How well does the Pakistani and Indian diaspora do in the US

[Laal]

Have seen a few threads on the sub-continent diaspora in the UK. Finally some statistics from the US.

 

[Laal]

Obviously, Indians take the cake. Pleasantly surprised that in terms of average family income, Pakistani diaspora ranks above the Chinese, English, German, etc.

 

[Slog]

Its well known that the Pakistani and Indian communities household average is much higher than the average.

As far as Pakistan is concerned the reasons are:

1) Immigrants are mostly from cities and not villages so are likely to be from an educated and well to do backgrounds to begin with
2) Many of the immigrants came to the US for studies and ended up staying so they are highly qualified to begin with and work professional jobs
4) They are more integrated into the communities
3) Education is given a lot of importance

 

[Neferpitou]

Damn it Indians, what kind of taxis are you bxstards driving?

 

[Laal]

[MENTION=4542]MO[/MENTION]ds: Please re-title the above thread to "How well does the Pakistani and Indian diapora do in the US". Thanks.

 

[SULTAN]

And this isn't even including the $$$$$ that business owners like gas station owners etc. hide the profits from Uncle Sam.

 

[Laal]

Its well known that the Pakistani and Indian communities household average is much higher than the average.

As far as Pakistan is concerned the reasons are:

1) Immigrants are mostly from cities and not villages so are likely to be from an educated and well to do backgrounds to begin with
2) Many of the immigrants came to the US for studies and ended up staying so they are highly qualified to begin with and work professional jobs
4) They are more integrated into the communities
3) Education is given a lot of importance

Also, I guess the gap in income and education could be explained by the fact that Pakistanis, as a group, are much more likely to own businesses, etc.

 

[Laal]

And this isn't even including the $$$$$ that business owners like gas station owners etc. hide the profits from Uncle Sam.

Or, paying below minimum wage (or no wage) to their imported bahu working at their restaurant.

 

[Slog]

tbh its not that hard to get above the average which is like US$45k

i mean if you have a college degree and have some social and networking skills you can do much better than that first year out of college.

Average of $80k on the whole is low for a household.
[MENTION=137980]Laal[/MENTION] do you know how these figures are collected though? I mean I dont ever remember recognizing myself specifically as Pakistani in any of these census type forms all these years.

Usually its Asian

 

[Slog]

Also, I guess the gap in income and education could be explained by the fact that Pakistanis, as a group, are much more likely to own businesses, etc.

Yes, I feel post graduate education is not a good parameter here if you want to compare income with education attainment. Just a college degree should be enough for this purposes.

Anyways sometimes postgraduate degree holders end up making less than a bachelors in finance and economics . So its not always a direct correlation as it is in case of the income of a college degree holder vs HS diploma holder

 

[Laal]

tbh its not that hard to get above the average which is like US$45k

i mean if you have a college degree and have some social and networking skills you can do much better than that first year out of college.

Average of $80k on the whole is low for a household.
[MENTION=137980]Laal[/MENTION] do you know how these figures are collected though? I mean I dont ever remember recognizing myself specifically as Pakistani in any of these census type forms all these years.

Usually its Asian

The book is under review seems like. But the sample is restricted to foreign-born. They must have done a survey.

 

[Laal]

What makes it more interesting is the immigration system in the US. Unlike Canada's point system, US relies on chain immigration (i.e. A family member sponsoring his entire family). Seems like that hasn't had much adverse affect.

 

[SULTAN]

Or, paying below minimum wage (or no wage) to their imported bahu working at their restaurant.

Actually they pay the imported person $9600/year (if single) and about 13000/year (if married/ filing jointly). That's the way they increase income tax RETURN for that person and pay like no taxes. (amounts change a bit every year).
All legal.

Uncle Sam can't handle desis

 

[Laal]

Actually they pay the imported person $9600/year (if single) and about 13000/year (if married/ filing jointly). That's the way they increase income tax RETURN for that person and pay like no taxes. (amounts change a bit every year).
All legal.

