How is it that a half-fit Shannon Gabriel can run through England, yet the hyped Shah duo can't?

[HappyWarsFan]

I am getting a bit tired of this pace attack, especially the Shahs, getting crazy levels of hype. And even after their performances, everyone is saying 'they are young, they need backing'.

This is TEST cricket. You cannot throw such youngsters in, with no experience, and expect immediate returns. And this isn't a playground to develop youngsters.

They have absolutely no bowling intelligence or understanding of how to setup a batsman. They have no clue how to mix up their bowling and make it difficult to negotiate.

It is ridiculous to call them world-class talent and act like it is a given.

We have suffered enough embrassments with this pace attack. Conceding 500 plus TWICE vs Aussies and then in England, conceding it again, and gifting Warner a triple ton and nearly giving a nobody like Crawley one.

They have averaged over 50 with the ball, in England, where a pacer is supposed to find it easy to bowl, with a swinging Dukes ball.

Compared to Windies, our pace attack has been far, far worse. As soon as the ball gets old, we look clueless with the ball.

Even in 2016, with the likes of Wahab, Rahat, Sohail we were taking much more wickets.

Sorry guys, but even for youngsters, these returns have been horrid. Only one of them should play at a time. Enough of the embrassments.

 

[sweep_shot]

West Indies currently have a scary fast bowling attack. But, they are still mediocre because of their below-average batting and ordinary spin attack.

West Indian fast bowling attack is superior to Pakistani attack. No doubt.

 

[Syed1]

First off Nasim Shah has no business playing test cricket. Heck I won't even play him in one dayers. T20s max.


This is Pakistani dehati mentality that a kid fresh from the block will run up and dismiss accomplished batsmen like Root and Buttler just on the basis of pace. I'm sure flop coach like Waqar was behind his selection. No hope of smart team selections while people like Misbah and Waqar are there.

 

[Major]

West indies plays different style of cricket. They bowl short and use pace well.
Their bowling is under rated. They suck as batting unit though.

Naseem isnt ready yet. Pakistan due to being a weak batting team also ends up playing one bowler short that affects them.

Had pakistan played sohail khan and shadab instead of fawad alam/shafiq and naseem, results could had been abit different.

 

[FreePalestine]

I thought they may play Shinwari in the third test instead of Shah. The talent was visible in the first test in the first innings and in the first half of the second innings. We should have won that test match, but they lost the crucial session. This means that maybe they can learn and improve. Lots of positives from the firs test.

I think Wahab and co, who someone mentioned above, also conceded big runs. Didn’t Root score a double ton against them? No Pakistani bowlers have performed consistently well in Australia since Asif and Akram before him. Even Waqar, Akhtar, Amir (v. 1 and v. 2) struggled in Australia. Also worth noting that Amir averaged in the 40’s in his first seven tests.

They have had a bad test match on a slow wicket, and one bad crucial session in the first test.

Shaheen has improved a lot. He is swinging it back in more. But needs to balance his skill set better. I still think he has potential.

Naseem Shah, I kind of agree, has been mismanaged. How can you play a bowler in a test match when you don’t intend to bowl him much? Doesn’t this unnecessarily increase the workload on the other bowlers? He can learn how to bowl in a few seasons of domestic cricket surely? Abbas plied his trade there for years before he got a chance!

 

[Titan24]

Basic FC experience is very under rated in Pakistan but makes a huge difference. Our two Shah's are learning the basics at test level, while Shanon Gabriel already knows the art of test bowling.

 

[Savak]

Shanon Gabriel did squat after the first test. England were rusty and undercooked but have been on their A game since then. The WI series was good preparation against Pakistan.

 

[Buffet]

It's their lack of experience otherwise Pakistan would have won the first test after having Eng 120/5 while chasing 275 runs. It happens and you can't blame them. Pakistan had a poor pace unit for a while now so young pacers with potentials get hyped up too much. It would have been better to play some domestic before debuting.

With some experience, the same bowlers will be more effective. They still need to learn many skills, but simple discipline is lacking right now.

 

[Gotham Cronie]

Shannon Gabriel after the 1st Test vs England:

Overs: 61.2
Wickets: 2
Average: 109
Economy: 3.55

 

[Junaids]

I am getting a bit tired of this pace attack, especially the Shahs, getting crazy levels of hype. And even after their performances, everyone is saying 'they are young, they need backing'.

This is TEST cricket. You cannot throw such youngsters in, with no experience, and expect immediate returns. And this isn't a playground to develop youngsters.

They have absolutely no bowling intelligence or understanding of how to setup a batsman. They have no clue how to mix up their bowling and make it difficult to negotiate.

It is ridiculous to call them world-class talent and act like it is a given.

