the British left India in 1947, the newly independent nation sought to promote Hindi as a link language to replace English. The constitution - enacted in 1950 - also nudges the federal government to promote the spread of Hindi.

Getty Images
Language is an especially sensitive issue in Tamil Nadu, which has seen fierce protests against Hindi
This invited fierce opposition from non-Hindi-speaking states, prompting the federal government to continue using English as an alternate official language for 15 years after 1950.

As the deadline year of 1965 approached, violent protests over fears of Hindi "imposition" erupted again across Tamil Nadu, leading the federal government to pass a law that assured the continued use of English as an official language.

However, successive federal governments have introduced policies or made announcements that have kept these anxieties simmering.

The 1968 NEP adopted the three-language formula for the first time and, in the same year, the government introduced policies mandating the teaching of Hindi in non-Hindi speaking states, leading to fresh protests.

Over the years, the issue of Hindi versus other languages has made headlines repeatedly. In 2023, Stalin criticised the Modi government for replacing some colonial-era laws with ones bearing Hindi names (the Indian Penal Code, for instance, has been replaced with a law named Bharatiya Nyaya Sanhita).

A federal government commission that examined the language policy during 1948-49 acknowledged that the issue's sentimental nature made it "difficult to consider it in a calm and detached manner".

"No other problem has caused greater controversy among educationists and evoked more contradictory views from our witnesses," it said.

Source -- https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c3w19242l63o

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

1. This thread is not about Pakistan. Look at my post history, I have been highly critical of many things in Pakistan and have been praising good things that India has been doing.

2. I am not some uninformed Pakistani, heck I'm not even Pakistani. I grew up in the US (not some FOB immigrant) and that is what I identify myself as. I am more than well aware than you are about normal healthy debates in a democracy because my country is much more democratic than yours.

I am under no obligation to share any of my background with you but I did you the courtesy of sharing my background.

PS: There are plenty of facts and background to whats getting debate. But any fact is just waste on you - This is exactly what I am saying of you and other Indian posters here. All I ask is that if the current set up is fair for the South Indian states but there was no response to this and only personal attacks from Indians.

Y'all say you care about facts? Then why resort to personal attacks on my background and Pakistan instead of directly answering the question? News flash - THIS THREAD IS NOT ABOUT PAKISTAN

Y'all say you care about facts? Read my first 2 posts and subsequent posts which only have facts?

What is it you think? Just because some of us are of Pakistani origin we are just trolling and are dumb about your country's history? Some of us are not just well read but also in tune with history thanks to having good friends from those parts of India. You think I do not know about India's language act of 1963 and the subsequent protests in Tamil Nadu in 1965? You want facts then have the guts to only debate facts instead of deflecting about Pakistan or personal attacks or some mumbo jumbo comment about this being a democratic process or some subjective statement that your neighbor's cousin is South Indian who is ok with this.

It is NOT a normal democratic process because the democratic power of South India is getting nullified by reducing the power of their MPs in South India. I have also said Pakistan also did this with Bengal and we know what happened in 1971.

Some of you Indians are the ones trolling in this thread. If you don't have the guts or brains to debate facts then accept your truth.

Well point 2 explains a lot. Typical American stereotypes are very much true, lack of knoweldge but extreme arrogance.

Look at your posts, you are not actually asking a genuine question but projecting your embedded bias in the form of a question.

And as for Indian democracy. What do you actually know about the seat structure? Do you even know about what has been the ratio in the past? You just pounced on, drooling, at a chance to poke fun at any perceived friction in India. Its simply pathetic.Such threads invite the usual suspects like Kaptaan Knowledge and here you are the other one I have noticed

Assuming you are serious. Just a hypothetical here, going on a whim here that you are actually being genuine.
India follows " one person one vote" with each person getting equal chance in representation irrespective of their regional identity, gender, relgion etc. Should India abandon this simple but non-discriminatory principle of democracy?
and plzzzz What Pakistan did to Bangladesh was an abomination, there is simply no analogy here.

Your understanding of Indian constitutional framework is near zero, hence your claims sound very moronic to us.

 

[rickroll]

Well point 2 explains a lot. Typical American stereotypes are very much true, lack of knoweldge but extreme arrogance.

Look at your posts, you are not actually asking a genuine question but projecting your embedded bias in the form of a question.

And as for Indian democracy. What do you actually know about the seat structure? Do you even know about what has been the ratio in the past? You just pounced on, drooling, at a chance to poke fun at any perceived friction in India. Its simply pathetic.Such threads invite the usual suspects like Kaptaan Knowledge and here you are the other one I have noticed

Assuming you are serious. Just a hypothetical here, going on a whim here that you are actually being genuine.
India follows " one person one vote" with each person getting equal chance in representation irrespective of their regional identity, gender, relgion etc. Should India abandon this simple but non-discriminatory principle of democracy?
and plzzzz What Pakistan did to Bangladesh was an abomination, there is simply no analogy here.

Your understanding of Indian constitutional framework is near zero, hence your claims sound very moronic to us.

Again, I am requesting you to refrain from personal attacks or Pakistan deflections (Pakistan should not be your comparison point here) and only discuss the issue relevant to this thread and stick to facts and logic. Do you see me making personal attacks against you?

One person one vote - This originated from social democratic construct probably from the same socialism utopia. This style of democracy has known flaws when it comes to protecting minorities. A blend of federalism combined with universal franchise that you would see in places like Switzerland circumvents this critical flaw in simplistic democracies that follow "one person one vote".

One person one vote is basically a feel good claim that people make. In reality it tramples the rights of those who are not part of the majority (and that majority could be a flimsy 51% majority). Putting it in simple terms, even with a 51% majority for Hindi cow belt of North India and their friends, they can outvote the remaining 49% so that the 49% is forced to learn their language and tax revenues of the 49% is funneled to them.

Some reference links below and I have many more.

How ranked choice voting survives the 'one person, one vote' challenge - FairVote

FairVote is a nonpartisan organization seeking better elections for all. We research and advance voting reforms that make democracy more functional and representative for every American.

fairvote.org

14. Why “One Man, One Vote” Doesn’t Work

https://scholarlycommons.law.case.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1280&context=caselrev

 

[rickroll]

"Yeah, let's force Hindi on the South, get them to the "cow belt life" and also take away their tax revenue. "

South India




North India

 

[rickroll]

Pakistanis and North Indians - speak from your hearts. Do you really think this level of harmony is possible in any northern part of India?

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Again, I am requesting you to refrain from personal attacks or Pakistan deflections (Pakistan should not be your comparison point here) and only discuss the issue relevant to this thread and stick to facts and logic. Do you see me making personal attacks against you?

One person one vote - This originated from social democratic construct probably from the same socialism utopia. This style of democracy has known flaws when it comes to protecting minorities. A blend of federalism combined with universal franchise that you would see in places like Switzerland circumvents this critical flaw in simplistic democracies that follow "one person one vote".

One person one vote is basically a feel good claim that people make. In reality it tramples the rights of those who are not part of the majority (and that majority could be a flimsy 51% majority). Putting it in simple terms, even with a 51% majority for Hindi cow belt of North India and their friends, they can outvote the remaining 49% so that the 49% is forced to learn their language and tax revenues of the 49% is funneled to them.

Some reference links below and I have many more.

How ranked choice voting survives the 'one person, one vote' challenge - FairVote

FairVote is a nonpartisan organization seeking better elections for all. We research and advance voting reforms that make democracy more functional and representative for every American.

fairvote.org

14. Why “One Man, One Vote” Doesn’t Work

https://scholarlycommons.law.case.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1280&context=caselrev

As i said you have no idea what Indian constitutional framework is.
One person one vote is part of the basic structure of our constitution which the Supreme Court has decades ago determined cannot be altered even if the parliament passes an amendment with 100% majority.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

"Yeah, let's force Hindi on the South, get them to the "cow belt life" and also take away their tax revenue. "

South India

View attachment 152064


North India

View attachment 152065

Why doesn't the headline have zero reference in the entire list?

