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How will the Fab-4 perform in the final stages of the World Cup?

Slog

Slog

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Especially in Odis. He’s not a 2019 player.
 
He is good ODi player but not a great one. Smith shouldn't be compared with Kohli as well.
 
He is much much better than Smith. Not as great as Kohli (GOAT level) but still great . He has had a superb world cup and looked excellent before a unlucky dismissal today
 
He was extremely unlucky to get out today. He has been carrying the NZ batting almost single handedly this WC.

In ODIs, Smith isn't close to these two..
 
Good Player, has been carrying his team more frequently than he needs to but he is not in the same class as Smith & Kohli.
Even Smith after his return from Sandgate looks jaded
 
In ODIs, Kohli > Root > Williamson > Smith

Don't let one innings in a world cup match cloud your judgement. Smith is a poor ODI player.
 
Kohli has been average in world cups.

Tendulkar remains the GOAT
 
None of the Fab 4 are half as good as Kohli in ODI cricket. Maybe I’m being too generous, they are not even 1/3rd as good as Kohli in ODI cricket.
 
I agree with you.He is good for chasing a 240ish score but not anything above it.
Secondly he is not a good hitter and even if he bats at full flow he wont secure the match.
Even smith is not a good hitter but atleast he i better than kane.
In odis:
kohli
daylight
joe root
smith
williamson
 
Dead Ball said:
He was extremely unlucky to get out today. He has been carrying the NZ batting almost single handedly this WC.

In ODIs, Smith isn't close to these two..
Click to expand...
He was playing a pretty poor innings before he got out

Smith had an ATG 2015 WC
And I’m talking overall so Smith will be in that conversation
 
Slog said:
He was playing a pretty poor innings before he got out

Smith had an ATG 2015 WC
And I’m talking overall so Smith will be in that conversation
Click to expand...

Williamson usually does not look pretty like Babar or Kohli when scoring runs... He is more of a grinder. Most of his hundreds in this WC were hard ugly grinds.
 
Not even near Virat Kohli. Is much closer to Steve Smith.
 
Kohli himself is three levels above Smith in ODIs, while the latter, Root and Williamson are very close.

Kohli
Big gap
Rohit
Daylight
Root/Smith/Williamson
 
Mamoon said:
Kohli himself is three levels above Smith in ODIs, while the latter, Root and Williamson are very close.

Kohli
Big gap
Rohit
Daylight
Root/Smith/Williamson
Click to expand...

How can Rohit come after Kohli? Isn’t Amla the 2nd greatest opener off all time after Sachin? That would automatically mean Amla> Rohit, since both are now openers.
 
Mamoon said:
Kohli himself is three levels above Smith in ODIs, while the latter, Root and Williamson are very close.

Kohli
Big gap
Rohit
Daylight
Root/Smith/Williamson
Click to expand...

Root and Williamson are alevel above Smith. Smith's ODI record is thoroughly mediocre.
 
Of the current lot, Kohli= Rohit =Warner > Root = Williamson > Smith = Babar in ODIs.
 
For his team he’s equivalent to the other big 3 but he’s a notch below them in reality.
 
Kohli, Rohit Sharma, AB de Villiers (retired)

These there men are/were the true elites of this generation. Easily a cut above everyone else.

Guys like Williamson, Dhawan, Root, Taylor, Warner, Dhoni and Amla are all in one class that's below the elites. Within this class someone will be better than someone else depending on which point their career they are at.

Then there is another class of batsmen who are clearly not at the level of the Roots and KWs but are still clearly very good.

These batsmen are du Plessis, Steve Smith, Tamim Iqbal, Guptill, Bairstow, Roy, Morgan, Babar Azam and a few others.

We can debate about the specific ranking order till the cows come home. But this is the basic structure of the global batting scene in this generation.
 
Kane averages 50 at 80. But he is much better than what his numbers suggest.

Of the current lot

Kohli

Warner, Rohit

Babar, Root, Kane, Smith
 
And this [MENTION=147314]topspin[/MENTION] guy trashes Babar Azam, thinks he doesn't have a shot at Fab 4. :)))

Kane is an awesome batsman especially in Tests. Smith and Kohli level.

Babar is doing exceptionally well in ODIs and in this cup has done better than Kane, Kohli.
 
Williamson out of the lot has a lot more responsibility on his shoulders and therefore he has to bat more circumspectly knowing full well that there is no one to come after him
 
Hawkeye said:
And this [MENTION=147314]topspin[/MENTION] guy trashes Babar Azam, thinks he doesn't have a shot at Fab 4. :)))

Kane is an awesome batsman especially in Tests. Smith and Kohli level.

Babar is doing exceptionally well in ODIs and in this cup has done better than Kane, Kohli.
Click to expand...

If you're going to quote me, I respectfully request you don't make up lies, but it seems you're triggered from my response to your other post earlier today, as I mentioned the hard truth about your beloved hero.

Now back on topic, I never said Babar "doesn't have a shot at Fab 4", I said he's not one of top 4 batsmen in the world, as you claim him to be.