Uncle Sam can't handle desis

Wah bhai!

 

[GenericBrand]

Subcontinent immigrants do well in the US, immigration laws are more strict in the US I believe so they don't just allow any Tom, Dick or Harry to come.

 

[RWAC]

Darn OP I saw this a couple of days and thought I'll post it next time there is a discussion on PP about immigrant communities in US, but you actually started a thread with this.

I was actually surprised to see the gap between Indians and the rest. Before this, I would have guesstimated Indians did slightly better than Pakistanis and almost as good as Chinese, but this is way off.

Regarding your point about Pakistani households earning more than Chinese households, do they control for household size?

I would assume Pakistani households would have more members (and thus earners) compared to Chinese households?

 

[JaDed]

The only reason i see for Chinese to be below Desis is probably coz the ones in the survey were who settled down long ago and are completely different compared to average Chinese present in general.

 

[Lords]

This stat is about people "born" in their native countries and migrated to US, how does the stat look like when you include people who are of foreign origin but first generation or second generation americans?

 

[IgnitedMind]

I think Most Indians who come to USA are for high payed jobs..even USA allows only them...I am guessing average IT pay for most Indians is around 100K...

Where as Pak and china are Allies...so any one irrespective of their eductaional background gets in..and do bussiness to blue color jobs..

not a level playing field IMO....futile to compare !

 

[Lurker_Ind]

^ Average IT pay is not $100k. Unless you are working in NY or San Jose etc. There, if you do not make $100k, it is hard to live a comfortable life.

Typically the average for IT job is around 70-75k unless you are talking about Managerial positions where $100k is average. Most software professionals average around $70k.

I think where Indian households crush all the competition in terms of household income is that both husband and wife work. Most of my friends wives are also into programming and development. The average income is around $150k for most Indian families where both partners work. If only husband works, the average is around $70k.

 

[IgnitedMind]

^ Average IT pay is not $100k. Unless you are working in NY or San Jose etc. There, if you do not make $100k, it is hard to live a comfortable life.

Typically the average for IT job is around 70-75k unless you are talking about Managerial positions where $100k is average. Most software professionals average around $70k.

I think where Indian households crush all the competition in terms of household income is that both husband and wife work. Most of my friends wives are also into programming and development. The average income is around $150k for most Indian families where both partners work. If only husband works, the average is around $70k.

yeah, I live in NY. So, may be you are right. I just moved jobs couple of months ago...when I was looking I got that perception and was able to get a job quoting as much !

Yeah, average household income with Two working IT professionals is very good...downside is taxes...friend of mine had to pay 16 thousand to IRS because both together made 225 plus that year ! Very hard to run a family with one income these days.

 

[Stewie]

In the state of Texas, I have seen tons of Pakistanis running their own businesses and I highly doubt this survey catches them on account on tax evasion and all that. Most Pakistanis here except maybe for some in Houston and most in Dallas, which is a big IT hub, run their own establishments and are the most well off residents.

 

[sjahmed23]

Subcontinent immigrants do well in the US, immigration laws are more strict in the US I believe so they don't just allow any Tom, Dick or Harry to come.

I disagree, I don't think you are familiar with the family laws in the US. Any US citizen can sponsor their parents/spouse/kids and siblings with family who later sponsor their extended family. If anything, it is easier for Tom, Dick or Harry to come here and take advantage of the benefits than anywhere else in the world.

 

[babareazam1]

I disagree, I don't think you are familiar with the family laws in the US. Any US citizen can sponsor their parents/spouse/kids and siblings with family who later sponsor their extended family. If anything, it is easier for Tom, Dick or Harry to come here and take advantage of the benefits than anywhere else in the world.