Ensure every American gets the right to vote as per their constitution, we have been managing that with 10 times less resources but for 4 times the population.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Pakistanis and North Indians - speak from your hearts. Do you really think this level of harmony is possible in any northern part of India?

View attachment 152066

And .... after long time .. the long awaited plug of RELIGION.. by the usual suspects.
It's commendable that you could resist for more than 100 posts of this thread, but reality does poke out.

 

[rickroll]

As i said you have no idea what Indian constitutional framework is.
One person one vote is part of the basic structure of our constitution which the Supreme Court has decades ago determined cannot be altered even if the parliament passes an amendment with 100% majority.

It is there and cannot be altered does not mean it is the right way.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

It is there and cannot be altered does not mean it is the right way.

Pity, you lack understanding that other countries have their own constitution and are sovereign.
You don't have basic concept of rule of law
There are thousands of reasons why we have the system we have and why it works for us and why the Supreme courts in all their wisdom took away the right of the parliament to alter this aspect of the Indian constitution.

 

[rickroll]

Why doesn't the headline have zero reference in the entire list?
Ensure every American gets the right to vote as per their constitution, we have been managing that with 10 times less resources but for 4 times the population.

Why doesn't the headline have zero reference in the entire list? -- US constitution, Pakistan etc have zero reference to this thread yet you are allowed to do that but others cannot do so? This means you judge others by different standards than you judge yourself?

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Why doesn't the headline have zero reference in the entire list? -- US constitution, Pakistan etc have zero reference to this thread yet you are allowed to do that but others cannot do so? This means you judge others by different standards than you judge yourself?

Again.. when u post fake titles and spread misinformation and simply ignore when pointed to the facts. Yes , you will be called out.
I have made zero reference american or pakistani constitution..

 

[rickroll]

Pity, you lack understanding that other countries have their own constitution and are sovereign.
You don't have basic concept of rule of law
There are thousands of reasons why we have the system we have and why it works for us and why the Supreme courts in all their wisdom took away the right of the parliament to alter this aspect of the Indian constitution.

I'm willing and open and happy to listen to your POV in spite of all your insults hurled at me. If I'm proven wrong I will readily admit and I have no ego about that. I do not believe in pretending to be some know it all. You can see my post history where I have literally called out and praised good practices that India does. I hope this helps you not to resort to insults and see if you can post a message of substance. Otherwise, no worries your loss.

 

[rickroll]

Again.. when u post fake titles and spread misinformation and simply ignore when pointed to the facts. Yes , you will be called out.
I have made zero reference american or pakistani constitution..

I have made zero reference american or pakistani constitution -- Oh but you did. I'm quoting those below and bolding them. Now you are claiming in this very thread that you did not.

Well point 2 explains a lot. Typical American stereotypes are very much true, lack of knoweldge but extreme arrogance.

Look at your posts, you are not actually asking a genuine question but projecting your embedded bias in the form of a question.

And as for Indian democracy. What do you actually know about the seat structure? Do you even know about what has been the ratio in the past? You just pounced on, drooling, at a chance to poke fun at any perceived friction in India. Its simply pathetic.Such threads invite the usual suspects like Kaptaan Knowledge and here you are the other one I have noticed

Assuming you are serious. Just a hypothetical here, going on a whim here that you are actually being genuine.
India follows " one person one vote" with each person getting equal chance in representation irrespective of their regional identity, gender, relgion etc. Should India abandon this simple but non-discriminatory principle of democracy?
and plzzzz What Pakistan did to Bangladesh was an abomination, there is simply no analogy here.

Your understanding of Indian constitutional framework is near zero, hence your claims sound very moronic to us.

Why doesn't the headline have zero reference in the entire list?
Ensure every American gets the right to vote as per their constitution, we have been managing that with 10 times less resources but for 4 times the population.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

I'm willing and open and happy to listen to your POV in spite of all your insults hurled at me. If I'm proven wrong I will readily admit and I have no ego about that. I do not believe in pretending to be some know it all. You can see my post history where I have literally called out and praised good practices that India does. I hope this helps you not to resort to insults and see if you can post a message of substance. Otherwise, no worries your loss.

Did I mention any American or Pakistani Constitution in this thread?
Did I make references to religions here?
Did I post a article title which is absolutely fake?

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

I have made zero reference american or pakistani constitution -- Oh but you did. I'm quoting those below and bolding them. Now you are claiming in this very thread that you did not.

was my reference to American or Paksitani Constitution??

You are the one who referenced Pakistan Bangladesh thing and i replied back on that btw.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Unless you find my references to American or Pakistani constitutions in this thread @rickroll , stop tagging me.

 

[rickroll]

Did I mention any American or Pakistani Constitution in this thread?
Did I make references to religions here?
Did I post a article title which is absolutely fake?

You did name call American education system and American political system and American transition of power. I have quoted this below.

Yes I believe the good tolerance and open mindedness of South Indians deserves a praise. It is a testament to their good governance and good education system. I feel it is unfair that South Indians have done such good things but things are imposed upon them.

There is nothing fake about anything I posted in this thread.

Why doesn't the headline have zero reference in the entire list?
Ensure every American gets the right to vote as per their constitution, we have been managing that with 10 times less resources but for 4 times the population.

 

[rickroll]

was my reference to American or Paksitani Constitution??


You are the one who referenced Pakistan Bangladesh thing and i replied back on that btw.

Who cares if it is American transition of power of American constitution? It is deflection nevertheless.

 

[rickroll]

Unless you find my references to American or Pakistani constitutions in this thread @rickroll , stop tagging me.

Nobody is tagging you dude. You just tagged me FYI. You are the one who referenced American transition of power and my country's politics, and commented about American education system. None of that is relevant to this thread.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

You did name call American education system and American political system and American transition of power. I have quoted this below.

Yes I believe the good tolerance and open mindedness of South Indians deserves a praise. It is a testament to their good governance and good education system. I feel it is unfair that South Indians have done such good things but things are imposed upon them.

There is nothing fake about anything I posted in this thread.

Is that a reference or mention of American Constitution or Pakistani Consitution?

 

[rickroll]

Is that a reference or mention of American Constitution or Pakistani Consitution?

I request you to calm down and read what I said. It does not matter what part of the United States constitution or election or power transition it refers to. It is a deflection to an unrelated entity nevertheless.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

I request you to calm down and read what I said. It does not matter what part of the United States constitution or election or power transition it refers to. It is a deflection to an unrelated entity nevertheless.

you are the one who brought in American and Pakistani constitution here.
From the looks of it , you don't even know the Constitutional frameworks of those two either.

Every nation have their written or unwritten Constitution to help them define and make laws. The present discussion raised is part of Indian process of openly debating upcoming major changes in the laws of the land. People are allowed to present their difference of opinion in a democracy. Your posts seem to imply that active open debate is a concept that is foreign to you.

And please tell me what on earth has the post about South Indian Muslims got anything to do with the language debate of this thread?

 

[rickroll]

you are the one who brought in American and Pakistani constitution here.
From the looks of it , you don't even know the Constitutional frameworks of those two either.

Every nation have their written or unwritten Constitution to help them define and make laws. The present discussion raised is part of Indian process of openly debating upcoming major changes in the laws of the land. People are allowed to present their difference of opinion in a democracy. Your posts seem to imply that active open debate is a concept that is foreign to you.

Not sure where I brought in American or Pakistani constitutions. My messages you quoted do not even mention Pakistani or American constitutions.

I'm well aware and educated with regards to my discussion points seems like you are not, hence the personal insults to cover up your lack of knowledge.

I would contend that this thread is not just language but also other issues stemming from it. I had clarified this in post #2 in this thread detailing it with references.

Oh, my knowledge of constitutional frameworks far exceeds yours and I have linked multiple academic sources to counter your one person one vote which you never responded and as usual just resorted to insults.

I also do not care what or how other users do. Perhaps you like following other users around and trade insults. Good luck.

 

[rickroll]

Pretty interesting sequence of events leading to the language issue. As the article states and I hope this thread implies, this is more than just language, it is the need for federalism.

