How do you rate the PSL scouts?

[Major]

While i dont watch IPL, still i always love the fact that Rajistan Royals had some crazy scouts that would find some crazy unknown player who was good enough to get attention. Guys like Kamran, Pravin Tambe etc.

Now, I look at PSL and than I look at the fact that players like Sahibzada Farhan are scoring runs and yet no PSL drafted him in their team. Ihsanullah is said to be still bowling fast and he is also without any team.

It seems like, PSL teams hire data analyst and think these are scouts aswell. Data analyst have a different job and can only judge players based on the data set available.

Alot of our players play in club cricket which has no data available as those scores are not stored in any database. This is where scouts come into action and unearth players. For this, you dont schedule but watch club games and ask around about players.

How do you guys rate PSL scouts? I rate them as garbage.

.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

It's not been so bad. Shadab Khan and Haris Rauf are PSL products aren't they? There has also been some good international players that weren't big names. Even unconventional players like Usman Tariq were picked up in PSL.

 

[Major]

It's not been so bad. Shadab Khan and Haris Rauf are PSL products aren't they? There has also been some good international players that weren't big names. Even unconventional players like Usman Tariq were picked up in PSL.

But Shadab Khan was selected from a TV match. THere was a Pakistan cup where he did well and got attention.

Haris Rauf, fair enough. But than Rauf was selected based on a speed net, not on the basis of club performance.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

But Shadab Khan was selected from a TV match. THere was a Pakistan cup where he did well and got attention.

Haris Rauf, fair enough. But than Rauf was selected based on a speed net, not on the basis of club performance.

If they hold camps and trials is there a need to watch club cricket?

Btw I don't know if they are good or bad - not arguing just curious.

 

[zn426]

Well it comes down to what you prioritize as bench marks right?
I'm no scouting expert but if I was a PSL scout I'd probably look at the following criteria for batting:

Range of shots on the wagon wheel
dot ball %
fitness test results such as yo-yo, etc
average distance traveled per hit
gym testing like bench press, wrist flexibility

bowling:
length percentages (short, full, yorker, etc)
strike rate
yorker success % for death bowling
economy at the death
average with the new ball in one-day/tests
average speed in 1st over
average speed in final over

I'm no expert at all, these are just what I can come up with without knowing a single scouting test.

 

[Savak]

PSL needs two new teams to accomodate more players.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

PSL needs two new teams to accomodate more players.

Have any of the PSL franchises hit break even yet?

 

[Josh]

PSL needs two new teams to accomodate more players.

Might lower the quality of games

 

[topspin]

PSL needs two new teams to accomodate more players.

No they don't, it'll just dilute the talent pool. The standard of players are already bad as it is.

 

[Major]

If they hold camps and trials is there a need to watch club cricket?

Btw I don't know if they are good or bad - not arguing just curious.

There is. Because in trial nets what happens is that you just watch a net sesssion. Playing a game and playing a net session are two different things.

In a net session you can maybe judge a bowler, but batters do not get identified.

Batters are identified through a proper match. And sometimes, some bowlers who arnt pacy are also figured from a match. Like Abbas.

One of the reasons why Sadaf Hussain never played for pakistan under Waqar Younis coaching stint was because in the net he was slow paced bowler. But in the matches of Quaid E Azam he was taking 5vers in almost every game.


Club cricket stats are not stored in the database, which is why alot of players just leak out

 

[Major]

At the same time, i would want to know more about how IPL scouts operate as well as scouting is an area that is not much talked about here, so would like Indian posters to chip into this.

 

[The Bald Eagle]

Shadab Khan and Hasan Ali have been the notable picks....one has already regressed into oblivion

 

[The Bald Eagle]

We had Umer Khan and Mohammad Ashghar as spinners from KK and PX respectively. Just ruined their careers.

 

[Savak]

Have any of the PSL franchises hit break even yet?

Probably the low cost teams like Quetta, Peshawar, Islamabad United.

The present PSL Financial model does not encourage the PSL Franchises to invest heavy resources to operate like a proper business 24/7 especially for the high cost PSL Franchises like Karachi, Lahore, Multan.

Latest reports coming out are that the PCB is demanding $10 million per annum in Franchise Fees for the two new teams and there are many overseas Pakistani's in the US, Europe who are willing to fork the amount. But the problem is that the Franchises have to be able to recoup their expenses and i doubt the current state of the Pakistani economy allows a Franchise to achieve even their annuals fees in return.