At present there are at least 8 ODI batsmen who are above Babar, that's not me bashing him, it's just a fact. Why would I bash our best batsmen in the team? I just don't appreciate him being overhyped like he is, by posters like yourself.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Williamson was unlucky with his wicket today.

He's played much better than Kohli and Smith in this world cup. He is two years younger than Kohli and Smith but is far more mature and smarter as a captain.

If you are chasing 250 on a dodgy wicket, Kane over them two all day long.
 
Mamoon said:
Kohli himself is three levels above Smith in ODIs, while the latter, Root and Williamson are very close.

Kohli
Big gap
Rohit
Daylight
Root/Smith/Williamson
Click to expand...

You do realise with your list you've broken the heart of fans of the world class Babar Azam!!?:))):))):)))
 
KingKhanWC said:
Williamson was unlucky with his wicket today.

He's played much better than Kohli and Smith in this world cup. He is two years younger than Kohli and Smith but is far more mature and smarter as a captain.

If you are chasing 250 on a dodgy wicket, Kane over them two all day long.
Click to expand...

Williamson needs a hitter at the other end to be effective in ODis and T20's.
 
I have always said he is overrated even in tests.

Look at his record in key countries.

kane.JPG
 
PakLFC said:
You do realise with your list you've broken the heart of fans of the world class Babar Azam!!?:))):))):)))
Click to expand...

Babar is very good and should reach the level of Root, Williamson, Smith when he matures, but Kohli and Rohit are different league. They are possibly two of the best 3 ODI batsmen ever along with Viv.
 
In tests, Williamson is an elite test bat. An all-time great. In ODIs, he is clutch but limited. Doesn't have enough gears but can perform in pressure situation. Very good ODI bat but not the best to come from even NZ.

Kohli is a GOAT in ODIs and ATG in tests. He will go down as among top 10 greatest batsmen of all by the time he retires.

Root is a great in tests and very very good in ODIs.

Smith is ATG in tests undoubtedly and good in ODIs.
 
I would have happily drop 3 Pakistani batsmen to accomodate a Kane Williamson. He is an absolute legend. Yes he does not bat in the most attractive ways but he is bloody calm.
 
jeeteshssaxena said:
I agree with you.He is good for chasing a 240ish score but not anything above it.
Secondly he is not a good hitter and even if he bats at full flow he wont secure the match.
Even smith is not a good hitter but atleast he i better than kane.
In odis:
kohli
daylight
joe root
smith
williamson
Click to expand...

You could probably put babar where you put daylight if he continues to perform the way he is for another year straight and onwards
 
Mamoon said:
Babar is very good and should reach the level of Root, Williamson, Smith when he matures, but Kohli and Rohit are different league. They are possibly two of the best 3 ODI batsmen ever along with Viv.
Click to expand...

But rohit is a ftb and has huge weaknesses
 
Savak said:
Williamson out of the lot has a lot more responsibility on his shoulders and therefore he has to bat more circumspectly knowing full well that there is no one to come after him
Click to expand...

Check Taylor’s record in recent times. Great consistency. Their problem was top 2
 
Yeah others have said it. Smith is NOT even close to the same league as Kohli in ODIs.

The person starting this thread cannot seriously think he is.
 
Mean&Green said:
You could probably put babar where you put daylight if he continues to perform the way he is for another year straight and onwards
Click to expand...

Too many ifs and buts. Let Babar perform consistently against top sides for several more years then we can talk. His only innings where he looked world-class was vs NZ. Need several such to be regarded among the best.

For now it criminal to even mention him in the same sentence as Fab 4 who are prodigies of this generation and match-winners for their sides.
 
Kane Williamson has at least two tours remaining in his career to rectify his record in England/SA/India. And have people already forgotten he just helped his team to a test series victory with some stellar batting in UAE?

I think people are just bitter and picking on Williamson since he was unable to get NZ (and therefore Pakistan) home against England in the WC.
 
As far as the Fab-4 is concerned it goes like this in ODI's

Kohli

some daylight

Joe Root
Kane Williamson
Steve Smith

In Tests I am going to assume Smith is the same as he was pre-ban and there is no reason for him not to be:

Steve Smith

Virat Kohli
Kane Williamson

Joe Root
 
Smith ,Root,Kohli,Williamson -Fab 4 . Who you will think can play match winning knock in knockout

After india england australia newzealand in semis.
Smith Root Kohli Williamson. Among thease fab 4 ,who will you think play a match winning knock in final and semifinal..
 
Kohli is yet to score a century in this WC! I think he will score one and will be a match winning century!
 
Ram Shekhar said:
I hope it's a tournament winning one and all the naysayers can shut up forever..
Click to expand...

Dont worry, even if he scores a match winning double century in the finals... haters will find a way to downplay it by saying he plays in the era of 'flat pitches, short boundaries and weak bowlers'. Haters gonna hate.