The battle against Hindi imposition: Why Tamil Nadu won't back down​

Tamil Nadu's opposition to Hindi imposition is rooted in history, identity and culture, as well as the principle of federalism. This has shaped its stance against the National Education Policy and reinforces its demand for linguistic and cultural autonomy.​

Recently, Tamil Nadu Chief Minister MK Stalin declared that the state is “ready for another language war” over Hindi imposition.

In Short​

• Tamil Nadu has resisted Hindi imposition for decades
• NEP 2020 reignites language debate in the state
• The issue extends beyond language to federalism

Tamil Nadu’s fight against Hindi imposition is not just politics - it is a fierce movement woven into the state’s social and cultural fabric. Tamil Nadu’s argument is simple: Why should a language be imposed on them?

So, why does Tamil Nadu, more than any other southern state, aggressively push back against Hindi? Why do both the ruling DMK and the opposition AIADMK stand united on this issue? And more importantly, would Tamil Nadu have accepted the National Education Policy (NEP) if Hindi wasn’t part of it?

To answer these questions, we need to rewind to the early 20th century, when this ‘language war’ first erupted.

A MOVEMENT ROOTED IN HISTORY​

https://www.indiatoday.in/movies/re...m_medium=mustread&utm_campaign=recommendation
Tamil Nadu’s fight against Hindi imposition didn’t start with Chief Minister MK Stalin or even his father, M Karunanidhi. It’s a resistance that dates back nearly a century, one that has shaped the state’s politics, identity, and governance.

The first major agitation flared up in 1937 when the C Rajagopalachari-governed Madras Presidency tried to make Hindi compulsory in schools. The decision triggered a massive uproar. Leaders like rationalist social reformer Periyar EV Ramasamy and CN Annadurai, the founder of the Dravida Munnetra Kazhagam (DMK), led the protests, resulting in the arrest of more than 1,100 people. The movement took a crucial turn when two protesters, Thalamuthu Nadar and Natarajan, died in prison. Under immense pressure, the government withdrew the order in February 1940.

By the time another attempt was made in 1946 to introduce Hindi in schools, the Dravidian movement had gained momentum, arguing that the North was politically and economically exploiting the South. The DMK, founded in 1949, made opposing Hindi imposition one of its core principles.


The biggest turning point came in 1965 when the Union government attempted to replace English with Hindi as the sole official language. Tamil Nadu erupted in flames. Students led agitations, and the movement turned violent. Several students died in police firing, while others set themselves on fire in protest. The backlash was so fierce that Prime Minister Lal Bahadur Shastri was forced to step in and declare English an “associate official language” alongside Hindi.

The agitation had a lasting impact, Congress lost its stronghold in Tamil Nadu in the 1967 elections, and leaders of the movement, like P Sreenivasan, defeated Congress veterans such as K Kamaraj.

By 1968, Tamil Nadu witnessed the rise of the DMK which firmly rejected the three-language formula and implemented a strict two-language policy: Tamil and English. The DMK even renamed All India Radio’s Tamil station from ‘Akashvani’ (a Sanskrit term) to ‘Tamil Vanoli’.

Even after the DMK split in 1972, leading to the formation of the AIADMK, both parties continued to oppose Hindi imposition. Since then, Tamil Nadu has stood firm, rejecting policies that push Hindi at the expense of Tamil and English.

Language has historically been more than just a medium of communication in Tamil Nadu, it’s a symbol of resistance against forced centralisation.

WHY TAMIL NADU IS FIGHTING NEP 2020​

The latest battlefield in Tamil Nadu’s linguistic war is the National Education Policy (NEP) 2020. The policy promotes a three-language formula, which many in Tamil Nadu see as a ‘backdoor attempt to push Hindi’.

But the opposition runs deeper. Tamil Nadu has long believed that education should be a state subject, tailored to its socio-cultural context. The state already has a high literacy rate and a thriving economy, thanks to its emphasis on English-medium education. Critics argue that NEP represents yet another attempt by the Centre to impose a ‘one-size-fits-all’ approach.

Would Tamil Nadu have accepted NEP if it did not include Hindi? Maybe. Maybe not. But the state’s resistance is about something bigger, the right to decide its own policies without interference from Delhi.

The BJP’s push for Hindi, whether in government communication, road signs, or education, has reignited tensions. Tamil Nadu has even been denied education funds for rejecting NEP, and by extension, the three-language policy.

Union Education Minister Dharmendra Pradhan stated that Rs 2,152 crore in funds under the Samagra Shiksha Abhiyan (SSA) would not be released unless the state fully implements NEP 2020, including the three-language policy.

BEYOND TAMIL NADU: WHO ELSE IS RESISTING HINDI?​

Tamil Nadu may be the loudest voice in the anti-Hindi movement, but it isn’t alone. Other states, particularly in South India, are also pushing back against the growing dominance of Hindi.

Karnataka has witnessed sporadic protests against Hindi signage in Bengaluru, while Kerala has resisted the use of Hindi in administration and education. West Bengal and Maharashtra have engaged in political debates over the role of Hindi, though not with the same intensity as Tamil Nadu. Meanwhile, the Northeast has long opposed Hindi imposition, viewing it as a form of cultural erasure.

But unlike Tamil Nadu, these states have not institutionalised their resistance. Tamil Nadu, on the other hand, has woven its anti-Hindi stance into its very governance, rejecting the three-language formula outright and consistently pushing back against every policy seen as a threat to its linguistic and political autonomy.

BEYOND LANGUAGE: THE FIGHT FOR FEDERALISM​

At its core, Tamil Nadu’s resistance to Hindi is not merely about preserving the Tamil language. It is tied to broader concerns over state autonomy and federalism. The fear is that linguistic imposition is part of a larger centralisation drive that could extend to governance, economic policies, and political representation.

People pick up a language when necessary. Many Tamils have learnt Hindi, just as many Hindi speakers in Tamil Nadu have picked up Tamil. For Tamil Nadu, the issue has not been about learning Hindi - it has been about the right to choose whether or not to learn it.

At its core, this fight is about federalism, linguistic freedom, and cultural identity.

For the DMK and other Dravidian parties, opposing Hindi is not just about protecting Tamil - it’s about protecting Tamil Nadu’s autonomy. And as history has shown, this is a battle the state will not back down from.

Source - https://www.indiatoday.in/india/tam...on-autonomy-federalism-nep-2690578-2025-03-07

 

[BouncerGuy]

YOU GUYS NEED TO CALM DOWN NOW... NO MORE PERSONAL REMARKS NOW... IF YOU CANNOT STAY ON TOPIC THEN PLEASE LEAVE THIS THREAD.

 

[rickroll]

YOU GUYS NEED TO CALM DOWN NOW... NO MORE PERSONAL REMARKS NOW... IF YOU CANNOT STAY ON TOPIC THEN PLEASE LEAVE THIS THREAD.

Thank you for saying this. I have been super patient and not responding in kind to one personal attack after another for no reason but a human can only be patient to some extent. I am glad you have stepped in. I'm glad there is an ignore function in the PP forum.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

YOU GUYS NEED TO CALM DOWN NOW... NO MORE PERSONAL REMARKS NOW... IF YOU CANNOT STAY ON TOPIC THEN PLEASE LEAVE THIS THREAD.

ok

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Pretty interesting sequence of events leading to the language issue. As the article states and I hope this thread implies, this is more than just language, it is the need for federalism.

The battle against Hindi imposition: Why Tamil Nadu won't back down​

Tamil Nadu's opposition to Hindi imposition is rooted in history, identity and culture, as well as the principle of federalism. This has shaped its stance against the National Education Policy and reinforces its demand for linguistic and cultural autonomy.​

Recently, Tamil Nadu Chief Minister MK Stalin declared that the state is “ready for another language war” over Hindi imposition.