The PCB could decide to do away with the Franchise Fees and in exchange take a greater share of the revenue pool as their compensation but will this help the Franchises lower their costs and achieve greater returns?

 

[Savak]

Might lower the quality of games

It hasn't lowered IPL's quality.

The PSL is perhaps the only major private sector tournament where all the stakeholders are pooling in maximum resources and where foreign players are getting included. Two new teams means more opportunities for domestic talent, more foreign players, greater eye balls, more competition for playoffs which means games have more value and the PCB can also ask for a better broadcast deal.

 

[zarak]

I think PSL scouts are good. Muqeem was scouted through PSL. Ihsanullah before his breakthrough season was scouted by Zalmi. Saim Ayub first played for Quetta was also an unknown commodity although he had an okay youth record. PSL always gives 1-2 players that are outisde the system. Issue is that our players do not evolve they stay at their baseline talent and then get figured out.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

It hasn't lowered IPL's quality.

The PSL is perhaps the only major private sector tournament where all the stakeholders are pooling in maximum resources and where foreign players are getting included. Two new teams means more opportunities for domestic talent, more foreign players, greater eye balls, more competition for playoffs which means games have more value and the PCB can also ask for a better broadcast deal.

IT did bhai, when they increased the number of teams. I remember all the scams about Kochi tuskers and some other team too. Expansion of teams is never easy even for mature leagues.

 

[charlie007]

If they hold camps and trials is there a need to watch club cricket?

Btw I don't know if they are good or bad - not arguing just curious.

There is always a need to watch competitive cricket and make decisions from there. I know of way too many players that look like a Tendulkar and Zaheer Khan in nets but go missing in competitive games.
Pressure and real life cricket makes people do weird things that are not apparent in non-competitive or net scenarios.

 

[charlie007]

Scouting should be made performance based. If you recommend one player and he ends up representing the national team for 5 matches, you get a bonus of 20000 PKR, if 2 of your selections make it to 5 games, you get 50000 PKR bonus, and 90k for the third. I don’t know if 20k PKR is a good amount but make it sufficient for them to ignore parchis.
Put a monetary incentive to pick players on merit. This way scouts will be more inclined to work and not be swayed by other interests (sifarish).

 

[zarak]

Scouting should be made performance based. If you recommend one player and he ends up representing the national team for 5 matches, you get a bonus of 20000 PKR, if 2 of your selections make it to 5 games, you get 50000 PKR bonus, and 90k for the third. I don’t know if 20k PKR is a good amount but make it sufficient for them to ignore parchis.
Put a monetary incentive to pick players on merit. This way scouts will be more inclined to work and not be swayed by other interests (sifarish).

Yeah in Pakistan some selector will end up having backdoor links to scouts and split the profit

 

[charlie007]

Yeah in Pakistan some selector will end up having backdoor links to scouts and split the profit

Well, if the foundation itself is bad, you can’t build a tall building on it. My assumption was that people will be honest with themselves at least if they benefited from it.

 

[Major]

I think PSL scouts are good. Muqeem was scouted through PSL. Ihsanullah before his breakthrough season was scouted by Zalmi. Saim Ayub first played for Quetta was also an unknown commodity although he had an okay youth record. PSL always gives 1-2 players that are outisde the system. Issue is that our players do not evolve they stay at their baseline talent and then get figured out.

nope, Ayub and alot of our batters were from the u19. Ayub wasnt unknown

I think our batting scouting has failed.

 

[Major]

At the same time, i would want to know more about how IPL scouts operate as well as scouting is an area that is not much talked about here, so would like Indian posters to chip into this.

@Tera Gawaandi @Smbhayi @jnaveen1980 @Vikram1989

 

[charlie007]

@Tera Gawaandi @Smbhayi @jnaveen1980 @Vikram1989

Not among the people quoted but for what it’s worth, here’s an article on IPL scouting:

The 5Ws and 1H of IPL Scouting: How the Teams Unearth Talent for Cash-rich T20 League - News18

Indian Premier League teams don't just splurge big on unknown entities at auctions; It takes months of careful scouting through the length & breadth of the country.

www.news18.com

 

[Vikram1989]

@Tera Gawaandi @Smbhayi @jnaveen1980 @Vikram1989

John Wright as a head of MI scouting team watched all kind of domestic Mumbai matches and picked bumrah.ponting approved bumrah's big inswinger and picked him .basically scouts will do a donkeys job of a honest selector.Rcb will use AI also for stats filtering and other criteria. Few of the ex franchise players acting as state coaches will look out for few categories. Irfan pathan takes care of kashmir domestic team.