Indians also tend to move much faster into higher management especially in IT . Most of the upper level management in Google and Apple are Indians . The Indians in these kinds of places tend to be very hardworking and brilliant. Pakistanis rarely get to even look on the inside of such campuses

 

[Pace90]

Before 9/11, Pakistanis were 2nd after India among the foreign medical graduates starting residencies in USA. Sadly , not any more. Visa restriction and other problems faced by Pakistani FMGs after 9/11, has left Pakistanis not even in top 10 nations in residency programes. I'm sure same is true with other professionl jobs also.

 

[JaDed]

Before 9/11, Pakistanis were 2nd after India among the foreign medical graduates starting residencies in USA. Sadly , not any more. Visa restriction and other problems faced by Pakistani FMGs after 9/11, has left Pakistanis not even in top 10 nations in residency programes. I'm sure same is true with other professionl jobs also.

Indians go to US for medicine didn't know that i thought its all about the Engineering.

 

[Laal]

Indians also tend to move much faster into higher management especially in IT . Most of the upper level management in Google and Apple are Indians . The Indians in these kinds of places tend to be very hardworking and brilliant. Pakistanis rarely get to even look on the inside of such campuses

That's not true at all. Plenty of Pakistanis in IT. They may not be upper-management but their entry has been fairly recent. Also, you have to control for the size of the Indian population v. the Pakistani population.

 

[Laal]

Although I'd like to see more Pakistanis in academia. There are hardly any.

 

[mnoman15]

Both wives and husbands from India work in US while most Pakistanis wives stay at home so there is a reason the Indians average family wages are much higher than everyone else ...

 

[CricketCartoons]

Both wives and husbands from India work in US while most Pakistanis wives stay at home so there is a reason the Indians average family wages are much higher than everyone else ...

Brother, did you get any progress towards your marriage?

 

[Syed1]

Have 15 kids and get benefits from the government.. atleast that is the strategy some of the desis employ in Canada

 

[Belawal2014]

Have 15 kids and get benefits from the government.. atleast that is the strategy some of the desis employ in Canada

If only it were that easy.

 

[justarslan]

The only reason i see for Chinese to be below Desis is probably coz the ones in the survey were who settled down long ago and are completely different compared to average Chinese present in general.

Chinese are the only people US Congress passed federal law to ban them from immigrating to USA.

 

[QazzarFan]

Pakistanis here in general are more educated and integrates extremely well as compared to their UK counterparts. Interacted with several Pakistani families over the years. Out of 10 Pakistani families....all 10 families are college educated, professional and have sent their sons and daughters to college as well.

 

[Sidilicious]

Pakistanis here in general are more educated and integrates extremely well as compared to their UK counterparts. Interacted with several Pakistani families over the years. Out of 10 Pakistani families....all 10 families are college educated, professional and have sent their sons and daughters to college as well.

Same for the Indians. Here in the UK, most of the Indo-Paks who came here were uneducated, and performed low skilled jobs to start with.
Whereas, in the USA, a significant majority who arrived there were educated and employed in highly skilled jobs.

 

[Inswinger]

Same for the Indians. Here in the UK, most of the Indo-Paks who came here were uneducated, and performed low skilled jobs to start with.
Whereas, in the USA, a significant majority who arrived there were educated and employed in highly skilled jobs.

And even if the Indo-Pak immigrants worked low skilled jobs they made sure their kids went on to get a ver good education. Don't think education was a big priority for Pakistanis in the UK, at least back in the day.

 

[Stewie]

My personal observation here in the States of Pakistani immigrants is that they can be classified into two categories.

1. Poor and humble background/ or business minded folks (not necessarily poor backgrounds) who somehow get here with enough money to start their own businesses and if they dont have money, they work like slaves to save up and own their own businesses. You see them running Gas stations, motels (an industry mostly dominated by Gujarati Patel community from India, but you do see some Pakistanis in it as well), dry cleaners, cabbies and limo drivers, car dealers.