In Short​

• Tamil Nadu has resisted Hindi imposition for decades
• NEP 2020 reignites language debate in the state
• The issue extends beyond language to federalism

Tamil Nadu’s fight against Hindi imposition is not just politics - it is a fierce movement woven into the state’s social and cultural fabric. Tamil Nadu’s argument is simple: Why should a language be imposed on them?

So, why does Tamil Nadu, more than any other southern state, aggressively push back against Hindi? Why do both the ruling DMK and the opposition AIADMK stand united on this issue? And more importantly, would Tamil Nadu have accepted the National Education Policy (NEP) if Hindi wasn’t part of it?

To answer these questions, we need to rewind to the early 20th century, when this ‘language war’ first erupted.

A MOVEMENT ROOTED IN HISTORY​

https://www.indiatoday.in/movies/re...m_medium=mustread&utm_campaign=recommendation
Tamil Nadu’s fight against Hindi imposition didn’t start with Chief Minister MK Stalin or even his father, M Karunanidhi. It’s a resistance that dates back nearly a century, one that has shaped the state’s politics, identity, and governance.

The first major agitation flared up in 1937 when the C Rajagopalachari-governed Madras Presidency tried to make Hindi compulsory in schools. The decision triggered a massive uproar. Leaders like rationalist social reformer Periyar EV Ramasamy and CN Annadurai, the founder of the Dravida Munnetra Kazhagam (DMK), led the protests, resulting in the arrest of more than 1,100 people. The movement took a crucial turn when two protesters, Thalamuthu Nadar and Natarajan, died in prison. Under immense pressure, the government withdrew the order in February 1940.

By the time another attempt was made in 1946 to introduce Hindi in schools, the Dravidian movement had gained momentum, arguing that the North was politically and economically exploiting the South. The DMK, founded in 1949, made opposing Hindi imposition one of its core principles.


The biggest turning point came in 1965 when the Union government attempted to replace English with Hindi as the sole official language. Tamil Nadu erupted in flames. Students led agitations, and the movement turned violent. Several students died in police firing, while others set themselves on fire in protest. The backlash was so fierce that Prime Minister Lal Bahadur Shastri was forced to step in and declare English an “associate official language” alongside Hindi.

The agitation had a lasting impact, Congress lost its stronghold in Tamil Nadu in the 1967 elections, and leaders of the movement, like P Sreenivasan, defeated Congress veterans such as K Kamaraj.

By 1968, Tamil Nadu witnessed the rise of the DMK which firmly rejected the three-language formula and implemented a strict two-language policy: Tamil and English. The DMK even renamed All India Radio’s Tamil station from ‘Akashvani’ (a Sanskrit term) to ‘Tamil Vanoli’.

Even after the DMK split in 1972, leading to the formation of the AIADMK, both parties continued to oppose Hindi imposition. Since then, Tamil Nadu has stood firm, rejecting policies that push Hindi at the expense of Tamil and English.

Language has historically been more than just a medium of communication in Tamil Nadu, it’s a symbol of resistance against forced centralisation.

WHY TAMIL NADU IS FIGHTING NEP 2020​

The latest battlefield in Tamil Nadu’s linguistic war is the National Education Policy (NEP) 2020. The policy promotes a three-language formula, which many in Tamil Nadu see as a ‘backdoor attempt to push Hindi’.

But the opposition runs deeper. Tamil Nadu has long believed that education should be a state subject, tailored to its socio-cultural context. The state already has a high literacy rate and a thriving economy, thanks to its emphasis on English-medium education. Critics argue that NEP represents yet another attempt by the Centre to impose a ‘one-size-fits-all’ approach.

Would Tamil Nadu have accepted NEP if it did not include Hindi? Maybe. Maybe not. But the state’s resistance is about something bigger, the right to decide its own policies without interference from Delhi.

The BJP’s push for Hindi, whether in government communication, road signs, or education, has reignited tensions. Tamil Nadu has even been denied education funds for rejecting NEP, and by extension, the three-language policy.

Union Education Minister Dharmendra Pradhan stated that Rs 2,152 crore in funds under the Samagra Shiksha Abhiyan (SSA) would not be released unless the state fully implements NEP 2020, including the three-language policy.

BEYOND TAMIL NADU: WHO ELSE IS RESISTING HINDI?​

Tamil Nadu may be the loudest voice in the anti-Hindi movement, but it isn’t alone. Other states, particularly in South India, are also pushing back against the growing dominance of Hindi.

Karnataka has witnessed sporadic protests against Hindi signage in Bengaluru, while Kerala has resisted the use of Hindi in administration and education. West Bengal and Maharashtra have engaged in political debates over the role of Hindi, though not with the same intensity as Tamil Nadu. Meanwhile, the Northeast has long opposed Hindi imposition, viewing it as a form of cultural erasure.

But unlike Tamil Nadu, these states have not institutionalised their resistance. Tamil Nadu, on the other hand, has woven its anti-Hindi stance into its very governance, rejecting the three-language formula outright and consistently pushing back against every policy seen as a threat to its linguistic and political autonomy.

BEYOND LANGUAGE: THE FIGHT FOR FEDERALISM​

At its core, Tamil Nadu’s resistance to Hindi is not merely about preserving the Tamil language. It is tied to broader concerns over state autonomy and federalism. The fear is that linguistic imposition is part of a larger centralisation drive that could extend to governance, economic policies, and political representation.

People pick up a language when necessary. Many Tamils have learnt Hindi, just as many Hindi speakers in Tamil Nadu have picked up Tamil. For Tamil Nadu, the issue has not been about learning Hindi - it has been about the right to choose whether or not to learn it.

At its core, this fight is about federalism, linguistic freedom, and cultural identity.

For the DMK and other Dravidian parties, opposing Hindi is not just about protecting Tamil - it’s about protecting Tamil Nadu’s autonomy. And as history has shown, this is a battle the state will not back down from.

Source - https://www.indiatoday.in/india/tam...on-autonomy-federalism-nep-2690578-2025-03-07

What does the Indian Constitution state about its federal structure? Do you know anything about it?
Can it be changed? if yes, How can it be changed?
Do you know anything about the above?

 

[AutoCrat]

I am from the South, born and brought up, and I have spent my whole life here except for a few years abroad. Here's my perspective:

The mother language is central and deep to South Indians' identity. There has always been a vehement opposition to the imposition of Hindi on South Indians, it's historical, and undercuts political parties, be it from the Congress or the BJP. There is a certain undercurrent of hatred and alienation that has started in the Southern psyche due to the recent events of tinkering with the language status quo, unequal tax distribution, the Center's step-motherly treatment of the South, delimitation, etc. While a full cessation may be unthinkable at this moment, the signs of danger are certainly there.

I urge my North Indian friends to be very careful and not brush aside these issues. Make no mistake, we Southerners will never accept Hindi as the national language. We are too proud of our own languages and don't see the need for a national language at all. Mind you, even cessation is casually talked about in friends and family circles although not seriously. The other day I got a call from my bank's customer service and the person just started blabbering something in Hindi. I immediately schooled him that he should either start the conversation in the state language or ask me in English, which language is preferable to me. He knows damn well where my residence is and yet assumed that I can converse in Hindi. Instances like these are plenty and add to our frustration with North India. If these frustrations and feelings become stronger and deeper, they will reach critical mass and the movement can assume a life of its own.

I have seen this play all too painfully in my own backyard when Telangana split from Andhra Pradesh in 2014. I remember my delusional fellow Andhrites brushing it off as a fringe movement when it started a decade earlier and even making fun of the people of Telangana. The result is obvious to everyone. As Kamal Hassan said "Don't make an inclusive India and exclusive one. All will suffer because of such short-sighted folly".

 

[Red-Indian]

I am from the South, born and brought up, and I have spent my whole life here except for a few years abroad. Here's my perspective:

The mother language is central and deep to South Indians' identity. There has always been a vehement opposition to the imposition of Hindi on South Indians, it's historical, and undercuts political parties, be it from the Congress or the BJP. There is a certain undercurrent of hatred and alienation that has started in the Southern psyche due to the recent events of tinkering with the language status quo, unequal tax distribution, the Center's step-motherly treatment of the South, delimitation, etc. While a full cessation may be unthinkable at this moment, the signs of danger are certainly there.

