How to reform Pakistan Army?

[LordJames]

For over 70 years Pakistan Army has ruled Pakistan like their personal fiefdom and sucked the people of Pakistan dry and separated them from their hard earned money.

Releasing Imran Khan (or XYZ) won't make any difference to Pakistan unless and until there are meaningful reforms in the structure of Pakistan Army to prevent ruling by a single person. It doesn't matter whether the COAS is a saint or sinner this position holds too much power. His powers need to be curbed without compromising the fighting strength of Pakistan Army as it is vital for the defense of Pakistan.

In my opinion, as soon as someone has the power to reform they should take few immediate steps:​

1. Organize Pakistan military command along the lines of American, Indian & Chinese and split it into Northern, Southern, Eastern, Western, Central Commands and elevate each of them to 4-star Generals, equal in rank and privilege to the COAS. This was what Turkey did to break the back of their military oppression after 2015​
2. The tenure of COAS should be constitutionally restricted to 3 years while the "Command" generals should be 4 years. This is on purpose so in the first year COAS is actually from a Junior batch! The most Senior officer without question assumes this position every 3 years.​
3. Elevate the most senior person to be "Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Committee" from Army, Navy or Air Force and make it equivalent in rank to COAS and his tenure should also be 3 years. The most Senior officer from any branch without question assumes this position every 3 years.​
4. Elevate Pakistan Marines to a Corps and eventually raise 2-3 Corps​
5. Pakistan Supreme court should be able to rule on military adjudication matters and officers (denied justice in military courts) should be able to take their cases to Supreme Court, India introduced this reform in 1960s under Nehru​
6. High ranking civilian administrators are higher in ranks and stature to military officers and seating arrangements, media briefings should reflect it (see examples in India)​
7. A Lt Gen does not need to be "DG-ISPR", the briefings should be conducted by a civil servant or a Junior military officer assigned to the Defense department (like the rest of the world)​
8. A career Intelligence officer should be assigned to head ISI, answerable to Prime Minister and select committees of the Parliament. It is because Intelligence matters cannot be openly discussed in Parliament.​
9. All non-fighting functions (ISPR etc) should be returned to department of defense and officers returned to their primary functions of fighting.​
10. No specialised and privileged land to be granted, review all benefits. 85% of Pakistani military officers retire after 20 years OR reaching the rank of Lt Colonel/Colonel and promotion to Brigadier should be done on the basis of commitment to the Army and not because of granting of land. You don't want to serve your country, leave and good luck!​
11. DROP all reciprocal training exchanges to Sandhurst and/or West Point, a Cadet does not require specilaised training apart from PMA or other Academies​
12. All retired NCO, JCO and officers to be monitored for 3 years in all employement and business ventures by IB (Intelligence Bureau)​
13. All retired NCO, JCO and officers to be barred from leaving the country for 3 years (except Umrah where a restricted special VISA is granted), same applies for medical treament​

Give this structure 10 years and restrict it from changing in the constitution.

​

 

[psyoptica]

Good thread. Something to keep me busy for the next few days

 

[Farhan The Man]

Not possible.

Once they have fed themselves on haram money since inception, it's hard to adjust.

kuttay ki dum hamesha terri hoti hai.

 

[LordJames]

Not possible.

Once they have fed themselves on haram money since inception, it's hard to adjust.

kuttay ki dum hamesha terri hoti hai.

Turkey & Indonesia say "Hi"

The issue is not the Army but the consolidation of power and it is acknowledged by military itself and it has degraded the fighting ability of the military.

I don't care who is from a military background but the Army is seriously demoralized at this time.

 

[Farhan The Man]

I don't care who is from a military background but the Army is seriously demoralized at this time.

Rightly so. Chickens coming home to roost.

When the snake that has ravaged your home is dying, you shouldn't feel remorse. You stomp on it like there's no tomorrow.

They prey on your inherent goodness to elicit positive sentiment. Resist the temptation.

 

[LordJames]

Rightly so. Chickens coming home to roost.

When the snake that has ravaged your home is dying, you shouldn't feel remorse. You stomp on it like there's no tomorrow.

They prey on your inherent goodness to elicit positive sentiment. Resist the temptation.​

No, I didn't mean it that way.

