What's new

"I pointed my chest to Ambrose, 'Try and hit me and I'll show you'" : Javed Miandad

UN talkz

First Class Star
Joined
Dec 24, 2016
Runs
4,138
"Imran had always been reluctant to hand it to me as a batsman. But after that tour he did."

Javed Miandad's reflections on Pakistan's 1988 series against the West Indies underline both the brilliance and volatility of his country's cricket team during the 1980s and 90s.

Coming almost 13 years and more than 10,000 runs after his international debut, Miandad's performance on that tour is regarded as one of his greatest achievements, not least because it finally silenced critics who said he couldn't perform away from the comforts of home.

Critics that included his own captain and long-time teammate, the legendary Imran Khan.

Two of Pakistan's greatest-ever players shared a love-hate relationship during their two decades playing together, which eased on that 1988 tour as only two wickets – and some questionable umpiring – came between Pakistan and the rarest of achievements; a series win against the mighty Windies.

Pakistan's impressive showing in a three-match series that ended 1-1 was built on the performances of Miandad and Imran, the latter having come out of retirement to reclaim the captaincy at the age of 35 after a plea from the country's president.

And who had started the tour by overseeing a 0-5 ODI series drubbing that, just seven days later, was all but forgotten when the tourists recorded a stunning nine-wicket victory in the first Test thanks to Imran's 11 wickets and Miandad's first-innings century.

While the Windies were without star quick Malcolm Marshall in that match, they still fielded an imposing pace attack of Courtney Walsh, debutant Curtly Ambrose, Patrick Patterson and Winston Benjamin that was expected to make light work of a Pakistan side that had won just two of 10 Tests in the Caribbean.

But the young tyros got carried away in their attempt to intimidate the tourists and conceded 38 no-balls in Pakistan's first innings as extras (71) finished as the second-highest scorer behind Miandad's 114.

"I taunted the bowlers," Miandad later recalled, having helped inflict the Windies' first home defeat in a decade. "I pointed my chest to Ambrose, 'Try and hit me and I'll show you', I told him."

Chastened by a shock defeat, the proud Windies responded as champions do; having conceded a 20-run lead on the first innings in the second Test, the hosts slumped to 4-88 before centuries from Viv Richards and Jeffrey Dujon helped set the tourists 372 to win the series.

After Imran had taken nine wickets with the ball, it was again Miandad's turn to shine with the bat. He defied a potent attack (including Marshall) for almost four-and-a-half hours in compiling an obdurate 102, the only batsman to pass 50 in an innings that spanned 129 overs.

He fell with 84 runs required to win from 20 overs in a thrilling chase that ended with the tourists 31 runs short of their target and with just a single wicket remaining, handing them a tense draw and a 1-0 lead heading into the series decider.

It was an equally nail-biting finish in the final Test; the tourists earned a slender three-run lead on the first innings before an unbeaten 43 from their skipper helped set the home side 266 runs to win the match and avoid their first series defeat in 15 years.

A target they reached with just two wickets remaining thanks to an unlikely 61-run stand from Dujon and No.10 Benjamin, as well as what both teams conceded was some questionable umpiring from the home officials.

"We would have wrapped up the game but a couple of crucial umpiring decisions robbed us of victory," Miandad recalls.

Imran finished the series with 23 wickets at 18 while Miandad led all batsmen with 282 runs at 56 in a series regarded as one of the best in the game's history.

"It probably represents some of the best cricket that's ever been played anywhere," Miandad later wrote.

And for Miandad, it helped silence the doubters, both internally and from within his own dressing-room.

"After that series I finally came to terms with my insecurities about scoring overseas," he wrote.

"The comments from my detractors ceased."

https://www.cricket.com.au/news/leg...n-west-indies-imran-khan-1988-tour/2018-05-20
 
Had we won this series this would have been our greatest achievement along with the 92 World Cup
 
Richie Benaud said that Miandad changed his style after getting hit by a Lillee bouncer in that he stopped getting in line and started hooking from outside his off stump. Not sure if true, but that would make the taunt at Ambrose slightly hollow if it was.
 
Over rated batsman. I will take Younis over him any day

He was brilliant. Invented the modern leg side slog shot where the batsman moves the front foot out of the way, the rest of the world studied his videos and adopted it so you see it has become common today.
 
Over rated batsman. I will take Younis over him any day

I don't think you can call a batsman who maintained an average of 50+ in tests from his first match till his last as overrated. You could argue there is no better way to define consistency.
 
Richie Benaud said that Miandad changed his style after getting hit by a Lillee bouncer in that he stopped getting in line and started hooking from outside his off stump. Not sure if true, but that would make the taunt at Ambrose slightly hollow if it was.

According to Junaids, He changed his stance after he stopped playing county cricket in the mid 80's.