I urge my North Indian friends to be very careful and not brush aside these issues. Make no mistake, we Southerners will never accept Hindi as the national language. We are too proud of our own languages and don't see the need for a national language at all. Mind you, even cessation is casually talked about in friends and family circles although not seriously. The other day I got a call from my bank's customer service and the person just started blabbering something in Hindi. I immediately schooled him that he should either start the conversation in the state language or ask me in English, which language is preferable to me. He knows damn well where my residence is and yet assumed that I can converse in Hindi. Instances like these are plenty and add to our frustration with North India. If these frustrations and feelings become stronger and deeper, they will reach critical mass and the movement can assume a life of its own.

I have seen this play all too painfully in my own backyard when Telangana split from Andhra Pradesh in 2014. I remember my delusional fellow Andhrites brushing it off as a fringe movement when it started a decade earlier and even making fun of the people of Telangana. The result is obvious to everyone. As Kamal Hassan said "Don't make an inclusive India and exclusive one. All will suffer because of such short-sighted folly".

Well said. At this point there are a lot of tensions in the Indian polity (like in any nation around the world).

Certain sections of South Indians see North Indians as illiterate boors and leaches
Certain sections of North Indians see South Indians as ugly weirdos speaking gobbledygook

Whether this turns into a deeper fissure and cause for conflicts will depend on the handling. A light hand with plenty of flexibility and effort to emphasise the commonalities versus a heavy hand and inflexibility.

One important fact is that both regions need each other to grow
The Cow belt gets massive cash infusions from the South and Coastal states like Gujarat and Maharashtra
These states in turn are heavily dependant on cheap labour from the North. Go to any construction site in any of the southern metropolis and you'll wonder which part of India you're in.

Besides this, the other advantage for India is that 75 years of Democracy offers natural safety valves to occasionally release pressure when it builds up. A protest against the national language or for local reservations doesn't result in army repression like it would in Pakistan or similar autocratic states. People do feel their voice are heard even if they're not fully heard. Also a lot of governance in India is at the local/state level which allows considerable leeway.

 

[rickroll]

Well said. At this point there are a lot of tensions in the Indian polity (like in any nation around the world).

Certain sections of South Indians see North Indians as illiterate boors and leaches
Certain sections of North Indians see South Indians as ugly weirdos speaking gobbledygook

Whether this turns into a deeper fissure and cause for conflicts will depend on the handling. A light hand with plenty of flexibility and effort to emphasise the commonalities versus a heavy hand and inflexibility.

One important fact is that both regions need each other to grow
The Cow belt gets massive cash infusions from the South and Coastal states like Gujarat and Maharashtra
These states in turn are heavily dependant on cheap labour from the North. Go to any construction site in any of the southern metropolis and you'll wonder which part of India you're in.

Besides this, the other advantage for India is that 75 years of Democracy offers natural safety valves to occasionally release pressure when it builds up. A protest against the national language or for local reservations doesn't result in army repression like it would in Pakistan or similar autocratic states. People do feel their voice are heard even if they're not fully heard. Also a lot of governance in India is at the local/state level which allows considerable leeway.

I am from the South, born and brought up, and I have spent my whole life here except for a few years abroad. Here's my perspective:

The mother language is central and deep to South Indians' identity. There has always been a vehement opposition to the imposition of Hindi on South Indians, it's historical, and undercuts political parties, be it from the Congress or the BJP. There is a certain undercurrent of hatred and alienation that has started in the Southern psyche due to the recent events of tinkering with the language status quo, unequal tax distribution, the Center's step-motherly treatment of the South, delimitation, etc. While a full cessation may be unthinkable at this moment, the signs of danger are certainly there.

I urge my North Indian friends to be very careful and not brush aside these issues. Make no mistake, we Southerners will never accept Hindi as the national language. We are too proud of our own languages and don't see the need for a national language at all. Mind you, even cessation is casually talked about in friends and family circles although not seriously. The other day I got a call from my bank's customer service and the person just started blabbering something in Hindi. I immediately schooled him that he should either start the conversation in the state language or ask me in English, which language is preferable to me. He knows damn well where my residence is and yet assumed that I can converse in Hindi. Instances like these are plenty and add to our frustration with North India. If these frustrations and feelings become stronger and deeper, they will reach critical mass and the movement can assume a life of its own.

I have seen this play all too painfully in my own backyard when Telangana split from Andhra Pradesh in 2014. I remember my delusional fellow Andhrites brushing it off as a fringe movement when it started a decade earlier and even making fun of the people of Telangana. The result is obvious to everyone. As Kamal Hassan said "Don't make an inclusive India and exclusive one. All will suffer because of such short-sighted folly".

Excellent posts and well put. I hope the North Indian verbal abuse trolls in this thread read these. But they generally never bother to read South Indian voices which is unfortunate for y'all.

Certain sections of North Indians see South Indians as ugly weirdos speaking gobbledygook -- @Red-Indian honestly, how common is this now? I have heard of similar things that happened in Pakistan towards Bengalis from my elderly relatives. I now have South Indian friends and friends from Bangladesh who are stand up genuine good people. I feel angered when I imagine the difficulty from their pov.

I urge my North Indian friends to be very careful and not brush aside these issues. -- @AutoCrat what typically happens when you raise this as a concern or point to a North Indian in real life conversations (assuming you had a chance to do that)? Is there any sense of empathy from them or do they brush you off or worse?

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Excellent posts and well put. I hope the North Indian verbal abuse trolls in this thread read these. But they generally never bother to read South Indian voices which is unfortunate for y'all.

Certain sections of North Indians see South Indians as ugly weirdos speaking gobbledygook -- @Red-Indian honestly, how common is this now? I have heard of similar things that happened in Pakistan towards Bengalis from my elderly relatives. I now have South Indian friends and friends from Bangladesh who are stand up genuine good people. I feel angered when I imagine the difficulty from their pov.

I urge my North Indian friends to be very careful and not brush aside these issues. -- @AutoCrat what typically happens when you raise this as a concern or point to a North Indian in real life conversations (assuming you had a chance to do that)? Is there any sense of empathy from them or do they brush you off or worse?

People who use derogatory racial slurs should tone down their pipe parades.

 

[AutoCrat]

I urge my North Indian friends to be very careful and not brush aside these issues. -- @AutoCrat what typically happens when you raise this as a concern or point to a North Indian in real life conversations (assuming you had a chance to do that)? Is there any sense of empathy from them or do they brush you off or worse?

I rarely bring this up with my North Indian colleagues or neighbors. In the rare occasions that this topic comes up, they appear mostly conciliatory and try to understand the issue, which gives me hope. Most of them in my experience are completely ignorant that Hindi is not our national language or that we don't even have one.

 

[rickroll]

I rarely bring this up with my North Indian colleagues or neighbors. In the rare occasions that this topic comes up, they appear mostly conciliatory and try to understand the issue, which gives me hope. Most of them in my experience are completely ignorant that Hindi is not our national language or that we don't even have one.

Yeah this is something I consistently hear many South Indians say. Interesting to hear this.

 

[rickroll]

Good video. Seems to be mostly in Hindi(not Urdu) but there are subtitles. This is an Indian video, and it hits and confirms all the points I have raised in this thread. The video is by a dude titled "Deshbhakt" but the blind North Indian abusers here (whom I have happily ignored) seem to bury their heads in sand and say none of these problems exist. Goddamn senseless people!

 

[rickroll]

I rarely bring this up with my North Indian colleagues or neighbors. In the rare occasions that this topic comes up, they appear mostly conciliatory and try to understand the issue, which gives me hope. Most of them in my experience are completely ignorant that Hindi is not our national language or that we don't even have one.

Voices from real people in Delhi about language imposition, is this real or fake?

 

[Red-Indian]

Excellent posts and well put. I hope the North Indian verbal abuse trolls in this thread read these. But they generally never bother to read South Indian voices which is unfortunate for y'all.