When a youngster enters the Army its due to Patriotism and the courage to die for the country and then slowly the system corrupts this person as they rise above Colonel they are transformed except for a select few.

When we need to transform the Pakistan military, neither treat it like a snake nor dismantle its fighting ability. I believe that majority of NCO, JCO and Officers are sick to death of what they are being asked to do and due to their training they are unable to distinguish between legal and illegal orders. The training needs a reform and the Senior leadership (Brigadier & above across all Services) need a serious cull and then structures put in place so it never rises again.​

 

[Bhaijaan]

Reforming the Pakistan Army sounds great in theory but in reality, its nearly impossible.

You’re talking about an entity that’s mastered the art of controlling civilians while maintaining the illusion of democracy. It is arguably the most sophisticated dictatorship in the world today that almost never fully shows its true extent of power but generally stays in the shadows and pulls the strings from behind.

Last many decades has seen fall of many dictatorships all over the world. Pakistan isn’t even discussed. They have always played 7D chess. That’s one thing where Pakistan army’s aura is untouchable.

This is just wishful thinking and it’s frankly like expecting billionaires to vote for a 99% wealth tax on themselves.

Only a people’s revolution can overturn this situation and even then army will just start a needless war with Bharat just to give itself an excuse to take control of Pakistan again.

Pakistan really is not a country. It’s a military entity that has a country.

 

[ElRaja]

theoretically, the only way thats happening is for a large enough civil force, a political party with huge grassroots support reform the army, because anything less and the army can bully the parties. the only thing armies are afraid of is killing their own civilians en masse, in reality, nothing is happening.

 

[psyoptica]

Reforming the Pakistan Army sounds great in theory but in reality, its nearly impossible.

You’re talking about an entity that’s mastered the art of controlling civilians while maintaining the illusion of democracy. It is arguably the most sophisticated dictatorship in the world today that almost never fully shows its true extent of power but generally stays in the shadows and pulls the strings from behind.

Last many decades has seen fall of many dictatorships all over the world. Pakistan isn’t even discussed. They have always played 7D chess. That’s one thing where Pakistan army’s aura is untouchable.

This is just wishful thinking and it’s frankly like expecting billionaires to vote for a 99% wealth tax on themselves.

Only a people’s revolution can overturn this situation and even then army will just start a needless war with Bharat just to give itself an excuse to take control of Pakistan again.

Pakistan really is not a country. It’s a military entity that has a country.

Pak army isn’t invincible in politics. The separation of Bangladesh and the subsequent fall of the military dictator Yahya Khan is an example. Even now it’s not as powerful or tactical as people make them out to be. They have handled the Imran Khan situation horribly and continue to make amateur level mistakes. They have lost all the goodwill of the peoole they had established through propaganda over the last 70 plus years and now their solution to every problem is using brute force methods like stifling prominent voices by the use of weapons.
They have lost all battles on the diplomatic front and can be defeated on the military front as well if the international establishment stopped backing them.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Pak army isn’t invincible in politics. The separation of Bangladesh and the subsequent fall of the military dictator Yahya Khan is an example. Even now it’s not as powerful or tactical as people make them out to be. They have handled the Imran Khan situation horribly and continue to make amateur level mistakes. They have lost all the goodwill of the peoole they had established through propaganda over the last 70 plus years and now their solution to every problem is using brute force methods like stifling prominent voices by the use of weapons.
They have lost all battles on the diplomatic front and can be defeated on the military front as well if the international establishment stopped backing them.

So you believe

 

[psyoptica]

The army puppets in power including Sharif bros, Asif Zardari, Maryam Nawaz and Movi Fazlu need to die to untether the political cover the top generals have and someone allowed to be in power by overwhelming support of the public to have any sliver of hope to reform the army.

 

[Markhor]

Great list. Add to that removal of all subsidies and perks from the dozens of military-affiliated businesses.

Three hot borders and insurgencies in two provinces yet some of these guys are only interested in filling their pockets.

 

[LordJames]

Reforming the Pakistan Army sounds great in theory but in reality, its nearly impossible.

You’re talking about an entity that’s mastered the art of controlling civilians while maintaining the illusion of democracy. It is arguably the most sophisticated dictatorship in the world today that almost never fully shows its true extent of power but generally stays in the shadows and pulls the strings from behind.