Let's just sit back and enjoy his batting while it lasts :)
 
dravidthewall said:
After india england australia newzealand in semis.
Smith Root Kohli Williamson. Among thease fab 4 ,who will you think play a match winning knock in final and semifinal..
Click to expand...
The player whose team gets to bat first will play a match winning knock.
Its very tough to play a match winning innings batting second.
 
My prediction on SF (& finals), strictly not an ordering of their skills

SS > KW > VK > JR

Why?
SS big match player
KW has already been put thru fire and successful
VK too much focus on strike bowlers & then soft dismissal to part timer
JR temperament in the WC has not been good so far
 
Smith or Warner, Aussies have unreal ability in WCs to make big ones.
 
jeeteshssaxena said:
The player whose team gets to bat first will play a match winning knock.
Its very tough to play a match winning innings batting second.
Click to expand...

yes Chasing sides have more pressure. When you set a target as a middle order bat, you don't have that much of pressure because it will be upto bowlers to win the match.
 
Williamson in an odd way will have more chance to click as their team is literally equal to Williamson. He must score. Despite having a low strike rate of 77, he is not averse to taking his own time as his team depends on him. Kohli is very conscious about the rate at which he scores unlike Rohit sharma. So he will take odd chances in between. That is why Kohli's strike rate is 95. Smith & Root have a strike rate of 91.
 
Aside from Virat, rest has done pretty well. Virat, though he got them 50's, has been quite dissapointing throughout the tournament.
 
light said:
Aside from Virat, rest has done pretty well. Virat, though he got them 50's, has been quite dissapointing throughout the tournament.
Click to expand...


Smith has done pretty well? lol

Kohli has the best strike rate among 4, second best average, highest runs in winning matches, Even the failures came in a couple of inconsequential matches

Willimason 7 innings 481 runs 623 balls faced 62.50 avge
Kohli 8 innings 442 runs 465 balls faced 96.20 avge
Root 9 innings 500 runs 545 balls faced 63.14 avge
Smith 9 innings 294 runs 322 balls faced 32.66 avge
 
Time for the big dog Kohli to show why he's no.1.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
Smith has done pretty well? lol

Kohli has the best strike rate among 4, second best average, highest runs in winning matches, Even the failures came in a couple of inconsequential matches

Willimason 7 innings 481 runs 623 balls faced 62.50 avge
Kohli 8 innings 442 runs 465 balls faced 96.20 avge
Root 9 innings 500 runs 545 balls faced 63.14 avge
Smith 9 innings 294 runs 322 balls faced 32.66 avge
Click to expand...

Williamson 96.20
Kohli 63.14 avge
Root 62.50 avge
Smith 32.66 avge
 
rhony said:
Time for the big dog Kohli to show why he's no.1.
Click to expand...

No need. I prefer India win. If KL Rahul scores an unbeaten 175, Rohit sharma scores an unbeaten 200. I am okay Kohli not batting at all. We don't have to be obsessed with one guy scoring 100. It means he has to come in early at the crease. Do we really want that?
 
So far Williamson > Kohli > Root > Smith

I hope someone plays a special knock chasing which is against the run of tournament so far ...
 
jnaveen1980 said:
No need. I prefer India win. If KL Rahul scores an unbeaten 175, Rohit sharma scores an unbeaten 200. I am okay Kohli not batting at all. We don't have to be obsessed with one guy scoring 100. It means he has to come in early at the crease. Do we really want that?
Click to expand...

Lol. C'mon man. Be realistic.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
Smith has done pretty well? lol

Kohli has the best strike rate among 4, second best average, highest runs in winning matches, Even the failures came in a couple of inconsequential matches

Willimason 7 innings 481 runs 623 balls faced 62.50 avge
Kohli 8 innings 442 runs 465 balls faced 96.20 avge
Root 9 innings 500 runs 545 balls faced 63.14 avge
Smith 9 innings 294 runs 322 balls faced 32.66 avge
Click to expand...

By Virat's standard, he has not done well in this WC. He is our main batsmen, yet to score like how we are used too of virat. Not saying he did bad, but by his standard, it's not the best.
 
Didn’t think Root would top them all
 
Root was the worst for his torturous 7 in 30 balls and then the dismissal. Smith and Kane did well in the SF. Kohli flopped.
 
It is all about necessity of the team. Root didn't have to be over-cautious as their team had a lot of depth. Same way Kohli had to be over-cautious instead of playing fancy across the line shot as his team lacked depth. Williamson even in the IPL way outside his capacity last season in the absence of warne and took his side with uber limited resources to IPL final. So in terms of cricketing smarts Williamson is way way ahead of everyone including smith. He knows what to do what not do while batting to survive. Definitely not as gifted as the other guys. But genuine survivor. Smith is closer to Williamson in that regard. He finds a way to survive.

Problem with Kohli is start especially when the opener is gone in the first 2 or 3 overs. That is his most vulnerable period. If he survives that period he will leave everyone else behind with his aggressive running between the wickets and calculated acceleration. He is a master of many things except this one little of weakness of not giving himself chance to survive for the first 10 overs when he is in early.

I still rate Kohli way above others in terms of overall one day ability. He will continue proving.
 
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