Below were his exact words on a thread I made regarding miandad.

His technique become very idiosyncratic from around the mid-1980s, when he gave up playing county cricket.

Until then he was fairly orthodox and also quite a powerful hitter in 40, 50, 55 and 60 overs cricket.

But from around 1985 he went from being a classical side-on batsman to becoming a two-eyed front-on batsman like Peter Willey or Shiv Chanderpaul.

He was never as good again, but funnily enough the high point of his career was when he scored successive centuries in the West Indies in 1987-88. But those were on wickets with no grass and no lateral movement. And three of the four quicks were nobodies, while Marshall was half-fit and missed the First Test.

But by that time he was hard to get out, and could score big on grassless surfaces, but he could no longer accelerate and he also could not survive against old-fashioned swing and seam bowling. In effect, his achievements from 1987-1992 were due to a combination of easy wickets and intense mental strength.

The last three years, from the Caribbean tour of 1992-93 until the 1996 World Cup, he was just an embarrassment, a former great who was now not much better than a tailender.
 
Over rated batsman. I will take Younis over him any day

LOL.

Younis is not even close to being Pak's great.

Younis first has to make a case for coming close to MoYo. Inzamam is far too ahead.

Let alone coming close to Miandad.
 
LOL.

Younis is not even close to being Pak's great.

Younis first has to make a case for coming close to MoYo. Inzamam is far too ahead.

Let alone coming close to Miandad.

Moyo had one good year, he is not fit to clean Younis Khan's kacha who is one of the all time greats not just a Pak great. Miandad is not over rated though that's just silly.
 
"Imran finished the series with 23 wickets at 18 while Miandad led all batsmen with 282 runs at 56 in a series regarded as one of the best in the game's history."

Wow, what a performance! Wish I could have seen it live. Absolute legends.

LOL.

Younis is not even close to being Pak's great.

Younis first has to make a case for coming close to MoYo. Inzamam is far too ahead.

Let alone coming close to Miandad.

1) Miandad
2) Younis
3) Inzamam
4) Yousuf
5) Anwar

The first two are ATGs.
 
The only reason Maindad is Pakistan's best ever batsman is that he was equally good in both tests and ODIs, while YK was a legend in tests but mediocre in ODIs.


If the discussion was only tests then YK is comfortably better.
 
The only reason Maindad is Pakistan's best ever batsman is that he was equally good in both tests and ODIs, while YK was a legend in tests but mediocre in ODIs.


If the discussion was only tests then YK is comfortably better.

People only talk about tests when discussing the likes of Khan, Dravid, Kallis and Gavasker. Their ODI careers are pretty underwhelming and not worth discussing.
 
People only talk about tests when discussing the likes of Khan, Dravid, Kallis and Gavasker. Their ODI careers are pretty underwhelming and not worth discussing.

I don't understand how that happened.... how can you be a legend in tests but absolutely bang average in ODIs. Its like someone can drive like Schumacher on the track but like a grandma in the city.
 
Considering the fact that his average in Tests never went below 50 (definition of consistency) and his brilliance in ODIs overall Javed Miandad is a way better batsman than Rahul Dravid, Sunil Gavaskar, and Younis Khan.
 
Miandad's was very strong mentally. Unlike YK in his prime he was quite hard to dismiss. He was a beast in ODIs in late 80s and early 90s. The one thing common between him and YK is that both took pride in guiding and helping the young batsmen with their batting.
PCB must utilize YK experience and give him a coaching job with the young and upcoming batsmen
 
Miandad was easily a better Test batsman than Younis. In ODIs there’s obviously no comparison
 
People only talk about tests when discussing the likes of Khan, Dravid, Kallis and Gavasker. Their ODI careers are pretty underwhelming and not worth discussing.

Dravid was a good ODI batsmen for his time. You are underestimating him. Look at his icc tournament record as well.
 
Moyo had one good year, he is not fit to clean Younis Khan's kacha who is one of the all time greats not just a Pak great. Miandad is not over rated though that's just silly.

I exaggerated that a bit, based on your personal perception and judgment, you could rate Younis higher or MoYo higher and you wouldn't be too wrong.

But yes, Younis was mentally stronger and consistent.

Still a league below Inzi, then several leagues below Miandad.


People only talk about tests when discussing the likes of Khan, Dravid, Kallis and Gavasker. Their ODI careers are pretty underwhelming and not worth discussing.


No, when you're talking about being at the top, your overall game comes into play.

Nobody rates Chanderpaul. Nobody outside Pak considers Younis a great.

If you're too limited in some formats, you're limited as a batsman and not in contention for all-time greatness.
 
Miandad was a true street fighter. It is a pity he did not give back to Pakistan Cricket after retirement inspite of having like a gazzilion oppurtunities to do so.
 