Last many decades has seen fall of many dictatorships all over the world. Pakistan isn’t even discussed. They have always played 7D chess. That’s one thing where Pakistan army’s aura is untouchable.

This is just wishful thinking and it’s frankly like expecting billionaires to vote for a 99% wealth tax on themselves.

Only a people’s revolution can overturn this situation and even then army will just start a needless war with Bharat just to give itself an excuse to take control of Pakistan again.

Pakistan really is not a country. It’s a military entity that has a country.

Completely disagree with 7D chess! Pakistan Army leadership does not know how to play "Chess" let alone 7D chess (whatever that is).

The wartime reading material for most officers is still General Rommel and WWII tactics and not Desert Storm/Desert Shield or even latest conflicts like Nagorno-Karabakh or Ukraine War.

The "non-wartime" prep is nonexistence as it should be because its a fighting force and not geared towards Administrator or politics.

Fortunately and Thanks God, Indian military is incompetent and their equipment is vintage which makes Pakistan military look like well oiled machine in limited skirmishes, in all out war the courage of soldiers (from both sides) dictates the tactical battlefields otherwise strategically both leaderships are equally stupid!

The 1971 war was more down to stupidity of Pakistan Army (Martial Law) and alienating its own people then down to "genius" of Sam Manekshaw...No Army can call its own citizens "Harami & Ghaddar" and then defend the land, doesn't work.

 

[RizwanT20Champ]

Some cultists reaching a new low here, maligning our own country and institutions and toeing the Indian line.

 

[Varun]

Some cultists reaching a new low here, maligning our own country and institutions and toeing the Indian line.

'Toeing the Indian line' made you lose half your country and put you at odds with another nation around you. Might as well try something different, Colonel sahib.

 

[Farhan The Man]

Pakistan really is not a country. It’s a military entity that has a country.

Nailed it.

We are forever doomed as a nation.

The cancer spread too far and wide. To neutralize it means killing the whole body.

 

[RidiculousMan]

For over 70 years Pakistan Army has ruled Pakistan like their personal fiefdom and sucked the people of Pakistan dry and separated them from their hard earned money.

Releasing Imran Khan (or XYZ) won't make any difference to Pakistan unless and until there are meaningful reforms in the structure of Pakistan Army to prevent ruling by a single person. It doesn't matter whether the COAS is a saint or sinner this position holds too much power. His powers need to be curbed without compromising the fighting strength of Pakistan Army as it is vital for the defense of Pakistan.

In my opinion, as soon as someone has the power to reform they should take few immediate steps:​

1. Organize Pakistan military command along the lines of American, Indian & Chinese and split it into Northern, Southern, Eastern, Western, Central Commands and elevate each of them to 4-star Generals, equal in rank and privilege to the COAS. This was what Turkey did to break the back of their military oppression after 2015​
2. The tenure of COAS should be constitutionally restricted to 3 years while the "Command" generals should be 4 years. This is on purpose so in the first year COAS is actually from a Junior batch! The most Senior officer without question assumes this position every 3 years.​
3. Elevate the most senior person to be "Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Committee" from Army, Navy or Air Force and make it equivalent in rank to COAS and his tenure should also be 3 years. The most Senior officer from any branch without question assumes this position every 3 years.​
4. Elevate Pakistan Marines to a Corps and eventually raise 2-3 Corps​
5. Pakistan Supreme court should be able to rule on military adjudication matters and officers (denied justice in military courts) should be able to take their cases to Supreme Court, India introduced this reform in 1960s under Nehru​
6. High ranking civilian administrators are higher in ranks and stature to military officers and seating arrangements, media briefings should reflect it (see examples in India)​
7. A Lt Gen does not need to be "DG-ISPR", the briefings should be conducted by a civil servant or a Junior military officer assigned to the Defense department (like the rest of the world)​
8. A career Intelligence officer should be assigned to head ISI, answerable to Prime Minister and select committees of the Parliament. It is because Intelligence matters cannot be openly discussed in Parliament.​
9. All non-fighting functions (ISPR etc) should be returned to department of defense and officers returned to their primary functions of fighting.​
10. No specialised and privileged land to be granted, review all benefits. 85% of Pakistani military officers retire after 20 years OR reaching the rank of Lt Colonel/Colonel and promotion to Brigadier should be done on the basis of commitment to the Army and not because of granting of land. You don't want to serve your country, leave and good luck!​
11. DROP all reciprocal training exchanges to Sandhurst and/or West Point, a Cadet does not require specilaised training apart from PMA or other Academies​
12. All retired NCO, JCO and officers to be monitored for 3 years in all employement and business ventures by IB (Intelligence Bureau)​
13. All retired NCO, JCO and officers to be barred from leaving the country for 3 years (except Umrah where a restricted special VISA is granted), same applies for medical treament​