We have suffered enough embrassments with this pace attack. Conceding 500 plus TWICE vs Aussies and then in England, conceding it again, and gifting Warner a triple ton and nearly giving a nobody like Crawley one.

They have averaged over 50 with the ball, in England, where a pacer is supposed to find it easy to bowl, with a swinging Dukes ball.

Compared to Windies, our pace attack has been far, far worse. As soon as the ball gets old, we look clueless with the ball.

Even in 2016, with the likes of Wahab, Rahat, Sohail we were taking much more wickets.

Sorry guys, but even for youngsters, these returns have been horrid. Only one of them should play at a time. Enough of the embrassments.

I have been clear all along that picking too many underage players is just as dangerous as picking too many overage ones.

I would have picked both Naseem and Shaheen Shah, but in an attack with two other fast bowlers in their twenties.

We already saw at Derby that Mohammad Abbas was very economical, but that away from the May conditions he enjoyed in 2018 he was averaging the same wicket every 100 balls in the warm-ups that he has now delivered in the Tests. Misbah picked a pace atatck with two kids and a medium pacer who couldn't take wickets.

Wasim and Waqar and Aaqib benefitted from having Imran Khan at mid-off, telling them what to bowl. Naseem and Shaheen have had no such guides.

I don't value the extra experience you get after age 30. But the extra experience that Amir and Faheem and even Shinwari and Sohail have would have been useful for the kids.

Misbah picked a team of kids and old men, with only 2 players aged 21-30 to do the donkey work. The last Inzamam/Arthur team had EIGHT players aged 21 to 30.

Picking kids is as risky as picking veterans. You need to balance the side.

 

[tyron_woodley]

West Indies currently have a scary fast bowling attack. But, they are still mediocre because of their below-average batting and ordinary spin attack.

West Indian fast bowling attack is superior to Pakistani attack. No doubt.

not sure about that. West Indies bowling is conducive to bouncy seaming conditons.

Pakistani bowling would fare better in Asia and most other conditions.

 

[tyron_woodley]

Shannon Gabriel after the 1st Test vs England:

Overs: 61.2
Wickets: 2
Average: 109
Economy: 3.55

loool. there we go. Pakistanis have no patience whatsoever.

 

[HappyWarsFan]

loool. there we go. Pakistanis have no patience whatsoever.

I know that he didn't do great but that's due to fitness. Point is, I couldn't in a million years see Naseem running through with a 9 wicket

haul to win a game away from home.

Gabriel's performance from the first test is enough as it was excellent.

I do have patience, but not with picking an undercooked kid who don't even have basic bowling IQ.

I'd rather take a domestic bowler in early-mid 20s with the IQ and some experience, and then let them play and develop.

 

[HappyWarsFan]

I have been clear all along that picking too many underage players is just as dangerous as picking too many overage ones.

I would have picked both Naseem and Shaheen Shah, but in an attack with two other fast bowlers in their twenties.

We already saw at Derby that Mohammad Abbas was very economical, but that away from the May conditions he enjoyed in 2018 he was averaging the same wicket every 100 balls in the warm-ups that he has now delivered in the Tests. Misbah picked a pace atatck with two kids and a medium pacer who couldn't take wickets.

Wasim and Waqar and Aaqib benefitted from having Imran Khan at mid-off, telling them what to bowl. Naseem and Shaheen have had no such guides.

I don't value the extra experience you get after age 30. But the extra experience that Amir and Faheem and even Shinwari and Sohail have would have been useful for the kids.

Misbah picked a team of kids and old men, with only 2 players aged 21-30 to do the donkey work. The last Inzamam/Arthur team had EIGHT players aged 21 to 30.

Picking kids is as risky as picking veterans. You need to balance the side.

Completely agree with you. Picking kids isn't right. You have to pick people who have the fundamentals already and can be easily worked on - and that's players aged 21-30.

 

[Mamoon]

Shaheen is a very good bowler who underperformed.

Naseem is awful though. The guy is the next Mohammad Talha but we have hyped him up as the second coming of Waqar. Comical.

 

[Omer2002]

Naseem has loads of potential..Shaheen was abig let down but people wanted Wahab and Sohail khan who would have destoyed the english line up i guess!!!!

There is no fast bowlers coming through at all...Naseem and Shaheen won us last two test series

We were better team first two test matches as there was something in the pitch ..this test is a flat wicket archer was bowling at 92 93 mph did he get any wickets????

woakes looked awfull too its our batters making them look good...you see the new ball off i dont see why they cant bat properly

Last thing we are playing away in England against propbably No2 best in the world i think need to cut some slack to bowlers.

I dont know where the people were when they made us win against srilanka and bangladesh

 

[raashidkhan89079]

Experience my dear