2. People from well off families in Pakistan, who either come here on professional visas, get sponsored by well-off relatives already in the states, or student visas. Especially those on student visas, manage to find decent employment after graduation and settle down here permanently.

In a broader sense, which may not be 100% accurate they can be categorized as either belonging to a poor or lower middle Pakistan class or educated middle to upper class from Pakistan.

Another observation of mine is that people who are really well-off in Pakistan, find no reason to come to the States. They have good enough lives in Pakistan so they prefer to stay there.

You dont see it that much with Indians. They seem to be more adventurous or ambitious and take the plunge even if they have a good enough future in India.

It could also be down to the facts that nowadays, it is difficult for Pakistanis to get business/student/employment visas compared to Indians.

Someone mentioned absence of Pakistanis in the academia here. I strongly agree with it. I see professors and teachers of Indian origin all the time but very few Pakistanis. Once again it could be due to the points I made earlier. Not too many Pakistanis in research and development and I have been a student of three different universities here.

 

[justarslan]

And even if the Indo-Pak immigrants worked low skilled jobs they made sure their kids went on to get a ver good education. Don't think education was a big priority for Pakistanis in the UK, at least back in the day.

Nailed it.

 

[daytrader]

Hyderabad To Have 55 New Windows For US Visa
Senior American diplomat Jennifer Larson said she will work towards improving the visa services and strengthening the India-US relationship.

Washington: The US consulate in Hyderabad will soon have 55 windows for visa and the consulate services will improve dramatically, a senior American diplomat promised Indian Americans from the region here.
Senior American diplomat Jennifer Larson, who is now headed to India to lead the Hyderabad USA Consulate as its Consul General, interacted with a group of eminent Indian Americans from Andhra Pradesh, Telangana and Odisha. She said she will work towards improving the visa services and strengthening the India-US relationship.

During the meet and greet luncheon organised in her honour by Indian-American entrepreneur and philanthropist Ravi Puli, Larson spoke in detail about her efforts to improve visa services, including to have 55 windows for visa interviews and will improve the services dramatically. This is her second stint in India.

The first time was in Mumbai consulate. She answered several questions ranging from bilateral relations, immigration issues, and longest wait times for obtaining visas. She also mentioned about the highest priority given to student visas, among others, according to the organisers.

In his remarks, Ravi Kota, Minister (Economic), Embassy of India highlighted the potential opportunities for strengthening economic relations between the United States and in the consular jurisdiction in India covering Telangana, Andhra Pradesh and Odisha.

He thanked Puli for facilitating the interaction of Larsen with other Indian origin American entrepreneurs who have equal interest both in Hyderabad and in the US.

Kota also drew the attention of the Consul General designate to the economic strengths of Andhra Pradesh, Telangana and Odisha.

“As Hyderabad consulate will be the largest consulate in Asia… will work towards creating more jobs in both countries and especially in Telugu states as the unemployment rate is very high although there is a high talent pool,” Puli said. “Although, we enjoy the highest standards of living in the US, we should not forget our roots, and give our best in empowering our people back home while we contribute to the country we live in by being a part of several business, social non profits, among others,” he added.

NDTV

 

[Realromeo]

Based on what I see

Indians and Pakistanis integrate well in USA equally.

Indians integrate will in UK but not Pakistanis.

Pakistanis integrate well in Canada but Indians not really.

 

[sweep_shot]

Both Pakistanis and Indians integrate in USA quite well (based on what I have seen).

There are more Indians than Pakistanis in USA and thus India has a number advantage.

 

[SalimBhai]

Based on what I see

Indians and Pakistanis integrate well in USA equally.

Indians integrate will in UK but not Pakistanis.

Pakistanis integrate well in Canada but Indians not really.

Pakistanis in USA have integrated better than the ones in UK. Highly educated, low crime, high incomes. Indians have done even better.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Based on what I see

Indians and Pakistanis integrate well in USA equally.