Give this structure 10 years and restrict it from changing in the constitution.

​

This is stage 2. Pakistan's problem has been stage 1, with will.

The system is designed as such that no good man can become a CAOS.

The person who might do any of the reforms that you have mentioned will come out of the system. Whenever that happens. God knows.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

How to reform the Pakistan army? Getting their permission first might be an idea.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Just to elaborate from memory:

I'm no fan of Nawaz Sharif, but I do believe he tried to curb army powers once before and if I'm not mistaken his govt got terminated and he ended up in jail/exile.

Imran Khan ditto.

Not sure what Benazir Bhutto tried or didn't try but she ended up having bits of her carcass cleaned up off the roadside.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

By the way, not for one minute am I making any accusations here, could all just be a coincidence or bad luck.

 

[Farhan The Man]

By the way, not for one minute am I making any accusations here, could all just be a coincidence or bad luck.

But you did. Accuse them of murdering leaders and destabilization of our country.

Then felt bad enough to cushion the potential blowback. Such is that fear of this establishment

Difference is establishment brutalized first bangla bros, then sindhis, then pathans, then balochis, and now eating their own. Welcome to the club.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

But you did. Accuse them of murdering leaders and destabilization of our country.

Then felt bad enough to cushion the potential blowback. Such is that fear of this establishment

Difference is establishment brutalized first bangla bros, then sindhis, then pathans, then balochis, and now eating their own. Welcome to the club.

Lol, the only blowback on here is the mods, so have to be careful with the wording otherwise it gets removed. I'm not even that bothered about martial law, as I already said in other threads, China used authoritarian rule to grow their economy. MBS ditto in Saudi Arabia. But in Pakistan they put themselves first and that seems to filter from the top to the bottom.

 

[psyoptica]

But you did. Accuse them of murdering leaders and destabilization of our country.

Then felt bad enough to cushion the potential blowback. Such is that fear of this establishment

Difference is establishment brutalized first bangla bros, then sindhis, then pathans, then balochis, and now eating their own. Welcome to the club.

Don’t forget the urdu speakers

 

[Pakpak]

Just to elaborate from memory:

I'm no fan of Nawaz Sharif, but I do believe he tried to curb army powers once before and if I'm not mistaken his govt got terminated and he ended up in jail/exile.

Imran Khan ditto.

Not sure what Benazir Bhutto tried or didn't try but she ended up having bits of her carcass cleaned up off the roadside.

Not at all, Nawaz Sharif simply replaced Musharraf with a pliant puppet COAS as he was interested in keeping the army under his thumb and if the COAS was his puppet it was job done.

I am a PTI supporter but Imran should have fired Bajwa especially when he himself admits he knew he was about to be overthrown.

 

[Farhan The Man]

Don’t forget the urdu speakers

Yup, them as well.

But no love lost since zia created and armed mqm, similar to taliban.

Army offloaded both when it was done dirty dealing with either destructive entity. karachi still reels from the effect of mohajir bhayaas running wild on the city.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

For over 70 years Pakistan Army has ruled Pakistan like their personal fiefdom and sucked the people of Pakistan dry and separated them from their hard earned money.

Releasing Imran Khan (or XYZ) won't make any difference to Pakistan unless and until there are meaningful reforms in the structure of Pakistan Army to prevent ruling by a single person. It doesn't matter whether the COAS is a saint or sinner this position holds too much power. His powers need to be curbed without compromising the fighting strength of Pakistan Army as it is vital for the defense of Pakistan.