Certain sections of North Indians see South Indians as ugly weirdos speaking gobbledygook -- @Red-Indian honestly, how common is this now? I have heard of similar things that happened in Pakistan towards Bengalis from my elderly relatives. I now have South Indian friends and friends from Bangladesh who are stand up genuine good people. I feel angered when I imagine the difficulty from their pov.

I urge my North Indian friends to be very careful and not brush aside these issues. -- @AutoCrat what typically happens when you raise this as a concern or point to a North Indian in real life conversations (assuming you had a chance to do that)? Is there any sense of empathy from them or do they brush you off or worse?

I would say the tyranny of the majority is pretty common in most countries. Language imposition is a pretty typical variant of it.

India definitely doesn't want to go the way of Pakistan which has almost succeeded at suppressing regional languages even at the cost of giving up a piece of itself.

As of now, the Centre seems careful even if a bit misguided in it's imposition of Hindi as a common language. The most penalty a state like Tamil Nadu will face for not allowing Hindi to be taught is losing some of the Central education funds allocation. Small penalty for a state that already has a very high level of literacy. If they try to be more inflexible, they risk provoking a bigger conflict and I doubt they're stupid enough to do that. The BJP have hopes of establishing a beachhead in the South and going overboard on Hindi is a guaranteed way of giving the opposition a readymade election winner.

As far as facing colour and language based racism in the North is concerned, it's an undercurrent not anything in your face. There's too much intermingling for anything more than that.

 

[Hellion]

I'm very curious now, IF South India does secede years down the road ...

1. Which city will be the capital of South India? Chennai? Bangalore? Hyderabad (Deccan)? Some other new city as a neutral city? Would love to get hypothetical thoughts from Indians regarding this.

2. What can Pakistan do to establish and normalize good trade relations with this potential Republic of South India?

Balkanisation of Pakistan will happen far earlier than secession of South India so this question becomes somewhat redundant.

 

[rickroll]

Balkanisation of Pakistan will happen far earlier than secession of South India so this question becomes somewhat redundant.

Ever heard of the concept of mutual exclusivity?

 

[Hellion]

Ever heard of the concept of mutual exclusivity?

OK . As a South Indian myself, I'm not sure what a future of Republic of South India stands to gain specifically from Pakistan

We would still strive to have excellent relations with the Republic of North India and that would be a problem with the respect to Pakistan.

Unless Pakistan has something really significant to offer , I don't see it particularly profitable to have anything more than a cordial/ politically neutral relationship with Pakistan

 

[rickroll]

OK . As a South Indian myself, I'm not sure what a future of Republic of South India stands to gain specifically from Pakistan

We would still strive to have excellent relations with the Republic of North India and that would be a problem with the respect to Pakistan.

Unless Pakistan has something really significant to offer , I don't see it particularly profitable to have anything more than a cordial/ politically neutral relationship with Pakistan

Choice 1 - Large hostile country
Choice 2 - Medium size hostile country + cordial/neutral small-medium country.

Any of us would take choice 2, right? Pakistan would hands down welcome a cordial/neutral new South Asian country.

 

[Romali_rotti]

Hi all,

Can someone confirm if south India has split from rest of India yet?

Regards

A concerned South Indian.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Hi all,

Can someone confirm if south India has split from rest of India yet?

Regards

A concerned South Indian.

Split happened already bhai, it is the fake India media thats hiding the truth from the world.
A separate country called South India is already in existence.
Actually, there is no country called India anymore, there are 25+ countries in the sub continent now. I have to apply for multiple visas every week travelling through the sub continent.

 

[RexRex]

Good video. Seems to be mostly in Hindi(not Urdu) but there are subtitles. This is an Indian video, and it hits and confirms all the points I have raised in this thread. The video is by a dude titled "Deshbhakt" but the blind North Indian abusers here (whom I have happily ignored) seem to bury their heads in sand and say none of these problems exist. Goddamn senseless people!

This is an informative video, good points raised by the host.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

I would say the tyranny of the majority is pretty common in most countries. Language imposition is a pretty typical variant of it.

India definitely doesn't want to go the way of Pakistan which has almost succeeded at suppressing regional languages even at the cost of giving up a piece of itself.

As of now, the Centre seems careful even if a bit misguided in it's imposition of Hindi as a common language. The most penalty a state like Tamil Nadu will face for not allowing Hindi to be taught is losing some of the Central education funds allocation. Small penalty for a state that already has a very high level of literacy. If they try to be more inflexible, they risk provoking a bigger conflict and I doubt they're stupid enough to do that. The BJP have hopes of establishing a beachhead in the South and going overboard on Hindi is a guaranteed way of giving the opposition a readymade election winner.

As far as facing colour and language based racism in the North is concerned, it's an undercurrent not anything in your face. There's too much intermingling for anything more than that.

Pakistan cant even own up its cultural heritage of Punjabi and other native languages. People who degraded their own mother tongues in favor of a foreign language are preaching and "rolling" in this thread .

 

[Romali_rotti]

Split happened already bhai, it is the fake India media thats hiding the truth from the world.
A separate country called South India is already in existence.
Actually, there is no country called India anymore, there are 25+ countries in the sub continent now. I have to apply for multiple visas every week travelling through the sub continent.

I hope north India won't turn into a Pakistan after balochistan gets its independence from the Pakistani occupation

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

I hope north India won't turn into a Pakistan after balochistan gets its independence from the Pakistani occupation

We have nuttier regional fanatics in the past. These new social media warriors dont know about the past.

 

[rickroll]

I hope north India won't turn into a Pakistan after balochistan gets its independence from the Pakistani occupation

Yes I also concur that many of the Balochistan concerns are valid and right now given Pakistan's fragile economy this risk is pretty high.

But how is Balochistan even relevant to this thread though? Does Pakistan breaking up somehow prevent the North-South divide in India? Like I said above, these are mutually exclusive events so raising Pakistan's security issues, while seemingly valid, are not relevant to this thread?

 

[Birdman]

As a Tamizhilian, learning Hindhi is useless. To answer the question, "What will you do when you go to the North?" "I will learn if that situation arises." I would say 90% of the people in TN will not go north because they see it as this vast, lawless land. I studied in CBSE medium and was forced to take Hindhi as a third language, but I did not learn anything; I couldn't even recite the alphabet.
I am glad I learned English because it has helped me travel the world and be gainfully employed. As far as Tamizhl people are concerned, Hindhi and English are equally foreign languages to us, but learning English gives us a step up in life. Also, they equate Hindhi to pani puri and pan spitting (not a politically correct statement, but it is what it is)

Also, no offense, Hindhi, Sanscrit, Urudu, and Arabic all sound similar to me and are not pleasing to my ears.

 

[JaDed]

As a Tamizhilian, learning Hindhi is useless. To answer the question, "What will you do when you go to the North?" "I will learn if that situation arises." I would say 90% of the people in TN will not go north because they see it as this vast, lawless land. I studied in CBSE medium and was forced to take Hindhi as a third language, but I did not learn anything; I couldn't even recite the alphabet.
I am glad I learned English because it has helped me travel the world and be gainfully employed. As far as Tamizhl people are concerned, Hindhi and English are equally foreign languages to us, but learning English gives us a step up in life. Also, they equate Hindhi to pani puri and pan spitting (not a politically correct statement, but it is what it is)

Also, no offense, Hindhi, Sanscrit, Urudu, and Arabic all sound similar to me and are not pleasing to my ears.

Wth is Tamizhilian? Tamizhan is the word.

 

[rickroll]

As a Tamizhilian, learning Hindhi is useless. To answer the question, "What will you do when you go to the North?" "I will learn if that situation arises." I would say 90% of the people in TN will not go north because they see it as this vast, lawless land. I studied in CBSE medium and was forced to take Hindhi as a third language, but I did not learn anything; I couldn't even recite the alphabet.
I am glad I learned English because it has helped me travel the world and be gainfully employed. As far as Tamizhl people are concerned, Hindhi and English are equally foreign languages to us, but learning English gives us a step up in life. Also, they equate Hindhi to pani puri and pan spitting (not a politically correct statement, but it is what it is)

Also, no offense, Hindhi, Sanscrit, Urudu, and Arabic all sound similar to me and are not pleasing to my ears.