Indians integrate will in UK but not Pakistanis.

Pakistanis integrate well in Canada but Indians not really.

Can you tell us why you feel that Pakistanis have not integrated in the UK?

 

[Stewie]

Can you tell us why you feel that Pakistanis have not integrated in the UK?

This issue has been beaten to death on various threads. Let’s not start this again, please.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

This issue has been beaten to death on various threads. Let’s not start this again, please.

Well I'm not the one who keeps bringing it up, but if people keep throwing it out there as if it is a fact then it needs to be backed up.

 

[Ahmad-GERMANFC]

Well I'm not the one who keeps bringing it up, but if people keep throwing it out there as if it is a fact then it needs to be backed up.

It’s been backed up enough time. All the statistics show that British Pakistanis are scraping bottom of barrel whether it’s education, per capita income, home ownership rates

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

It’s been backed up enough time. All the statistics show that British Pakistanis are scraping bottom of barrel whether it’s education, per capita income, home ownership rates

What's that got to do with failing to integrate?

 

[SalimBhai]

What's that got to do with failing to integrate?

Stop trolling Captain saab.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Stop trolling Captain saab.

Hello new poster, it's a simple enough question, if you can't answer it then no need to comment.

 

[daytrader]

US Court's Ruling On H-1B Visa To Benefit Thousands Of Indian Techies
Tech companies such as Amazon, Apple, Google, and Microsoft had opposed the lawsuit. The US has so far issued nearly 1,00,000 work authorisations to spouses of H-1B workers, a significantly large number of whom are Indians.

A judge in the US has ruled that partners of H-1B visa holders, a significantly large number of whom are Indians, can work in the country, in a big relief to foreign workers in the American tech sector which has seen massive retrenchments.
The H-1B visa is a non-immigrant visa that allows US companies to employ foreign workers in speciality occupations that require theoretical or technical expertise. Technology companies depend on it to hire tens of thousands of employees each year from countries like India and China.

US District Judge Tanya Chutkan dismissed a lawsuit filed by Save Jobs USA which had approached the court to dismiss the Obama-era regulation that gave employment authorisation cards to partners of certain categories of H-1B visa holders.

Save Jobs USA is an organisation comprising IT workers who claim they lost their jobs to H-1B workers Tech companies such as Amazon, Apple, Google, and Microsoft had opposed the lawsuit. The US has so far issued nearly 1,00,000 work authorisations to spouses of H-1B workers.

In her order, Judge Chutkan said the primary contention of Save Jobs USA is that Congress has never granted the Department of Homeland Security authority to allow foreign nationals, like H-4 visa-holders, to work during their stay in the United States.

...
https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/spo...says-judge-3905012#pfrom=home-ndtv_topstories

 

[daytrader]

Pakistani doctor recognised as top faith leader in US

The US Department of Health and Human Services will honour Dr Farha Abbasi, a Michigan-based Pakistani-American psychiatrist, on Thursday as one of the top 15 women faith leaders in the United States.

The event — “Women on the Frontlines: Celebrating Women Faith Leaders” — will be hosted by Secretary of Health and Human Services Xavier Becerra on Thursday (today), where Dr Abbasi will be recognised for “her incredible work and extraordinary leadership qualities in the service of humanity”.

She urges using faith as a tool to fight isolation.

“Imagine being alone in a new country — unable to speak the language, surrounded by an unfamiliar culture, and forced to leave your entire life behind,” Dr Abbasi writes in one of her papers on the power of faith in dealing with trauma.

“Immigration, even when it’s by choice, can cause serious trauma, and for many it becomes a significant risk factor for mental health concerns.”

Dr Abbasi teaches her medical students at Michigan State University to “make the faith conversation a part of every patient evaluation”.

DAWN

 

[daytrader]

"Our Lives At Stake": Indian Students In Canada Face Deportation Risk
The Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) has recently issued deportation letters to as many as 700 Indian students.