The below one compares the effort of lahore who got the best squad from zeroes.

Domestic scouting in the IPL

Creating success in a cost and time efficient way

danweston.substack.com

This is from rcb scouting head

The art of IPL scouting

Once the domestic season starts, we are always on the road, says Malolan Rangarajan

www.deccanherald.com

 

[Major]

John Wright as a head of MI scouting team watched all kind of domestic Mumbai matches and picked bumrah.ponting approved bumrah's big inswinger and picked him .basically scouts will do a donkeys job of a honest selector.Rcb will use AI also for stats filtering and other criteria. Few of the ex franchise players acting as state coaches will look out for few categories. Irfan pathan takes care of kashmir domestic team.

The below one compares the effort of lahore who got the best squad from zeroes.

Domestic scouting in the IPL

Creating success in a cost and time efficient way

danweston.substack.com

This is from rcb scouting head

The art of IPL scouting

Once the domestic season starts, we are always on the road, says Malolan Rangarajan

www.deccanherald.com

thank you for this.

RCB tends to pick big players if I am not wrong.

What insight do you have on Rajistan scouts? How do they pick unknown entities

 

[Major]

Not among the people quoted but for what it’s worth, here’s an article on IPL scouting:

The 5Ws and 1H of IPL Scouting: How the Teams Unearth Talent for Cash-rich T20 League - News18

Indian Premier League teams don't just splurge big on unknown entities at auctions; It takes months of careful scouting through the length & breadth of the country.

www.news18.com

thanks man appreciated. The IPL scouting is itself a case study.

You can see from the responses by Pakistani posters, they dont know what scouting really is.

 

[Mamoon]

There is zero talent in Pakistan so no point in blaming the scouts.

 

[Major]

There is zero talent in Pakistan so no point in blaming the scouts.

Are there scouts in Pakistan? Thats the question.

Based on the Sahibzada Farhan fiasco, what i believe is happening is that any player that does well on a TV match and catches the attention of some player or management gets drafted. Or else alot of these players are lost in the system.

If you look at some of the drafts, alot of the players for emerging category were picked on the basis of videos available. No one really went to the matches to check out these players.

 

[Vikram1989]

thank you for this.

RCB tends to pick big players if I am not wrong.

What insight do you have on Rajistan scouts? How do they pick unknown entities

Rajastan is all about that moneyball movie style.pick the players who worth your value for that specific period. They will pick the honest ,hardworking, selfless youngsters with promise. All the recent set Samson, Jaiswal, jurel , suyavanshi etc are going to stay with Indian team for a long time and they brought every one at cheapest price.infact jaiswal did nothing in his first 2 seasons after a stellar u 19 wc.But he improved himself by putting a lot of effort in the gym.Same goes for jurel.he practiced batting /keeping atleast for 4 hours on a madeup spin pitch in rr facilities and won the test match against eng.he is the all format Indian team wk back up.

 

[Major]

Rajastan is all about that moneyball movie style.pick the players who worth your value for that specific period. They will pick the honest ,hardworking, selfless youngsters with promise. All the recent set Samson, Jaiswal, jurel , suyavanshi etc are going to stay with Indian team for a long time and they brought every one at cheapest price.infact jaiswal did nothing in his first 2 seasons after a stellar u 19 wc.But he improved himself by putting a lot of effort in the gym.Same goes for jurel.he practiced batting /keeping atleast for 4 hours on a madeup spin pitch in rr facilities and won the test match against eng.he is the all format Indian team wk back up.

Yeh. I was alwyas impressed by RRs scouting.

From Sohail Tanvir to Racindra Jadeja to Kamran Khan and Pravin Tambe.

 

[giri26]

Yeh. I was alwyas impressed by RRs scouting.

From Sohail Tanvir to Racindra Jadeja to Kamran Khan and Pravin Tambe.

Even Riyan Parag. They backed him for years when everyone was questioning his inclusion and now we can see his performances for the franchise and for his domestic side. RR has always been this franchise who picked obscure players and gave them long run.

 

[AamchiMumbaikar]

MI scouting is the best followed by kkr.

Rr and lsg are decent.

MI keeps looking for players throughout off season, attends all kinds of leagues, opens and domestic matches. They picked a player from kerala, who did not even get a chance in domestic so far, he was their best bowler in match 1

 

[Smbhayi]

@Tera Gawaandi @Smbhayi @jnaveen1980 @Vikram1989

Don't have any clue about that but I think they do checks local club tournament.. for eg Vignesh Puthur is unearthed by MI in some local club match here in Kerala and groomed him by having him as a net bowler for sa20..