What is your response to the clueless North Indian trolls in this thread denying that this is even an issue for South Indians?

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

What is your response to the clueless North Indian trolls in this thread denying that this is even an issue for South Indians?

People from North India often mock South Indians, their eating habits, skin color, way of speaking, and, of course, their language. You won't find bigger racists than North Indians. Downplaying such issues is the beginning of something serious. Nice to see some South Indians have finally spoken up about this, which means the issue is real.

I am sure even people from South India are fed up with illiterate politicians running the country. In my opinion, whatever good image India has abroad is largely due to the contributions of South Indians.

 

[Birdman]

What is your response to the clueless North Indian trolls in this thread denying that this is even an issue for South Indians?

Just like the guy above who missed my entire post and decided to concentrate on a spelling mistake, they have no clue. This issue will only unite the people of TN under DMK and make them strong.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Your premises have no basis in reality.
Worry about Afghans taking back KPK
Baloch and Sindhis getting their freedom and
PoK rejoining India while China makes the rest of Pakistan its colony

I don't think you have thought this through. If all that transpired, do you think it would be healthy for India?

 

[ChennaiFan]

Just like the guy above who missed my entire post and decided to concentrate on a spelling mistake, they have no clue. This issue will only unite the people of TN under DMK and make them strong.

Here is an incident occurred involving my friend and a North Indian colleague. They were working late in a conference room when the colleague received a phone call. During the conversation, he stated, 'Yes, he's South Indian, but he's not like that.' This remark suggests how some north Indians hold stereotypical beliefs about South Indians. While we are not bothered, it does illustrate a concerning attitude.

Back to the topic, if learning three languages is so good, why are the Hindi belt states are so poor that they need helping hand from the southern states, Maharashtra, and Gujarat?

I, like many people in TN, am not against learning Hindi. We will learn it if there is a need. Also, we don't prevent any of children from learning Hindi. But, we don't want it imposed on us. This is not just about a language. It is about protecting our state's rights.

 

[rickroll]

Here is an incident occurred involving my friend and a North Indian colleague. They were working late in a conference room when the colleague received a phone call. During the conversation, he stated, 'Yes, he's South Indian, but he's not like that.' This remark suggests how some north Indians hold stereotypical beliefs about South Indians. While we are not bothered, it does illustrate a concerning attitude.

Back to the topic, if learning three languages is so good, why are the Hindi belt states are so poor that they need helping hand from the southern states, Maharashtra, and Gujarat?

I, like many people in TN, am not against learning Hindi. We will learn it if there is a need. Also, we don't prevent any of children from learning Hindi. But, we don't want it imposed on us. This is not just about a language. It is about protecting our state's rights.

How committed are your people about protecting your state's rights? How are you planing to have a befitting response to the North Indian trolls like we see in this thread that mock or deny or trivialize or deflect (usual Pakistan as bogeyman) issue?

What if the pleas of Tamil people continue to fall on deaf north indian ears? What will Tamil people do then? What constitutional reform or legal recourse do Tamil people have for their language especially after the Indian parliament's delimitation in 2026?

We all know what Tamil people in Sri Lanka had to resort to when the Sinhala language was imposed on them in the 70s and 80s.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Pakistani posters, this is the context :-

https://twitter.com/x/status/1901651307737575721

 

[Red-Indian]

How committed are your people about protecting your state's rights? How are you planing to have a befitting response to the North Indian trolls like we see in this thread that mock or deny or trivialize or deflect (usual Pakistan as bogeyman) issue?

What if the pleas of Tamil people continue to fall on deaf north indian ears? What will Tamil people do then? What constitutional reform or legal recourse do Tamil people have for their language especially after the Indian parliament's delimitation in 2026?

We all know what Tamil people in Sri Lanka had to resort to when the Sinhala language was imposed on them in the 70s and 80s.

I suppose the options open to Tamil Nadu and those of us who live in other southern/coastal states would be roughly analogous to the options open to California and other liberal states in the States given the behaviour of the rightist trolls especially on emotive issues like immigration and abortion rights where they mock and trivialise deeply held beliefs.

 

[rickroll]

I suppose the options open to Tamil Nadu and those of us who live in other southern/coastal states would be roughly analogous to the options open to California and other liberal states in the States given the behaviour of the rightist trolls especially on emotive issues like immigration and abortion rights where they mock and trivialise deeply held beliefs.

I think you are referring to the CalExit initiative. While this seems legally daunting, there is a paper process (as daunting or unrealistic as it may seem) for California to exit the union through a constitutional amendment. I think I added a government website link in this thread for this ballot measure (in 2026?).

There is also a dedicated website for CalExit - https://calexitnow.org/

Now all of this is the paper/legal process aiming constitutional changes. If that legal voice is suppressed or ignored, you can be guaranteed people in any part of the world will have to take up more drastic measures when they are pushed to a corner. History is rife with such examples.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Pakistani posters, this is the context :-

https://twitter.com/x/status/1901651307737575721

BJP Cell really needs to avoid the word "REGIME CHANGE". :

 

[rickroll]

Pakistani posters, this is the context :-

https://twitter.com/x/status/1901651307737575721

Man I had to convert everything in USD and make it a ratio of GDP per capita to understand the magnitude of these scams (and they seem pretty big scams!).

US median annual household income = $80K
India median annual household income = ~$322 ($27K INR)
1000 Crore INR = ~$115M USD

Ratio of scam amount per median Indian household income = $115M/$322 = 357,142
Equivalent scam amount in the US = 357,142 * $80,000 = $28.5 Billion

A $28.5B scam in the US would be national level (not just one state), in the range of Bernie Madoff scam ($65B) and it would be international headlines. It does not seem to be the case in India, which makes me wonder about the volume+intensity of corruption scams in India.

 

[rickroll]

Pakistani posters, this is the context :-

https://twitter.com/x/status/1901651307737575721

Now I'm not denying or mitigating these scams (see my above post). But at the same time, the scam does not take away the genuine concerns people in South India have ...

1. Imposition of language (I have seen countless Indian news channel videos about this now).
2. Taking away tax revenues
3. Reducing voting power through delimitation.

The above 3 are genuine issues. Given that at least some of your posts seem reasonable, please try to give me a genuine response here for my questions below. If you choose to troll or verbally abuse like that clueless "fire bending idiot" then I have no issues adding yet another person to my ignore list. But I am giving the benefit of doubt and requesting a genuine response from all North Indians to my 5 questions below.

1. For the issue #1 above, how would you feel if all Hindi speakers (picture your friends and family to make it relatable) are forced to learn Tamil but Tamil speakers are not forced to learn Hindi? Your three language policy not explicitly mentioning Hindi is a straw man argument and we all know that, don't we? If a school in South India has 40 kids in class and if these 40 kids pick 10 languages as 3rd language choice, then do most schools (especially in 3rd world) have that many teaching resources? What will realistically happen here? The language with most resources (Hindi thanks to Indian central govt spending on it) will be the most obvious choice.

2. Also on #1, do you honestly see the masses in UP/Bihar/Rajasthan/MP etc choose a South Indian language as their third language? I see many articles and interviews where most of them choose Sanskrit as their third language, which is now a slap in the face of South Indians who are forced to learn Hindi. How is this fair in practice?

3. Issue #3 from above. Delimitation proposed by North Indian states seems to be cloaked under a simplistic narrative of one person one vote to get passionate support from those masses and to also mislead South Indian protests. There are many documented flaws with the one person one vote and the resulting rule of majority captured in multiple legal journals. Please look these up (I have provided some in this very thread).