Hundreds of Indian students in Canada have hit the streets in protest against the possibility of deportation. The students, mostly from Punjab, allege that Canadian authorities have accused them of obtaining their visas on the basis of fraudulent admission letters for Canadian universities.
The Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) has recently issued deportation letters to as many as 700 Indian students. The letters were issued after the CBSA found that the students' admission offer letters were fake.

Many protesting students claim that they arrived in Canada in 2018, but the fake letters only came to light now, five years later, when they applied for permanent residency.

"When we arrived in Canada our agent told us that the seats were full in the colleges which we had received admission letters for. He told us that universities were overbooking so he can transfer us to another college. Since we did not want to lose a year, we agreed." said Chamandeep Singh, a protesting student, in an exclusive interview with NDTV.

"We changed college and finished our studies but three-four years later, we were told by the CBSA that the admission letter on the basis of which we had received our visas was fraudulent," he added.

...
https://www.ndtv.com/indians-abroad...tation-risk-4103588#pfrom=home-ndtv_topscroll

 

[RajBan]

"Our Lives At Stake": Indian Students In Canada Face Deportation Risk
The Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) has recently issued deportation letters to as many as 700 Indian students.

Hundreds of Indian students in Canada have hit the streets in protest against the possibility of deportation. The students, mostly from Punjab, allege that Canadian authorities have accused them of obtaining their visas on the basis of fraudulent admission letters for Canadian universities.
The Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) has recently issued deportation letters to as many as 700 Indian students. The letters were issued after the CBSA found that the students' admission offer letters were fake.

Many protesting students claim that they arrived in Canada in 2018, but the fake letters only came to light now, five years later, when they applied for permanent residency.

"When we arrived in Canada our agent told us that the seats were full in the colleges which we had received admission letters for. He told us that universities were overbooking so he can transfer us to another college. Since we did not want to lose a year, we agreed." said Chamandeep Singh, a protesting student, in an exclusive interview with NDTV.

"We changed college and finished our studies but three-four years later, we were told by the CBSA that the admission letter on the basis of which we had received our visas was fraudulent," he added.

...
https://www.ndtv.com/indians-abroad...tation-risk-4103588#pfrom=home-ndtv_topscroll

This has been going on for sometime. Surely not all have tricked the law but certainly quite a few students and their families have come through fraudulent means. There has been recent reports on how some of the Punjab officials are part of a mafia syndicate to issue these certificates.

 

[ahsan17]

I wonder when USCIS will seriously start cracking down on Indians making 10-20 duplicate applications for H1B to increase their odds in the lottery. The problem has been known for a while yet because there's no crackdown it keeps happening.

 

[MenInG]

: India on Thursday hit out at Canada for giving space to separatists and extremists elements after visuals surfaced on social media of a float in the Canadian city of Brampton that reportedly celebrated the assassination of former Prime Minister Indira Gandhi.
At a media briefing, External Affairs Minister S Jaishankar said Canada allowing anti-India elements to operate from its soil is not good for the bilateral relationship as well as for itself.

"I think there is a bigger issue involved. And the bigger issue involved really is the space that Canada has continuously and frankly we are at a loss to understand other than the requirements of vote bank politics, why anybody would do this," he said.

"Because if you look at their history, you would imagine that they learn from history and they would not like to repeat that history. It is not only one incident, however, egregious it may be," Jaishankar said.

"I think there is a larger underlying issue about the space which is given to separatists, to extremists, to people who advocate violence and I think it is not good for relationships and not good for Canada," he added.

A video has emerged on social media that showed a float depicting the assassination of Indira Gandhi. It was reportedly part of a parade that was organised by some Khalistani elements in Brampton.

Canadian High Commissioner in India Cameron MacKay tweeted that there is no place in Canada for "hate or for the glorification of violence".