Scouted, sharpened, spotlighted: Vignesh Puthur steps up

 

[Kianig89]

Well PSL focus is more on Data Analysis ,Trial Camps referrals & networking from ex-players/mentors , though with the pattern franchises pick players it seems agents like Saya Corp. , Yazoo Group act as Scouts.

 

[Major]

Well PSL focus is more on Data Analysis ,Trial Camps referrals & networking from ex-players/mentors , though with the pattern franchises pick players it seems agents like Saya Corp. , Yazoo Group act as Scouts.

Those are player agents, not scouts

 

[Major]

MI scouting is the best followed by kkr.

Rr and lsg are decent.

MI keeps looking for players throughout off season, attends all kinds of leagues, opens and domestic matches. They picked a player from kerala, who did not even get a chance in domestic so far, he was their best bowler in match 1

Share more details. So who are the scouts of MI, and any insight on how they do scouting? Like is it club based or domestic based?

And also why KKR ?

 

[jnaveen1980]

Scouting shouldn't have restriction

Who is Vignesh Puthur? Auto rickshaw driver's son is MI's scouting gem for IPL 2025​

MSN

 

[Vikram1989]

Scouting shouldn't have restriction

Who is Vignesh Puthur? Auto rickshaw driver's son is MI's scouting gem for IPL 2025​

MSN

Definitely they have spent more on his development than his brought up price. They sent him to sa and got training from rashid khan .zealous fans will say ipl is paid vacation but you can see the level of effort by franchises.Its all economics for them.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Definitely they have spent more on his development than his brought up price. They sent him to sa and got training from rashid khan .zealous fans will say ipl is paid vacation but you can see the level of effort by franchises.Its all economics for them.

DC - vipraj nigam (allrounder)
Lsg - digvesh ( spinner)
Pbks - priyansh arya (bat )

Few more.

 

[AMSS]

John Wright as a head of MI scouting team watched all kind of domestic Mumbai matches and picked bumrah.

Lmao, Boom was playing FC cricket for Gujarat before his IPL debut. How did John Wright pick him from Mumbai domestic?

 

[Vikram1989]

Lmao, Boom was playing FC cricket for Gujarat before his IPL debut. How did John Wright pick him from Mumbai domestic?

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/jasprit-bumrah-revels-on-big-stage-628234.

Wright picking up is correct but its from syed mustaq ali (domestic t20 leagues) tournament league stage.Bumrah played first class match in oct 2013 where as he played ipl in 2013 may.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Lmao, Boom was playing FC cricket for Gujarat before his IPL debut. How did John Wright pick him from Mumbai domestic?

Bumrah was scouted by John wright. It is well known. But for scouting he was never going to play for India. Nobody heard about Bumrah when he was playing his first match.

 

[Varun]

Well their job isn't too hard because:

1. Pakistan mein bohut talent hain.
2. You shake a tree in Pakistan and 2-3 fast bowlers will fall out.

 

[AMSS]

Bumrah was scouted by John wright. It is well known. But for scouting he was never going to play for India. Nobody heard about Bumrah when he was playing his first match.

And Sangakkara scouted Jaiswal for Royals even though he was playing for Mumbai. Also well known.

 

[BouncerGuy]

STAY ON TOPIC. THREAD IS ABOUT PSL (NOT IPL)

NO IRRELEVANT POSTS

 

[Major]

Well their job isn't too hard because:

1. Pakistan mein bohut talent hain.
2. You shake a tree in Pakistan and 2-3 fast bowlers will fall out.

Interms of pacers, Pakistan does churn out 1 or 2 rawbpacers per year.

But its the batting area where we have sucked cause we dont scout batters at all

 

[mominsaigol]

Interms of pacers, Pakistan does churn out 1 or 2 rawbpacers per year.

But its the batting area where we have sucked cause we dont scout batters at all

How do you scout a batter? A pace bowler can be scouted based of raw pace and hence you can scout that and develop him into a world class line and length swing bowler.

How do you scout a batsmen which is entirely technique dependent? Unless you're talking about gauging reaction times?

 

[charlie007]

How do you scout a batter? A pace bowler can be scouted based of raw pace and hence you can scout that and develop him into a world class line and length swing bowler.

How do you scout a batsmen which is entirely technique dependent? Unless you're talking about gauging reaction times?