4. Also issue #3, I believe the original consensus of using your 1971 census for 50 years was the core assumption that all states will reduce their population. Now the South Indian states have walked the talk and reduced their TFR (Kerala and Tamil Nadu below 2.0) while the North Indian Hindi states never executed this plan and continue to breed like rats with their TFR above 3.0. So, is your delimitation now aiming to penalize your well performing states with less political power and reward your poorly run states with more political power?

5. Your own fellow Indian (South Indian) posters here have confirmed all of my points and have also confirmed the persistent inherent biases North Indians have towards them. What is your response to them? Are they somehow in cahoots with Pakistanis now by stating their genuine grievances?

To the North Indians here saying "what do Pakistanis know" - Not all Pakistanis or Pakistani origin people raise Indian issues at surface level. Some of us are very well read, have many Indian friends, follow global economic+legal trends, and probably exhibit more knowledge about your own country than you do.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Man I had to convert everything in USD and make it a ratio of GDP per capita to understand the magnitude of these scams (and they seem pretty big scams!).

US median annual household income = $80K
India median annual household income = ~$322 ($27K INR)
1000 Crore INR = ~$115M USD

Ratio of scam amount per median Indian household income = $115M/$322 = 357,142
Equivalent scam amount in the US = 357,142 * $80,000 = $28.5 Billion

A $28.5B scam in the US would be national level (not just one state), in the range of Bernie Madoff scam ($65B) and it would be international headlines. It does not seem to be the case in India, which makes me wonder about the volume+intensity of corruption scams in India.

Are you using internet explorer for extra outdated data?

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

Pakistani posters, this is the context :-

https://twitter.com/x/status/1901651307737575721

Nice predictable pattern there.

 

[rpant_gabba]

People from North India often mock South Indians, their eating habits, skin color, way of speaking, and, of course, their language. You won't find bigger racists than North Indians. Downplaying such issues is the beginning of something serious. Nice to see some South Indians have finally spoken up about this, which means the issue is real.

DMKs has rioted over language issues for decades ago. convenient issue to rile up the the clueless goosn

I am sure even people from South India are fed up with illiterate politicians running the country. In my opinion, whatever good image India has abroad is largely due to the contributions of South Indians.

Except DMK would like to get rid of the community which makes those large contributions.

DMK spokesperson supports Periyar’s call for 'killing Brahmins'; Subramanian Swamy moves EC

Subramanian Swamy has moved ECI seeking derecognition of the DMK as a political party

www.deccanherald.com

BTW, keeping the in the spirit of this how about you spout you **** brained "fake indian" idiocy in English and not hindi.

 

[rickroll]

DMKs has rioted over language issues for decades ago. convenient issue to rile up the the clueless goosn

Except DMK would like to get rid of the community which makes those large contributions.

DMK spokesperson supports Periyar’s call for 'killing Brahmins'; Subramanian Swamy moves EC

Subramanian Swamy has moved ECI seeking derecognition of the DMK as a political party

www.deccanherald.com

BTW, keeping the in the spirit of this how about you spout you **** brained "fake indian" idiocy in English and not hindi.

Who cares what DMK/ADMK/Congress/BJP do or their motives in South India. The focus should be on the issue/message and not the political party/messenger ... in simpler words focus on the message and not the messenger as long as the message has merit.

NOW - are you denying the concerns expressed by South Indians in this thread and are you saying that these concerns are not valid?

 

[rpant_gabba]

Who cares what DMK/ADMK/Congress/BJP do or their motives in South India. The focus should be on the issue/message and not the political party/messenger ... in simpler words focus on the message and not the messenger as long as the message has merit.

Of course it does. Thats why I made the Robert clive reference

If someone says arsenic and aspirin has side affects and they should treated the same, I question their motive or intelligence.
bit like RFK with vaccines

NOW - are you denying the concerns expressed by South Indians in this thread and are you saying that these concerns are not valid?

Yup. Becos I was around in south india when the same issues were hot topic decades ago and current CM's father played the same cards

 

[rickroll]

Of course it does. Thats why I made the Robert clive reference

If someone says arsenic and aspirin has side affects and they should treated the same, I question their motive or intelligence.
bit like RFK with vaccines

Yup. Becos I was around in south india when the same issues were hot topic decades ago and current CM's father played the same cards

Not an apples-apples comparison though. The prior language issues in South India were only language issues. Now there are three issues all combined -- language, South Indian tax revenues diverted to North India, and delimitation. What you probably saw in South India was only language (one out of the three). Now the issue is more serious because there are tangible threats to them becoming second class citizens and their tax revenues also being taken away on top of the language issue?

Even with language issues, the hypocrisy from North Indians seems surprising (similar to right wing Trumper whites being racist to even legal immigrants when they themselves were immigrants). Assuming your language is Hindi, how would you feel if you are forced to learn Tamil/Malayalam/Telugu/Kannada while those people are not at all forced to learn Hindi? Don't you think it is unfair to them as well?

I have asked the above bolded question to north Indians multiple times in this thread. I have not received a direct response even once ... NOT-EVEN-ONCE in this thread. Put yourself in the other peoples' shoes and tell me if this is fair to them?

 

[Cricket Warrior]

Guys calm down.. no more trolling or pesonal attacks just stick to the topic or leave this thread

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

MNS workers beat up shopkeeper for speaking in hindi in Navi Mumbai. And this was few months ago.

Here is the latest case. MNS workers in Mumbai beat up two individuals for speaking in Hindi.

Aise banega hindu rashtra? @Rajdeep @Devadwal

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Pakistani posters, this is the context :-

https://twitter.com/x/status/1901651307737575721

We have seen it in Pakistan. Invent fake cases and then regime change.

 

[Champ_Pal]

MNS workers beat up shopkeeper for speaking in hindi in Navi Mumbai. And this was few months ago.

Here is the latest case. MNS workers in Mumbai beat up two individuals for speaking in Hindi.

Aise banega hindu rashtra? @Rajdeep @Devadwal

MNS are goons and thugs. They do all these street goondagiri to show how powerful they are. Everyone of them must be in prison.

 

[Champ_Pal]

All these South Indian political parties like DMK are nothing but a bunch of scoundrels and rascals. They have looted the people for decades all the while feeding them the fake Tamil language in danger lies.

The disease has spread to Karnataka too. Too many jobless morons feel empowered and find a new purpose in life by bashing immigrants from other states.

 

[ChennaiFan]

All these South Indian political parties like DMK are nothing but a bunch of scoundrels and rascals. They have looted the people for decades all the while feeding them the fake Tamil language in danger lies.

The disease has spread to Karnataka too. Too many jobless morons feel empowered and find a new purpose in life by bashing immigrants from other states.

DMK a bunch of scoundrels and rascals ? - They may be and could be.
All the south Indian political parties are like that? - That is stretching too far.

Majority of us in Tamil Nadu are not worried that Tamil is in danger. It is for the politicians to use it as tool to create fear. Negativity attracts more. Our issue is about our rights, sovereignty of the state. We don't want to be told what should we learn. The central government has no business in imposing hindi on us. There are many people who learn hindi here and we are good with it.

Go and and impose a south Indian language on the people in northern states like UP, MP, Bihar and see how they react. And you will see the true colors of the political parties there. We are a peaceful state and it should not be taken as our weakness.

 

[Champ_Pal]

DMK a bunch of scoundrels and rascals ? - They may be and could be.
All the south Indian political parties are like that? - That is stretching too far.

Majority of us in Tamil Nadu are not worried that Tamil is in danger. It is for the politicians to use it as tool to create fear. Negativity attracts more. Our issue is about our rights, sovereignty of the state. We don't want to be told what should we learn. The central government has no business in imposing hindi on us. There are many people who learn hindi here and we are good with it.

Go and and impose a south Indian language on the people in northern states like UP, MP, Bihar and see how they react. And you will see the true colors of the political parties there. We are a peaceful state and it should not be taken as our weakness.

No one should enforce any language on others. It should be left to the child and his/her parents to decide if Hindi or Punjabi or Gujrati can be learned at school.

I was specifically talking about thugs on the streets trying to enforce Tamil or Kannada on unsuspecting North Indians or even a fellow south indian who does not speak the language.