"I am appalled by reports of an event in Canada that celebrated the assassination of late Indian Prime Minister Indira Gandhi. There is no place in Canada for hate or for the glorification of violence. I categorically condemn these activities," he said.

On some Indian students facing difficulties in Canada over charges that they did not study in the colleges they applied for, Jaishankar said India has taken up the issue with Canadian authorities.

"If there were people who misled them (the students), the culpable parties should be acted upon. It is unfair to punish a student who undertook education in good faith," he said.

The external affairs minister said the Canadian prime minister has also made a statement in the House of Commons on the issue.

"We are in touch with Canada on the issue," he said.


NDTV

 

[Champ_Pal]

I wonder when USCIS will seriously start cracking down on Indians making 10-20 duplicate applications for H1B to increase their odds in the lottery. The problem has been known for a while yet because there's no crackdown it keeps happening.

They don't care. USCIS makes money in millions. Its a scam.

10-20 applications is a bit too exaggerated. The average is around 2. Most cannot afford the money to pay for more than 2 applications.

The blame must also go on Indian bigshot companies like TCS, Infosys etc. They apply in bulk citing future projects. At least this was the case a decade ago. I am not sure how it is now.

 

[Mockingbird]

I wonder when USCIS will seriously start cracking down on Indians making 10-20 duplicate applications for H1B to increase their odds in the lottery. The problem has been known for a while yet because there's no crackdown it keeps happening.

You must be seriously behind the curve. USCIS has seriously started cracking down on the duplicate applicants and consultancies- in many case they are even giving lifebans to the fraudulent applicants who were previous lottery winners. The Reddit forums are full of messages from these H1Bs people panicking and lawyering up. It’s finally happening.

 

[Mockingbird]

They don't care. USCIS makes money in millions. Its a scam.

10-20 applications is a bit too exaggerated. The average is around 2. Most cannot afford the money to pay for more than 2 applications.

The blame must also go on Indian bigshot companies like TCS, Infosys etc. They apply in bulk citing future projects. At least this was the case a decade ago. I am not sure how it is now.

I believe TCS, Wipro. Infy can’t do that these days, there is far more scrutiny on their operations. You need to have a job offer in hand matching your application when you are selected for lottery. More fraudulent are these small desi consultancies who can get one multiple job offers from more than one workplace and apply multiple applications to increase the lottery chance.

 

[JaDed]

I wonder when USCIS will seriously start cracking down on Indians making 10-20 duplicate applications for H1B to increase their odds in the lottery. The problem has been known for a while yet because there's no crackdown it keeps happening.

Because it’s legal due to USCIS stupidity I know of someone that did 15, who didn’t deserve 1.

The worst part is its hurting actual Indians that are applying through Actual companies.(permanent ones)

They need to put priority for direct company employees over consultancy, it’s pretty straightforward or limit it to 3 or something.

The crackdown does nothing, they need to change the rules, because this hurts the Indian expats because these guys aren’t as qualified as the ones for whom it’s not getting selected , I know atleast 3 from Silicon valley companies that didn’t get selected one being my distant cousin.(Big tech)

 

[JaDed]

They don't care. USCIS makes money in millions. Its a scam.

10-20 applications is a bit too exaggerated. The average is around 2. Most cannot afford the money to pay for more than 2 applications.

The blame must also go on Indian bigshot companies like TCS, Infosys etc. They apply in bulk citing future projects. At least this was the case a decade ago. I am not sure how it is now.

Tcs Infy never apply duplicates for a single employee. It’s always the shady consultancies that do so and one person can apply from 3, it’s not about money master students that are earning here from these consultancies can easily apply from 5.

 

[JaDed]

Both Pakistanis and Indians integrate in USA quite well (based on what I have seen).

There are more Indians than Pakistanis in USA and thus India has a number advantage.

Number advantage only matters if they all are performing, number can be a disadvantage because the fault can increase.