In my opinion, as soon as someone has the power to reform they should take few immediate steps:​

1. Organize Pakistan military command along the lines of American, Indian & Chinese and split it into Northern, Southern, Eastern, Western, Central Commands and elevate each of them to 4-star Generals, equal in rank and privilege to the COAS. This was what Turkey did to break the back of their military oppression after 2015​
2. The tenure of COAS should be constitutionally restricted to 3 years while the "Command" generals should be 4 years. This is on purpose so in the first year COAS is actually from a Junior batch! The most Senior officer without question assumes this position every 3 years.​
3. Elevate the most senior person to be "Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Committee" from Army, Navy or Air Force and make it equivalent in rank to COAS and his tenure should also be 3 years. The most Senior officer from any branch without question assumes this position every 3 years.​
4. Elevate Pakistan Marines to a Corps and eventually raise 2-3 Corps​
5. Pakistan Supreme court should be able to rule on military adjudication matters and officers (denied justice in military courts) should be able to take their cases to Supreme Court, India introduced this reform in 1960s under Nehru​
6. High ranking civilian administrators are higher in ranks and stature to military officers and seating arrangements, media briefings should reflect it (see examples in India)​
7. A Lt Gen does not need to be "DG-ISPR", the briefings should be conducted by a civil servant or a Junior military officer assigned to the Defense department (like the rest of the world)​
8. A career Intelligence officer should be assigned to head ISI, answerable to Prime Minister and select committees of the Parliament. It is because Intelligence matters cannot be openly discussed in Parliament.​
9. All non-fighting functions (ISPR etc) should be returned to department of defense and officers returned to their primary functions of fighting.​
10. No specialised and privileged land to be granted, review all benefits. 85% of Pakistani military officers retire after 20 years OR reaching the rank of Lt Colonel/Colonel and promotion to Brigadier should be done on the basis of commitment to the Army and not because of granting of land. You don't want to serve your country, leave and good luck!​
11. DROP all reciprocal training exchanges to Sandhurst and/or West Point, a Cadet does not require specilaised training apart from PMA or other Academies​
12. All retired NCO, JCO and officers to be monitored for 3 years in all employement and business ventures by IB (Intelligence Bureau)​
13. All retired NCO, JCO and officers to be barred from leaving the country for 3 years (except Umrah where a restricted special VISA is granted), same applies for medical treament​

Give this structure 10 years and restrict it from changing in the constitution.

​

I am very sure that this post is in violation of cyber laws of Pakistan. Please be careful.

 

[Extra_Cover]

Reform in theory is quite simple actually. Two easy steps:
1. Pakistan Army turn their business empire into trusts run by Boards appointed by Parliament. Army shall have no business other than arms and technology deals with other countries but this is also under the remit of Interior Ministry and signed off by Parliament.
2. Judiciary is free of bias and able to hand out verdicts against anyone in the country.

You want to reform Pakistan then simply allow "rule of law". Let judiciary hand sentences to police goons, army thugs or blackmailing politicians and see how the country slowly but surely starts towing the line of law.

 

[HalBass9]

Reform in theory is quite simple actually. Two easy steps:
1. Pakistan Army turn their business empire into trusts run by Boards appointed by Parliament. Army shall have no business other than arms and technology deals with other countries but this is also under the remit of Interior Ministry and signed off by Parliament.
2. Judiciary is free of bias and able to hand out verdicts against anyone in the country.

You want to reform Pakistan then simply allow "rule of law". Let judiciary hand sentences to police goons, army thugs or blackmailing politicians and see how the country slowly but surely starts towing the line of law.

A real change will never come without a street uprising and a bloody revolution.

The economy is expected to improve slightly in 2026 in the short term, and it will continue to do well as long as the current COAS secures another extension, which he inevitably will. However, long-term prosperity will remain elusive. The status quo will persist, and over time, people, especially those in Punjab, will forget the past atrocities committed by the PDM and the army.

Pakistan has had leaders like Imran Khan before, but there was no social media back then to broadcast events live. The military has learned from its past mistake of executing a sitting Prime Minister, as his daughter later rose to power. This time, instead of making a martyr out of him, they will either let him die in prison or release him once the economy stabilizes and his support has dwindled.