Considering the fact that his average in Tests never went below 50 (definition of consistency) and his brilliance in ODIs overall Javed Miandad is a way better batsman than Rahul Dravid, Sunil Gavaskar, and Younis Khan.

Javed better than Gavaskar & dravid
You must be kidding
 
I exaggerated that a bit, based on your personal perception and judgment, you could rate Younis higher or MoYo higher and you wouldn't be too wrong.

But yes, Younis was mentally stronger and consistent.

Still a league below Inzi, then several leagues below Miandad.





No, when you're talking about being at the top, your overall game comes into play.

Nobody rates Chanderpaul. Nobody outside Pak considers Younis a great.

If you're too limited in some formats, you're limited as a batsman and not in contention for all-time greatness.

He is at least 500 levels above Moyo, about 1-2 levels above Inzi and Miandad is worthy of being compared on a level playing field as Younis and vice versa
 
The brilliant Javed Miandad played in an era of fast bowling the world may never see again. While others would crumble or their knees would shake at the sight of West Indian quick running in against them, JM enjoyed the challenge, he thrived upon it.

Having skills is one thing but when you have no fear, unlimited courage and fight to the death it's when you become a great in sports.
 
People only talk about tests when discussing the likes of Khan, Dravid, Kallis and Gavasker. Their ODI careers are pretty underwhelming and not worth discussing.

Test will always be the gold standard for most.

Look at Neil Fairbrother - top ODI man, couldn’t translate his success to tests. More recently, Eoin Morgan. Even if the latter leads England to a World Cup win, Root will be considered the greater player.
 
The brilliant Javed Miandad played in an era of fast bowling the world may never see again. While others would crumble or their knees would shake at the sight of West Indian quick running in against them, JM enjoyed the challenge, he thrived upon it.

Plus Lillee, Thomson, Hadlee, Willis, Botham, Kapil.
 
The brilliant Javed Miandad played in an era of fast bowling the world may never see again. While others would crumble or their knees would shake at the sight of West Indian quick running in against them, JM enjoyed the challenge, he thrived upon it.

Having skills is one thing but when you have no fear, unlimited courage and fight to the death it's when you become a great in sports.

That's why he averages less than 30 against them.
 
we were robbed.

The WI umpire were notorious cheaters (so were ours and every home country), but WI got horrible if their team was in trouble.

The did the same when not giving Walsh caught behind against Wasim Akram a few series later
 
JM, # lastballsix #Sharjah, there’s a song after him, there’s Bollywood movies based on his batting.
As a kid I watched JM playing, Younis doesn’t even come close to JM. Watch YouTube videos of him batting.
 
I don't understand how that happened.... how can you be a legend in tests but absolutely bang average in ODIs. Its like someone can drive like Schumacher on the track but like a grandma in the city.

I don't mind. We've found some potentially great ODI batsmen but might never see a test batsman like Younis Khan again. Great test cricketers are a dying breed.

Dravid was a good ODI batsmen for his time. You are underestimating him. Look at his icc tournament record as well.

Well, even Kallis can be considered a good batsman for his time. I was comparing them to modern batsmen as well.

Test will always be the gold standard for most.

Look at Neil Fairbrother - top ODI man, couldn’t translate his success to tests. More recently, Eoin Morgan. Even if the latter leads England to a World Cup win, Root will be considered the greater player.

I agree. Even Jos Buttler admitted as much. Tests are where greats are made, ODIs are just an add-on. T20s do absolutely nothing for a player's legacy.
 
I exaggerated that a bit, based on your personal perception and judgment, you could rate Younis higher or MoYo higher and you wouldn't be too wrong.

But yes, Younis was mentally stronger and consistent.

Still a league below Inzi, then several leagues below Miandad.





No, when you're talking about being at the top, your overall game comes into play.

Nobody rates Chanderpaul. Nobody outside Pak considers Younis a great.

If you're too limited in some formats, you're limited as a batsman and not in contention for all-time greatness.

Okay, how are you going to rank Bradman, Sobers, Gavasker, Hanif, etc who either never played ODIs or were poor at the format?

The beautiful thing about test cricket is that the vast majority of great crickets have played it and thrived at it. It has also remained more or less the same so we can even do cross-generational comparisons.

ODIs are an add-on.
 
I don't understand how that happened.... how can you be a legend in tests but absolutely bang average in ODIs. Its like someone can drive like Schumacher on the track but like a grandma in the city.

pace of the game.

Problem with Younis Khan is that he takes his time. In test you could take your time but in Odi you have to take a risk at some point due to the scoring rate.

Asad Shafiq is a very good example.

he avgs well in test, but his odi was terrible.
 
Back
Top