 

[ahsan17]

You must be seriously behind the curve. USCIS has seriously started cracking down on the duplicate applicants and consultancies- in many case they are even giving lifebans to the fraudulent applicants who were previous lottery winners. The Reddit forums are full of messages from these H1Bs people panicking and lawyering up. It’s finally happening.

It must be a very recent thing then, and at a small scale. I haven't heard of this happening at any large scale. AFAIK it is a very common practice at WITCH companies.

 

[ahsan17]

They don't care. USCIS makes money in millions. Its a scam.

10-20 applications is a bit too exaggerated. The average is around 2. Most cannot afford the money to pay for more than 2 applications.

The blame must also go on Indian bigshot companies like TCS, Infosys etc. They apply in bulk citing future projects. At least this was the case a decade ago. I am not sure how it is now.

Ideally there's a law to prevent that, but you are right that until that happens there won't be any large scale crackdown.

Average might be 2 but at some companies it's 10-20. WITCH come to mind, for example.

 

[ahsan17]

Because it’s legal due to USCIS stupidity I know of someone that did 15, who didn’t deserve 1.

The worst part is its hurting actual Indians that are applying through Actual companies.(permanent ones)

They need to put priority for direct company employees over consultancy, it’s pretty straightforward or limit it to 3 or something.

The crackdown does nothing, they need to change the rules, because this hurts the Indian expats because these guys aren’t as qualified as the ones for whom it’s not getting selected , I know atleast 3 from Silicon valley companies that didn’t get selected one being my distant cousin.(Big tech)

Interesting - I thought that practice was widespread at WITCH but thanks for correcting me that it's primarily the shady consultancies. And yeah I agree until there is a law, nothing significant is going to change.

There's also an argument to be made that either they need to remove the country cap on H1B -> GC path or put a country cap on H1B itself. This madness of making Indians wait 50 years for GC doesn't make sense. But I wouldn't expect that to change in the near future.

At some point, Indians with approved I-140 will be getting GC sponsored by their kids and that might release the pressure on the queue. But that again won't be any time soon.

 

[Mockingbird]

It must be a very recent thing then, and at a small scale. I haven't heard of this happening at any large scale. AFAIK it is a very common practice at WITCH companies.

Yeah it is finally happening this year and it’s great that USCIS finally woke up to these shady consulting shenanigans. As i said earlier, don’t think the WITCH companies do this anymore, it is more the small players who usually slip under the radar who are now getting caught up big time -they are now talking about USCIS life-banning these applicants and companies from the US as well as initiating criminal charges. But honestly don’t know what took them so long to act on these malpractices- this was an open secret throughout the tech world. And with all the information they have, how hard is to build a software which will detect multiple entries on behalf of individual applicants?

 

[JaDed]

Interesting - I thought that practice was widespread at WITCH but thanks for correcting me that it's primarily the shady consultancies. And yeah I agree until there is a law, nothing significant is going to change.

There's also an argument to be made that either they need to remove the country cap on H1B -> GC path or put a country cap on H1B itself. This madness of making Indians wait 50 years for GC doesn't make sense. But I wouldn't expect that to change in the near future.

At some point, Indians with approved I-140 will be getting GC sponsored by their kids and that might release the pressure on the queue. But that again won't be any time soon.

Same consultancy cannot apply for the same employee twice, employee working in one of the Infy tcs etc they always apply per employee .. but master students that work here (US) or ones in India that don’t want to do masters but have family money to apply multiple times through diff consultancies.. as i said apply from 5-20.
[MENTION=156243]Champ_Pal[/MENTION] USCIS returns the petition and filing fee unless determined duplicate.
So it’s not really a money issue its the stupidity issue on USCIS side.

Also GC line isn’t for Indian citizens as such but for anyone born in India and going through EB route. GC employment line is based on country of birth due to which I had no line but my friends do unfortunately who might have been actually more deserving considering they have kids etc and work in much tougher industries.

 

[daytrader]

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