Nothing succeeds like success. You just have to gauge the runs a batter scores across several matches and check his scores. Too much emphasis on technique may not always result in unearthing good talent and performers. Case in point: Sehwag vs Yasir Hameed - one flamboyant and result oriented, other too focused on technique and not producing results. But it’s not black and white, it just has to be on a case by case basis.
But in the end results must matter more than anything else.

 

[Major]

How do you scout a batter? A pace bowler can be scouted based of raw pace and hence you can scout that and develop him into a world class line and length swing bowler.

How do you scout a batsmen which is entirely technique dependent? Unless you're talking about gauging reaction times?

By watching club matches. Players way of approaching the game.

A standard that is followed in pakistani club matches is that how many centuries did the person scored on paper.

No one watches games and every player is judged on 100s

 

[mominsaigol]

Nothing succeeds like success. You just have to gauge the runs a batter scores across several matches and check his scores. Too much emphasis on technique may not always result in unearthing good talent and performers. Case in point: Sehwag vs Yasir Hameed - one flamboyant and result oriented, other too focused on technique and not producing results. But it’s not black and white, it just has to be on a case by case basis.
But in the end results must matter more than anything else.

Sehwag having a weird stance doesn't mean he was poor in technique and shot selections lol

 

[jnaveen1980]

Under-19 is an indicator. If your U19 is not good that means your school cricket is not good.

 

[charlie007]

Sehwag having a weird stance doesn't mean he was poor in technique and shot selections lol

He was all hand eye coordination versus pace, no foot movement. He was great against spin and all aggressive against the spinners and used his feet but against pacers he just stood and delivered. I have watched him live and always wondered how just standing at one place he flayed the bowling. Great batter in non swinging conditions but really got exposed when his feet movement or lack thereof left him nonplussed in places like England.

 

[Vikram1989]

Under-19 is an indicator. If your U19 is not good that means your school cricket is not good.

I don't think pak u 19 team is good in past decade (barring few good players) apart from last tournament team.one more big issue is that age fudging is rampant.

 

[jnaveen1980]

I don't think pak u 19 team is good in past decade (barring few good players) apart from last tournament team.one more big issue is that age fudging is rampant.

Yea..Nobody stands out. Shaheen is the only one i can think of. In terms of batting guys like Imam, Abdullah didn't flourish in these shorter formats as much as they expect.

 

[Energy]

Sohail Akhtar was Lahore Qalandars captain. Somebody scouted him for that role. That scout is now coaching Pakistan's main team.

 

[Major]

Sohail Akhtar was Lahore Qalandars captain. Somebody scouted him for that role. That scout is now coaching Pakistan's main team.

So Aqib is a good scout but a bad coach

 

[Major]

Under-19 is an indicator. If your U19 is not good that means your school cricket is not good.

Nope.

First of pakistan has no school cricket.

Second, u19 cricket is all based on net selection. Plus there alot of players that dont play u19 but dont get noticed

 

[charlie007]

thanks man appreciated. The IPL scouting is itself a case study.

You can see from the responses by Pakistani posters, they dont know what scouting really is.

@Major you might find this interesting…

Decoding Mumbai Indians' talent scouting for IPL

Mumbai Indians, the five-time IPL champions, have a robust scouting system that unearths hidden gems from across the country.

m.rediff.com

 

[Hellion]

Interms of pacers, Pakistan does churn out 1 or 2 rawbpacers per year.

But its the batting area where we have sucked cause we dont scout batters at all

I can't think of any batter who was scouted from outside the system in IPL. At least not in recent years. All the batters have played Ranji, VH or at least SMAT/ India under 19 etc.

So I'm not sure what you mean by scouting batters. Maybe other Indian posters can correct me when it comes to this.

It's usually only bowlers who are likely to come from outside the system

 

[jnaveen1980]

I can't think of any batter who was scouted from outside the system in IPL. At least not in recent years. All the batters have played Ranji, VH or at least SMAT/ India under 19 etc.

So I'm not sure what you mean by scouting batters. Maybe other Indian posters can correct me when it comes to this.

It's usually only bowlers who are likely to come from outside the system

All T20 batsmen are from IPL. SKY, Rinku, Dube, Abhishek, Samson, TIlak. Abhishek a middle order bowling all rounder in un10 world cup. Tilak no.4 batsman in u19 world cup. Rinku became famous after that one innings in IPL. Samson outside IPL is nothing. Poor list A records. Dube until he reinvented himself with CSK was tried and tested failure. Ruturaj is another guy. But guys like Gill, Jaiswal, Iyer, Sarfraz khan are not playing because of IPL.